Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Aaron Mason]

On Thu, Aug 29, 2019 at 12:40 AM Mohamed salah
 wrote:
>
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

For most of my purposes, it Just Works(TM). The firewall rules are
user readable and easy to understand, most of the out of the box
software with configs follows the same easy-to-read scheme, and it
doesn't load anything out of the box that I don't need, it leaves that
decision to me and never insults my intelligence.  And those man
pages...

When I changed jobs and needed a service desk suite, I opted for
Request Tracker and rolled up a Hyper-V VM running OpenBSD 6.1.  Even
though no doco exists for this, I was able to make my way well enough
that I started to document my process as best I could on the httpd
GitHub repo wiki.

As a case study, at previous jobs I ran ManageEngine ServiceDesk Plus
on Windows Server, and the whole required 2GB of RAM minimum.  My
pokey little RT server has 512MB of RAM and it's all it has ever
needed.

-- 
Aaron Mason - Programmer, open source addict
I've taken my software vows - for beta or for worse

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Peter Nicolai Mathias Hansteen]

> 28. aug. 2019 kl. 16:32 skrev Mohamed salah :
> 
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
> 

You’ll find a bunch of testimonials over at runbsd.info , 
mine is at https://runbsd.info/people/pitrh.html 
, with the essence being I found a high 
quality, security oriented, well documented (as in everything has a man page) 
system where everything just made more sense than the systems I had encountered 
previously. That still stands, even after 20+ years and exposure to a lot of 
different systems and environments.

All the best,
Peter


—
Peter N. M. Hansteen, member of the first RFC 1149 implementation team
http://bsdly.blogspot.com/ http://www.bsdly.net/ http://www.nuug.no/
"Remember to set the evil bit on all malicious network traffic"
delilah spamd[29949]: 85.152.224.147: disconnected after 42673 seconds.






signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Raymond, David]

Why do I like openbsd?

I used linux for several decades and it has become harder and harder
to keep up with gratuitous changes and to keep my 20+ machines running
and updated.  The last straw was usb mounting being broken in the
linux kernel for 6 months.  Really!  The whole linux enterprise seems
to be spinning out of control as it gets jerked around by commercial
interests.

OpenBSD is easy to install and use and retains some of the delightful
simplicity of early days UNIX.  I can mostly get done what I need to
get done and I am working on the rest.  The emphasis on security in
this increasingly hostile digital world is certainly a plus as well.

Dave Raymond

On 1/10/20, Christopher Turkel  wrote:
> On Friday, January 10, 2020, Raul Miller  wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 10:41 AM Mohamed salah
>>  wrote:
>> > I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
>> > OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't
>> work
>> > fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>>
>> I wanted a machine with tcp and udp but which wasn't listening for rpc
>> requests, and OpenBSD was the quickest way for me to get there.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> --
>> Raul
>>
>>
> It’s the easiest OS I’ve ever used.
>


-- 
David J. Raymond
david.raym...@nmt.edu
http://physics.nmt.edu/~raymond

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Christopher Turkel]

On Friday, January 10, 2020, Raul Miller  wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 10:41 AM Mohamed salah
>  wrote:
> > I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> > OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't
> work
> > fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>
> I wanted a machine with tcp and udp but which wasn't listening for rpc
> requests, and OpenBSD was the quickest way for me to get there.
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Raul
>
>
It’s the easiest OS I’ve ever used.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Raul Miller]

On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 10:41 AM Mohamed salah
 wrote:
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

I wanted a machine with tcp and udp but which wasn't listening for rpc
requests, and OpenBSD was the quickest way for me to get there.

Thanks,

-- 
Raul

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Stanislav]

I consider my way as quite typical path to become OpenBSD-newbie. 
1.5 years ago I decided to remove Windows 10 from my home notebook. 

Why not Linux? I have own experience in using Linux distros for work/home
purposes on many machines. Actually Im not advanced but I pretend to have
the confident opinion.
At the first stage I made smth like table about well-known modern GNU\Linux
distros with the pros and cons. I hoped to catch optimal solution for
non-specific purposes. This approach failed due to classical "linux is a
mess". I finished the review deciding to install Debian if OpenBSD-try fails
on my notebook. 
Generally "Linux" is practically more convenient distro at the moment, but
there are bad trends in linux world too as I see. Second, If I need to
explain my final decision based on its esthetic component I declare that I
want the elegant system with own straight way according to my understanding.
I love holistic and consistent things. 

