Re: Linux Mag OT
On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 12:38:34 -0500 Bruce Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The error I got from some of the failures was invalid byte code. | | Hmmm I sez to myself. Could MS be planting a bogus bit of code in their | java created by Front Page to 'kill' all other browsers? Naw, they wouldn't | do that, would they?? | | Has anyone else seen a problem like this? Wouldn't suprise me. Still, a library IS publically funded. Any local Linux user groups should protest. Claim that the library is prejudiced against a minority and as a result making it difficult for their children to obtain acces to publically funded services. You know the rant. In fact, they probably never even considered non-Explorer in their system setup. BTW, did the Windows Netscape work? -- = Roger Oberholtzer E-mail:[EMAIL PROTECTED] OPQ Systems AB WWW: http://www.opq.se Erik Dahlbergsgatan 41-43 Phone: Int + 46 8 314223 115 32 Stockholm Mobile: Int + 46 733 621657 Sweden Fax: Int + 46 8 302602 ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tuesday 22 January 2002 3:13 am, Roger Oberholtzer wrote: On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 12:38:34 -0500 Bruce Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The error I got from some of the failures was invalid byte code. | Hmmm I sez to myself. Could MS be planting a bogus bit of code in their | java created by Front Page to 'kill' all other browsers? Naw, they | wouldn't do that, would they?? | | Has anyone else seen a problem like this? Wouldn't suprise me. Still, a library IS publically funded. Any local Linux user groups should protest. Claim that the library is prejudiced against a minority and as a result making it difficult for their children to obtain acces to publically funded services. You know the rant. In fact, they probably never even considered non-Explorer in their system setup. BTW, did the Windows Netscape work? I couldn't find *any* browser other than Internet Exploder that would work. And I did complain to the library and got a nice reply that they were in the midst of changing their method of generating web pages blah blah blah... but after 3 months, nothing has changed. If anyone wants to try it, the url and sequence is: 1) www.npls.org 2) select 'online catalog' 3) select Java WEBpac The error I now get on mozilla after loading the java applet is: applet not initialized. (it bombed) -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 08:58 + ++ He that would govern others, first should be the master of himself. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
Just tried it. It works o.k.. I'm using Mandrake 8.0 with Netscape 4.77. Lee Bruce Marshall wrote: On Tuesday 22 January 2002 3:13 am, Roger Oberholtzer wrote: On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 12:38:34 -0500 Bruce Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The error I got from some of the failures was invalid byte code. | Hmmm I sez to myself. Could MS be planting a bogus bit of code in their | java created by Front Page to 'kill' all other browsers? Naw, they | wouldn't do that, would they?? | | Has anyone else seen a problem like this? Wouldn't suprise me. Still, a library IS publically funded. Any local Linux user groups should protest. Claim that the library is prejudiced against a minority and as a result making it difficult for their children to obtain acces to publically funded services. You know the rant. In fact, they probably never even considered non-Explorer in their system setup. BTW, did the Windows Netscape work? I couldn't find *any* browser other than Internet Exploder that would work. And I did complain to the library and got a nice reply that they were in the midst of changing their method of generating web pages blah blah blah... but after 3 months, nothing has changed. If anyone wants to try it, the url and sequence is: 1) www.npls.org 2) select 'online catalog' 3) select Java WEBpac The error I now get on mozilla after loading the java applet is: applet not initialized. (it bombed) -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 08:58 + ++ He that would govern others, first should be the master of himself. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tuesday 22 January 2002 10:12 am, Rick Sivernell wrote: Bruce Just tried your site with opera. www.npls.org/onlinecatalog worked here. Acutually then went to childrens area found Sanat. My opera anounces it self as IE5. cheers You didn't mention loading the java applet. My opera announces itself as IE5 too but doesn't work nor does Opera under Windows. -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 10:41 + ++ Hell is kept warm with profane burners. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
I also tried it with Opera. It didn't load, but it didn't crap out either. It did, however, vanish a different site and a few pages later. No reason. HTH On Tuesday 22 January 2002 08:12 am, you wrote: Bruce Just tried your site with opera. www.npls.org/onlinecatalog worked here. Acutually then went to childrens area found Sanat. My opera anounces it self as IE5. cheers -- PDA HandyMan www.pdahandyman.com Giving the Mobile User What They Really Want! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
