RE: Virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Howdy.
I was in a very similar situation about a year ago.  Virtualized about a dozen 
Windows servers.  Decided to go w/ 3 host servers and an iSCSI SAN from NetApp 
with 24 drives.
Couldn't be happier.

During the initial phase, I found Dell's DPACK tool to be very helpful.
It is free (unlike my experience w/ VMWare's capacity planner - which I had 
several resellers offer to run for a fee).
You download and run Dell's tool on your servers for several days (or longer if 
you have monthly spikes in activity)
You do have to send the results to Dell, but they will in turn provide a very 
detailed report (CPU/RAM/LAN/IOPS/Etc.) to get you in the right direction.

Good luck!
Feel free to hit me up if you have any other questions.






From: itli...@imcu.com [mailto:itli...@imcu.com]
Sent: Friday, April 26, 2013 8:19 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Virtualization

Looks like I am taking 13 physical Windows 2008/2003 servers and virtualizing 
them.  Also one of the servers has 4 apps they would like to split off into 4 
additional servers.
Would like to be able to have them all work in a DR state if needed as well.  
So I will be buying 2 of these physical servers one for production and one for 
DR.

I am looking at the HP tool and I need to get
AverageCPU Util %
Average Memory Used MB
Average Disk IOPS Trans
Average Disk Throughput MBps
Average Network Throughput MBps

Looking at Perfmon I don't see these exact settings.

I do see:
Processor\% Processor Time
Memory\Availabe Mbytes
PhysicalDisk\Avg Disk Sec/Read
PhysicalDisk\Avg Dis k Sec/Transfer
Network Interface\Bytes Total/Sec

Am I on the right track?
I am looking more at HyperV. But really, I don't have any clue.



From: James Rankin [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com]
Posted At: Friday, April 26, 2013 7:45 AM
Posted To: itli...@imcu.com
Conversation: Virtualization
Subject: Re: Virtualization

I wouldn't particularly say any hypervisor would be your best bet with this 
little info to go on

For instance XenServer might make sense if you were running XenApp or XenDesktop

VMWare is often the choice for "production" environments given the features it 
has and the product maturity, but I am sure its competitors are now catching 
up. However if it's a sandbox environment then one of the cheaper or free 
alternatives will do fine

There are a vast amount of licensing considerations in the mix too...

Are you looking to P2V existing servers or create new ones?

Are you hosting sessions on these servers (i.e. RDS or Citrix), or are they 
just app servers? The use you make of the servers will dictate the sizing and 
performance you require

The SAN question is a whole other kettle of fish, and one that has often 
started some interesting flame wars on this list :-)

I think maybe a bit more info would help us guide you a bit better.

Cheers,


JR
On 26 April 2013 12:10, itli...@imcu.com 
mailto:itli...@imcu.com>> wrote:
Looking to virtualize 7 windows 2008 servers.
A couple of questions:
How do I size a Virtualized server and san?
Which virtual server software is best?
Hyper V, VMware, citrix
Any guidance in this area is appreciated...


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--
James Rankin
Technical Consultant (ACA, CCA, MCTS)
http://appsensebigot.blogspot.co.uk

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RE: Rename 2003 domain

[David Mazzaccaro]

We hired a consultant to move us to AD 2008 R2 and E2010.

He renamed the domain to company.net this past weekend.

We did have to manually rejoin the clients to the new domain (rebooting
twice did not make the clients auto-join), but everything appears to be
working fine.  We have just extended the schema and have our first 2008
R2 domain controller up and running.

 

Anything in particular I should check to verify that all is well?

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Michael B. Smith [mailto:mich...@smithcons.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2013 9:50 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Rename 2003 domain

 

Don't rename the domain. Just Say No. There is no need. 

Sent from my Windows Phone



From: David Mazzaccaro
Sent: 2/1/2013 9:50 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Rename 2003 domain

Thx

I Just read through that thread.

One comment was that you never need to register an internal name on a
certificate 

But it doesn't go into detail as to why.

 

The other bigger headache (which I understand) is to NOT use an internal
name that will also be used externally. 

We only use "company.com" on in the internet.  So if we never use
"company.NET" on the outside, why couldn't/shouldn't I rename the domain
to that?

 

Thx

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 12:23 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Rename 2003 domain

 

Go to the archives and read the "SSL and the new no internal names
ruling" thread.  I think you are going in the wrong direction.

 

Thanks

 

 

Webster

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 9:48 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Rename 2003 domain

 

I will be upgrading my domain from 2003 to 2008 R2 and Exchange 2003 >
2010.

Apparently E2010 does not like my current domain name
"company.town.main"

It wants (needs?) a name that can be registered w/ an internet registrar
in order to obtain a certificate.

So... I will be renaming the domain to "company.net" this weekend.

I have already registered the "company.net" name.

>From what I have read, it is fairly (?) straightforward:

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc738208(v=ws.10).aspx
<http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc738208(v=ws.10).aspx> 

Then there are specific Exchange changes: "XDR-fixup"

Then it seems EVERY computer needs to reboot twice for them to see the
new domain.

I do have a script for this and a txt file w/ all the machines in it:

for /f %%i in (machines.txt) do shutdown -m \\%%i 
-f -r -t 05

My question is... has anyone here successfully renamed a 2003 domain
(especially w/ Exchange 2003 in it)?

Care to share your experience and any gotcha's that came up?

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
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RE: Rename 2003 domain

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thx

I Just read through that thread.

One comment was that you never need to register an internal name on a
certificate 

But it doesn't go into detail as to why.

 

The other bigger headache (which I understand) is to NOT use an internal
name that will also be used externally. 

We only use "company.com" on in the internet.  So if we never use
"company.NET" on the outside, why couldn't/shouldn't I rename the domain
to that?

 

Thx

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 12:23 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Rename 2003 domain

 

Go to the archives and read the "SSL and the new no internal names
ruling" thread.  I think you are going in the wrong direction.

 

Thanks

 

 

Webster

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 9:48 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Rename 2003 domain

 

I will be upgrading my domain from 2003 to 2008 R2 and Exchange 2003 >
2010.

Apparently E2010 does not like my current domain name
"company.town.main"

It wants (needs?) a name that can be registered w/ an internet registrar
in order to obtain a certificate.

So... I will be renaming the domain to "company.net" this weekend.

I have already registered the "company.net" name.

>From what I have read, it is fairly (?) straightforward:

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc738208(v=ws.10).aspx
<http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc738208(v=ws.10).aspx> 

Then there are specific Exchange changes: "XDR-fixup"

Then it seems EVERY computer needs to reboot twice for them to see the
new domain.

I do have a script for this and a txt file w/ all the machines in it:

for /f %%i in (machines.txt) do shutdown -m \\%%i 
-f -r -t 05

My question is... has anyone here successfully renamed a 2003 domain
(especially w/ Exchange 2003 in it)?

Care to share your experience and any gotcha's that came up?

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

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RE: MS site?

[David Mazzaccaro]

And... it's back (for me)

 

 

From: Sobey, Richard A [mailto:r.so...@imperial.ac.uk] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 10:05 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: MS site?

 

Oops! Google Chrome could not connect to support.microsoft.com

 

 

From: bounce-9579199-8267...@lyris.sunbelt-software.com
[mailto:bounce-9579199-8267...@lyris.sunbelt-software.com] On Behalf Of
Christopher Bodnar
Sent: 01 February 2013 14:54
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: MS site?

 

Anyone else having trouble getting to this link? 

http://support.microsoft.com   

Christopher Bodnar 
Enterprise Architect I, Corporate Office of Technology:Enterprise
Architecture and Engineering Services 

Tel 610-807-6459  
3900 Burgess Place, Bethlehem, PA 18017 
christopher_bod...@glic.com   

 

The Guardian Life Insurance Company of America

www.guardianlife.com   




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Rename 2003 domain

[David Mazzaccaro]

I will be upgrading my domain from 2003 to 2008 R2 and Exchange 2003 >
2010.
Apparently E2010 does not like my current domain name
"company.town.main"
It wants (needs?) a name that can be registered w/ an internet registrar
in order to obtain a certificate.
So... I will be renaming the domain to "company.net" this weekend.
I have already registered the "company.net" name.

>From what I have read, it is fairly (?) straightforward:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc738208(v=ws.10).aspx

Then there are specific Exchange changes: "XDR-fixup"

Then it seems EVERY computer needs to reboot twice for them to see the
new domain.
I do have a script for this and a txt file w/ all the machines in it:
for /f %%i in (machines.txt) do shutdown -m \\%%i -f -r -t 05

My question is... has anyone here successfully renamed a 2003 domain
(especially w/ Exchange 2003 in it)?
Care to share your experience and any gotcha's that came up?

TIA!




.
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RE: MS site?

[David Mazzaccaro]

Reports coming into Twitter now... office365 down, outlook.com down,
support site down... 

Ut oh...

 

 

From: Guyer, Don [mailto:dgu...@che.org] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 10:02 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: MS site?

 

Not working from here.

 

Regards,

 

Don Guyer
Catholic Health East - Information Technology

Enterprise Directory & Messaging Services
3805 West Chester Pike, Suite 100, Newtown Square, Pa  19073

email: dgu...@che.org

Office:  610.550.3595 | Cell: 610.955.6528 | Fax: 610.271.9440

For immediate assistance, please open a Service Desk ticket or call the
helpdesk @ 610-492-3839.

 

 

From: Christopher Bodnar [mailto:christopher_bod...@glic.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 9:54 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: MS site?

 

Anyone else having trouble getting to this link? 

http://support.microsoft.com   

Christopher Bodnar 
Enterprise Architect I, Corporate Office of Technology:Enterprise
Architecture and Engineering Services 

Tel 610-807-6459  
3900 Burgess Place, Bethlehem, PA 18017 
christopher_bod...@glic.com   

 

The Guardian Life Insurance Company of America

www.guardianlife.com   




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in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and
delete the message and any attachments. Thank you. 

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RE: MS site?

[David Mazzaccaro]

Down for me... L

http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/support.microsoft.com

 

 

From: Christopher Bodnar [mailto:christopher_bod...@glic.com] 
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2013 9:54 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: MS site?