Why not FreeBSD? I was running it as desktop in 2007 on my home PC and I had
few episodes with maintaining it remotely and as half-dead body in DC.
Good modern system. It has own strong features and advantages. But none of
them helps to choose FreeBSD as desktop or laptop in 2018 without any
doubts. I think its true (IMHO) in 2020 too.
Finally, I observe smth like crisis in FreeBSD's growth. Its future is not
clear. Of course, future is not absolutely clear always and everywhere, but
Im sure you understand what I mean. Sorry, FreeBSD-people.

Let me stop to list rejected systems here. The full list of technical points
I compared is too boring. And, of course, small note is not good option to
tell why I reject each specific distro.

OpenBSD was just experiment. I wanted to test it. Now I stay with OpenBSD.
It is cool.

OK, so, this experiment has the result. I tend to call it positive. The
migration from Windows 10 to OpenBSD 6.4 completed successfully in short
time (week). I guarantee that the function volume and comfort have not
decreased dramatically. What I have got now as profit?
First of all, I think it is not correct when one writes similar report in
economic terms. OpenBSD project is not commercial. It is not product I
think. For me it is interesting project with strong basement consisted of
clear principles, strong team, long history, own community and clear future.
In Linux area we have got huge size of community, and for practical purposes
it is optimal to be with Linux, because scale helps user to find answers, it
provides wide spectra of software for every task. In OpenBSD users has got
not so rich economics. The obvious fact is "if you want your best system you
need to contribute and to do smth for the project". 
So, what is my profit (vs Windows)? 
I have old-school transparent OS: 
https://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#46 
https://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#45
https://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#61
My computer works fully on my own tasks; my data is only my data; unix-way;
correctness; proactive security; controlled reboot and update; I have not
extra and imposed stuff.  

I thank all participants of the OpenBSD project (developers, devops etc) and
all OpenBSD users.
I thank OpenBSD Foundation and its contributors for their help.

Disclaimer. I love Windows and I continue using it due to current work.
Windows is product for certain areas. OpenBSD and Windows are not
competitors. But OpenBSD is quite universal instrument and I hope to install
it instead of Windows soon where it is depends on me and if it is possible
technically and legally. The reason why I will do it is just desire to
increase experience for the project.

Few words additionally. To be honest I have to say that I use wi-fi via
usb-adapter because my on-board card doesn't work here. If you migrate
please check you hardware using available information. The situation is very
good, you have good chances to launch OpenBSD without appearing troubles.
Perhaps, the another option would be to build the best configuration for
your OpenBSD-PC. Share your experience !
  



-
Best Regards,
Stanislav Gilmulin
--
Sent from: http://openbsd-archive.7691.n7.nabble.com/openbsd-user-misc-f3.html

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[slackwaree]

‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐
On Friday, September 6, 2019 12:26 PM, Péter Bertalan Zoltán 
 wrote:

> Mohamed salah mohamed.a.sala...@gmail.com [2019-08-28 16:32:29 +0200]:
>
> > I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> > OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't
> > work fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

My number 1 motivation for moving to BSDs, in particular is the system(d) 
cancer in linux, what they forced down on our throats. It's a free world so you 
can use whatever OS you want.

I'm using OpenBSD since 4.x but only for servers and I loved it's clean design 
even at the 2.6 linux kernel series distros were a mess with tons of files (X 
server, extra libs, bloatware configs in etc) then imagine it Today when a 
basic Ubuntu installation with Gnome installs 8GB garbage or more on your hdd 
with so many security vulns in apps you have no idea what is installed anymore 
(70% you will pbly never use).

I was a hardcore Debian fan since potato with 2.2 kernel but since their recent 
decisions at Jessie with replacing the init system with that crapware made me 
uncomfortable using Debians. You can still remove it in Stretch but there are 
bloatware components which stay on your system even after and you cant remove 
it like systemd-udevd, and with Deb10 dropping the old init system it's clear 
to me Debian is going to the wrong direction and it is not a system I 
personally want to use anymore.

