Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Danny Noonan]

True. JFW does however allow you to choose if you turn off forms mode when 
using navigation. This would be a nice feature set for VO. It currently isn't 
though unfortunately. :-)

Danny.

On 02/09/2013, at 2:07 AM, Sarah k Alawami  wrote:

> It does it already in ios. We'll see what happens. Remember qn is not just 
> for forms mode. Qn is for quickly navigating around the screen with out using 
> both hands. so having it automatically turning off might not be such a good 
> idea at times. If I want it off I'll do it. Remember apple makes you think 
> outside the box and that's what I love.
> 
> Tc.
> On Sep 1, 2013, at 1:10 AM, William Lomas  wrote:
> 
>> I wish voice-over could be more intelligent; and turn off the quick Nav  
>> when you encounter a text box just like jaws.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On 1 Sep 2013, at 06:27, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi Sarah,
>>> 
>>> Thanks a lot for mentioning this!
>>> On 9/1/2013 9:47 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
 Agreed. that's why I'm saying turn qn off if you are to type in a field. 
 IN fact on a bt keyboard  in ios generally qn is turn doff when you press 
 up and down arrow to tap a field for editing. I generally use it to move 
 to a button then turn it off as I have access to other elements of vo and 
 links and stuff with those keys that are in the quick start and help menus.
 
 Take care all and be blessed.
 On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
 
> Hi all,
> 
> The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
> without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a 
> text box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
> interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
> 
> Thanks.
> On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
>> It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
>> stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in 
>> tot eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I 
>> get around web pages like google.
>> 
>> Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I 
>> don't think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not 
>> found it used all the  time.
>> 
>> Good luck.
>> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan 
>>> of Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>>> 
>>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the 
>>> system and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down. 
>>>  Before you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously 
>>> do know about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable 
>>> sollution however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric 
>>> keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital 
>>> letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my 
>>> keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being 
>>> I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, but 
>>> my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
>>> constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert 
>>> too much pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking 
>>> the thing, which of corse could give very undesirable results.
>>> 
>>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I 
>>> have Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  
>>> Well, by default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the 
>>> Sweetspot is set to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  
>>> That's normally in most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop 
>>> open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, and just start typing my 
>>> query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover 
>>> utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter 
>>> navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys 
>>> while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block 
>>> text by block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within 
>>> Safari, I can use those single letter keys.  The only problem which is 
>>> really pissing me off is that let's use Google just for example.  Now, 
>>> this happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for simplisity 
>>> sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav 
>>> enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm 
>>> popped immediately into the sear

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Danny Noonan]

Not trying to assign blame here.   I actually was more commenting on the 
message thread subject than your specific message but as your message got sent 
to my phone it was the one that got responded too.

You can never assume the mac works the way other systems do in regard to 
functionality and even core concepts. This is 1 of the biggest reasons people 
have trouble. They expect it to be quote un quote logical like JFW or 
WindowEyes. It's quite logical yet very different in some key aspects.

Kind regards,
Danny.
On 01/09/2013, at 3:27 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:

> Hi Danny,
> 
> Right. My fault then. By reading the Voiceover manual, I incorrectly assumed 
> that making no mention of this behavior meant VO functions the same as screen 
> readers on other platforms when interacting on a form field.
> 
> I'm soon buying a Mac mini, so I'm glad stuff like this is brought up in the 
> list. :-)
> 
> Thanks!
> On 9/1/2013 9:46 AM, Danny Noonan wrote:
>> To be correct, your problem is with quick nabs functionality rather than it 
>> being buggy. It works the way it's intended too.
>> 
>> 
>> Danny.
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On 01/09/2013, at 3:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
>>> without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a 
>>> text box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
>>> interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
 It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
 stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot 
 eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get 
 around web pages like google.
 
 Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I 
 don't think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not 
 found it used all the  time.
 
 Good luck.
 On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  
 wrote:
 
> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan 
> of Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
> 
> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander. 
>  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that 
> I probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very 
> heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, 
> thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give 
> very undesirable results.
> 
> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I 
> have Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, 
> by default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is 
> set to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally 
> in most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and 
> boom, I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit 
> return.  Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table 
> by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, 
> etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those 
> single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
> that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on 
> any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for 
> this example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter 
> navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search 
> box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  
> Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for 
> example purpose.  So I start interacting with the text box, because if I 
> don't, it will think that some of those letters should be intercepted as 
> navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys 
> t

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Danny Noonan]

Also, vo shift space will often click a link that vo space won't in my 
experience.

Danny.

