Re: feature request: text search in LaTex Preamble

[Richard Kimberly Heck]

On 03/31/2018 04:32 PM, David Pesetsky wrote:
> I often find myself hunting for something in the preamble and having to cut 
> and paste the contents of the "Document Settings/LaTex Preamble" window into 
> a text processing program to search for what I want. (And then I sometimes 
> tinker with it in the text processing program, forgetting that this does 
> nothing until I go back to LyX and make the change there.) It would be nice 
> to have a text search facility available within this LyX window, if possible. 
> Or am I missing something and the feature is there somewhere?
>
> (If there is another place to post feature requests let me know.  The bug 
> tracker looks like it's only for bugs.)

It also accepts enhancement requests. Just choose "enhancement" as the Type.

Riki

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Ross Reyes]

Alex,  This did not work for me.

I can run the python script from the command line and it does produce a 
.png output.   So I know the

script is working.

But, in LyX 2.0.1 which I'm using, I get "Error converting to loadable 
format".  I am trying to debug it.
Not sure at this point why it does not convert inside LyX.  I double 
checked the file format is defined and

also the converter is defined correctly.

I will try to turn on a log file to see if there are some other 
diagnostic messages.


Phil
On 6/2/2014 1:25 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
This might work!! Thanks for the suggestions, I will try it 
extensively and I will comments my experiences afterwards. It seems it 
also renders the graphic inside LyX itself! That's what I was talking 
about.


Regards
Alex

- Original Message - From: "Rainer M Krug" 
To: "Alex Vergara Gil" 
Cc: "Richard Heck" ; "lyx-users Users" 
; 

Sent: Monday, June 02, 2014 8:31 AM
Subject: Re: [Feature Request] python binding

I just add comments inline


Let's see if I understand:


-1. You define a *file type* in LyX under
 Preferences > File Handling > File Formats
for the file type .pygr in which "Vector graphics format" is ticked!

0. You define a converter under
 Preferences > File Handling > Converters
which calls a script which executed files with the extension .pygr and
generates, as you suggest below, an svg.


1. I wrote a python script that produces the graphic I want


Exactly - and you give it a specific extension .pygr for "python
script which generates a graphic" which you defined above.


2. I insert it in LyX somehow I don't know, perhaps defining a
converter from .py to svg, but this needs to be inside a module or
every python script in LyX will try to be converted into a svg!! So a
module is also needed


Use insert graphic and select *your .pygr* file as graphic - and Lyx
will do the rest of the conversion - i.e. use your converter to convert
the .pygr to an svg and other existing converters to generate the png
for the preview and the pdf / eps / ... for the final copmpilation of
the document.


3. LyX is the one who knows the correct size of the graphic so in
principle if I produce a svg should be enough but in this way I need
to produce a new svg every time the data change


Correct - if the input data changes, you have to generate the graph again
manually, or, if the "Converter file cache" is disabled, you just have
to close the document and open it again.

Hope this helps,

Rainer

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Alex Vergara Gil]

This might work!! Thanks for the suggestions, I will try it extensively and 
I will comments my experiences afterwards. It seems it also renders the 
graphic inside LyX itself! That's what I was talking about.


Regards
Alex

- Original Message - 
From: "Rainer M Krug" 

To: "Alex Vergara Gil" 
Cc: "Richard Heck" ; "lyx-users Users" 
; 

Sent: Monday, June 02, 2014 8:31 AM
Subject: Re: [Feature Request] python binding

I just add comments inline


Let's see if I understand:


-1. You define a *file type* in LyX under
 Preferences > File Handling > File Formats
for the file type .pygr in which "Vector graphics format" is ticked!

0. You define a converter under
 Preferences > File Handling > Converters
which calls a script which executed files with the extension .pygr and
generates, as you suggest below, an svg.


1. I wrote a python script that produces the graphic I want


Exactly - and you give it a specific extension .pygr for "python
script which generates a graphic" which you defined above.


2. I insert it in LyX somehow I don't know, perhaps defining a
converter from .py to svg, but this needs to be inside a module or
every python script in LyX will try to be converted into a svg!! So a
module is also needed


Use insert graphic and select *your .pygr* file as graphic - and Lyx
will do the rest of the conversion - i.e. use your converter to convert
the .pygr to an svg and other existing converters to generate the png
for the preview and the pdf / eps / ... for the final copmpilation of
the document.


3. LyX is the one who knows the correct size of the graphic so in
principle if I produce a svg should be enough but in this way I need
to produce a new svg every time the data change


Correct - if the input data changes, you have to generate the graph again
manually, or, if the "Converter file cache" is disabled, you just have
to close the document and open it again.

Hope this helps,

Rainer

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Rainer M Krug]

"Alex Vergara Gil"  writes:

> From: "Richard Heck" 
> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 5:05 PM
>>> I might be *completely* off, but couldn't you achieve exactly this via
>>> defining converters? I have for example a converter defined, which
>>> "converts" plantuml source fields into uml graphs, i.e. it defines the
>>> call to compile them and return the graphs which are then inserted in
>>> the document?
>> 
>> Yes, that's more or less what I was suggesting.
>> 
>> rh
>> 
>

I just add comments inline

> Let's see if I understand:

-1. You define a *file type* in LyX under 
  Preferences > File Handling > File Formats
for the file type .pygr in which "Vector graphics format" is ticked!

0. You define a converter under
  Preferences > File Handling > Converters
which calls a script which executed files with the extension .pygr and
generates, as you suggest below, an svg.

> 1. I wrote a python script that produces the graphic I want

Exactly - and you give it a specific extension .pygr for "python
script which generates a graphic" which you defined above.

> 2. I insert it in LyX somehow I don't know, perhaps defining a
> converter from .py to svg, but this needs to be inside a module or
> every python script in LyX will try to be converted into a svg!! So a
> module is also needed

Use insert graphic and select *your .pygr* file as graphic - and Lyx
will do the rest of the conversion - i.e. use your converter to convert
the .pygr to an svg and other existing converters to generate the png
for the preview and the pdf / eps / ... for the final copmpilation of
the document.

> 3. LyX is the one who knows the correct size of the graphic so in
> principle if I produce a svg should be enough but in this way I need
> to produce a new svg every time the data change

Correct - if the input data changes, you have to generate the graph again
manually, or, if the "Converter file cache" is disabled, you just have
to close the document and open it again. 

Hope this helps,

Rainer

>
> Take this simple script as example
>
> import numpy as np
> from numpy.random import randn
> import matplotlib as mpl
> import matplotlib.pyplot as plt
> np.random.seed(9221999)
> data = randn(75)
> plt.hist(data)
>
> which produce a graphic like this in spyder
>
>
>
> So basically I save this graphic to a svg and then I load it into LyX,
> but why not letting LyX doing this automatically if it already handles
> with python?? This is my question.
>
> Regards
>
> Alex

-- 
Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology, 
UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)

Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
Stellenbosch University
South Africa

Tel :   +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
Cell:   +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
Fax :   +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44

Fax (D):+49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44

email:  rai...@krugs.de

Skype:  RMkrug

PGP: 0x0F52F982


pgp86MxwTSdD2.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Alex Vergara Gil]

From: "Richard Heck" 
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 5:05 PM
>> I might be *completely* off, but couldn't you achieve exactly this via
>> defining converters? I have for example a converter defined, which
>> "converts" plantuml source fields into uml graphs, i.e. it defines the
>> call to compile them and return the graphs which are then inserted in
>> the document?
> 
> Yes, that's more or less what I was suggesting.
> 
> rh
> 

Let's see if I understand:
1. I wrote a python script that produces the graphic I want
2. I insert it in LyX somehow I don't know, perhaps defining a converter from 
.py to svg, but this needs to be inside a module or every python script in LyX 
will try to be converted into a svg!! So a module is also needed
3. LyX is the one who knows the correct size of the graphic so in principle if 
I produce a svg should be enough but in this way I need to produce a new svg 
every time the data change

Take this simple script as example

import numpy as np
from numpy.random import randn
import matplotlib as mpl
import matplotlib.pyplot as plt
np.random.seed(9221999)
data = randn(75)
plt.hist(data)

which produce a graphic like this in spyder



So basically I save this graphic to a svg and then I load it into LyX, but why 
not letting LyX doing this automatically if it already handles with python?? 
This is my question.

Regards

Alex

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 3:36 PM, Alex Vergara Gil  wrote:
> Hello Lyxers
>
> I wonder why LyX is not available to process little pieces of python code
> within its own framework, like ipython notebook for instance??
> This feature allows us to have beautiful graphics such the one produced by
> matplotlib package. I know there already exists a similar binding for R
> through knitr module, so why not a binding for python too??
>
> Is there a way, like modules or whatever, to achieve the same functionality
> or at least some basic functionality of ipython notebook within LyX??

Hi Alex,

Have you tried using knitr for python? Attached is a simple example
and the output created. For more info, see
http://yihui.name/knitr/demo/engines/ . graphics and everything else
should also work, although you might need to add custom hooks (not as
hard as it sounds).

This might not be ideal because you have to have R installed (knitr is
still itself written in R). But I would be curious in your thoughts.

Scott


python_knitr.21.lyx
Description: application/lyx


python_knitr.21.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Richard Heck]

On 05/29/2014 04:57 PM, Rainer M Krug wrote:

"Alex Vergara Gil"  writes:

   Richard you obviously miss the point here, or I was not very clear!
it is not a different format, is a facility to have python scripts
running within LyX framework, you have to see ipython notebook to
understand what I mean, you will be surprised!!  Basically to build
graphs, for instance (and only a piece of what can be done), you add
the (let's call it) "knitpy" module and then place a knitpy insert,
write some python code that produces a matplotlib graphic and then
when lyx compiles the document, instead of the code it is shown the
graph, it also can be done in the lyx editing window, but thats a more
dificult request.
I might be *completely* off, but couldn't you achieve exactly this via
defining converters? I have for example a converter defined, which
"converts" plantuml source fields into uml graphs, i.e. it defines the
call to compile them and return the graphs which are then inserted in
the document?


Yes, that's more or less what I was suggesting.

rh

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Richard Heck]

On 05/29/2014 05:34 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:


*From:* Richard Heck 
*Sent:* Thursday, May 29, 2014 3:26 PM

On 05/29/2014 03:36 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:

Hello Lyxers
I wonder why LyX is not available to process little pieces of
python code within its own framework, like ipython notebook for
instance??

This feature allows us to have beautiful graphics such the one
produced by matplotlib package. I know there already exists a
similar binding for R through knitr module, so why not a binding
for python too??
Is there a way, like modules or whatever, to achieve the same
functionality or at least some basic functionality of ipython
notebook within LyX??

Can you be more precise about what you want to do? I've never
heard of ipython notebook.

sudo aptitude install ipython-notebook
ipython notebook

and there you can write even thesis in a web environment with python 
commands being executed inlined, exporting to pdf and latex too, it is 
a wonder of our times, so why not letting LyX do this miracle too??


Sweave works by our having an output format (sweave) for such
documentsand then our declaring Rscript as a sweave --> LaTeX
converter, so PDF export (say) goes via Rscript and pdflatex.
There's a special script in lib/scripts/ that "sets up some things
for LyX"first, or so it claims. It would be reasonably easy to do
the same sort of thing for Python, if you wanted to do so. You'd
just need to set up an appropriate format and then declare an
appropriate script as a whatever -> latex converter. Then LyX will
run the script and do as you wish with the embedded python code.

Of course, as we've discussed on the list with respect to R, there
are large security issues here, too.

Richard

you obviously miss the point here, or I was not very clear! it is not 
a different format, is a facility to have python scripts running 
within LyX framework, you have to see ipython notebook to understand 
what I mean, you will be surprised!!
Basically to build graphs, for instance (and only a piece of what can 
be done), you add the (let's call it) "knitpy" module and then place a 
knitpy insert, write some python code that produces a matplotlib 
graphic and then when lyx compiles the document, instead of the code 
it is shown the graph, it also can be done in the lyx editing window, 
but thats a more dificult request.


No, that's exactly what I had in mind: Python code inthe document that 
gets executed at compile timeto create graphsor tables---or delete all 
your files. ;-) Formats are a LyX-internal method for keeping track of 
such thingsas what stage of compilation a document is at. The file 
format wouldn't really be different.


