Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Anne Robertson]

I’m afraid I don’t understand what you mean.

You have to turn the trackpad commander off to be able to use the trackpad the 
way a sighted person would use it. This is necessary for you to be able to drag 
the horizontal splitter to the bottom of the window. Using VO to drag the 
splitter down results in Mail being busy and does not work.

If you follow my original instructions carefully, it should work.

Just in case your trackpad settings in System preferences could be causing 
trouble, here are the ones I have.
• Point&Click: Tap to click unchecked checkbox, Secondary click unchecked 
checkbox, Look up unchecked checkbox, Three finger drag unchecked checkbox, 
Tracking speed 33.3%.
• Scroll & Zoom: Scroll direction: natural checked checkbox, Zoom in or out 
checked checkbox, Smart zoom unchecked checkbox, Rotate checked checkbox.
• More Gestures: Swipe between pages unchecked checkbox, Swipe between 
full-screen apps unchecked checkbox, Notification Center unchecked checkbox, 
Mission Control unchecked checkbox, App Exposé unchecked checkbox, Launchpad 
unchecked checkbox, Show Desktop unchecked checkbox.

Cheers,

Anne


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 06:54, Dionipher Presas Herrera  wrote:
> 
> do i have to turn the mouse track pad on? and   n i can just rout my keyboard 
> to decrease it?

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Re: Downloading Adobe Flash

[Hayri Tulumcu]

http://fpdownload.macromedia.com/get/flashplayer/current/licensing/mac/install_flash_player_16_osx_pkg.dmg
- Original Message - 
From: "Eileen Misrahi" 

To: 
Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 8:37 PM
Subject: Downloading Adobe Flash



Hello All,

This is a related question to Adobe flash player. And the automatic 
update. I have an education that requires Adobe Flash. Is this obtained 
from the app store or do you go to the web page for Adobe to download it? 
Thanks for your advise in advance.


Best,
Eileen

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Anne Robertson]

Hello Jamie,

In Pages, there’s no need to select the paragraph whose style you wish to 
change, you just need to have the text pointer somewhere in it.
To change the paragraph style:
• Jump to the Formatter.
• Press VO-Space on the Paragraph styles button.
• Navigate right to the Paragraph styles table.
• Interact and find the style you want.
• Bring the mouse (VO-Cmd-F5).
• Press VO-Shift-Space.
• Press Escape to close the popover.
• Interact with the Paragraph styles button and navigate right to check that 
the new style has been applied.

To remove a style:
• Navigate to the unwanted style in the Paragraph styles table.
• Bring the mouse.
• Interact.
• Press VO-Cmd-j.
• Navigate right to the Menu button and click it.
• Select Delete Style … and press Return.

Cheers,

Anne
 


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 05:23, Jamie Pauls  wrote:
> 
> Hello, all:
> 
> I have been trying to apply paragraph styles in the latest version of Pages. 
> I select the paragraph I want to work with, move to the format area with 
> VO-J, and interact with paragraph styles. I see the style I want to apply. 
> We’ll use heading level 2 as an example. No matter how I interact with and 
> try to select the heading level 2 radio button, I can’t seem to get it to 
> stick reliably. I have gotten it to work a couple times, but I honestly have 
> no idea why. In the process of fiddling around, I’ve managed to create about 
> three new body styles which I am unable to get rid of. To add insult to 
> injury, I was unable to get the demo of Nisus Writer Pro to load on my 
> Macbook. I wasn’t sure I wanted to pay $79 for the app anyway, but I was 
> going to give it a whirl. Before anyone suggests that I just take the easy 
> way out and use Text Edit, there doesn’t seem to be a way to apply actual 
> heading levels in Text Edit. Centering appears to be the closest I can get.
> 
> Any and all help would be appreciated. 
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Take care and have a great day.
> Jamie Pauls
> jamiepa...@gmail.com 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Basic rules for interacting

[Piotr Machacz]

You can interact with anything that's likely to contain other items. IE 
a tool bar will have buttons in it, a table has various items, scroll 
areas are parts of the screen that have a lot of controls, html, etc. 
Sometimes, it's not obvious that you can interact with something to get 
even more items (like the styles in pages), but most of the time it's 
obvious. You can always turn on VoiceOver control hints, and it will 
tell you when something can be interacted with

On 2/8/2015 7:47 AM, Pamela Francis wrote:

Hi folks,
I know this is an elementary question, I should know it, however there are 
times I screw it up. A friend was working with me to help me make rules for a 
mailbox. There are times I know when to interact and when not to. Is there a 
basic rule of thumb one can follow in order to know when to do this and when 
not to?
Thanks much

Pam Francis



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RE: Making a Popup Menu in excell

[george b]

Do you mean numbers or are you using excel with a mac?

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Deb Lewis
Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 20:57
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Making a Popup Menu in excell

I need to put a popup menu in a spreadsheet I’m making. I found a YouTube on 
this but it could have used a bit of description, lOL. so I know you go to the 
Inspector, and choose the option for cell. But then I got a little lost in the 
maze there. How do you create the popup, and how do you return to the 
spreadsheet. I did manage to do it once but I stumbled around so much that I 
can’t repeat the action. Any help will be appreciated. Thanks!!

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Re: Basic rules for interacting

[Alex Hall]

Normally you can interact with containers. Scroll areas, tables, toolbars, 
groups, HTML contents, and probably a few others I'm forgetting. Note that to 
review the contents of some of these items, interacting is not always required 
(particularly true of tables). You can also interact with just about anything 
including button names, checkboxes, text labels, and so on if you need to 
examine how text in those items is spelled.
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 1:47 AM, Pamela Francis  wrote:
> 
> Hi folks,
> I know this is an elementary question, I should know it, however there are 
> times I screw it up. A friend was working with me to help me make rules for a 
> mailbox. There are times I know when to interact and when not to. Is there a 
> basic rule of thumb one can follow in order to know when to do this and when 
> not to?
> Thanks much
> 
> Pam Francis
> 
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--
Have a great day,
Alex Hall
mehg...@icloud.com

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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Jamie Pauls]

Hi, Anne,
Thank you so much for the response. After playing around a bit more last night, 
I figured out how to apply the styles. I did not figure out how to delete them. 
Your instructions will help. As a sidenote, when I created a new document, the 
new styles I had added were not present. The adding of new styles, at least in 
my case, appears to be document specific. Again, thanks for the help.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 4:08 AM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> Hello Jamie,
> 
> In Pages, there’s no need to select the paragraph whose style you wish to 
> change, you just need to have the text pointer somewhere in it.
> To change the paragraph style:
> • Jump to the Formatter.
> • Press VO-Space on the Paragraph styles button.
> • Navigate right to the Paragraph styles table.
> • Interact and find the style you want.
> • Bring the mouse (VO-Cmd-F5).
> • Press VO-Shift-Space.
> • Press Escape to close the popover.
> • Interact with the Paragraph styles button and navigate right to check that 
> the new style has been applied.
> 
> To remove a style:
> • Navigate to the unwanted style in the Paragraph styles table.
> • Bring the mouse.
> • Interact.
> • Press VO-Cmd-j.
> • Navigate right to the Menu button and click it.
> • Select Delete Style … and press Return.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
>  
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 05:23, Jamie Pauls  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello, all:
>> 
>> I have been trying to apply paragraph styles in the latest version of Pages. 
>> I select the paragraph I want to work with, move to the format area with 
>> VO-J, and interact with paragraph styles. I see the style I want to apply. 
>> We’ll use heading level 2 as an example. No matter how I interact with and 
>> try to select the heading level 2 radio button, I can’t seem to get it to 
>> stick reliably. I have gotten it to work a couple times, but I honestly have 
>> no idea why. In the process of fiddling around, I’ve managed to create about 
>> three new body styles which I am unable to get rid of. To add insult to 
>> injury, I was unable to get the demo of Nisus Writer Pro to load on my 
>> Macbook. I wasn’t sure I wanted to pay $79 for the app anyway, but I was 
>> going to give it a whirl. Before anyone suggests that I just take the easy 
>> way out and use Text Edit, there doesn’t seem to be a way to apply actual 
>> heading levels in Text Edit. Centering appears to be the closest I can get.
>> 
>> Any and all help would be appreciated. 
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Take care and have a great day.
>> Jamie Pauls
>> jamiepa...@gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
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>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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> 
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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Dionipher Presas Herrera]

what i mean is that i can i just interact with the plitter by pressing VO shift 
down arrow. then pressing to the right arrow.
On 08 Feb 2015, at 10:01 am, Anne Robertson  wrote:

> I’m afraid I don’t understand what you mean.
> 
> You have to turn the trackpad commander off to be able to use the trackpad 
> the way a sighted person would use it. This is necessary for you to be able 
> to drag the horizontal splitter to the bottom of the window. Using VO to drag 
> the splitter down results in Mail being busy and does not work.
> 
> If you follow my original instructions carefully, it should work.
> 
> Just in case your trackpad settings in System preferences could be causing 
> trouble, here are the ones I have.
> • Point&Click: Tap to click unchecked checkbox, Secondary click unchecked 
> checkbox, Look up unchecked checkbox, Three finger drag unchecked checkbox, 
> Tracking speed 33.3%.
> • Scroll & Zoom: Scroll direction: natural checked checkbox, Zoom in or out 
> checked checkbox, Smart zoom unchecked checkbox, Rotate checked checkbox.
> • More Gestures: Swipe between pages unchecked checkbox, Swipe between 
> full-screen apps unchecked checkbox, Notification Center unchecked checkbox, 
> Mission Control unchecked checkbox, App Exposé unchecked checkbox, Launchpad 
> unchecked checkbox, Show Desktop unchecked checkbox.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 06:54, Dionipher Presas Herrera  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> do i have to turn the mouse track pad on? and   n i can just rout my 
>> keyboard to decrease it?
> 
> 
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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Dionipher Herrera]

i already did it what you did tell but i don’t know if i did it. One strange 
thing on mail on yosemite is that the messages is on the left, while on 
mavericks is on the right. is this the preview pain of the mail?
> On 08 Feb 2015, at 10:01, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> I’m afraid I don’t understand what you mean.
> 
> You have to turn the trackpad commander off to be able to use the trackpad 
> the way a sighted person would use it. This is necessary for you to be able 
> to drag the horizontal splitter to the bottom of the window. Using VO to drag 
> the splitter down results in Mail being busy and does not work.
> 
> If you follow my original instructions carefully, it should work.
> 
> Just in case your trackpad settings in System preferences could be causing 
> trouble, here are the ones I have.
> • Point&Click: Tap to click unchecked checkbox, Secondary click unchecked 
> checkbox, Look up unchecked checkbox, Three finger drag unchecked checkbox, 
> Tracking speed 33.3%.
> • Scroll & Zoom: Scroll direction: natural checked checkbox, Zoom in or out 
> checked checkbox, Smart zoom unchecked checkbox, Rotate checked checkbox.
> • More Gestures: Swipe between pages unchecked checkbox, Swipe between 
> full-screen apps unchecked checkbox, Notification Center unchecked checkbox, 
> Mission Control unchecked checkbox, App Exposé unchecked checkbox, Launchpad 
> unchecked checkbox, Show Desktop unchecked checkbox.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 06:54, Dionipher Presas Herrera > > wrote:
>> 
>> do i have to turn the mouse track pad on? and   n i can just rout my 
>> keyboard to decrease it?
> 
> 
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> .
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> .
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Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell

[Phil Halton]

position in the cell where you want  the popup. then go to inspector with the 
VO+J command and select the cell radio button.
Now, VO right to the scroll area and interact. there will be a data type popup 
field right at the top. press enter or vo space on it and arrow down to popup 
and press enter.
You can populate that field by adding items to a table there I think (I’m 
working from memory). 