On 01/09/2013, at 6:01 AM, Sarah k Alawami  wrote:

> I have that issue to, but I just keep clicking the link, but when you let's 
> say go from the item chooser  and find the link you *have to* press the thing 
> twice as the first press moves it to the link, the second time clicks the 
> link, or what ever the item might be.
> 
> Tc.
> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:30 PM, Andy Collins  wrote:
> 
>> All I can say, is that I regularly encounter times when clicking a link on a 
>> webpage produces nothing at all, like you say, it just sits there on the 
>> link. VO says link pressed, but it doesn't activate it! -
>> 
>> Andy
>> On 31 Aug 2013, at 20:11, Chris Gilland  wrote:
>> 
>>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
>>> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>>> 
>>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
>>> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
>>> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
>>> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
>>> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
>>> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
>>> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  
>>> Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
>>> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that I 
>>> probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy 
>>> fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, thus 
>>> accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give very 
>>> undesirable results.
>>> 
>>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
>>> Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
>>> default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
>>> to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
>>> most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
>>> I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  
>>> Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
>>> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
>>> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table by 
>>> table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, etc.  
>>> Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those single 
>>> letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is that let's 
>>> use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any web site 
>>> I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, 
>>> I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
>>> Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's 
>>> say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
>>> ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
>>> interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some 
>>> of those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter 
>>> commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start 
>>> interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the 
>>> top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, 
>>> so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of 
>>> the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away 
>>> by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, now, if I 
>>> simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the next 
>>> heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to jump 
>>> me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on 
>>> the page, which in this case happens to be the search field, then, at the 
>>> beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text box without my 
>>> will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then 
>>> delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then 
>>> try hitting H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, 
>>> which it is, then I get the same result.  It jumps me back up to that text 
>>> box, interacts, then types the letter H.  This is incredibly buggy in my 
>>> book!  Oh, and as if that's not enough, here's another weird thing.  With 
>>> Quick nav on, and single letter nav on, if I type in my search query, then 
>>> don't even vo+right arrow to the google search button, but instead just hit 
>>> r

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Danny Noonan]

QN does what its meant to do. People try to make it suit them and get 
frustrated. I agree, turn it off and type and then turn it on. It's a 2 finger 
key stroke.

As for 1 letter navigation, I turned it off a long time ago as it's the factor 
that makes entering text into fields etc more complicated. I use the roter in 
QN to move round and when I have to do a table or something unusual that isn't 
inn my roter, well I do the full keyboard command and don't complane that I 
have to spend .09 extra seconds to do it.

Danny.

On 01/09/2013, at 6:00 AM, Sarah k Alawami  wrote:

> It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting stuff 
> so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot eh 
> field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get around 
> web pages like google.
> 
> Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
> think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it used 
> all the  time.
> 
> Good luck.
> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:
> 
>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
>> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>> 
>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
>> use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
>> anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
>> lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
>> then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, 
>> say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've 
>> just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also 
>> understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use 
>> trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump 
>> the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably 
>> would exert too much pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally 
>> clicking the thing, which of corse could give very undesirable results.
>> 
>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
>> Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
>> default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
>> to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
>> most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
>> I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, 
>> I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I 
>> set it up to use single letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep 
>> holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table by table, heading by 
>> heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, etc.  Now, as long as 
>> quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those single letter keys.  The 
>> only problem which is really pissing me off is that let's use Google just 
>> for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for 
>> simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav 
>> enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm 
>> popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now 
>> do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but 
>> again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start interacting with the 
>> text box, because if I don't, it will think that some of those letters 
>> should be intercepted as navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my 
>> down and right arrow keys together, and start interacting.  I then type in 
>> ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with 
>> fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a 
>> physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of the page, not even 
>> focused anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away by doing the 
>> fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, now, if I simply hit the 
>> letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the next heading on the 
>> page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to jump me back to the 
>> search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on the page, which in 
>> this case happens to be the search field, then, at the beginning of the box, 
>> it's interacting me with that text box without my will, and it's literally 
>> insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then delete and backspace it 
>> out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then try hitting H again, first 
>> being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, which it is, then I get the 
>> same result.  It jumps me back up to that text box, interacts, then types 
>> the letter H.  This is inc

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Sarah k Alawami]

It does it already in ios. We'll see what happens. Remember qn is not just for 
forms mode. Qn is for quickly navigating around the screen with out using both 
hands. so having it automatically turning off might not be such a good idea at 
times. If I want it off I'll do it. Remember apple makes you think outside the 
box and that's what I love.

Tc.
On Sep 1, 2013, at 1:10 AM, William Lomas  wrote:

> I wish voice-over could be more intelligent; and turn off the quick Nav  when 
> you encounter a text box just like jaws.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On 1 Sep 2013, at 06:27, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
> 
>> Hi Sarah,
>> 
>> Thanks a lot for mentioning this!
>> On 9/1/2013 9:47 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
>>> Agreed. that's why I'm saying turn qn off if you are to type in a field. IN 
>>> fact on a bt keyboard  in ios generally qn is turn doff when you press up 
>>> and down arrow to tap a field for editing. I generally use it to move to a 
>>> button then turn it off as I have access to other elements of vo and links 
>>> and stuff with those keys that are in the quick start and help menus.
>>> 
>>> Take care all and be blessed.
>>> On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all,
 
 The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
 without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a 
 text box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
 interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
 
