Re: [Mailman-Users] individual moderation notices stopped suddenly
A new question about the same list: Can a submitted e-mail, stupidly deleted by list owner (me) through the list administration web interface, be somehow reconstructed if the option "Forward messages (individually) to: [owner address]" was previously checked and the resulting e-mail-to-owner still exists? There is no single-message notification to owner because this one was held only through "emergency moderation." Shell access with root privileges is available, and I've already wasted some time there trying to reconstruct a heldmsg-*.pck file by copying one for another message and trying to substitute data from the deleted message. This doesn't seem to create anything mailman is willing to use (unsurprisingly, since I don't understand mailman's internal data storage). -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] individual moderation notices stopped suddenly
I may have just figured out the key difference between posts for which I get single moderation notices and those for which I don't. Some of my subscribers are set to individual moderation, and for them I get the single-post notices. Then the whole list was more recently set to "emergency moderation," and there are no single-post notices for posts that are moderated for that reason only. I suppose this means that the only way to get immediate notification of every single post is to set all subscribers to moderated status? -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
[Mailman-Users] individual moderation notices stopped suddenly
Currently running Mailman 2.1.9 with a low-volume moderated list called kuenning-relati...@qhpress.org. I'm supposed to receive notifications of posts to be moderated at kuenning-relatives-ow...@qhpress.org, both as single notifications as the posts come in and as daily batch notifications (normally at 8:00 AM) if there are any accumulated posts from the day before. On Aug. 31 I received, as usual, a single-post notification, > Subject: Kuenning-Relatives post from [user@domain] requires approval which I acted on promptly. On Sept. 1 at 8:00 AM I received a daily summary notification, > Subject: 1 Kuenning-Relatives moderator request(s) waiting covering one post for which there had _not_ been a single-post notification (not the above post but a reply to it). Again this morning, Sept. 3, I got another summary, > Subject: 4 Kuenning-Relatives moderator request(s) waiting covering 4 posts for _none_ of which there had been any single-post notification. This sudden and unexpected loss of the immediate single-post notifications naturally makes it harder to moderate the posts in a timely fashion. No changes were made to the list or the mailman setup during the relevant time period. Where should I look in the mailman logs for clues about what's wrong? I tried cd-ing to the log directory (/var/log/mailman) and grepping for the notification address kuenning-relatives-ow...@qhpress.org, but nothing turned up. P.S. I know I'd be better off if I could upgrade from 2.1.9 to something that can cope with DMARC, but this is a Plesk setup and I'm afraid to mess with it for fear of breaking something. Any advice about this would be welcome but isn't the main subject of this query. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Changing MTAs on Mailman box
On 11/23/2016 9:31 AM, Bryan Carbonnell wrote: ... I'll find a proper Postfix mailing list to ask the stupid Postfix questions. ... If you find one, could you tell this list where it is? The one I found a few years ago, postfix-us...@yahoogroups.com, hasn't had any messages since July 2014. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Expressions to reduce spam
On 11/13/2016 5:17 PM, Cyndi Norwitz wrote: My latest failure is: ^[^@]+@(.*\.)*\.top$ It looks like what fails here is that the expression requires two dots before "top": some...@something..top would be caught but not some...@something.top. So try this: ^[^@]+@(.*\.)*top$ Or probably better: ^[^@]+@[^@]+\.top$ -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Many users unsubscribed at once (not by me)
On 12/13/2015 5:14 AM, Hal wrote: Seeing that 17 out of those 18 unsubscribed messages were sent from Hotmail I can only assume the above was what happened. [etc] This sounds as if Hotmail has joined the villainous club formerly composed only of Yahoo and AOL, publishing a DMARC policy of "p=reject". Can anyone else confirm that this has happened? (Despite all the work Mark has put into updating Mailman 2.1.x to deal automatically with the DMARC problem, I'm still handling it by putting Yahoo and AOL users on moderation and manually wrapping their posts. I do this because I'm not sure I can successfully upgrade Mailman on a Plesk system that I don't really understand; and it's feasible because I have only two very low-volume lists. I guess I now have to do the same with Hotmail users?) -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Many users unsubscribed at once (not by me)
