Re: smtps://smtp.office365.com:587 CONNECT_CR_SRVR_HELLO:wrong version number

[Roman Neuhauser]

# wagner_m_bre...@web.de / 2018-08-08 13:03:22 +0200:
> On Aug 08, 2018 at 12:44:00, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > i'm having trouble setting up mutt for SMTP submission to office365.com.
> > the error message is:
> > 
> >   SSL failed: error:1400410B:SSL routines:CONNECT_CR_SRVR_HELLO:wrong 
> > version number
> > 
> > my configuration is:
> > 
> >   set my_addr = "roman.neuhauser@..."
> >   set my_pass = "..."
> > 
> >   set smtp_url = "smtps://$my_a...@smtp.office365.com:587"
> >   set smtp_pass = "$my_pass"

>   set smtp_url = "smtp://$my_a...@smtp.office365.com:587"

hello Michael,

many thanks for the tip, this let me past the protocol version hurdle.

next up was "No authenticators available", caused by missing SASL
modules (i had libsasl installed but cyrus-sasl-modules was missing).

it's working now.  thanks again,

-- 
roman

smtps://smtp.office365.com:587 CONNECT_CR_SRVR_HELLO:wrong version number

[Roman Neuhauser]

hello,

i'm having trouble setting up mutt for SMTP submission to office365.com.
the error message is:

  SSL failed: error:1400410B:SSL routines:CONNECT_CR_SRVR_HELLO:wrong version 
number

my configuration is:

  set my_addr = "roman.neuhauser@..."
  set my_pass = "..."

  set smtp_url = "smtps://$my_a...@smtp.office365.com:587"
  set smtp_pass = "$my_pass"

the IMAP(S) side of things works.

BTW, `openssl s_client -starttls smtp -connect smtp.office365.com:587`
on the same machine gives me the following output:

  [...]
  SSL handshake has read 3832 bytes and written 373 bytes
  ---
  New, TLSv1/SSLv3, Cipher is ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384
  Server public key is 2048 bit
  Secure Renegotiation IS supported
  Compression: NONE
  Expansion: NONE
  No ALPN negotiated
  SSL-Session:
  Protocol  : TLSv1.2
  Cipher: ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384
  Session-ID:
  F018182FEF77665B38703A449871173C25E8735A0FB1B7158F8287BA99D4
  Session-ID-ctx:
  Master-Key:
  
9C91B432BEC0273FFE252AD602420CD291B310FDD85B65788857D0D4E7B87238A928B89FBD10D4DD11EA5D68E7B594B9
  Start Time: 1533721667
  Timeout   : 7200 (sec)
  Verify return code: 0 (ok)
  ---
  250 SMTPUTF8


`openssl version` says:

  LibreSSL 2.7.4

`mutt -v` says:

  Mutt 1.10.1 (2018-07-13)
  Copyright (C) 1996-2016 Michael R. Elkins and others.
  Mutt comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `mutt -vv'.
  Mutt is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it
  under certain conditions; type `mutt -vv' for details.

  System: Linux 4.17.9_1 (x86_64)
  ncurses: ncurses 6.1.20180127 (compiled with 6.1)
  libidn: 1.34 (compiled with 1.34)
  hcache backend: GDBM version 1.16. 27/06/2018 (built Jul 16 2018 08:54:52)

  Compiler:
  Using built-in specs.
  COLLECT_GCC=/usr/bin/cc
  COLLECT_LTO_WRAPPER=/usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu/7.3.0/lto-wrapper
  Target: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
  Configured with: /builddir/gcc-7.3.0/configure 
--build=x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
  --enable-fast-character --prefix=/usr --mandir=/usr/share/man --infodir=/usr/
  share/info --libexecdir=/usr/lib --libdir=/usr/lib --enable-threads=posix
  --enable-__cxa_atexit --disable-multilib --with-system-zlib --enable-shared
  --enable-lto --enable-vtable-verify --enable-linker-build-id
  --enable-serial-configure --disable-werror --disable-nls --enable-default-pie
  --enable-default-ssp --enable-checking=release --disable-libstdcxx-pch
  --with-isl --with-linker-hash-style=gnu --disable-libunwind-exceptions
  --disable-target-libiberty --with-default-libstdcxx-abi=gcc4-compatible
  --enable-languages=c,c++,objc,obj-c++,fortran,lto,go
  Thread model: posix
  gcc version 7.3.0 (GCC)

  Configure options: '--prefix=/usr' '--sysconfdir=/etc' '--sbindir=/usr/bin'
  '--bindir=/usr/bin' '--mandir=/usr/share/man' '--infodir=/usr/share/info'
  '--localstatedir=/var' '--enable-pop' '--enable-imap' '--enable-smtp'
  '--enable-hcache' '--enable-gpgme' '--with-regex' '--with-idn' '--with-ssl'
  '--with-sasl' '--enable-sidebar' '--with-gpgme-prefix=/usr' 
'--sysconfdir=/etc/mutt'
  '--with-gdbm=/usr' 'mutt_cv_regex_broken=no' '--host=x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu'
  '--build=x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu' 'build_alias=x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu'
  'host_alias=x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu' 'CC=cc'
  'CFLAGS=-D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 -mtune=generic -O2 -pipe   -g'
  'LDFLAGS=-Wl,-z,relro -Wl,-z,now -Wl,--as-needed' 'CPPFLAGS=   ' 'CPP=cpp'

  Compilation CFLAGS: -Wall -pedantic -Wno-long-long -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 
-mtune= generic -O2 -pipe   -g

  Compile options:
  -DOMAIN
  -DEBUG
  -HOMESPOOL  -USE_SETGID  +USE_DOTLOCK  -DL_STANDALONE  +USE_FCNTL  -USE_FLOCK

  +USE_POP  +USE_IMAP  +USE_SMTP
  +USE_SSL_OPENSSL  -USE_SSL_GNUTLS  +USE_SASL  -USE_GSS  +HAVE_GETADDRINFO
  -HAVE_REGCOMP  +USE_GNU_REGEX
  +HAVE_COLOR  +HAVE_START_COLOR  +HAVE_TYPEAHEAD  +HAVE_BKGDSET
  +HAVE_CURS_SET  +HAVE_META  +HAVE_RESIZETERM  +HAVE_FUTIMENS
  +CRYPT_BACKEND_CLASSIC_PGP  +CRYPT_BACKEND_CLASSIC_SMIME  +CRYPT_BACKEND_GPGME

  -EXACT_ADDRESS  -SUN_ATTACHMENT
  +ENABLE_NLS  -LOCALES_HACK  +HAVE_WC_FUNCS  +HAVE_LANGINFO_CODESET
  +HAVE_LANGINFO_YESEXPR
  +HAVE_ICONV  -ICONV_NONTRANS  +HAVE_LIBIDN  -HAVE_LIBIDN2  +HAVE_GETSID
  +USE_HCACHE  +USE_SIDEBAR  -USE_COMPRESSED
  -ISPELL
  SENDMAIL="/usr/sbin/sendmail"
  MAILPATH="/var/mail"
  PKGDATADIR="/usr/share/mutt"
  SYSCONFDIR="/etc/mutt"
  EXECSHELL="/bin/sh"
  -MIXMASTER

any ideas?

-- 
roman

Re: location of signature.

[Roman Neuhauser]

# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2002-09-04 18:17:34 -0500:
> OK. I found the messages and I am not glad about those so-called rules.

Yes. Ah, so-called good manners. Such a useless junk!

> I THINK it is better to put the reply BEFORE quoted text and this has
> nothing to do with M$. It is natural (to me) to put important part (my
> reply) before non-important part (quote) 

Yes. Just as it's natural to answer questions before they're asked.

> and keep my signature closer to the main body.

Yes. Just as you put your signature at the top of paper letters.

> This also makes an email easier to read if the quote is long.

Which of itself is rude enough.

-- 
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Re: Being subscribed to a mailing list but having sender displayed in index

[Roman Neuhauser]

# [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 2002-09-05 16:00:37 +0200:

> I would like to have the following feature:
> - I am subscribed to a mailing list
> and
> - I would like to see the sender of the email as it is the case for
>   emails that do not belong to a mailing lists.

see index_format, s/%L/%F/

-- 
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FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
4:28PM up 15 days, 22:21, 8 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
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Re: location of signature.

[Roman Neuhauser]

# Bo Peng <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> / 2002-09-04 10:24:57 + (-0500):
> Hi, Everyone,
> 
> Mutt automatically put the signature at the end of the email. Can I let
> it be put before the quoted text? 

yes. use Outlook.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
5:32PM up 14 days, 23:25, 8 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.03, 0.03

Re: TDMA (was Re: Spam filtering software)

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 11:46:59 +0100
> From: Chris Green <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: TDMA (was Re: Spam filtering software)
> 
> On Wed, Aug 28, 2002 at 12:34:58PM +0200, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > > Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 10:15:48 +0100
> > > From: Chris Green <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Subject: Re: TDMA (was Re: Spam filtering software)
> > > 
> > > On Wed, Aug 28, 2002 at 04:05:57AM -0500, John Buttery wrote:
> > > >   Anyway, just out of curiosity, how come you guys aren't using TMDA?
> > > > Just haven't found it yet, or...?
> > > 
> > > Probably because it's useless for quite a number of people.
> > > 
> > > Much of my incoming mail is in response to enquiries I send out to
> > > trade suppliers and small businesses.  If I implemented TMDA they
> > > would have to jump through hoops to get their response to me, it's
> > > difficult enough getting a response from some people anyway so I
> > > suspect that TMDA would reduce the reply rate to negligable
> > > proportions.  The alternative of modifying the TDMA 'whitelist' when I
> > > send the enquiry out is similarly flawed (I have to jump through
> > > hoops) and anyway isn't guaranteed to work as they may not respond
> > > from an address I know about.
> > 
> > I think you should re-read the tmda docs, especially the client
> > configuration.
> > 
> Yes?  This assumes that I own a domain and have an unlimited number of
> E-Mail addresses available to me, again not the normal situation.

no. tmda can work on a nullclient. it only requires that

1) your pop3 server stores envelope information in headers
2) the smtp server of your provider accepts addresses with
   extensions

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
1:48PM up 7 days, 19:41, 19 users, load averages: 0.04, 0.06, 0.01

Re: TDMA (was Re: Spam filtering software)

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 10:15:48 +0100
> From: Chris Green <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: TDMA (was Re: Spam filtering software)
> 
> On Wed, Aug 28, 2002 at 04:05:57AM -0500, John Buttery wrote:
> >   Anyway, just out of curiosity, how come you guys aren't using TMDA?
> > Just haven't found it yet, or...?
> 
> Probably because it's useless for quite a number of people.
> 
> Much of my incoming mail is in response to enquiries I send out to
> trade suppliers and small businesses.  If I implemented TMDA they
> would have to jump through hoops to get their response to me, it's
> difficult enough getting a response from some people anyway so I
> suspect that TMDA would reduce the reply rate to negligable
> proportions.  The alternative of modifying the TDMA 'whitelist' when I
> send the enquiry out is similarly flawed (I have to jump through
> hoops) and anyway isn't guaranteed to work as they may not respond
> from an address I know about.

I think you should re-read the tmda docs, especially the client
configuration.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
12:29PM up 7 days, 18:22, 17 users, load averages: 0.04, 0.11, 0.10

Re: Reducing duplication

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 15:31:28 -0600
> From: "Rob 'Feztaa' Park" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Reducing duplication
> To: Mutt Users List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> Alas! darren chamberlain spake thus:
> > Or skip your sent-mail folder altogether.
> 
> I wanted to avoid this for portability; if I just skip my own sent
> mail folder, then I'm limiting the script to my own machine. I want it
> to work for other people as well ;)

make it a parameter, then. (not an answer either, sorry)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
9:06AM up 14:59, 7 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: Quoting the signature in replies (yes, I want)

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 2002 11:41:38 +0200
> From: Stephane Bortzmeyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Quoting the signature in replies (yes, I want)
> 
> When I reply to a message with something starting with -- in it, mutt
> does not quote it, probably because it assumes it is a signature.
> 
> But some people who write me do use -- at random places :-( and I want
> to quote it nevertheless. I cannot find an option
> 'include_sig_in_replies'. Any idea?

while i might be very much wrong, i don't think this is mutt. looks
like your editor strips the sig.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
12:12PM up 3 days, 7 mins, 8 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: mutt + pcre

[Roman Neuhauser]

> From: "Calum Selkirk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2002 09:03:20 -0400
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: mutt + pcre
 
i somehow missed the Sven's message, so i'm replying to this one

> * Sven Guckes [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] [2002-08-02 13:57 +0200]:
> > * Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2002-08-02 11:35]:
> >
> > > if mutt could be ./configure'd --with-pcre (nondefault, of course),
> > > there'd be virtually no problems with confusion between regexps
> > > found in various published .muttrc's and the syntax mutt linked with
> > > pcre actually expected.
> >
> > assuming this is true - who would
> > (1) prepare the transition?
> > (2) write the patches?
> > (3) write the documentation?
> > (4) update the setup files?
> > any takers?

2 i cannot do
will gladly take 3
what exactly mean 1 and 4?

> Sven,
> 
> "if" is generally regarded as a conditional and is never in and of
> itself "true" but predicated on meeting certain conditions (in this
> case 1,2,3,4)
> 
> To add to your list of Q's:
> 
> (0) what exactly is a "bullshit detector"?
> (0.1) is it worth discussing something even "if" only theoreticly?
> (0.2) return to 0?