 Thanks.
 On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
> It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
> stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in 
> tot eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I 
> get around web pages like google.
> 
> Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I 
> don't think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not 
> found it used all the  time.
> 
> Good luck.
> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  
> wrote:
> 
>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan 
>> of Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>> 
>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
>> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
>> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
>> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
>> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
>> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  
>> I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard 
>> commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a 
>> macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are 
>> big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  
>> Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much 
>> pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, 
>> which of corse could give very undesirable results.
>> 
>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I 
>> have Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, 
>> by default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot 
>> is set to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's 
>> normally in most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open 
>> Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, 
>> then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and 
>> under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation 
>> so that I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while 
>> jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text 
>> by block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, 
>> I can use those single letter keys.  The only problem which is really 
>> pissing me off is that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this 
>> happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm 
>> gonna use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well 
>> as single letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped 
>> immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now do 
>> a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but 
>> again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start interacting with 
>> the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some of those 
>> letters should be intercepted as navigation sin

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[William Lomas]

I wish voice-over could be more intelligent; and turn off the quick Nav  when 
you encounter a text box just like jaws.

Sent from my iPhone

On 1 Sep 2013, at 06:27, Parham Doustdar  wrote:

> Hi Sarah,
> 
> Thanks a lot for mentioning this!
> On 9/1/2013 9:47 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
>> Agreed. that's why I'm saying turn qn off if you are to type in a field. IN 
>> fact on a bt keyboard  in ios generally qn is turn doff when you press up 
>> and down arrow to tap a field for editing. I generally use it to move to a 
>> button then turn it off as I have access to other elements of vo and links 
>> and stuff with those keys that are in the quick start and help menus.
>> 
>> Take care all and be blessed.
>> On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
>>> without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a 
>>> text box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
>>> interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
 It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
 stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot 
 eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get 
 around web pages like google.
 
 Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I 
 don't think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not 
 found it used all the  time.
 
 Good luck.
 On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  
 wrote:
 
> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan 
> of Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
> 
> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander. 
>  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that 
> I probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very 
> heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, 
> thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give 
> very undesirable results.
> 
> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I 
> have Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, 
> by default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is 
> set to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally 
> in most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and 
> boom, I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit 
> return.  Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table 
> by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, 
> etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those 
> single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
> that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on 
> any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for 
> this example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter 
> navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search 
> box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  
> Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for 
> example purpose.  So I start interacting with the text box, because if I 
> don't, it will think that some of those letters should be intercepted as 
> navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys 
> together, and start interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit 
> return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  
> Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical hom/end key, 
> nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of the page, not even focused anymore in 
> the text box, as I moved focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump 
> to the top of the screen, now, if 

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Parham Doustdar]

Hi Sarah,

Thanks a lot for mentioning this!
On 9/1/2013 9:47 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

Agreed. that's why I'm saying turn qn off if you are to type in a field. IN 
fact on a bt keyboard  in ios generally qn is turn doff when you press up and 
down arrow to tap a field for editing. I generally use it to move to a button 
then turn it off as I have access to other elements of vo and links and stuff 
with those keys that are in the quick start and help menus.

Take care all and be blessed.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:


Hi all,

The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a text 
box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not interacting, 
you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?

Thanks.
On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting stuff 
so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot eh field, 
hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get around web pages 
like google.

Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it used 
all the  time.

Good luck.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:


OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.

My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say 
I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just 
disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand 
that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, 
but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much 
pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of 
corse could give very undesirable results.

I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I opened 
up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have Safari set 
automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by default on the 
Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set to the google 
search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in most cases exactly 
what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, and 
just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into the 
Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single 
letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys 
while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by 
block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use 
those single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any 
web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example. 
 So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I 
want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some of 
those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter commands.  So I 
hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start interacting.  I then type 
in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with 
fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical 
hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of the page, not even focused 
anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to 
jump to the top of the screen, now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, 
that it would move me to the next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually. 
 What it's doing is to jump me back to the search box, I presume it's finding 
the next search box on the page, which in this case happens to be the search 
field, then, at the beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text 
box without my will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  
If I then delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, 
then try hitting H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, 
wh

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Sarah k Alawami]

Lol. No problems. We all learn. I've been a mac user for 3 years and I am 
always learning new things in regards to what my mac can and cannot do. bbut I 
love qn as you can quickly get around stuff like dialogues and stuff. I don't 
know all of the key strokes but it is still very very useful.

Tc and be blessed.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:27 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:

> Hi Danny,
> 
> Right. My fault then. By reading the Voiceover manual, I incorrectly assumed 
> that making no mention of this behavior meant VO functions the same as screen 
> readers on other platforms when interacting on a form field.
> 
> I'm soon buying a Mac mini, so I'm glad stuff like this is brought up in the 
> list. :-)
> 
> Thanks!
> On 9/1/2013 9:46 AM, Danny Noonan wrote:
>> To be correct, your problem is with quick nabs functionality rather than it 
>> being buggy. It works the way it's intended too.
>> 
>> 
>> Danny.
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On 01/09/2013, at 3:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
>>> without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a 
>>> text box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
>>> interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
 It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
 stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot 
 eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get 
 around web pages like google.
 
 Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I 
 don't think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not 
 found it used all the  time.
 