On 12/13/2015 12:01 PM, Laura Creighton wrote: Have I more or less understood it correctly? No. Let us say you have 5 users on your list, us...@aol.com, us...@aol.com, us...@aol.com us...@aol.com and us...@aol.com. us...@aol.com posts a piece of mail to your list. mailman tries to deliver to user2, user3, user4 and user5 @ aol.com aol says "drop dead, we don't talk to you because of our DMARC policy" mail to user2 user3 user4 and user5 bounces. Their bounce count is incremented. But this account is still incomplete. Besides what AOL does with the attempted deliveries to user2, user3, user4, and user5, you also get problems with delivery to users on a lot of other domains. The reason is that some other domains automatically consult AOL to see what to do with mail that claims to come from us...@aol.com but didn't reach them directly from an AOL server. They find that AOL has published a DMARC policy of "p=reject", and they obediently follow AOL's instruction to reject the post. So it bounces not only for the other AOL users (2 through 5) but for a lot of users on miscellaneous other domains. The problem originates with AOL's DMARC policy but creates bounces in delivery attempts to users on many other domains because those domains have decided to respect AOL's published "p=reject" policy. And Hal's report suggests that this is now happening not only with AOL and Yahoo (which started this practice in April 2014) but with messages originating on Hotmail as well. Can anyone check that Hotmail has published a "p=reject" DMARC policy? -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] The right way to reply to a mailing list
On 3/21/2015 8:52 PM, William Bagwell wrote: On Saturday 21 March 2015, Al Black wrote: Although the ideal solution is obviously users changing their behaviour and or MUAs, I've wondered whether an auto-trim function within mailman would make sense (for digest users...) Yes! For every one, not just digest users. And it should default to removing all but one single level of quoted text (regardless of top or bottom posting) and be *user* setable to none removed or all quoted text removed. Settable by which user? The sender or the recipient? And wouldn't a default of removing all but one level of quoted text make nonsense of some posts? E.g. in the passage above, one needs the inner quotation to know what the outer quotation refers to. It seems to me correct editing of quotation sequences requires human thought, not just mechanical text manipulation. Even though some people expect their computers to think for them. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Mailman Subscribers Management
On 7/6/2014 10:01 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote: see the 'Find member' help link for documentation of the regular expression syntax. This link currently gets a 404 File Not Found error. Incidentally I find by experiment that neither a star (as mentioned by the OP) nor the regular expression ^.*@.*$ succeeds in showing all members of a list in my Mailman 2.1.9 installation. The star by itself gets Error: Bad regular expression: * (not surprising) and the regular expression (or the simpler @) gets only a list of the A's (except in a list that's so small it shows its whole membership automatically in the web interface). A more restrictive search term (such as @yahoo) does work but of course doesn't find all members. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Formatting the Welcome Message
On 6/11/2014 11:39 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote: You can put things like *this is bold* in the message and some MUAs will understand that the text between the asterisks is to be rendered in a bold font. Similarly /italic/ and _underlined_. However, Thunderbird, which I use, tries to do this *but fails* when the begin/end markers occur on separate lines. Thus _this is important_ will be underlined in Thunderbird, _but this is also important_ will not (at least if the line break falls within the markers, as it did when I tested this by sending it to myself). I suppose one could work around this _by putting extra markers_ _at the end of the first line and the beginning of the second_. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] 2.1.18 internal documentation suggestions
