Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sun, 9 May 2004 17:01:37 -0400 Todd Slater [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: alt.binaries.sounds.ogg alt.binaries.sounds.lossless But shhh. Too late; I overheard something. Todd -- David E. Fox Thanks for letting me [EMAIL PROTECTED]change magnetic patterns [EMAIL PROTECTED] on your hard disk. --- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sun, 9 May 2004 09:56:00 -0400 Ronald J. Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tom, I've used the XMMS diskwriter route to burning audio CD's here ever since the first time I saw you post it some time back... :-) Me too :), and probably longer. I'm very happy with it for two reasons - one, it's very fast, and two, it's the only method, so far that I've found, that'll decode variable-rate mp3s. -- David E. Fox Thanks for letting me [EMAIL PROTECTED]change magnetic patterns [EMAIL PROTECTED] on your hard disk. --- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sun, 9 May 2004 14:12:37 -0400 Greg Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sunday 09 May 2004 01:23 pm, Tom Brinkman wrote: It's actually much easier to hear with earphones, which is the only way my wife will let me listen to my music. :-) Speaking of headphone listening, have you done any experimenting with 'sox' and its 'earwax' option? -- David E. Fox Thanks for letting me [EMAIL PROTECTED]change magnetic patterns [EMAIL PROTECTED] on your hard disk. --- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Fri, May 14, 2004 at 02:01:46PM -0700, David E. Fox wrote: On Sun, 9 May 2004 14:12:37 -0400 Greg Meyer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sunday 09 May 2004 01:23 pm, Tom Brinkman wrote: It's actually much easier to hear with earphones, which is the only way my wife will let me listen to my music. :-) Speaking of headphone listening, have you done any experimenting with 'sox' and its 'earwax' option? I tried it and didn't like it. This was on a low-quality ogg (-q 3) I was playing though earphone on my Zaurus. It sounded really tinny to me. Todd Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Saturday 08 May 2004 03:03 pm, Greg Meyer wrote: -I'll give a prize to the first poster that can recognize the song I used by -listening to this. I did compress it again to save bandwidth, but it won't -change your impreion about how much of a track is lost when it is -compressed, even at a high quality like I did here. - -http://cybercfo.gkmweb.com/diff_q6.ogg Queen...Crazy Little Thing Called Love...or something like that? We have a winner. I said you'd get a prize, but I lied :-p It is really astounding to me that one can figure out the song from listening to the difference between the original and the compressed version. Hell, I'm still tryin to figure out what y'all are talkin about ;)Not to hijack, but I will since the original query seems to be satisfied ;) I'm still stuck in mp3. I've got a paid news server (giganews). Just about any artist and their albums are available, anytime, but only as mp3's. Most are 160 or higher encodes, mostly 192 or variable (up to 256). I've got audio cd's floatin out my ears ;) In the dir where the mp3's are I run 'mp3_check -ssf *.mp3' (outputs only errors if there are any that can't be fixed). Usin Xmms diskwriter I convert to wav's. Then several runs of 'normalize -m *.wav' to equalize the files (sound volume levels). I run that command till it reports already normalized, not adjusting. Usually 3 times. Burn to CDr with 'bacd' Resulting audio cd's are better than store bought. Not just my ear either, people I make cd's for tell me the same. Particularly effective for poor original recordings (typically 40's, 50's, 60's stuff) and vinyl rips. Even new releases (store bought), the copies sound much better. A simple 'cpaudiocd' does it all. Much better than the fallacy of tryin to burn encoded files (mp3, ogg) directly to audio cd's. Specially with a GUI. ... alias cpaudiocd='ripacd normall bacd rm -f /home/tom/wav/* | | alias ripacd='cdparanoia -vB 1- /home/tom/wav/' alias normall='normalize -m /home/tom/wav/*' alias bacd='cdrecord -v -eject driveropts=burnfree speed=32 dev=1,0,0 -sao -pad -audio /home/tom/wav/*.wav' Note: I've found express path to be better than ~/wav/, when used in aliases. I've needed -sao to copy audio CD's that are close to the 80 min limit. I reckon it defeats -pad... but what'a heck, it works -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Proud