However OpenBSD and the other BSDs are still behind Linuxes in a lot of areas: 
eg multimedia, virtualization, hw compatibility. For example I use Vmware for 
tons of stuff, this is a product I don't want to abandon, will Vmware 
workstaion be supported on Obsd, pbly not so Obsd is a no go for me on my 
desktop computer and laptop but on my servers I systematically replace Debian 
and other linux based servers with BSD based ones.

When I do these migrations I always go with OpenBSD first and only choose 
another BSD if there is something OpenBSD can't do or not that good at doing 
for example:

-fileserver: obvious choice FreeBSD with ZFS
-mysql server, sorry if I'm wrong but using the exact same virtualization 
platform I always get degraded DB performance compared to fbsd or nbsd so I 
prefer using those for Mysql server
-gitlab: have you ever tried to install this on any BSD, kinda nightmare when 
it's a 1 click installer on a Debian system
-virtualization: already mentioned the lack of vmware support but does obsd 
support anything at all except its own vmm like virtualbox, I dont think so..
-multimedia: does it support kodi, I don't think so
-arm platforms compatibility: raspberry pi, orange pi, banana pi these all run 
linux fine, bsds are either unsupported or you can put it on with some hack, 
half of the stuff doesn't work and they even segfault
-gaming on it: forget it
...list would go on...

So OpenBSD and the other BSDs have a lot to improve but they are great reliable 
and secure server platforms.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Péter Bertalan Zoltán]

Mohamed salah  [2019-08-28 16:32:29 +0200]:
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't
> work fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

My journey was

Windows ---> ‘friendly Linux’ ---> ‘less friendly Linux’ ---> OpenBSD

I (sadly) grew up on using Windows and other MS products, but being
interested in computers I kept checking out Linux (Ubuntu) after a
while, but I always got fed up relatively quickly because things just
didn't work how they worked on Windows.

There was always something I had to mess around with, which I partly
enjoyed but at the same time it could be very frustrating (eg. somebody
asking me to copy a few images over from their phone only to discover
there's no such driver for Linux and spending two days trying to find
some solution or not being able to just run software everyone else was
running without problems on Windows, etc).

This made me dual boot after a while and often I just fell back to
Windows altogether. Then I chose to force myself to learn more about the
Linux world by trying out Arch Linux, which was arguably a bit more
challenging than say Ubuntu or Linux Mint. The quirks were *not* much
better though. Things broke, crashed or just didn't work at all.

Finally I stumbled upon some articles on OpenBSD around a year ago --
just at the right time because I think now my computing skills were
finally adequate and I started having a thing for privacy and FOSS at
that time. I decided to give it a try and I have zero regrets. It took a
little effort to familiarize myself with the differences (such as having
to use different command line options or different programs altogether),
but OpenBSD has taught me a lot and I am sure I still have a *lot* to
learn.

I can't say OpenBSD fixed all problems I had with computers though --
for example I can't use adb to connect to my Android phone and I am
unable to have UTF-8 characters outside X, but I am certain the benefits
overweight these tiny drawbacks. The defaults are indeed very sane, the
system is good to use out of the box. PF is absolutely wonderful.
Although I like experimenting with things, I like that basically
everything you might need is in the base system. Of course I must also
mention the legendary man pages. I didn't have random and sometimes
extremely infuriating crashes and my system never broke like a few
experiences I recall from Arch. I am very grateful for the developers
of OpenBSD and I am looking forward to contribute to it once I get to
that level. So if you are a contributor and are reading this, thank you!
:-)

PS sorry about the lengthy email, I hope it's not too inappropriate

-- 
Bertalan Z. Péter 
FB9B 34FE 3500 3977 92AE  4809 935C 3BEB 44C1 0F89

/"\
\ /ASCII Ribbon Campaign
 X   against HTML email & proprietary attachments
/ \www.asciiribbon.org

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[b2s2d]

On 2019-08-28 07:47, Raul Miller wrote:

I would fix the issue, or use something else to get that done or
abandon that project.

(I am not sure why you would imagine that using OpenBSD implies not
using other operating systems. It's *because* I use other operating
systems that I like using OpenBSD.)

Thanks,



So many good points brought up.

Along with all that has been mentioned, I use OpenBSD because there are 
no surprises when you install a service. The service is not started 
until you start it. Even if it started inadvertently, the config will 
have 'sane' defaults and not get you breached.