(Despite the subject line, this follows up a digression by correcting some mistaken information about an e-mail attack on AOL.) On 5/2/2014 12:33 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: BTW, that blog [http://onlinegroups.net/blog/2014/05/01/dmarc-taking-responsibility-sending-group-email/] also says The attackers succeeded in accessing about 20% of AOL users’ email accounts and obtaining details of their contacts. I hope that means that AOL is now down to the 100 Stupidest On-Line Americans, of whom 20 were fooled But I digress. What it actually means is that onlinegroups.net miscopied the percentage from the AOL blog! The figure given by AOL is 2%. (Discovered because I'm a compulsive looker-up of sources) -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Excessive bounces to list members on my list
On 4/30/2014 9:20 AM, Larry Finch wrote: They are also rewriting From: headers in outgoing googlegroups posts whose original From: address is in a domain with DMARC p=reject. Is yahoo doing the same thing for yahoo groups? Yahoo doesn’t have to. Mail from a Yahoo group already has a Yahoo domain in the From field - the group address. Yahoo doesn't have to, but not for that reason. Yahoo groups don't put the Yahoo domain into the From line. They leave the original sender's address there (whether it's a Yahoo address or not). Or at least that's how they were handling it the last time anyone posted to a Yahoo group I'm subscribed to, though that was before this DMARC p=reject business started. I think the reason Yahoo groups don't have to rewrite the From line is that even if the original sender uses an @yahoo address, passing the message through a Yahoo groups server won't break the DMARC tests because it's still a yahoo server and therefore aligns with the original From address. Or so I understand it: Mark or somebody correct me if I'm wrong? But now I wonder what happens if a user with an @aol address posts to a Yahoo group. Will it run afoul of AOL's p=reject policy? If I still had an AOL address I'd be tempted to try this just to see what happens. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and Bellsouth, etc.
On 4/16/2014 12:51 PM, Lindsay Haisley wrote: What I'm advising list admins here, which puts a band-aid on the problem, is to put all yahoo.com subscribers on moderation, effectively making them read-only subscriptions. Also go through your membership list and clear any nomail disablements with a [B] beside them. We're also advising yahoo.com list subscribers to get a Gmail account (as free and easy to get as a Yahoo account) Query: On a very low-traffic mailing list (i.e. one where the list admin doesn't think it too much trouble), would it be a reasonable workaround for the list admin to paste the content of a message-to-be-moderated (i.e. one From: a yahoo address) into a new message _of his/her own_ and send _that_ to the list? This message could include the original From: address _in its body text_ (not its headers) along with a brief reference to the yahoo problem to explain the unusual format. From what I've read here so far, I think this would succeed in avoiding the usual yahoo-generated problems. However, I can foresee a couple of drawbacks (besides the extra work for list admins): 1. Other subscribers replying to the message will get MUA-generated text saying Larry List-Admin wrote instead of Sonia Subscriber wrote. Those who pay attention and take a little trouble can change that before clicking Send, but many won't. 2. Similarly, other subscribers wanting to reply privately will send their replies to Larry List-Admin instead of Sonia Subscriber if they aren't careful (and some of them won't be). The list admin can forward these replies, but in a few cases they may contain confidential material that the admin shouldn't have seen. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and Bellsouth, etc.
On 4/16/2014 1:57 PM, Larry Kuenning wrote: Query: On a very low-traffic mailing list (i.e. one where the list admin doesn't think it too much trouble), would it be a reasonable workaround for the list admin to paste the content of a message-to-be-moderated (i.e. one From: a yahoo address) into a new message _of his/her own_ and send _that_ to the list? This message could include the original From: address _in its body text_ (not its headers) along with a brief reference to the yahoo problem to explain the unusual format. I've since thought of a third difficulty besides the two I mentioned. If the post-to-be-moderated is itself a reply to an earlier post, then mailman's archive threading will be broken unless the list moderator goes to the trouble of setting up the substitute message as a reply to the same earlier post. (And of course one must delete all the stuff one's MUA wants to insert, as that will already be provided in the message-to-be-moderated.) Is this correct? -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] DMARC and Bellsouth, etc.