Calum, i'm not sure how to parse your message. Does the #0 above
suggest that what i'm saying is bullshit?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
3:51PM up 2 days, 23:27, 10 users, load averages: 0.01, 0.03, 0.06

Re: most commonly used regex lib for awk/frep/mutt/sed?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2002 18:55:42 +1000
> From: Erik Christiansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: most commonly used regex lib for awk/frep/mutt/sed?
> 
> On Thu, Aug 01, 2002 at 01:47:37PM +0200, Sven Guckes wrote:
> > > Is this too ambitious a wish?
> > 
> > unfortunately, yes.
> 
>Ricardo SIGNES is a man of vision, I think. If it is practical to
> link in a preferred regex suite, as described in his post on this
> thread, to allow the ERE-proficient amongst us to escape the
> frustrations and limitations of BREs, then my only questions are:
> 
>  o Do I have to dust off my rusty but revivable 'C' skills to help get
>this moving?
 
someone *will* need to do it. i'd definitely love to see this
inlined as a ./configure knob, but a (probably quite hard to
maintain) patch looks more likely.
(oh gosh, how i regret i don't know enough c)

>  o Should vim be fixed first? 'cos I think Roman is definitely right.
>(There's still no magic that allows "+" in lieu of "\+")
 
vim needs a fix really badly imo, but i don't think any such thing
will happen (soon), and even if Bram jumpstarted replacing the
strange cousin of re that's used in vim, it would delay the work
in mutt too much.

> > let's assume you could make this change within a day.
> > how many setup files, scripts, shell aliases etc
> > would have to be adjusted?  can you give this service?
> 
>As Ricardo implies, let's not change any. It would require that
> people change, and I recognise that it is only in accepting the existing
> tower of babel, that we have any hope of providing a simpler consistent
> interface for those who prefer it.
 
if mutt could be ./configure'd --with-pcre (nondefault, of course),
there'd be virtually no problems with confusion between regexps
found in various published .muttrc's and the syntax mutt linked with
pcre actually expected. 

> > besides, would everyone gain from this?
> 
>Oh-oh, is this devil's advocacy?
> 
>Whether it is:
> 
>  o The time lost by countless users individually clawing their way up the
>learning curve of a panoply of regex dialects, just to do a simple
>job.
> 
>  o The countless hours spent by worthy individuals reinventing the wheel
>for their otherwise great tool. (When the time could be spent on
>features which help users.)
> 
>  o The resulting bugs, fixes, and re-releases of these tools, impacting
>both developer and user.
> 
>  o The newsgroup and mailing list traffic due to regex knowledge already
>acquired not being portable. (Much energy has also been expended on
>the procmail mailling list, examining how their dialect can be made
>stranger still, as various deficiencies of the older syntax are
>addressed.)
> 
>  o The confusion sown by inconsistency. Beginner pain is exacerbated by
>behavioural variability. Lessons learned on one dialect must be
>unlearned on others. (After approximately a decade, I still send
>stuff to grep, rather than use vim's irregular expressions.)
> 
>there is benefit enough for all.

i'll sign this.


-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
1:21PM up 2 days, 20:58, 8 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: problem about subjects in asian charsets

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2002 15:58:46 +1000
> From: Erik Christiansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt users ml <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: problem about subjects in asian charsets
 
>OK, it seems then that the xterm and vim are more tolerant than mutt,
>when it comes to ISO8859-1 characters. They work fine with $LANG=C
>and LC_CTYPE="". Trying Roman Neuhauser's most helpful response on
>another thread:
> 
>export LANG=en_AU.ISO8859-1
> 
>was enough for mutt, despite previous failures when setting LC_CTYPE
>to ISO8859-1.
> 
>Grateful thanks Roman!
> 
>Given that mutt is suffiently popular to be the one that we trip
>over, an FAQ entry might save some mailing list bandwidth. :-)

I had just as hard time setting this stuff up when I started using
mutt (I was almost completely green wrt unix as well), so you're
most welcome. :)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
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Re: SMTP Error (MAIL FROM:), "from" header variable

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Cc: recipient list not shown: ;
> Subject: SMTP Error (MAIL FROM:), "from" header variable
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 23:29:20 -0700
 
1) break your lines @ ~72 chars.
2) if you want any replies, why do you make it hard to others to
   reply to the list?

> SMTP error from remote mailer after MAIL FROM:<(my username)@(my
> unregistered domain)>
> 
> How can I force mutt to issue the "MAIL FROM:" command to my SMTP
> server using my email address - and not (my username)@(my unregistered
> domain)? Thanks,

you need to send the "real" mail address in the envelope.
mutt-specific solution is "set envelope_from = yes", system-wide
solution depends on the MTA you use.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
2:50PM up 1 day, 22:27, 11 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: RFE: regex backrefs

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2002 01:25:27 +1000
> From: Iain Truskett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: RFE: regex backrefs
> 
> * Ricardo SIGNES ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [01 Aug 2002 01:21]:
> > On Wed, Jul 31, 2002 at 05:08:25PM +0200, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > > this reminds me: how hard would it be to make mutt use libpcre?
> 
> > And, how much would it slow down / bloat up mutt, if at all?
> 
> Strictly speaking, if used as a shared library, and existing regexp
> support is blown away and replaced, then it reduces bloat.
> 
> The problem is, such a change would probably kill everyone's existing
> configurations. You'd need something like Vim's \m, \M, \v, \V  escapes
> (magic, no magic, very magic, very no magic), only probably \P (use
> PCRE; assuming \P isn't taken by PCRE).

while i very much appreciate the fact that i can use 1.5 with
.muttrc created for 1.2.5i (i think only noted one or two non-bugfix
changes between 1.2.5i and 1.5.1i), such changes are what major
version number bumps are for.

btw, vim's regex support is completely b0rken IMO. its (no) magic
switches... weird syntax... ugh.

if PCRE was adopted, and used as the only regex library in the next
major mutt version, such an escape wouldn't be needed.

anyway, PCRE is quite ubiquitous (apache 2, postfix, python,
php...), and a de facto standard. standards are god.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
5:40PM up 1 day, 1:17, 7 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: RFE: regex backrefs

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 10:57:39 -0400
> From: Ricardo SIGNES <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RFE: regex backrefs
> 
> I know this has been brought up before, but I just thought I'd voice
> my deep desire:  mutt should be able to have backrefs to its regexen.
> If I get a 'vote' in future development, this is how I would cast it.
> My C is crappy, or I'd shut up and code it.
> 
> Imagine the power available in something as simple as:
> 
> folder-hook =friends\.([a-z]+)my_hdr From: 
> 
> This is only a tiny fraction of the Supreme Cosmic Power that this could
> unlock.

this reminds me: how hard would it be to make mutt use libpcre?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
5:07PM up 1 day, 43 mins, 4 users, load averages: 0.04, 0.04, 0.01

Re: Display of non-ascii chars

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:58:48 +0200
> From: Erik van der Meulen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Display of non-ascii chars
> 
> On Wed, Jul 31, 2002 at 01:46:24PM +0200, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> 
> > looks like you have $LANG set to C, POSIX, or something like that.
> > what happens if you just cat(1) the message (i. e. view it w/o any
> > intervening program)? i'd guess it won't come up "right" either.
> 
> Thanks a lot for your reply.
> You are right. It comes up just like in 'less'

ok, so it's your terminal (or rather, environment) that's not set up
as you need.
 
> > roman@freepuppy ~ 865:1 > echo $LANG 
> > cs_CZ.ISO8859-2
> 
> Mine gives (as you had guessed) 'C'

> >>From this I deduce that my problem is in the $LANG.

yes

> Any suggestion on how and where to change that? I am on a Debian 2.2
> box.

you can fix it by
% setenv LANG en_US.ISO8859-1
or
% export LANG=en_US.ISO8859-1
depending on the type of shell you use.

permanent fix lies in your shell's start up files. export $LANG with
appropriate value from there.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
2:12PM up 21:48, 9 users, load averages: 0.03, 0.05, 0.01

Re: Display of non-ascii chars

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:32:49 +0200
> From: Erik van der Meulen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Display of non-ascii chars
> 
> Dear all, I have some issue with the displaying of non-ascii chars in my
> mail. I have to admit that I am not 100% sure that this is a mutt-issue
> or more shell or terminal related. Sorry if it is off-topic, I have
> tried all kinds of things to get this right.

this is both mutt and terminal issue
 
> If an incoming mail contains accents or other non-ascii things, they
> seem to show up as '?' or even blanks within mutt. This is most
> annoying.
> For instance if I look at a 'From' line in a mail that displays
> perfectly in Evolution mail (contains two different 'e' accents), it
> shows:
> 
> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E9l=E8ne_Corthals?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

looks like you have $LANG set to C, POSIX, or something like that.
what happens if you just cat(1) the message (i. e. view it w/o any
intervening program)? i'd guess it won't come up "right" either.
 
> in 'less' on the terminal, and the same line in 'mutt' is displayed as:
> 
> From: H?el?ne Corthals
> 
> Again, I have tried to change char-sets in mutt and other settings that
> I thought might help, all to no avail. Any hints or suggestions are
> indeed much appreciated!

roman@freepuppy ~ 865:1 > echo $LANG 
cs_CZ.ISO8859-2
roman@freepuppy ~ 866:0 > grep charset .mail/mutt/muttrc   
set charset = "iso-8859-2"
set send_charset = "us-ascii:iso-8859-2:utf-8"

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
1:41PM up 21:17, 9 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: search-next annoyance

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 08:30:25 +0200
> From: Cedric Duval <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: search-next annoyance
> 
> Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > > >   macro pager n "\n"
> 
> > > ISTR there was a reason why i didn't just do this in the first
> > > place, but i can't remember what it was right now. will try.
> 
> > hm, yes, here's the reason:
> 
> > the macro as suggested scrolls down one line with my current
> > mappings,
> 
> Your binding for \n interferes with the macro? What if you replace \n
> with ?
> 
> macro pager n ""
> 
> Seems to work correctly (for me, at least).

this line is from the pager halp:

next-line  scroll down one line

and i'm not going to give it up :)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
9:14AM up 5 days, 19:33, 6 users, load averages: 0.11, 0.04, 0.01

Re: search-next annoyance

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 02:59:21 +0200
> From: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: search-next annoyance
> 
> > > it's obviously trying to be helpful, but in fact does just the
> > > opposite. i just want it to do what i told it, which is search for the
> > > next match, not create a new search.
> > 
> >   macro pager n "\n"
> 
> ISTR there was a reason why i didn't just do this in the first
> place, but i can't remember what it was right now. will try.

hm, yes, here's the reason:

the macro as suggested scrolls down one line with my current
mappings, so the matched lines end up outside the pager.
if i add  at the end, it'll cause the matched line to
be the second displayed line instead of the first, subsequent calls
are ok (where the  does what it's there for. 

really, it's just a nitpick, but this is pretty distracting.

i guess i'll just mail mutt-dev@

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
3:27AM up 5 days, 13:46, 5 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.02, 0.00

Re: search-next annoyance

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:12:38 +0200
> From: Cedric Duval <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: search-next annoyance
> 
> Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > 
> > 
> 
> > at this moment, instead of just jumping to the next match, mutt prompts
> > me for the pattern.
> 
> But you are presented the previous value at the prompt, don't you?

yes. 
 
> > it's obviously trying to be helpful, but in fact does just the
> > opposite. i just want it to do what i told it, which is search for the
> > next match, not create a new search.
> 
>   macro pager n "\n"

ISTR there was a reason why i didn't just do this in the first
place, but i can't remember what it was right now. will try.

thanks!

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
2:57AM up 5 days, 13:16, 5 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: search-next annoyance [1.5.1]

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:13:41 +0200
> From: Michael Tatge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: search-next annoyance [1.5.1]
> 
> Sven Guckes ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) muttered:
> > * Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2002-07-15 19:57]:
> > > starting in index:
> > > ~b pattern
> > > 
> > > pattern
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > hmm...
> > 
> > > at this moment, instead of just jumping to the
> > > next match, mutt prompts me for the pattern.
> > 
> > huh?  that doesn't happen with my mutt 1.4.
> 
> I see exactly the same behavior as Roman with mutt 1.4 Seven.
> Hm, are you running any patches Roman?

just patch-1.5.1.cd.edit_threads.9.2

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
2:57AM up 5 days, 13:16, 5 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.00

Re: search-next annoyance [1.5.1]

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:00:21 +0200
> From: Sven Guckes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: search-next annoyance [1.5.1]
> 
> * Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2002-07-15 19:57]:
> > i'm getting pretty annoyed by the behavior of search-next; this is how i
> > use mutt pretty often, and it doesn't exactly help to make it easier:
> >
> > starting in index:
> > ~b pattern
> > 
> > pattern
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> hmm...
> 
> > at this moment, instead of just jumping to the
> > next match, mutt prompts me for the pattern.
> 
> huh?  that doesn't happen with my mutt 1.4.

it has behaved this way all the way back to 1.2.5i *IIRC*.
i had a look at the source, and it looks like the search pattern is
being invalidated when you go pager <-> index, and is compiled
again.
 
> > is there a knob i've overlooked?  i'm running 1.5.1i,
> 
> oh - mutt 1.5.1  maybe that one's different?
> how come you complain about a *developer*
> version on the users* list then?
 
well, it wasn't meant to be a complaint in any way. and as i said
above: this is not anything new AFAICT.

> you should try discussing this with
> the developers on mutt-dev... ;-)

ok.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
2:53AM up 5 days, 13:12, 5 users, load averages: 0.05, 0.03, 0.00

search-next annoyance

[Roman Neuhauser]

hi there,

i'm getting pretty annoyed by the behavior of search-next; this is how i
use mutt pretty often, and it doesn't exactly help to make it easier:

starting in index:

~b pattern

pattern





at this moment, instead of just jumping to the next match, mutt prompts
me for the pattern. it's obviously trying to be helpful, but in fact
does just the opposite. i just want it to do what i told it, which is
search for the next match, not create a new search.

is there a knob i've overlooked?  i'm running 1.5.1i, but iirc it
behaved this way since i started using it (which isn't a terribly long
period): 1.2.5i, couple of 1.3.2x revisions, one 1.4.x iirc (just a few
days), and now 1.5.1i

thanks

-- 
FreeBSD 4.6-STABLE
9:46PM up 2 days, 12 hrs, 4 users, load averages: 0.12, 0.03, 0.01

Re: substituing ~l in send-hook

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 19:57:27 +0100
> From: Hanspeter Roth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: substituing ~l in send-hook
> 
> I'd like to create a generic send-hook which substitutes ~l,
> something like:
> 
> send-hook ~l 'my_hdr Reply-To: ~l'
> 
> The ~l won't be substituted in my_hdr. Is there some means to achieve
> this?