My OpenBSD start:
I was running Untangle (based on Debian Linux) back in 2009 while 
looking for a PC-based router of some sort. I read Dru Lavigne's 'BSD 
Hacks' and found some things that I wanted my router to do using OpenBSD 
that Linux couldn't do (at least without recompiling the kernel). After 
that I was onto OpenBSD 4.6 with some early 'bump in the wire' devices 
in front of my Linux firewalls. I also read Michael W. Lucas OpenBSD 
books - lots of info.


Then around 2010 I started using only OpenBSD as my firewall. I studied 
and built the pf rules up (thanks Peter N.M. Hansteen) so that I had 
confidence in placing OpenBSD on the open Internet as my only 
protection.


These days I use only OpenBSD for all my server builds. This includes 
router/firewall (pf), http webserver (in base), and OpenVPN servers. If 
there is anything I place on the open Internet - it is an OpenBSD build. 
No other.


Truthfully, you'll never know how good OpenBSD is until you try it. 
That's what I did.


Thank you.

Zann (at zonbie-dot-net)

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[john slee]

User since ~2001 here, albeit intermittently. My first encounter with it
was where it was used — mostly to run Postfix, Squid and BIND, if my hazy
memory is trustworthy — by a private company who was effectively an ISP for
many Australian Federal Government departments.

I think the aspect I like most is the gradual, carefully-considered but
also inexorable flow of improvements that may individually look small, but,
when viewed collectively, represent a huge improvement.

A [software developer] colleague recently said, in a different context, "a
big-bang release only guarantees a big bang". Seems appropriate here. I
might have missed one but I can't remember a "big bang" OpenBSD release.
That's a good thing.

John

On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 at 00:32, Mohamed salah 
wrote:

> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[jungle boogie]

Thus said Mohamed Salah  on Wed, 28 Aug 
2019 16:32:29 +0200

I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?



See stories here: https://runbsd.info/people/

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Normen Wohner]

That is a long story,
I first switched to BSD around 2010,
I was just a kid with a Netbook
running on a VIA C7-M.
I was pissed at lack of open source drivers
and wanted to code my own
for the on board graphics.
The Ubuntu and general Linux boards
back then where full of script kiddies
ridiculing anyone with any perceived
lack of knowledge to oblivion.
Even when they them selves lacked the knowledge.

This hostility, combined with the utter lack of
documentation among the Linux Distros,
drove me away from Linux.
I came to FreeBSD, then Dragonfly,
then finally OpenBSD.

I currently use Dfly and OBSD on my private machines where ever I do not run 
MacOS,
sometimes alongside. FreeBSD became rare,
NetBSD is only around on an image that 
I sometimes boot on my PlayStation 2.

I tend to choose OpenBSD in the following scenarios:
1. outdated and/or obscure hardware.
Example: I have an older G3 iMac
that I use out of pure enjoyment,
getting Open running on there still took half a day
(I had to write my first own X11 config in 6 years)
but it runs, is secure and always up to date. 
I even managed to write my own TBXI boot file
for the OpenFirmware from the source on the
image for macppc. Now I have a nice Pufferfish
greeting me if I hold down the Option (Alt) key
at boot.

2. Pentesting
Rationale: In Opsec scenarios you have to often
make yourself vulnerable to exploit someone elses
vulnerability. I like to be able to select where my
ports are open. OpenBSD is, as stated often,
secure by default. It therefore won’t surprise you
with new and sudden vulnerabilities. OpenBSD
also won’t complain when running as root only

3. network facing always on devices
Example: I have exactly one device at home that
is constantly running and exposed to the Internet
instead of only our intranet. That thing runs ssh.
No other distro would I trust with handling my
security right.

Other benefits of OpenBSD include:
-Lack of patheticism:  Other Distros call you an idiot
when they assume you i.e. tried to mount an already
hung in device (Ubuntu), I even wrote a Program in
Go before, Go craps it’s pants when you do not
indent correctly. I hat shit like that.
OpenBSD just assumes sou what you do.

-excellent documentation as mentioned
in contrast to Linux.
Oh how I hate fumbling for „solutions“ in Forums.

-maintained base of excellent standard software,
they really do fork what they need.
Xenocara and LibreSSL are excellent examples.
OpenBSD is doing where others are merely complaining.