On 4/16/2014 4:51 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote (about my suggestion of manually moderating posts from Yahoo users): But what you are suggesting is essentially what the Wrap Message option introduced as a site option in 2.1.16 and expanded in 2.1.18 does. Well, yes. But: -- if you're working with an earlier Mailman version (I have 2.1.9), -- if upgrading Mailman might be difficult (mine was pre-installed under Plesk, which probably implies some unknown tweaking), -- if you're a novice at writing and debugging Python scripts, -- and if your site has *extremely* low traffic (I have 2 lists with a total of 20 messages in the past year, and only 5 Yahoo users, who are usually lurkers), then you might find it easier to live with the manual moderating task than to try to make changes to an otherwise well-working system. (At least in the short run while waiting to see what else develops.) -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] converting an e-mail discussion to a list (with existing archive)
On 2/3/2014 3:11 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote: Steps 3. through 6. could be more easily accomplished by the following: 1) Gather all the emails into a single *nix mbox format file. Depending on your email client, this may already exist as the folder containing the desired messages. 2) copy that mbox file to /path/to/mailman/archives/private/listname.mbox/listname.mbox 3) run Mailman's bin/arch --wipe listname Before running step 3 it might be a good idea to verify that all the messages in your mbox file have correct Date: lines. Incorrect Date lines will cause Mailman to arrange messages in the wrong order. Date lines can be incorrect if the original sender's MUA was misconfigured. If a wrong timestamp is given, Mailman will accept it and order the messages accordingly. If a message has no timestamp at all, Mailman will order that message as if it had been sent at the moment when Mailman is indexing the archive. At least this is what happened for me when I tried a somewhat similar project. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Ordering of messages in the moderation queue by date?
My 2 cents for Mark Sapiro's question: OK. Since this may be more widely used, here's a question? The current summary groups all the messages from a single sender into one 'box'. If we sort the boxes[1] by time, should multiple messages from a single address be in separate, time sorted boxes or should they still be grouped in a single box, and if the latter should the boxes be time sorted by oldest or newest in the box. The original post spoke of a list where all messages are moderated, and conversations are long. A moderator who is trying to track the progress of a long conversation (while perhaps moderating for civility) would probably want to see all messages in strict time order, oldest first, without grouping by author. I would want it that way on my lists if they had enough traffic to make manual sorting tedious. This could be especially important in cases where writers are sending off-list copies to each other, and thus sometimes replying to posts that haven't even reached the list in moderated form yet. You don't want to make a moderation decision about a reply before deciding what to do about the post being replied to. (And of course time order must handle time zones accurately, e.g. a message sent from London at 1:00 am Wednesday should precede one sent from New York at 10:00 pm Tuesday. I mention this because I _think_ I remember running into a problem with this when archiving old messages from a pre-Mailman incarnation of a list.) -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Hello all - mailman down after power failure and hard shutdown
On 6/8/2013 6:43 AM, Tanstaafl wrote: Ok, we had a power failure, and apparently my UPS thought it had more time left than it did, as the UPS shut down before it shut down the system. Everything is back up and running, and postfix is running fine for all other mail, except list/mailman mail. Is mailman possibly not running? Try this: ps -A | grep mailmanctl If that gives blank output, try this: /usr/lib/mailman/bin/mailmanctl start (This was the solution for me when I had a similar problem a month and a half ago. I would like to know where to plug this in so it happens automatically on reboot. That should be an elementary question but I'm still not familiar with all these sysadmin tasks.) -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Hello all - mailman down after power failure and hard shutdown
On 6/8/2013 8:52 AM, Tanstaafl wrote: On 2013-06-08 8:10 AM, Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org wrote: Is mailman possibly not running? Try this: ps -A | grep mailmanctl If that gives blank output, try this: /usr/lib/mailman/bin/mailmanctl start Not blank - but what does the question mark mean? # ps -A | grep mailmanctl 2600 ?00:00:00 mailmanctl Leaving out the grep to get the header (ps -C mailmanctl would have been better to start with) I see that that column is headed TTY. I guess the question mark means the process is not tied to a terminal and so will continue running even if all users log out. Which is the behavior you want, so the problem must be elsewhere. Thanks for the assist - any other ideas? Now you need help from somebody who actually knows how Mailman works. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
On 5/9/2013 10:00 PM, David Benfell wrote: It looks like the relevant commands are postalias (which I've never used, at least by that name) and postmap. Thanks! Actually I ran across postalias and postmap a couple of hours before I saw your post, but it's nice to have this confirmed by someone else. (Actually Mark Sapiro also mentioned them, but I think I saw yours first.) Both of these programs can, I think, be used to create missing text files; the difference seems to be that postalias inserts the colons needed for alias files and postmap just uses whitespace. To create the text file aliases from the db file aliases.db, the command is: postalias -s aliases aliases -- where the extension .db is not mentioned on either side of the redirect but is assumed by postalias on the left side. If you explicitly mention aliases.db then postalias fails and complains that aliases.db.db is missing. The same syntax works for postmap. Both programs have reasonable man pages. More on the results in an upcoming reply to Mark Sapiro. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
On 5/9/2013 9:43 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
There should be both an aliases (plain text) and an aliases.db
(database) and likewise for virtual(.db) and transport(.db). The .db
files are made from the plain text files by the Postfix commands
postalias in the case of aliases and postmap in the case of the others.