Richard

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Rainer M Krug]

"Alex Vergara Gil"  writes:

>   From: Richard Heck 
>   Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 3:26 PM
>
>
>   On 05/29/2014 03:36 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
>
> Hello Lyxers
>
> I wonder why LyX is not available to process little pieces of
> python code within its own framework, like ipython notebook for
> instance??
>
>
> This feature allows us to have beautiful graphics such the one
> produced by matplotlib package. I know there already exists a
> similar binding for R through knitr module, so why not a binding
> for python too??
>
> Is there a way, like modules or whatever, to achieve the same
> functionality or at least some basic functionality of ipython notebook
> within LyX??  Can you be more precise about what you want to do? I've
> never heard of ipython notebook.  sudo aptitude install
> ipython-notebook ipython notebook
>
> and there you can write even thesis in a web environment with python
> commands being executed inlined, exporting to pdf and latex too, it is
> a wonder of our times, so why not letting LyX do this miracle too??
>
>   Sweave works by our having an output format (sweave) for such
>   documents and then our declaring Rscript as a sweave --> LaTeX
>   converter, so PDF export (say) goes via Rscript and
>   pdflatex. There's a special script in lib/scripts/ that "sets up
>   some things for LyX" first, or so it claims. It would be reasonably
>   easy to do the same sort of thing for Python, if you wanted to do
>   so. You'd just need to set up an appropriate format and then declare
>   an appropriate script as a whatever -> latex converter. Then LyX
>   will run the script and do as you wish with the embedded python
>   code.
>
>   Of course, as we've discussed on the list with respect to R, there are 
> large security issues here, too.
>
>   Richard you obviously miss the point here, or I was not very clear!
> it is not a different format, is a facility to have python scripts
> running within LyX framework, you have to see ipython notebook to
> understand what I mean, you will be surprised!!  Basically to build
> graphs, for instance (and only a piece of what can be done), you add
> the (let's call it) "knitpy" module and then place a knitpy insert,
> write some python code that produces a matplotlib graphic and then
> when lyx compiles the document, instead of the code it is shown the
> graph, it also can be done in the lyx editing window, but thats a more
> dificult request.

I might be *completely* off, but couldn't you achieve exactly this via
defining converters? I have for example a converter defined, which
"converts" plantuml source fields into uml graphs, i.e. it defines the
call to compile them and return the graphs which are then inserted in
the document?

I have never used python, but I guess a similar approach should be
possible here as well?

Cheers,

Rainer


>
> Regards
> Alex

-- 
Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology, 
UCT), Dipl. Phys. (Germany)

Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
Stellenbosch University
South Africa

Tel :   +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
Cell:   +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
Fax :   +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44

Fax (D):+49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44

email:  rai...@krugs.de

Skype:  RMkrug

PGP: 0x0F52F982


pgpNzrUAU7G2A.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Alex Vergara Gil]

  From: Richard Heck 
  Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2014 3:26 PM


  On 05/29/2014 03:36 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:

Hello Lyxers

I wonder why LyX is not available to process little pieces of python code 
within its own framework, like ipython notebook for instance??


This feature allows us to have beautiful graphics such the one produced by 
matplotlib package. I know there already exists a similar binding for R through 
knitr module, so why not a binding for python too??

Is there a way, like modules or whatever, to achieve the same functionality 
or at least some basic functionality of ipython notebook within LyX??
  Can you be more precise about what you want to do? I've never heard of 
ipython notebook.
sudo aptitude install ipython-notebook
ipython notebook

and there you can write even thesis in a web environment with python commands 
being executed inlined, exporting to pdf and latex too, it is a wonder of our 
times, so why not letting LyX do this miracle too??

  Sweave works by our having an output format (sweave) for such documents and 
then our declaring Rscript as a sweave --> LaTeX converter, so PDF export (say) 
goes via Rscript and pdflatex. There's a special script in lib/scripts/ that 
"sets up some things for LyX" first, or so it claims. It would be reasonably 
easy to do the same sort of thing for Python, if you wanted to do so. You'd 
just need to set up an appropriate format and then declare an appropriate 
script as a whatever -> latex converter. Then LyX will run the script and do as 
you wish with the embedded python code.

  Of course, as we've discussed on the list with respect to R, there are large 
security issues here, too.

  Richard
you obviously miss the point here, or I was not very clear! it is not a 
different format, is a facility to have python scripts running within LyX 
framework, you have to see ipython notebook to understand what I mean, you will 
be surprised!!
Basically to build graphs, for instance (and only a piece of what can be done), 
you add the (let's call it) "knitpy" module and then place a knitpy insert, 
write some python code that produces a matplotlib graphic and then when lyx 
compiles the document, instead of the code it is shown the graph, it also can 
be done in the lyx editing window, but thats a more dificult request.

Regards
Alex

Re: [Feature Request] python binding

[Richard Heck]

On 05/29/2014 03:36 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:

Hello Lyxers
I wonder why LyX is not available to process little pieces of python 
code within its own framework, like ipython notebook for instance??


This feature allows us to have beautiful graphics such the one 
produced by matplotlib package. I know there already exists a similar 
binding for R through knitr module, so why not a binding for python too??
Is there a way, like modules or whatever, to achieve the same 
functionality or at least some basic functionality of ipython notebook 
within LyX??


Can you be more precise about what you want to do? I've never heard of 
ipython notebook.


Sweave works by our having an output format (sweave) for such 
documentsand then our declaring Rscript as a sweave --> LaTeX converter, 
so PDF export (say) goes via Rscript and pdflatex. There's a special 
script in lib/scripts/ that "sets up some things for LyX"first, or so it 
claims. It would be reasonably easy to do the same sort of thing for 
Python, if you wanted to do so. You'd just need to set up an appropriate 
format and then declare an appropriate script as a whatever -> latex 
converter. Then LyX will run the script and do as you wish with the 
embedded python code.


Of course, as we've discussed on the list with respect to R, there are 
large security issues here, too.


Richard

Re: Feature request

[Scott Kostyshak]

Thanks Jim. I just responded to your feature request. Let's continue
the conversation on the trac ticket.

Scott

On Sat, Feb 1, 2014 at 6:49 PM, Jim Rockford  wrote:
> Thanks for your attention Scott.  I just submitted the enhancement request
> you suggested.
>
> Best,
> Jim
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 4:43 PM, Scott Kostyshak  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Jim,
>>
>> Do you think something like the insert table icon would work well for
>> matrices? If you haven't tried it yet, click on the "Insert table"
>> icon in the top toolbar. If matrices worked in this way, would you
>> consider that better or worse than how MathType does it?
>>
>> Can you open an enhancement request on trac for this?
>> http://www.lyx.org/trac
>> Also on the trac ticket can you post a screenshot of what MathType
>> does? I'm wondering what the user interface is like.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Scott
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 4:29 PM, Jim Rockford 
>> wrote:
>> > MathType has the nice feature that when you click to insert a matrix,
>> > one
>> > has the choice of immediately inserting a typical low-dimensional matrix
>> > (i.e. 2x2, 3x3, 3x1, etc), in addition to the option of setting the row
>> > and
>> > column numbers manually.  As far as I can tell, in Lyx you must always
>> > specify the dimension explicitly.  I find this a bit of a nuisance and
>> > thus
>> > make the feature request.
>> >
>> > Thanks to the Lyx team for their great work and their consideration of
>> > user
>> > feature requests.
>> >
>> > Jim
>
>

Re: Feature request

[Scott Kostyshak]

Hi Jim,

Do you think something like the insert table icon would work well for
matrices? If you haven't tried it yet, click on the "Insert table"
icon in the top toolbar. If matrices worked in this way, would you
consider that better or worse than how MathType does it?

Can you open an enhancement request on trac for this? http://www.lyx.org/trac
Also on the trac ticket can you post a screenshot of what MathType
does? I'm wondering what the user interface is like.

Best,

Scott

On Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 4:29 PM, Jim Rockford  wrote:
> MathType has the nice feature that when you click to insert a matrix, one
> has the choice of immediately inserting a typical low-dimensional matrix
> (i.e. 2x2, 3x3, 3x1, etc), in addition to the option of setting the row and
> column numbers manually.  As far as I can tell, in Lyx you must always
> specify the dimension explicitly.  I find this a bit of a nuisance and thus
> make the feature request.
>
> Thanks to the Lyx team for their great work and their consideration of user
> feature requests.
>
> Jim

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Ray Rashif]

On 4 April 2013 07:11, Richard Heck  wrote:
> On 04/03/2013 04:41 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Alex Vergara Gil wrote:

 I don´t know if thi request can be made inside Qt (I think there should
 be some package for this in the nokia library!).
>>>
>>> Pavel Sanda wrote:
>>> No it isn't. Mr Google suggest that "Qt team at one point stopped
>>> developing
>>> the control due to Microsoft licensing."
>>> This sounds funny given the fact that tabbed toolbar was already around
>>> in 90s
>>> and I remember it from Borland's Delphi UI.
>>>
>>> Pavel
>>>
>>
>>
>> Yes indeed, this sounds like we should not be able to build frames at all
>> because they look like Microsoft´s Windows and these are licensed by
>> Microsoft ;) so what kind of things are legal or not? This point puts even
>> more fuzzy to my logic! I thougth graphic design as long as it is not equal
>> are not the same and we can make the ribbon as different as we want, just
>> keeping the idea and even better, instead of putting it in the top we can
>> put then at the left so we can avoid the vertical space eating that Jacob
>> mentioned.
>
>
> Though one can put it this way: Nokia decided they did not wish to spend a
> gazillion dollars fighting a patent case, even if they might win it in the
> end, and even if Microsoft's patent makes about as much sense as the old
> joke that they would eventually patent 0 and 1.
>
> Remember: Apple got a design patent for a rectangle with rounded corners,
> and they won a patent infringement suit against Samsung. Really.
>
> That's the sad state of US patent law.

Hi guys this might be an interesting example of something like those
ribbon menus on Linux (with Qt):

http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/03/wps-office-for-linux-looks-like-microsoft-office-but-isnt

"The Qt suite apes the interface of Microsoft’s ‘Ribbon’ interface,
and whilst I can’t tell you whether it’s 100% accurate in its
replication (I haven’t used Microsoft Office long enough to tell),
it’s certainly authentic looking."

Just thought I'd share this -- not that I particularly love this kind
of UI (I don't dislike it either). I work extensively cross-platform
and sometimes with very old hardware/software as well so I tend to
adapt wherever needed without much trouble, so to say.


--
GPG/PGP ID: C0711BF1

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Liviu Andronic]

On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 9:46 PM, Nico Williams  wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 1:36 PM, Liviu Andronic  wrote:
>> On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 8:20 PM, Nico Williams  wrote:
>>> textual user, I prefer everything as textual as possible.  I'd even
>>> like a search feature for menus/functions, and in general I'd like
>>>
>> That's a good idea and easy to pull-off: Put in a search box that will
>> filter UI-elements given a keyword. Similar to what we do in Settings
>> and in outline.
>
> OK, well, while we're at it, here's another thing I'd like: to be able
> to create my own menus and toolbars, and this probably (oddly enough,
> for me) graphically by dragging things into custom menus/toolbars.  In
> particular I use custom insets a fair bit, so I'd like to make use of
> custom insets much easier than now.
>
This could be made part of the Toolbar customization dialog (
http://wiki.lyx.org/Devel/SummerOfCode2013Ideas#toc6 ) project for
GSoC 2013. If only we had a mentor and a student for the project.

Liviu

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Nico Williams]

On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 1:36 PM, Liviu Andronic  wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 8:20 PM, Nico Williams  wrote:
>> textual user, I prefer everything as textual as possible.  I'd even
>> like a search feature for menus/functions, and in general I'd like
>>
> That's a good idea and easy to pull-off: Put in a search box that will
> filter UI-elements given a keyword. Similar to what we do in Settings
> and in outline.

OK, well, while we're at it, here's another thing I'd like: to be able
to create my own menus and toolbars, and this probably (oddly enough,
for me) graphically by dragging things into custom menus/toolbars.  In
particular I use custom insets a fair bit, so I'd like to make use of
custom insets much easier than now.

Nico
--

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Liviu Andronic]

On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 8:20 PM, Nico Williams  wrote:
> textual user, I prefer everything as textual as possible.  I'd even
> like a search feature for menus/functions, and in general I'd like
>
That's a good idea and easy to pull-off: Put in a search box that will
filter UI-elements given a keyword. Similar to what we do in Settings
and in outline.

Liviu

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Nico Williams]

Since we're piling on...