 Good luck.
 On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  
 wrote:
 
> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan 
> of Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
> 
> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander. 
>  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that 
> I probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very 
> heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, 
> thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give 
> very undesirable results.
> 
> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I 
> have Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, 
> by default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is 
> set to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally 
> in most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and 
> boom, I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit 
> return.  Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table 
> by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, 
> etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those 
> single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
> that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on 
> any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for 
> this example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter 
> navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search 
> box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  
> Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for 
> example purpose.  So I start interacting with the text box, because if I 
> don't, it will think that some of those letters should be intercepted as 
> navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys 
> together, and start interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit 
> return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  
> Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a phys

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Parham Doustdar]

Hi Danny,

Right. My fault then. By reading the Voiceover manual, I incorrectly 
assumed that making no mention of this behavior meant VO functions the 
same as screen readers on other platforms when interacting on a form field.


I'm soon buying a Mac mini, so I'm glad stuff like this is brought up in 
the list. :-)


Thanks!
On 9/1/2013 9:46 AM, Danny Noonan wrote:

To be correct, your problem is with quick nabs functionality rather than it 
being buggy. It works the way it's intended too.


Danny.
Sent from my iPhone

On 01/09/2013, at 3:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:


Hi all,

The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a text 
box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not interacting, 
you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?

Thanks.
On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting stuff 
so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot eh field, 
hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get around web pages 
like google.

Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it used 
all the  time.

Good luck.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:


OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.

My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say 
I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just 
disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand 
that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, 
but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much 
pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of 
corse could give very undesirable results.

I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I opened 
up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have Safari set 
automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by default on the 
Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set to the google 
search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in most cases exactly 
what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, and 
just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into the 
Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single 
letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys 
while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by 
block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use 
those single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any 
web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example. 
 So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I 
want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some of 
those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter commands.  So I 
hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start interacting.  I then type 
in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with 
fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical 
hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of the page, not even focused 
anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to 
jump to the top of the screen, now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, 
that it would move me to the next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually. 
 What it's doing is to jump me back to the search box, I presume it's finding 
the next search box on the page, which in this case happens to be the search 
field, then, at the beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text 
box without my will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  
If I then delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, 
then try hitting H again, first being sure that qui

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Danny Noonan]

To be correct, your problem is with quick nabs functionality rather than it 
being buggy. It works the way it's intended too. 


Danny. 
Sent from my iPhone

On 01/09/2013, at 3:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
> without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a text 
> box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
> interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
> 
> Thanks.
> On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
>> It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
>> stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot 
>> eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get 
>> around web pages like google.
>> 
>> Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
>> think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it 
>> used all the  time.
>> 
>> Good luck.
>> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:
>> 
>>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
>>> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>>> 
>>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
>>> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
>>> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
>>> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
>>> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
>>> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
>>> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  
>>> Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
>>> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that I 
>>> probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy 
>>> fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, thus 
>>> accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give very 
>>> undesirable results.
>>> 
>>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
>>> Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
>>> default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
>>> to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
>>> most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
>>> I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  
>>> Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
>>> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
>>> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table by 
>>> table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, etc.  
>>> Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those single 
>>> letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is that let's 
>>> use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any web site 
>>> I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, 
>>> I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
>>> Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's 
>>> say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
>>> ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
>>> interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some 
>>> of those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter 
>>> commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start 
>>> interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the 
>>> top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, 
>>> so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of 
>>> the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away 
>>> by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, now, if I 
>>> simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the next 
>>> heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to jump 
>>> me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on 
>>> the page, which in this case happens to be the search field, then, at the 
>>> beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text box without my 
>>> will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then 
>>> delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then 
>>> try hitting H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, 
>>> which it is, then I get the same result.  It jumps me back up to that text 
>

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Sarah k Alawami]

Agreed. that's why I'm saying turn qn off if you are to type in a field. IN 
fact on a bt keyboard  in ios generally qn is turn doff when you press up and 
down arrow to tap a field for editing. I generally use it to move to a button 
then turn it off as I have access to other elements of vo and links and stuff 
with those keys that are in the quick start and help menus.

Take care all and be blessed.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:12 PM, Parham Doustdar  wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other items 
> without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting with a text 
> box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas when not 
> interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?
> 
> Thanks.
> On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:
>> It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting 
>> stuff so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot 
>> eh field, hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get 
>> around web pages like google.
>> 
>> Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
>> think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it 
>> used all the  time.
>> 
>> Good luck.
>> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:
>> 
>>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
>>> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>>> 
>>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
>>> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
>>> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
>>> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
>>> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
>>> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
>>> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  
>>> Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
>>> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that I 
>>> probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy 
>>> fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, thus 
>>> accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give very 
>>> undesirable results.
>>> 
>>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
>>> Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
>>> default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
>>> to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
>>> most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
>>> I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  
>>> Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
>>> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
>>> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table by 
>>> table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, etc.  
>>> Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those single 
>>> letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is that let's 
>>> use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any web site 
>>> I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, 
>>> I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
>>> Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's 
>>> say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
>>> ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
>>> interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some 
>>> of those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter 
>>> commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start 
>>> interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the 
>>> top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, 
>>> so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of 
>>> the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away 
>>> by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, now, if I 
>>> simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the next 
>>> heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to jump 
>>> me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on 
>>> the page, which in this case happens to be the search field, then, at the 
>>> beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text box without my 
>>> will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Parham Doustdar]

Hi all,

The reason for quicknav, I'd think, is to quickly navigate to other 
items without turning it on and off all the time. Wouldn't interacting 
with a text box mean that you want all the keys to be typed, whereas 
when not interacting, you'd want them to be used as quicknav keys?