When you’re don, stop interacting with the scroll area and return to the 
spreadsheet with the jump command VO+J.
Also, if you select a range of cells that have data and then do the above, the 
entire range will be set as  popups and the popup table will be populated with 
the data in the selected range.

> On Feb 7, 2015, at 11:57 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
> I need to put a popup menu in a spreadsheet I’m making. I found a YouTube on 
> this but it could have used a bit of description, lOL. so I know you go to 
> the Inspector, and choose the option for cell. But then I got a little lost 
> in the maze there. How do you create the popup, and how do you return to the 
> spreadsheet. I did manage to do it once but I stumbled around so much that I 
> can’t repeat the action. Any help will be appreciated. Thanks!!
> 
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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Anne Robertson]

Trying to drag the splitter using VO results in Mail being busy and doesn’t 
work.

Cheers,

Anne


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 15:03, Dionipher Presas Herrera  wrote:
> 
> what i mean is that i can i just interact with the plitter by pressing VO 
> shift down arrow. then pressing to the right arrow.

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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Anne Robertson]

In classic view and without the preview pane, mail boxes are on the left and 
messages on the right. In the new layout, mail boxes are on the left, messages 
in the middle and the message preview on the right.

Cheers,

Anne


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 15:33, Dionipher Herrera  wrote:
> 
> i already did it what you did tell but i don’t know if i did it. One strange 
> thing on mail on yosemite is that the messages is on the left, while on 
> mavericks is on the right. is this the preview pain of the mail?

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RE: Entering a long number

[wayne17a]

Hello could you not copy and paste the number from somewhere 


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Angus MacKinnon
Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 9:56 PM
To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries
Subject: Entering a long number

I launch Skype from the doc. I then do a cmd + 2 to dial a number. Itype 
18662223456 to call my bank. I am greeded wit the message to enter my16 digit 
account number. I get 12 digits entered and then returned to the greeting 
message. Any ideas how to enter my 16 digit account number before the time out 
happens? Thank you.

Angus MacKinnon

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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Anne Robertson]

Hello Jamie,

Styles, hotspots and short cuts are all properties of the specific document, 
other than the standard set of styles.

If you create a template with its own styles and short cuts, they will always 
be present in that document.

Cheers,

Anne


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 15:02, Jamie Pauls  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Anne,
> Thank you so much for the response. After playing around a bit more last 
> night, I figured out how to apply the styles. I did not figure out how to 
> delete them. Your instructions will help. As a sidenote, when I created a new 
> document, the new styles I had added were not present. The adding of new 
> styles, at least in my case, appears to be document specific. Again, thanks 
> for the help.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 4:08 AM, Anne Robertson  > wrote:
> 
>> Hello Jamie,
>> 
>> In Pages, there’s no need to select the paragraph whose style you wish to 
>> change, you just need to have the text pointer somewhere in it.
>> To change the paragraph style:
>> • Jump to the Formatter.
>> • Press VO-Space on the Paragraph styles button.
>> • Navigate right to the Paragraph styles table.
>> • Interact and find the style you want.
>> • Bring the mouse (VO-Cmd-F5).
>> • Press VO-Shift-Space.
>> • Press Escape to close the popover.
>> • Interact with the Paragraph styles button and navigate right to check that 
>> the new style has been applied.
>> 
>> To remove a style:
>> • Navigate to the unwanted style in the Paragraph styles table.
>> • Bring the mouse.
>> • Interact.
>> • Press VO-Cmd-j.
>> • Navigate right to the Menu button and click it.
>> • Select Delete Style … and press Return.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> Anne
>>  
>> 
>> 
>>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 05:23, Jamie Pauls >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello, all:
>>> 
>>> I have been trying to apply paragraph styles in the latest version of 
>>> Pages. I select the paragraph I want to work with, move to the format area 
>>> with VO-J, and interact with paragraph styles. I see the style I want to 
>>> apply. We’ll use heading level 2 as an example. No matter how I interact 
>>> with and try to select the heading level 2 radio button, I can’t seem to 
>>> get it to stick reliably. I have gotten it to work a couple times, but I 
>>> honestly have no idea why. In the process of fiddling around, I’ve managed 
>>> to create about three new body styles which I am unable to get rid of. To 
>>> add insult to injury, I was unable to get the demo of Nisus Writer Pro to 
>>> load on my Macbook. I wasn’t sure I wanted to pay $79 for the app anyway, 
>>> but I was going to give it a whirl. Before anyone suggests that I just take 
>>> the easy way out and use Text Edit, there doesn’t seem to be a way to apply 
>>> actual heading levels in Text Edit. Centering appears to be the closest I 
>>> can get.
>>> 
>>> Any and all help would be appreciated. 
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> 
>>> Take care and have a great day.
>>> Jamie Pauls
>>> jamiepa...@gmail.com 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Basic rules for interacting

[Gerard Doody]

Hi all, there is also no problem with trying to interact as you will find out 
quickly if you can't 
Jerry 
On Feb 8, 2015, at 5:23 am, Piotr Machacz  wrote:

You can interact with anything that's likely to contain other items. IE a tool 
bar will have buttons in it, a table has various items, scroll areas are parts 
of the screen that have a lot of controls, html, etc. Sometimes, it's not 
obvious that you can interact with something to get even more items (like the 
styles in pages), but most of the time it's obvious. You can always turn on 
VoiceOver control hints, and it will tell you when something can be interacted 
with
On 2/8/2015 7:47 AM, Pamela Francis wrote:
> Hi folks,
> I know this is an elementary question, I should know it, however there are 
> times I screw it up. A friend was working with me to help me make rules for a 
> mailbox. There are times I know when to interact and when not to. Is there a 
> basic rule of thumb one can follow in order to know when to do this and when 
> not to?
> Thanks much
> 
> Pam Francis
> 

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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Phil Halton]

Wow, now we can access the menu of a style without all those gymnastics we used 
to have to do. One thing I noticed, I don’t need to bring the mouse to access 
the menu. I just interact with the style, use the VO Command J command (that’s 
a new one on me), VO right and press vo space on the menu button.
So much easier! Now if Apple will only fix the selection over page boundaries 
bug, and refrain from breaking things in future updates.

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 5:08 AM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> Hello Jamie,
> 
> In Pages, there’s no need to select the paragraph whose style you wish to 
> change, you just need to have the text pointer somewhere in it.
> To change the paragraph style:
> • Jump to the Formatter.
> • Press VO-Space on the Paragraph styles button.
> • Navigate right to the Paragraph styles table.
> • Interact and find the style you want.
> • Bring the mouse (VO-Cmd-F5).
> • Press VO-Shift-Space.
> • Press Escape to close the popover.
> • Interact with the Paragraph styles button and navigate right to check that 
> the new style has been applied.
> 
> To remove a style:
> • Navigate to the unwanted style in the Paragraph styles table.
> • Bring the mouse.
> • Interact.
> • Press VO-Cmd-j.
> • Navigate right to the Menu button and click it.
> • Select Delete Style … and press Return.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
>  
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 05:23, Jamie Pauls > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hello, all:
>> 
>> I have been trying to apply paragraph styles in the latest version of Pages. 
>> I select the paragraph I want to work with, move to the format area with 
>> VO-J, and interact with paragraph styles. I see the style I want to apply. 
>> We’ll use heading level 2 as an example. No matter how I interact with and 
>> try to select the heading level 2 radio button, I can’t seem to get it to 
>> stick reliably. I have gotten it to work a couple times, but I honestly have 
>> no idea why. In the process of fiddling around, I’ve managed to create about 
>> three new body styles which I am unable to get rid of. To add insult to 
>> injury, I was unable to get the demo of Nisus Writer Pro to load on my 
>> Macbook. I wasn’t sure I wanted to pay $79 for the app anyway, but I was 
>> going to give it a whirl. Before anyone suggests that I just take the easy 
>> way out and use Text Edit, there doesn’t seem to be a way to apply actual 
>> heading levels in Text Edit. Centering appears to be the closest I can get.
>> 
>> Any and all help would be appreciated. 
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Take care and have a great day.
>> Jamie Pauls
>> jamiepa...@gmail.com 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Alex Hall]

So, the best way to save your styles is to make a template, correct? Make your 
styles in a blank document, set up hotkeys if you want, than save it as "my 
commonly used styles template" or something similar. Too bad there's no way to 
add to globally available styles, since the above method then makes your styles 
unavailable if you use any other templates in Pages.
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 11:00 AM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> Hello Jamie,
> 
> Styles, hotspots and short cuts are all properties of the specific document, 
> other than the standard set of styles.
> 
> If you create a template with its own styles and short cuts, they will always 
> be present in that document.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 15:02, Jamie Pauls > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Anne,
>> Thank you so much for the response. After playing around a bit more last 
>> night, I figured out how to apply the styles. I did not figure out how to 
>> delete them. Your instructions will help. As a sidenote, when I created a 
>> new document, the new styles I had added were not present. The adding of new 
>> styles, at least in my case, appears to be document specific. Again, thanks 
>> for the help.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 4:08 AM, Anne Robertson > > wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello Jamie,
>>> 
>>> In Pages, there’s no need to select the paragraph whose style you wish to 
>>> change, you just need to have the text pointer somewhere in it.
>>> To change the paragraph style:
>>> • Jump to the Formatter.
>>> • Press VO-Space on the Paragraph styles button.
>>> • Navigate right to the Paragraph styles table.
>>> • Interact and find the style you want.
>>> • Bring the mouse (VO-Cmd-F5).
>>> • Press VO-Shift-Space.
>>> • Press Escape to close the popover.
>>> • Interact with the Paragraph styles button and navigate right to check 
>>> that the new style has been applied.
>>> 
>>> To remove a style:
>>> • Navigate to the unwanted style in the Paragraph styles table.
>>> • Bring the mouse.
>>> • Interact.
>>> • Press VO-Cmd-j.
>>> • Navigate right to the Menu button and click it.
>>> • Select Delete Style … and press Return.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Anne
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
 On 8 Feb 2015, at 05:23, Jamie Pauls >>> > wrote:
 
 Hello, all:
 
 I have been trying to apply paragraph styles in the latest version of 
 Pages. I select the paragraph I want to work with, move to the format area 
 with VO-J, and interact with paragraph styles. I see the style I want to 
 apply. We’ll use heading level 2 as an example. No matter how I interact 
 with and try to select the heading level 2 radio button, I can’t seem to 
 get it to stick reliably. I have gotten it to work a couple times, but I 
 honestly have no idea why. In the process of fiddling around, I’ve managed 
 to create about three new body styles which I am unable to get rid of. To 
 add insult to injury, I was unable to get the demo of Nisus Writer Pro to 
 load on my Macbook. I wasn’t sure I wanted to pay $79 for the app anyway, 
 but I was going to give it a whirl. Before anyone suggests that I just 
 take the easy way out and use Text Edit, there doesn’t seem to be a way to 
 apply actual heading levels in Text Edit. Centering appears to be the 
 closest I can get.
 
 Any and all help would be appreciated. 
 
 Thanks.
 
 Take care and have a great day.
 Jamie Pauls
 jamiepa...@gmail.com 
 
 
 
 
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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Sabahattin Gucukoglu]

Hi all, and sorry I’m late.

If you have a keyboard with a numpad, a very leet way to turn off the preview 
pane in the classic layout is to turn on and use Mouse Keys, from System 
Preferences > Accessibility.  Route the VO cursor to the horizontal splitter, 
then press and hold the numpad 5 key, and while it is held, press and hold the 
numpad 2 key to drag straight down.  This always works reliably, because the 
computer always goes in straight lines.

This technique can also be very useful for other scenarios where the VoiceOver 
cursor doesn’t (but should, dammit!) work.  It was a favourite strategy of mine 
before Apple gave us a means to move to the table header row, for instance, and 
also when Dropbox was rendered inaccessible in earlier versions by the 
constraints on the accessibility of menu extras in the past.