Bruce Marshall wrote: On Tuesday 22 January 2002 9:54 am, Lee wrote: Just tried it. It works o.k.. I'm using Mandrake 8.0 with Netscape 4.77. Lee Sure you got the Java version? (there's also a non-Java version of the catalog) Yeah. JavaWeb. Had to enable Java Script on my browser, normally run with it shutdown. -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 10:12 + ++ Luck can't last a lifetime unless you die young. - Russell Banks ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tuesday 22 January 2002 10:44 am, Lee wrote: Bruce Marshall wrote: On Tuesday 22 January 2002 9:54 am, Lee wrote: Just tried it. It works o.k.. I'm using Mandrake 8.0 with Netscape 4.77. Lee Sure you got the Java version? (there's also a non-Java version of the catalog) Yeah. JavaWeb. Had to enable Java Script on my browser, normally run with it shutdown. Looks like 4.77 is a keeper. Anything newer make it fail. -- + + + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 10:12 + + + Luck can't last a lifetime unless you die young. - Russell Banks ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL. -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 10:49 + ++ It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tuesday 22 January 2002 06:54 am, Lee wrote: If anyone wants to try it, the url and sequence is: 1) www.npls.org 2) select 'online catalog' 3) select Java WEBpac The error I now get on mozilla after loading the java applet is: applet not initialized. (it bombed) I got the same error using mozilla but using netscaoe 4.78 (Mandrake 8.1) works just fine. Ted Ozolins (VE7TVO) Westbank, B. C. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tue, Jan 22, 2002 at 10:40:35AM -0500, Bruce Marshall wrote: ... What version of Opera? It fails on my 5.0. I did get it to work under Win/Netscape/4.7 but it fails on Win/Netscape/6.2 with Not init'd I got it to work here with Netscape Communicator 4.75 (Caldera eDesktop 2.4). It didn't work on Mozilla 0.94, and when I went to view source, it said the browser didn't have java enabled although there was an open window where it appeared to be attempting to load applets. Under Opera 5.0 it says not init'd Under Win/Opera/6.0 it says invalid bytecode Linux Opera 6.0 came up with a blank screen, but I don't think I've got java configured properly for it. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC UUCP: camco!bill PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 URL: http://www.celestial.com/ ``The only freedom which deserves the name, is that of pursuing our own good in our own way, so long as we do not attempt to deprive others of theirs, or impede their efforts to obtain it.'' -- John Stuart Mill, 1859 ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tue, 22 Jan 2002 10:40:35 -0500 Bruce Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tuesday 22 January 2002 10:12 am, Rick Sivernell wrote: Bruce Just tried your site with opera. www.npls.org/onlinecatalog worked here. Acutually then went to childrens area found Sanat. My opera anounces it self as IE5. cheers What version of Opera? It fails on my 5.0. I did get it to work under Win/Netscape/4.7 but it fails on Win/Netscape/6.2 with Not init'd Under Opera 5.0 it says not init'd Under Win/Opera/6.0 it says invalid bytecode -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 10:27 + ++ An expert is a person who avoids the small errors as he sweeps on to the grand fallacy. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL. Bruce This is the static version: Version Information Version : 5.0 Unregistered version Operating System Information Running on : Linux Kernel version : 2.4.9 #1aD SMP Fri Oct 12 02:10:17 CEST 2001 Machine : i686 Node : RSivernell.sivernell.net Configuration Information Preference file : /home/rick/.opera/opera.ini Opera directory : /home/rick/.opera Window data storage file : /home/rick/.opera/opera.win Hot List file : /home/rick/.opera/opera.adr Cache directory : /home/rick/.opera/cache4 Help directory : /usr/share/opera/help/ Plugin directory : /usr/lib/opera/plugins Sound Information Sound is not avaliable. Opera uses the Network Audio System to play sound -- Rick Sivernell Dallas, Texas 75287 972 306-2296 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1 Registered Linux User .~. / v \ /( _ )\ ^ ^ In Linux we trust! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On January 22, 2002 06:54 am, Lee wrote: Just tried it. It works o.k.. I'm using Mandrake 8.0 with Netscape 4.77. One of the local libraries ( www.spl.surrey.bc.ca ) has something similar. I've found it only works in Netscape 4 and Internet Explorer. David Aikema ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Tuesday 22 January 2002 13:37 pm, Rick Sivernell wrote: On Tue, 22 Jan 2002 10:40:35 -0500 Bruce This is the static version: I don't think Opera under Linux supports Java yet. Version Information Version : 5.0 Unregistered version Operating System Information Running on : Linux Kernel version : 2.4.9 #1aD SMP Fri Oct 12 02:10:17 CEST 2001 Machine : i686 Node : RSivernell.sivernell.net Configuration Information Preference file : /home/rick/.opera/opera.ini Opera directory : /home/rick/.opera Window data storage file : /home/rick/.opera/opera.win Hot List file : /home/rick/.opera/opera.adr Cache directory : /home/rick/.opera/cache4 Help directory : /usr/share/opera/help/ Plugin directory : /usr/lib/opera/plugins Sound Information Sound is not avaliable. Opera uses the Network Audio System to play sound -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/22/02 14:03 + ++ The Tao that is seen Is not the true Tao, until You bring fresh toner. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 01:31:21 -0500 Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gates might start feeling like a wagonmaster under indian attack who is one wagon short of circling the wagons. Increased market share for linux is happening, but I'm not sure how many paying customers are ponying up to the bar yet. And MS still has a virtual softwre monopoly for the home user. Techies love linux, but my wife hates it! -- Ken Moffat [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
Well, I hate to say it, my wife can not remember were the cdrom disk drive is located on the machine. Can not remember were I setup the easy to icons on the desktop. Actually unless it is sometyhing she uses everyday, reteach her. This is a common problem with computer users, I only want to know that which I only need to know or use. Most do not want to know what their system does and basic system usage. This is a fact that will always plauge Linux, and aid M$. cheers -- Rick Sivernell Dallas, Texas 75287 972 306-2296 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1 Registered Linux User .~. / v \ /( _ )\ ^ ^ In Linux we trust! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 08:02:31 -0600 Rick Sivernell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: | | Well, I hate to say it, my wife can not remember were the cdrom disk drive | is located on the machine. Can not remember were I setup the easy to icons | on the desktop. Actually unless it is sometyhing she uses everyday, reteach her. | This is a common problem with computer users, I only want to know that which | I only need to know or use. Most do not want to know what their system does | and basic system usage. This is a fact that will always plauge Linux, and aid | M$. My wife's only complaint about Linux is that one of our banks' security software only runs on Windows. Until recently we have been dual boot for that reason. I am now checking if the security blip will run on Win4Lin. -- = Roger Oberholtzer E-mail:[EMAIL PROTECTED] OPQ Systems AB WWW: http://www.opq.se Erik Dahlbergsgatan 41-43 Phone: Int + 46 8 314223 115 32 Stockholm Mobile: Int + 46 733 621657 Sweden Fax: Int + 46 8 302602 ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
RE: Linux Mag OT
Ken Moffat wrote: who is one wagon short of circling the wagons. Increased market share for linux is happening, but I'm not sure how many paying customers are ponying up to the bar yet. And MS still has a virtual softwre monopoly for the home user. Techies love linux, but my wife hates it! She'll come around. Mine did. :-) It has taken the better part of 2 1/2 years though. It is just a battle of will power and my will to work in Linux out lasted her will to keep rebooting to get into Windoze. Though she still occasionally does, tis a rare occasion these days. Like when we have to use the scanner. That will be solved when we get a new PC though. -- Tom Wilson ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
RE: Linux Mag OT
Well, I hate to say it, my wife can not remember were the cdrom disk drive is located on the machine. Can not remember were I setup the easy to icons on the desktop. Actually unless it is sometyhing she uses everyday, reteach her. This is a common problem with computer users, I only want to know that which I only need to know or use. Most do not want to know what their system does and basic system usage. This is a fact that will always plauge Linux, and aid M$. I respectfully dieagree, Rick. The people that are only vaguely interested in the base functionality of an application or two that slightly interests them are not the vast majority, and most do not require constant retraining. These kinds of users plague MS as well. Where do you think that handful of fantastic technical support stories come from? Each OS as a profile for its target user. -Linux is pleased to offer what it can to anyone willing to try it (that distro companies extend the OS is NOT apropos). Linux users will, with a small amount of effort, reap solid rewards, but they will feel the pinch when it comes to software, especially commercial games. Cost? Loss of some consistency one gets from a commercial OS. Payoff? Greater sense of accomplishment and a newly learned technical skill. -Windows wants the classic fast food restaurant worker; no prior experience and a willingness to be shaped like clay for practically nothing in return. Windows users will, in XP, be coddled through most every task and will be offered ideas on what to do with ones time in front of the computer. Free will and choice are stripped by clever marketing and giving for free only those apps that basic users will find useful. Cost? Loss of choice and diversity. Payoff? A bunch of killer games... if they don't crash... and world wide acceptance (regardless of the fact that it was practically forced). Tyler ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Monday 