I don't mind the sort of ribbon menu as they've evolved to be at MSFT,
but I do prefer pull-down menus with *text* instead of icons.  I'm a
textual user, I prefer everything as textual as possible.  I'd even
like a search feature for menus/functions, and in general I'd like
search to be as powerful as possible.  I'm so text-oriented that I'd
rather you add vi keybindings than ribbon menus.

Still, that said, if you organize the implementation cleverly, then
you could easily give the user the option of traditional vs. "ribbon"
menus.  I don't care if you do implement the option for ribbon menus
but it strikes me as a good idea to organize the implementation such
that you *can* add the option with minimal effort later.

Nico
--

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[katsumi liquer]

As someone who routinely uses LyX on different platforms between Mac OS X
and Windows 7 I just wanted to say that I think the LyX interface is
beautiful. It strikes a great balance of feeling native and attractive on
all platforms in my opinion, and with the higher resolutions many displays
have these days I can keep all the toolbars turned out without any issues.

OT:

LyX has really been a transformative tool for me -- I went from being
miserable and suffering in other word processors to being proficient and
passionate about my work again because I feel LyX helps the user be
organized and productive rather than working against them.

Thank you LyX developers, you have made an absolutely spectacular tool and
your efforts are hugely appreciated!

On Tue, Apr 9, 2013 at 10:52 AM, EK  wrote:

>  *PLEASE DO NOT CONSIDER RIBBON MENUS-*- they are (one of the many)
> reason(s) I switched from MS-WORD to Lyx in the first place!
> They hide what you are looking for!
>
> Ehud Kaplan
>
>
>
> On 04/07/2013 04:05 PM, Clemens Eisserer wrote:
>
> > Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.
>
> This is also my personal oppinion.
> I have to use Office-2010 sometimes, and whenever I can I revert to
> LibreOffice mostly because of the awkward UI ms office has.
>
>
> Regards
>
>
>
>

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[EK]

  
  
PLEASE DO NOT CONSIDER RIBBON MENUS-- they are (one of the
many) reason(s) I switched from MS-WORD to Lyx in the first place!
They hide what you are looking for!

Ehud Kaplan


On 04/07/2013 04:05 PM, Clemens
  Eisserer wrote:


  
  > Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.
  
  
  This is also my personal oppinion.
  I have to use Office-2010 sometimes, and whenever I can I revert
  to LibreOffice mostly because of the awkward UI ms office has.
  
  
  Regards




  

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Clemens Eisserer]

> Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.

This is also my personal oppinion.
I have to use Office-2010 sometimes, and whenever I can I revert to
LibreOffice mostly because of the awkward UI ms office has.


Regards

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Wolfgang Keller]

> > Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.  I find
> > them quite difficult to use, it takes ages to find what you are
> > looking for.  Quite probably they are ok when you get used to them,
> > but there is really no need for all to go the M$ way.
> 
> This is also my judgement after having being forced to use these
> menus over the past months. But certainly, this is a matter of will
> and personal taste.

It isn't. Even if an empirical one, ergonomics is still a science with
very well established rules. 

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Wolfgang Keller]

> I have a feature request if this is not already requested to you:
> Ribbon Menus.

> What are your opinions about this? Is this approach correct to you?

Anti-ergonomic garbage.

"Ribbon menus" are a cerebral flatulance emanating from some product
manager's "brain" at MS.

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Alex Vergara Gil]

- Original Message - 
From: "Jürgen Spitzmüller" 

To: 
Sent: Friday, April 05, 2013 11:16 AM
Subject: Re: feature request: ribbon menus




Well, this is an open source project. So if there are no license issues,
everybody who is motivated enough to implement and maintain such an UI is 
of

course allowed to go ahead and propose a patch.

This was my initial intention, but I was exploring in this list to see if 
there are some users who actually want this. Not the case, so the intention 
seems to have wrong fundations. My bad :(



At the moment, nobody seems to be really enthusiastic, so one consequence
could be that you do it yourself (this is actually exactly how I came into 
LyX

development).

Jürgen

I am learning Qt right now but I have some experience developing, especially 
with UI. My concept of a text editor software always include ribbon menus 
and thats why I shout this proposition, but without community acceptance any 
purpose is a nonsense! So next time will be.


Alex

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Walter van Holst]

On 2013-04-05 16:49, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:


As I said this is my personal opinion so I migth be wrong, but I
haven´t received any useful opinion (besides M$ patent) of why not
doing such a thing just a few user complaining they will affect some
how what they feel is comfortable. Regarding the patent believe me
that if they patent 0s and 1s then we are definitively lost.:)


Several people have responded that ribbon  menus have limited use to 
them, to say the least. I don't think that is a useless opinion.


As someone who spends most of his working hours in Microsoft's ribbon 
menus, allow me to add to the chorus that ribbon menus tend to be 
spiteful and useless. And no, they don't really grow on you. I have no 
idea what flavour of LSD Microsoft's usability experts have been 
consuming, but I hope it is widely available so that if I ever contract 
a terminal disease I'd like to spend my final hours tripping on that 
stuff.


I'd much rather have people spend time on a concurrent user web 
front-end. Or a curses front-end to LyX. Either of these two are more 
likely to serve users well than the bloody ribbon menus.


Regards,

 Walter

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Alex Vergara Gil]

- Original Message - 
From: "Steve Litt" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2013 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: feature request: ribbon menus



On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 14:31:07 +0200 (CEST)
Csikos Bela  wrote:


Alex Vergara Gil  írta:

>Hello developers!
>
>I have a feature request if this is not already >
>requested to you: Ribbon Menus.>

I don't know what ribbon menus is, and I may not be the only one.
You should have explained it, attached an image, or given a link
where it is explained.


The way I see it, if LyX developers were to have enough time to put in
this UI eye candy, that time would be much better spent, for instance,
finishing the job of making LyX a full outliner that can add, delete,
change and move nodes. Or something else necessary or highly desirable
for someone who actually uses it to create large volumes of content.

Next thing you know, somebody will ask for an io/s looking interface to
match his iPhone.

SteveT


Changes in UI like this one takes to anyone just 1 day, it is just a matter 
of decide to make it or not, however the changes you mentioned take a lot of 
coding and a lot of man-hour work, so the time scale is not comparable.


On the other hand ribbon menus once you get use to them you find your 
productivity increasing, actually LyX has something that is like this: "The 
math toolbar", which groups several common operators in just one menu and 
have several menus grouped by functionality. If the ribbon appearance is 
problematic then you can create something like the math toolbar for every 
toolbar and put them in just one toolbar. I see people here who argue with 
this because they would not have everything in front of their eyes, really!! 
then why don´t you complain of not having every single option visible in 
toolbars? What I beg is an UI organization grouping icons by functionality, 
so the resulting toolbar (or ribbon menu) should be smaller and highly 
configurable. Come on people, not only M$ do this, even Apple and there are 
some linux programs that are using a similar approach right now. Static 
toolbars are obsolete in terms of modern GUIs. This request is not for 
beautyness but for increasing productivity.


As I said this is my personal opinion so I migth be wrong, but I haven´t 
received any useful opinion (besides M$ patent) of why not doing such a 
thing just a few user complaining they will affect some how what they feel 
is comfortable. Regarding the patent believe me that if they patent 0s and 
1s then we are definitively lost.:)


Alex

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[John Kane]

 From: stefano franchi 
To: Csikos Bela  
Cc: "lyx-users@lists.lyx.org"  
Sent: Thursday, April 4, 2013 10:04:41 AM
Subject: Re: feature request: ribbon menus
 



On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 7:31 AM, Csikos Bela  wrote:

If ribbon menus is what Windows has in their menus, that is only the first
>few items are shown and then you have to click an arrow to make other
>menu items visible, 
>

That used to be what ribbon menus were all about, hence the name.

They no longer have the "ribbon-like" functionality now, but the name has 
apparently stuck. No wonder you are confused, so is everyone else not working 
on Windows. Here is a link to a Microsoft Word screen shot showing the ribbon:

http://techhelpvideos.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/word-2007_2003-menus.jpg


Ah, I remember them. I had to use Word a few months ago and those ribbons make 
a 10 minute job 30 minutes of hell.  



You'll find a gazillion more on Google Images

In my experience, most people not working on Microsoft Office on a daily basis 
(Mac versions have ribbons too) find them confusing.  I would certainly not 
impose them on Linux/non-Office users.


Cheers,

S.


-- 
__
Stefano Franchi
Associate Research Professor
Department of Hispanic Studies            Ph:   +1 (979) 845-2125
Texas A&M University                          Fax:  +1 (979) 845-6421
College Station, Texas, USA

stef...@tamu.edu
http://stefano.cleinias.org 

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Steve Litt]

On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 14:31:07 +0200 (CEST)
Csikos Bela  wrote:

> Alex Vergara Gil  írta:
> 
> >Hello developers!
> >
> >I have a feature request if this is not already >
> >requested to you: Ribbon Menus.>
> 
> I don't know what ribbon menus is, and I may not be the only one.
> You should have explained it, attached an image, or given a link
> where it is explained.

The way I see it, if LyX developers were to have enough time to put in
this UI eye candy, that time would be much better spent, for instance,
finishing the job of making LyX a full outliner that can add, delete,
change and move nodes. Or something else necessary or highly desirable
for someone who actually uses it to create large volumes of content.

Next thing you know, somebody will ask for an io/s looking interface to
match his iPhone.

SteveT

Steve Litt*  http://www.troubleshooters.com/
Troubleshooting Training  *  Human Performance

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[stefano franchi]

On Thu, Apr 4, 2013 at 7:31 AM, Csikos Bela  wrote:

> If ribbon menus is what Windows has in their menus, that is only the first
> few items are shown and then you have to click an arrow to make other
> menu items visible,
>

That used to be what ribbon menus were all about, hence the name.
They no longer have the "ribbon-like" functionality now, but the name has
apparently stuck. No wonder you are confused, so is everyone else not
working on Windows. Here is a link to a Microsoft Word screen shot showing
the ribbon:

http://techhelpvideos.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/word-2007_2003-menus.jpg

You'll find a gazillion more on Google Images
In my experience, most people not working on Microsoft Office on a daily
basis (Mac versions have ribbons too) find them confusing.  I would
certainly not impose them on Linux/non-Office users.

Cheers,

S.

-- 
__
Stefano Franchi
Associate Research Professor
Department of Hispanic StudiesPh:   +1 (979) 845-2125
Texas A&M University  Fax:  +1 (979) 845-6421
College Station, Texas, USA

stef...@tamu.edu
http://stefano.cleinias.org

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Csikos Bela]

Alex Vergara Gil  írta:

>Hello developers!
>
>I have a feature request if this is not already >
>requested to you: Ribbon Menus.>

I don't know what ribbon menus is, and I may not be the only one.
You should have explained it, attached an image, or given a link where it is 
explained.

>The actual look of lyx makes duplicate functions in >
>text menus and icon menus,

That is good. Some prefer icons, some text. I prefer having both text
menus and icons.

> besides there is a lot of space wasted by >allocating >
>the icon menus.

??? I don't understand what you mean by "wasted space".
Do you mean the toolbars itself? It is possible to customize the toolbars
and even remove them.

> This has nothing to do with intrinsic code but to UI graphic >
>design. This modern approach is the best to maximize functionality and >avoid 
>duplicating functionality.

Maximizing funcionality by removing alternative approaches?
Are you serious?

If ribbon menus is what Windows has in their menus, that is only the first
few items are shown and then you have to click an arrow to make other
menu items visible, then I don't want anything like that. That menu type
is useless and annoying.

bcsikos

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Charlie]

 On Thu, 04 Apr 2013 12:47:25 +0200 "Jürgen Spitzmüller sp...@lyx.org"
 sent this:

>Juha Meriluoto wrote:
>> Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.  I find
>> them quite difficult to use, it takes ages to find what you are
>>  looking for.  Quite probably they are ok when you get used
>>  to them, but there is really no need for all to go the M$
>>  way.
>
>This is also my judgement after having being forced to use these menus
>   over the past months. But certainly, this is a matter of will
>   and personal taste.
>
>Anyway, since those menus seem to be a Windows thing only, we would,
>   if we could and should, only implement them for the Windows OS.

I am of a like mind in this. I have no liking for ribbon menus, I'm
uncertain they are an improvement. I am certain they are not an
improvement for me.

They appear to be fancy for its own sake and not at all clear for quick
use. But then I am not a windows user and therefore use them very
occasionally. Only use them to try to find things for windows users who
also have a problem finding things they want, when using them.