You can’t use Numpad Commander while you’re playing this trick, for obvious 
reasons.  Strange things will happen if you try.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Entering a long number

[Angus MacKinnon]

Jonathan

Thank you. The problem turned out to be, I was inputing the wrong number. I 
sure wish i could get the Numpad of this Microsoft Natural Ergonomic 4000 
version 1.1 working with OS 10.9.5 and above.

Angus MacKinnon

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Re: Entering a long number

[Angus MacKinnon]

Wayne17A

I have tried the cut and paste method. All that happens is that my pasted 
number is combined with the number i called and the call is put on hold. I just 
tried with a corrected number and it worked. I sure wish I could get the Numpad 
of this Microsoft Natural Ergonomic 4000 Version 1.1 working with OS 10.9.5 and 
above.

Angus MacKinnon

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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Gabriele Battaglia]

> Hi Sabahattin
You gave also a terminal command to disable that panel, Am I right?
Thanks so much to reposting it.
Gabriel.

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Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell

[Deb Lewis]

It was thenotion of using VO-J that I was totally missing. I actually
had gotten it all done without doing that, but it's so much more
elegant with the VO-J. Because I don't use that command very often, I
often don't realize where to apply it. And yeah, sorry for my
subjectnot beig too clear. I ws tired. It's an Excell sheet that I've
brought into Number. The popups did't export so I was making htem
back. I really wish there was better conversion between Mac and
Windows programs--it's the only thing that keeps mein windows.

On 2/8/15, Phil Halton  wrote:
> position in the cell where you want  the popup. then go to inspector with
> the VO+J command and select the cell radio button.
> Now, VO right to the scroll area and interact. there will be a data type
> popup field right at the top. press enter or vo space on it and arrow down
> to popup and press enter.
> You can populate that field by adding items to a table there I think (I'm
> working from memory).
>
> When you're don, stop interacting with the scroll area and return to the
> spreadsheet with the jump command VO+J.
> Also, if you select a range of cells that have data and then do the above,
> the entire range will be set as  popups and the popup table will be
> populated with the data in the selected range.
>
>> On Feb 7, 2015, at 11:57 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>
>> I need to put a popup menu in a spreadsheet I'm making. I found a YouTube
>> on this but it could have used a bit of description, lOL. so I know you go
>> to the Inspector, and choose the option for cell. But then I got a little
>> lost in the maze there. How do you create the popup, and how do you return
>> to the spreadsheet. I did manage to do it once but I stumbled around so
>> much that I can't repeat the action. Any help will be appreciated.
>> Thanks!!
>>
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RE: Making a Popup Menu in excell

[george b]

Well Deb,

I asked because I have Microsoft office on my mac and v o can not read any 
entries in a cell and I thought you might of found a work around.

Just a tip for you I run v m fusion 7.2 on my mac and windows and it works 
great and takes up only 40 gigs of space on my hard drive.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Deb Lewis
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2015 10:59
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell

It was thenotion of using VO-J that I was totally missing. I actually
had gotten it all done without doing that, but it's so much more
elegant with the VO-J. Because I don't use that command very often, I
often don't realize where to apply it. And yeah, sorry for my
subjectnot beig too clear. I ws tired. It's an Excell sheet that I've
brought into Number. The popups did't export so I was making htem
back. I really wish there was better conversion between Mac and
Windows programs--it's the only thing that keeps mein windows.

On 2/8/15, Phil Halton  wrote:
> position in the cell where you want  the popup. then go to inspector with
> the VO+J command and select the cell radio button.
> Now, VO right to the scroll area and interact. there will be a data type
> popup field right at the top. press enter or vo space on it and arrow down
> to popup and press enter.
> You can populate that field by adding items to a table there I think (I'm
> working from memory).
>
> When you're don, stop interacting with the scroll area and return to the
> spreadsheet with the jump command VO+J.
> Also, if you select a range of cells that have data and then do the above,
> the entire range will be set as  popups and the popup table will be
> populated with the data in the selected range.
>
>> On Feb 7, 2015, at 11:57 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>
>> I need to put a popup menu in a spreadsheet I'm making. I found a YouTube
>> on this but it could have used a bit of description, lOL. so I know you go
>> to the Inspector, and choose the option for cell. But then I got a little
>> lost in the maze there. How do you create the popup, and how do you return
>> to the spreadsheet. I did manage to do it once but I stumbled around so
>> much that I can't repeat the action. Any help will be appreciated.
>> Thanks!!
>>
>> --
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>
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Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell

[Deb Lewis]

I have VMware Fusion but honestly I really hate it. I've tried to do
the keymapping and it kind of works, but really it's a very clutsy
solution except to go in and do a quick and dirty Windows thing. So
right now I'm stuck with a Windows PC and a Mac.

On 2/8/15, george b  wrote:
> Well Deb,
>
> I asked because I have Microsoft office on my mac and v o can not read any
> entries in a cell and I thought you might of found a work around.
>
> Just a tip for you I run v m fusion 7.2 on my mac and windows and it works
> great and takes up only 40 gigs of space on my hard drive.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Deb Lewis
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2015 10:59
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell
>
> It was thenotion of using VO-J that I was totally missing. I actually
> had gotten it all done without doing that, but it's so much more
> elegant with the VO-J. Because I don't use that command very often, I
> often don't realize where to apply it. And yeah, sorry for my
> subjectnot beig too clear. I ws tired. It's an Excell sheet that I've
> brought into Number. The popups did't export so I was making htem
> back. I really wish there was better conversion between Mac and
> Windows programs--it's the only thing that keeps mein windows.
>
> On 2/8/15, Phil Halton  wrote:
>> position in the cell where you want  the popup. then go to inspector with
>> the VO+J command and select the cell radio button.
>> Now, VO right to the scroll area and interact. there will be a data type
>> popup field right at the top. press enter or vo space on it and arrow
>> down
>> to popup and press enter.
>> You can populate that field by adding items to a table there I think (I'm
>> working from memory).
>>
>> When you're don, stop interacting with the scroll area and return to the
>> spreadsheet with the jump command VO+J.
>> Also, if you select a range of cells that have data and then do the
>> above,
>> the entire range will be set as  popups and the popup table will be
>> populated with the data in the selected range.
>>
>>> On Feb 7, 2015, at 11:57 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>>
>>> I need to put a popup menu in a spreadsheet I'm making. I found a
>>> YouTube
>>> on this but it could have used a bit of description, lOL. so I know you
>>> go
>>> to the Inspector, and choose the option for cell. But then I got a
>>> little
>>> lost in the maze there. How do you create the popup, and how do you
>>> return
>>> to the spreadsheet. I did manage to do it once but I stumbled around so
>>> much that I can't repeat the action. Any help will be appreciated.
>>> Thanks!!
>>>
>>> --
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>>
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A question about selecting audio in TwistedWave

[Krister Ekstrom]

Hello folks.
Firstly i’m sorry for cross posting but i wasn’t sure exactly where i would 
post this and it sorta belongs to both lists in a way so here we go:
I saw some mentioning on Twitter the other day that the latest Twistedwave 
should have an accessible way of selecting sounds in the waveform. Does anyone 
know what that is and how to get to it?
Thanks for any answers.
/Krister

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Re: questions about Apple scripts

[Aleeha Dudley]

Thanks! That helped a ton. 
Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Dog Dallas 
Vice President, Ohio Association of Guide Dog Users 
Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students 
Both proud divisions of the National Federation of the Blind of Ohio 
Email: blindcowgirl1...@gmail.com  
The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the 
characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the 
expectations of blind people, because low expectations create obstacles between 
blind people and our dreams. You can live the life you want; blindness is not 
what holds you back. 
“The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse’s ears.” - Arabian 
proverb 

> On Feb 7, 2015, at 4:43 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> First, commanders in the VoiceOver Utility. You could use a keystroke on the 
> keyboard, or (depending on what computer you have) the numpad or trackpad. 
> Here's an article about commanders I wrote for AppleVis:
> http://www.applevis.com/guides/mac-os-x/understanding-and-using-voiceovers-commanders
>  
> 
> 
> Second, you can make your own script for this, it's not terrible. 
> Unfortunately, it's not trivial either, as there is no simple command to just 
> grab the battery level (why? No clue.) I have a set of scripts that can do 
> this and more, though, so feel free to download them and give them a try. I 
> made them so you can easily customize what they say and how they say it, by 
> changing the template used when they run. The zip file in the below link 
> includes a Readme file that explains all this in way more detail. Enjoy.
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/17005121/talking%20dashboard.zip 
> 
>> On Feb 7, 2015, at 2:25 PM, Aleeha Dudley  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello All, 
>> I am writing with a couple of questions. First, where do I go to assign a 
>> keystroke to a task, such as opening an app or speaking the time and date? 
>> Also, I know that somewhere there is a script that will allow me to make 
>> voiceover announce the status of my battery. Does anyone know where I can 
>> get this script file and how to make it work?
>> Thanks.
>> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Dog Dallas 
>> Vice President, Ohio Association of Guide Dog Users 
>> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students 
>> Both proud divisions of the National Federation of the Blind of Ohio 
>> Email: blindcowgirl1...@gmail.com  
>> The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the 
>> characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the 
>> expectations of blind people, because low expectations create obstacles 
>> between blind people and our dreams. You can live the life you want; 
>> blindness is not what holds you back. 
>> “The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse’s ears.” - Arabian 
>> proverb 
>> 
>> 
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> 
> 
> --
> Have a great day,
> Alex Hall
> mehg...@icloud.com
> 
> 
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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Anne Robertson]

Hello Phil,

Do you have your mouse set to follow the other cursors? I always have mine set 
to ignore the other cursors and I always have to bring the mouse before I can 
get access to the menu button.

I get irritated with Apple breaking things, too. I used to be a systems 
programmer so I get really cross about the lack of non-regression testing. I’ve 
come across too many programmers these days who change their test data so that 
their programs don’t fail.

Cheers,

Anne


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 17:12, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> Wow, now we can access the menu of a style without all those gymnastics we 
> used to have to do. One thing I noticed, I don’t need to bring the mouse to 
> access the menu. I just interact with the style, use the VO Command J command 
> (that’s a new one on me), VO right and press vo space on the menu button.
> So much easier! Now if Apple will only fix the selection over page boundaries 
> bug, and refrain from breaking things in future updates.

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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Anne Robertson]

Hello Alex,

You’re right. But most people use the same styles that they favour most of the 
time.

Templates are really useful. I always save mine in a folder in my documents 
folder before adding them to the templates in Pages so that I can share them if 
necessary.

cheers,

Anne


> On 8 Feb 2015, at 17:57, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> So, the best way to save your styles is to make a template, correct? Make 
> your styles in a blank document, set up hotkeys if you want, than save it as 
> "my commonly used styles template" or something similar. Too bad there's no 
> way to add to globally available styles, since the above method then makes 
> your styles unavailable if you use any other templates in Pages.

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Re: Question about applying paragraph styles in Pages

[Phil Halton]

Hi Ann,
No, I always keep the mouse untethered. Maybe I misspoke, but I don’t think I 
routed the mouse before VOing right to the menu. I did however, use the 
alternatives action keystroke as suggested in the help tag for the style radio 
button (VO command spacebar). After pressing  the "show actions"  in the 
alternative  actions menu, I could just arrow to the menu button without 
routing the  mouse. 
I worked as a systems programmer in the insurance industry for a few years as 
well, and, like you,  I am also  surprised at the laxity of Apple’s regression 
testing. It’s a glaring omission  in an otherwise fine piece of engineering.