21 January 2002 10:14 am, Roger Oberholtzer wrote: My wife's only complaint about Linux is that one of our banks' security software only runs on Windows. Until recently we have been dual boot for that reason. I am now checking if the security blip will run on Win4Lin. A similar problem here. A friend who (was) running Linux likes to connect to the local library to check out the availability of books. The web page uses a java program to run . She told me that it wouldn't work in Linux. So I tried it. Nope, didn't work. I used Opera, Mozilla, and Konqy. Then I fired up windows and tried Netscape and Opera. Nope. The only thing that would work was Internet Explorer. I checked the web pages and Front Page was being used as the web package. The error I got from some of the failures was invalid byte code. Hmmm I sez to myself. Could MS be planting a bogus bit of code in their java created by Front Page to 'kill' all other browsers? Naw, they wouldn't do that, would they?? Has anyone else seen a problem like this? -- ++ + Bruce S. Marshall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bellaire, MI 01/21/02 10:54 + ++ They always say that time changes things, but you actually have to change them yourself. - Andy Warhol, American pop artist (1928-1987) ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Mon, Jan 21, 2002 at 10:04:05AM -0700, Tyler Regas wrote: -Linux is pleased to offer what it can to anyone willing to try it (that distro companies extend the OS is NOT apropos). Linux users will, with a small amount of effort, reap solid rewards, but they will feel the pinch when it comes to software, especially commercial games. Cost? Loss of some consistency one gets from a commercial OS. Payoff? Greater sense of accomplishment and a newly learned technical skill. -Windows wants the classic fast food restaurant worker; no prior experience and a willingness to be shaped like clay for practically nothing in return [...] I couldn't agree more with these statements. I have only been using linux for about nice months now, and have found it to be a steep learning curve but well worth it. I have a much better sense of how my computer works now, something I would have never acheived with M$ requiring me to trust them and just point and click and don't ask why. The one thing that really bothers me though is this, I didn't switch to linux to see it become more windows-like. I don't mind the GUI, I have the option of the console. I guess my feeling is that if you want a system that does everything for you without you having to learn about it, why not just stay with windows? Why does linux have to be made easier, some of us like it the way it is. Regards, Dallam -- Dallam Wych [EMAIL PROTECTED] 1024: A89A2371 Ipsa scientia potestas est 2717 4EB8 461D 743B 47CF Registered Linux User 0D68 C32A 5CDE A89A 2371 counter.li.org:213656 ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
-Windows wants the classic fast food restaurant worker; no prior experience and a willingness to be shaped like clay for practically nothing in return. Windows users will, in XP, be coddled through most every task and will be offered ideas on what to do with ones time in front of the computer. Free will and choice are stripped by clever marketing and giving for free only those apps that basic users will find useful. Cost? Loss of choice and diversity. Payoff? A bunch of killer games... if they don't crash... and world wide acceptance (regardless of the fact that it was practically forced). Tyler your statment above, justified my statement. Thanks for respectfully, I get so little here at home g cheers -- Rick Sivernell Dallas, Texas 75287 972 306-2296 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1 Registered Linux User .~. / v \ /( _ )\ ^ ^ In Linux we trust! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
Hmmm, I have found that I do a lot more in consol mode than I did with windowsNT. I was still like GUI's, they have a place. But I get just as much done using both as I need the value that one gets from Linux. Config stuff, compiling, untar etc i use the console others thing I use the GUI. There is a old saying, Use the proper tool for the proper job. cheers -- Rick Sivernell Dallas, Texas 75287 972 306-2296 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1 Registered Linux User .~. / v \ /( _ )\ ^ ^ In Linux we trust! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
- Original Message - From: Dallam Wych [EMAIL PROTECTED] I couldn't agree more with these statements. I have only been using linux for about nice months now, and have found it to be a steep learning curve but well worth it. I have a much better sense of how my computer works now, something I would have never acheived with M$ requiring me to trust them and just point and click and don't ask why. I too find Linux enjoyable and a refreshing change from Win, but I am interested in computers for their own sake. Users, by definition, aren't. The one thing that really bothers me though is this, I didn't switch to linux to see it become more windows-like. I don't mind the GUI, I have the option of the console. I guess my feeling is that if you want a system that does everything for you without you having to learn about it, why not just stay with windows? Why does