Thanks.
On 9/1/2013 12:30 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting stuff 
so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot eh field, 
hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get around web pages 
like google.

Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it used 
all the  time.

Good luck.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:


OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.

My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say 
I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just 
disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand 
that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, 
but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much 
pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of 
corse could give very undesirable results.

I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I opened 
up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have Safari set 
automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by default on the 
Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set to the google 
search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in most cases exactly 
what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, and 
just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into the 
Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single 
letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys 
while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by 
block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use 
those single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any 
web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example. 
 So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I 
want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some of 
those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter commands.  So I 
hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start interacting.  I then type 
in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with 
fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical 
hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of the page, not even focused 
anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to 
jump to the top of the screen, now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, 
that it would move me to the next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually. 
 What it's doing is to jump me back to the search box, I presume it's finding 
the next search box on the page, which in this case happens to be the search 
field, then, at the beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text 
box without my will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  
If I then delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, 
then try hitting H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, 
which it is, then I get the same result.  It jumps me back up to that text box, 
interacts, then types the letter H.  This is incredibly buggy in my book!  Oh, 
and as if that's not enough, here's another weird thing.  With Quick nav on, 
and single letter nav on, if I type in my search query, then don't even 
vo+right arrow to the google search button, but instead just hit return, like I 
normally did with quick nav not enabled, it doesn't do a bloody thing!  It just 
kind a sits there, and thinks about life.  It doesn't go busy busy busy or 
an

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Chris Gilland]

Andy,

Can you give us a specific example of a page you're having issues with and 
tell us how to navigate to the link you're having issues with?  This way we 
can try reproducing the problem?


Chris.

- Original Message - 
From: "Sarah k Alawami" 

To: "Mac OSX & iOS Accessibility" 
Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2013 5:01 PM
Subject: Re: Incredibly annoying,not to mention extremely buggy problem with 
Quicknav



Hmm. maybe the page changes and you don't hear it. I've had dynamic pages 
like that where they change and you have to look for it. Try that as well.


Good luck.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 1:50 PM, Andy Collins  wrote:

Sarah - No matter  how many  times I click the link, it doesn't work, nor 
does using the item chooser, I've even interacted, brought the mouse 
pointer to the link with vo cmd f5, and done a single and double mouse 
click using vo shift space, but nothing works on those links -


Andy
On 31 Aug 2013, at 21:01, Sarah k Alawami  wrote:

I have that issue to, but I just keep clicking the link, but when you 
let's say go from the item chooser  and find the link you *have to* press 
the thing twice as the first press moves it to the link, the second time 
clicks the link, or what ever the item might be.


Tc.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:30 PM, Andy Collins  
wrote:


All I can say, is that I regularly encounter times when clicking a link 
on a webpage produces nothing at all, like you say, it just sits there 
on the link. VO says link pressed, but it doesn't activate it! -


Andy
On 31 Aug 2013, at 20:11, Chris Gilland  
wrote:


OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan 
of Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.


My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the 
system and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down. 
Before you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously 
do know about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable 
sollution however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric 
keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital 
letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my 
keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being 
I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, but 
my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert 
too much pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking 
the thing, which of corse could give very undesirable results.


I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I 
have Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch. 
Well, by default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the 
Sweetspot is set to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK. 
That's normally in most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop 
open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, and just start typing my 
query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover 
utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter 
navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys 
while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block 
text by block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within 
Safari, I can use those single letter keys.  The only problem which is 
really pissing me off is that let's use Google just for example.  Now, 
this happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for simplisity 
sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav 
enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm 
popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I want to 
now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I 
start interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think 
that some of those letters should be intercepted as navigation single 
letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys together, and 
start interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go 
to the top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a 
macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad. 
Now, at the top of the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, 
as I moved focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top 
of the screen, now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it 
would move me to the next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually. 
What it's doing is to jump me back to the search box, I presume it's 
finding the next search 

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Sarah k Alawami]

Hmm. maybe the page changes and you don't hear it. I've had dynamic pages like 
that where they change and you have to look for it. Try that as well.