to be an American Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sunday 09 May 2004 08:56 am, Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Sunday 09 May 2004 09:44 am, Tom Brinkman wrote: -Hell, I'm still tryin to figure out what y'all are talkin -about ;)Not to hijack, but I will since the original query -seems to be satisfied ;) I think he was referring to what the compression did to it. I listened to what the link had and it was ugly. I had to crank my Monsoon speakers almost max and listen a couple of times before I figured out what it was. Same as me. I had to turn speaker volume (on the spkr system) way up to hear the difference. It wasn't recognizeable to me other than knowin the answer beforehand. I still don't understand the purpose of the exercise. I surmised tryin to improve quality, which is why I posted what 'works for me'. But I was sort'a fishin for critique/suggestions on my doins ;) -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Proud to be an American Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sunday 09 May 2004 08:55 am, Aron Smith wrote: alias cpaudiocd='ripacd normall bacd rm -f /home/tom/wav/* alias ripacd='cdparanoia -vB 1- /home/tom/wav/' alias normall='normalize -m /home/tom/wav/*' alias bacd='cdrecord -v -eject driveropts=burnfree speed=32 dev=1,0,0 -sao -pad -audio /home/tom/wav/*.wav' Note: I've found express path to be better than ~/wav/, when used in aliases. I've needed -sao to copy audio CD's that are close to the 80 min limit. I reckon it defeats -pad... but what'a heck, it works Tom we need you to write a how2 on this subject BTW got this one? Moose Turd Pie get it here http://www.utahphillips.org/utah.html I'll check it later, I'm hooked into the Cowboy Cultural Society stream (again) just now. My cd's sound better than theirs do tho, they've just got more'n me ;) How-to: As I've already admonished Twiki Anne; It's a movin target, varies with hardware, particularly now with the 2.4 vs. 2.6 kernels changes, and Mandrakes back'n forth moves in this area. I think order of usefulness is (least to best), hardware web sites, twiki's, web searches, cooker (or lklm, app associated) mailin list archives . hands on guru sittin next to ya. 'Sides, as my last quoted phrase suggests, I'm just treadin water tryin to keep up with changes too. Not all that hard for me to change and amend, for newbies with GUI dependancy it's got'a be a miserable mystery. I don't always get it right either. Charles and Tim are often there to help. As they are here too, as are several others, the OP Greg Meyers included. Sometimes I reckon y'all would be better off just run'n cooker and subscribin to those lists. You wouldn't have to put up with me ... near as much, horses mouth alerts and advice there. Probly the closest you can get to guru's and current advice ; -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Proud to be an American Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sunday 09 May 2004 01:23 pm, Tom Brinkman wrote: I think he was referring to what the compression did to it. I listened to what the link had and it was ugly. I had to crank my Monsoon speakers almost max and listen a couple of times before I figured out what it was. Same as me. I had to turn speaker volume (on the spkr system) way up to hear the difference. It's actually much easier to hear with earphones, which is the only way my wife will let me listen to my music. :-) It wasn't recognizeable to me other than knowin the answer beforehand. I still don't understand the purpose of the exercise. To *hear* what the compression process takes out of the track. So many state that they can hear the difference betwwen a cd and an mp3/ogg. Well I don't have that good an ear, and I was curious as to what was being thrown away by the encoder. I thought the best way to understand it was to hear it, so I tried to isolate what was being removed. -- /g Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