Glaring Cons: 
-Bluetooth support, I mean folks it’s 2019
-That lackluster Raspberry port
-The often harsh community,
there is a certain elitism here^ 
-The obvious lack of proprietary graphics drivers
the likes of which Linux gets^^
-No killer Filesystem like ZFS or HAMMER,
get used to UFS brother

^however it mostly extends to telling others when
and why they made dumb decisions and it goes
by without namecalling, Linux is just a Swamp
nowadays, a swamp of kiddies.
Dragonfly, in contrast to all here, really is
the heaven of polite technical conversation.

^^that is just stupid vendors though, the community ports where there is 
interest.

> On Wed, 28 Aug 2019, at 15:32, Mohamed salah wrote:

> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Patrick Harper]

What motivates me to stay on OpenBSD is that I want the free desktop concept to 
work. This system + Arcan + GNOME-like interface seems, to me, like an 
compelling way to get there. I hope I can shoehorn this project into my life 
and then reality in some fashion.

-- 
  Patrick Harper
  paia...@fastmail.com

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019, at 15:32, Mohamed salah wrote:
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Zeb Packard]

Stallman's moral arguments are compelling. Theo's moral arguments are
impeccable.

There is more Unix tradition in OpenBSD than there is in any modern Posix
compliant system, where most projects change their interface needlessly,
OpenBSD is a classic where much documentation is in effect timeless. This
is a product of stability being a moral stance which endeavours to create a
substrate for morally oriented code.

The objective of bug free code is nearly unheard of in the industry and in
fact where it is paid lip-service it is not sufficiently served.

The objective and means of obtaining security is among the most accurate,
most logical, and least impulsive strategies in the industry.

Stability, fitness for service and security combine to form a practical
morality in applied software engineering that I find compelling.

On Sun, Sep 1, 2019 at 5:44 PM andrew fabbro  wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 7:45 AM Mohamed salah  >
> wrote:
>
> > I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> > OPENBSD
>
>
> The vastly superior mascot and soundtrack.
>
> --
> andrew fabbro
> and...@fabbro.org
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[andrew fabbro]

On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 7:45 AM Mohamed salah 
wrote:

> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD


The vastly superior mascot and soundtrack.

-- 
andrew fabbro
and...@fabbro.org

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Luke Call]

For what it may be worth, I found xfce very usable and clean, even for someone 
used to Windows 7 (my wife and some others required very little or no help, as 
far as the GUI goes anyway).  More recently, I took the time to learn about 
tmux and fvwm and to customize their configs to my tastes, which I haven't 
regretted (and I now prefer since they are part of base).
-- 
Luke Call
Things I want to say to many (a lightly-loading site):
http://lukecall.net  (updated 2019-08-27)


On 09-01 12:18, Strahil Nikolov wrote:
> I'm a "linux guy" who wants a little bit more security...
> I'm still learning openBSD, but I like the project's idea to build software 
> with security in mind.Also, PF seems pretty good and I'm willing to learn it 
> and if possible to deploy a CARP-ed cluster.
> 
> Sadly, I am still hesitant to try the gui... yet, there are a lot of stuff 
> this BSD can be used for - from a firewall/router to a full blown Laptop 
> distro.
> 
> And Of course, I love the documentation.
> 
> Best Regards,
> Strahil Nikolov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >I first started using it around version 4.3. I was trying BSD's after 
> >using Linux for a bit, and tried FreeBSD first.
> >
> >But OpenBSD was the only one that supported my laptop's WiFi card. And 
> >getting everything running was much less of a hassle.
> >
> >It's the best BSD for getting a fine workstation up quickly.
> >
> >My Thinkpad T60 running OpenBSD got me through college just fine.
> >
> >It's the first operating system that I was able to do lots of cool 
> >sysadmin stuff because of how simple it is.
> >
> >And also the first operating system I found that was easier to find 
> >answers in the manual, and not through Google.
> >
> >Also the OS that inspired me to learn C programming.
> >
> >OpenBSD is the best BSD, and getting better every release.
> 

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Strahil Nikolov]

I'm a "linux guy" who wants a little bit more security...
I'm still learning openBSD, but I like the project's idea to build software 
with security in mind.Also, PF seems pretty good and I'm willing to learn it 
and if possible to deploy a CARP-ed cluster.

Sadly, I am still hesitant to try the gui... yet, there are a lot of stuff this 
BSD can be used for - from a firewall/router to a full blown Laptop distro.