Have you ever received a reply to this question, or perhaps found a
solution? I'm interested, too.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:34PM up 2 days, 1:19, 12 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.04, 0.02

Re: How to display texts encoded in UTF-8?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 08:34:50 +0800
> From: Charles Jie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: How to display texts encoded in UTF-8?
> 
> Hi,
> 
> My linux box has locale zh_TW.Big5 (Traditional Chinese). I have the
> following settings in .muttrc and it works well in most of the cases.
> 
> set charset="big5"
> charset-hook "" big5  # for the mail missing 'charset'
> 
> But from time to time, I may get mail from MUA that encodes in UTF-8.
> Then the pager would fail to display.
> 
> Could anybody give a hand? I can not find solution in manual.txt.

Hi Charles,

this is what I get when I grep my .muttrc for 'charset':

set charset = "iso-8859-2"
set send_charset = "us-ascii:iso-8859-2:utf-8"

and utf-8 messages are displayed just fine. Makes me think you
should be looking elsewhere. Sorry for not having an answer.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:02PM up 8 days, 18:10, 9 users, load averages: 0.03, 0.02, 0.00

Re: Breaking News: Lusers _want_ to quote email replies The Right Way.

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 22:50:30 -0700
> From: "Rob 'Feztaa' Park" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Breaking News: Lusers _want_ to quote email replies The Right Way.
> To: Mutt Users List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> Really, though: this isn't a network, just one person to one person. She
> can read proper quoting, so that's not a problem. She _wants_ to learn
> proper quoting, so that's also not a problem. 
> 
> The only problem is, she's a little slow, and her mail client doesn't
> really want her to learn anything, so she probably won't without my
> intervention.

Umm... How about getting her another MUA that will not get in the
way that much?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:46PM up 17 days, 23:10, 15 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.02, 0.00

rxvt-2.6.4, mutt-1.3.26i, ncurses-5.1, and ascii_chars

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

yesterday I switched back from aterm (TERM=xterm-color) to rxvt
(TERM=rxvt). I had some problems with display in mutt, and during the
attempts to solve it I upgraded to 1.3.26i (don't use SSL, so I don't
care about the bug).

It works quite well, except for one thing: ascii_chars (w3m-0.2.1 also
stopped rendering "frames" properly, while links-0.9.6 works just fine
["VT100 frames" in the "Terminal Options menu]).

This is what I see with ascii_chars unset:

3341 Feb 01 William Wu  (  21) [feature requests] bcc and sent
3342 Feb 01 Will Yardley(  22) tq>   
3343 Feb 01 David Champion  (  21) x mq>   
3344 Feb 01 Will Yardley(  19) x   tq>
3345   ! Feb 01 Michael Elkins  (  14) x   mq> 
3346  s  Feb 01 David T-G   (  73) mq>

Now, this is on FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE, but the termcap definitions are
taken from the Thomas E. Dickey's termcap.src.gz. Are *those* incorrect,
or is it a mutt issue?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
3:40PM up 14 days, 22:04, 9 users, load averages: 0.07, 0.04, 0.02

Re: char % as quote

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2002 13:24:06 +0100
> From: Martin Karlsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mutt Users' List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: char % as quote
> 
> On Fri Jan 25, 2002 at 12:44:59AM -0700, Rob 'Feztaa' Park wrote:
> > ...I dunno what shell you guys are using, but
> > mine uses $ for user and # for root... '%' doesn't enter into it.
> 
> IIRC, '>' is the default for tcsh (and (again, IIRC) '%' is the default
> for csh).

dunno about "real" csh (csh == tcsh on FreeBSD), but % is the
default for 0

available MDA's: are you satisfied?

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

I'd like to colllect feedback on an idea that's been on my mind for some
time now:

looks like there's just two MDA's in use: Procmail, and Maildrop. Both
have their fine (and not so fine) points, which I'll summarize briefly
(YMMV):

Procmail:
+ lots of prepackaged antispam filters
- config files resemble uuencoded assembler
- quite resource-hungry (keeps the whole message in memory while
  processing it)
- reportedly isn't completely safe (can lose your mail)

Maildrop:
- not as popular as Procmail (fewer filter packages)
+ square head is not a prerequisite to understand the configuration
- quite optimized (larger messages stored in temp files during
  processing)
+ should be safer than Procmail

In fact, I found only a *single* spam filter for Maildrop.

Now, what bugs me about both of these programs: to the best of my
knowledge, neither offers you a real programming language. This can be a
plus, or a minus (YMMV), but imagine being able to write filters using a
full-featured scripting language! This idea really attracts me, and I
started prototyping such an MDA in PHP. Using a scripting language has
of course a few inherent drawbacks, but I don't think the speed decrease
would be so horrible to mean anything on a single user box (as opposed
to a corporate POP 3 server, for example). However, I know that I would
benefit from the enhanced capabilities.

I'm slowly getting the picture of the classes that would make this
happen, and would like to ask you: is there something that you sorely
lack in your favorite MDA? What is it?

Any feedback is much appreciated.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
1:33AM up 4 days, 7:57, 11 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.03, 0.00

Re: [OT] html email

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 18:42:05 -0500
> From: Brian Clark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [OT] html email
> 
> * Matthew D. Fuller ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [Jan 24. 2002 18:29]:
 


> If it catches a friend, newletter, etc, I just add the sender's address
> to a file called known.list and use this rule:
> 
> # known sender's list
> :0:
> * ? (formail -x From: | fgrep -iqf $PMDIR/known.list)
> $MAILDIR/inbox
> 
> (By the way, is there a better way to do the above?)

Maybe this:

if (/^From: *!.*/ && lookup($MATCH2, "$PMDIR/known.list"))
{
to $MAILDIR/inbox
}

But I have to stop rambling. :) 

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
1:30AM up 4 days, 7:53, 11 users, load averages: 0.10, 0.05, 0.01

Re: [OT] html email

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:36:28 -0600
> From: Jeremy Blosser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [OT] html email
> 
> On Jan 24, Matthew D. Fuller [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] wrote:
> > Actually, I've found that this:
> > if(/^Content-Type: text\/html/)
> > to $MBOXDIR/crap
> > 
> > catches more of my spam than any other of my off-the-cuff heuristics (I
> > mean, like at factor of 2 more, and seemingly more than the rest combined).
> > I read through my 'crap' mailbox every few days, and pretty much end up
> > just hitting 'd' (granted, for about 5 minutes, but better
> > 5 minutes every few days than a few seconds a few hundred times EVERY
> > day, eh?).  The only false positive I've had it get was a payment
> > confirmation from the telco's online bill payment (in the rare case that
> > it actually works).
> 
> I wonder if you could improve that even more by checking if the message is
> actually addressed to you?

Like this?
   
if(/^Content-Type: text\/html/ && hasaddr([EMAIL PROTECTED]))
to $MBOXDIR/crap

X-Warning: had a few beers.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
12:57AM up 4 days, 7:20, 11 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.00

Re: lynx-dev Use mutt to download and distribute incoming mails to various folder?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2002 07:01:50 -0500
> From: David T-G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mutt Users' List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: Neo Sze Wee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: lynx-dev Use mutt to download and distribute incoming mails to various 
>folder?
> 
> % I do not use fetchmail because the recent version requires the cryto
> % libraries which make the whole thing big and slow.
> 
> What about going back to a previous version if you can't just configure
> the crypto to off when you build it?

Or using a different (lightweight) retriever?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
3:40PM up 1 day, 22:03, 11 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.10, 0.12

Re: maildir over mbox?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2002 12:08:44 -0600
> From: David Rock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Users List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: maildir over mbox?
> 
> I was just wondering what the real differences were between maildir and
> mbox formats? I know mbox is an appended file while maildir is a
> separate directory for each mail (each what, exactly)? 
> 
> What are the benefits of using one type over the other?



mbox

This is the traditional mailbox format. It is a simple plain text
file with the messages in it. Each message has this structure:
   
From [EMAIL PROTECTED] date
Headers

Body


Since MUAs recognize the beginning of a message in an mbox by a line
starting with "From " (this is commonly called "the From_ line"),
any lines in message bodies starting with this string will get
rewritten as ">From " by your MDA.

It is not a good idea to use this mailbox format if you have your
mail on a NFS share. Many NFS implementations have buggy locking,
and you can easily have your mailboxes stomped.

See mbox(5) for more info (different man pages installed at least
with mutt and qmail).
   
maildir

This is a newer format, introduced by the qmail MTA. Each mailbox is
a directory containing three subdirectories: tmp/, new/, and cur/.
When your MDA delivers a message to a maildir mailbox, it writes it
to the tmp/ directory, and when the message is succesfully written,
it moves it to the new/ directory. Since this is atomical operation,
the mailbox is safe from curruption.

It is quite safe to use over NFS.

Also, it can be easier when you want to process your mail using regular
tools provided in the base system: you can use a small shell script to
move old mail away from your "active" mailboxes to an "archive" using
find(1), xargs(1), and alike.
   
This format can get _very_ slow with large mailboxes on filesystems that do
not handle directoris with many files in them. This should include the
Linux ext2fs.
   
FreeBSD post-4.4 FFS with softupdates and dirhash should shine with this
format.

See maildir(5) (installed at least with qmail) for more info.



-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
9:47PM up 4:11, 8 users, load averages: 2.25, 2.44, 2.60

Re: message-hooks

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 08:36:55 -0500
> From: Dan Boger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: message-hooks
> 
> I'm trying to do something here, maybe it's not doable - who knows?
> 
> what I want is that whenever I write or reply to a certain address, that
> message will be automagically BCCed to another address.  I tried using
> send-hooks, but those do not seem to affect the current message, only
> subsequent messages.
> 
> send-hook . 'unmy_hdr Bcc:'
> send-hook [EMAIL PROTECTED] 'my_hdr Bcc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>'

Doesn't message-hook do what you describe here?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:21PM up 3 days, 23:18, 21 users, load averages: 0.03, 0.02, 0.00

Re: how to set localization

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2002 23:16:04 +0800
> From: Willy Sutrisno <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: how to set localization
> 
> * Im Eunjea ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > Do you have Indonesian message file for mutt?
> > 
> > /usr/share/locale/id/LC_MESSAGES/mutt.mo
> > 
> 
> Yes, I do have mutt.mo in that folder. I meet a strange thing, I have
> exported "id" into LC_ALL, LANG. I checked using locale, and it shows
> all with "id". After I exit my root session, and if I go back to my root
> session and check locale, it will show en_US, why do they reset back? 
> 
> I know that this is actually out of the mutt topic, but please help me.

You have to set them in your shell's startup file, or create an
appropriate login class, and put yourself in it. This is IMO the
right way to do it, but requires root access. See login.conf(5) and
passwd(5).

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:46PM up 1 day, 20:44, 18 users, load averages: 0.05, 0.07, 0.02

Re: mutt && mime.types

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 10:19:50 -0800
> From: David Ellement <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: mutt && mime.types
> 
> On 020112, at 17:58:56, Roman Neuhauser wrote
> > So... could someone point me to the function which mutt uses to
> > determine the MIME type of the attachments when you view a
> > message?
> 
> When viewing a message, mutt uses the content-type header to
> determine the MIME type (and then mailcap to determine what to do
> with that type).  It's up to the sending MUA to set the content-type
> header.

Doh. Should have been quite clear. Thanks for the explanation.
 
> It is possible to invoke a filter via a mailcap entry to try to
> guess the MIME type.  For an example, see Dave Pearson's
> mutt.octet.filter (http://www.davep.org/mutt).

Ok. I'll use this.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:40PM up 3 days, 37 mins, 19 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

mutt && mime.types

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

some time ago I reported problems with mailcap handlers for tar.(gz|bz2)
files. I didn't investigate it further until yesterday when I tried (and
failed) to get mutt recognize a file by its extension no matter where I
put the ext -> MIME type mapping (i. e. /usr/local/etc/mime.types or
~/.mime.types).

I got really bothered by this, and run mutt in strace. While I could see
mutt opening ~/.mailcap, there was no mention of mime.types. So I got
mutt log debug info, but this didn't show mutt using mime.types either.
Might be the right piece of code doesn't call the dprint() macro; the
only place where the code mentions mime.types is check_mime_type() in
sendlib.c, however. Plus, it looks like this function is only called
when you *compose* a message (because then I get the right content
type).

So... could someone point me to the function which mutt uses to
determine the MIME type of the attachments when you view a message?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:39PM up 2 days, 22:35, 19 users, load averages: 0.22, 0.24, 0.10

Re: Suggestion for List Etiquette

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 08:27:47 -0800
> From: "J. Scott Dorr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Anh Lai <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Suggestion for List Etiquette
> 



> Nah. :) He coulda just highlighted the appropriate lines (via shift-v or some
> such) then ':s/^/This is quoted text: '
> 
> Faster that then changed the reply thingy-ma-jiggy, then changing it back. ;)

I guess that quite a few of the subscribers are just devoted to
flooding this list with chitchat. I would suggest creating
mutt-chat, so that those who feel the urge to send non-technical, OT
stuff to mutt-users would have a place to go.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
6:32PM up 1 day, 23:29, 19 users, load averages: 0.03, 0.03, 0.03

Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:39:54 +0800
> From: Charles Jie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Mail-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?
> 
> Thanks, Roman.
> 
> 1. My getmail.log gives:
> 
>  Aborting... (command "/usr/bin/maildrop ~/.maildroprc" returned 19200
>  (maildrop: signal 0x06))
> 
>  $getmail gives sth similar:
> 
>   msg #1 : len 998 ... retrievedfailed to process message list for
>   "charlesjie" (command "/usr/bin/maildrop ~/.maildroprc" returned 19200
>   (maildrop: signal 0x06))
>   Resetting connection and aborting...
> 
> 2. My maildrop now looks OK and saves message to given mbox. The problem
>is that getmail doesn't remove message in POP server. I'll get a copy
>of the same message each time I run getmail.

So it works now? Was the problem just the getmail rpm?

As to your question: getmail *does* remove retrieved messages from
the server just fine. I don't know if it's the default behavior, but
you can certainly get it with

delete = 1

in your .getmailrc
   
> 
> 3. getmail also fails to fetch mail if the destination mbox doesn't
>exist. Thus I can not let mutt remove the empty mbox file when all
>messages are deleted.