 

Anyone else having trouble getting to this link? 

http://support.microsoft.com   

Christopher Bodnar 
Enterprise Architect I, Corporate Office of Technology:Enterprise
Architecture and Engineering Services 

Tel 610-807-6459  
3900 Burgess Place, Bethlehem, PA 18017 
christopher_bod...@glic.com   

 

The Guardian Life Insurance Company of America

www.guardianlife.com   




- This message, and any
attachments to it, may contain information that is privileged,
confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the
reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified
that any use, dissemination, distribution, copying, or communication of
this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message
in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and
delete the message and any attachments. Thank you. 

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RE: email encryption

[David Mazzaccaro]

Zix here as well.  

Very easy to use.  Our users include "secure" in their subject line, and
Zix redirects the email to the secure portal where the recipient logs in
to retrieve it.

 

So here's some ammo for you when people start crying... and they will
cry.

This is why I use ZixCorp for email encryption...  30 million users.

 

"Zix Corporation (ZixCorp), (NASDAQ-NMS: ZIXI), the leader in email
encryption services, has announced that ZixDirectory(r), its shared
email encryption network, has registered its 30 millionth member."

 

"Growing at approximately 100,000 members per week"

 

"ZixDirectory is the largest email encryption network in the world and
provides the foundation of ZixCorp Email Encryption Services."

Listed in the ZixDirectory are many of the nation's most influential and
trusted institutions, including:

* The US Federal Banking Regulators

* More than 20 State Banking Regulators

* U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission

* Over 1,500 financial institutions in the U.S.

* More than half of the Blue Cross Blue Shield Institutions

* Health insurance customers protecting over 85 million
Americans

* (1 in 5) hospitals in the U.S.

Sources:

http://telecommsbriefing.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=artic
le&sid=202757

http://www.activehost.com/hosted/email-encryption.aspx

 

 

 

From: Greg Sweers [mailto:gswe...@acts360.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 10:12 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: email encryption

 

Almost all of our healthcare clients use Zix.  Either the application
provider has integrated it into the messaging part of their application
or they provide an appliance and we integrate it with their email
solution.  More and more we are seeing the application providers
(EMR/PM) providing this as part of their package.  

 

For non medical clients or those that are not doing EMR/PM, an example
is our billing agencies are almost exclusively on Zix because all the
hospitals are and it provides that seamless email that's encrypted.

 

We also setup TLS for any clients that have business relationships
(Contract) and sign the appropriate HIPAA forms, so that they can
essentially send email encrypted between each other without the expense
of Zix.  Usually a billing company and their corresponding client, or
manufacturer... This is not my recommended way because it requires
manually configuring TLS for each client, but Exchange 2010 makes this
really easy.

 

The integration part of ZIX is pretty straight forward.  

 

 

Greg Sweers

CEO

ACTS360.com  

P.O. Box 1193

Brandon, FL  33509

813-657-0849 Office

813-758-6850 Cell

 

From: Adam Greene [mailto:maill...@webjogger.net] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2012 9:59 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: email encryption

 

Hi all,

We provide hosted Zimbra and Exchange email to customers, as well as
manage customers' on-site mail servers. 

More and more we are getting requests to provide outbound email
encryption service as well.

We reviewed a few solutions: Barracuda, McAfee and Zix, and chose
McAfee, since they are 100% cloud based and also provide inbound
filtering and archiving solutions. Their pricing model also makes it
easy to start out small and grow. 

However, we are running into people, especially in healthcare, who feel
Zix is a better solution for them. As far as I know, all these solutions
basically require the recipient to log into a secure portal in order to
retrieve the secured message, and in healthcare, with so much private
information, the risk is that everybody will have to log into 15 portals
daily to retrieve secure emails from their partners, which nobody likes
the idea of. 

Zix's way to capture the market, as far as I can tell, is to enable full
encryption when Zix customers send to other Zix customers, without the
use of a secure portal. In other words, it's transparent to the
end-user. Only if the recipient is not also using Zix will they be
required to log into a secure portal to retrieve a secure message. 

So, we feel considerable pressure to resell Zix instead of McAfee. 

But before committing, we wanted to see what other people out there are
doing, and what their experience has been. 

Some concrete questions:

*  Have you used Zix and if so, do you have an opinion of it?

*  Do you have a sense about how many health care organizations,
hospitals, and Practices are using Zix (vis a vis other products)?

*  Why are/are'nt you using Zix?

*  Is it easy to use?

*  Is Zix interoperable with other encryption products, and might you
share any specifics?

*  Have you any experience with McAfee encryption?  Opinion?  How Many
are using?

Thanks for any and all feedback anyone is willing to share. 

Thanks,
Adam

Webjogger
(845) 757-4000
http://www.webjogger.net

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ 

RE: Window 8 on your PC

[David Mazzaccaro]

 [1] As a side rant: Why can't Windows allow an administrator to
force a logoff of a locked account locally on a machine? This was
possible in XP. Starting with Vista, the only way an administrator could
locally logoff a locked machine was to force a power down.


I believe you have to logon as an admin, and then use task manager:
http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/133754-task-manager-users-log-off-loca
l-user.html





-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org] 
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 12:03 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Window 8 on your PC

You would be correct if we were talking laptops or tablets for
individual users.

But I'm talking about labs of computers for students. Every 50 minutes,
a new set of users must come in and they expect to get to their files
and settings.

For this reason, the simple action of logging off needs to be simple.
Microsoft has chosen, in their infinite wisdom, to make this process
difficult. Maybe not difficult for you or I, but it's not obvious to the
layperson. Here are some possible scenarios:

1) Users don't log off. This causes either A) the session to be locked,
making it impossible to login[1] or B) let the next student see/screw
with the last user's data. Oh, I guess I could C) allow multiple log in
sessions, but this is not ideal.

2) Users share desktops. If you can't log off, just stay logged in!
Everybody can use the same desktop and home folder then. (Again, not
ideal.)

It's not that I'm against Windows 8's DCIM interface. I'm not all that
thrilled by it, but I see where they are going. I see the benefit on
smaller, more mobile devices. (Which, oddly, Microsoft hasn't been
focusing on. Where is the 7" RT Tablet?) I am hopeful that Microsoft can
make a few changes that will make it much more friendly on both Touch
and Desktop interfaces.

But until they do, we won't be adopting it.

[1] As a side rant: Why can't Windows allow an administrator to force a
logoff of a locked account locally on a machine? This was possible in
XP. Starting with Vista, the only way an administrator could locally
logoff a locked machine was to force a power down.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: Rod Trent
[mailto:rodtr...@myitforum.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Wed, 21 Nov 2012
06:43:44 -0800
Subject: RE: Window 8 on your PC


> Also, consider that Windows 8 is built for devices that are never
meant to
> be shut off.  Why give easy access to a function that we are moving
beyond?
> 
>  
> 
> From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2012 8:56 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: Window 8 on your PC
> 
>  
> 
> "You no longer have to "pre-tell" Windows that you want to shut down
and let
> it handle everything for you. Windows is now hardware aware enough
that you
> just hit the power and Windows does whatever you told it to do (Power
> Settings)"
> 
>  
> 
> How enlightening! We've gotten so used to the scenario where we
couldn't use
> the power button to turn a device off that now being able to do so
seems
> weird. "What? I can use the device's power button to turn the Windows
device
> off? That's CRAZY!". Amazing what mind shift just one sentence can
make.
> 
>  
> 
> From: Tim Vander Kooi [mailto:tvanderk...@expl.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 5:06 PM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: Window 8 on your PC
> 
>  
> 
> Running the same 4 here, except we went with the Samsung Slates
instead of
> the Surface, they are excellent machines. Once I demonstrated to users
that
> the Start Page is just where their Start Button went to they were
totally
> onboard. It is a total mind shift (just like Office 2003 to Office
2007, but
> once you make that shift it is much more useful. As for Shutdown being
hard
> to get to, what I was told by a friend at Microsoft (and which makes
perfect
> sense once you think about it) is just use the power button on your
device
> (whatever it might be). You no longer have to "pre-tell" Windows that
you
> want to shut down and let it handle everything for you. Windows is now
> hardware aware enough that you just hit the power and Windows does
whatever
> you told it to do (Power Settings). This won't work in some
environments
> where the power button is not accessible, but for the majority of
businesses
> it works just fine, and it is incredibly fast! Going to Sleep and
waking
> back up take my machines on average 2 seconds.
> 
> Tim
> 
>  
> 
> From: Rod Trent [mailto:rodtr...@myitforum.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 3:59 PM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: Window 8 on your PC
> 
>  
> 
> J  I'm running all three - plus a desktop.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> From: Guyer, Don [mailto:dgu...@che.org] 
> Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2012 4:25 PM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: Window 8 on your PC
> 
>  
> 
> Keep the Win 8 i

RE: Off Topic - Internet Usage Tracking Software

[David Mazzaccaro]

iPrism (Edgewave)
Simple to install, very detailed reporting, real-time monitoring, a
client for remote laptops to stay filtered independent of the internet
connection they may be using.




-Original Message-
From: Sharie Breaux [mailto:sharielbre...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 10:29 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Off Topic - Internet Usage Tracking Software

Anyone out there have experience with this type of software?  If so,
which do you use and a short reason why.  My company is asking me to
look into and I have no experience and neither does my outside
consultant.

Thanks!
Sharie

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RE: A question about Virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Yes, 10 currently.  

Good to know I should be able to scale to 120. 

Thanks!

 

 

 

 

 

From: Don Ely [mailto:don@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 1:10 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: A question about Virtualization

 

3 hosts for 10 servers?!?!?!!?!?!  I have 3 hosts and I run 120 servers
on them  SAN switches?  Kool-aid taste good?

On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 8:40 AM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

LOL

I was right there with you at the beginning of 2012.

We just signed off on FINALLY getting VMware and a SAN in here.  Should
be happening in the next weeks.

We are 100% physical right now (10 servers).

Getting 3 hosts, a SAN, 2 SAN switches, and a bunch of software (VMWare
Essentials Plus).

Over $200k for everything (P2V servers, upgrade AD to 2008, migrate to
Exchange 2010, migrate to Citrix XenApp 6.5) 

 

Without more details on what you currently have, hard to say what you
will need.

But this should give you an idea of what we are about to go through.

 

Also, if you search the archives here on specifically (4/3/2012,
4/16/2012, and 7/17/2012) I started a few threads voicing my concerns
and looking for answers just like you.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: itli...@imcu.com [mailto:itli...@imcu.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 11:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: A question about Virtualization

 

I have no experience with Virtualized anything.