> On Feb 8, 2015, at 4:11 PM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> Hello Phil,
> 
> Do you have your mouse set to follow the other cursors? I always have mine 
> set to ignore the other cursors and I always have to bring the mouse before I 
> can get access to the menu button.
> 
> I get irritated with Apple breaking things, too. I used to be a systems 
> programmer so I get really cross about the lack of non-regression testing. 
> I’ve come across too many programmers these days who change their test data 
> so that their programs don’t fail.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 17:12, Phil Halton  wrote:
>> 
>> Wow, now we can access the menu of a style without all those gymnastics we 
>> used to have to do. One thing I noticed, I don’t need to bring the mouse to 
>> access the menu. I just interact with the style, use the VO Command J 
>> command (that’s a new one on me), VO right and press vo space on the menu 
>> button.
>> So much easier! Now if Apple will only fix the selection over page 
>> boundaries bug, and refrain from breaking things in future updates.
> 
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Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell

[Phil Halton]

I use Fusion/windows7 with Jaws and have remapped the grave accent key to act 
as caps lock, and the caps lock to act as grave accent key.
I used the windows Sharpkeys utility and it works like a charm.
So, my grave accent key is my jaws modifier key and if I ever really a grave 
accent, I can get it  with the caps lock key.

I have found sharpkeys to be the easiest solution for remapping keys, although 
it’s a bit tricky at first. There’s a good podcast about it on AppleVis , 
although the podcaster is pretty fast and hard to follow at times.

I have all but abandoned windows at this point, finding solutions for all I 
need on the mac - numbers being the biggest one of them all.

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 3:10 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
> I have VMware Fusion but honestly I really hate it. I've tried to do
> the keymapping and it kind of works, but really it's a very clutsy
> solution except to go in and do a quick and dirty Windows thing. So
> right now I'm stuck with a Windows PC and a Mac.
> 
> On 2/8/15, george b  wrote:
>> Well Deb,
>> 
>> I asked because I have Microsoft office on my mac and v o can not read any
>> entries in a cell and I thought you might of found a work around.
>> 
>> Just a tip for you I run v m fusion 7.2 on my mac and windows and it works
>> great and takes up only 40 gigs of space on my hard drive.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Deb Lewis
>> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2015 10:59
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Making a Popup Menu in excell
>> 
>> It was thenotion of using VO-J that I was totally missing. I actually
>> had gotten it all done without doing that, but it's so much more
>> elegant with the VO-J. Because I don't use that command very often, I
>> often don't realize where to apply it. And yeah, sorry for my
>> subjectnot beig too clear. I ws tired. It's an Excell sheet that I've
>> brought into Number. The popups did't export so I was making htem
>> back. I really wish there was better conversion between Mac and
>> Windows programs--it's the only thing that keeps mein windows.
>> 
>> On 2/8/15, Phil Halton  wrote:
>>> position in the cell where you want  the popup. then go to inspector with
>>> the VO+J command and select the cell radio button.
>>> Now, VO right to the scroll area and interact. there will be a data type
>>> popup field right at the top. press enter or vo space on it and arrow
>>> down
>>> to popup and press enter.
>>> You can populate that field by adding items to a table there I think (I'm
>>> working from memory).
>>> 
>>> When you're don, stop interacting with the scroll area and return to the
>>> spreadsheet with the jump command VO+J.
>>> Also, if you select a range of cells that have data and then do the
>>> above,
>>> the entire range will be set as  popups and the popup table will be
>>> populated with the data in the selected range.
>>> 
 On Feb 7, 2015, at 11:57 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
 
 I need to put a popup menu in a spreadsheet I'm making. I found a
 YouTube
 on this but it could have used a bit of description, lOL. so I know you
 go
 to the Inspector, and choose the option for cell. But then I got a
 little
 lost in the maze there. How do you create the popup, and how do you
 return
 to the spreadsheet. I did manage to do it once but I stumbled around so
 much that I can't repeat the action. Any help will be appreciated.
 Thanks!!
 
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Re: questions about Apple scripts

[gkearney]

OK here is a simple AppleScript that will announce the status of the 
battery I have attached the script to this post as well.

*set* batstat *to* *do shell script* "pmset -g batt"

*say* batstat


You could also do this from a shell script or in the terminal as well like 
this:


pmset -g batt | say



On Saturday, 7 February 2015 11:25:34 UTC-8, Aleeha Dudley wrote:
>
> Hello All, 
> I am writing with a couple of questions. First, where do I go to assign a 
> keystroke to a task, such as opening an app or speaking the time and date? 
> Also, I know that somewhere there is a script that will allow me to make 
> voiceover announce the status of my battery. Does anyone know where I can 
> get this script file and how to make it work?
> Thanks.
> Aleeha Dudley and Seeing Eye Dog Dallas 
> Vice President, Ohio Association of Guide Dog Users 
> Vice President, Ohio Association of Blind Students 
> Both proud divisions of the National Federation of the Blind of Ohio 
> Email: blindcow...@gmail.com  
> The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the 
> characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise the 
> expectations of blind people, because low expectations create obstacles 
> between blind people and our dreams. You can live the life you want; 
> blindness is not what holds you back. 
> “The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse’s ears.” - Arabian 
> proverb 
>  
>

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BatteryStatus.scpt
Description: Binary data

Where do I go to change the email address that is connected to my Apple ID?

[Donna Goodin]

Thanks in advance.  I did this once a long time ago, but can't remember where 
you have to go to change it.
Cheers,
Donna

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RE: Where do I go to change the email address that is connected to my Apple ID?

[Scott Erichsen]

Hi Donna,
GO to: applied.apple.com and all the info is there.
Remember though if you have an icloud.com or me.com address it can't be done.
Cheers,
Scott


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
Sent: Monday, 9 February 2015 9:29 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Where do I go to change the email address that is connected to my 
Apple ID?

Thanks in advance.  I did this once a long time ago, but can't remember where 
you have to go to change it.
Cheers,
Donna

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Re: Numbers Question

[Caitlyn Furness]

Hi,
So, is there a way for vo to get to the last cell with data when you reopen it?
Thanks,
Cait

> On Jan 31, 2015, at 6:07 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> Hi Emilio,
> I use Numbers now on a daily basis and it has completely replaced  Excel for 
> all my spreadsheet work. In a lot of ways it is easier and more accessible 
> than excel with JAWS. The big thing that you’ll have to get used to coming 
> from Excel is the way numbers handles data. In excel, a sheet is one large 
> grid of cells that you can organize your data on in the form of lists, 
> tables, etc. Then you navigate around the sheet to move to your various data 
> lists and tables.
> 
> In numbers, you don’t have one big open sheet with a vast array of cells. 
> Instead you place data objects on a “canvas”  and store your data in those 
> objects. These objects are usually in the form of tables which act much like 
> a list in excel. I hope that makes sense.
> 
> you expand and contract the size of the tables as needed to accommodate new 
> data rows and columns. You can have up to five header rows, header columns 
> and footer rows along with unlimited data rows and columns in a table, and 
> numbers does a good job of automatically keeping everything organized. Also, 
> Working with formulas is a pleasure once you get the hang of the formula 
> editor. 
> 
> I don’t know of any tutorials, but a good thorough reading of the help 
> system, and referring to it often along with your existing knowledge of 
> spreadsheeting will get you up and running. Spend some time just 
> experimenting with setting up tables and doing simple formula work for a 
> while before trying to convert your excel stuff over to numbers.
> 
> Like I said, I was a die-hard Excel user but I actually like numbers better 
> now. It handles everything I can throw at it and now all my Excel 
> spreadsheets are converted over to numbers tables. (of course, I had to tweet 
> things quite a bit to make that happen)
> 
> For $20 I don’t think you can go wrong. Just be prepared to spend some time 
> on the learning curve. 
> 
> Numbers is at least, if not more accessible with VO than is Excel with Jaws. 
> It just has some different data storage concepts that you need to understand.
> Good Luck
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jan 30, 2015, at 11:08 AM, Emilio Hernandez 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello everyone,
>> 
>> Does anyone know of a good voiceover tutorial that could usher me along 
>> using Numbers?
>> I want to give this program a fair shake if it will be comparable to using 
>> Excel.
>> 
>> Thanks for any help anyone can provide.
>> 
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Color schemes

[The Believer]

   I am writing on behalf of a friend who is using a Mac, no idea what 
model. She is very low vision, deaf and no braille.


   She needs to change the Color schemes but it appears that here Apple 
falls behind Microsoft. There seems np ability to change colors, just 
Invert Colors and that is dreadful for it mucks up colors so badly its 
useless for her.


   Windows offers high contrast schemes, black on white and white on 
black, in which one can tweak many things like fonts, sizes etc.


   Is there anything like this for OS X?

From The Believer. . .
 . . . what if it were true?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

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Re: Where do I go to change the email address that is connected to my Apple ID?

[Dave O.]

It would help if you spelled the URL correctly.

Go to appleid.apple.com

On that page, there's a link to manage your id.

On that page, you can edit or change the email address associated with your 
account.

Be advised, before actually doing this, you may want to sign out of 
everything that is associated with your Apple ID.

This includes iTunes, iCloud, iMessage, Face Time on all your devices.

It makes making the change much easier.

Dave

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Re: Color schemes

[David Griffith]

I am not a low vision user but I think that there will be a relative lack of 
customisation in relation to colour schemes across the Mac OS compared to 
Windows.

You can customise the size of the Fonts by bringing up the view options window 
in finder with command J.

There are a set of colour profiles in system preferences but as I have no sight 
I cannot comment on these  
When this issue was discussed before I suggested people contact Apple 
Accessibility with their requirements. Suitable Colour Profiles may then be 
include in future OS. It is unlikely that Apple will ever provide the level of 
customisation that Windows provides, especially as this often on the Windows 
platform is a contributory factor in instability. Jaws for example used to be 
famously intolerant of the High contrast scheme.
The trade off in the mac is stability against relative lack of customisation.

An expensive alternative is apparently Zoomtext which can provide some level of 
colour customisation.

David Griffith
> On 8 Feb 2015, at 23:22, The Believer  wrote:
> 
>   I am writing on behalf of a friend who is using a Mac, no idea what model. 
> She is very low vision, deaf and no braille.
> 
>   She needs to change the Color schemes but it appears that here Apple falls 
> behind Microsoft. There seems np ability to change colors, just Invert Colors 
> and that is dreadful for it mucks up colors so badly its useless for her.
> 
>   Windows offers high contrast schemes, black on white and white on black, in 
> which one can tweak many things like fonts, sizes etc.
> 
>   Is there anything like this for OS X?
> 
> From The Believer. . .
> . . . what if it were true?
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: Where do I go to change the email address that is connected to my Apple ID?

[Donna Goodin]

Thank you, all.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 5:26 PM, Dave O.  wrote:
> 
> It would help if you spelled the URL correctly.
> 
> Go to appleid.apple.com
> 
> On that page, there's a link to manage your id.
> 
> On that page, you can edit or change the email address associated with your 
> account.
> 
> Be advised, before actually doing this, you may want to sign out of 
> everything that is associated with your Apple ID.
> 
> This includes iTunes, iCloud, iMessage, Face Time on all your devices.
> 
> It makes making the change much easier.
> 
> Dave
> 
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Re: Color schemes

[The Believer]

   I am all too familiar with those issues in Windows. What she really 
needs is white on black. If she can find that, the rest she can tweak.


   Are there sources for downloading custom color profiles?

From The Believer. . .
 . . . what if it were true?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 2/8/2015 3:35 PM, David Griffith wrote:

I am not a low vision user but I think that there will be a relative lack of 
customisation in relation to colour schemes across the Mac OS compared to 
Windows.

You can customise the size of the Fonts by bringing up the view options window 
in finder with command J.