Yes. This is clearly stated in the docs... Or was it the source?
Anyway, I don't see how this could be a problem given that you
have getmail deliver to maildrop?
 
> 4. My getmail is 2.1.9, while maildrop is 1.3.4.
>The broken getmail rpm from Mandrake 8.1 is 2.1.5. I'll send it to
>you in another mail. It misses ALL the python modules.

As I already wrote in a separate message, I don't know what good it
is to send rpm files. But let's get over it.
 
> 7. It takes no hard work to prepare man page but it's a big convenience.

Well, you have to *maintain* it: keep it up to date. And that's
worse.

>Without it, I need to run "$ rpm -ql getmail" to find out the right
>document every time, and then copy and paste to run "less" to check it.
>Do you have a better approach to do it?

> cd /usr/share/doc/getmail-2.1.9 && ls
   
(or wherever the docs get stored on a Mandrake box)
 
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:36PM up 1 day, 33 mins, 19 users, load averages: 0.15, 0.08, 0.01

Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2002 22:08:18 +0800
> From: Charles Jie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Mail-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?
> 
> Thank you, Charles, Roman and Mark.
> 
> I've tried procmail and maildrop to go with getmail but all failed. I
> believe they should be able to work someday when I have enough hard work
> on them. :)
> 
> Report:
> 2. maildrop returns (-1) while I set for getmail:
> 
>postmaster = "|/usr/bin/maildrop ~/.maildroprc"
> 
>(The .maildroprc contains stuff like Roman's.)

Interesting. I suggest you to enable logging in both getmail and
maildrop, tail -f both logfiles, and get some mail.
Also, it'd be nice if you provided version numbers. I'm no maildrop
hacker, but Charles wrote getmail, and a version number could
probably help.

> 3. getmail doesn't have enough documentation at this moment:

I dare to disagree:

share/doc/getmail/CHANGELOG
share/doc/getmail/docs.txt
share/doc/getmail/faq.txt
share/doc/getmail/getmail.txt
share/examples/getmail/getmailrc-example

>   a. no man page

While man page would be really nice IMO, Charles
expressed he was not interested in maintaining it. That said, the
tarball *does* have enough docs IMO.

>   b. the rpm package comes with Mandrake 8.1 is broken. It misses a (at
>  least) python module. I replace it with a D/L one.

You should bug the package's maintainer. The FreeBSD port I
installed Getmail from didn't give me any trouble. And again, not
enough info: *what* Python module?


-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:52PM up 14 days, 3:30, 20 users, load averages: 0.03, 0.02, 0.02

Re: mbox trouble

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 16:33:56 +0100
> From: Nick Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt-Users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: mbox trouble
> 
> Hi all.
> I have this line in .muttrc
> 
>  set mbox="/home/nick/Mail/mbox"
> 
> There is no file called mbox in Mail though?
> Is this something to do with using pop3 rather than *local* mail?

IIRC $mbox is a place where messages you have read in one of your
spoolfiles (e. g. /var/mail/$USER) are saved. I. e. you read a
message in /var/mail/nick, and mutt will save it in $mbox, possibly
creating it). This however depends on value of $move, and I have it
set to "no", since messages I read are already in their final
destinations (=lists/mutt-users for this list, for example).
 
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:46PM up 12 days, 3:24, 13 users, load averages: 1.11, 0.57, 0.28

Re: "set mail_check" lies

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 13:28:09 +0100
> From: Nick Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: "set mail_check" lies
> 
> > > 
> > > I have the same problem, I only get my mail if I hit 'G'
> > > What should $mailboxes be set to?
> > > I had a look at the manual but couldn't really understand it. 
> > > An example would be great!
> > 
> > You use mutt's POP3 functions? AFAIK check_new etc. don't apply
> > here. They're for checking your _local_ mailboxes for new mail.
> > 
> > BTW, you would really benefit from using a POP3 mail retriever and
> > an MDA.
> 
> Yes you're right: POP3. 
> What would you suggest I looked into regarding retrieval and delivery?

getmail / maildrop
first hits on google.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
2:09PM up 12 days, 47 mins, 17 users, load averages: 0.07, 0.03, 0.01

Re: "set mail_check" lies

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2002 12:31:46 +0100
> From: Nick Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: "set mail_check" lies
> 
> * René Clerc <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [020107 11:29]:
> > * Philip Mak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [07-01-2002 11:16]:
> > 
> > | "set mail_check" configures how often (in seconds) mutt should look
> > | for new mail. I have it set to 5, but new e-mail that I receive does
> > | *not* show up within 5 seconds.
> > | 
> > | It seems that it only shows up if I press a key in mutt.
> > 
> > Do you have set the $mailboxes directive to look at the correct
> > mailbox(es)?
> > 
> > -- 
> > René Clerc  - ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
> 
> I have the same problem, I only get my mail if I hit 'G'
> What should $mailboxes be set to?
> I had a look at the manual but couldn't really understand it. 
> An example would be great!

You use mutt's POP3 functions? AFAIK check_new etc. don't apply
here. They're for checking your _local_ mailboxes for new mail.

BTW, you would really benefit from using a POP3 mail retriever and
an MDA.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
1:07PM up 11 days, 23:45, 14 users, load averages: 0.07, 0.05, 0.00

Re: tagging in browser

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2002 17:35:16 -0500
> From: Ken Wahl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: tagging in browser
> 
> On Sun, Jan 06, 2002 at 07:26:28PM +0100, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > t   tag-entry  tag the current entry
> > 
> > but it doesn't work:
> > 
> > (hit 't')
> > -- Mutt: Mailboxes [11]
> > Tagging is not supported.
> > 
> 
> It seems like your trying to tag a mailbox and not a message, which mutt
> won't let you do.  (Usually mutt only shows "Mutt: Mailboxes [nn]" when
> browsing the mailbox files, not in the message index of the mailbox
> itself.) I was able to reproduce your error message by doing the same.  
> Try going into a mailbox and using "t" on message(s).

Well, yes, that's what I'm talking about.
Go to the browser, and look for 'tag' in the help. It _does_ list
"t   tag-entry" function in there. If it's not supported, why is it
listed?


-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
9:34AM up 11 days, 20:12, 11 users, load averages: 0.08, 0.06, 0.01

tagging in browser

[Roman Neuhauser]

/usr/local/share/doc/mutt/html/manual-6.html says:
%t * if the file is tagged, blank otherwise
 
when I press '?' in the browser, I see this:
t   tag-entry  tag the current entry

but it doesn't work:

(hit 't')
-- Mutt: Mailboxes [11]
Tagging is not supported.

This is mutt-1.3.23i.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:21PM up 11 days, 5:59, 17 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.00

Re: pyurlview.py: a more flexible 'urlview'

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2002 15:14:00 -0500
> From: Maciej Kalisiak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: pyurlview.py: a more flexible 'urlview'
> 
> On Fri, Jan 04, 2002 at 02:18:16PM -0500, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > quite nice, with a few nits:
> > 
> > curses.wrapper () initializes color support, and I haven't found a
> > way to make it set the background transparent.
> 
> curses.wrapper() is a function from an external module (Python's
> "curses" module). I haven't bothered changing its default colours and
> behaviour, but I suppose this is something I'll look at when I improve
> pyurlview.

I know where it comes from. I'd suggest resorting to the "manual"
curses setup. It's just a few lines more, and allows more
flexibility.
 
> > besides, the colorsare quite unpleasant.
> 
> Really? What do you get? I get an admittedly boring white on black, but
> I wouldn't necessarily call that "unpleasant".

I get black text on wheat background. With #0f1319 root window,
transparent xterms, and grey70 font, this isn't exactly nice. Like
being hit in the face with a snowball.
 
> > Looks like this happens when the new size of the window is more
> > than 2x the original, or less than 1/2 of the original. I'm
> > talking about resizing the window, of course.
> 
> I'll have a look.  The menu printing code needs a once over anyhow, to watch
> for and trim print-lines that wrap, so this will probably be taken care of
> automatically.
> 
> > and last, what's with that GPL everybody seems to be hypnotized?
> 
> Why?  I'm no license zealot, but it just seems to fit my needs the best.

Erm, sorry for the remark. I'm gradually developing strong distaste
for the license... Didn't mean to start a flamewar, nor do I want
one now. Just ignore it.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
9:37PM up 9 days, 8:15, 17 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.02, 0.04

Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2002 12:01:22 -0800
> From: Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Mail-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?
> 
> On Fri, Jan 04, 2002 at 08:29:55PM +0100, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > as pointed out by others, you made a good choice with getmail over
> > fetchmail, since the latter breaks the unix philosophy "do one
> > thing, but do it right".
> 
> What?  fetchmail only does one thing.  It downloads mail and injects it
> into the local mail system. It has no filtering mechanism other than a
> rudimentary anti-spam mechanism.  If you want to do filtering you just
> set your LDA to something like fetchmail.  
> 
> And as you pointed out mutt can check POP/IMAP boxes but that's it's
> purposes.  Nor is fetchmail's purpose to filter mail.  So what is it
> that you think fetchmail does to break the unix philosophy more than any
> other tool you're using?
> 
> I really don't care what program you use.  But really is it necessary to
> belittle someone elses tool in the process?

I think I forgot to attach ":)" to that sentence. That said, I _do_
think that fetchmail has gone the Windows "I can do it all for ya,
pal" way, which is not what I like.

Let me put it this way: how would you label fetchmail? what is its
job? is it to talk SSL, talk SMTP (great if you need to get rid of
some messages in endless loops and similar stuff), filter spam, or
is it to talk POP, and write the messages to /dev/null, disk or
another program's stdin?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
9:25PM up 9 days, 8:03, 17 users, load averages: 0.10, 0.10, 0.08

Re: pyurlview.py: a more flexible 'urlview'

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 00:38:47 -0500
> From: Maciej Kalisiak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: pyurlview.py: a more flexible 'urlview'
> 
> Hello mutters,
> 
> After finding "urlview" a bit limiting I have written a somewhat more flexible
> version of it.  I figured I'd share it with the community in case others are
> in a similar "needs-more-power" bind.  Main improvements:
>   - user-defined key bindings for everything (with Vi-style defaults)
>   - any number of user-defined commands to run on URLs (e.g.: different
> keys for netscape, lynx, galeon, wget, xclip, whatever)
>   - ability to show context of a given URL in menu
> 
> You can get it at http://www.dgp.toronto.edu/~mac/projects/pyurlview.py
> 
> This is a Python script (too lazy to do it in C and don't have the time), so
> you'll need Python.  Tested under Python 2.1, not sure about earlier versions.
> Also uses the curses library for screen output.
> 
> If passed a filename, this script scans the file for URLs, else it looks at
> stdin.  Once running, press 'h' or '?' for a brief help on (default) keys.
> 
> Comments, suggestions welcome.

Hi Maciej,

quite nice, with a few nits:

curses.wrapper () initializes color support, and I haven't found a
way to make it set the background transparent. besides, the colors
are quite unpleasant.

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/home/roman/bin/pyurlview.py", line 346, in ?
main()
  File "/home/roman/bin/pyurlview.py", line 339, in main
curses.wrapper(frob_urls)
  File "/usr/local/lib/python2.1/curses/wrapper.py", line 44, in wrapper
res = apply(func, (stdscr,) + rest)
  File "/home/roman/bin/pyurlview.py", line 219, in frob_urls
stdscr.move(h-1, 0)
_curses.error: wmove() returned ERR
   
Looks like this happens when the new size of the window is more than
2x the original, or less than 1/2 of the original. I'm talking about
resizing the window, of course.

and last, what's with that GPL everybody seems to be hypnotized?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
8:04PM up 9 days, 6:42, 18 users, load averages: 0.13, 0.07, 0.03

Re: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2002 01:56:47 +0800
> From: Charles Jie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Mail-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Possible to get the mail fetched by getmail filtered?
> 
> Now I have a mail system = postfix + mutt + procmail + getmail.
> 
> getmail fetches my mail in some POP3 servers. But it just places mail in
> some mboxes - compared to the mail received by postfix and
> sorted/filtered by procmail - and looks having no way to sort/filter
> mail further.
> 
> How do you do it for POP3 mail? (some of these mailboxes do be able to
> 'forward' mail to my server, but inevitably add lines to message header.
> :)
> best,
> charlie

Hi Charles,

as pointed out by others, you made a good choice with getmail over
fetchmail, since the latter breaks the unix philosophy "do one
thing, but do it right".

While getmail has some rudimentary filtering facilities (just like
mutt has some rudimentary POP3 facilities), it's not a mail filter.
So to get your mail filtered, you need to put another tool between
getmail and your mailboxes. I use getmail with maildrop, and have it
configured like this:

getmailrc:
   
[mail.cz]
...
postmaster = "|/usr/bin/env PERSONA=mail.cz maildrop /path/to/maildroprc"
[mobil.cz]
postmaster = "|/usr/bin/env PERSONA=mobil.cz maildrop /path/to/maildroprc"

maildroprc:
   
MAILDIR  = "$HOME/Mail"
LISTDIR  = "$MAILDIR/lists"
PHPDIR   = "$LISTDIR/php"
WORKDIR  = "$MAILDIR/work"

if (/^list-post: /)
{
to "$PHPDIR/php-qa"
}

if (/^list-post: /)
{
to "$LISTDIR/svn-dev"
}

if (/^Subject: .* Genesis2 zmeny/)
{
to "$WORKDIR/cvs"
}

if (/^From: .*@mobil\.cz/ || /.*genesis@mobil\.cz/)
{
to "$WORKDIR/mobil.cz"
}

to "$MAILDIR/IN.$PERSONA"


My maildrop config is somewhat longer, but you get the idea.


-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
8:19PM up 9 days, 6:57, 18 users, load averages: 0.15, 0.09, 0.05

Re: \222 instead of "'"

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 20:23:04 -0600
> From: "Robert A. Knop Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Magnus Bodin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: \222 instead of "'"
> 
> > Windows-1252 is a superset of iso-8859-1 and includes a number of
> > additional characters. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Windows users and their software usually mix in WIN-1252 chars in
> > iso-8859-1 text. I think of it as their problem more than yours. 
> 
> It's their mistake, but it's our problem, alas.  The Windows machines
> are ubiquitous, and the broken CP-1252 quotes and such are all over the
> place.  A pity, but a fact of life.