I have read VMware is better than Citrix.

What kind of hardware do I put all of this on?

A Blade server with a SAN back end?

I really have no opinions or experience on any of this.

Please don't flame me to badly.

Thanks

David

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RE: A question about Virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Good luck!
Also consider "VM Sprawl". 
You may have 6 servers now, but that could very easily double or triple.

(testing, backup, upgrades, redundancy, load balancing, etc...)





-Original Message-
From: itli...@imcu.com [mailto:itli...@imcu.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 12:09 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: A question about Virtualization

Thanks all,
I know I will have 6 servers to virtualize.  Outside of that I am not
sure.  I am waiting on specs.
I will look through archives and trying and get more info going forward.


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org] 
Posted At: Tuesday, November 6, 2012 11:57 AM
Posted To: itli...@imcu.com
Conversation: A question about Virtualization
Subject: Re: A question about Virtualization

Hey David.

My recommendation: Start small. Find a desktop with a VM enabled chip
and create a little VM server. All of the major players have a free
version to use:

VMWare: ESXi (The industry standard)
Microsot: Hyper-V Server (Quickly gaining popularity)
Citrix: XenServer (Best for Desktop Virtualization, I hear.)
Linux: ProxMox VE (Web-based VM, but no Desktop Virtualization option)



After you get your feet wet, you will then start to see what kind of
investment you are in for. You'll have to start thinking of large
servers to host VMs, with lots of processors/memory, not to mention
extra networking and shared storage.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: itli...@imcu.com
[mailto:itli...@imcu.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Tue, 06 Nov 2012
08:28:21 -0800
Subject: A question about Virtualization


> I have no experience with Virtualized anything.
> 
> I have read VMware is better than Citrix.
> 
> What kind of hardware do I put all of this on?
> 
> A Blade server with a SAN back end?
> 
> I really have no opinions or experience on any of this.
> 
> Please don't flame me to badly.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> David
> 
> 
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ 
>   ~
> 
> ---
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> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

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RE: A question about Virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Here's some things I learned:

 

* The host servers will have several NICS.

They will connect to the new switches (2 for redundancy), and the 2 new
switches connect the SAN.

The host servers also connect to your LAN via their other NICs, but you
have to think of the SAN as its own mini environment.

 

* IOPS (in/out per second) are critically important.  

Dell has a free tool (DPACK) that you can download and run over a few
days that will give you an idea of your IOPS, storage, CPU, RAM,
throughput, RW ratio, etc...  NetApp will likely charge for a similar
report.

Just knowing your IOPS will help greatly in making sure you buy an
adequate SAN.

For the SAN, generally these calculations are used:

15k drive ~175 IOPS per spindle

10k drive ~150 IOPS per spindle

 

* Don't forget about your backups.  

They will very likely change from what you are doing now.

 

* Training!

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: itli...@imcu.com [mailto:itli...@imcu.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 11:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: A question about Virtualization

 

I have no experience with Virtualized anything.

I have read VMware is better than Citrix.

What kind of hardware do I put all of this on?

A Blade server with a SAN back end?

I really have no opinions or experience on any of this.

Please don't flame me to badly.

Thanks

David

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~   ~

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RE: A question about Virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

LOL

I was right there with you at the beginning of 2012.

We just signed off on FINALLY getting VMware and a SAN in here.  Should
be happening in the next weeks.

We are 100% physical right now (10 servers).

Getting 3 hosts, a SAN, 2 SAN switches, and a bunch of software (VMWare
Essentials Plus).

Over $200k for everything (P2V servers, upgrade AD to 2008, migrate to
Exchange 2010, migrate to Citrix XenApp 6.5) 

 

Without more details on what you currently have, hard to say what you
will need.

But this should give you an idea of what we are about to go through.

 

Also, if you search the archives here on specifically (4/3/2012,
4/16/2012, and 7/17/2012) I started a few threads voicing my concerns
and looking for answers just like you.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: itli...@imcu.com [mailto:itli...@imcu.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 11:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: A question about Virtualization

 

I have no experience with Virtualized anything.

I have read VMware is better than Citrix.

What kind of hardware do I put all of this on?

A Blade server with a SAN back end?

I really have no opinions or experience on any of this.

Please don't flame me to badly.

Thanks

David

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~   ~

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RE: 7 shortcuts To Get Your Network Hacked (huh?)

[David Mazzaccaro]

Allowing users to run as local admins

 

 

 

From: Stu Sjouwerman [mailto:s...@sunbelt-software.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2012 1:39 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: 7 shortcuts To Get Your Network Hacked (huh?)

 

Hi Guys,

 

Yes, that was on purpose.  In your opinion, what are the most gruesome
errors a system admin can make

which will result in getting their network hacked? Just jot down a few
and reply to the list, I will tabulate

and come up with the 7 most mentioned sorted by importance.  This should
be fun. 

 

Have at it !!

 

Warm regards,

 

Stu 

 

 

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RE: East Coast people out there?

[David Mazzaccaro]

We have 3 out of 9 offices down (NJ, NY, NH).

Oddly enough, NY (long island) has power, T1, and landline, but no one
can physically get to it.

NJ and NH both have no power.

 

 

 

From: Christopher Bodnar [mailto:christopher_bod...@glic.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2012 9:45 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: OT: East Coast people out there?

 

Anyone else on the east coast dealing with the aftermath of Sandy? 

Still waiting to hear how our NY office faired. 




Chris


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RE: Side Job Pricing

[David Mazzaccaro]

I'd be very cautious of this scenario.

You're going to have 2 different parties involved (1 running the cable,
1 terminating)

With 300 drops... when (not if) there is a problem later, there is the
potential for a lot of finger-pointing.  

Especially if the runs are not certified and signed off on at the time
of completion.

Just my $.02 having been through this before.

 

 

 

From: James Kerr [mailto:cluster...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2012 8:44 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Side Job Pricing

 

I don't have the cash to buy the tester to certify. I just have the
basic everything in the right place and connected tester.

On Tue, Sep 25, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Michael B. Smith
 wrote:

Are you going to certify them too?

 

Regardless, I have no idea how to price this, but I always want my drops
certified...

 

From: James Kerr [mailto:cluster...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 9:14 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Side Job Pricing

 

So I have this side job that's being offer to me by an electrician I
know. He is running some cabling CAT5 and CAT6. He wants me to terminate
it all (patch panels and wall jacks). I assume he wants me to tone out
and label the wall jacks. There is about 300 runs to terminate and he
wants to know how much I would charge for each one. Anyone know what the
going rate is for this? I know how much to charge for a full drop but
not for part of it. Maybe I should just estimate how many I can do an
hour and figure out how much I want to make an hour. It's a little
tricky since I never timed how many I can do in an hour before. 

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RE: Side Job Pricing

[David Mazzaccaro]

That price would be without running the cable (as OP noted)... I'd
double that if you are actually pulling the cable, too

 

 

From: Sam Cayze [mailto:sca...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 11:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Side Job Pricing

 

That's pretty much the going rate we see.

Our company is in the cabling business.  (One of the many aspects of our
company).

 

Sam

 

 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 10:16 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Side Job Pricing

 

If you have to certify them (recommended) and have a fluke or similar
equip to do so... 

I'd say $100 - $125/drop.

Depends on where the job is located, too.

 

 

 

 

From: James Kerr [mailto:cluster...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 9:14 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Side Job Pricing

 

So I have this side job that's being offer to me by an electrician I
know. He is running some cabling CAT5 and CAT6. He wants me to terminate
it all (patch panels and wall jacks). I assume he wants me to tone out
and label the wall jacks. There is about 300 runs to terminate and he
wants to know how much I would charge for each one. Anyone know what the
going rate is for this? I know how much to charge for a full drop but
not for part of it. Maybe I should just estimate how many I can do an
hour and figure out how much I want to make an hour. It's a little
tricky since I never timed how many I can do in an hour before. 

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RE: Side Job Pricing

[David Mazzaccaro]

If you have to certify them (recommended) and have a fluke or similar
equip to do so... 

I'd say $100 - $125/drop.

Depends on where the job is located, too.

 

 

 

 

From: James Kerr [mailto:cluster...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 9:14 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Side Job Pricing

 

So I have this side job that's being offer to me by an electrician I
know. He is running some cabling CAT5 and CAT6. He wants me to terminate
it all (patch panels and wall jacks). I assume he wants me to tone out
and label the wall jacks. There is about 300 runs to terminate and he
wants to know how much I would charge for each one. Anyone know what the
going rate is for this? I know how much to charge for a full drop but
not for part of it. Maybe I should just estimate how many I can do an
hour and figure out how much I want to make an hour. It's a little
tricky since I never timed how many I can do in an hour before. 

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RE: Btw what is everyone using for enterprise based malware tools

[David Mazzaccaro]

Vipre works well for us.

200 users across multiple locations.  

The definition updates can be large, but I think that is industry
standard nowadays.

 

 

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 12:29 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Btw what is everyone using for enterprise based malware tools

 

What is everyone finding is good fit in your business/organizations for
enterprise malware tools, that you always utilize to clean systems
infected with malware?

 

Ones that I know work pretty darn well:

Malware Bytes

Super-AntiSpyware

Sysinternals Tools

Vipre  Rescue

Hijack this

 

Any others you are using?  Feel free to share

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

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RE: This is what I get....

[David Mazzaccaro]

None of my users are local admins.  And they have no problems with it.

Am I just lucky to not have a "complete nightmare" because of it, or are
your users doing all sorts of crazy things that required elevated
privileges?  Any more detail on what is/was the "complete nightmare"?

 

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 10:30 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: This is what I get

 

Are those calls documented?  And what was the nature of the call?

 

After the initial transition, this will actually make admin's lives
easier, since they have a more controlled environment to work in.

 

Yeah, some things are easier when they have admin rights, but that
doesn't mean that users should be doing those things, either.

On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 10:22 AM, David Lum  wrote:

Here's how much fight I get when I even SUGGEST we should be removing
admin right from our users.

 

Worthy to note  I am not a local admin on my own NWEA machine, and none
of my %sidejob% clients are local admins on theirs. This guy knows this,
but still fights me every time.

 

This reply incensed me enough to start again working on the management
buy-in, as it's a lot harder to stop a top down order.