linux have to be made easier, some of us like it the way it is. Make Linux easier != Make Linux a clone of Windows; And one way Linux can easily 1-up MS is to keep all the under-the-hood options available (command line, etc.) while still making the gui ever more powerful/easier. Keeping Linux just the way it is certainly an option. But then there's no room to complain about MS as we've decided we are perfectly alright with them having a 90+% desktop marketshare. Their monopoly will be secure. With Linux forever relegated to a small niche. Fact is, Linux has gotten *lots* easier. The COL 3.1 I'm working with now is a giant leap from the RH 5.2 I started with 2 years ago. But all the power is still there. Indeed, the power stuff has grown right along with it. Linux could be the first OS in history to make both the Users and the Techies happy. Big Group Hug! Best regards, Michael ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
RE: Linux Mag OT
The one thing that really bothers me though is this, I didn't switch to linux to see it become more windows-like. I don't mind the GUI, I have the option of the console. I guess my feeling is that if you want a system that does everything for you without you having to learn about it, why not just stay with windows? Why does linux have to be made easier, some of us like it the way it is. A good case study here is MacOS X. Apple (supposedly) designed it to be the next step in Macintosh evolution, which means its supposed to be easy and facilitate the users goals without getting in the way. On the other hand, there are no *nix distros like it and hackers seem to like it. This is likely because of X's conquest factor, which is rather high right now. IMHO, I see that there are two dynamics in the Linux community. One says that Linux should be king of the hill and kick Gates in the booty. To get there, said group realizes that concessions will need to be made and Linux *must* become more Windows like. This concept was followed through rather well by Apple with X. The other group is the loyal, diehard hacker that says that if someone wants to use Linux they must endure the learning curve. Computing has never been easy and if one wants to partake of the feast, you must help kill the beast. IOW, you can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs. In an odd sort of way, this whole division is something like the Ford and Chevy debate, but in the end everyone simply drives what they want to drive. We CAN have both an easy to use, intuitive, powerful desktop environment Linux AND the hacker friendly, console ridden, command line Linux at the same time. As proven (at least so far) with MacOS X, this can also come without any limitations levied on either camp. Peace. Tyler ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
RE: Linux Mag OT
Hmmm, I have found that I do a lot more in consol mode than I did with windowsNT. I was still like GUI's, they have a place. But I get just as much done using both as I need the value that one gets from Linux. Config stuff, compiling, untar etc i use the console others thing I use the GUI. There is a old saying, Use the proper tool for the proper job. My point is that you can have several tools that do the same thing. Take MS Word, KWord, AbiWord, Star Writer, and about a hundred others for example. You just pick the tool that suits you the best. Tyler ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On the other hand, there are no *nix distros like it and hackers seem to like it. This is likely because of X's conquest factor, which is rather high right now. Tyler Please exspond her please on the above staement, I am not a Mac user I do not follow completely. cheers -- Rick Sivernell Dallas, Texas 75287 972 306-2296 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1 Registered Linux User .~. / v \ /( _ )\ ^ ^ In Linux we trust! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 10:56:39 -0500 Tom Wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ken Moffat wrote: who is one wagon short of circling the wagons. Techies love linux, but my wife hates it! She'll come around. Mine did. :-) It has taken the better part of 2 1/2 years though. It is just a battle of will power and my will to work in Linux out lasted her will to keep rebooting to get into Windoze. Though she still occasionally does, tis a rare occasion these days. Like when we have to use the scanner. That will be solved when we get a new PC though. Well, I fought the reboot battle for a while, then I went out and bought myself a new computer, so the wife and her equally obstinate daughter could have their windows in peace. Now I have 60 gigs to fill with linux (except for the 6 gigs I left to winme. I have redhat, libranet and elx right now, plus a couple of spare partitions, and a 20 gig fat32 for sharing files.) Everyone seems ok with it. Hopefully they'll come around when they get tired of Win95 on the old P233 ;-) -- Ken Moffat [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