If those plain text files aren't in the same directory, they are
somewhere, but I can't imagine why they're not there. You might try
locate or find to find them.
They're not there, or anywhere else. Or rather they weren't there until
I created them using postalias as pointed out by David Benfell.
I'm guessing this means that Plesk creates the .db files directly
without using text files. Ugh. Now I wonder, if I use postalias to
update the .db files after editing my newly created text files, will
Plesk eventually overwrite my work, say the next time I create a mailbox
or an e-mail alias? I guess the way to find out is to try.
mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=R user=mailman:mailman
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman ${nexthop} ${user} ${recipient}
OK, so Plesk has it's own transport for Mailman, possibly related to the
(hated by me) postfix_to_mailman.py http://wiki.list.org/x/EYDt
So we need to see the aliases, virtual and transport files in order to
know exactly what addresses are delivered via the 'mailman' transport
and why the 'mailman' list addresses aren't among them.
The aliases file tells us nothing to the point (except that it contains
one example of delivery to a program, which I had tried unsuccessfully
to do in /etc/aliases -- now I know where to try again).
The transport file shows that Plesk's transport for Mailman is being
applied to my successfully working lists but not to the site list:
# grep test transport
t...@qhpress.orgmailman:post
test-ad...@qhpress.org mailman:admin
test-boun...@qhpress.orgmailman:bounces
test-le...@qhpress.org mailman:leave
test-ow...@qhpress.org mailman:owner
test-requ...@qhpress.orgmailman:request
test-unsubscr...@qhpress.orgmailman:unsubscribe
test-conf...@qhpress.orgmailman:confirm
test-j...@qhpress.org mailman:join
test-subscr...@qhpress.org mailman:subscribe
# grep 'mailman[@-]' transport
[no output]
The virtual file shows virtually the same thing:
# grep test virtual
t...@qhpress.orgt...@qhpress.org
test-ad...@qhpress.org test-ad...@qhpress.org
test-boun...@qhpress.orgtest-boun...@qhpress.org
test-le...@qhpress.org test-le...@qhpress.org
test-ow...@qhpress.org test-ow...@qhpress.org
test-requ...@qhpress.orgtest-requ...@qhpress.org
test-unsubscr...@qhpress.orgtest-unsubscr...@qhpress.org
test-conf...@qhpress.orgtest-conf...@qhpress.org
test-j...@qhpress.org test-j...@qhpress.org
test-subscr...@qhpress.org test-subscr...@qhpress.org
# grep mailman virtual
mailman-l...@qhpress.orgmailman-loop@localhost.localdomain
My current idea is to add mailman lines similar to all the test
lines in transport and virtual and then update transport.db and
virtual.db with postmap. (After first making backups of the current
forms!) If this creates valid files, will Postfix start using the new
versions immediately, or do I need to do something else to draw its
attention to the changes?
Failing
that, I wonder if it would do any good to delete the site list from the
command line and recreate it using Plesk (which seems to produce usable
lists on this system). But can this be done safely? Doesn't it say
somewhere that Mailman won't run if the site list doesn't exist? (It
would have to go out of existence briefly in order to recreate it.)
You could do that and as long as my diabolical conjecture is not in
play, it should work. It is safe as long as it doesn't take forever and
isn't done when cron/mailpasswds is running as that 'sends from' the
site list and requires it.