Yep. I don't see how someone could think that having my display
broken is not my problem. Sure, it's the other party's fault, but
that's it.

That said, I've just had a look at the mutt docs (FAQ+manual), and
looks like this isn't mentioned. Does every user of mutt have to
reinvent the wheel? Or does everybody just bite the bullet?

Also, it occured to me that I could probably use message-hook to
identify Outlook messages and override the charset. Would this work?
Does anyone use it?
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
8:30AM up 7 days, 19:07, 19 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.09, 0.06

Re: mail filtering with procmail

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2002 02:58:36 +0100
> From: Cliff Sarginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: mail filtering with procmail
 
[...]

> procmail and it's use of locks is one of the greatest mysteries on
> earth (at least to a dummy like me)

Hi Cliff,

I see you keep bashing procmail. Do you use it? Looks like switching
to something else might greatly help your emotional stability. :)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:47AM up 7 days, 18:25, 19 users, load averages: 0.01, 0.01, 0.00

\222 instead of "'"

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

looks like Outlook (specifically: X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build
9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0)) does something wrong when it base64-encodes a
message: single quote becomes "\222". Instead of "I'm not sure", mutt
would display "I\222m not sure". Anyone else seeing this? How can I get
compensate for it?

This is a snippet from a message where I noticed this:
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.
[...]
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--=_NextPart_000_0038_01C1931A.1931A040
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
[...]

my environment:
LANG=cs_CZ.ISO_8859-2
LC_COLLATE=en_US.ISO_8859-1
LC_MESSAGES=en_US.ISO_8859-1
LC_MONETARY=en_US.ISO_8859-1
LC_NUMERIC=en_US.ISO_8859-1
LC_TIME=en_US.ISO_8859-1
MM_CHARSET=ISO-8859-2

my .muttrc:
set charset = "iso-8859-2"

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
8:30PM up 7 days, 7:08, 19 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.03, 0.00

Re: List-Reply problems

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2001 17:31:25 +0100
> From: Nick Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: List-Reply problems
> 
> Hi 
> I'm having trouble replying to this list.
> If I enter ,L for a 'list-reply' I get the @gbnet address come up as the
> To field.
> I now have 'subscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED]' in my .muttrc but cannot seem
> to make it work.
> 
> What might be causing this?

AFAIU this feature works roughly this way:
when you issue , mutt checks whether any of the
addresses in the headers matches one in your 'subscribe' or 'lists'
(partial) addresses. If it finds a match, it replies to that
address.

So, two scenarios:
1) you have "mutt-users" in your 'subscribe' line.
   you 'list-reply' to a message someone sent to
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   mutt takes that address as a list address, and puts it in the
   "To:" field.
2) you have "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" in your 'subscribe' line.
   you 'list-reply' to a message someone sent to
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   mutt finds no match in your 'subscribe' line, and the command
   fails.
   
Somebody correct me if this is wrong -- I haven't checked the
source.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
2:38PM up 7 days, 1:15, 11 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.03, 0.00

Re: Using message-hook to run messages through a filter

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2001 17:09:05 +0100
> From: Andre Majorel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Using message-hook to run messages through a filter
> 
> There is one guy out there who has particular and very annoying
> writing idiosyncracies (think Prince or B1FF). I wrote a filter to
> translate his prose to something less obnoxious. Now how do I
> configure Mutt to automatically pipe his messages through the
> filter when reading or replying to him ?
> 
> I thought that 
> 
>   message-hook "~f joe@blow\.com" "pipe-message /usr/local/bin/unmangle"
> 
> would do the trick but Mutt says "pipe-message: unknown command".

It's  (incl. the angle brackets) isn't it?
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
6:21PM up 2 days, 4:59, 11 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.00

Re: Writing bullets/lists in vim

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 27 Dec 2001 11:59:46 -0500 (EST)
> From: Philip Mak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mutt Users' List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Writing bullets/lists in vim
> 
> Does anyone have a vim configuration to make writing bullets/lists easier?
> e.g. when I'm writing something like this:
> 
> --- begin example ---
> 1. Pick one of the RaQs to be the DNS server.
> 2. E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] and ask him for an additional IP for
>that RaQ.
> 3. When you get the IP, tell me and I'll set the server to use it.
> --- end example ---
> 
> it would be nice if when the line wraps while I'm typing point #2, the
> cursor starts on column 3 instead of column 0 on the second line.
 
Add 'n' to 'formatoptions'. IOW, put this in your .vimrc:

set fo+=n

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:47PM up 1 day, 6:25, 6 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: auto_view problem

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sat, 22 Dec 2001 13:16:46 +0100
> From: Martin Karlsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: auto_view problem
> 
> On Fri Dec 21, 2001 at 06:29:19PM +0100, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
>  
> [...snip...]
> 
> One idea could be to try Dave Pearson's 'mutt.octet.filter' (found on:
> http://www.davep.org/mutt/ ), which "... will attempt to guess the true content of an
> octet-stream MIME attatchment and format for easy text-oriented  viewing."
> 
> Who knows, it might work for you.

Yes, might be a working hackaround. But I'd prefer if mutt worked as
advertised. :)
 
> > I have tried all possible invocations of tar/gzip I could think of:
> > 
> > application/x-tar-gz; gunzip -c %s|tar tf -;copiousoutput
> > application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf -;copiousoutput
> > application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf %s;copiousoutput
> > 
> > None of them work. I ran mutt under strace, and couldn't find any
> > notion of it reading _any_ mailcap file. This seems to be because it
> > spawns some children -- it positively _does_ read my ~/.mailcap,
> > since this entry works as expected (wrapped):
> > 
> > image/*; anytopnm %s|pnmscale -xs 70
> > |ppmtopgm|pgmtopbm|pbmtoascii;copiousoutput
> 
> [...snip...]
> 
> My mutt (1.2.5 now, used to run 1.3.23) _will_not_ act upon my
> ~/.mailcap;

I was told the same by another 1.2.5 user.

> it does however recognize my ~/.mutt/mailcap, so try moving
> your mailcap. Again, who knows, it might work. *smiles hopefully*

roman@roman ~ > grep image /usr/local/etc/mailcap
image/gif; xv %s
image/jpg; xv %s
roman@roman ~ > grep image .mailcap
image/*; anytopnm %s|pnmscale -xs 70 |ppmtopgm|pgmtopbm|pbmtoascii;copiousoutput

mutt correctly passes images through this pipe, so the file IS read.
   
> /Martin (who has exhausted his "knowledge" of mailcap-related problems and
> hopes a full-fledged mailcap-guru will join the thread. :-) )

Thanks a lot for at least responding. :)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:49PM up 1 day, 13:19, 11 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: Can't send, wierd error message

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2001 22:15:55 -0700
> From: Steven Schneider <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Can't send, wierd error message
> 
> Thanks, for the tip.  I didn't think to look in my .muttrc, but when I
> did I noticed that set sendmail="/usr/local/sbin/sendmail -oem -oi"
> which was fine for when I had postfix.  But plain Sendmail has the
> path /usr/sbin/sendmail on OBSD.
> 
> Now that I've made that small change, everything works.  :)

Well, Sendmail is the default MTA on all BSD's AFAIK, and being a
part of the base system it's in /usr. But it's not Sendmail that's
in /usr/sbin/sendmail, it's a symlink to /usr/sbin/mailwrapper which
just invokes another program based on argv[0] and
/etc/mail/mailer.conf.  What strikes me is the fact
that you invoked postfix with the path /usr/local. 

roman@roman ~ > ls -laF /usr/sbin/sendmail
lrwxr-xr-x  1 root  wheel  21 Oct  9 16:08 /usr/sbin/sendmail@ ->
/usr/sbin/mailwrapper

BTW, how did you install postfix on the old machine? Didn't you use
the port?  I don't know the OpenBSD ports system details (a quick
glance at the cvsweb interface suggests the similarity ends with the
/usr/ports path), but "the other" MTAs' port makefiles generally
have a "replace" target that takes care of all this. On FreeBSD,
that is.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:11AM up 3:41, 4 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: Can't send, wierd error message

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2001 18:21:01 -0700 (MST)
> From: Steven Schneider <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Can't send, wierd error message
> 
> Oops, forgot to add that my os is OpenBSD 3.0 and Sendmail is 8.12.  Hope that
> this helps anyone who can help me.
> 
> If you need any more info to assist, just ask.
> 
> Steve

I don't know what the problem is, but have you verified that the
switches mutt invokes sendmail with are valid for 8.12? If that
doesn't reveal anything suspicious, I would try invoking sendmail
with the same switches by hand. That could give you a more
descriptive error message...

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:08AM up 38 mins, 3 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

Re: auto_view problem

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 17:14:51 +0100
> From: Martin Karlsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: auto_view problem
> 
> You could try:
> 
> application/x-tar-gz  tar -ztf %s;copoiousoutput
>  ^^|
>   \ add this!
> 
> This works for me.

I have tried all possible invocations of tar/gzip I could think of:

application/x-tar-gz; gunzip -c %s|tar tf -;copiousoutput
application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf -;copiousoutput
application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf %s;copiousoutput

None of them work. I ran mutt under strace, and couldn't find any
notion of it reading _any_ mailcap file. This seems to be because it
spawns some children -- it positively _does_ read my ~/.mailcap,
since this entry works as expected (wrapped):

image/*; anytopnm %s|pnmscale -xs 70
|ppmtopgm|pgmtopbm|pbmtoascii;copiousoutput


Mutt 1.3.23i (2001-10-09)
Copyright (C) 1996-2001 Michael R. Elkins and others.
Mutt comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `mutt -vv'.
Mutt is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it
under certain conditions; type `mutt -vv' for details.

System: FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE [using ncurses 5.1]
Compile options:
-DOMAIN
+DEBUG
-HOMESPOOL  +USE_SETGID  +USE_DOTLOCK  +DL_STANDALONE  
-USE_FCNTL  +USE_FLOCK
-USE_POP  -USE_IMAP  -USE_GSS  -USE_SSL  -USE_SASL  
+HAVE_REGCOMP  -USE_GNU_REGEX  
+HAVE_COLOR  +HAVE_START_COLOR  +HAVE_TYPEAHEAD  +HAVE_BKGDSET  
+HAVE_CURS_SET  +HAVE_META  +HAVE_RESIZETERM  
+HAVE_PGP  -BUFFY_SIZE -EXACT_ADDRESS  -SUN_ATTACHMENT  
+ENABLE_NLS  -LOCALES_HACK  -HAVE_WC_FUNCS  -HAVE_LANGINFO_CODESET
-HAVE_LANGINFO_YESEXPR  +HAVE_ICONV  -ICONV_NONTRANS  +HAVE_GETSID
-HAVE_GETADDRINFO  
ISPELL="/usr/local/bin/ispell"
SENDMAIL="/usr/sbin/sendmail"
MAILPATH="/var/mail"
PKGDATADIR="/usr/local/share/mutt"
SYSCONFDIR="/usr/local/etc"
EXECSHELL="/bin/sh"
-MIXMASTER
To contact the developers, please mail to <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>.
To report a bug, please use the flea(1) utility.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
6:21PM up 4 days, 5:16, 17 users, load averages: 0.05, 0.03, 0.00

Re: filters

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2001 13:07:04 +0100
> From: giorgian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: filters
> 
> sorry if i reply only now, but i had some troubles with my mail... :( 
> 
> many thanks, now i use procmail and i'm almost happy.
> i still have a problem: there are some MLs which use a strange return 
> path: 
> 
> focus-linux: 
> 
> Return-path: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> where 1081 changes every time...
> 
> a worse example is yahoogroops, which uses:
> Return-path: 
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> where 192652 is the mailing list (and i have to match it exactly,
> since i've subscribed many yahoo groups; the other numbers change
> evewry time.
> 
> which regexp shall i use to do this?

A regexp that will match the header, of course. Is the Return-Path
header the only one by which you can identify the mailing list? I'm
subscribed to a few mailing lists myself, and I have to identify a
header by which I could tell traffic from the list every time I
subscribe to a new one. Couple of examples:

if (/^list-post: /)
{
to "$LISTDIR/svn-dev"
}
if (/^list-id: /)
{
to "$LISTDIR/freebsd-questions"
}
if (/^List-Unsubscribe: <.*@lists\.ispi\.net>/)
{
to "$LISTDIR/smarty"
}
if (/^List-Post: <.*@lists\.horde\.org>/)
{
to "$LISTDIR/horde"
}
if (/^Delivered-To: mailing list vim@vim\.org/)
{
to "$LISTDIR/vim"
}

etc. If the lists you mention can only be told by the Return-Path
headers (which I doubt), you could use something like this
(untested, and for maildrop. you'll have to edit it for procmailrc):

if (/^Return-path: 

Re: unsubscribe

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2001 11:38:29 -0700
> From: "Rob 'Feztaa' Park" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: unsubscribe
> 
> On Thu, Dec 20, 2001 at 09:26:55AM -0800, Marjo F. Mercado (dis)graced my inbox with:
> > unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Why do I get the feeling that somebody doesn't like us?

Perhaps it has to do with the endless nonsense titled "Quoting when
replying"?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
9:47PM up 3 days, 8:42, 14 users, load averages: 0.01, 0.02, 0.00

Re: how best to use addressbook queries?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 23:14:22 -0800
> From: Gary Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: how best to use addressbook queries?
> 
> On Wed, Dec 19, 2001 at 08:01:29AM +0100, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> 
> > > From: Mark Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> > > I'm using abook in mutt via query_command. Wishing to address a new message
> > > to dick and jane, neither of whose email addresses I remember, I first query
> > > for dick using Q, then append to that a query for jane using A. Now both
> > > addresses appear on the query output listing. 
> > > 
> > > Question: How do I insert both addresses into the To: line, without typing
> > > one out the long way? 
> > 
> > This is what I do:
> > 
> > dick, jane
> 
> So do I, but isn't that:
> 
>   dick, jane

Ahem, sorry:

roman@roman ~ > grep complete-query .mail/mutt/muttrc
bind editor \Cd complete-query

So it's prolly  by default.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
8:50AM up 1 day, 19:45, 9 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.02, 0.00

Re: how best to use addressbook queries?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2001 23:37:31 -0700
> From: Mark Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: how best to use addressbook queries?
> 
> I'm using abook in mutt via query_command. Wishing to address a new message
> to dick and jane, neither of whose email addresses I remember, I first query
> for dick using Q, then append to that a query for jane using A. Now both
> addresses appear on the query output listing. 
> 
> Question: How do I insert both addresses into the To: line, without typing
> one out the long way? 