And Of course, I love the documentation.

Best Regards,
Strahil Nikolov




>I first started using it around version 4.3. I was trying BSD's after 
>using Linux for a bit, and tried FreeBSD first.
>
>But OpenBSD was the only one that supported my laptop's WiFi card. And 
>getting everything running was much less of a hassle.
>
>It's the best BSD for getting a fine workstation up quickly.
>
>My Thinkpad T60 running OpenBSD got me through college just fine.
>
>It's the first operating system that I was able to do lots of cool 
>sysadmin stuff because of how simple it is.
>
>And also the first operating system I found that was easier to find 
>answers in the manual, and not through Google.
>
>Also the OS that inspired me to learn C programming.
>
>OpenBSD is the best BSD, and getting better every release.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Tyler]

I first started using it around version 4.3. I was trying BSD's after 
using Linux for a bit, and tried FreeBSD first.


But OpenBSD was the only one that supported my laptop's WiFi card. And 
getting everything running was much less of a hassle.


It's the best BSD for getting a fine workstation up quickly.

My Thinkpad T60 running OpenBSD got me through college just fine.

It's the first operating system that I was able to do lots of cool 
sysadmin stuff because of how simple it is.


And also the first operating system I found that was easier to find 
answers in the manual, and not through Google.


Also the OS that inspired me to learn C programming.

OpenBSD is the best BSD, and getting better every release.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Chris Bennett]

I decided to move away from Windows and I needed to setup a web and
email server. Trying many different versions of Linux left me
unsatisfied. Then I accidentally ran into OpenBSD website.
That was exactly what I wanted.
As a totally inexperienced guy, I found a server company that could
pre-install it. I never looked backed and learned almost everything
remotely. I dual booted at home for a while and I use OpenBSD only for
a long time now.

I have found two intersting things about the mailing lists.
1. Here is what you need to know, how else can I help.
2. RTFM and read the source code yourself.

I found read the source code a little frustrating at first.
But I have realized that the OpenBSD community is NOT about holding your
hand. There is an expectation that you need to put out the effort
necessary to at least try to figure it out yourself. If that means
learning some C or Perl or other languages, then you will have to do
that.
I now heartily agree with this. Why should a developer waste time when
there are truly more important things that constantly change as the
world moves forward. I have never been concerned about missing a few
months without checking up on a server. Problems are very very rare!
And fixed really really fast!

Thanks for giving me a fantastic system and the chance to laugh at the
other OS's that think security and bug fixing is an optional concern!

Chris Bennett

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Magnus Wild]

On 8/28/19 4:32 PM, Mohamed salah wrote:

I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?



I enjoy using it because of it's clean design. It's a fairly simple 
system, with sane default configuration and it "just works" on most 
laptops that I've used it on.


I use a lot of Linux at work and in other environments as well, and the 
application support is naturally better. But the things I really care 
about works on OpenBSD, and as such, I tend to come back to it when 
using computers in my free time.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Edgar Pettijohn]

It's easy to upgrade. I'm never worried that upgrading will break something. As 
far as BSD's go it's the easiest to get a desktop going. Since x is in base you 
just have to do a few pkg_add's. And those packages will be built the way you 
expect 9 out of 10 times. 

Edgar
On Aug 28, 2019 3:37 PM, Daniel Ouellet  wrote:
>
> On 8/28/19 10:32 AM, Mohamed salah wrote:
> > I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> > OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> > fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>
> - Simplicity.
> - Clean
> - Lean and Slim
> - Work as advertise
> - Secure
>
> And the most important fact a few decades ago got me turn to OpenBSD
> without ever turning back is the man page.
>
> I can't say how many times I wasted trying to figure out how to get shit
> working on other Linux flavors and simply give up.
>
> I have to say I am short of time and anything that make me save some it
> a plus for me. So when I discover OpenBSD totally by mistake, I never
> look back.
>
> My son tells me that some Linux have improved their man page some today,
> but some to me mean nothing and I really could case less.
>
> However searching for ever and reading a lots of stuff that you realize
> simply doesn't apply drives me nuts.
>
> I am sure the list is difference for everyone, instead of asking just
> try it and see for yourself.
>
> No one will know more then you what you are looking for or like.
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Daniel Ouellet]

On 8/28/19 10:32 AM, Mohamed salah wrote:
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

- Simplicity.
- Clean
- Lean and Slim
- Work as advertise
- Secure

And the most important fact a few decades ago got me turn to OpenBSD
without ever turning back is the man page.