I see cron/mailpasswds is supposed to run on the first of each month.
It wasn't done this month (which was the only opportunity so far). I
guess that was because it couldn't use the site list.
--
Larry Kuenning
la...@qhpress.org
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Re: [Mailman-Users] [SOLVED] no mail delivery to site list
On 5/10/2013 9:03 AM, I wrote: My current idea is to add mailman lines similar to all the test lines in transport and virtual and then update transport.db and virtual.db with postmap. (After first making backups of the current forms!) I tried this and it works: I can now post to the site list. If this creates valid files, will Postfix start using the new versions immediately, or do I need to do something else to draw its attention to the changes? After updating transport.db and virtual.db, and before posting, I ran newaliases just in case, with the result that now I don't know whether that step was necessary. I'm guessing this means that Plesk creates the .db files directly without using text files. Ugh. Now I wonder, if I use postalias to update the .db files after editing my newly created text files, will Plesk eventually overwrite my work, say the next time I create a mailbox or an e-mail alias? I guess the way to find out is to try. I tried this too, creating a new alias for my catchall box after my first successful post. A second post arrived with no trouble, and examining the .db files with postmap shows they are as they should be. So at any rate Plesk doesn't throw away data it finds in those files that it didn't put there. Thanks for all your help! -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
[Mailman-Users] Importing old archives into Mailman
This is not a request for help but a report of experience in case someone else finds it helpful. I recently migrated some old mailing lists into Mailman. They had previously run on different software (my own), and at first I assumed I'd need to keep two sets of archives, putting the old ones on my regular website (not the lists. subdomain created by Mailman). Then I saw in the FAQ that it was possible to edit list archives. The emphasis there was on deleting posts, but I thought, if this works for deleting posts it should also work for adding them. Fortunately my old archives were already in mbox format. Or rather, almost in mbox format. The old incarnation of my lists had been on a server where I had a low usage quota, so I had been downloading all archives over a year old and storing them on my home computer. In doing so, I had passed them through a word processor macro to do some minimal cleanup, which was chiefly to remove the that mbox files put in front of body lines beginning with From (From the historian's viewpoint, one subscriber wrote). Undoing that change was easy enough, but what I didn't notice was that word wrap had gotten imposed on some very long header lines (such as DomainKey-Signatures:). This damaged the headers and made them appear to end sooner, with some of their data falling through into the message body. Usually, when this happened, the Date: line would be in the part that fell through. Mailman seems to rely on this line when sorting posts by date (it does _not_ rely on the physical order of messages in the mbox file). In the absence of a Date: line in the header, Mailman seems to use the current time (when it is indexing the archive). To fix this I had to go back through the imported mbox files and clean up the headers. Since I was doing this in vi over an SSH connection and couldn't see clearly whether there was a newline character or only a line that was too long for the screen, I decided the safest method was just to delete all those overlong headers. They shouldn't be needed in the archive anyway. (The Received: and Delivered-To: lines had long since been removed by my program, when it saved out a week's files and started a new archive.) I also found some Date: lines that had been mistaken from the beginning. One of my subscribers wrote that he had just switched to a Mac in order to clear a Windows-based virus out of his mailbox. Somehow his Macintosh had its system date set to August 27, 1956! Mailman made this the first post on the list, followed by a silence of over 40 years. I went back and corrected the date as well as I could and then indexed the archive all over again. Moral: You can import old mbox files to a Mailman archive, but be sure to clean up the headers before you generate the index. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] Importing old archives into Mailman
On 5/10/2013 3:18 PM, Barry S. Finkel wrote: The in front of From in message bodies IS REQUIRED. Of course it's required -- as long as the file is serving as a real mbox. That's why I put the back in before having Mailman index the files for the archives of the new lists. (Undoing that change was easy enough is how I put it in my first post about this.) I had started taking out the long ago when I thought the only future use for these files would be as human-readable text files, where the would be perceived as clutter or as a mistaken attempt to indicate quotation. There's no law that says what was once an mbox file has to remain an mbox file forever if nobody's going to read it except in a notepad or word processor. Which is what I expected at the time. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