 


Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 6:35 AM
To: David Lum
Subject: RE: IE 0-day, MS releases bulletin

 

We have this very rare instance of a Zero Day attack in IE for a few
sites and you think that is a reason to create the complete nightmare of
taking away Admin rights to a local machine.  Clearly you don't know how
often our users are using their admin rights on their machines.  The
SD got a call once a week from the ONE person who had that setup when
she was moved to Windows 7.   If we spent some time building the
infrastructure that makes such a situation workable (like I did at the
school district I worked at), then we could live with our 500 users not
being admins.

 

David Grand

 

From: David Lum 
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 6:24 AM
Subject: IE 0-day, MS releases bulletin

 

Please read this article and weigh in on the suggested workarounds.

 

Microsoft has released a bulletin on this, and has suggested
workarounds. Most can be achieved via GPO:

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/security/advisory/2757760

 

Note 1: "An attacker who successfully exploited this vulnerability could
gain the same user rights as the current user. Users whose accounts are
configured to have fewer user rights on the system could be less
impacted than users who operate with administrative user rights."

SD - this exact scenario is the benefit of users not being local
administrators.

 

Note 2: Some of this is already done via the Trusted Site GPO. Their
additional recommendations recommend disabling ActiveX for Internet and
Local Intranet. The latter would disable some Commons functionality, but
we can disable it on the Internet site zone temporarily. Even this will
generate Service Desk calls but I feel this is worth mitigating the
risk.

 

Dave

 

From: David Lum 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 12:39 PM
Subject: Just so you know that I know..

 

0-day of the week:

 

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9231367/Hackers_exploit_new_IE_ze
ro_day_vulnerability?source=rss_latest_content&utm_source=feedburner&utm
_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+computerworld%2Fnews%2Ffeed+%28Latest+
from+Computerworld%29

 

Dave

 

 

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RE: Go Daddy outage info...

[David Mazzaccaro]

Yep.  We’ll likely never know the truth.

 

 

From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 9:57 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Go Daddy outage info...

 

“to a series of internal network events” = “someone got inside our network and 
hosed us”  perhaps?

 

“At no time was any sensitive customer information, including credit card data, 
passwords or names and addresses, compromised.”

Consistent with the attackers’ claim that he/she hosed GoDaddy’s DNS servers…

 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 6:48 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Go Daddy outage info...

 

~ Email I just got ~  30% off ~

 

We owe you a big apology for the intermittent service outages we experienced on 
September 10 that may have impacted your website, your email and other Go Daddy 
services.

 

We let you down and we know it. We take our responsibilities — and the trust 
you place in us — very seriously. I cannot express how sorry I am to those of 
you who were inconvenienced.

 

The service outage was due to a series of internal network events that 
corrupted router data tables. Once the issues were identified, we took 
corrective actions to restore services for our customers and GoDaddy.com. We 
have implemented a series of immediate measures to fix the problem.

 

At no time was any sensitive customer information, including credit card data, 
passwords or names and addresses, compromised.

 

Throughout our history, we have provided 99.999% uptime in our DNS 
infrastructure. This is the level of performance we expect from ourselves. 
Monday, we fell short of these expectations. We have learned from this event 
and will use it to drive improvement in our services.

 

As a result of this disruption, you will receive 30% off any new product or 
renewal.* This offer will be available to you for the next 7 days. Simply place 
source code Apology4a in your cart or mention the code when you call 
480-505-8877.

 

From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 9:48 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Go Daddy outage info...

 

I watched the Twitter feed of the alleged attacker, and they said “GoDaddy will 
be back up soon” and less than an hour later…it was up. So it was either really 
an attacker, or it was an insider. Or the attacker HAS an insider at GoDaddy.

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 4:53 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Go Daddy outage info...

 

I think internal DOS is worse than external DDOS at least for them… but 
definitely they are trying a media spin on the whole situation.  I agree 
underlying issues aren’t corrected, the same stuff will continue. 

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 8:27 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Go Daddy outage info...

 

And, as I commented to someone at work earlier:

I don't know which is worse for someone in their line of business, being taken 
down by a single person using a DDoS engine, or fubaring your routing 
infrastructure.

Kurt

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 5:05 PM, Andrew S. Baker  wrote:

Gives new meaning to the term "intermittent"

 

Well, if they are lying about the DDoS, and haven't addressed the underlying 
weakness, we can expect a repeat performance in the near future...


ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market…

 

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 5:11 PM, Maglinger, Paul  wrote:

Tried to post this once and didn't see it come through.  Trying again...

 http://www.godaddy.com/newscenter/release-view.aspx?news_item_id=410

 -Paul

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
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RE: Go Daddy outage info...

[David Mazzaccaro]

~ Email I just got ~  30% off ~

 

We owe you a big apology for the intermittent service outages we experienced on 
September 10 that may have impacted your website, your email and other Go Daddy 
services.

 

We let you down and we know it. We take our responsibilities — and the trust 
you place in us — very seriously. I cannot express how sorry I am to those of 
you who were inconvenienced.

 

The service outage was due to a series of internal network events that 
corrupted router data tables. Once the issues were identified, we took 
corrective actions to restore services for our customers and GoDaddy.com. We 
have implemented a series of immediate measures to fix the problem.

 

At no time was any sensitive customer information, including credit card data, 
passwords or names and addresses, compromised.

 

Throughout our history, we have provided 99.999% uptime in our DNS 
infrastructure. This is the level of performance we expect from ourselves. 
Monday, we fell short of these expectations. We have learned from this event 
and will use it to drive improvement in our services.

 

As a result of this disruption, you will receive 30% off any new product or 
renewal.* This offer will be available to you for the next 7 days. Simply place 
source code Apology4a in your cart or mention the code when you call 
480-505-8877.

 

From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 9:48 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Go Daddy outage info...

 

I watched the Twitter feed of the alleged attacker, and they said “GoDaddy will 
be back up soon” and less than an hour later…it was up. So it was either really 
an attacker, or it was an insider. Or the attacker HAS an insider at GoDaddy.

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 4:53 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Go Daddy outage info...

 

I think internal DOS is worse than external DDOS at least for them… but 
definitely they are trying a media spin on the whole situation.  I agree 
underlying issues aren’t corrected, the same stuff will continue. 

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 8:27 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Go Daddy outage info...

 

And, as I commented to someone at work earlier:

I don't know which is worse for someone in their line of business, being taken 
down by a single person using a DDoS engine, or fubaring your routing 
infrastructure.

Kurt

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 5:05 PM, Andrew S. Baker  wrote:

Gives new meaning to the term "intermittent"

 

Well, if they are lying about the DDoS, and haven't addressed the underlying 
weakness, we can expect a repeat performance in the near future...


ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market…

 

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 5:11 PM, Maglinger, Paul  wrote:

Tried to post this once and didn't see it come through.  Trying again...

 http://www.godaddy.com/newscenter/release-view.aspx?news_item_id=410

 -Paul

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RE: Password policy question

[David Mazzaccaro]

I have found that passphrases instead of passwords help for a lot of C-level 
people.

Here’s an “easy” one for example:  4sa7ya!

 

 

From: Stefan Jafs [mailto:stefan.j...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 1:46 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Password policy question

 

I told him the other day that I have about 15 - 20 different passwords that I 
remember on a daily bases, he did not think that was possible, I think it's 
very important not to have the same login and password for everything, actually 
a sales guy just had his Linkedin, Yahoo accounts compromised and also his 
Aeroplan miles stolen.

So I'm working on the President to add a few more variations on his password, 
we'll see. Anyhow for the rest of the company, I'm starting to enforce complex 
passwords.

 

Stefan

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 1:26 PM, John Cook  wrote:

Because no doubt he's the most careful employee when it comes to password 
security :-) 
John W. Cook 
Network Operations Manager 
Partnership for Strong Families
 

From: Stefan Jafs [mailto:stefan.j...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 01:16 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues  
Subject: Re: Password policy question 
 

Thanks Jonathan, just needed to confirm, the President does not want to change 
his password, so I'll leave his as never expire.

 

Stefan

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 11:26 AM, Jonathan Link  wrote:

That's correct, Never expire takes precedence.

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 10:16 AM, Stefan Jafs  wrote:

Windows 2003 AD, if i turn on “Maximum password age� in GP but a user 
have "Password never expire" set in Active Directory Users and Computers I 
assume that it will not affect that user, am I correct it that assumption?



-- 
Stefan Jafs

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Stefan Jafs

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Servers - Cisco UCS C220 M3 instead of HP DL360?

[David Mazzaccaro]

I am getting a few quotes for VMware hosts.
3 vendors quoted me DL360 Gen8 servers, but one other is pushing Cisco
UCS C220 M3 servers instead.
Anyone have any good/bad opinions on the Cisco offering? 



.
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RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Good to know (I actually started this thread, and have yet to move to
VM)...


-Original Message-
From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Monday, August 20, 2012 4:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Looks like this (vRAM entitlement) will no longer be an issue.

http://www.crn.com/news/cloud/240005840/vmware-kills-vram-licensing-will
-fo
cus-on-vsphere-cloud-bundles.htm


Carl Webster
Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional
http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/>






On 4/13/12 1:05 PM, "Paul Hutchings"  wrote:

>OK one more thing:
>
>vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.
>
>Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.
>
>6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.
>
>So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
>occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).
>____
>From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
>Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!
>
>LOL
>Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
>Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!
>
>I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck
out...
>
>> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
>
>Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
>it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100...
As
>long as I'm looking at the right memory.
>
>http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7
&
>Cat=RAM
>48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
>$8099.91
>
>Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
>Sm:)e.
>
>
>--Matt Ross
>Ephrata School District
>
>
>- Original Message -
>From: David Mazzaccaro
>Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!
>
>
>> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
>> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
>solution:
>>
>> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
>> HP DL380 G7 E5660
>> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
>> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
>> Quad port gig adapter
>>
>> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
>> HP 2910
>>
>> 1 SAN ($22,700)
>> NetApp 2240
>> 12 x 600GB
>>
>> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>>
>> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
>> Server 2008 Datacenter
>>
>> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>>
>> $40k services
>> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
>> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>>
>> Total: $185,000
>>
>> Sound good?



~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
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RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

LOL


-Original Message-
From: Ben Scott [mailto:mailvor...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 7:33 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: help w/ tracert

On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 11:59 PM, Daniel Chenault
 wrote:
>>> Paetec has a routing issue. But you already knew that.
>>
>>   Daniel wins the thread.  :-)
>
> Do I get a prize? Bottle of tequila?