Just my thoughts.
Charlie
-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

Simplicity doesn't mean to live in misery and poverty. You have
what you need, and you don't want what you don't
need. Charan Singh

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Jürgen Spitzmüller]

Juha Meriluoto wrote:
> Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.  I find
> them quite difficult to use, it takes ages to find what you are looking
> for.  Quite probably they are ok when you get used to them, but there is
> really no need for all to go the M$ way.

This is also my judgement after having being forced to use these menus over 
the past months. But certainly, this is a matter of will and personal taste.

Anyway, since those menus seem to be a Windows thing only, we would, if we 
could and should, only implement them for the Windows OS.

Jürgen

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Juha Meriluoto]

On 3.4.2013 19:20, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
> Hello developers!
>  
> I have a feature request if this is not already requested to you: Ribbon
> Menus.
>  
> The actual look of lyx makes duplicate functions in text menus and icon
> menus, besides there is a lot of space wasted by allocating the icon
> menus. This has nothing to do with intrinsic code but to UI graphic
> design. This modern approach is the best to maximize functionality and
> avoid duplicating functionality. I don´t know if thi request can be made
> inside Qt (I think there should be some package for this in the nokia
> library!).
>  
> What are your opinions about this? Is this approach correct to you?
>  
> Best Regards
>  
> Alex

Personally, I hate ribbon menus from the bottom of my heart.  I find
them quite difficult to use, it takes ages to find what you are looking
for.  Quite probably they are ok when you get used to them, but there is
really no need for all to go the M$ way.

Just my 2 cents,

 - Juha

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Richard Heck]

On 04/03/2013 04:41 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:



Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
I don´t know if thi request can be made inside Qt (I think there 
should be some package for this in the nokia library!).

Pavel Sanda wrote:
No it isn't. Mr Google suggest that "Qt team at one point stopped 
developing

the control due to Microsoft licensing."
This sounds funny given the fact that tabbed toolbar was already 
around in 90s

and I remember it from Borland's Delphi UI.

Pavel




Yes indeed, this sounds like we should not be able to build frames at 
all because they look like Microsoft´s Windows and these are licensed 
by Microsoft ;) so what kind of things are legal or not? This point 
puts even more fuzzy to my logic! I thougth graphic design as long as 
it is not equal are not the same and we can make the ribbon as 
different as we want, just keeping the idea and even better, instead 
of putting it in the top we can put then at the left so we can avoid 
the vertical space eating that Jacob mentioned.


Though one can put it this way: Nokia decided they did not wish to spend 
a gazillion dollars fighting a patent case, even if they might win it in 
the end, and even if Microsoft's patent makes about as much sense as the 
old joke that they would eventually patent 0 and 1.


Remember: Apple got a design patent for a rectangle with rounded 
corners, and they won a patent infringement suit against Samsung. Really.


That's the sad state of US patent law.

Richard

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Steve Litt]

On Wed, 3 Apr 2013 11:20:24 -0500
"Alex Vergara Gil"  wrote:

> Hello developers!
> 
> I have a feature request if this is not already requested to you:
> Ribbon Menus.
> 
> The actual look of lyx makes duplicate functions in text menus and
> icon menus, besides there is a lot of space wasted by allocating the
> icon menus. This has nothing to do with intrinsic code but to UI
> graphic design. This modern approach is the best to maximize
> functionality and avoid duplicating functionality. I don´t know if
> thi request can be made inside Qt (I think there should be some
> package for this in the nokia library!).
> 
> What are your opinions about this? Is this approach correct to you?
> 
> Best Regards
> 
> Alex

Alex, shouldn't you have posted this on 4/1 instead of 4/3?

SteveT

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Alex Vergara Gil]

Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
I don´t know if thi request can be made inside Qt (I think there should 
be some package for this in the nokia library!).

Pavel Sanda wrote:
No it isn't. Mr Google suggest that "Qt team at one point stopped 
developing

the control due to Microsoft licensing."
This sounds funny given the fact that tabbed toolbar was already around in 
90s

and I remember it from Borland's Delphi UI.

Pavel




Yes indeed, this sounds like we should not be able to build frames at all 
because they look like Microsoft´s Windows and these are licensed by 
Microsoft ;) so what kind of things are legal or not? This point puts even 
more fuzzy to my logic! I thougth graphic design as long as it is not equal 
are not the same and we can make the ribbon as different as we want, just 
keeping the idea and even better, instead of putting it in the top we can 
put then at the left so we can avoid the vertical space eating that Jacob 
mentioned.


So I don´t understand that logic.

Just my POW
Alex 

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Pavel Sanda]

Alex Vergara Gil wrote:
> I don´t know if thi request can be made inside Qt (I think there should be 
> some package for this in the nokia library!).

No it isn't. Mr Google suggest that "Qt team at one point stopped developing
the control due to Microsoft licensing."
This sounds funny given the fact that tabbed toolbar was already around in 90s
and I remember it from Borland's Delphi UI.

Pavel

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Jacob Bishop]

Opinions are cheap, so I guess I'll offer mine.

Patents are one thing I know next to nothing about, so that may be a game
stopper to begin with, as Richard pointed out. I may be in the minority
here, but in general I think the ribbon toolbar is a useful improvement for
Microsoft products (at least Excel, Word, and Powerpoint). It makes sense
to me since it allows easier access to all of those functions hidden 4 menu
items deep. For this reason, I personally dislike using older MS Word, for
example, and don't find Open/Libre Office to be any better (I think a
ribbon interface would be a big improvement for libreoffice). Then again, I
prefer to use LyX over either of those, but when I don't have a choice I
prefer Word with the ribbon interface.

Despite my generally favorable opinion of the ribbon toolbar, however, I do
not find myself wishing for it in LyX. I like the icons, and leave them
there, but typically find myself using keyboard shortcuts as soon as I can
learn them. My biggest concern about the ribbon toolbar is that it eats up
your vertical screen real-estate. Unfortunately, monitors seem to be
getting wider, not taller.

All that said, I would of course be interested to see how it turned out if
someone were to undertake the endeavor. I might be pleasantly surprised.

Jacob

Re: feature request: ribbon menus

[Richard Heck]

On 04/03/2013 12:20 PM, Alex Vergara Gil wrote:

Hello developers!
I have a feature request if this is not already requested to you: 
Ribbon Menus.


If someone wanted to code these as an option, I'd have no objection, 
except for the fact that

Microsoft appears to have patented this:
http://www.google.com/patents/US8117542
in the US. (Patent law here is ridiculous, no doubt.) But I think I'd 
have to count myself on the side of peoplewho think that's terrible UI 
design, anyway:

http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/44734
http://betanews.com/2011/05/20/now-you-can-send-the-office-ribbon-to-join-clippy/
So I'd certainly not want to see it as the default.

The actual look of lyx makes duplicate functions in text menus and 
icon menus, besides there is a lot of space wasted by allocating the 
icon menus.


I almost never use toolbars, so I tend just to hide those.

rh

Re: Feature request

[Helge Hafting]

On 29. sep. 2011 00:22, Guenter Milde wrote:

On 2011-09-28, ehud.kap...@gmail.com wrote:


[-- Type: text/plain, Encoding: 7bit --]



Every time Latex is updated, Lyx must be reconfigured.
Is there a way for Lyx to check whether Latex has been updated
since the last time it was reconfigured, and if so, to reconfigure itself?


Just an idea: how about comparing the modification time of LyX's config file
and the ls-R files in the texmf trees (system, local, and user)?


Not enough. You also need to reconfigure LyX if you install/remove
any other supported software. Such as image/spreadsheet converters that 
LyX can use - or new layouts. Of course, the layouts can probably be

detected by the timestamp on the .lyx/layouts directory...

Still, it would help for the case of LaTeX updates.

Helge Hafting

Re: Feature request

[Guenter Milde]

On 2011-09-28, ehud.kap...@gmail.com wrote:

> [-- Type: text/plain, Encoding: 7bit --]

> Every time Latex is updated, Lyx must be reconfigured.
> Is there a way for Lyx to check whether Latex has been updated
> since the last time it was reconfigured, and if so, to reconfigure itself?

Just an idea: how about comparing the modification time of LyX's config file
and the ls-R files in the texmf trees (system, local, and user)?

Günter

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Ganesh Sundaram]

On 5/7/2011 1:30 AM, Liviu Andronic wrote:

On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 9:57 PM, Neal Becker  wrote:

No File>  Import>  Gnumeric here (fedora 14 lyx-2.0.0-0.21.rc3.fc14.x86_64)

What am I missing?


Maybe Gnumeric. And perhaps LyX 2.0.
Liviu

After installing Gnumeric, path to its executable must be added to the 
PATH environment variable. When it comes to LyX this procedure of adding 
path of executables is more or less implicit.


Just now I checked. It works fine.

Ganesh

---
Mail scanned by Amrita GAV Server

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 9:57 PM, Neal Becker  wrote:
> No File > Import > Gnumeric here (fedora 14 lyx-2.0.0-0.21.rc3.fc14.x86_64)
>
> What am I missing?
>
Maybe Gnumeric. And perhaps LyX 2.0.
Liviu

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Andrew Parsloe]

On 6/05/2011 10:26 a.m., Julien Rioux wrote:

On 05/05/2011 12:22 AM, Andrew Parsloe wrote:

On 5/05/2011 12:32 p.m., Charlie wrote:


If a vote is being taken on this feature request.

I would rather that it doesn't happen, so please put me down as a "no".

Please don't do it.

There are plenty of spreadsheet programs and if you haven't completed
your work in the program you use, why would you place it into a LyX
document and edit it anyway? LyX is great as is.

Thank you,
Charlie


I think I have confused people, perhaps because I used the phrase 'LyX
office suite' (but in quotes -- it was meant with a certain
tongue-in-cheek quality) and mentioned the word spreadsheet.

I meant something more on these lines: you have a table in LyX with a
few columns of figures; you want the totals of the columns, perhaps a
grand total. The numbers aren't at this point fixed. New data may arise
as you work on your document. Yes you could open a spreadsheet program
but it's just two or three columns and there's a certain overkill about
that.

Alternatively, you can put \usepackage{spreadtab} in your preamble and,
as things are at present, open an ERT inset, write
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, construct the table with the
figures, ampersands, newline markers \\, spreadtab's sum() command, and
finish with \end{spreadtab}. It's now there in your document easily
accessible for any adjusted figures to be entered. This is what I do
now. LyX doesn't do any calculating.

But it is easier to enter figures and text into a table in LyX proper
rather than ERT. My request was for a button on the table toolbar that
would change LyX's \begin{tablular}{|c|c|c|} into
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, and \end{tabular} into
\end{spreadtab}, and a few 'tidying up' operations like replacing
\tabularnewline with \\. Again, no request that LyX acquire calculating
abilities. Rather, the ability to replace one environment, tabular, with
another, spreadtab. The calculational abilities are in spreadtab and, as
far as LyX is concerned, are a side-effect of the environment change.
LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to
see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.

Andrew



Being able to customize the output of a tabular like this is in my
opinion a valid request and more general than just this particular case
(spreadtab, which I did not know). There are a number of latex
environment which use tab alignment &. All of them would benefit from
the nice interface that LyX provides. I can think of tikz \matrix{}, or
customizing a table using the booktabs package, for example.

The proper way to implement this is not obvious, but extending the
layout syntax would be the most flexible, with the specifics about
spreadtab in a spreadtab.module file.



My current practice is to open a table in LyX, leave the top left cell 
blank then label the remaining cells of the top row a, b, c, ... and the 
remaining cells of the first column 1, 2, 3 ... I fill in the table with 
text and figures but ensure that any spreadtab commands involving the 
backslash (e.g. \STcopy) or curly brackets (e.g. :={}) are entered in 
ERT -- it just means doing ctrl-L before entering these elements. The 
labelling of the first row & column make cell references easy. When 
finished I delete the first row & column, copy the code from the source 
view window and paste it into an ERT inset (outside the table of 
course). One still needs to insert line breaks, change \tabularnewline 
to \\, and the \begin and \end statements but that's all.


On a slightly different point, spreadtab itself isn't fussy about 
whether it works with the tabular environment or others. The examples in 
the spreadtab manual are mainly for tabular, but other environments used 
are matrix, array and tabularx.


Andrew

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Julien Rioux]

On 05/05/2011 12:22 AM, Andrew Parsloe wrote:

On 5/05/2011 12:32 p.m., Charlie wrote:


If a vote is being taken on this feature request.