Good luck.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 1:50 PM, Andy Collins  wrote:

> Sarah - No matter  how many  times I click the link, it doesn't work, nor 
> does using the item chooser, I've even interacted, brought the mouse pointer 
> to the link with vo cmd f5, and done a single and double mouse click using vo 
> shift space, but nothing works on those links -
> 
> Andy
> On 31 Aug 2013, at 21:01, Sarah k Alawami  wrote:
> 
>> I have that issue to, but I just keep clicking the link, but when you let's 
>> say go from the item chooser  and find the link you *have to* press the 
>> thing twice as the first press moves it to the link, the second time clicks 
>> the link, or what ever the item might be.
>> 
>> Tc.
>> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:30 PM, Andy Collins  wrote:
>> 
>>> All I can say, is that I regularly encounter times when clicking a link on 
>>> a webpage produces nothing at all, like you say, it just sits there on the 
>>> link. VO says link pressed, but it doesn't activate it! -
>>> 
>>> Andy
>>> On 31 Aug 2013, at 20:11, Chris Gilland  wrote:
>>> 
 OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
 Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
 
 My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
 and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
 you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
 about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
 however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
 Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
 hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  
 Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
 could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that 
 I probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very 
 heavy fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, 
 thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give 
 very undesirable results.
 
 I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
 opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
 Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
 default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
 to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
 most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
 I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  
 Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
 commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
 I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table 
 by table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, 
 etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those 
 single letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is 
 that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on 
 any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this 
 example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation. 
  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So 
 great!  Let's say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I 
 know it's just ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example 
 purpose.  So I start interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it 
 will think that some of those letters should be intercepted as navigation 
 single letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys together, 
 and start interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I 
 go to the top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a 
 macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, 
 at the top of the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I 
 moved focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the 
 screen, now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move 
 me to the next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's 
 doing is to jump me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the 
 next search box on the page, which in this case happens to be the search 
 field, then, at the beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that 
 text box without my will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into 
 the box.  If I then delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away 
 from th

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Andy Collins]

Sarah - No matter  how many  times I click the link, it doesn't work, nor does 
using the item chooser, I've even interacted, brought the mouse pointer to the 
link with vo cmd f5, and done a single and double mouse click using vo shift 
space, but nothing works on those links -

Andy
On 31 Aug 2013, at 21:01, Sarah k Alawami  wrote:

> I have that issue to, but I just keep clicking the link, but when you let's 
> say go from the item chooser  and find the link you *have to* press the thing 
> twice as the first press moves it to the link, the second time clicks the 
> link, or what ever the item might be.
> 
> Tc.
> On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:30 PM, Andy Collins  wrote:
> 
>> All I can say, is that I regularly encounter times when clicking a link on a 
>> webpage produces nothing at all, like you say, it just sits there on the 
>> link. VO says link pressed, but it doesn't activate it! -
>> 
>> Andy
>> On 31 Aug 2013, at 20:11, Chris Gilland  wrote:
>> 
>>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
>>> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>>> 
>>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system 
>>> and use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before 
>>> you say anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know 
>>> about VO+; to lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution 
>>> however, as this will then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as 
>>> Voiceover commands.  Meaning, say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I 
>>> hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  
>>> Real nice!  Not?  I also understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I 
>>> could definitely use trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that I 
>>> probably would bump the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy 
>>> fingers, and probably would exert too much pressure on the thing, thus 
>>> accidentally literally clicking the thing, which of corse could give very 
>>> undesirable results.
>>> 
>>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
>>> Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
>>> default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
>>> to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
>>> most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
>>> I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  
>>> Well, I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under 
>>> commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use single letter navigation so that 
>>> I'd not have to keep holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table by 
>>> table, heading by heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, etc.  
>>> Now, as long as quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those single 
>>> letter keys.  The only problem which is really pissing me off is that let's 
>>> use Google just for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any web site 
>>> I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, 
>>> I have quicknav enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up 
>>> Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's 
>>> say I want to now do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just 
>>> ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start 
>>> interacting with the text box, because if I don't, it will think that some 
>>> of those letters should be intercepted as navigation single letter 
>>> commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys together, and start 
>>> interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the 
>>> top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, 
>>> so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of 
>>> the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away 
>>> by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, now, if I 
>>> simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the next 
>>> heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to jump 
>>> me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on 
>>> the page, which in this case happens to be the search field, then, at the 
>>> beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text box without my 
>>> will, and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then 
>>> delete and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then 
>>> try hitting H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, 
>>> which it is, then I get the same result.  It jumps me back up to that text 
>>> box, interacts, then types the letter H.  This is incredibly buggy in my 
>>> book!  Oh, and as if that's not enough, here's an

Item chooser and web pages [was Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav]

[Esther]

Hi All,

Just wanted to expand on Sarah's point about using item chooser menu on web 
pages: when you navigate with item chooser or links chooser menu on a web page, 
using VO-Space or pressing moves you to that location -- it does not activate a 
link.  You might want to perform a selection that forces a file download (e.g. 
Option+Return (or "Enter" for those used to Windows)), or you might want to 
choose a particular option from the context menu (VO-Shift-M or Control+Click 
on the link), such as "Download as", etc., instead of just activating the link. 
 So if you need to activate a link, you issue a VO-Space or use your Trackpad 
to perform an action twice -- first to move to the location and next to 
activate the link.  This is a feature and not a bug.

And remember, that on both the Mac and on iOS devices, you want to turn 
QuickNav off before you type in text fields (for search, as Sarah also 
mentioned in her previous post.)