  One month of free Internet service from Paetec.

-- Ben

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RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

Good to hear.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that we start seeing an improvement.

 

 

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 4:17 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

We ended up saving a lot of money on our connection services from the
buyout, we've not (knock on wood) seen any issues since the takeover.

 

 John W. Cook

Network Operations Manager

Partnership For Strong Families

5950 NW 1st Place

Gainesville, Fl 32607

Office (352) 244-1610

Cell (352) 215-6944

MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 4:00 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

It was never like this when they were Paetec.  They were bought by
Windstream and have gone completely downhill.

Of course, that was after we re-signed for 3 years... naturally.

 

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:39 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

ROFL... that is utterly sad, but definitely not untypical.

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:21 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

It was Paetec (Windstream).

They weren't routing appropriately.  Only took them 6 hours to figure
that out.

 

 

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 2:19 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

Routing issue in FW probably 

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:44 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: help w/ tracert

 

When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any suggestions
from the group?

Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...

Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]

over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}

  2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

Trace com

RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

Touché


-Original Message-
From: Free, Bob [mailto:r...@pge.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 4:14 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

Or more apropos to the concurrent threads...pong :-]

-Original Message-
From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 12:43 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

Like a tennis match.


-Original Message-
From: Steve Kradel [mailto:skra...@zetetic.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:30 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: help w/ tracert

Routing loops are not that unusual when folks get to (badly) configuring 
routing, although it's most unfortunate when absolutely all your outbound 
traffic gets stuck in the loop...
When a.b.c.13 has a.b.c.14 as its default gateway, and a.b.c.14 has
a.b.c.13 as *its* default gw... there ya go.

--Steve

On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 2:18 PM, Ziots, Edward 
wrote:
> Routing issue in FW probably
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +
>
> Security Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
>
>
> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:44 PM
>
>
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: help w/ tracert
>
>
>
> When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any
suggestions from
> the group?
>
> Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...
>
> Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]
>
> over a maximum of 30 hops:
>
>   1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}
>
>   2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>   4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>   610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>   813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
> Trace complete.
>
>
> .
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ 
> <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Ente

RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

It was never like this when they were Paetec.  They were bought by
Windstream and have gone completely downhill.

Of course, that was after we re-signed for 3 years... naturally.

 

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:39 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

ROFL... that is utterly sad, but definitely not untypical.

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:21 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

It was Paetec (Windstream).

They weren't routing appropriately.  Only took them 6 hours to figure
that out.

 

 

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 2:19 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

Routing issue in FW probably 

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:44 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: help w/ tracert

 

When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any suggestions
from the group?

Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...

Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]

over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}

  2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

Trace complete.


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunb

RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

Like a tennis match.


-Original Message-
From: Steve Kradel [mailto:skra...@zetetic.net] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:30 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: help w/ tracert

Routing loops are not that unusual when folks get to (badly)
configuring routing, although it's most unfortunate when absolutely
all your outbound traffic gets stuck in the loop...
When a.b.c.13 has a.b.c.14 as its default gateway, and a.b.c.14 has
a.b.c.13 as *its* default gw... there ya go.

--Steve

On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 2:18 PM, Ziots, Edward 
wrote:
> Routing issue in FW probably
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +
>
> Security Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
>
>
> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:44 PM
>
>
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: help w/ tracert
>
>
>
> When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any
suggestions from
> the group?
>
> Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...
>
> Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]
>
> over a maximum of 30 hops:
>
>   1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}
>
>   2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>   4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>   610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>   813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>   914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
>  2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.14]
>
>  3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net
> [63.138.116.13]
>
> Trace complete.
>
>
> .
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>

~ Finally, powerful endpo

RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

It was Paetec (Windstream).

They weren't routing appropriately.  Only took them 6 hours to figure
that out.

 

 

 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 2:19 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

Routing issue in FW probably 

 

Z

 

Edward E. Ziots, CISSP, Security +, Network +

Security Engineer

Lifespan Organization

ezi...@lifespan.org

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:44 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: help w/ tracert

 

When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any suggestions
from the group?

Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...

Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]

over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}

  2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

Trace complete.


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

Correct.  

Internet is down for all my remote locations.  

They all come back here via the Paetec (Windstream) MPLS network to go out 
through COX.

 

This is how it is supposed to work:

Remote office requests google.com>goes out their router>over the MPLS 
network>to Newington’s router>passes to Newington’s firewall>Cox internet

 

 

 

 

 

From: Richard Stovall [mailto:rich...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:59 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: help w/ tracert

 

What prompted the trace?  Is your Internet service down?  Is Paetec your ISP?  
Your e-mail looks to have originated from 98.172.163.12, a Cox ip.

On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 1:43 PM, David Mazzaccaro 
 wrote:

When I run a tracert to google, here are the results… any suggestions from the 
group?

Its like it just bounces between these two hosts…

Tracing route to google.com <http://google.com/>  [74.125.224.161]

over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}

  2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

  3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

  4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

  5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

  610 ms10 ms10 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

  710 ms10 ms11 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

  813 ms13 ms13 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

  914 ms14 ms28 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 1017 ms17 ms17 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 1117 ms17 ms17 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 1220 ms20 ms20 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 1324 ms20 ms20 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 1432 ms37 ms24 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 1524 ms24 ms35 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 1628 ms26 ms26 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 1727 ms27 ms27 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 1830 ms31 ms31 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 1931 ms30 ms32 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 2033 ms33 ms33 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 2134 ms38 ms34 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 2237 ms52 ms37 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 2337 ms37 ms37 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 2440 ms41 ms40 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 2541 ms42 ms41 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 2650 ms43 ms43 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 2744 ms44 ms44 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.14  ]

 2860 ms47 ms64 ms  63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.static.ip.paetec.net/>  [63.138.116.13  ]

 2947 ms47 ms48 ms  63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net 
<http://customer.st

RE: help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

That's what I figured... Paetec is now Windstream and OH BOY what a
disaster...

They were telling me it's my firewall blocking traffic... then my
router, now admitting they have the wrong routes.

Ridiculous.

 

 

 

From: Daniel Chenault [mailto:dchena...@lgnetworksinc.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 1:47 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: help w/ tracert

 

Paetec has a routing issue. But you already knew that.

 

Daniel Chenault

dchena...@lgnetworksinc.com

 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 12:44 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: help w/ tracert

 

When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any suggestions
from the group?

Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...

Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]

over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}

  2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

  813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

  914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

 2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]

 3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

Trace complete.


.

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help w/ tracert

[David Mazzaccaro]

When I run a tracert to google, here are the results... any suggestions
from the group?
Its like it just bounces between these two hosts...

Tracing route to google.com [74.125.224.161]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1 1 ms<1 ms<1 ms  {local IP Address removed}
  2 3 ms 3 ms 3 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
  3 4 ms 4 ms 4 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
  4 7 ms 8 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
  5 7 ms 7 ms 7 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
  610 ms10 ms10 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
  710 ms10 ms11 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
  813 ms13 ms13 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
  914 ms14 ms28 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 1017 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 1117 ms17 ms17 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 1220 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 1324 ms20 ms20 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 1432 ms37 ms24 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 1524 ms24 ms35 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 1628 ms26 ms26 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 1727 ms27 ms27 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 1830 ms31 ms31 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 1931 ms30 ms32 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 2033 ms33 ms33 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 2134 ms38 ms34 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 2237 ms52 ms37 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 2337 ms37 ms37 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 2440 ms41 ms40 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 2541 ms42 ms41 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 2650 ms43 ms43 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 2744 ms44 ms44 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 2860 ms47 ms64 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]
 2947 ms47 ms48 ms
63-138-116-14.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.14]
 3052 ms50 ms51 ms
63-138-116-13.customer.static.ip.paetec.net [63.138.116.13]

Trace complete.

.
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RE: Logmein - down???

[David Mazzaccaro]

Good here (CT)

 

 

From: David L Herrick [mailto:davidherr...@nincal.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2012 2:18 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Logmein - down???

 

Or is it only here?

 

Tx

 

David

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RE: Recycling Resource

[David Mazzaccaro]

LOL
Nice one!


-Original Message-
From: Daniel Chenault [mailto:dchena...@lgnetworksinc.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2012 1:44 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Recycling Resource

I have a bunch of dead batteries but I can't sell them to anyone.
They're no charge.

Daniel Chenault
dchena...@lgnetworksinc.com



-Original Message-
From: Ben Scott [mailto:mailvor...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2012 12:33 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Recycling Resource

On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 1:21 PM, N Parr  wrote:
> Good Will takes almost everything.  They even told me last time we had

> a city recycling day to just call them and they will send a truck 
> since I had all my old stuff shrink wrapped on a pallet.  They even 
> take old batteries from my backups.

  Batteries contain metals that have value, so they're a profitable
item.  You can usually get money for them if you find a metals
reclamation company.

  The tough ones are usually CRTs.  They contain unprofitable but toxic
leaded glass, are bulky and heavy, and *nobody* wants them anymore.

-- Ben

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  ~

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RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

The 5 server configuration is exactly what the vendor I am leaning
towards is proposing. 

Thank you.

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 8:15 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

For 5 2008 R2 VMs, install WI/CSG, a dedicated ZDC, three 6.5 servers,
basic configuration, install apps and testing can easily be done in 16
hours.  That is based on "Typical published apps (Office, Adobe reader,
IE, my docs)".  A couple of more hours for documentation and knowledge
transfer and we are done.

 

If you create a 2008 R2 SP1 fully patched template beforehand you can
save yourself some billable hours from me. J

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com  

 

From: Michael B. Smith [mailto:mich...@smithcons.com] 
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

I did very much this work for a client recently and my quote was for 100
hours (which included setting up a 3 node DAG). Only significant
difference was I used Hyper-V instead of VMware and no Citrix work was
involved. I doubt that the virtualization platform should make any
significant difference. Based on what I've subbed to Webster in the
past, the Citrix work shouldn't be more than 15-20 hours, if that.

 

That being said, I script the heck out of everything.

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RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Yes, but at first appearance it was not 100% clear...

 

"Desktop Director provides a detailed and intuitive overview of
XenDesktop environments"

Vs.

"Desktop Director provides an overview of XenDesktop hosted desktops and
XenApp sessions"

Vs.

"Desktop Director is truly a great tool and so Citrix now extended
Desktop Director for XenApp 6.5 and newer (you can see how XenDesktop
and XenApp are slowly converging)."