At 09:03 PM 1/21/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Monday 21 January 2002 7 19:24 pm, Ken Moffat dropped these nuggets of information: [schnip] Hopefully they'll come around when they get tired of Win95 on the old P233 ;-) Lucky you, that's what I'm running as my main box still. Someday I'll get a new box, I'm just waiting for processor speed to level off. ;-) Heck by then the I64 stuff will be mainsteam and their speed will be racing ahead towards new max highs:) I set up my wife's computer as a dual boot machine (COL 1.3 -2.4 and win98) Then one day she asked me to take that horrible crap off of her computer. My first thought was darn she hates linux but I was wrong. She wanted win98 removed from her computer, She has since downloaded every plugin for gimp that she can find (now that she has 8Gig to play with) and uses her computer to actively search for info about her adoption. Recently her effort has brought her in touch with her brother Greg who was also adopted at birth, one down, two to go. She can do everything she needs (word processing, household accounting and play games) using Linux. Ted Ozolins (VE7TVO) Westbank, B. C. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On 21 Jan 2002, at 21:03, Tom Wilson boldly uttered: On Monday 21 January 2002 7 19:24 pm, Ken Moffat dropped these nuggets of information: [schnip] Hopefully they'll come around when they get tired of Win95 on the old P233 ;-) Lucky you, that's what I'm running as my main box still. Someday I'll get a new box, I'm just waiting for processor speed to level off. ;-) I like to buy boards with wide CPU compatibility (which means something like ASUS, not Intel), stick a cheap commodity CPU on it (like a Celeron) to begin with and then when the price of the top-end chip for that platform has fallen to pennies on the dollar, scoop one up and sell the old one. People who pay hundreds of dollars extra to have ie a P4 2.2 Ghz chip instead of a 2.0 Ghz chip really should have their head examined, unless they're in some hyper-competitive field (computer animation, scientific data modeling) where cost is no object. -- Philip J. Koenig [EMAIL PROTECTED] Electric Kahuna Systems -- Computers Communications for the New Millenium ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
On Sunday 20 January 2002 19:24, Rick Sivernell wrote: | I was at the book store this afternoon, minding my own | bussiness. I picked up a Linux Mag, right in the middle of the mag | was a M$ web host ad. free XP and free that for isp's. That really | does take go nads. great! if microsoft is willing to spend money so that publications and sites that advocate linux can stay in business, that's just dandy. of course, microsoft ads would be more effective for microsoft in just about any other publication, including ms. and the dairy goat journal. but that's microsoft's concern, not ours. -- dep There is sobbing of the strong, And a pall upon the land; But the People in their weeping Bare the iron hand; Beware the People weeping When they bare the iron hand. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
Well, I guess in Linux we do need a break a good laugh too. cheers -- Rick Sivernell Dallas, Texas 75287 972 306-2296 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera Open Linux eWorkStation 3.1 Registered Linux User .~. / v \ /( _ )\ ^ ^ In Linux we trust! ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
Re: Linux Mag OT
dep wrote: On Sunday 20 January 2002 19:24, Rick Sivernell wrote: | I was at the book store this afternoon, minding my own | bussiness. I picked up a Linux Mag, right in the middle of the mag | was a M$ web host ad. free XP and free that for isp's. That really | does take go nads. great! if microsoft is willing to spend money so that publications and sites that advocate linux can stay in business, that's just dandy. of course, microsoft ads would be more effective for microsoft in just about any other publication, including ms. and the dairy goat journal. but that's microsoft's concern, not ours. -- dep I believe that M$ is more concerned than just a little. After years of just ignoring Linux M$ has had a few nasty turn of events lately. XP is in the process of bombing and software writers are starting to advise businesses to look at Linux as an alternative to M$. Then Big Blue dumps $10 million worth of Linux software on the net so show their commitment to Linux. That drove the price of Red Hat from $4 a share to $8 on the market and Caldera's stock went from $.22/share to $1.89 (now back to $.95). Then their hot Linux memo gets leaked to the press and to add to their misery, Mandrake starts shopping around for businesses to highlight in their ads who have switched from M$ to Linux to counter M$'s ads. And, you know those IBM ads featuring the stolen servers being replaced by IBM's running Linux must be driving up sales of Rolaids in Redmond. Finally, AOL annpunces that it is in talks to buy Red Hat. Which would leave AOL to go after a piece M$'s desktop market while IBM! keeps thumping away at M$'s server market. Gates might start feeling like a wagonmaster under indian attack who is one wagon short of circling the wagons. Lee There is sobbing of the strong, And a pall upon the land; But the People in their weeping Bare the iron hand; Beware the People weeping When they bare the iron hand. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL. ___ Linux-users mailing list - http://linux.nf/mailman/listinfo/linux-users Subscribe/Unsubscribe info, Archives,and Digests are located at the above URL.