Aron Smith wrote: On Sunday 09 May 2004 06:44 am, Tom Brinkman wrote: alias cpaudiocd='ripacd normall bacd rm -f /home/tom/wav/* alias ripacd='cdparanoia -vB 1- /home/tom/wav/' alias normall='normalize -m /home/tom/wav/*' alias bacd='cdrecord -v -eject driveropts=burnfree speed=32 dev=1,0,0 -sao -pad -audio /home/tom/wav/*.wav' Note: I've found express path to be better than ~/wav/, when used in aliases. I've needed -sao to copy audio CD's that are close to the 80 min limit. I reckon it defeats -pad... but what'a heck, it works Tom we need you to write a how2 on this subject Agreed. As Anne seems to have missed this one...can you add it to the Twiki please? ;-) Margot Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sun, May 09, 2004 at 10:12:50AM -0400, Greg Meyer wrote: On Sunday 09 May 2004 09:34 am, Todd Slater wrote: On Sat, May 08, 2004 at 12:33:12PM -0400, Greg Meyer wrote: I have been playing around with various encoding techniques trying to hear what is removed from a wav file when it is encoded and I have run into an interesting issue, and I am hoping somebody knows what is causing this. I ripped a song to wav from a CD and I ended up with a file of size 28877900. When I encode that wav as an Ogg and then decode it back to wav, I get a consistent file size of 28877900, but when I encode the original wav to mp3 and back, I get a wav file size of 28882988. 5088 blocks bigger. Can anyone explain this? My guess would be the header info. Does that mean I could clip the first part of the file to eliminate the extra info. Perhaps this is better asked in a audio newsgroup? I don't think so as the header isn't part of the audio. If you're in an experimenting mood, try ripping several tracks as a single wav and encode to a single mp3; then rip the same tracks as individual wav's and encode to individual mp3's. My guess is that the sum of the individual mp3's will add up to more than the single mp3 due to the headers. Todd Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sun, May 09, 2004 at 08:44:25AM -0500, Tom Brinkman wrote: On Saturday 08 May 2004 03:03 pm, Greg Meyer wrote: -I'll give a prize to the first poster that can recognize the song I used by -listening to this. I did compress it again to save bandwidth, but it won't -change your impreion about how much of a track is lost when it is -compressed, even at a high quality like I did here. - -http://cybercfo.gkmweb.com/diff_q6.ogg Queen...Crazy Little Thing Called Love...or something like that? We have a winner. I said you'd get a prize, but I lied :-p It is really astounding to me that one can figure out the song from listening to the difference between the original and the compressed version. Hell, I'm still tryin to figure out what y'all are talkin about ;)Not to hijack, but I will since the original query seems to be satisfied ;) I'm still stuck in mp3. I've got a paid news server (giganews). Just about any artist and their albums are available, anytime, but only as mp3's. Most are 160 or higher encodes, mostly 192 or variable (up to 256). I've got audio cd's floatin out my ears ;) alt.binaries.sounds.ogg alt.binaries.sounds.lossless But shhh. Todd -- Name that tune #22: No caffeine, no protein, no booze or nicotine. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sunday 09 May 2004 04:01 pm, Todd Slater wrote: alt.binaries.sounds.ogg alt.binaries.sounds.lossless But shhh. Todd Damn. Masha Danki Todd!! Never occurred to me to search those terms (ogg, lossless) OTOH, what'a fsck is a .ape or .flac ? Never mind let me do some experimentin... Thanks, Meantime (back at the ranch), Stream Tuner and Cowboy Cultural Society keep me fairly busy -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Proud to be an American Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Sun, May 09, 2004 at 05:12:37PM -0500, Tom Brinkman wrote: On Sunday 09 May 2004 04:01 pm, Todd Slater wrote: alt.binaries.sounds.ogg alt.binaries.sounds.lossless But shhh. Todd Damn. Masha Danki Todd!! Never occurred to me to search those terms (ogg, lossless) OTOH, what'a fsck is a .ape or .flac ? Never mind let me do some experimentin... Thanks, flac is free lossless audio codec--I believe it's part of the vorbis project. There's a plugin for xmms for it. .ape is for monkey's audio codec or some such; also a plugin for xmms for it. Problem is lately there have been a lot of posts using monkey 3.99 and the latest linux version I can find is 3.96. Todd Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] mp3 and ogg decode to different sizes
On Saturday 08 May 2004 04:03 pm, Greg Meyer wrote: -We have a winner. I said you'd get a prize, but I lied :-p - -It is really astounding to me that one can figure out the song from listening -to the difference between the original and the compressed version. TBH, it took me awhile. I'm familiar with the song (I've always liked Queen) and I cranked my Monsoon speakers darn near max... -- /\ Dark Lord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