Vs.

"Desktop Director 2.0 allows connections to both XenDesktop 5.5 and
XenApp 6.5. The default installation is only configured for XenDesktop
connections"

 

It sounds like it is new to XA, and should work w/ possibly some
tweaks... just not as straightforward as some might think.

 

Anyway, I just wanted to check w/ our resident expert.

J

Thx!

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2012 10:21 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Did u read any of the links?

Webster

Sent from my Verizon Wireless Phone

David Mazzaccaro wrote: 

It sounds like DD is only for XenDesktop?  

If I'm only using XenApp will DD still be of any use?

Thx

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 4:40 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

How can I say this without breaking NDA?  I wouldn't worry too much
about EdgeSight.  I would spend my time with the new Desktop Director.

 

http://support.citrix.com/proddocs/topic/technologies/director-landing-p
age.html

 

http://virtualizationreview.com/blogs/virtual-insider/2012/05/how-to-ins
tall-desktop-director-on-citrix-xenapp-6-5-servers.aspx

 

http://www.rogerbirong.com/2012/05/configuring-citrix-desktop-director-2
-1-for-use-with-citrix-xenapp-6-5/

 

http://support.citrix.com/article/CTX130713

 

J

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 3:08 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

You can download it but it will not work without the proper
XenApp/XenDesktop product edition license.

 

http://support.citrix.com/article/CTX126059

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Excellent info! Thank you VERY much.

Is EdgeSight another paid product?  Or free download/addon?

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

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RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

In this area (Connecticut), $175 is pretty standard.

 

 

From: Brian Desmond [mailto:br...@briandesmond.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 5:24 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

So:

 

$38K @ $150 = 253 hours, or, 6 weeks of work for one resource

$38K @ $175 = 217 hours, or about 5 weeks of work for one resource

 

Both labor estimates seem a bit on the high side to me. What's the
vendor's rate? 

 

Thanks,

Brian Desmond

br...@briandesmond.com

 

w - 312.625.1438 | c   - 312.731.3132

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:52 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Here is the SOW (for $38k)

 

* Hold a kickoff meeting (one hour; online; 2 resources)

* Review and assess Exchange Environment

* Confirm Active Directory readiness

* Create Discovery documentation (approx.. 4 pages)

* Prepare the Exchange 2010 design

* Provide recommendations for network planning, coexistence planning,
and policy planning

* Provide recommendations for auxiliary pieces of the architecture, such
as faxing and mobile devices

* Install and configure 3 VM hosts running VMWare vSphere 5

* Install Server 2008 R2 on physical server for Domain Controller
functionality

* Build 6 new Virtual Machines

* Install Server 2008 R2 on new VM's

* Update firmware on Dell Equallogic SAN

* Create Volumes and connect vSphere hosts to volumes

* Upgrade AD to 2008 R2 forest and domain levels

* Install and Configure AD 2008 R2 on one VM

* Install vCenter Server and configure HA on one VM

* Install Server 2008 R2 on three VM's for Citrix XenApp

* Install Citrix XenApp on three VM's

* Install up to 4 applications

* Publish up to 4 Applications

* Procure and install 1 UCC Certificate for the Exchange 2010
environment

* Implement the necessary prerequisites for Exchange 2010 installation

* Perform pre-implementation configuration of Exchange 2010 environment

* Storage setup for new environment (up to 2 Mail Databases)

* CAS/HT/MB Role Installation for 1 Multi-role server

* Modify Exchange 2003 to allow proxying from 2010

* Functionality testing

* Provide implementation issue remediation (up to 4 hours)

* Provide one 2-hour training session to CLIENT Exchange Admin for
MB/Public Folder migration

* Provide migration issue remediation (up to 2 hours)

* Physical to Virtual (P2V) existing servers in environment

* Retire the Exchange 2003 environment

* Retire 2003 Domain controllers (power down)

* Provide knowledge transfer to CLIENT Exchange/VM Admin (up to 4 hours)

* Provide Post-Implementation Support (up to 8 hours)

* Configure backups for all new machines

* Install anti-virus on all new VM's

* Provide As-Built Documentation of the environment (up to 4 pages)

* Planned onsite visit(s): 1

 

 

 

From: Brian Desmond [mailto:br...@briandesmond.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 4:23 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

I can't comment on the AD/Exchange services costs without knowing what's
in the scope of work.

 

As to the storage, the NetApp frame is going to offer you
*substantially* more functionality than the competing solution, IMO. I'd
strongly lean towards NetApp's offering especially looking at it as a
long term investment. 

 

Thanks,

Brian Desmond

br...@briandesmond.com <mailto:br...@briandesmond.com> 

 

w - 312.625.1438 | c   - 312.731.3132

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com
<mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com> ] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 2:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: moving to virtual

 

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for Xen

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

It sounds like DD is only for XenDesktop?  

If I'm only using XenApp will DD still be of any use?

Thx

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 4:40 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

How can I say this without breaking NDA?  I wouldn't worry too much
about EdgeSight.  I would spend my time with the new Desktop Director.

 

http://support.citrix.com/proddocs/topic/technologies/director-landing-p
age.html

 

http://virtualizationreview.com/blogs/virtual-insider/2012/05/how-to-ins
tall-desktop-director-on-citrix-xenapp-6-5-servers.aspx

 

http://www.rogerbirong.com/2012/05/configuring-citrix-desktop-director-2
-1-for-use-with-citrix-xenapp-6-5/

 

http://support.citrix.com/article/CTX130713

 

J

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 3:08 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

You can download it but it will not work without the proper
XenApp/XenDesktop product edition license.

 

http://support.citrix.com/article/CTX126059

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Excellent info! Thank you VERY much.

Is EdgeSight another paid product?  Or free download/addon?

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Ah, thank you.

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 4:08 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

You can download it but it will not work without the proper
XenApp/XenDesktop product edition license.

 

http://support.citrix.com/article/CTX126059

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Excellent info! Thank you VERY much.

Is EdgeSight another paid product?  Or free download/addon?

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

This is the response I got from VMW when I asked if I could have each
machine installed w/ 192GB.
I guess he's telling me that that RAM will be fine, but I likely won't
have enough CPU to go around:

You can have 192 GB of RAM on each machine, the issue that you will run
into if you were to move everything onto one host is the amount of CPU
that you will have to allocate to the virtual machines within the
environment.  Again you have to remember that even though you have
allocated "X" amount of vRAM to a virtual machine the virtual machine
may not be utilizing all of that allocated vRAM.  I hope that this helps
answer your question.




-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:07 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

By all means double check (I am now!!) but my understanding is that the
entire point of the vRAM licensing is that it removes any physical
restriction on the RAM in a machine, as per the PDF I linked to "No
Limits on Physical Resources".

So sure, you still need to have each processor licensed, but the vRAM
allowance that comes with each processor license goes into a single pool
and they wouldn't care if each individual host had 32gb or 512gb of
physical RAM so long as your VM's weren't allocated more than 192gb of
vRAM in total.

The Essentials kits appear to limit you to 2 physical CPUs but the
documentation states that the vRAM capacity is still pooled, so it's
almost a mix of two licensing limits.
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 17 July 2012 4:53 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

This is not what VMW told me on the phone.
I will ask them to clarify, thx.
In any case, for my environment I would still think 64GB per host would
be plenty?



-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 11:14 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

VMware don't care what physical RAM is in your servers any more.  All
they care about is that your vRAM is licensed.

-Original Message-
From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
Sent: 17 July 2012 15:42
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

Read that a bit more carefully - the section titled Essentials Kits - no
more than two procs per machine and no more than three hosts.They are
pretty much enforcing a maximum of three machines, though you could do
only one or two, but you're crippling yourself if you do.

Kurt

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 11:51 PM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:
> I don't think it is, it's pooled across your hosts hence vRAM
entitlement.  You need to have the right amount licensed but it doesn't
care how it's spread across hosts.
>
> http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/vsphere_pricing.pdf
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
> Sent: 16 July 2012 23:10
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: moving to virtual
>
> As I mentioned to ASB - he can't do that. Licensing for RAM is 64gb
per host.
>
> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:
>> Get double that if you can.  HP RAM is expensive, Kingston is cheap
>> and works just fine.
>> 
>> From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
>> Sent: 16 July 2012 9:31 PM
>>
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: RE: moving to virtual
>>
>> Yes, 64GB per server.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Kramer, Jack [mailto:jack.kra...@cabs.msu.edu]
>> Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:45 PM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: Re: moving to virtual
>>
>>
>>
>> I think you'll be fine with 6-core processors. Make sure you have as
>> much RAM as your licensing permits in your hosts-you'll use RAM a lot
>> faster than CPU.
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> Jack Kramer
>> Manager of Information Technology
>> Communications and Brand Strategy
>>
>> Michigan State University
>>
>> w: 517-884-1231 / c: 248-635-4955
>>
>>
>>
>> From: David Mazzaccaro 
>> Reply-To: NT System Admin Issues
>> 
>> Date: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:36 PM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues 
>> Subject: moving to virtual
>>
>>
>>
>> Greetings,
>>
>> Getting  very close to moving into the VM world,andhave acouple of
>> questions...
>>
>> 1)I am trying to figure out if Ishould go with 8 core or 6 core
>> processors in my3 hosts for myupcoming VMware environment.
>>
>> The price is about double.  And I&

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Is that a free download?

 

 

From: Rankin, James R [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:06 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

No resource manager in XA 6 or 6.5 - its all EdgeSight now

---Blackberried



From: "David Mazzaccaro"  

Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2012 12:51:05 -0400

To: NT System Admin Issues

ReplyTo: "NT System Admin Issues"


Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Thanks Webster!

 

I just went through this matrix.

It appears to me that everything I would need is included w/ Advanced.

 

>From the user's perspective, one thing that they have now is if they log
into WI, launch an app, then log into WI from another computer, their
app follows them.  

Is this included w/ Advanced?

 

For me, I use "Resource Manager" pretty frequently to check counters,
get alerts, and run server snapshots to see historical performance.

Is this included w/ Advanced?

 

Also - there are a couple of things that I wouldn't get w/ Adv that I
could use more clarification on... for my size environment are any of
the following things necessary?

 

"Service Monitoring" - Enable IT to quickly pinpoint and troubleshoot
server, network, and application performance issues that impact the user
experience.  