I would rather that it doesn't happen, so please put me down as a "no".

Please don't do it.

There are plenty of spreadsheet programs and if you haven't completed
your work in the program you use, why would you place it into a LyX
document and edit it anyway? LyX is great as is.

Thank you,
Charlie


I think I have confused people, perhaps because I used the phrase 'LyX
office suite' (but in quotes -- it was meant with a certain
tongue-in-cheek quality) and mentioned the word spreadsheet.

I meant something more on these lines: you have a table in LyX with a
few columns of figures; you want the totals of the columns, perhaps a
grand total. The numbers aren't at this point fixed. New data may arise
as you work on your document. Yes you could open a spreadsheet program
but it's just two or three columns and there's a certain overkill about
that.

Alternatively, you can put \usepackage{spreadtab} in your preamble and,
as things are at present, open an ERT inset, write
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, construct the table with the
figures, ampersands, newline markers \\, spreadtab's sum() command, and
finish with \end{spreadtab}. It's now there in your document easily
accessible for any adjusted figures to be entered. This is what I do
now. LyX doesn't do any calculating.

But it is easier to enter figures and text into a table in LyX proper
rather than ERT. My request was for a button on the table toolbar that
would change LyX's \begin{tablular}{|c|c|c|} into
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, and \end{tabular} into
\end{spreadtab}, and a few 'tidying up' operations like replacing
\tabularnewline with \\. Again, no request that LyX acquire calculating
abilities. Rather, the ability to replace one environment, tabular, with
another, spreadtab. The calculational abilities are in spreadtab and, as
far as LyX is concerned, are a side-effect of the environment change.
LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to
see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.

Andrew



Being able to customize the output of a tabular like this is in my 
opinion a valid request and more general than just this particular case 
(spreadtab, which I did not know). There are a number of latex 
environment which use tab alignment &. All of them would benefit from 
the nice interface that LyX provides. I can think of tikz \matrix{}, or 
customizing a table using the booktabs package, for example.


The proper way to implement this is not obvious, but extending the 
layout syntax would be the most flexible, with the specifics about 
spreadtab in a spreadtab.module file.


--
Julien

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Dr Eberhard W Lisse]

Oh, I see,

gnumeric will pull ODS or XLS in as well as its own.

This is non-intuitive, but I haven't read the manual yet:-)-O

el

On 5/5/11 2:46 PM, Liviu Andronic wrote:
> On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Dr Eberhard W Lisse  wrote:
>> on 2.0 RC3 on 10.6.7 I can't see the OOo or Excell formats offered unter
>> External Material.
>>
>> Please advise.
>>
> You should see the Gnumeric external material. It supports files saved
> under Gnumeric, OOo or Excel spreadsheet formats (you can use any of
> the three to edit the files). You need to have Gnumeric installed for
> this to work. For more details, see [1].
> Liviu
> 
> [1] http://wiki.lyx.org/Examples/SpreadsheetExternalInset

-- 
Dr. Eberhard W. Lisse  \/  Obstetrician & Gynaecologist
e...@lisse.na/ * | Telephone: +264 81 124 6733 (cell)
PO Box 8421 \ / Please do NOT email to this address
Bachbrecht, Namibia ;/  if it is DNS related in ANY way

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 2:47 PM, Dr Eberhard W Lisse  wrote:
> on 2.0 RC3 on 10.6.7 I can't see the OOo or Excell formats offered unter
> External Material.
>
> Please advise.
>
You should see the Gnumeric external material. It supports files saved
under Gnumeric, OOo or Excel spreadsheet formats (you can use any of
the three to edit the files). You need to have Gnumeric installed for
this to work. For more details, see [1].
Liviu

[1] http://wiki.lyx.org/Examples/SpreadsheetExternalInset

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Dr Eberhard W Lisse]

Liviu,

on 2.0 RC3 on 10.6.7 I can't see the OOo or Excell formats offered unter
External Material.

Please advise.

greetings, el

On 5/4/11 10:18 AM, Liviu Andronic wrote:
> On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:01 AM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:
>> The current lack of even a basic 'active' table in LyX, where you can sum a
>> column of figures for instance,
>>
> This is not accurate. In 2.0 you can:
> File > Import > Table (CSV)
> File > Import > xls
> File > Import > Gnumeric
> Insert > File > External > Gnumeric (supports Excel, OOo, Gnumeric)
> 
> The Gnumeric external material allows you to have and maintain a
> spreadsheet in Excel, OOo, Gnumeric. This means that whatever
> modifications you introduce in the spreadsheet file, they will be
> visible upon the next compilation of your LyX document. Pretty nifty,
> actually. :)
> 
> A more advanced way to do something similar is to use R via the Sweave
> module. But this is not for the faint hearted.
> 
> Cheers
> Liviu
> 

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Andrew Parsloe]

On 5/05/2011 7:49 p.m., Liviu Andronic wrote:

On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Guenter Milde  wrote:

LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to
see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.


But I am pretty sure that, when this support is implemented, there will
be requests that LyX displays the calculated values ;-)


Couldn't this be done in a way similar to Instant Preview for math?
Liviu

Instant preview had crossed my mind as a complicating factor. However I 
have lived happily using PSTricks with LyX without instant preview. And 
I presume that 'code creep' would be because the feature was being used 
and in response to a need resulting from that use.


Andrew

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Andrew Parsloe]

On 5/05/2011 7:39 p.m., Guenter Milde wrote:

On 2011-05-05, Andrew Parsloe wrote:


I think I have confused people, perhaps because I used the phrase 'LyX
office suite' (but in quotes -- it was meant with a certain
tongue-in-cheek quality) and mentioned the word spreadsheet.


...


My request was for a button on the table toolbar that
would change LyX's \begin{tablular}{|c|c|c|} into
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, and \end{tabular} into
\end{spreadtab}, and a few 'tidying up' operations like replacing
\tabularnewline with \\. Again, no request that LyX acquire calculating
abilities. Rather, the ability to replace one environment, tabular, with
another, spreadtab. The calculational abilities are in spreadtab and, as
far as LyX is concerned, are a side-effect of the environment change.


Maybe, if you had used the phrase: "Add LyX support for the 'spreadtab' LaTeX
package", there would not have been such an uproar.


Yes, a lesson learnt.

Andrew



LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to
see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.


But I am pretty sure that, when this support is implemented, there will
be requests that LyX displays the calculated values ;-)

Anyway, I support this enhancement request.

Günter

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Guenter Milde  wrote:
>> LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to
>> see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.
>
> But I am pretty sure that, when this support is implemented, there will
> be requests that LyX displays the calculated values ;-)
>
Couldn't this be done in a way similar to Instant Preview for math?
Liviu

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Guenter Milde]

On 2011-05-05, Andrew Parsloe wrote:

> I think I have confused people, perhaps because I used the phrase 'LyX 
> office suite' (but in quotes -- it was meant with a certain 
> tongue-in-cheek quality) and mentioned the word spreadsheet.

...

> My request was for a button on the table toolbar that 
> would change LyX's \begin{tablular}{|c|c|c|} into 
> \begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, and \end{tabular} into 
> \end{spreadtab}, and a few 'tidying up' operations like replacing 
> \tabularnewline with \\. Again, no request that LyX acquire calculating 
> abilities. Rather, the ability to replace one environment, tabular, with 
> another, spreadtab. The calculational abilities are in spreadtab and, as 
> far as LyX is concerned, are a side-effect of the environment change. 

Maybe, if you had used the phrase: "Add LyX support for the 'spreadtab' LaTeX
package", there would not have been such an uproar.

> LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to 
> see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.

But I am pretty sure that, when this support is implemented, there will
be requests that LyX displays the calculated values ;-)

Anyway, I support this enhancement request.

Günter

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 6:22 AM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:
> I meant something more on these lines: you have a table in LyX with a few
> columns of figures; you want the totals of the columns, perhaps a grand
> total. The numbers aren't at this point fixed. New data may arise as you
> work on your document. Yes you could open a spreadsheet program but it's
> just two or three columns and there's a certain overkill about that.
>
> Alternatively, you can put \usepackage{spreadtab} in your preamble and, as
> things are at present, open an ERT inset, write
> \begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, construct the table with the figures,
> ampersands, newline markers \\, spreadtab's sum() command, and finish with
> \end{spreadtab}. It's now there in your document easily accessible for any
> adjusted figures to be entered. This is what I do now. LyX doesn't do any
> calculating.
>
> But it is easier to enter figures and text into a table in LyX proper rather
> than ERT. My request was for a button on the table toolbar that would change
> LyX's \begin{tablular}{|c|c|c|} into \begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}},
> and \end{tabular} into \end{spreadtab}, and a few 'tidying up' operations
> like replacing \tabularnewline with \\.
>
This could be easy and acceptable enough. If you may want to file an
enhancement request on bug tracker.

Regards
Liviu


> Again, no request that LyX acquire
> calculating abilities. Rather, the ability to replace one environment,
> tabular, with another, spreadtab. The calculational abilities are in
> spreadtab and, as far as LyX is concerned, are a side-effect of the
> environment change. LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I
> have no wish to see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.
>
> Andrew
>



-- 
Do you know how to read?
http://www.alienetworks.com/srtest.cfm
http://goodies.xfce.org/projects/applications/xfce4-dict#speed-reader
Do you know how to write?
http://garbl.home.comcast.net/~garbl/stylemanual/e.htm#e-mail

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Andrew Parsloe]

On 5/05/2011 12:32 p.m., Charlie wrote:


If a vote is being taken on this feature request.

I would rather that it doesn't happen, so please put me down as a "no".

Please don't do it.

There are plenty of spreadsheet programs and if you haven't completed
your work in the program you use, why would you place it into a LyX
document and edit it anyway? LyX is great as is.

Thank you,
Charlie


I think I have confused people, perhaps because I used the phrase 'LyX 
office suite' (but in quotes -- it was meant with a certain 
tongue-in-cheek quality) and mentioned the word spreadsheet.


I meant something more on these lines: you have a table in LyX with a 
few columns of figures; you want the totals of the columns, perhaps a 
grand total. The numbers aren't at this point fixed. New data may arise 
as you work on your document. Yes you could open a spreadsheet program 
but it's just two or three columns and there's a certain overkill about 
that.


Alternatively, you can put \usepackage{spreadtab} in your preamble and, 
as things are at present, open an ERT inset, write 
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, construct the table with the 
figures, ampersands, newline markers \\, spreadtab's sum() command, and 
finish with \end{spreadtab}. It's now there in your document easily 
accessible for any adjusted figures to be entered. This is what I do 
now. LyX doesn't do any calculating.


But it is easier to enter figures and text into a table in LyX proper 
rather than ERT. My request was for a button on the table toolbar that 
would change LyX's \begin{tablular}{|c|c|c|} into 
\begin{spreadtab}{{tabular}{|c|c|c|}}, and \end{tabular} into 
\end{spreadtab}, and a few 'tidying up' operations like replacing 
\tabularnewline with \\. Again, no request that LyX acquire calculating 
abilities. Rather, the ability to replace one environment, tabular, with 
another, spreadtab. The calculational abilities are in spreadtab and, as 
far as LyX is concerned, are a side-effect of the environment change. 
LyX doesn't need to acquire spreadsheet capabilities. I have no wish to 
see it heading down the road of OpenOffice.


Andrew

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Steve Litt]

On Wednesday 04 May 2011 20:32:03 Charlie wrote:
> If a vote is being taken on this feature request.
> 
> I would rather that it doesn't happen, so please put me down as a "no".
> 
> Please don't do it.

Context? What are we talking about?

Do I really need to research my mailbox to find out?

SteveT

Steve Litt
Recession Relief Package
http://www.recession-relief.US
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/stevelitt

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Charlie]

If a vote is being taken on this feature request.

I would rather that it doesn't happen, so please put me down as a "no".

Please don't do it. 

There are plenty of spreadsheet programs and if you haven't completed
your work in the program you use, why would you place it into a LyX
document and edit it anyway? LyX is great as is.