- n n - - pipe
flags=Fq. user=foo argv=/usr/local/sbin/bsmtp -f $sender $nexthop
$recipient
plesk_virtual unix - n n - - pipe flags=DORhu user=popuser:popuser
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-local -f ${sender} -d ${recipient} -p
/var/qmail/mailnames
mailman unix - n n - - pipe flags=R user=mailman:mailman
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-mailman ${nexthop} ${user} ${recipient}
127.0.0.1:10025 inet n n n - - spawn user=mhandlers-user
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-queue 127.0.0.1 10027 before-queue
127.0.0.1:10026 inet n - n - - smtpd -o smtpd_client_restrictions= -o
smtpd_helo_restrictions= -o smtpd_sender_restrictions= -o
smtpd_recipient_restrictions=permit_mynetworks,reject -o
smtpd_data_restrictions= -o
receive_override_options=no_unknown_recipient_checks
127.0.0.1:10027 inet n n n - - spawn user=mhandlers-user
argv=/usr/lib64/plesk-9.0/postfix-queue 127.0.0.1 10026 before-remote
plesk_saslauthd unix y y n - 1 plesk_saslauthd status=5 listen=6
dbpath=/var/spool/postfix/plesk/passwd.db
smtps inet n - n - - smtpd -o smtpd_proxy_filter=127.0.0.1:10025 -o
smtpd_tls_wrappermode=yes
[ end of /etc/postfix/master.cf ]
Aside, please see the FAQs at http://wiki.list.org/x/tIA9 and
http://wiki.list.org/x/OIDD.
Yes, I saw these; that's why I wrote in my first post, I realize this
may conceivably be a Postfix issue, or even a Plesk issue, but I thought
someone here might be able to guess the answer.
I would most like to find out how to get into those .db files. Failing
that, I wonder if it would do any good to delete the site list from the
command line and recreate it using Plesk (which seems to produce usable
lists on this system). But can this be done safely? Doesn't it say
somewhere that Mailman won't run if the site list doesn't exist? (It
would have to go out of existence briefly in order to recreate it.)
--
Larry Kuenning
la...@qhpress.org
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
A few minutes ago I wrote: my site list does exist But mail doesn't get delivered to it My own guess, as far as it goes, is that the problem has something to do with this server being set up to host multiple virtual domains, and with the site list having been created by Network Solutions before I installed my own virtual domain. I think I've just found the problem. Doing a dumpdb on the site list and on one of my regular lists, I find that 'host_name' is different. So probably all I need to know is how to get the correct name (the virtual domain name) into the list database where Mailman will find it. I'm still new to Mailman and Python, though I've done various other sorts of Unix programming (including writing my own software for the previous incarnation of my mailing lists, using shellscripts). -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
[Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
Unlike Francesco's problem, my site list does exist (it was given as part of the pre-installed Mailman on my Linux VPS from Network Solutions), and after some trouble I've gotten it to put its configuration pages at the right URL (lists.mydomain), to list me as the owner (instead of nore...@networksolutions.com), and to let me in with a password of my own devising. But mail doesn't get delivered to it. Mail to mailman@mydomain lands in my catchall mailbox, where all the spam for unknown users goes. This doesn't happen to my regular mailing lists, which I created on this server using Plesk (which came preinstalled). (These lists existed on my previous server but were managed by different mailing list software.) Only after setting up my regular lists did I find there was supposed to be a site list called mailman@mydomain. I realize this may conceivably be a Postfix issue, or even a Plesk issue, but I thought someone here might be able to guess the answer. My own guess, as far as it goes, is that the problem has something to do with this server being set up to host multiple virtual domains, and with the site list having been created by Network Solutions before I installed my own virtual domain. I've thought of deleting the existing site list and recreating it through Plesk, since I know that lists created through Plesk work. I'm reluctant to try this since it would create an interval when the site list doesn't exist at all, and I've read that Mailman refuses to operate at all under those conditions. Anyway I would rather know how to find whatever is misconfigured about the present site list. My VPS is running GNU/Linux kernel 2.6.18-028stab101.1 on some kind of x86_64 (data reported by uname). From the generic hardware name and the fact that they call it a VPS I suppose this is a virtual machine running on some more powerful kind of hardware. Thanks, -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
Oops, another self-reply: I think I've just found the problem. Doing a dumpdb on the site list and on one of my regular lists, I find that 'host_name' is different. Wrong. I was looking at an old dumpdb output file, from before I ran fix_url to get the configuration pages to show up. On rerunning dumpdb I find that host_name has been correct for a day or two now and the problem must be somewhere else. -- Larry Kuenning la...@qhpress.org -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] no mail delivery to site list
-1307, USA.