 

"System monitoring and reporting" - Administrator can efficiently manage
and monitor system resources and generate reports on application and
server availability, configuration, performance, capacity, and
maintenance.  

 

"Virtual memory optimization" - Improves overall performance by rebasing
DLLs to better optimize the use of virtual memory. The optimizations
attempt to eliminate DLL memory mapping conflicts from process to
process (app to app or session to session) which reduces the amount of
page swapping.

 

"Power and capacity management" - Create system policies that manage
server power consumption and make the most optimal use of server
capacity during both peak and off-peak hours. Automatically brings
capacity online to maintain expected user performance and access and
retires capacity when it is no longer needed.

 

"Health assistant" - Performs continuous server health checks and
automatically initiates recovery procedures, minimizing the need for
administrator intervention.

 

"Server preference and fail-over" - Establishes user sessions based on
their proximity to and availability of a particular server or group of
servers. This feature enables higher user and farm performance in
implementations that span multiple data centers and eases disaster
recovery and business continuity by automatically directing users to
backup servers if primary servers are unavailable.

 

"CPU utilization management" - Prevents individual users and processes
from taking too much CPU at any given time, ensuring a consistent
performance level for all users on the server.

 

"Profile data capture" - Auto-detects and stores modified profile
settings in the registry and file system and captures any modifications
within the profile, preventing unintentional overwriting of user
profiles using built-in logic to determine what data should be kept.

"User profile streaming" - Loads user profile settings on-demand rather
than during logon. Administrators can specify rules for downloading and
caching large profile components in the background. This reduces logon
time and accelerates application access.

 

"HDX Broadcast Branch optimization" - Powered by Citrix Branch
Repeater(r), these features automatically adapt and tune WAN
communications. Auto-optimizer adaptively tunes for optimal performance
based on real-time network and traffic conditions. Adaptive TCP flow
control mitigates TCP penalties and maximizes bandwidth utilization for
all communications across the WAN between branch offices and client
devices. Multi-level compression reduces data size for all WAN
communications by up to 3500-to-1 by applying the optimal combination of
multiple compression techniques.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 10:44 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

It Depends [1].  What features are you using in the current license
edition and what features can you use or do without in 6.5 Adv or Ent?

 

http://www.citrix.com/site/resources/dynamic/additional/Citrix_XenApp_6.
5_Comparative_Feature_Matrix.pdf

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

1.   This should be trademarked by Citrix. J

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:09 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Looking into it further, if all I want is to be on the current
equivalent of 

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thanks Webster!

 

I just went through this matrix.

It appears to me that everything I would need is included w/ Advanced.

 

>From the user's perspective, one thing that they have now is if they log
into WI, launch an app, then log into WI from another computer, their
app follows them.  

Is this included w/ Advanced?

 

For me, I use "Resource Manager" pretty frequently to check counters,
get alerts, and run server snapshots to see historical performance.

Is this included w/ Advanced?

 

Also - there are a couple of things that I wouldn't get w/ Adv that I
could use more clarification on... for my size environment are any of
the following things necessary?

 

"Service Monitoring" - Enable IT to quickly pinpoint and troubleshoot
server, network, and application performance issues that impact the user
experience.  

 

"System monitoring and reporting" - Administrator can efficiently manage
and monitor system resources and generate reports on application and
server availability, configuration, performance, capacity, and
maintenance.  

 

"Virtual memory optimization" - Improves overall performance by rebasing
DLLs to better optimize the use of virtual memory. The optimizations
attempt to eliminate DLL memory mapping conflicts from process to
process (app to app or session to session) which reduces the amount of
page swapping.

 

"Power and capacity management" - Create system policies that manage
server power consumption and make the most optimal use of server
capacity during both peak and off-peak hours. Automatically brings
capacity online to maintain expected user performance and access and
retires capacity when it is no longer needed.

 

"Health assistant" - Performs continuous server health checks and
automatically initiates recovery procedures, minimizing the need for
administrator intervention.

 

"Server preference and fail-over" - Establishes user sessions based on
their proximity to and availability of a particular server or group of
servers. This feature enables higher user and farm performance in
implementations that span multiple data centers and eases disaster
recovery and business continuity by automatically directing users to
backup servers if primary servers are unavailable.

 

"CPU utilization management" - Prevents individual users and processes
from taking too much CPU at any given time, ensuring a consistent
performance level for all users on the server.

 

"Profile data capture" - Auto-detects and stores modified profile
settings in the registry and file system and captures any modifications
within the profile, preventing unintentional overwriting of user
profiles using built-in logic to determine what data should be kept.



"User profile streaming" - Loads user profile settings on-demand rather
than during logon. Administrators can specify rules for downloading and
caching large profile components in the background. This reduces logon
time and accelerates application access.

 

"HDX Broadcast Branch optimization" - Powered by Citrix Branch
Repeater(r), these features automatically adapt and tune WAN
communications. Auto-optimizer adaptively tunes for optimal performance
based on real-time network and traffic conditions. Adaptive TCP flow
control mitigates TCP penalties and maximizes bandwidth utilization for
all communications across the WAN between branch offices and client
devices. Multi-level compression reduces data size for all WAN
communications by up to 3500-to-1 by applying the optimal combination of
multiple compression techniques.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 10:44 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

It Depends [1].  What features are you using in the current license
edition and what features can you use or do without in 6.5 Adv or Ent?

 

http://www.citrix.com/site/resources/dynamic/additional/Citrix_XenApp_6.
5_Comparative_Feature_Matrix.pdf

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

1.   This should be trademarked by Citrix. J

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:09 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Looking into it further, if all I want is to be on the current
equivalent of what I have now - is XenApp Advanced good enough?

Right now I have PS4.0 Enterprise:

3 PS4.0 servers hosting apps

1 web interface server

1 server that hosts my user profiles.

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:51 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

IMNSHO, XenDesktop (and VDI in general) is oversold, over hyped, over
promised, under delivered and vastly misunderstood.

 

Carl Webster

Co

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

This is not what VMW told me on the phone.
I will ask them to clarify, thx.
In any case, for my environment I would still think 64GB per host would be 
plenty?



-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 11:14 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

VMware don't care what physical RAM is in your servers any more.  All they care 
about is that your vRAM is licensed.

-Original Message-
From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 17 July 2012 15:42
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

Read that a bit more carefully - the section titled Essentials Kits - no more 
than two procs per machine and no more than three hosts.They are pretty much 
enforcing a maximum of three machines, though you could do only one or two, but 
you're crippling yourself if you do.

Kurt

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 11:51 PM, Paul Hutchings  
wrote:
> I don't think it is, it's pooled across your hosts hence vRAM entitlement.  
> You need to have the right amount licensed but it doesn't care how it's 
> spread across hosts.
>
> http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/vsphere_pricing.pdf
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
> Sent: 16 July 2012 23:10
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: moving to virtual
>
> As I mentioned to ASB - he can't do that. Licensing for RAM is 64gb per host.
>
> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Paul Hutchings  
> wrote:
>> Get double that if you can.  HP RAM is expensive, Kingston is cheap 
>> and works just fine.
>> 
>> From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
>> Sent: 16 July 2012 9:31 PM
>>
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: RE: moving to virtual
>>
>> Yes, 64GB per server.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Kramer, Jack [mailto:jack.kra...@cabs.msu.edu]
>> Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:45 PM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: Re: moving to virtual
>>
>>
>>
>> I think you'll be fine with 6-core processors. Make sure you have as 
>> much RAM as your licensing permits in your hosts—you'll use RAM a lot 
>> faster than CPU.
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> Jack Kramer
>> Manager of Information Technology
>> Communications and Brand Strategy
>>
>> Michigan State University
>>
>> w: 517-884-1231 / c: 248-635-4955
>>
>>
>>
>> From: David Mazzaccaro 
>> Reply-To: NT System Admin Issues
>> 
>> Date: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:36 PM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues 
>> Subject: moving to virtual
>>
>>
>>
>> Greetings,
>>
>> Getting  very close to moving into the VM world,andhave acouple of 
>> questions…
>>
>> 1)I am trying to figure out if Ishould go with 8 core or 6 core 
>> processors in my3 hosts for myupcoming VMware environment.
>>
>> The price is about double.  And I’m not sure I need 8 cores.
>>
>> The layoutthat has been quoted is as follows:
>>
>> 3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.
>>
>> Thehost serversI am looking at are either:
>>
>> HPDL360 G82x Intel® Xeon® E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W) $5356 
>> each
>>
>> HPDL360 G82x Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
>> $10,061 each
>>
>> I currentlyhave8 physical servers(Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0)that we 
>> will be P2V’d.
>>
>> After I P2Vthe servers, the plan is to begincreating new Windows 2008
>> R2 VMs andmigrating each server’s role(2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010, 
>> and Citrix XenApp 6.5).
>>
>> I wantenough power to be able to run my existing8 servers in a 
>> virtual environmentand migratethem to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as 
>> leave some room for testingand growth.
>>
>> 2of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core 
>> processors.
>>
>> 2) The quotes I have for the“services” part of this are:
>>
>> $40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch, $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)
>>
>> $38,000 (not itemized)
>>
>> $28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex,$6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)
>>
>> Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.
>>
>> I really think 28k iseither too aggressive or simply not realistic.
>> This is the same vendor who quoted me(3) singleprocessorservers, so I 
>> have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.
>>
>> 3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:
>>
>> PS4100XV (12 600GB 

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Only 1 vendor I talked to is putting in a physical DC as part of their
quote.

For the same reasons you mentioned here.

The other 2 quotes said to virtualize everything... which makes me
nervous.

 

 

 

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 10:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

3 5.0 hosts in main Datacenter and another in a separate future DR
location. Both setups are iSCSI. Probably 25ish VMs, a mix of XP, W7,
Server 2003, 2008 and 2008R2 running Exchange 2010, SQL 2008, email
archiving, BES, AV, DCs, ect.   I DO maintain a physical DC in case
of that whole datacenter shutdown. Bringing it up first helps
tremendously.

 

 John W. Cook

Network Operations Manager

Partnership For Strong Families

5950 NW 1st Place

Gainesville, Fl 32607

Office (352) 244-1610

Cell (352) 215-6944

MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:53 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Glad to hear it. Thanks.

How many servers/users/devices you managing?