Thank you,
Charlie
-- 
Registered Linux User:- 329524
***

If anything in nature strikes you as ugly, you are not appreciating its
diversity. - anon

***

Debian GNU/Linux - just the best way to create magic

-

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 12:26 PM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:
> For a computer with limited memory (1 GB seemed big when I bought it), where
> there's a lot of disk activity with multiple programs running, being able to
> work in LyX alone would be helpful.
>
If computer resources are your biggest concern, you could try out the
Gnumeric solution (and not MS Excel or OOo). Gnumeric is as
lightweight as it gets, and normally opening/closing it shouldn't hog
much of your system resources.
Liviu

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Abdelrazak Younes]

On 04/05/2011 18:42, Pavel Sanda wrote:

Andrew Parsloe wrote:

Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without having
to fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever. (To take matters to extremes, you


this is the same as request that we should introduce some 'simple' graphics
editor for pictures. after simple editor is introduced another next requests
appear and at the end we will have the whole office suite as you propose.

i think we should be good at editing text and typesetting. preparing the basic
material like drawings, tables, computing numbers etc should do different apps
which do it much better then we will ever do.
we can create some reasonable binding to them, but thats all i would propose...


Indeed. But I could well imagine a simple OctaveInset that would get the 
table cell indexes as arguments and automatically call Octave to compute 
the result. Similar what we can do with Octave in math.


Abdel.

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[David L. Johnson]

On 05/04/2011 12:33 PM, Jens Nöckel wrote:

On May 4, 2011, at 3:26 AM, Andrew Parsloe wrote:



On 4/05/2011 9:59 p.m., Liviu Andronic wrote:

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:46 AM, Andrew Parsloe   wrote:

Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without having to
fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever.
I don't quite get that.  Why?  In the background you are firing up some 
sort of whatever, and it may not be the one you want to use.  I always 
preferred the unix way, to have a lot of tools that can talk to each 
other, not the one big program that does everything (which is one reason 
I always hated emacs).  Easy import/export to your favorite spreadsheet 
is good -- in fact, I usually use this in a cut&paste way which works.  
Documents are for reporting and interpreting calculations, not doing them.


Maybe I'm just too old for this...

The fact that 1 GB seems small nowadays is a sad reminder of how bloated some 
programs have become.
Precisely for that reason I would not be in favor of an added spreadsheet tool 
in LyX.
See also this link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep

I agree with this.  LyX doesn't have to do everything.

--

David L. Johnson

Accept risk.  Accept responsibility.  Put a lawyer out of business.

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Rich Shepard]

On Wed, 4 May 2011, Pavel Sanda wrote:


i think we should be good at editing text and typesetting. preparing the
basic material like drawings, tables, computing numbers etc should do
different apps which do it much better then we will ever do. we can create
some reasonable binding to them, but thats all i would propose...


pavel,

  Absolutely! Single tools for each job, integrate as needed. LyX is for
entering text and typesetting it. Graphics, tables, and more can be
incorporated but it's not an "office suite" but a typesetting front end.
Period.

Rich

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Pavel Sanda]

Andrew Parsloe wrote:
> Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without having 
> to fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever. (To take matters to extremes, you 

this is the same as request that we should introduce some 'simple' graphics
editor for pictures. after simple editor is introduced another next requests
appear and at the end we will have the whole office suite as you propose.

i think we should be good at editing text and typesetting. preparing the basic
material like drawings, tables, computing numbers etc should do different apps
which do it much better then we will ever do.
we can create some reasonable binding to them, but thats all i would propose...

pavel

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Jens Nöckel]

On May 4, 2011, at 3:26 AM, Andrew Parsloe wrote:

> 
> 
> On 4/05/2011 9:59 p.m., Liviu Andronic wrote:
>> On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:46 AM, Andrew Parsloe  
>> wrote:
>>> Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without having to
>>> fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever.
>>> 
>> It sure would.
>> 
>> 
>>> (To take matters to extremes, you
>>> could even fire up an external wordprocessor and create a pdf or latex
>>> document and import into LyX, but we don't. LyX is so much better and more
>>> fun to work in.)
>>> 
>> I understand your concern, but adding true spreadsheet capabilities to
>> LyX would be a massive undertaking, and something to which some
>> developers would object. LyX is by design a very flexible beast that
>> allows you to interact with a huge (and growing) number of external
>> tools: LaTeX, DocBook, BibTeX, R, Maxima, etc., etc.
>> 
>> As far as I'm concerned, LyX does provide spreadsheet capabilities via
>> the Gnumeric external material. It allows you to create and maintain
>> your tables in a mature spreadsheet tool (something that LyX would
>> never provide natively), and _dynamically_ import the results into
>> your LyX documents. Personally I couldn't ask for more. (Think of it
>> as graphics creation: you do not create them in LyX; you use some
>> external tool to either create a final PDF and import into LyX, or to
>> dynamically manage via external material).
>> 
>> Cheers
>> Liviu
>> 
> Actually I do create graphics in LyX (using PSTricks in a LyX document that 
> consists entirely of one sometimes big ERT inset). But I take your point. For 
> a computer with limited memory (1 GB seemed big when I bought it), where 
> there's a lot of disk activity with multiple programs running, being able to 
> work in LyX alone would be helpful.
> 
> Regards,
> Andrew

The fact that 1 GB seems small nowadays is a sad reminder of how bloated some 
programs have become. 
Precisely for that reason I would not be in favor of an added spreadsheet tool 
in LyX. 
See also this link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep

Jens

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Andrew Parsloe]

On 4/05/2011 9:59 p.m., Liviu Andronic wrote:

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:46 AM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:

Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without having to
fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever.


It sure would.



(To take matters to extremes, you
could even fire up an external wordprocessor and create a pdf or latex
document and import into LyX, but we don't. LyX is so much better and more
fun to work in.)


I understand your concern, but adding true spreadsheet capabilities to
LyX would be a massive undertaking, and something to which some
developers would object. LyX is by design a very flexible beast that
allows you to interact with a huge (and growing) number of external
tools: LaTeX, DocBook, BibTeX, R, Maxima, etc., etc.

As far as I'm concerned, LyX does provide spreadsheet capabilities via
the Gnumeric external material. It allows you to create and maintain
your tables in a mature spreadsheet tool (something that LyX would
never provide natively), and _dynamically_ import the results into
your LyX documents. Personally I couldn't ask for more. (Think of it
as graphics creation: you do not create them in LyX; you use some
external tool to either create a final PDF and import into LyX, or to
dynamically manage via external material).

Cheers
Liviu

Actually I do create graphics in LyX (using PSTricks in a LyX document 
that consists entirely of one sometimes big ERT inset). But I take your 
point. For a computer with limited memory (1 GB seemed big when I bought 
it), where there's a lot of disk activity with multiple programs 
running, being able to work in LyX alone would be helpful.


Regards,
Andrew

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:46 AM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:
> Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without having to
> fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever.
>
It sure would.


> (To take matters to extremes, you
> could even fire up an external wordprocessor and create a pdf or latex
> document and import into LyX, but we don't. LyX is so much better and more
> fun to work in.)
>
I understand your concern, but adding true spreadsheet capabilities to
LyX would be a massive undertaking, and something to which some
developers would object. LyX is by design a very flexible beast that
allows you to interact with a huge (and growing) number of external
tools: LaTeX, DocBook, BibTeX, R, Maxima, etc., etc.

As far as I'm concerned, LyX does provide spreadsheet capabilities via
the Gnumeric external material. It allows you to create and maintain
your tables in a mature spreadsheet tool (something that LyX would
never provide natively), and _dynamically_ import the results into
your LyX documents. Personally I couldn't ask for more. (Think of it
as graphics creation: you do not create them in LyX; you use some
external tool to either create a final PDF and import into LyX, or to
dynamically manage via external material).

Cheers
Liviu

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Andrew Parsloe]

On 4/05/2011 9:18 p.m., Liviu Andronic wrote:

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:01 AM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:

The current lack of even a basic 'active' table in LyX, where you can sum a
column of figures for instance,


This is not accurate. In 2.0 you can:
File>  Import>  Table (CSV)
File>  Import>  xls
File>  Import>  Gnumeric
Insert>  File>  External>  Gnumeric (supports Excel, OOo, Gnumeric)

The Gnumeric external material allows you to have and maintain a
spreadsheet in Excel, OOo, Gnumeric. This means that whatever
modifications you introduce in the spreadsheet file, they will be
visible upon the next compilation of your LyX document. Pretty nifty,
actually. :)

A more advanced way to do something similar is to use R via the Sweave
module. But this is not for the faint hearted.

Cheers
Liviu

Yes, but it would be nice to be able to sum a table in LyX without 
having to fire up Gnumeric or Excel or whatever. (To take matters to 
extremes, you could even fire up an external wordprocessor and create a 
pdf or latex document and import into LyX, but we don't. LyX is so much 
better and more fun to work in.)


Regards,
Andrew

Re: Feature request: the missing element in the LyX office suite

[Liviu Andronic]

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 11:01 AM, Andrew Parsloe  wrote:
> The current lack of even a basic 'active' table in LyX, where you can sum a
> column of figures for instance,
>
This is not accurate. In 2.0 you can:
File > Import > Table (CSV)
File > Import > xls
File > Import > Gnumeric
Insert > File > External > Gnumeric (supports Excel, OOo, Gnumeric)

The Gnumeric external material allows you to have and maintain a
spreadsheet in Excel, OOo, Gnumeric. This means that whatever
modifications you introduce in the spreadsheet file, they will be
visible upon the next compilation of your LyX document. Pretty nifty,
actually. :)

A more advanced way to do something similar is to use R via the Sweave
module. But this is not for the faint hearted.

Cheers
Liviu

Re: feature request

[Abdelrazak Younes]

Stefano Baroni wrote:
Hi All! I understand that in LyX it is not possible to start the 
numbering in an "enumearte" environment other than from one. Right? If 
this is the case, it would be extremely useful to have the possibility 
of starting from any value, without tweaking the LaTeX code (which I 
did). A common instance where such a feature would be helpful is in 
preparing written exam tests. The various questions of the text should 
be enumerated sequentually, but they are often separated by some text 
whose paragraphs ought not be numbered.


Probably not the answer you're waiting for but you can also indent 
normal paragraph after an enumerate environment, just hit the "Tab" key 
and it work automagically in 1.6.


Thanks for the beautiful 
software and the wonderful feedback from/to the users' community - 
Stefano Baroni


---
Stefano Baroni - SISSA  &  DEMOCRITOS National Simulation Center - Trieste
http://stefano.baroni.me [+39] 040 3787 406 (tel) -528 (fax) / 
stefanobaroni (skype)


La morale est une logique de l'action comme la logique est une morale de 
la pensée - Jean Piaget


Don't know this guy but trying to understand this gave me a headache :-)

Abdel.

Re: feature request

[Guenter Milde]

On 2009-03-31, Stefano Baroni wrote:

> it would be extremely useful to have the possibility =20=
> of starting from any value, without tweaking the LaTeX code

This is possible with the enumitem module which you can download from the
LyX wiki (http://wiki.lyx.org).

Günter

Re: Feature request: Insert->TODO

[Nick Bell]

http://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-users@lists.lyx.org/msg68906.html

Manoj Rajagopalan wrote:

Hi all,

  It would be nice to have an insert action where we insert a TODO item. 
Right now I am managing with Insert->Note->Lyx Note but there is no way 
to view just the TODO notes in the outline list-box.


  I am using LyX v1.6.0

One hack to get this working now would be start each TODO note with a 
"TODO" string and then to use the sort option on the outline listing. 
The suggested feature would however be a cleaner document management 
provision.


Thanks,
Manoj



--
Nick Bell
4F2, 1 Royston Terrace
Edinburgh EH3 5QU
Home 0131 552 1682
Work 0131 537 2417
Mobile 0796 764 8984
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Feature request: Insert->TODO

[Manoj Rajagopalan]

Margin notes appear in the final output though. Won't it be nice to have 
a clean output with annotations like TODO only in the LyX source?




A. Scottedward Hodel wrote:
I use margin notes for this purpose. The string (TODO in your case) is 
easily searchable to find the next item.


Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 6, 2008, at 1:56 PM, Manoj Rajagopalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Hi all,

 It would be nice to have an insert action where we insert a TODO 
item. Right now I am managing with Insert->Note->Lyx Note but there is 
no way to view just the TODO notes in the outline list-box.


 I am using LyX v1.6.0

One hack to get this working now would be start each TODO note with a 
"TODO" string and then to use the sort option on the outline listing. 
The suggested feature would however be a cleaner document management 
provision.


Thanks,
Manoj

Re: Feature request: Insert->TODO

[A. Scottedward Hodel]

I use margin notes for this purpose. The string (TODO in your case) is  
easily searchable to find the next item.