I can't say how many times I wasted trying to figure out how to get shit
working on other Linux flavors and simply give up.

I have to say I am short of time and anything that make me save some it
a plus for me. So when I discover OpenBSD totally by mistake, I never
look back.

My son tells me that some Linux have improved their man page some today,
but some to me mean nothing and I really could case less.

However searching for ever and reading a lots of stuff that you realize
simply doesn't apply drives me nuts.

I am sure the list is difference for everyone, instead of asking just
try it and see for yourself.

No one will know more then you what you are looking for or like.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Pierre Emeriaud]

Le mer. 28 août 2019 à 16:38, Mohamed salah
 a écrit :
>
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

Almost everything I need is in base. Software (routing daemons, dns
servers, pf), and documentation (man pages, config examples) is here.
I can rely almost exclusively on this to get what I want to do, no
need to google for outdated howtos.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Solene Rapenne]

On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 04:32:29PM +0200, Mohamed salah wrote:
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

What I really like in the OpenBSD team is the ability to take correct
decisions and not trying to be consumer friendly or following a trend.

I say consumer friendly instead of user friendly, because OpenBSD _is_
user friendly, as far as you do your homeworks and learn how to read the
documentation. The system come with sane defaults and every user can
easily enjoy their own system for their own use.

Consumers don't want to think or make the effort.

Some of the decisions are the following:

Microphone on laptop?
disabled by default, change requires root

Webcam?
only for root by default

Disable SMT?
default setting

Sacrifice startup speed for security (randomization)?
done

The list could be extended with unmaintained code removal (tmpfs,
bluetooth, linux emulation etc...)

Those choices would be considered bold or even harmful to users on some
others systems I've been slightly involved.

But in the end, they are beneficial for the end user.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Dave Anderson]

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019, Mohamed salah wrote:

>I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
>OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
>fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?

The emphasis on security and correctness.

-- 
Dave Anderson

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[prx]

see : https://why-openbsd.rocks/fact/

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Vivek Vinod]

I'm going to be hated for this But I don't feel like logging into my 
servers everyday to check if all is well. Some (*BSDs) I've not logged into for 
years and also forgotten my passwords. 

With OpenBSD on public IPs, I'm safe(r) than the GNU/Linux (worst offender) or 
Windows (2nd worst) or FreeBSD (1 incident in 3 years) counterparts. 

Then again, I feel OpenBSD has made me start to question everything... which 
has led me to better work choices. 

Please excuse my brevity - Sent from my mobile



  Original Message  



From: mohamed.ahmed.fouad@gmail.com
Sent: 28 August 2019 9:34 PM
To: mohamed.a.sala...@gmail.com
Cc: misc@openbsd.org
Subject: Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD


OpenBSD community is formed around the idea of doing things in a simple but
correct manner; the community also rejects all stupid ideas that many
others may accept because it is a bit more convenient. That's a good
community to learn from.

A community that got a good taste for sensible ideas.

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019, 11:42 Mohamed salah  I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[U'll Be King of the Stars]

On 28/08/2019 15:32, Mohamed salah wrote:

I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux
Of all the things that naturally pull me towards BSD, I can not think of 
anything that OpenBSD does better than the other BSD's.


Conversely OpenBSD is not very good at being a file server.  It's also 
not very good at SMP.  These issues have been known for a long time and 
it doesn't take much research to find out these facts when evalutation 
technologies for specific important use cases.  I understand that the 
SMP deficiencies are being worked on.  I don't know about the lack of 
file server functionality however.


In other words, I don't know how important it is for the OpenBSD project 
that it eventually becomes a top contender when evaluating an OS for a 
file server or NAS.


I also use NetBSD.  NetBSD and OpenBSD are both excellent and often I 
enjoy using NetBSD more.


I use OpenBSD for many reasons.  Here are a few, and many of them apply 
equally well to my use of NetBSD:


-   The /community/ of /any/ software that I have the luxury of choosing 
is a critical factor.  It is equally as important as the technology 
itself.  OpenBSD's community has been wonderful to work with.  I mostly 
interact on the the misc@openbsd.org mailing list and the #OpenBSD IRC 
channel on freenode.