There are a set of colour profiles in system preferences but as I have no sight 
I cannot comment on these
When this issue was discussed before I suggested people contact Apple 
Accessibility with their requirements. Suitable Colour Profiles may then be 
include in future OS. It is unlikely that Apple will ever provide the level of 
customisation that Windows provides, especially as this often on the Windows 
platform is a contributory factor in instability. Jaws for example used to be 
famously intolerant of the High contrast scheme.
The trade off in the mac is stability against relative lack of customisation.

An expensive alternative is apparently Zoomtext which can provide some level of 
colour customisation.

David Griffith

On 8 Feb 2015, at 23:22, The Believer  wrote:

   I am writing on behalf of a friend who is using a Mac, no idea what model. 
She is very low vision, deaf and no braille.

   She needs to change the Color schemes but it appears that here Apple falls 
behind Microsoft. There seems np ability to change colors, just Invert Colors 
and that is dreadful for it mucks up colors so badly its useless for her.

   Windows offers high contrast schemes, black on white and white on black, in 
which one can tweak many things like fonts, sizes etc.

   Is there anything like this for OS X?

 From The Believer. . .
. . . what if it were true?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

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Re: Color schemes

[David Griffith]

>From memory colour profiles are a tab under display in system preferences.
It is difficult for me to comment with authority  as I have not really seen 
this for years but I thought the whole point of the invert colours feature  on 
the Mac was to provide white  on black. So essentially you need a  colour 
profile which delivers black on white text and simply use invert colours.

Remember you can also crank up the contrast and brightness as well in 
Accessibility and system settings.
Of course Zoom is also available.
However  perhaps I should leave this to someone who is a low vision user on the 
Mac as they will know more.
  .
> On 9 Feb 2015, at 00:00, The Believer  wrote:
> 
>   I am all too familiar with those issues in Windows. What she really needs 
> is white on black. If she can find that, the rest she can tweak.
> 
>   Are there sources for downloading custom color profiles?
> 
> From The Believer. . .
> . . . what if it were true?
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 2/8/2015 3:35 PM, David Griffith wrote:
>> I am not a low vision user but I think that there will be a relative lack of 
>> customisation in relation to colour schemes across the Mac OS compared to 
>> Windows.
>> 
>> You can customise the size of the Fonts by bringing up the view options 
>> window in finder with command J.
>> 
>> There are a set of colour profiles in system preferences but as I have no 
>> sight I cannot comment on these
>> When this issue was discussed before I suggested people contact Apple 
>> Accessibility with their requirements. Suitable Colour Profiles may then be 
>> include in future OS. It is unlikely that Apple will ever provide the level 
>> of customisation that Windows provides, especially as this often on the 
>> Windows platform is a contributory factor in instability. Jaws for example 
>> used to be famously intolerant of the High contrast scheme.
>> The trade off in the mac is stability against relative lack of customisation.
>> 
>> An expensive alternative is apparently Zoomtext which can provide some level 
>> of colour customisation.
>> 
>> David Griffith
>>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 23:22, The Believer  wrote:
>>> 
>>>   I am writing on behalf of a friend who is using a Mac, no idea what 
>>> model. She is very low vision, deaf and no braille.
>>> 
>>>   She needs to change the Color schemes but it appears that here Apple 
>>> falls behind Microsoft. There seems np ability to change colors, just 
>>> Invert Colors and that is dreadful for it mucks up colors so badly its 
>>> useless for her.
>>> 
>>>   Windows offers high contrast schemes, black on white and white on black, 
>>> in which one can tweak many things like fonts, sizes etc.
>>> 
>>>   Is there anything like this for OS X?
>>> 
>>> From The Believer. . .
>>> . . . what if it were true?
>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>> 
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>> 
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Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Alex Hall]

Hi all,
First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the same 
conclusion I have.

I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer voices 
(Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I favored Ava, and 
she is still among the best voices I know of, except a couple from Ivona. In 
testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from Ava to Alex, just to see if 
any problems were being caused by the use of Nuance voices. I accidentally made 
a startling discovery: Alex used to be pretty bad a few years ago, but now, 
he's quite good. I've always liked the breathing thing, but Alex would 
constantly run words together, mispronounce syllables, and have other small 
problems that made him hard to understand, especially at higher speeds. The 
more I use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for reasons to switch back 
to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava misses the period after 
certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase 
letters, although that setting is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has 
delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up VO menus while using Nuance 
voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and more.

So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in that 
VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I mean 
"better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when speaking 
and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe I'm the only 
one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus invisible to those 
who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested in hearing your 
thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit iPhone so I can start 
using Alex there as well. My only complaint about Alex is that he doesn't speed 
up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I find I miss things at more 
than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all think? If you haven't used Alex 
in a long time, give him another chance. If you use him all the time, have you 
noticed anything?

--
Have a great day,
Alex Hall
mehg...@icloud.com

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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Ray Foret Jr]

Alex, it ain't just you dude.  Alex is tons better than he used to be in every 
respect you mentioned.  Much smoother, faster, way more responsive, and, other 
than Fred, which I am using at the moment for strictly sentamintal purposes, 
Alex is the best of all the voices out there.  In fact, he's better even than 
the Acapela voices which, if I may be frank, have taken severle steps backward 
from where they used to be.


Sincerely,
The Constantly Barefooted Ray

Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!

Sent from my Mac,
the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
> same conclusion I have.
> 
> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer voices 
> (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I favored Ava, 
> and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a couple from Ivona. 
> In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from Ava to Alex, just to 
> see if any problems were being caused by the use of Nuance voices. I 
> accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be pretty bad a few 
> years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the breathing thing, 
> but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce syllables, and 
> have other small problems that made him hard to understand, especially at 
> higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for 
> reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava 
> misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says 
> "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting is disabled, and 
> Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up 
> VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and 
> more.
> 
> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe I'm 
> the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about Alex 
> is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I 
> find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all 
> think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another chance. If 
> you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
> 
> --
> Have a great day,
> Alex Hall
> mehg...@icloud.com 
> 
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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Jessica Moss]

Fred? lol, that voice sounds aweful, reminds me too much of either the dectalk 
voices, or the Vera reading machine we used to use when I went to FSDB.
  Things have definitely come so far sense then.
On Feb 8, 2015, at 8:17 PM, Ray Foret Jr  wrote:

> Alex, it ain't just you dude.  Alex is tons better than he used to be in 
> every respect you mentioned.  Much smoother, faster, way more responsive, 
> and, other than Fred, which I am using at the moment for strictly sentamintal 
> purposes, Alex is the best of all the voices out there.  In fact, he's better 
> even than the Acapela voices which, if I may be frank, have taken severle 
> steps backward from where they used to be.
> 
> 
> Sincerely,
> The Constantly Barefooted Ray
> 
> Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!
> 
> Sent from my Mac,
> the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in
> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
>> same conclusion I have.
>> 
>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I favored 
>> Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a couple from 
>> Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from Ava to Alex, 
>> just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of Nuance voices. I 
>> accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be pretty bad a few 
>> years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the breathing thing, 
>> but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce syllables, and 
>> have other small problems that made him hard to understand, especially at 
>> higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for 
>> reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava 
>> misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says 
>> "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting is disabled, and 
>> Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing 
>> up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; 
>> and more.
>> 
>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
>> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
>> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
>> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
>> I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
>> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
>> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
>> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about Alex 
>> is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I 
>> find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all 
>> think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another chance. If 
>> you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
>> 
>> --
>> Have a great day,
>> Alex Hall
>> mehg...@icloud.com
>> 
>> 
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> 
> 
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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[David Taylor]

Hi,

Can anybody tell me how to get this new Alex? I’ve even tried deleting and 
re-downloading to get him.

Cheers
Dave

> On 9 Feb 2015, at 1:54 am, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> Fred? lol, that voice sounds aweful, reminds me too much of either the 
> dectalk voices, or the Vera reading machine we used to use when I went to 
> FSDB.
>   Things have definitely come so far sense then.
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 8:17 PM, Ray Foret Jr  > wrote:
> 
>> Alex, it ain't just you dude.  Alex is tons better than he used to be in 
>> every respect you mentioned.  Much smoother, faster, way more responsive, 
>> and, other than Fred, which I am using at the moment for strictly 
>> sentamintal purposes, Alex is the best of all the voices out there.  In 
>> fact, he's better even than the Acapela voices which, if I may be frank, 
>> have taken severle steps backward from where they used to be.
>> 
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray
>> 
>> Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!
>> 
>> Sent from my Mac,
>> the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in
>> 
>>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:41 PM, Alex Hall >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
>>> same conclusion I have.
>>> 
>>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
>>> favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
>>> couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
>>> Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
>>> Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be 
>>> pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the 
>>> breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce 
>>> syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard to understand, 
>>> especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the 
>>> more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons 
>>> allude me. Ava misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex 
>>> doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting 
>>> is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO 
>>> Utility or bringing up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I 
>>> find no such delays; and more.
>>> 
>>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
>>> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
>>> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
>>> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
>>> I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
>>> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
>>> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
>>> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about 
>>> Alex is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, 
>>> but I find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do 
>>> you all think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another 
>>> chance. If you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Have a great day,
>>> Alex Hall
>>> mehg...@icloud.com 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
>>> .
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>>> .
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>>> .
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout 
>>> .
>> 
>> 
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>> .
> 

Making mobile calls from Mac

[David Taylor]

Hi,

Can anybody tell me what it is I need to do to make mobile calls from mac work 
please? I have my texts sorted, but get call failed when I try to make a call 
from mac.

Thanks
Dave

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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Jessica Moss]

What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the time, 
and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try to log in 
anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he speaks the 
"remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth clenched, or has 
something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, and I've always thought 
it really weird that he sounds like that.
On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:

> Hi all,
> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
> same conclusion I have.
> 
> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer voices 
> (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I favored Ava, 
> and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a couple from Ivona. 
> In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from Ava to Alex, just to 
> see if any problems were being caused by the use of Nuance voices. I 
> accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be pretty bad a few 
> years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the breathing thing, 
> but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce syllables, and 
> have other small problems that made him hard to understand, especially at 
> higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for 
> reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava 
> misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says 
> "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting is disabled, and 
> Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up 
> VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and 
> more.
> 
> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe I'm 
> the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about Alex 
> is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I 
> find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all 
> think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another chance. If 
> you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
> 
> --
> Have a great day,
> Alex Hall
> mehg...@icloud.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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Re: Numbers Question

[Phil Halton]

Yes, kind of.

You can go to the bottom of the table, assuming your data extends to the 
bottom, by either pressing VO shift right arrow, or by pressing command down 
arrow to go to the bottom of the current column.
You have to be very careful with the latter command though, because its right 
next to the option down arrow, and that command will insert a new row below the 
current row. Likewise option right and left arrows insert columns to the right 
and left of the current column. 
I do that a lot when I’m tired and it can tend to mess up your spreadsheets.

Anyway, command up down right and left arrows move to the extreme top bottom 
right or left edge of the table. Once at the bottom of the table you can VO 
arrow right or left to get to the desired column.

It’s not like excel where the data is stored in regions and there are special 
key combos for going to the first, last cell of the region etc. All the data is 
stored in individual self-contained tables that you set up so each table is its 
own region in a sense.
Unfortunately, if a data range does not extend to the top or bottom of a 
column, there are no VO keys that will get you to the last data item. you 
either go to the top or bottom, no in-between. Its not a big deal though, you 
just have to set up your tables and arrange your data so that its not an issue.


> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:16 PM, Caitlyn Furness  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> So, is there a way for vo to get to the last cell with data when you reopen 
> it?
> Thanks,
> Cait
> 
>> On Jan 31, 2015, at 6:07 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Emilio,
>> I use Numbers now on a daily basis and it has completely replaced  Excel for 
>> all my spreadsheet work. In a lot of ways it is easier and more accessible 
>> than excel with JAWS. The big thing that you’ll have to get used to coming 
>> from Excel is the way numbers handles data. In excel, a sheet is one large 
>> grid of cells that you can organize your data on in the form of lists, 
>> tables, etc. Then you navigate around the sheet to move to your various data 
>> lists and tables.
>> 
>> In numbers, you don’t have one big open sheet with a vast array of cells. 
>> Instead you place data objects on a “canvas”  and store your data in those 
>> objects. These objects are usually in the form of tables which act much like 
>> a list in excel. I hope that makes sense.
>> 
>> you expand and contract the size of the tables as needed to accommodate new 
>> data rows and columns. You can have up to five header rows, header columns 
>> and footer rows along with unlimited data rows and columns in a table, and 
>> numbers does a good job of automatically keeping everything organized. Also, 
>> Working with formulas is a pleasure once you get the hang of the formula 
>> editor. 
>> 
>> I don’t know of any tutorials, but a good thorough reading of the help 
>> system, and referring to it often along with your existing knowledge of 
>> spreadsheeting will get you up and running. Spend some time just 
>> experimenting with setting up tables and doing simple formula work for a 
>> while before trying to convert your excel stuff over to numbers.
>> 
>> Like I said, I was a die-hard Excel user but I actually like numbers better 
>> now. It handles everything I can throw at it and now all my Excel 
>> spreadsheets are converted over to numbers tables. (of course, I had to 
>> tweet things quite a bit to make that happen)
>> 
>> For $20 I don’t think you can go wrong. Just be prepared to spend some time 
>> on the learning curve. 
>> 
>> Numbers is at least, if not more accessible with VO than is Excel with Jaws. 
>> It just has some different data storage concepts that you need to understand.
>> Good Luck
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 30, 2015, at 11:08 AM, Emilio Hernandez 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello everyone,
>>> 
>>> Does anyone know of a good voiceover tutorial that could usher me along 
>>> using Numbers?
>>> I want to give this program a fair shake if it will be comparable to using 
>>> Excel.
>>> 
>>> Thanks for any help anyone can provide.
>>> 
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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Ray Foret Jr]

You mean get Alex for the iPhone?  Well, first, let's start by informing you 
that you absolutely MUST have at the very least the iPhone 5S.  Nothing less 
than that will do.  Now, assuming you do have that, do this.

1.  Click Settings.

2.  Click general.

3.  Click accessibility.

4.  Click Voice Over.

5.  Now, click languages and dialects.  I think that's now inside speech.

6.  Select Alex as one of the choices from inside the language  choices for 
English.  Takes a bit to download, and, when done, you'll need to turn VO off 
then back on with the tripple click of the home button.


Sincerely,
The Constantly Barefooted Ray

Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!

Sent from my Mac,
the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:56 PM, David Taylor  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Can anybody tell me how to get this new Alex? I’ve even tried deleting and 
> re-downloading to get him.
> 
> Cheers
> Dave
> 
>> On 9 Feb 2015, at 1:54 am, Jessica Moss > > wrote:
>> 
>> Fred? lol, that voice sounds aweful, reminds me too much of either the 
>> dectalk voices, or the Vera reading machine we used to use when I went to 
>> FSDB.
>>   Things have definitely come so far sense then.
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 8:17 PM, Ray Foret Jr > > wrote:
>> 
>>> Alex, it ain't just you dude.  Alex is tons better than he used to be in 
>>> every respect you mentioned.  Much smoother, faster, way more responsive, 
>>> and, other than Fred, which I am using at the moment for strictly 
>>> sentamintal purposes, Alex is the best of all the voices out there.  In 
>>> fact, he's better even than the Acapela voices which, if I may be frank, 
>>> have taken severle steps backward from where they used to be.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sincerely,
>>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray
>>> 
>>> Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!
>>> 
>>> Sent from my Mac,
>>> the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in
>>> 
 On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:41 PM, Alex Hall >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi all,
 First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
 subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
 same conclusion I have.
 
 I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
 voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
 favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
 couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
 Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
 Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be 
 pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked 
 the breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, 
 mispronounce syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard 
 to understand, especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in 
 Yosemite, though, the more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but 
 the more those reasons allude me. Ava misses the period after certain 
 words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase 
 letters, although that setting is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver 
 has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up VO menus while using 
 Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and more.
 
 So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
 that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
 mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
 speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
 I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
 invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm 
 interested in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to 
 obtain a 64-bit iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only 
 complaint about Alex is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can 
 go crazy fast, but I find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. 
 Anyway, what do you all think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, 
 give him another chance. If you use him all the time, have you noticed 
 anything?
 
 --
 Have a great day,
 Alex Hall
 mehg...@icloud.com 
 
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OT can I use the ipod touch in landscape?

[erik burggraaf]

Hi all,

I am just trying to switch an ipod touch fifth generation to landscape 
orientation and it won't fly.  Orientation lock is off but moving the ipod 
doesn't change the orientation.  I can't find a setting to do it manually 
either.  Did they take this feature out of Ipod touch?

Thanks,

Erik Burggraaf

On feb 22nd 2015, Both reno area Chilis Locations will donate %15 of all sales 
to the NFB of Northern nevada when customers present the flyer linked below at 
time of purchase.
Please download and print the flyer, or load it to your mobile device, And join 
us at Chilis on the 22nd.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1291668/Give%20Back%20Event%20Flyer%28201512922433987%29.pdf

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have to force quit mail because messages can't be deleted for some reason

[Ray Foret Jr]

Subject line just about says it all.  Sometimes, when I go to quit mail, I get 
an alert that says that some messages cannot be moved to the trash or  deleted 
from the trash.  When I press the okay button here I am forced to force quit 
mail then start it up again.  After that, it seems to work okay.  anybody else 
notice this and have a cure?


Sincerely,
The Constantly Barefooted Ray

Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!

Sent from my Mac,
the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in

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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Dionipher Presas Herrera]

i already drag the splitter to 0 by interacting it.
On 08 Feb 2015, at 04:53 pm, Anne Robertson  wrote:

> Trying to drag the splitter using VO results in Mail being busy and doesn’t 
> work.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 15:03, Dionipher Presas Herrera  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> what i mean is that i can i just interact with the plitter by pressing VO 
>> shift down arrow. then pressing to the right arrow.
> 
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Re: Making mobile calls from Mac

[Shawn Krasniuk]

Hi. Did you allow cellular calls from FaceTime on both your Mac and iPhone? You 
have to have the latest version of iOS 8 and OS X Yosemite in order to do this.

Shawn
Sent From My White MacBook

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:58 PM, David Taylor  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Can anybody tell me what it is I need to do to make mobile calls from mac 
> work please? I have my texts sorted, but get call failed when I try to make a 
> call from mac.
> 
> Thanks
> Dave
> 
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RE: have to force quit mail because messages can't be deleted for some reason

[M. Taylor]

Hello Ray,

This usually occurs because your connection to the Internet is either lost, 
unstable, or extremely slow, causing the server connection to time-out.  

The next time this happens, before closing Mail, Open Safari and see if it is 
online.

It may also be time for you to reboot your Internet MODEM and/or router.  

Mark


From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Ray Foret Jr
Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2015 6:23 PM
To: Mac Visionaries List
Subject: have to force quit mail because messages can't be deleted for some 
reason

Subject line just about says it all.  Sometimes, when I go to quit mail, I get 
an alert that says that some messages cannot be moved to the trash or  deleted 
from the trash.  When I press the okay button here I am forced to force quit 
mail then start it up again.  After that, it seems to work okay.  anybody else 
notice this and have a cure?


Sincerely,
The Constantly Barefooted Ray
Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!

Sent from my Mac,
the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in

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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Shawn Krasniuk]

Hey guys. I agree with you about Alex, he's awesome. And I agree with Ray in 
the sense that Acapela has taken steps backwards. In my opinion, they've 
replaced quality with features that aren't really necessary. That's why I even 
use Alex on my iPhone. One thing about the vocalizer voices, Alex, you 
mentioned that they say capital before every capital letter. Well if you listen 
to it carefully, you'll notice that they're getting really bad with that now, 
because now they're saying "OS capital x" instead of saying "OS 10" like they 
used to. For example if I wrote OS X Yosemite right now and you read that with 
the Nuance voices, you'll see what I mean.

Shawn
Sent From My White MacBook

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:17 PM, Ray Foret Jr  wrote:
> 
> Alex, it ain't just you dude.  Alex is tons better than he used to be in 
> every respect you mentioned.  Much smoother, faster, way more responsive, 
> and, other than Fred, which I am using at the moment for strictly sentamintal 
> purposes, Alex is the best of all the voices out there.  In fact, he's better 
> even than the Acapela voices which, if I may be frank, have taken severle 
> steps backward from where they used to be.
> 
> 
> Sincerely,
> The Constantly Barefooted Ray
> 
> Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!
> 
> Sent from my Mac,
> the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in
> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:41 PM, Alex Hall > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
>> same conclusion I have.
>> 
>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I favored 
>> Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a couple from 
>> Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from Ava to Alex, 
>> just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of Nuance voices. I 
>> accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be pretty bad a few 
>> years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the breathing thing, 
>> but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce syllables, and 
>> have other small problems that made him hard to understand, especially at 
>> higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for 
>> reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava 
>> misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says 
>> "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting is disabled, and 
>> Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing 
>> up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; 
>> and more.
>> 
>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
>> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
>> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
>> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
>> I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
>> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
>> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
>> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about Alex 
>> is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I 
>> find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all 
>> think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another chance. If 
>> you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
>> 
>> --
>> Have a great day,
>> Alex Hall
>> mehg...@icloud.com 
>> 
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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Devin Prater]

The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a little on 
the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on the mac because 
of that.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the 
> time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try to 
> log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he speaks 
> the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth clenched, or has 
> something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, and I've always thought 
> it really weird that he sounds like that.
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
>> same conclusion I have.
>> 
>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I favored 
>> Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a couple from 
>> Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from Ava to Alex, 
>> just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of Nuance voices. I 
>> accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be pretty bad a few 
>> years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the breathing thing, 
>> but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce syllables, and 
>> have other small problems that made him hard to understand, especially at 
>> higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for 
>> reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava 
>> misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says 
>> "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting is disabled, and 
>> Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing 
>> up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; 
>> and more.
>> 
>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
>> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
>> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
>> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
>> I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
>> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
>> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
>> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about Alex 
>> is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I 
>> find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all 
>> think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another chance. If 
>> you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
>> 
>> --
>> Have a great day,
>> Alex Hall
>> mehg...@icloud.com
>> 
>> 
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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Alex Hall]

Thanks for the confirmation, everyone. I never thought I'd say it, but I plan 
on keeping Alex as my primary voice for the foreseeable future. Of course, 
that's assuming some genius doesn't port ESpeak over to the Mac. :)

Odd that you're encountering suttering, Devin. Nuance voices would definitely 
stutter and lag, even in the latest Yosemite, but Alex has no such problems. In 
fact, VoiceOver with Alex is way more responsive, and I often feel like I have 
that immediate response the Mac has been lacking for so long. It used to be 
that a Windows screen reader had the immediacy down - hit a key, hear speech, 
no delays at all - but now the Mac is getting there too. Alex is the only voice 
to offer it, though; the Nuance voices I've tried still have a bit of lag to 
them in all situations, and can lag terribly every so often.
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:56 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a little 
> on the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on the mac 
> because of that.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss  > wrote:
> 
>> What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the 
>> time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try to 
>> log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he speaks 
>> the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth clenched, or has 
>> something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, and I've always 
>> thought it really weird that he sounds like that.
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall > > wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
>>> same conclusion I have.
>>> 
>>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
>>> favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
>>> couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
>>> Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
>>> Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be 
>>> pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the 
>>> breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce 
>>> syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard to understand, 
>>> especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the 
>>> more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons 
>>> allude me. Ava misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex 
>>> doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting 
>>> is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO 
>>> Utility or bringing up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I 
>>> find no such delays; and more.
>>> 
>>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
>>> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
>>> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
>>> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
>>> I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
>>> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
>>> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
>>> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about 
>>> Alex is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, 
>>> but I find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do 
>>> you all think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another 
>>> chance. If you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Have a great day,
>>> Alex Hall
>>> mehg...@icloud.com 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
>>> .
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>>> .
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>>> .
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>>> .
>> 
>> 
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Re: OT can I use the ipod touch in landscape?

['Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries]

An iPod touch should operate just like an iPhone without the phone 
features. What app are you using at the time? The app launcher doesn't 
change orientation but many apps do such as Safari.


CB

On 2/8/15 9:21 PM, erik burggraaf wrote:

Hi all,

I am just trying to switch an ipod touch fifth generation to landscape 
orientation and it won't fly.  Orientation lock is off but moving the 
ipod doesn't change the orientation.  I can't find a setting to do it 
manually either.  Did they take this feature out of Ipod touch?


Thanks,

Erik Burggraaf

On feb 22nd 2015, Both reno area Chilis Locations will donate %15 of 
all sales to the NFB of Northern nevada when customers present the 
flyer linked below at time of purchase.
Please download and print the flyer, or load it to your mobile device, 
And join us at Chilis on the 22nd.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1291668/Give%20Back%20Event%20Flyer%28201512922433987%29.pdf

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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Mary Otten]

If you're using Yosemite and you're noticing Alex skipping or stuttering, I 
don't think that is an Alex problem. Rather, I think it is something to do with 
Yosemite, although it doesn't appear on everybody's machine. It also happens 
with vocalizer voices. I use the Russian ones, and it happens there, just like 
it does with Alex. I couldn't stand using Fred, skip or not. Just not ready to 
go back that far in time. I started with Alex and snow leopard. And I thought 
he was really good there. Then there were some steps backwards and lion and 
mountain lion. Now, if it wasn't for this voice issue in Yosemite, I would say 
he is back to his old self.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:56 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a little 
> on the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on the mac 
> because of that.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>> 
>> What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the 
>> time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try to 
>> log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he speaks 
>> the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth clenched, or has 
>> something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, and I've always 
>> thought it really weird that he sounds like that.
>>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
>>> same conclusion I have.
>>> 
>>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
>>> favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
>>> couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
>>> Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
>>> Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be 
>>> pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked the 
>>> breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, mispronounce 
>>> syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard to understand, 
>>> especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in Yosemite, though, the 
>>> more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but the more those reasons 
>>> allude me. Ava misses the period after certain words, like "app", Alex 
>>> doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase letters, although that setting 
>>> is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO 
>>> Utility or bringing up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I 
>>> find no such delays; and more.
>>> 
>>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
>>> that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
>>> mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
>>> speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
>>> I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
>>> invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm interested 
>>> in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit 
>>> iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only complaint about 
>>> Alex is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can go crazy fast, 
>>> but I find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. Anyway, what do 
>>> you all think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, give him another 
>>> chance. If you use him all the time, have you noticed anything?
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Have a great day,
>>> Alex Hall
>>> mehg...@icloud.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "MacVisionaries" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>> 
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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Devin Prater]

I've had the studdering issue for a while now, but I'd always use Fred and 
forget about it.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:04 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> Thanks for the confirmation, everyone. I never thought I'd say it, but I plan 
> on keeping Alex as my primary voice for the foreseeable future. Of course, 
> that's assuming some genius doesn't port ESpeak over to the Mac. :)
> 
> Odd that you're encountering suttering, Devin. Nuance voices would definitely 
> stutter and lag, even in the latest Yosemite, but Alex has no such problems. 
> In fact, VoiceOver with Alex is way more responsive, and I often feel like I 
> have that immediate response the Mac has been lacking for so long. It used to 
> be that a Windows screen reader had the immediacy down - hit a key, hear 
> speech, no delays at all - but now the Mac is getting there too. Alex is the 
> only voice to offer it, though; the Nuance voices I've tried still have a bit 
> of lag to them in all situations, and can lag terribly every so often.
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:56 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
>> 
>> The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a little 
>> on the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on the mac 
>> because of that.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>>> 
>>> What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the 
>>> time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try 
>>> to log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he 
>>> speaks the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth clenched, 
>>> or has something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, and I've 
>>> always thought it really weird that he sounds like that.
 On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
 
 Hi all,
 First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
 subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to the 
 same conclusion I have.
 
 I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
 voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
 favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
 couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
 Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
 Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be 
 pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked 
 the breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, 
 mispronounce syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard 
 to understand, especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in 
 Yosemite, though, the more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but 
 the more those reasons allude me. Ava misses the period after certain 
 words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase 
 letters, although that setting is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver 
 has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up VO menus while using 
 Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and more.
 
 So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" in 
 that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly does. I 
 mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far clearer when 
 speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm misremembering, or maybe 
 I'm the only one to notice, since the change was likely gradual and thus 
 invisible to those who have used Alex all along. Either way, I'm 
 interested in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager than ever to 
 obtain a 64-bit iPhone so I can start using Alex there as well. My only 
 complaint about Alex is that he doesn't speed up very well - sure, he can 
 go crazy fast, but I find I miss things at more than 70% speaking rate. 
 Anyway, what do you all think? If you haven't used Alex in a long time, 
 give him another chance. If you use him all the time, have you noticed 
 anything?
 
 --
 Have a great day,
 Alex Hall
 mehg...@icloud.com
 
 
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 "MacVisionaries" group.
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>>> 
>>> 
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Re: OT can I use the ipod touch in landscape?

[erik burggraaf]

I'm just trying it on the home screen.  No luck.

Best,

Erik Burggraaf

On feb 22nd 2015, Both reno area Chilis Locations will donate %15 of all sales 
to the NFB of Northern nevada when customers present the flyer linked below at 
time of purchase.
Please download and print the flyer, or load it to your mobile device, And join 
us at Chilis on the 22nd.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1291668/Give%20Back%20Event%20Flyer%28201512922433987%29.pdf

On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:09 PM, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

> An iPod touch should operate just like an iPhone without the phone features. 
> What app are you using at the time? The app launcher doesn't change 
> orientation but many apps do such as Safari.
> 
> CB
> 
> On 2/8/15 9:21 PM, erik burggraaf wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> I am just trying to switch an ipod touch fifth generation to landscape 
>> orientation and it won't fly.  Orientation lock is off but moving the ipod 
>> doesn't change the orientation.  I can't find a setting to do it manually 
>> either.  Did they take this feature out of Ipod touch?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Erik Burggraaf
>> 
>> On feb 22nd 2015, Both reno area Chilis Locations will donate %15 of all 
>> sales to the NFB of Northern nevada when customers present the flyer linked 
>> below at time of purchase.
>> Please download and print the flyer, or load it to your mobile device, And 
>> join us at Chilis on the 22nd.
>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1291668/Give%20Back%20Event%20Flyer%28201512922433987%29.pdf
>> 
>> -- 
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>> "MacVisionaries" group.
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>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
> 
> -- 
> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
> 
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Re: Disabling the Preview pain in Mail in the latest OS X release

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

As mentioned, dragging with VO will not usually do what you are wanting it to 
do.  You actually want the Horizontal Splitter to be at 100%, not 0%.  You will 
know that the Preview Pane is gone by selecting a message, then stopping 
Interaction with everything, then using VO-right to move through the Mail 
window.  The Horizontal Splitter will now be at the bottom of the window and 
there will be no announcing of any text of the selected message.   In Classic 
view, if you try with VO to drag the Horizontal Splitter down, so that the 
percent increases, it will normally only reach a maximum of about 82%, which, 
of course, still allows the Preview pane to be active.  The only way for the 
Preview pane to be totally inactive, is to get that splitter to 100% using the 
methods Anne and others, including myself, have previously mentioned.  Either 
the physical drag of the Trackpad or mouse-keys dragging.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Feb 8, 2015, at 19:36, Dionipher Presas Herrera  wrote:

i already drag the splitter to 0 by interacting it.
On 08 Feb 2015, at 04:53 pm, Anne Robertson  wrote:

> Trying to drag the splitter using VO results in Mail being busy and doesn’t 
> work.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
>> On 8 Feb 2015, at 15:03, Dionipher Presas Herrera  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> what i mean is that i can i just interact with the plitter by pressing VO 
>> shift down arrow. then pressing to the right arrow.
> 
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Re: have to force quit mail because messages can't be deleted for some reason

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

I’ve usually seen this when quitting Mail too quick after either sending or 
deleting messages in an iMap account, most often in a Gmail iMap account.  Just 
wait 10 to 15 seconds after doing these actions before quitting Mail and you 
should be fine.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Feb 8, 2015, at 19:23, Ray Foret Jr  wrote:

Subject line just about says it all.  Sometimes, when I go to quit mail, I get 
an alert that says that some messages cannot be moved to the trash or  deleted 
from the trash.  When I press the okay button here I am forced to force quit 
mail then start it up again.  After that, it seems to work okay.  anybody else 
notice this and have a cure?


Sincerely,
The Constantly Barefooted Ray

Still a happy Mac, Verizon Wireless iPhone 6+ and Apple TV user!

Sent from my Mac,
the only computer with full accessibility for the blind built-in


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Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Traci Duncan]

I take it, this new Alex is in Yosimity only?  I have consistently used Compact 
Samantha on my Mac.  I have mostly found Alex difficult to understand after 
long periods of reading.  He seems to blur his words together.  I was using him 
on my iPad mini for a while, but ended up going back to trusty Compact Samantha.

When I upgrade to Yosimity, maybe I’ll give Alex another whirl.  :)

Traci
PS. Compact Samantha says OS X correctly.  As in OS Ten.  :)


On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:27 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:

> I've had the studdering issue for a while now, but I'd always use Fred and 
> forget about it.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:04 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
>> Thanks for the confirmation, everyone. I never thought I'd say it, but I 
>> plan on keeping Alex as my primary voice for the foreseeable future. Of 
>> course, that's assuming some genius doesn't port ESpeak over to the Mac. :)
>> 
>> Odd that you're encountering suttering, Devin. Nuance voices would 
>> definitely stutter and lag, even in the latest Yosemite, but Alex has no 
>> such problems. In fact, VoiceOver with Alex is way more responsive, and I 
>> often feel like I have that immediate response the Mac has been lacking for 
>> so long. It used to be that a Windows screen reader had the immediacy down - 
>> hit a key, hear speech, no delays at all - but now the Mac is getting there 
>> too. Alex is the only voice to offer it, though; the Nuance voices I've 
>> tried still have a bit of lag to them in all situations, and can lag 
>> terribly every so often.
>>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:56 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
>>> 
>>> The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a little 
>>> on the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on the mac 
>>> because of that.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>>> 
 What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the 
 time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try 
 to log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he 
 speaks the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth clenched, 
 or has something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, and I've 
 always thought it really weird that he sounds like that.
 On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
 
> Hi all,
> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to 
> the same conclusion I have.
> 
> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
> favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
> couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
> Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
> Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to be 
> pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always liked 
> the breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, 
> mispronounce syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard 
> to understand, especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in 
> Yosemite, though, the more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but 
> the more those reasons allude me. Ava misses the period after certain 
> words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase 
> letters, although that setting is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver 
> has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up VO menus while 
> using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and more.
> 
> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" 
> in that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly 
> does. I mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far 
> clearer when speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm 
> misremembering, or maybe I'm the only one to notice, since the change was 
> likely gradual and thus invisible to those who have used Alex all along. 
> Either way, I'm interested in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more eager 
> than ever to obtain a 64-bit iPhone so I can start using Alex there as 
> well. My only complaint about Alex is that he doesn't speed up very well 
> - sure, he can go crazy fast, but I find I miss things at more than 70% 
> speaking rate. Anyway, what do you all think? If you haven't used Alex in 
> a long time, give him another chance. If you use him all the time, have 
> you noticed anything?
> 
> --
> Have a great day,
> Alex Hall
> mehg...@icloud.com
> 
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribe

Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Alex Hall]

Yes, this is Yosemite. As I said in my original message, speech synthesis is 
one of the most subjective things about accessibility software. For instance, 
I'm in that crazy minority that love ESpeak and KeynoteGold.  
> On Feb 9, 2015, at 12:01 AM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> 
> I take it, this new Alex is in Yosimity only?  I have consistently used 
> Compact Samantha on my Mac.  I have mostly found Alex difficult to understand 
> after long periods of reading.  He seems to blur his words together.  I was 
> using him on my iPad mini for a while, but ended up going back to trusty 
> Compact Samantha.
> 
> When I upgrade to Yosimity, maybe I’ll give Alex another whirl.  :)
> 
> Traci
> PS. Compact Samantha says OS X correctly.  As in OS Ten.  :)
> 
> 
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:27 PM, Devin Prater  > wrote:
> 
>> I've had the studdering issue for a while now, but I'd always use Fred and 
>> forget about it.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:04 PM, Alex Hall > > wrote:
>> 
>>> Thanks for the confirmation, everyone. I never thought I'd say it, but I 
>>> plan on keeping Alex as my primary voice for the foreseeable future. Of 
>>> course, that's assuming some genius doesn't port ESpeak over to the Mac. :)
>>> 
>>> Odd that you're encountering suttering, Devin. Nuance voices would 
>>> definitely stutter and lag, even in the latest Yosemite, but Alex has no 
>>> such problems. In fact, VoiceOver with Alex is way more responsive, and I 
>>> often feel like I have that immediate response the Mac has been lacking for 
>>> so long. It used to be that a Windows screen reader had the immediacy down 
>>> - hit a key, hear speech, no delays at all - but now the Mac is getting 
>>> there too. Alex is the only voice to offer it, though; the Nuance voices 
>>> I've tried still have a bit of lag to them in all situations, and can lag 
>>> terribly every so often.
 On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:56 PM, Devin Prater >>> > wrote:
 
 The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a 
 little on the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on 
 the mac because of that.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss >>> > wrote:
 
> What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all the 
> time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when you try 
> to log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, when he 
> speaks the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth 
> clenched, or has something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, 
> and I've always thought it really weird that he sounds like that.
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall  > wrote:
> 
>> Hi all,
>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to 
>> the same conclusion I have.
>> 
>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
>> favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
>> couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching from 
>> Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the use of 
>> Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex used to 
>> be pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've always 
>> liked the breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words together, 
>> mispronounce syllables, and have other small problems that made him hard 
>> to understand, especially at higher speeds. The more I use him in 
>> Yosemite, though, the more I look for reasons to switch back to Ava, but 
>> the more those reasons allude me. Ava misses the period after certain 
>> words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says "capital" before uppercase 
>> letters, although that setting is disabled, and Alex doesn't; VoiceOver 
>> has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing up VO menus while 
>> using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such delays; and more.
>> 
>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" 
>> in that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly 
>> does. I mean "better" in that, compared to a few years ago, he's far 
>> clearer when speaking and makes far fewer mistakes. Maybe I'm 
>> misremembering, or maybe I'm the only one to notice, since the change 
>> was likely gradual and thus invisible to those who have used Alex all 
>> along. Either way, I'm interested in hearing your thoughts, and I'm more 
>> eager than ever to obtain a 64-bit iPhone so I can start u

Re: Am I nuts, or is Alex way better now?

[Faisal ali]

I really wish Apple would reduce the lag in some of the other voices as well. 
I’d love to be able to use Eva again.
Also, I just stick to Alex and have done so for a while since he use to be the 
only voice who could read emojis

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:16 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> Yes, this is Yosemite. As I said in my original message, speech synthesis is 
> one of the most subjective things about accessibility software. For instance, 
> I'm in that crazy minority that love ESpeak and KeynoteGold.  
>> On Feb 9, 2015, at 12:01 AM, Traci Duncan > > wrote:
>> 
>> I take it, this new Alex is in Yosimity only?  I have consistently used 
>> Compact Samantha on my Mac.  I have mostly found Alex difficult to 
>> understand after long periods of reading.  He seems to blur his words 
>> together.  I was using him on my iPad mini for a while, but ended up going 
>> back to trusty Compact Samantha.
>> 
>> When I upgrade to Yosimity, maybe I’ll give Alex another whirl.  :)
>> 
>> Traci
>> PS. Compact Samantha says OS X correctly.  As in OS Ten.  :)
>> 
>> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:27 PM, Devin Prater > > wrote:
>> 
>>> I've had the studdering issue for a while now, but I'd always use Fred and 
>>> forget about it.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:04 PM, Alex Hall >> > wrote:
>>> 
 Thanks for the confirmation, everyone. I never thought I'd say it, but I 
 plan on keeping Alex as my primary voice for the foreseeable future. Of 
 course, that's assuming some genius doesn't port ESpeak over to the Mac. :)
 
 Odd that you're encountering suttering, Devin. Nuance voices would 
 definitely stutter and lag, even in the latest Yosemite, but Alex has no 
 such problems. In fact, VoiceOver with Alex is way more responsive, and I 
 often feel like I have that immediate response the Mac has been lacking 
 for so long. It used to be that a Windows screen reader had the immediacy 
 down - hit a key, hear speech, no delays at all - but now the Mac is 
 getting there too. Alex is the only voice to offer it, though; the Nuance 
 voices I've tried still have a bit of lag to them in all situations, and 
 can lag terribly every so often.
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:56 PM, Devin Prater  > wrote:
> 
> The only thing I don't like is that Alex seems to studder and skip a 
> little on the mac, but he doesn't do that on the iPhone. So I use Fred on 
> the mac because of that.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:59 PM, Jessica Moss  > wrote:
> 
>> What words did you find he ran together?  I use him as my default all 
>> the time, and only thing I've found that sounds really weird, is when 
>> you try to log in anywhere and go to the usual "remember me," checkbox, 
>> when he speaks the "remember me," he sounds like he either has his teeth 
>> clenched, or has something in his mouth, which always makes me cringe, 
>> and I've always thought it really weird that he sounds like that.
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 7:41 PM, Alex Hall > > wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> First, yes, this is about a speech synthesizer, and will thus be very 
>>> subjective. I wanted to see, though, if anyone else might have come to 
>>> the same conclusion I have.
>>> 
>>> I got a Mac in the days of Lion, and quickly switched to the Vocalizer 
>>> voices (Serena or Lee, mostly). When we got new ones in Mavericks, I 
>>> favored Ava, and she is still among the best voices I know of, except a 
>>> couple from Ivona. In testing things for Yosemite, I kept switching 
>>> from Ava to Alex, just to see if any problems were being caused by the 
>>> use of Nuance voices. I accidentally made a startling discovery: Alex 
>>> used to be pretty bad a few years ago, but now, he's quite good. I've 
>>> always liked the breathing thing, but Alex would constantly run words 
>>> together, mispronounce syllables, and have other small problems that 
>>> made him hard to understand, especially at higher speeds. The more I 
>>> use him in Yosemite, though, the more I look for reasons to switch back 
>>> to Ava, but the more those reasons allude me. Ava misses the period 
>>> after certain words, like "app", Alex doesn't; Ava says "capital" 
>>> before uppercase letters, although that setting is disabled, and Alex 
>>> doesn't; VoiceOver has delays when opening the VO Utility or bringing 
>>> up VO menus while using Nuance voices, but with Alex, I find no such 
>>> delays; and more.
>>> 
>>> So, is it just me, or has Alex gotten way better? I don't mean "better" 
>>> in that VoiceOver runs faster while using Alex, although it certainly 
>>> does. I mean "better" in that, 

Re: Numbers Question

[Caitlyn Furness]

Thanks.

Caitlyn

> On Feb 8, 2015, at 9:08 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> Yes, kind of.
> 
> You can go to the bottom of the table, assuming your data extends to the 
> bottom, by either pressing VO shift right arrow, or by pressing command down 
> arrow to go to the bottom of the current column.
> You have to be very careful with the latter command though, because its right 
> next to the option down arrow, and that command will insert a new row below 
> the current row. Likewise option right and left arrows insert columns to the 
> right and left of the current column. 
> I do that a lot when I’m tired and it can tend to mess up your spreadsheets.
> 
> Anyway, command up down right and left arrows move to the extreme top bottom 
> right or left edge of the table. Once at the bottom of the table you can VO 
> arrow right or left to get to the desired column.
> 
> It’s not like excel where the data is stored in regions and there are special 
> key combos for going to the first, last cell of the region etc. All the data 
> is stored in individual self-contained tables that you set up so each table 
> is its own region in a sense.
> Unfortunately, if a data range does not extend to the top or bottom of a 
> column, there are no VO keys that will get you to the last data item. you 
> either go to the top or bottom, no in-between. Its not a big deal though, you 
> just have to set up your tables and arrange your data so that its not an 
> issue.
> 
> 
>> On Feb 8, 2015, at 6:16 PM, Caitlyn Furness  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> So, is there a way for vo to get to the last cell with data when you reopen 
>> it?
>> Thanks,
>> Cait
>> 
>>> On Jan 31, 2015, at 6:07 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Emilio,
>>> I use Numbers now on a daily basis and it has completely replaced  Excel 
>>> for all my spreadsheet work. In a lot of ways it is easier and more 
>>> accessible than excel with JAWS. The big thing that you’ll have to get used 
>>> to coming from Excel is the way numbers handles data. In excel, a sheet is 
>>> one large grid of cells that you can organize your data on in the form of 
>>> lists, tables, etc. Then you navigate around the sheet to move to your 
>>> various data lists and tables.
>>> 
>>> In numbers, you don’t have one big open sheet with a vast array of cells. 
>>> Instead you place data objects on a “canvas”  and store your data in those 
>>> objects. These objects are usually in the form of tables which act much 
>>> like a list in excel. I hope that makes sense.
>>> 
>>> you expand and contract the size of the tables as needed to accommodate new 
>>> data rows and columns. You can have up to five header rows, header columns 
>>> and footer rows along with unlimited data rows and columns in a table, and 
>>> numbers does a good job of automatically keeping everything organized. 
>>> Also, Working with formulas is a pleasure once you get the hang of the 
>>> formula editor. 
>>> 
>>> I don’t know of any tutorials, but a good thorough reading of the help 
>>> system, and referring to it often along with your existing knowledge of 
>>> spreadsheeting will get you up and running. Spend some time just 
>>> experimenting with setting up tables and doing simple formula work for a 
>>> while before trying to convert your excel stuff over to numbers.
>>> 
>>> Like I said, I was a die-hard Excel user but I actually like numbers better 
>>> now. It handles everything I can throw at it and now all my Excel 
>>> spreadsheets are converted over to numbers tables. (of course, I had to 
>>> tweet things quite a bit to make that happen)
>>> 
>>> For $20 I don’t think you can go wrong. Just be prepared to spend some time 
>>> on the learning curve. 
>>> 
>>> Numbers is at least, if not more accessible with VO than is Excel with 
>>> Jaws. It just has some different data storage concepts that you need to 
>>> understand.
>>> Good Luck
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jan 30, 2015, at 11:08 AM, Emilio Hernandez 
  wrote:
 
 Hello everyone,
 
 Does anyone know of a good voiceover tutorial that could usher me along 
 using Numbers?
 I want to give this program a fair shake if it will be comparable to using 
 Excel.
 
 Thanks for any help anyone can provide.
 
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