Sent from my iPhone

On Dec 6, 2008, at 1:56 PM, Manoj Rajagopalan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Hi all,

 It would be nice to have an insert action where we insert a TODO  
item. Right now I am managing with Insert->Note->Lyx Note but there  
is no way to view just the TODO notes in the outline list-box.


 I am using LyX v1.6.0

One hack to get this working now would be start each TODO note with  
a "TODO" string and then to use the sort option on the outline  
listing. The suggested feature would however be a cleaner document  
management provision.


Thanks,
Manoj

Re: Feature request: parent-child document clash resolution

[Jürgen Spitzmüller]

James Sutherland wrote:
> Interesting.  I have not had a problem with settings in parent/child  
> documents.  When I compile the parent document, its settings trump any  
> changes in the children.  When compiling the child document alone, its  
> settings are respected...  I am currently running 1.6.

Yes, this is how it is supposed to work, actually.

Jürgen

Re: Feature request: parent-child document clash resolution

[James Sutherland]

Interesting.  I have not had a problem with settings in parent/child  
documents.  When I compile the parent document, its settings trump any  
changes in the children.  When compiling the child document alone, its  
settings are respected...  I am currently running 1.6.


James


On Dec 5, 2008, at 2:04 PM, Manoj Rajagopalan wrote:


Hi all,

 In my work I frequently encounter Latex complaints that are due to  
different settings for parent and child documents (which I may have  
made  when working on the child just to experiment). Fixing them can  
require a lot of going back and forth between the two documents to  
ensure both have identical Document settings esp. if the child  
document is a new one which is initialized to default settings.


 Would it be possible for future versions of LyX to override child- 
document settings with that of the parent when building the DVI/PDF  
etc.? The child document settings would be useful when that document  
is built-standalone but in the context of the parent they should be  
overridden.


 In the meantime, if a better overall solution to hierarchical  
document management exists, I'd love to be educated.


Thanks in advance,
Manoj

Re: Feature request: Sessions

[Jürgen Spitzmüller]

Manoj Rajagopalan wrote:

> Would it
> be possible to create a "Sessions" menu like in KATE (KDE Advanced Text
> Editor) that simply maintains groups of related files that can be opened
> or closed with a single menu action? I imagine this scenario is quite
> common.

Sounds like a good idea. Please open an enhancement request at bugzilla.lyx.org.

Jürgen

Re: Feature request: Macro updates when definitions are pasted after use

[Rex Dieter]

José Matos wrote:

On Friday 14 November 2008 12:51:11 rgheck wrote:

Manoj Rajagopalan wrote:

Cool! i'm currently using v1.5.6 and a v1.6 update isn't yet available
for my platform (FC8 rpm)

Yes, but it's easy to compile yourself on FC8. Hard to know if 1.6 will
get packaged for FC8.


I suppose that it could but I will leave that for Rex to answer. :-)


A lyx-1.6.0 update for F-8 is in the works.

-- Rex

Re: Feature request: Macro updates when definitions are pasted after use

[José Matos]

On Friday 14 November 2008 12:51:11 rgheck wrote:
> Manoj Rajagopalan wrote:
> > Cool! i'm currently using v1.5.6 and a v1.6 update isn't yet available
> > for my platform (FC8 rpm)
>
> Yes, but it's easy to compile yourself on FC8. Hard to know if 1.6 will
> get packaged for FC8.

I suppose that it could but I will leave that for Rex to answer. :-)

> rh

-- 
José Abílio

Re: Feature request: Macro updates when definitions are pasted after use

[rgheck]

Manoj Rajagopalan wrote:
Cool! i'm currently using v1.5.6 and a v1.6 update isn't yet available 
for my platform (FC8 rpm)


Yes, but it's easy to compile yourself on FC8. Hard to know if 1.6 will 
get packaged for FC8.


rh

Re: Feature request: Macro updates when definitions are pasted after use

[Manoj Rajagopalan]

Cool! i'm currently using v1.5.6 and a v1.6 update isn't yet available 
for my platform (FC8 rpm)


Manoj



Stefan Schimanski wrote:


Am 09.11.2008 um 23:08 schrieb Manoj Rajagopalan:
 When copy-pasting between LyX documents, sometimes I find I have 
forgotten to paste the definition of some macros. When I copy and 
paste them later (always before the first use in the document), I find 
there is no way to get LyX to iterate over the macros and to update 
them to render the definition just pasted.


 Can this feature be implemented in a future release?


Which version do you use? In LyX 1.6 this should work without problems. 
If not, it's a bug.


Stefan

Re: Feature request: Macro updates when definitions are pasted after use

[Stefan Schimanski]

Am 09.11.2008 um 23:08 schrieb Manoj Rajagopalan:
 When copy-pasting between LyX documents, sometimes I find I have  
forgotten to paste the definition of some macros. When I copy and  
paste them later (always before the first use in the document), I  
find there is no way to get LyX to iterate over the macros and to  
update them to render the definition just pasted.


 Can this feature be implemented in a future release?


Which version do you use? In LyX 1.6 this should work without  
problems. If not, it's a bug.


Stefan

Re: Feature request: Collapsed items show LABEL

[Keith Roberts]

On Wed, 29 Oct 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


To: LyX Users List 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Feature request: Collapsed items show LABEL

HI-

I've always found that collapsing figures, tables and 
sections of text has been a great asset ... except for 
when I want to look at a specific table and I have to open 
them all up to find the one I want.


Could the next release of LyX show the first label 
encountered within the collapsed item WITHIN the rectangle 
of the collapsed item?


Thanks!

Mateo.


What about some sort of hover function, similar to the 
Eclipse IDE? When you move the mouse over a collapsed 
function, Eclipse pops up a window showing the content of 
the collapsed function.


Similar to hovering your mouse over a browser href link with 
the the title attribute enabled.


Kind regards,

Keith Roberts

-
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The mind of the prudent is ever getting knowledge, and the
eear of the wise is ever seeking, inquiring for and craving
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Where will you spend Eternity?
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All email addresses are challenge-response protected with
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Re: feature request

[Rodrigo Fresneda]

Yes, I meant 1.6. However, I tried lyx 1.5.6 and the drop down menu in the
cross-reference dialog didn't work for me. I am using report class, and
unless I am doing something wrong, no matter what child document I selected
in the menu, I kept seeing all references from all child documents.
rodrigo.

On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 7:23 PM, Abdelrazak Younes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Rodrigo Fresneda wrote:
>
>> hi,
>> it would be nice if, when editing a document part of a master document, it
>> would be possible to toggle the lyx cross-reference dialog to only show
>> equation labels from the child document being edited.
>>
>>
> Do you mean in 1.6? I've seen someone else requesting this already (Abe?)
>
> All I can say is "Maybe" :-)
>
> Abdel.
>
>

Re: feature request

[Abdelrazak Younes]

Rodrigo Fresneda wrote:

hi,
it would be nice if, when editing a document part of a master document, it
would be possible to toggle the lyx cross-reference dialog to only show
equation labels from the child document being edited.
   

Do you mean in 1.6? I've seen someone else requesting this already (Abe?)

All I can say is "Maybe" :-)

Abdel.

Re: Feature Request - new file command from insert file dialog box.

[Abdelrazak Younes]

Ryan Cross wrote:

Yes, I meant in the Child Document Dialog (though there are other dialogs
for inserting files that might benefit from a similar function).

I have created this issue -
http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4475please let me know if it
is insufficient.


It is, thanks. I've confirmed the request.

Abdel.

Re: Feature Request - new file command from insert file dialog box.

[Ryan Cross]

Yes, I meant in the Child Document Dialog (though there are other dialogs
for inserting files that might benefit from a similar function).

I have created this issue -
http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4475please let me know if it
is insufficient.

-Ryan

On Jan 10, 2008 6:27 PM, Abdelrazak Younes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Ryan Cross wrote:
> > Not sure if this would be the best place to post this, but it dawned on
> me
> > today that it would be really useful if I could have an option in the
> insert
> > file dialog box to create a new file,
>
> You mean in the 'Child Document' dialog right?
>
> > instead of just browsing for an
> > existing one. Ideally, this option would create a new lyx file will all
> the
> > appropriate document settings from the parent file.
>
> Yes, that would be helpful, please put an enhancement entry in
> 'bugzilla.lyx.org'.
>
> Abdel.
>
>

Re: Feature Request - new file command from insert file dialog box.

[Abdelrazak Younes]

Ryan Cross wrote:

Not sure if this would be the best place to post this, but it dawned on me
today that it would be really useful if I could have an option in the insert
file dialog box to create a new file,


You mean in the 'Child Document' dialog right?


instead of just browsing for an
existing one. Ideally, this option would create a new lyx file will all the
appropriate document settings from the parent file.


Yes, that would be helpful, please put an enhancement entry in 
'bugzilla.lyx.org'.


Abdel.

Re: [feature request] Using Sweave with LyX - "out of the box" support for creating R reports

[rgheck]

Paul Johnson wrote:

I think the other part--the layout part--is just cosmetic. It controls
the way the R code chunks look on the screen only. The R code chunks
can be written as ordinary ERT.  If the Lyx user is happy enough to
just put in ERT (without a layout representation in the on-screen
display), the document will go through LaTeX and R fine.  It does not
matter what the blocks of ERT are called.

You could follow Gregor's example and add a layout environment that is
common to all noweb document classes. It could be called "Scrap" or
"Schunk".  Note in Gregor's Layouts, the structure is simple.  He
includes the existing noweb document layout and a
"literate-scrap.inc".

  
For 1.6, this can be created as a module that can then be used with any 
document class. That conversion may be as simple as renaming the file 
with the .module extension and adding the appropriate header. See the 
docs in 1.6.svn.



There is a more serious problem that I was never able to overcome.  If
one writes a book LyX, the R code chunks will be properly processed
only if they are actually in the main book file.  If one follows the
usual practice of writing chapters and then putting them together with
includes in the main book file, then in my experience, the R code does
not get processed.  I would be eager to see a working example of an R
book that solved this problem.  I asked about this in the LyX user
list last year and didn't get any answers, so I assumed it was an
intractable problem.

  
This may be a known sort of problem. If you're putting all the relevant 
header info in the main document---e.g., in the preamble---then it won't 
be seen when you compile the children. The solution (workaround) is to 
include that info in the child as well. At present, children don't know 
about their parents unless they are loaded as children of the parents, 
and even then they don't import the parent's preamble when compiled 
separately.


rh

RE: [feature request] Using Sweave with LyX - "out of the box" support for creating R reports

[Gorjanc Gregor]

Gorjanc Gregor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> take a look at
>> http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4286
>>
>> I did try to change the milestone to 1.6, but was not able to do
>> that, since I was not the original poster.

> FWIW, I have downloaded the paper and began to read it. I am not sure
> what is the best way to proceed. I guess it would be enough to
> configure either noweb or Sweave depending on which one is available.

The problem is of course when both are available.

> Also it would be nice to be able to use this with any class. The new
> support for modules should be enough for that, but it needs thought
> and a bit of design. I doubt I will have time to work on it personally.

> Unfortunately, the target will be set to 1.6 only if we find somebody
> willing to work on it.

I think 1.6 series is fine.

Regards, Gregor

Re: [feature request] Using Sweave with LyX - "out of the box" support for creating R reports

[Paul Johnson]

On Jan 4, 2008 7:32 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gorjanc Gregor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > take a look at
> > http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4286
> >
> > I did try to change the milestone to 1.6, but was not able to do
> > that, since I was not the original poster.
>
> FWIW, I have downloaded the paper and began to read it. I am not sure
> what is the best way to proceed. I guess it would be enough to
> configure either noweb or Sweave depending on which one is available.
> Also it would be nice to be able to use this with any class. The new
> support for modules should be enough for that, but it needs thought
> and a bit of design. I doubt I will have time to work on it
> personally.
>
> Unfortunately, the target will be set to 1.6 only if we find somebody
> willing to work on it.
>
> JMarc
>

It appears to me that this is mostly superficial.  The change in the R
batch processing has simplified the problem somewhat from when I was
working on it originally.   Now it is no longer necessary to use that
small bash script to pass the LyX noweb output to R.  Rather, one can
simply make one Lyx preference change, either with the lyx GUI
preference changer or by adding a like like this in ~/.lyx/preferences

\converter "literate"  "latex" "R CMD Sweave $$i" ""

It appears to me this "does the trick" even if one does not install Sweave.sty.