This is what I do:

dick, jane

HTH

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
8:00AM up 1 day, 18:55, 8 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.06, 0.07

Re: auto_view problem

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 14:07:56 -0500
> From: John P Verel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: auto_view problem
> 
> On 12/17/01, 07:32:36PM +0100, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > Hi there,
> > 
> > I started playing with auto_view, but stumbled upon a problem:
> > 
> > roman@roman ~ > grep tar-gz /usr/local/etc/mime.types
> > application/x-tar-gztgz tar.gz
> > roman@roman ~ > grep tar-gz ~/.mailcap
> > application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf -;copiousoutput
> > 
> > [-- Attachment #2: mutt-manual.html.tar.gz --]
> > [-- Type: application/x-tar-gz, Encoding: base64, Size: 96K --]
> > 
> > [-- application/x-tar-gz is unsupported (use 'v' to view this part) --]
> > 
> > application/x-tar-gz; gunzip -c %s|tar tf -;copiousoutput
> > 
> > or
> > 
> > application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf -;copiousoutput
>
> Missing dash in front of tar options, e.g.
> application/x-tar-gz; tar -tzf ;copiousoutput
> ??

No. All the variants I tried putting in my .mailcap work in the
shell, and adding the dash to the .mailcap entry didn't help either.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:02AM up 1 day, 17:57, 8 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.08, 0.06

auto_view problem

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

I started playing with auto_view, but stumbled upon a problem:

roman@roman ~ > grep tar-gz /usr/local/etc/mime.types
application/x-tar-gztgz tar.gz
roman@roman ~ > grep tar-gz ~/.mailcap
application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf -;copiousoutput

[-- Attachment #2: mutt-manual.html.tar.gz --]
[-- Type: application/x-tar-gz, Encoding: base64, Size: 96K --]

[-- application/x-tar-gz is unsupported (use 'v' to view this part) --]

application/x-tar-gz; gunzip -c %s|tar tf -;copiousoutput

or

application/x-tar-gz; tar tzf -;copiousoutput

didn't help either. Interestingly enough, this works just fine:

image/*; anytopnm %s|pnmscale -xs 70 |ppmtopgm|pgmtopbm|pbmtoascii; \
copiousoutput

Any ideas what's wrong?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:24PM up 6:19, 9 users, load averages: 0.12, 0.09, 0.05

Re: Mutt file browser question

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2001 19:13:08 +0300
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Mutt file browser question
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> I have all my mail sorted in a number of mailboxes and when I change
> from one to another (i.e. go to file browser and select needed mailbox)
> cursor is always at the top. Is it possible to make it stay on the last
> open file, not jump to the top?

I would also love to know if this is possible... If it's not, what
are the chances of this feature getting implemented?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:32PM up 4:27, 8 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.03, 0.00

Re: Mailing list replies

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2001 23:36:49 +0100
> From: Andreas Landmark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Mailing list replies
> 
> While we're on the subject of the difference of subscribe and lists, can
> anybody tell me how to get the functionality of subscribe (I.E.
> Mail-Followup-To set correctly), but still show the sender instead of
> the listname in the From-field in the mailbox-index?
 
I guess you're looking for manual-6.html#index_format, specifically
the %F expando. (The default value of $index_format contains %L
instead, the list address -- you don't need to see it in the index
when all the trafic from the list ends up in this folder. :)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
4:41PM up 3:36, 7 users, load averages: 0.01, 0.03, 0.00

Re: Changing file browser settings for Mail folder

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 22:27:48 +0100
> From: Balazs Javor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: MUTT Users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Changing file browser settings for Mail folder
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I was trying to change the folder_format for just my
> ~/Mail folder where I store my mailboxes.

Hi Balazs,

have you received a reply to your question off-list perhaps?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
3:28PM up 2:24, 7 users, load averages: 0.16, 0.07, 0.02

Re: setting content-type of attachments

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2001 13:14:35 +
> From: Bruno Postle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: setting content-type of attachments
> 
> On Thu 13-Dec-2001 at 11:53:10AM +0100, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > 
> > > I would be interested if somebody had a better solution involving
> > > mime-magic or something that didn't rely on file extensions.
> > 
> > Sorry for replying this late, but have you checked how file(1) works? 
> 
> Yep, it's something that looks-up magic numbers to identify filetypes,
> instead of relying on file extensions - Much like mime-magic.
> 
> Do you have a way of using it in mutt to set the mime-type of an
> attachment?

No. I guess mutt would have to use the code to gain this ability,
but I might be wrong.

Anyway, I just wanted to point out that there _is_ something that
can guess the mime type based on the contents of the file.
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
2:35PM up 51 days, 1:18, 13 users, load averages: 0.19, 0.26, 0.17

Email HowTo

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

here's the promised document. It's still in early stages, but should
give you an idea about what it'll look like, and where I'm heading with
it.

Another thing I should mention is the fact that I still haven't gotten
around to putting more energy into the coverage of the programs that
together create the email toolchain. Just a few snippets.

And one last note: I'm by no means an expert in either of the things I
cover in the howto, so please _do_ send me corrections if you find any
false statements or other nonsense.

TIA

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
1:49PM up 51 days, 32 mins, 13 users, load averages: 0.17, 0.13, 0.04



 ** THE MAIL HOWTO **
 * Using email on Unix the hard way *
 

## TODO: ##
### add "screenshots". super-mega-hyper cool, and useful. a single picture
saves a thousand words.
### add links to websites, and names of the authors of the individual
components used in this doc.
(links added)
### mailcap + mime.types
### "minitutorials" on individual components.
## :TODO #



1) SYNOPSIS

Email is perhaps the most widely used form of electronic communication.
Without all those servers running various flavors of Unix, there would be no
Internet, nor email. However, as you might have already found out, most
documents on setting up Unix hosts for email is aimed at the server side of
things, and seems to expect the reader already knows much about the topic.
Frankly, finding information on setting up your Unix workstation to handle
email aimed at users new to Unix is one of the harder parts of switching to the
new operating system.

Note: Unix is (R) of OpenGroup.




2) TARGET AUDIENCE

This HowTo is not for you if:
a) you prefer mouse over keyboard
b) you like html email
c) you can't be bothered to learn how to operate new software

But honestly, if you answered yes to any of the above questions, you should
probably not think about using Unix at all.

This HowTo is for you if:
a) you handle large amounts of email (twice so if substantive amount comes
   from various mailing lists)
b) you want to handle your email effectively
c) you are just plain 'techy' in general

Before reading this document you should:

* have a Unix-like operating system installed on a computer connected to
  Internet (I'm running FreeBSD, which means that you should also be able
  to adjust the FreeBSD-specific details to your system if you're running
  Linux for example)
* be capable of basic shell operations (creating directories, changing
  permissions, etc.)
* be able to edit files in a text editor
* know how to install additional third-party software. This means you must
  be able to type (on FreeBSD, that is)
  # cd /usr/ports/foo/bar
  # make install
  or
  # pkg_add foo-1.0.tgz
  or (on RedHat Linux)
  # rpm -i foo-1.0-i686.rpm

The following skills are not absolutely required, but would help a lot:

* basic knowledge of regular expressions

Note however that some of the packages described in this document are
configured with the use of regular expressions, while others employ downright
cryptographic format for their configuration files! As a rule of thumb, the
approach excercised in this howto is not for the faint of heart or lazy.

After reading this document you will:

* know what software components are involved in manipulating email
* have a functional email subsystem on your personal computer running
  a Unix-like operating system.



3) THE PROBLEM

To put it straight: configuring your Unix workstation to receive and send mail
can prove to be hell.  While Windows, MacOS, and alike were designed to be
usable even by (almost) completely clueless people, abstracting the fact that
the user is in fact operating a computer, and the way it works away from the
user, unices expose the gory details to the user.
After all, operating systems like FreeBSD, Solaris or Linux, do not strive to
be the system of choice for my granny. They don't attempt to amuse their users
with bells and wistles, they strive to be technically superior, even at the
expense of point'n'click eyecandy.

Of course. There's Netscape Communicator available for Unix (the Linux binary
runs--of course--on FreeBSD), there's Mozilla...  And numerous other, far less
resource-hungry X11-based mail clients.  All you need to do to continue to use
your mail (and web) if you switch from windows or mac to a Unix flavor is to
install mozilla or netscape, click through the wizard, and you're set up.

Except, well, that netscape 4.x won't allow you to use more than one pop3
server, and mozilla is a resource hog. Plus, why the heck do I have to take my
hand off the keyboard, and click the button when I could just as well just 
press a key, and be done with it in a hundredth of the time? These all-in-one
packages are really all in one, all or nothing, bringing the windows
philosophy to Unix. 



4) THE GOAL

The goal this document is to help you understand how to set 

Re: Negative scores and regexp questions

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 16:55:39 +0100
> From: Cliff Sarginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mutt Users' List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Negative scores and regexp questions
> 
> On Wed, Dec 12, 2001 at 04:23:51PM +0100, Christian Ordig wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 12, 2001 at 06:00:36AM -0500, David T-G wrote:
> > > I'm in the same boat, in fact :-)  What we really need is for active
> > > scorers to reply!
> > ok. here I is one ...
> > > 
> > > If you tried to implement all of that, with those incremental tests, in
> > > procmail your rules would be ugly *and* you'd have a lot of duplication
> > > (I imagine the same sorts of problems would apply to any filter, but I
> > > dunno from maildrop or the others recently mentioned -- yet).
> > That's the point. Imagine someone you don't really care about.
> 
> Ok, that is a good explanation.
> It still does sound a little complex (since you have been the only
> "active" scorer to reply so far, it does not seem widely used).
> Interesting though, I have a *prime* candidate for a person on a
> particular list (I won't name list or person, but it's no-one on
> this list .. unless he lurks..) whose messages I usually crudely filter into
> a mailbox called "bollocks". Unfortunately he sometimes appears cc'ed
> or to'ed or whatever on a subject I want to hear about. Sounds like
> scoring might help.

I think I know the name of the person, and this is what I have in my
.maildroprc:

if (/^Received: from .*hisdomain\.com/)
{
to "$MAILDIR/trash"
}

This catchis only those messages that he has sent to the list,
leaving those that have been cc'd to him pass as usual.

HTH.
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
12:12PM up 50 days, 22:55, 13 users, load averages: 0.07, 0.15, 0.17

Re: setting content-type of attachments

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2001 18:49:15 +
> From: Bruno Postle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: setting content-type of attachments
> 
> On Sun 02-Dec-2001 at 07:34:42PM +0100, René Clerc wrote:
> > 
> > how does Mutt derive what to set the Content Type of attachments to?
> 
> Mainly from looking it up in the /etc/mime.types and ~/.mime.types
> files.
> 
> 
> I would be interested if somebody had a better solution involving
> mime-magic or something that didn't rely on file extensions.

Sorry for replying this late, but have you checked how file(1)
works? 
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
11:36AM up 50 days, 22:19, 13 users, load averages: 0.04, 0.09, 0.08

"subscribe" and "lists" commands

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

the post about anding / oring values of these variables (ok, so they're
listed as commands :) reminded me of one thing that was a somewhat
unpleasant surprise when I started using mutt... I never got around
asking about it, so here you are. :)

I was quite surprised to find out that the patterns you give to
"subscribe" are anchored at the beginning; I would certainly expect them
to be anchored at the end of the string: I don't want to get into the
"most sites do it this or that way", so instead lemme give you an
example:

instead of 
subscribe php-dev php-qa pear-dev jitterbug

I could've just have
subscribe lists.php.net

and instead of 
subscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

subscribe lists.horde.org
would have been enough


It's obvious that this behavior is not going to change after it's been
in use for so long, I'm just curious about the reasons that lead to the
current behavior.

And, as a bonus question: would it be possible to add RE support to
"subscribe" and "lists"?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:34PM up 49 days, 6:17, 13 users, load averages: 0.34, 0.15, 0.10

Re: are options replaced or and'ed?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2001 10:10:24 -0800
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: are options replaced or and'ed?
> From: Peter Jay Salzman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> setting an option like "lists", are: 
> 
>   lists '[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] \
>   [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] \
>   [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> 
> and
> 
>   lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>   lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>   lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> equivalent?   or do susequent "lists" directives replace earlier ones?

I don't know about "lists", but "subscribe" lines are definitely
anded, and I have this feeling that "mailboxes" is the same.
Why don't you try it?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:24PM up 49 days, 6:07, 13 users, load averages: 0.13, 0.11, 0.08

tag-(thread|pattern) in pager

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

I'd like to be able to use tag-thread, tag-subthred, tag-pattern in
the pager view. Looks like they're not defined in the pager map
(1.3.23i) are there any plans to include them in pager map, and if not,
would I (as someone who is not very good in C) be able to hack this in
myself? Where should I look?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:58PM up 48 days, 6:41, 13 users, load averages: 0.15, 0.17, 0.14

Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2001 22:39:22 +0530
> From: Prahlad Vaidyanathan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc: Eric Kidd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Robert R. Wal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>Cliff Sarginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>David T-G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]
> 
> Since you are interested in both scoring, and anti-spam filters, I
> thought I'd point you to this : 
> 
> http://ceti.pl/~kravietz/spamrc/spamrc.php3
> 
> Seems real impressive, though I've never used it. It does use procmail
> though, and I can already see some people scoffing at it :-)
> 
> Anyway, do post your results. I, for one, enjoy getting my hands on new
> documentation on Email - the concept never ceases to amaze me !