Cheers,

Esther

On Aug 31, 2013, at 10:01 AM, Sarah k Alawami wrote:

> I have that issue to, but I just keep clicking the link, but when you let's 
> say go from the item chooser  and find the link you *have to* press the thing 
> twice as the first press moves it to the link, the second time clicks the 
> link, or what ever the item might be.
> 
> Tc.

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Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Sarah k Alawami]

I have that issue to, but I just keep clicking the link, but when you let's say 
go from the item chooser  and find the link you *have to* press the thing twice 
as the first press moves it to the link, the second time clicks the link, or 
what ever the item might be.

Tc.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:30 PM, Andy Collins  wrote:

> All I can say, is that I regularly encounter times when clicking a link on a 
> webpage produces nothing at all, like you say, it just sits there on the 
> link. VO says link pressed, but it doesn't activate it! -
> 
> Andy
> On 31 Aug 2013, at 20:11, Chris Gilland  wrote:
> 
>> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
>> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
>> 
>> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
>> use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
>> anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
>> lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
>> then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, 
>> say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've 
>> just disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also 
>> understand that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use 
>> trackpad commander, but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump 
>> the thing almost constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably 
>> would exert too much pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally 
>> clicking the thing, which of corse could give very undesirable results.
>> 
>> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I 
>> opened up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have 
>> Safari set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by 
>> default on the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set 
>> to the google search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in 
>> most cases exactly what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, 
>> I'm in the text box, and just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, 
>> I have also gone into the Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I 
>> set it up to use single letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep 
>> holding down my vo+command keys while jumping table by table, heading by 
>> heading, anker by anker, block text by block text, etc.  Now, as long as 
>> quicknav is enabled within Safari, I can use those single letter keys.  The 
>> only problem which is really pissing me off is that let's use Google just 
>> for example.  Now, this happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for 
>> simplisity sake, I'm gonna use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav 
>> enabled as well as single letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm 
>> popped immediately into the search box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now 
>> do a search for say… ACB Radio.  Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but 
>> again, this is simply for example purpose.  So I start interacting with the 
>> text box, because if I don't, it will think that some of those letters 
>> should be intercepted as navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my 
>> down and right arrow keys together, and start interacting.  I then type in 
>> ACBRadio, and hit return.  Now, I go to the top of the web site with 
>> fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on a macbook Pro, so I don't have a 
>> physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, at the top of the page, not even 
>> focused anymore in the text box, as I moved focus away by doing the 
>> fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, now, if I simply hit the 
>> letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the next heading on the 
>> page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to jump me back to the 
>> search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on the page, which in 
>> this case happens to be the search field, then, at the beginning of the box, 
>> it's interacting me with that text box without my will, and it's literally 
>> insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then delete and backspace it 
>> out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then try hitting H again, first 
>> being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, which it is, then I get the 
>> same result.  It jumps me back up to that text box, interacts, then types 
>> the letter H.  This is incredibly buggy in my book!  Oh, and as if that's 
>> not enough, here's another weird thing.  With Quick nav on, and single 
>> letter nav on, if I type in my search query, then don't even vo+right arrow 
>> to the google search button, but instead just hit return, like I normally 
>> did with quick nav not enabled, it doesn't do a bloody thing!  It just kind 
>> a sits there, and thinks about life.  It doesn't go busy busy busy or 
>> anything of sort, thank God.  Don't give it any ideas

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Sarah k Alawami]

It won't. not unless qn is off. Remember vo plus enter starts selecting stuff 
so that is I think a feature. Also, just turn an off and type in tot eh field, 
hit enter and turn qn on. Easy fix there and this is how I get around web pages 
like google.

Take care and try turning qn off before typing in the search field. I don't 
think qun is meant to be used all the time. At least I have not found it used 
all the  time.

Good luck.
On Aug 31, 2013, at 12:11 PM, Chris Gilland  wrote:

> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
> 
> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
> use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
> anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
> lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
> then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, 
> say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just 
> disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand 
> that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, 
> but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
> constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert too 
> much pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, 
> which of corse could give very undesirable results.
> 
> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I opened 
> up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have Safari 
> set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by default on 
> the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set to the google 
> search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in most cases exactly 
> what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, 
> and just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into 
> the Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use 
> single letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my 
> vo+command keys while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by 
> anker, block text by block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled 
> within Safari, I can use those single letter keys.  The only problem which is 
> really pissing me off is that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this 
> happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna 
> use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single 
> letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the 
> search box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now do a search for say… ACB 
> Radio.  Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for 
> example purpose.  So I start interacting with the text box, because if I 
> don't, it will think that some of those letters should be intercepted as 
> navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys 
> together, and start interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  
> Now, I go to the top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on 
> a macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, 
> at the top of the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I moved 
> focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, 
> now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the 
> next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to 
> jump me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on 
> the page, which in this case happens to be the search field, then, at the 
> beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text box without my will, 
> and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then delete 
> and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then try hitting 
> H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, which it is, then 
> I get the same result.  It jumps me back up to that text box, interacts, then 
> types the letter H.  This is incredibly buggy in my book!  Oh, and as if 
> that's not enough, here's another weird thing.  With Quick nav on, and single 
> letter nav on, if I type in my search query, then don't even vo+right arrow 
> to the google search button, but instead just hit return, like I normally did 
> with quick nav not enabled, it doesn't do a bloody thing!  It just kind a 
> sits there, and thinks about life.  It doesn't go busy busy busy or anything 
> of sort, thank God.  Don't give it any ideas, LOL!  but it doesn't proceed to 
> the next page with my results.  It's almost like it's not even clicking the 
> search button at all, whenever I hit the return key.
> 
> Ver