Take one the lyx documents I have posted here (files that use the
ordinary Lyx noweb article layout)

http://pj.freefaculty.org/stat/Distributions

Take Normal-01.lyx. You can see how the output is supposed to look
because I have the pdf file posted as well.  If you have R installed,
then open the document in LyX and the document will be processed just
fine. I do not think it is necessary to put Sweave.sty in the LaTeX
path, but, as I originally said in 2006, it is necessary to have
noweb.sty.  It is not necessary to have the whole noweb installation,
just that file.

I think the other part--the layout part--is just cosmetic. It controls
the way the R code chunks look on the screen only. The R code chunks
can be written as ordinary ERT.  If the Lyx user is happy enough to
just put in ERT (without a layout representation in the on-screen
display), the document will go through LaTeX and R fine.  It does not
matter what the blocks of ERT are called.

You could follow Gregor's example and add a layout environment that is
common to all noweb document classes. It could be called "Scrap" or
"Schunk".  Note in Gregor's Layouts, the structure is simple.  He
includes the existing noweb document layout and a
"literate-scrap.inc".

There is a more serious problem that I was never able to overcome.  If
one writes a book LyX, the R code chunks will be properly processed
only if they are actually in the main book file.  If one follows the
usual practice of writing chapters and then putting them together with
includes in the main book file, then in my experience, the R code does
not get processed.  I would be eager to see a working example of an R
book that solved this problem.  I asked about this in the LyX user
list last year and didn't get any answers, so I assumed it was an
intractable problem.

pj
-- 
Paul E. Johnson
Professor, Political Science
1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504
University of Kansas


Here's Sweave.sty:

\NeedsTeXFormat{LaTeX2e}
\ProvidesPackage{Sweave}{}

\RequirePackage{ifthen}
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
\ProcessOptions

\RequirePackage{graphicx,fancyvrb}
\IfFileExists{upquote.sty}{\RequirePackage{upquote}}{}

[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  \RequirePackage[T1]{fontenc}
  \RequirePackage{ae}
}{}%

\DefineVerbatimEnvironment{Sinput}{Verbatim}{fontshape=sl}
\DefineVerbatimEnvironment{Soutput}{Verbatim}{}
\DefineVerbatimEnvironment{Scode}{Verbatim}{fontshape=sl}

\newenvironment{Schunk}{}{}

Re: [feature request] Using Sweave with LyX - "out of the box" support for creating R reports

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

Gorjanc Gregor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> take a look at
> http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4286
>
> I did try to change the milestone to 1.6, but was not able to do
> that, since I was not the original poster.

FWIW, I have downloaded the paper and began to read it. I am not sure
what is the best way to proceed. I guess it would be enough to
configure either noweb or Sweave depending on which one is available.
Also it would be nice to be able to use this with any class. The new
support for modules should be enough for that, but it needs thought
and a bit of design. I doubt I will have time to work on it
personally.

Unfortunately, the target will be set to 1.6 only if we find somebody
willing to work on it.

JMarc

Re: [feature request] Using Sweave with LyX - "out of the box" support for creating R reports

[Liviu Andronic]

On 1/3/08, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Please create a bug with all the relevant information if it is not yet
> done.

http://bugzilla.lyx.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4286

Gregor took care of updating the bug report accordingly.

Regards,
Liviu

Re: [feature request] Using Sweave with LyX - "out of the box" support for creating R reports

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

"Liviu Andronic" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> This message is mainly intended to LyX developers. A paper [1] by
> Gregor Gorjanc and due to appear in the near future on Rnews [2]
> describes into great detail all the steps needed to customize LyX so
> that it integrate nicely with Sweave [3] for creating reports using R.

Hello,

Please create a bug with all the relevant information if it is not yet
done. 

JMarc

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

Eric S Fraga <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> No, please no!  Tooltips et al. imply the use of the mouse. Mouse use
> should not be a requirement, IMHO.  Not only that, I hate it when
> things pop-up just because I shoved the mouse out of the way when
> doing something else!

Agreed. But the message could also be shown in the status bar when the
cursor is on front of the inset.

JMarc

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Eric S Fraga]

At Mon, 03 Dec 2007 11:43:05 +0100, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
> 
> When people are beginning to ask for a brand new user interface for
> such a minuscule feature, something is wrong. What about a tooltip
> on the closed button instead?

No, please no!  Tooltips et al. imply the use of the mouse. Mouse use
should not be a requirement, IMHO.  Not only that, I hate it when
things pop-up just because I shoved the mouse out of the way when
doing something else!

I try avoid all use of the mouse whenever possible (due to RSI issues
mainly but also because they take my hands off the
keyboard). Actually, the need to use the mouse is one reason I've gone
back to emacs w/auctex+reflex+... instead of lyx in general. I love
lyx but there are still places where you have to use the mouse and I
find that irritating.  It *is* much better than it used to be in this
regard, mind you!

cheers,
eric

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

Todd Denniston <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

>> Don't we have this in View menu already?
>
> 1.5 yes
> 1.4 no

You are right of course. I already forgot...

JMarc

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Todd Denniston]

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote, On 12/03/2007 11:03 AM:

Todd Denniston <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:


Or how about an option that to me would make more sense:
A collapse|expand ALL button/setting/menu,  that on collapse-able
elements had a similar effect to the View->Threads->"Expand All
Threads"|"Collapse All Threads" does on threads in Thunderbird.


Don't we have this in View menu already?

JMarc



1.5 yes
1.4 no

Sorry, I was going from my experience with 1.4 and the context of the email, 
which was indicating that Daniel was getting version control conflicts due to 
changes in [un]collapsed state.  I just installed a box with 1.5 so I will 
find this feature helpful.


--
Todd Denniston
Crane Division, Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC Crane)
Harnessing the Power of Technology for the Warfighter

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[G. Milde]

On  3.12.07, Todd Denniston wrote:

> Or how about an option that to me would make more sense:
> A collapse|expand ALL button/setting/menu,  

It is already present: View>Open_all_Insets and View>Close_all_Insets.

GM

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

Todd Denniston <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Or how about an option that to me would make more sense:
> A collapse|expand ALL button/setting/menu,  that on collapse-able
> elements had a similar effect to the View->Threads->"Expand All
> Threads"|"Collapse All Threads" does on threads in Thunderbird.

Don't we have this in View menu already?

JMarc

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Jean-Marc Lasgouttes]

Daniel Lohmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
>> Daniel Lohmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>>
>>> As we are already on it :-)
>>>
>>> It also would be really nice, if
>>>
>>> 1) there is an opportunity to specify the *default* display for *new*
>>> inset, preferably even customizable per inset-type.
>>>
>>> 2) the document-specific state of each inset would no longer be stored
>>> in the document file (fancydoc.lyx),  but in some extra settings file
>>> (such as fancydoc.lyxrc).
>>> (It is kind of annoying to get version control conflicts just because
>>> of the fact the me and my colleagues prefer different ways to display
>>> the insets on screen.)
>>
>> When people are beginning to ask for a brand new user interface for
>> such a minuscule feature, something is wrong. What about a tooltip
>> on the closed button instead?

> Do you really consider a team-work-feasible document format (in the
> sense that it can be managed with tools such as svn or cvs) a
> "minuscule feature" and an indicator for "something is wrong"? I just
> can't believe that.

Sorry, my comment was a bit harsh and short. My point was:

- intended effect: have the contents of a closed float be visible when
  it is closed.

- means: provide 3 levels of display for each inset (3 radio buttons);
  provide a default for new insets (3 radio buttons) configurable by
  inset types (one combox).

I think that trying to solve this (real) problem by way of 7 different
UI elements (and associated support code and file format extension) is
a case of overengineering. I did not mean minuscule as "not useful",
but as "we should be able to get it right without configuration".

Note that I was not at all addressing the part 2) above, which is also
a different and orthogonal problem. I do not think that anybody has a
really good solution to this problem, actually.

> Maybe I have not explained myself well enough. I am mainly asking for
> separation of concerns between the document content and the
> editor-ui-related data associated with it, which is IMHO a good design
> principle anyway.

As I wrote above, I was commenting about the other one. I am sorry
that I was not very clear.

> Character styles, however, are another story. I use them very
> extensively, but had to learn that their default display style (with
> label) is -- for me -- very distracting. It consumes too much space
> and my eyes always stumble across the labels. So I tend to fold
> them. 

I am not sure that having settings for each and every preference of
users (a la Emacs or KDE) is the best way to go.

> Another thing with the display of character style insets is that they
> are not stored within the document in 1,4.x. This means that I have to
> fold them every time I re-open the document, a fact I am actually glad
> about; otherwise the frequency of svn conflicts would go up
> significantly, which is the (practical) reason for the request for
> separating content from ui-data on the file system.

It would be nice to achieve, but not easy at all IMO.

And with some documents (for example docs), we have ideas on how we
want insets to be toggled or note when we distribute the file.

JMarc

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[Todd Denniston]

G. Milde wrote, On 12/03/2007 10:21 AM:

On  3.12.07, Daniel Lohmann wrote:

Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:

Daniel Lohmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

...

2) the document-specific state of each inset would no longer be stored
in the document file (fancydoc.lyx),  but in some extra settings file
(such as fancydoc.lyxrc).
(It is kind of annoying to get version control conflicts just because
of the fact the me and my colleagues prefer different ways to display
the insets on screen.)

...
Maybe I have not explained myself well enough. I am mainly asking for 
separation of concerns between the document content and the 
editor-ui-related data associated with it, which is IMHO a good design 
principle anyway.

...

otherwise the frequency of svn conflicts would go up significantly, which
is the (practical) reason for the request for separating content from
ui-data on the file system.


While I understand the reason and the rationale to separate content and
presentation, I would not like to see a separate file for every lyx file:
this would clutter my view on the file-system a lot.

OTOH, there is the design principle to keep together information that
belongs together: and type and status of a Note can be considered
information that belongs together -- it would become a more complicated
to specify which inset the "collapsed" status belongs to when stored in a
different file.

Maybe there is a way to tell SVN to ignore these settings? 


Or how about an option that to me would make more sense:
A collapse|expand ALL button/setting/menu,  that on collapse-able elements had 
a similar effect to the View->Threads->"Expand All Threads"|"Collapse All 
Threads" does on threads in Thunderbird.


I understand the issue with the version control, which is why when I am 
preparing to check in my changes I always walk through the document and 
collapse all the ERT&&FootNotes&&Notes...
If we had a big collapse|expand button it would be easier to explain as a 
"coding convention" that `prior to committing changes the changer will 
collapse|expand all collapse-able elements in the document.`



I don't know if it would make since to have multiple collapse|expand buttons 
somewhere [one for each collapse-able type] or just one big toggle button.



(I remember faintly that SVN diffing ignores some specially formatted
tokens, so maybe a file format that stores these settings specially marked
up would help. Another option would be to use an external diff command and
customize it to ignore the line behind \begin_inset Note...)

Guenter




--
Todd Denniston
Crane Division, Naval Surface Warfare Center (NSWC Crane)
Harnessing the Power of Technology for the Warfighter

Re: Feature Request: Show the title in closed floats

[G. Milde]

On  3.12.07, Daniel Lohmann wrote:
> Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote:
>> Daniel Lohmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
...
>>> 2) the document-specific state of each inset would no longer be stored
>>> in the document file (fancydoc.lyx),  but in some extra settings file
>>> (such as fancydoc.lyxrc).
>>> (It is kind of annoying to get version control conflicts just because
>>> of the fact the me and my colleagues prefer different ways to display
>>> the insets on screen.)
...
> Maybe I have not explained myself well enough. I am mainly asking for 
> separation of concerns between the document content and the 
> editor-ui-related data associated with it, which is IMHO a good design 
> principle anyway.
...
> otherwise the frequency of svn conflicts would go up significantly, which
> is the (practical) reason for the request for separating content from
> ui-data on the file system.

While I understand the reason and the rationale to separate content and
presentation, I would not like to see a separate file for every lyx file:
this would clutter my view on the file-system a lot.

OTOH, there is the design principle to keep together information that
belongs together: and type and status of a Note can be considered
information that belongs together -- it would become a more complicated
to specify which inset the "collapsed" status belongs to when stored in a
different file.

Maybe there is a way to tell SVN to ignore these settings? 
(I remember faintly that SVN diffing ignores some specially formatted
tokens, so maybe a file format that stores these settings specially marked
up would help. Another option would be to use an external diff command and
customize it to ignore the line behind \begin_inset Note...)

Guenter