Thanks, I'll definitely take a look. I saw TMDA mentioned in
freebsd-questions@ just a few hours ago, but haven't gotten around
to put more time in it than just 
   
> sudo sh -c "cd /usr/ports/mail/tmda && make install"

Does anyone on the list use it?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
6:54PM up 48 days, 5:37, 13 users, load averages: 0.05, 0.13, 0.08

Re: spamcop forwarding redux

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2001 09:30:38 -0800
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: spamcop forwarding redux
> From: Peter Jay Salzman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> combining all 3 ideas that were posted to this list, i have:
> 
>   macro pager \Cf "[EMAIL PROTECTED]\n\n"
> 
> there are still two problems:
> 
> 1.  when forwarding (as opposed to bouncing), mutt places me in
> an editor (vim).   is there a way to tell mutt to ixnay the
>editing here?

no idea here.
 
> 2.  mutt trims the headers (which makes this macro useless).  is
> there a  type directive i can give in the
>macro?

display-toggle-weed

> i'm reading the mutt manual, but it's slow going.  i'm on line 800 of 6000
> and i feel like i've been reading forever.   i've already finished 2 huge
> cups of coffee...:-)

there'll be more. :)

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
6:45PM up 48 days, 5:28, 13 users, load averages: 0.04, 0.08, 0.04

Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

thanks everyone for the kind responses. See below for comments.

> From: Thorsten Haude <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]
> 
> Very, very good idea. I found that many people know about email, and
> you can even find people eating sendmail.cfs for breakfest, but there
> are few or none documents covering the middle ground.

Yes, that made me think about writing this document. No
documentation is needed to use the mailer in Mozilla and such,
there's lots of stuff on doing particular things with sendmail,
postfix, whatever, but virtually none that would tell a naive user
_what_ sendmail is; where it fits in the big picture of
sending/receiving email.

> I did something /much/ smaller at www.vranx.de/mail/mail.html. Please
> find errors.

I think it's bad practice to reinject mail by SMTP. As noted in the
getmail docs (IIRC), this can easily lead to loops and bounces.

> A similar thing may even hold true for your docuentation: Keep at
> least part of it so /small/ that nobody will be deters by the size
> alone.

This is a valuable hint I'll try to keep on my mind. 

Thanks!


> From: Cliff Sarginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]
> 
> Mutt
> 
> Explain scoring and how it can be used.

Ok. Will require me to start using it, or someone else to write such
a section.

> I am sure I am not the first to be suprised by what the arrow keys do
> when you are in the pager with part of the index displayed
> on the screen (jumps to the next index entry rather than goes
> down the text being paged).

Well, this one is... There are two things you might want j/k do in
pager: jump to prev/next message, or scroll by one line. I had these
keys originally rebound to do the scrolling, but went back later. I
still haven't figured out suitable keys for the scrolling, but will
cover this in the howto. 

> And lots and lots of other things.
> Maybe later when I am less tired I may send some more :)

Looking forward. :)

> In general.
> Tell them there are other (safer,securer,simpler) MTA's than sendmail.

Sure. A snip from the HowTo:
"It is a full-blown SMTP server, and one that's notoriously known
for its cryptic configuration. We'll ditch it."

> Warn them that procmail is a nightmare invented by someone with
> a grudge against the human race, and eats cpu cycles like they
> are going out of fashion.

Well, since I saw quite a few bitter remarks about procmail, and
since maildrop is really easier on the eye, I use that. But... I'd
like to make use (in the howto, I don't care much, personally) of
some of the antispam filter packages, I was contemplating plugging
procmail either between getmail and maildrop, or inside .maildroprc.
(Procmail would be used as a 'black box', receiving minimal coverage
in the howto.) This would of course create additional load, which
I'd like to avoid. Are there any [good] antispam filter packages for
maildrop?

> That mutt is an MUA and it's inbuilt pop capabilities are
> strictly last-resort.
> 
> If you can clear up for beginners where an MTA ends and an MDA
> begins that would help. Since MTA's are also "MDA's" (in the
> literal sense of the words), it is better to see MDA's as a delivery
> processing agent (or whatever).

Yes. This is where it began. To explain the terms. Later is began
growing in the direction "the terms mean this-and-that, the programs
are this-and-that, and you set them up this-and-that way". 

> From: David T-G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]
> 
> I'd love to see it!

I have the latest revision at home, but will post it tomorrow.
 
> You might also see how you could contribute to the mutt-newbie guide
> (surf over to
> 
>   http://mutt-newbie.sourceforge.net

Will take a look. thanks.
 

> From: Prahlad Vaidyanathan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]
> 
> Not really - here are some stuff I thought was lacking :
> 
> - Scoring

Well, since there were two replies to my message mentioning the
scoring coverage in the mutt manual as lacking, maybe the manual
itself should be improved?
 
> - A list of apps to be used in the mailcap file .I've tried to collate
> whatever I could find at http://www.symonds.net/~prahladv/mutt.html.

Yes. .mailcap is definitely among things that need to be covered.
Thanks for the URL.
 
> - Some notes on email etiquette : sig-dashes, mail-followup-to, etc.

Good idea, thank you!

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
1:05PM up 47 days, 23:48, 13 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.06, 0.02

Re: A couple of probably dumb questions :)

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 12:48:04 +0100
> From: Cliff Sarginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: A couple of probably dumb questions  :)
> 
> On Sat, Dec 08, 2001 at 09:07:35AM +, Thomas Hurst wrote:
> > * Thomas Hurst ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > 
> > > Unfortunately, short of shooting anyone who ignores Mail-Followup-To,
> > > I don't think there's a workable solution.  About the best way I can
> > > think of is on every list delivery, scan Inbox for the message id (and
> > > same/similar content if I'm feeling paranoid) and if it's found, nuke
> > > it.  That's rather expensive though :)
> > 
> > Actually, a better solution would be to do this filtering before final
> > delivery; have fetchmail deliver to a small agent which queues messages
> > for a minute and then weeds out dupes based on a few simple rules
> > (prefer one with ML-alike headers, for instance), before inserting it's
> > queue into the MDA.
> > 
> > Hmm..
> 
> A better solution is to write an MDA that was not written with
> Klingons in mind (and I am not talking about regexps, they are
> inescapable) and doesn't *consume* system resources in the way
> procmail does.
> 
> It is a project I am tinkering with, still at the stage of some
> ideas written with a pencil on a scrap of paper.. but maybe..

Hi Cliff,

have you checked out maildrop?
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
11:35AM up 47 days, 22:18, 13 users, load averages: 0.10, 0.05, 0.01

Re: LWN

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2001 10:42:07 +0100
> From: Thomas Roessler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Mutt Users List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: LWN
> 
> On 2001-12-06 23:35:43 +0530, Prahlad Vaidyanathan wrote:
> 
> >In particular,  evolution (1) is bad at noticing PGP errors, (2) doesn't
> >support rules like "always encrypt mail to so-and-so" and (3) replies to
> >encrypted messages with quoted, unencrypted bodies by default (a
> >*serious* security hole that it shares with Mutt).
> 
> >Why does he mention (3) as a security hole ?
> 
> Probably because (3) is indeed mutt's default behaviour - but 
> actually something PGP-using people will normally configure 
> differently.
> 
> But ok, that's the general problem with mutt for most users:  It has 
> to be configured properly.

Does that mean that the default configuration is improper?

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
11:33AM up 44 days, 22:16, 6 users, load averages: 0.00, 0.01, 0.00

Email HowTo [was: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail]

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Subject: Re: Searching big gobs of e-mail
> From: Eric Kidd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Robert R. Wal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Date: 06 Dec 2001 17:06:43 -0500
> 
> [A bit of UI criticism: The main mutt UI is very good (it even includes
> a menu bar of all important commands for novice users!), but these
> extended features lack "discoverability"--they can't be figured out
> simply by screwing around with the program.  A HOWTO would have been
> very helpful.]

I'm writing [somewhat slowly] an email howto which covers mutt
(among other things). It's aimed at helping unix newbies grok the
new terminology (MUA, MTA, MDA), and set their machines up for email
"the hard way" (ie. avioding Mozilla etc., and going the
"traditional" way instead - getmail, stunnel, maildrop, mutt, pgp,
vim, abook, nullmailer, .mailcaap, etc.). Right now, it mostly
covers stuff I, and one of my friends found underdocumented or hard
to grasp, and where I write about mutt, I mostly cover the way _I_
use it (of course).

So... I would really like to get some info from others: what parts
of mutt's documentation have you found lacking? What are your
patterns of use of mutt, and did you have hard time setting it up
the way you wanted, or was everything you needed obvious from the
manual?
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
11:10AM up 44 days, 21:53, 6 users, load averages: 0.01, 0.03, 0.00

Re: matching in hooks

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2001 12:17:31 +0100
> From: René Clerc <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: mutt-users <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: matching in hooks
> 
> * Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [05-12-2001 12:06]:
> 
> | Hi there,
> | 
> | I started playing with hooks, and can't get one thing to work:
> | 
> | Let's say I want to have a different signature when mailing/replying to
> | [EMAIL PROTECTED] I put this in my .muttrc:
> | 
> | send-hook . 'set signature = ~/bin/signature|'
> | send-hook '~e john@doe\\.com' 'set signature="FUBAR"'
> | 
> | When I start mutt with this config, and locate a mail from john doe with
> | /~e john@doe\.com
> | (i. e. the pattern matches), and hit r, I get the regular signature, not
> | the customized one. 
> | 
> | What ad I doing wrong?
> 
> Spotted in TFM:
> 
> ~e EXPR message which contains EXPR in the ``Sender'' field
> 
> In your scenario, John Doe isn't the sender, *you* are the sender.
> John Doe was the sender of the mail you received from him, but since
> you're replying, there is a new message, which contains John Doe as
> recipient, not as sender.
> 
> You'll probably want one of these: ~C, ~c or ~t.
> 
> HTH,
 
Yes, that was it. Thanks a lot.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
1:12PM up 42 days, 23:55, 13 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.05, 0.06

matching in hooks

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

I started playing with hooks, and can't get one thing to work:

Let's say I want to have a different signature when mailing/replying to
[EMAIL PROTECTED] I put this in my .muttrc:

send-hook . 'set signature = ~/bin/signature|'
send-hook '~e john@doe\\.com' 'set signature="FUBAR"'

When I start mutt with this config, and locate a mail from john doe with
/~e john@doe\.com
(i. e. the pattern matches), and hit r, I get the regular signature, not
the customized one. 

What ad I doing wrong?

TIA

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
12:03PM up 42 days, 22:46, 13 users, load averages: 0.02, 0.06, 0.05

Re: color problems after upgrade

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Tue, 4 Dec 2001 06:11:14 -0700
> To: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: color problems after upgrade
> From: Dave Price <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> also, when i try to set:
> 
> color  body  black  default
> 
> i get "too few arguments"? hmmm

color body black default .*

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
2:28PM up 42 days, 1:11, 14 users, load averages: 0.21, 0.13, 0.05

Re: a hook entered upon sending a message?

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 15:04:22 -0500
> From: David T-G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mutt Users' List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: a hook entered upon sending a message?
> 
> Roman --
> 
> ...and then Roman Neuhauser said...
> % Hi there,
> % 
> % is there a means to let mutt perform an action on the message it sends
> % out _when_ it sends it? All the documented hooks take place long before
> 
> Not AFAIK.

Any plans to implement this feature?
 
> % this happens... To be more specific, I'm looking for a way to delay the
> % inserting of the signature until the moment the message goes off. 
> % I know my own signature, I don't need to see it every time I write an
> % email. :)
> 
> If it really bothers you that much, unset $signature and $sig_dashes and
> then modify your editor command to append your signature file onto the
> temp file after the real editor completes.  Note that re-editing a file
> will cause duplicate signatures, so you might also tell your editor to
> find the sig_dashes and delete from there down before jumping back to
> the beginning of the message.

Yeah, I figured out it'd be probably left for vim to do this. Then
again, (I'm no vim-hacker) there are at least three ways to quit
from vim, saving the buffer, which means I'd have to noremap all of 
them... Unless I'm missing a way to avoid this. Ok, time to mail 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] :)

> The code is left as an exercise for the reader ;-)

No problem. Thanks for the reply.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
9:16PM up 41 days, 7:59, 16 users, load averages: 0.13, 0.31, 0.26

function mail unavailable in the browser menu

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

what is the rationale behind making the mail function unavailable in the
browser menu? The need to enter a mailbox just to send a mail has
bothered me for some time, and when I finally went to bind it, I
realized I was out of luck... :|

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
7:47PM up 41 days, 6:30, 17 users, load averages: 0.15, 0.12, 0.05

a hook entered upon sending a message?

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

is there a means to let mutt perform an action on the message it sends
out _when_ it sends it? All the documented hooks take place long before
this happens... To be more specific, I'm looking for a way to delay the
inserting of the signature until the moment the message goes off. 
I know my own signature, I don't need to see it every time I write an
email. :)

TIA

-- 
Roamn
 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:39PM up 41 days, 4:22, 16 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.03, 0.04

Re: Limiting max text width

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2001 05:52:19 -0500
> From: David T-G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mutt Users' List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: Odhiambo Washington <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Limiting max text width
> 
> ...and then Odhiambo Washington said...
> % 
> % A quick and dumb one: How do I limit my e-mails to 70 cols in .muttrc??
> % I want lines to wrap auto at 70.
> 
> Do you mean for viewing or editing?  The latter is an editor question,
> usually solved in vi with "set wm=" or vim with "set tw=70".
> The former is one I haven't yet seen; mutt will wrap long lines and
> optionally put in markers for you, but I don't know how to get it to wrap
> earlier than the screen edge.

I think you could set your MDA to pass messages through a reformatter,
or perhaps this can be done on individual messages from inside mutt.
I've been thinking about the same recently, and the thought of 
unattended email munging gave creeps, but I might go for it anyway 
once I feel comfortable enough about the software that would do this 
task...