Re: Incredibly annoying, not to mention extremely buggy problem with Quicknav

[Andy Collins]

All I can say, is that I regularly encounter times when clicking a link on a 
webpage produces nothing at all, like you say, it just sits there on the link. 
VO says link pressed, but it doesn't activate it! -

Andy
On 31 Aug 2013, at 20:11, Chris Gilland  wrote:

> OK, so normally, I don't know why, but I haven't really been a huge fan of 
> Quicknav, but now, I'm really! not a fan.
> 
> My ultimate goal was to turn on Quick nav globally throughout the system and 
> use it instead of having to constantly hold my VO keys down.  Before you say 
> anything, I'm a Voiceover trainer, so yes, I obviously do know about VO+; to 
> lock my keys.  This isn't always a valuable sollution however, as this will 
> then intercept regular alpha-numeric keys as Voiceover commands.  Meaning, 
> say I wanted to type a capital letter K.  I hit shift+K, and Boom.  I've just 
> disabled/enabled my keyboard commander.  Real nice!  Not?  I also understand 
> that being I've got a macbook Pro, I could definitely use trackpad commander, 
> but my hands are big enough that I probably would bump the thing almost 
> constantly.  Plus, I have very heavy fingers, and probably would exert too 
> much pressure on the thing, thus accidentally literally clicking the thing, 
> which of corse could give very undesirable results.
> 
> I actually was having a fairly decent experience with Quicknav until I opened 
> up Safari.  What a disaster!  First thing that I noticed was I have Safari 
> set automatically to take me into Google upon launch.  Well, by default on 
> the Google web site, unless you change it, the Sweetspot is set to the google 
> search text box.  That's perfectly OK.  That's normally in most cases exactly 
> what I'd want.  This way, I pop open Safari, and boom, I'm in the text box, 
> and just start typing my query, then hit return.  Well, I have also gone into 
> the Voiceover utility and under commanders/quicknav, I set it up to use 
> single letter navigation so that I'd not have to keep holding down my 
> vo+command keys while jumping table by table, heading by heading, anker by 
> anker, block text by block text, etc.  Now, as long as quicknav is enabled 
> within Safari, I can use those single letter keys.  The only problem which is 
> really pissing me off is that let's use Google just for example.  Now, this 
> happens pretty much on any web site I use, but for simplisity sake, I'm gonna 
> use Google for this example.  So, I have quicknav enabled as well as single 
> letter navigation.  I fire up Safari, and I'm popped immediately into the 
> search box.  So great!  Let's say I want to now do a search for say… ACB 
> Radio.  Again, I know it's just ACBRadio.org, but again, this is simply for 
> example purpose.  So I start interacting with the text box, because if I 
> don't, it will think that some of those letters should be intercepted as 
> navigation single letter commands.  So I hit my down and right arrow keys 
> together, and start interacting.  I then type in ACBRadio, and hit return.  
> Now, I go to the top of the web site with fn+VO+left arrow.  Remember, I'm on 
> a macbook Pro, so I don't have a physical hom/end key, nor a num pad.  Now, 
> at the top of the page, not even focused anymore in the text box, as I moved 
> focus away by doing the fn+vo+left arrow to jump to the top of the screen, 
> now, if I simply hit the letter H, you'd think, that it would move me to the 
> next heading on the page, right?  Wrong, actually.  What it's doing is to 
> jump me back to the search box, I presume it's finding the next search box on 
> the page, which in this case happens to be the search field, then, at the 
> beginning of the box, it's interacting me with that text box without my will, 
> and it's literally insertting that letter H into the box.  If I then delete 
> and backspace it out, then vo+right arrow away from the box, then try hitting 
> H again, first being sure that quick nav is indeed enabled, which it is, then 
> I get the same result.  It jumps me back up to that text box, interacts, then 
> types the letter H.  This is incredibly buggy in my book!  Oh, and as if 
> that's not enough, here's another weird thing.  With Quick nav on, and single 
> letter nav on, if I type in my search query, then don't even vo+right arrow 
> to the google search button, but instead just hit return, like I normally did 
> with quick nav not enabled, it doesn't do a bloody thing!  It just kind a 
> sits there, and thinks about life.  It doesn't go busy busy busy or anything 
> of sort, thank God.  Don't give it any ideas, LOL!  but it doesn't proceed to 
> the next page with my results.  It's almost like it's not even clicking the 
> search button at all, whenever I hit the return key.
> 
> Very very very buggy in my view.  I'm wonderring if anyone else on here's had 
> or is having, for that mind, this issue, or moreover, is there maybe 
> something that I'm missing?  I'm definitely unaware of anything, but who 
>