-   Its out-of-the box pf firewall.  This has a LOT of community 
knowledge, which is a huge advantage.  Not only is this important to 
implement 100% correctly, but it's important that you understand all the 
relevant lurking unknowns so that you don't have false confidence in a 
misconfigured firewall.  This is one area where a large community of 
experts is extremely helpful.


-   I would prefer to use a simply configured OS instead of an appliance 
like OPNSence or pfSense.  I don't think they add much value.


However, if I was a network or security engineer in a large 
enterprise, I'd probaby be working very differently.  Based on my 
experiences working in large corporate enterprises so far, i.e., based 
on my observations, I'd probably be using an appliance from Cisco, 
Juniper, F5, etc.


This is not a negative point against choosing OpenBSD.  I've never 
been in a position of influence in a large, corporate enterprise's 
network division (I'm not a network engineer professionally).


It's an observation, not something I would /necessarily/ choose. 
To be fair, I have seen many amazing things that these expensive devices 
from Cisco, Juniper, and F5 can do too.


On the other hand the libre nature of OpenBSD is one its major 
benefits.  If you ever need to audit your security infrastructure then 
OpenBSD puts you in a good place right from the beginning.


-   OpenBSD's documentation is excellent.  Documentation is clear and 
complete.  Man pages exist and are meaningful.  In fact, I use OpenBSD's 
(and other *BSD's) coding standards and documentation style as a model 
for my own projects, even they have nothing in particular to do with *BSD.


-   OpenBSD has a concise base system that is understandable, learnable 
without too much congitive stress, and (usually) fast to install.


-   As somebody else has mentioned, they use OpenBSD precisely *because* 
they also use other operating systems.  It is the same for me.  It is 
important to learn how different OS'es do similar functions.  Moreover, 
I am starting to learn how to write my software to be more portable. 
Portable software is, by its nature, of a higher standard than software 
that runs only on GNU/Linux, for example.  I'm still a beginner as far 
as this is concerned.  It means expanding beyond *nix too.


(This blind adherence to "the Unix philosophy" as though its 
superiority in OS design is axiomatically true has had a negative effect 
on the collective imagination of many people.)


-   OpenBSD runs on architectures other than x86_64 that I am interested 
in.  For example, PowerPC-based Apple Macintosh systems and SPARC-based 
systems.  This ties in intimimately with my previous point re: support 
of architectures.


Andrew
--
OpenPGP key: EB28 0338 28B7 19DA DAB0  B193 D21D 996E 883B E5B9

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Mohamed Fouad]

OpenBSD community is formed around the idea of doing things in a simple but
correct manner; the community also rejects all stupid ideas that many
others may accept because it is a bit more convenient. That's a good
community to learn from.

A community that got a good taste for sensible ideas.

On Wed, 28 Aug 2019, 11:42 Mohamed salah  I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Mike]

On 8/28/2019 10:32 AM, Mohamed salah wrote:
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
> 

I run a few different OS's here.  The reason I choose OpenBSD for the
tasks I use it for:

It just works.

It doesn't carry a lot of extra baggage.

It just works.

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Christopher Turkel]

I use OpenBSD because it can do everything I want it to do and it’s easy to
use.

On Wednesday, August 28, 2019, Raul Miller  wrote:

> I would fix the issue, or use something else to get that done or
> abandon that project.
>
> (I am not sure why you would imagine that using OpenBSD implies not
> using other operating systems. It's *because* I use other operating
> systems that I like using OpenBSD.)
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
> Raul
>
> On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 10:41 AM Mohamed salah
>  wrote:
> >
> > I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> > OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't
> work
> > fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?
>
>

Re: What is you motivational to use OpenBSD

[Raul Miller]

I would fix the issue, or use something else to get that done or
abandon that project.

(I am not sure why you would imagine that using OpenBSD implies not
using other operating systems. It's *because* I use other operating
systems that I like using OpenBSD.)

Thanks,

-- 
Raul

On Wed, Aug 28, 2019 at 10:41 AM Mohamed salah
 wrote:
>
> I wanna put something in discussion, what's your motivational to use
> OPENBSD what not other bsd's what not gnu/Linux, if something doesn't work
> fine on openbsd and you love this os so much what will do?