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:51PM up 37 days, 4:34, 18 users, load averages: 0.10, 0.08, 0.05

Re: New Mutt User Question

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2001 17:21:35 +0100
> From: Thorsten Haude <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: New Mutt User Question
> 
> Hi,
> 
> * Ken Ficara <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [01-11-29 16:58]:
> >I have a directory full of Unix mailboxes. I put a statement into my
> >.muttrc like so:
> >
> > set folder="/path/to/my/directory/of/mailboxes"
> >
> >I then start mutt so:
> >
> > mutt -y
> >
> >and mutt sez
> >
> > No incoming mailboxes defined.
> >
> >Huh? What am I doing wrong?
> Nothing that I know of, but you leave something out:
>   mailboxes `find /path/to/my/directory/of/mailboxes -type f -print | grep -Ev 
>'(log|backup|sent|postponed|trash)' | xargs`
> Somebody asked me about the xarg, and I couldn't really say whether
> Mutt accepts one mailbox per line. I never tried: Never change a
> running system.
> $folder sets only the '=' and '+' special variables. I think.

This is my version (single line in my .muttrc):
mailboxes `find ~/Mail/ -type f | perl -ne 'chomp; print "$_ "
unless m/^.*(postponed|sent|trash)$/'

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
5:56PM up 37 days, 4:39, 18 users, load averages: 0.09, 0.05, 0.04

problematic behavior

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

I don't know whether this is really a bug, or something configurable,
but I have this problem with mutt (1.3.23i) I'd like to have solved.

This is when it shows up:

enter an embox
do nothing in it AFTER it's got new mail
go to the mailboxes view
enter a different mbox

I end up in the one I left.

Roman
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
2:11PM up 8 days, 54 mins, 15 users, load averages: 0.07, 0.09, 0.08

Re: color

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 13:20:53 -0500 (EST)
> From: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: color
> 
> On Thu, 1 Nov 2001, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> 
> > > Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 10:54:42 -0500 (EST)
> > > From: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > Subject: Re: color
> > >
> > > On Thu, 1 Nov 2001, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > >
> > > > > what was $TERM before you set rxvt.termName ?
> > > >
> > > > just xterm.
> > >
> > > "xterm" is usually the same as "xterm-r6" (no color).
> > >
> > > (but "xterm-color" isn't correct - would be nice if FreeBSD installed the
> > > correct termcap entries so this wasn't something I had to point out
> > > periodically).
> >
> > I don't say it's correct. I _don't_ know the correct value. I've seen
> > this suggested on freebsd-questions@, and it works. But if you tell me
> > the correct value, I'll be happy to change the setting.
> 
> Usually (except of course the suggestions which are secondhand or worse)
> the suggestion is based on the fact that FreeBSD doesn't install a termcap
> entry for anything more appropriate.
> 
> There is a termcap file distributed with rxvt and one with XFree86 xterm.
> I'd start with those (preferring "rxvt" and "xterm-xfree86").  FreeBSD
> uses a compiled database for termcap, iirc under /usr/share/misc.  Edit
> (save the original of course) the termcap file, putting the new entries at
> the beginning.  Recompile the termcap database (I don't recall the name of
> the command - something like make_capdb - there is a manpage for it).
> 
> There is also a better termcap file here (but doesn't necessarily include
> a few of the specialized console types for FreeBSD):
> 
> ftp://invisible-island.net/ncurses/termcap.src.gz
 
Hi Thomas,

thank you for your answer. I don't know if it means anything, but my
termcap already contained a rxvt entry, with a comment that it's taken
from the rxvt-2.6.3 sources, which is what I use. I rebuilt the database
just to be sure, commented out the rxvt.termName line in my .Xdefaults
file, and opened a new terminal window (rxvt):
   
roman@roman ~ > grep termName .Xdefaults 
! rxvt.termName: xterm-color
roman@roman ~ > echo $TERM
xterm
   
Next, I put the two rxvt entries (rxvt-basic and rxvt) from
termcap.src.gz in my /usr/share/misc/termcap, and got these two
messages upon issuing cap_mkdb:

cap_mkdb: record not tc expanded: rxvt|rxvt terminal emulator (X
 Window System)
cap_mkdb: record not tc expanded: rxvt|rxvt terminal emulator (X
 Window System)
  
Whassup?

Besides, termcap.src.gz says 'rxvt is normally configured to look for
"xterm" or "xterm-color" as $TERM. Since rxvt is not really compatible
with xterm, it should be configured as "rxvt" (monochrome) and
"rxvt-color"'. What does that mean for me? 

Thank you for your patience.
   
Roman

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
12:26PM up 9 days, 23:09, 15 users, load averages: 0.71, 0.65, 0.57

Re: color

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 10:54:42 -0500 (EST)
> From: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: color
> 
> On Thu, 1 Nov 2001, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> 
> > > what was $TERM before you set rxvt.termName ?
> >
> > just xterm.
> 
> "xterm" is usually the same as "xterm-r6" (no color).
> 
> (but "xterm-color" isn't correct - would be nice if FreeBSD installed the
> correct termcap entries so this wasn't something I had to point out
> periodically).

I don't say it's correct. I _don't_ know the correct value. I've seen 
this suggested on freebsd-questions@, and it works. But if you tell me 
the correct value, I'll be happy to change the setting.

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
6:18PM up 9 days, 5:01, 15 users, load averages: 0.18, 0.13, 0.09

Re: color

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 09:35:11 -0500 (EST)
> From: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: color
> 
> On Thu, 1 Nov 2001, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> 
> > > did you use curses/ncurses or slang?
> > > rxvt sets $COLORTERM, which is used by slang to circumvent the normal
> > > setting of $TERM.
> >
> > I have installed mutt from the port with the default settings.
> > Looking in the makefile doesn't reveal anything suspicious, so I
> > guess mutt's chose either of them: ncurses is part of the base
> > system on FreeBSD, and I have libslang 1.4.4_1 port installed too.
> > $COLORTERM is rxvt-xpm, so I guess that indicates mutt is linked
> > against ncurses, right?
> 
> what was $TERM before you set rxvt.termName ?
   
just xterm.
   
> (your version summary says mutt is linked with ncurses 5.1, which sounds
> reasonable)

heh, yes, I originally missed the System: line, and looked for it in
the Compile options list.
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
3:44PM up 9 days, 2:27, 14 users, load averages: 0.08, 0.14, 0.10

Re: color

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 06:39:01 -0500 (EST)
> From: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: color
> 
> On Thu, 1 Nov 2001, Roman Neuhauser wrote:
> > If xterm-color is incorrect, what should the value be?
> > BTW, 1.2.5 displayed colors in rxvt without this hack,
> > 1.3.23i didn't display colors until I put
> > rxtv.termName = xterm-color in my .Xdefaults.
> 
> did you use curses/ncurses or slang?
> rxvt sets $COLORTERM, which is used by slang to circumvent the normal
> setting of $TERM.

I have installed mutt from the port with the default settings.
Looking in the makefile doesn't reveal anything suspicious, so I
guess mutt's chose either of them: ncurses is part of the base
system on FreeBSD, and I have libslang 1.4.4_1 port installed too.
$COLORTERM is rxvt-xpm, so I guess that indicates mutt is linked
against ncurses, right? 

mutt -v:
Mutt 1.3.23i (2001-10-09)
Copyright (C) 1996-2001 Michael R. Elkins and others.
Mutt comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `mutt -vv'.
Mutt is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it
under certain conditions; type `mutt -vv' for details.

System: FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE [using ncurses 5.1]
Compile options:
-DOMAIN
+DEBUG
-HOMESPOOL  +USE_SETGID  +USE_DOTLOCK  +DL_STANDALONE  
-USE_FCNTL  +USE_FLOCK
-USE_POP  -USE_IMAP  -USE_GSS  -USE_SSL  -USE_SASL  
+HAVE_REGCOMP  -USE_GNU_REGEX  
+HAVE_COLOR  +HAVE_START_COLOR  +HAVE_TYPEAHEAD  +HAVE_BKGDSET  
+HAVE_CURS_SET  +HAVE_META  +HAVE_RESIZETERM  
+HAVE_PGP  -BUFFY_SIZE -EXACT_ADDRESS  -SUN_ATTACHMENT  
+ENABLE_NLS  -LOCALES_HACK  -HAVE_WC_FUNCS  -HAVE_LANGINFO_CODESET
-HAVE_LANGIFO_YESEXPR  
+HAVE_ICONV  -ICONV_NONTRANS  +HAVE_GETSID  -HAVE_GETADDRINFO  
ISPELL="/usr/local/bin/ispell"
SENDMAIL="/usr/sbin/sendmail"
MAILPATH="/var/mail"
PKGDATADIR="/usr/local/share/mutt"
SYSCONFDIR="/usr/local/etc"
EXECSHELL="/bin/sh"
-MIXMASTER

TIA
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
2:59PM up 9 days, 1:42, 18 users, load averages: 0.05, 0.12, 0.09

Re: color

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2001 13:56:52 -0500 (EST)
> From: "Thomas E. Dickey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Daniel Farnsworth Teichert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: color
> 
> On Wed, 31 Oct 2001, Daniel Farnsworth Teichert wrote:
> 
> > When I was first messing around with Mutt I had similar
> > troubles when trying to use a regular old xterm. It
> > seems like I found that setting the environment variable
> > TERM to color_xterm instead of just xterm made it work.
> > Calling xterm with the -tn color_xterm flag has a similar
> > effect, I think.
> 
> color_xterm is similar to xterm-color, and both are incorrect for XFree86
> xterm and rxvt (ditto Eterm and aterm, konsole and gnome-terminal).
 
If xterm-color is incorrect, what should the value be?
BTW, 1.2.5 displayed colors in rxvt without this hack,
1.3.23i didn't display colors until I put 
rxtv.termName = xterm-color in my .Xdefaults.

TIA

-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
10:30AM up 8 days, 21:13, 14 users, load averages: 0.06, 0.06, 0.02

Re: PGP

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 21:04:51 -0600
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: PGP
> From: "Stephen E. Hargrove" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> i'm trying to get mutt working with GnuPGP.  mutt.org states:
> 
> Go to the contrib subdirectory of the source tree.  You'll find
> three files there, pgp2.rc, pgp5.rc, and gpg.rc.  These files
> contain ready-to-use configurations for using mutt with pgp2, pgp5,
> and gpg.
> 
> when i go to ftp.mutt.org, i'm presented with the following:
> 
> ftp://ftp.mutt.org/
> Name Type Size Time
> Freie_Software_und_IT_Sicherheit Directory 2001.04.20 09:18:00
> GnuPG Directory 2001.06.19 13:02:00
> fruis Directory 2001.04.20 09:18:00
> gcrypt Directory 2001.06.19 13:02:00
> mutt Directory 2001.10.10 12:12:00
> people Directory 2001.04.23 18:48:00
> pub Directory 2001.04.23 18:48:00
> welcome.msg MSG 1 KB 2001.04.04 14:34:00
> 
> when i click on on anything, it presents me with the exact same directory structure. 
> it's been doing this for 2 days now.  anyone know where i can get a copy of gpg.rc?
> 
> thanks.

I also see this when I access ftp.mutt.org with Opera. It's ok if I
use ncftp. So I suggest you try something like that.
   
-- 
FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE
10:04AM up 5 days, 20:47, 9 users, load averages: 0.10, 0.06, 0.02

Re: no color in 1.3.23i

[Roman Neuhauser]

> Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 11:32:18 +0200
> From: Roman Neuhauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: no color in 1.3.23i
> 
> Hi there,
> 
> I have 1.3.23i running on FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE (installed from the port),
> and looks like I can't get color support. I had 1.2.5i on this box
> (colors worked just fine), also installed from the port, deinstalled it,
> and installed the 1.3.23i version. Same ~/.mutt/muttrc, which _is_ used
> (every other setting is applied) but no color. I have 1.3.22(i?) on
> another FreeBSD 4.4-RELEASE box, and the same muttrc gives me colors.
> The 1.3.22 mutt is installed from the package.
> 
> Now, I've read somewhere that mutt has (had) problems with detecting
> color support, but mutt -v seems to indicate that this is not the case.
> Is this is a known problem, or is it a PEBKAC?
 
Turned out I needed setenv TERM xterm-color.
Sorry for the bother.

Roman

no color in 1.3.23i

[Roman Neuhauser]

Hi there,

I have 1.3.23i running on FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE (installed from the port),
and looks like I can't get color support. I had 1.2.5i on this box
(colors worked just fine), also installed from the port, deinstalled it,
and installed the 1.3.23i version. Same ~/.mutt/muttrc, which _is_ used
(every other setting is applied) but no color. I have 1.3.22(i?) on
another FreeBSD 4.4-RELEASE box, and the same muttrc gives me colors.
The 1.3.22 mutt is installed from the package.

Now, I've read somewhere that mutt has (had) problems with detecting
color support, but mutt -v seems to indicate that this is not the case.
Is this is a known problem, or is it a PEBKAC?

TIA

roman@roman ~ > mutt -v
Mutt 1.3.23i (2001-10-09)
Copyright (C) 1996-2001 Michael R. Elkins and others.
Mutt comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `mutt -vv'.
Mutt is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it
under certain conditions; type `mutt -vv' for details.

System: FreeBSD 4.4-STABLE [using ncurses 5.1]
Compile options:
-DOMAIN
+DEBUG
-HOMESPOOL  +USE_SETGID  +USE_DOTLOCK  +DL_STANDALONE  
-USE_FCNTL  +USE_FLOCK
-USE_POP  -USE_IMAP  -USE_GSS  -USE_SSL  -USE_SASL  
+HAVE_REGCOMP  -USE_GNU_REGEX  
+HAVE_COLOR  +HAVE_START_COLOR  +HAVE_TYPEAHEAD  +HAVE_BKGDSET  
+HAVE_CURS_SET  +HAVE_META  +HAVE_RESIZETERM  
+HAVE_PGP  -BUFFY_SIZE -EXACT_ADDRESS  -SUN_ATTACHMENT  
+ENABLE_NLS  -LOCALES_HACK  -HAVE_WC_FUNCS  -HAVE_LANGINFO_CODESET
-HAVE_LANGINFO_YESEXPR  
+HAVE_ICONV  -ICONV_NONTRANS  +HAVE_GETSID  -HAVE_GETADDRINFO  
ISPELL="/usr/local/bin/ispell"
SENDMAIL="/usr/sbin/sendmail"
MAILPATH="/var/mail"
PKGDATADIR="/usr/local/share/mutt"
SYSCONFDIR="/usr/local/etc"
EXECSHELL="/bin/sh"
-MIXMASTER