This module contains your site-specific settings.
From a brand new distribution it should be copied to mm_cfg.py. If you
already have an mm_cfg.py, be careful to add in only the new settings you
want. Mailman's installation procedure will never overwrite your mm_cfg.py
file.
The complete set of distributed defaults, with documentation, are in the
file
Defaults.py. In mm_cfg.py, override only those you want to change,
after the
from Defaults import *
line (see below).
Note that these are just default settings; many can be overridden via the
administrator and user interfaces on a per-list or per-user basis.
###
# Here's where we get the distributed defaults.
from Defaults import *
import pwd, grp
##
# Put YOUR site-specific settings below this line.
##
#Here's where we override shipped defaults with settings #
#suitable for the RPM package. #
MAILMAN_UID = pwd.getpwnam('mailman')[2]
MAILMAN_GID = grp.getgrnam('mailman')[2]
##
#Set URL and email domain names #
#
# Mailman needs to know about (at least) two fully-qualified domain
# names (fqdn)
#
# 1) the hostname used in your urls (DEFAULT_URL_HOST)
# 2) the hostname used in email addresses for your domain
(DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
#
# For example, if people visit your Mailman system with
# http://www.dom.ain/mailman; then your url fqdn is www.dom.ain,
# and if people send mail to your system via yourl...@dom.ain then
# your email fqdn is dom.ain. DEFAULT_URL_HOST controls the former,
# and DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST controls the latter. Mailman also needs to
# know how to map from one to the other (this is especially important
# if you're running with virtual domains). You use
# add_virtualhost(urlfqdn, emailfqdn) to add new mappings.
# Default to using the FQDN of machine mailman is running on.
# If this is not correct for your installation delete the following 5
# lines that acquire the FQDN and manually edit the hosts instead.
from socket import *
try:
fqdn = getfqdn()
except:
fqdn = 'mm_cfg_has_unknown_host_domains'
DEFAULT_URL_HOST = fqdn
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = fqdn
# Because we've overriden the virtual hosts above add_virtualhost
# MUST be called after they have been defined.
add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
##
# Put YOUR site-specific configuration below, in mm_cfg.py . #
# See Defaults.py for explanations of the values.#
# Note - if you're looking for something that is imported from mm_cfg,
but you
# didn't find it above, it's probably in Defaults.py.
add_virtualhost('lists.qhpress.org', 'qhpress.org')
-end mm_cfg.py-
(This is me again.) That last line was different until I changed it
just now; it was:
add_virtualhost('lists.qhpress.org')
which looks to me like it might have been the problem.
But maybe it wasn't. After changing it I've tried posting to the site
list again, with no luck. Repeated this after reloading Mailman, and
yet again after stopping and restarting Mailman -- still no luck. (At
least I didn't break the other lists in the process!) Does this file
have to be compiled before it works? I see a .pyc and a .pyo next to it
in the ~mailman/Mailman directory. I don't know anything yet about
compiling Python files.
If I had landed in this system after careful planning, probably I would
have learned more about Postfix and Mailman before starting to use it.
Unfortunately there was a disaster on my previous host which caused a
near-total e-mail delivery failure for about a week, and this prompted
me to jump into a new hosting solution as fast as I could. Hence this
help-what-do-I-do-now approach to learning how to use it.
Thanks for taking a look at this stuff!
--
Larry Kuenning
la...@qhpress.org
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