 

 

 

 

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:33 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Which is exactly how we have it set up. A host failure on any level goes
unnoticed by the end users plus we can do host updates during business
hours, it really makes life easier to not have to come in after hours to
do this and with your one man shop (I'm with you) it is essential for
not hitting the burnout wall trying to keep up.

 

 John W. Cook

Network Operations Manager

Partnership For Strong Families

5950 NW 1st Place

Gainesville, Fl 32607

Office (352) 244-1610

Cell (352) 215-6944

MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:04 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

3 hosts will give me an n+1 configuration.

I assume I will need 2 hosts to run my environment, and having 3 will
allow for 1 to be down.

Unless you are saying 1 host is enough to run everything and the 2nd
host would still give me redundancy?

 

 

 

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 5:02 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

The 8 cores vs 6 cores is really not apples to apples in this case, and
while you will almost always be better off going with the best you can
afford at a given moment, the truth is that you'll be positively fine
with 6-cores.

 

The key, as others have already mentioned is RAM -- closely followed by
disk.  CPU is a bit further out.  Get tons of RAM.

 

Now, I have to ask.  Why 3 hosts?  You only have 8 systems to
virtualize, plus some growth.  Define the reasonable range of growth for
1 year?  4 VMs?  8 VMs?Unless you said, "20 VMs", I'd be very much
inclined to tell you to save yourself the hardware and licensing costs
of one host server right now.


We're running dozens of production VMs across a pair of quad-core host
servers. For 190 users, you'll be fine.

 

I second Brian on the NetApp recommendation.

 

As for the services part of the quote, why do you think the $28K is
unrealistic?  What are the quoted timeframes for the project?  What is
the proposed scope of work?


Regards,

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 3:36 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Vmotion.

And things like John Cook mentioned…being able to update hosts during business 
hours, host outage won’t affect users.

 

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 10:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

There’s nothing here that suggests SAN.  You could run it all on a single box 
using DAS.  Two boxes gives some redundancy.

 

If you want to be able to vMotion and move hosts whilst you maintenance then 
sure, you need shared storage, but you have less than 1tb of VM’s – even 
allowing for expansion I would think very strongly about something like the 
VMware or HP VSA – it’ll actually give you better redundancy than a single box 
from Equallogic or Netapp or any other non-clustered SAN/NAS would.

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: 17 July 2012 14:30
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Dell actually ran this thing called DPACK and provided a nice report of drive 
space, RAM, IOPS, throughput, etc.

Used storage capacity is 822GB.

Total RAM is 30GB, used is 20GB

Total throughput: 94

IOPS:  at 95%, 2500 at 99%, 2868 at peak.  (This includes nightly backups.  
Looking at each individual server, throughout the work day is MUCH less)  most 
servers rarely go over 200 during the day.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: hotmail_b243df4f33245...@live.com 
[mailto:hotmail_b243df4f33245...@live.com] On Behalf Of ken schaefer
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 7:15 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

In my experience, disk I/O is your biggest bottleneck. You start needing gobs 
of RAM to cater for underspecced disk subsystem.

Otherwise, 6 core is fine. Run some perfmon or MAP tool to get some idea of 
your CPU usage today. But I suspect you'll find it quite low.

Even with RAM for 8 VMs on 3 hosts, I think 64GB is possibly overkill, though 
it depends on your user base.

We've got 1000+ VMs, and density of up to 20:1 on DL380s with 192GB RAM. 6 core 
CPUs, though moving to 8 core with the G8 series

Sent from my Windows Phone



From: Kurt Buff
Sent: 17/7/2012 9:00 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

Can't.

Essentials Plus package specifies max RAM per host of 64gb.

Kurt

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 2:03 PM, Andrew S. Baker  wrote:

Not enough.  Go with 96+GB at 6-cores across only 2 hosts.  You'll be happier 
for longer.


 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market…

 

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 4:31 PM, David Mazzaccaro 
 wrote:

Yes, 64GB per server.

 

 

From: Kramer, Jack [mailto:jack.kra...@cabs.msu.edu] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:45 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: moving to virtual 

 

I think you'll be fine with 6-core processors. Make sure you have as much RAM 
as your licensing permits in your hosts—you'll use RAM a lot faster than CPU.

 


Jack Kramer
Manager of Information Technology
Communications and Brand Strategy 

Michigan State University 

w: 517-884-1231 / c: 248-635-4955

 

From: David Mazzaccaro 
Reply-To: NT System Admin Issues 
Date: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues 
Subject: moving to virtual

 

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world,andhave acouple of 
questions…

1)I am trying to figure out if Ishould go with 8 core or 6 core 
processors in my3 hosts for myupcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I’m not sure I need 8 cores.

The layoutthat has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

Thehost serversI am looking at are either:

HPDL360 G82x Intel® Xeon® E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W) $5356 
each

HPDL360 G82x Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W) 
$10,061 each

I currentlyhave8 physical servers(Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0)that we 
will be P2V’d.

After I P2Vthe servers, the plan is to begincreating new Windows 2008 
R2 VMs andmigrating each server’s role(2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010, and Citrix 
XenApp 6.5).

I wantenough power to be able to run my existing8 servers in a virtual 
environmentand migratethem to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave some room 
for testingand growth.

2of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core 
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the“services” part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch, $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex,$6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k iseither too aggressive or simply not realistic. 
This is the same vendor who quoted me(3) singleprocessorservers, so I have to 

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Glad to hear it. Thanks.

How many servers/users/devices you managing?

 

 

 

 

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:33 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Which is exactly how we have it set up. A host failure on any level goes
unnoticed by the end users plus we can do host updates during business
hours, it really makes life easier to not have to come in after hours to
do this and with your one man shop (I'm with you) it is essential for
not hitting the burnout wall trying to keep up.

 

 John W. Cook

Network Operations Manager

Partnership For Strong Families

5950 NW 1st Place

Gainesville, Fl 32607

Office (352) 244-1610

Cell (352) 215-6944

MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 9:04 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

3 hosts will give me an n+1 configuration.

I assume I will need 2 hosts to run my environment, and having 3 will
allow for 1 to be down.

Unless you are saying 1 host is enough to run everything and the 2nd
host would still give me redundancy?

 

 

 

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 5:02 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

The 8 cores vs 6 cores is really not apples to apples in this case, and
while you will almost always be better off going with the best you can
afford at a given moment, the truth is that you'll be positively fine
with 6-cores.

 

The key, as others have already mentioned is RAM -- closely followed by
disk.  CPU is a bit further out.  Get tons of RAM.

 

Now, I have to ask.  Why 3 hosts?  You only have 8 systems to
virtualize, plus some growth.  Define the reasonable range of growth for
1 year?  4 VMs?  8 VMs?Unless you said, "20 VMs", I'd be very much
inclined to tell you to save yourself the hardware and licensing costs
of one host server right now.


We're running dozens of production VMs across a pair of quad-core host
servers. For 190 users, you'll be fine.

 

I second Brian on the NetApp recommendation.

 

As for the services part of the quote, why do you think the $28K is
unrealistic?  What are the quoted timeframes for the project?  What is
the proposed scope of work?


Regards,

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 3:36 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I
have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!

with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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with the body: unsubscribe 

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thank you very much!

I will ask about the trade up (it was not mentioned).  I do not have SA
on my current 4.0 licenses if that makes a difference?

I am wondering if we will ever use XD... and realistically, if we aren't
going to, I could save some money ($5400) by going w/ XenApp Enterprise.

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 9:40 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

I have an article on using one Web Interface site with multiple XenApp
farms.

 

http://carlwebster.com/using-one-citrix-web-interface-site-with-multiple
-xenapp-farms-3/

 

You can do this to migrate users to the new 6.5 farm while they are
still using the 4.0 farm.  It is totally transparent to your users.  As
I show in the article, you can even have test users who are using both
farms for TAT and UAT.

 

Did you get the 2 for 1 trade up on the XA/XD licenses?  A XenDesktop
license gives you the right to use XenApp.  IMNSHO, Citrix does this to
say we sold another 75 XenDesktop licenses today so we now have
(Previous XD User Count) + 75 XenDesktop users even though very few
actually use XD.  Sorry, I don't know anything about pricing.

 

The next version of XenApp will use the same infrastructure as
XenDesktop.  IOW, IMA is going away.  IMA is the bottleneck in
scalability of XenApp farms.  That has been greatly improved with 6.5.
Even for 75 users, I would recommend a dedicated Zone Data Collector/XML
Broker, a dedicated Web Interface server and three Session-host only
servers.

 

Let me know if you need any additional info.

 

Thanks

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Thx for the reply.

 

Currently 75 Citrix users on 3 PS4.0 servers +1 web interface server.  

Typical published apps (Office, Adobe reader, IE, my docs)

 

I guess not technically migrating... the plan would be to create a new
farm, and move users from old farm to new.

XenDesktop Enterprise - I was told that gives up XenApp for now and we
will have the ability to move to xendesktop in the future.  

IIRC, it was $72 more per user than XenApp Enterprise.

 

Is this correct?

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Dell actually ran this thing called DPACK and provided a nice report of drive 
space, RAM, IOPS, throughput, etc.

Used storage capacity is 822GB.

Total RAM is 30GB, used is 20GB

Total throughput: 94

IOPS:  at 95%, 2500 at 99%, 2868 at peak.  (This includes nightly backups.  
Looking at each individual server, throughout the work day is MUCH less)  most 
servers rarely go over 200 during the day.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: hotmail_b243df4f33245...@live.com 
[mailto:hotmail_b243df4f33245...@live.com] On Behalf Of ken schaefer
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 7:15 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

In my experience, disk I/O is your biggest bottleneck. You start needing gobs 
of RAM to cater for underspecced disk subsystem.

Otherwise, 6 core is fine. Run some perfmon or MAP tool to get some idea of 
your CPU usage today. But I suspect you'll find it quite low.

Even with RAM for 8 VMs on 3 hosts, I think 64GB is possibly overkill, though 
it depends on your user base.

We've got 1000+ VMs, and density of up to 20:1 on DL380s with 192GB RAM. 6 core 
CPUs, though moving to 8 core with the G8 series

Sent from my Windows Phone



From: Kurt Buff
Sent: 17/7/2012 9:00 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

Can't.

Essentials Plus package specifies max RAM per host of 64gb.

Kurt

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 2:03 PM, Andrew S. Baker  wrote:

Not enough.  Go with 96+GB at 6-cores across only 2 hosts.  You'll be happier 
for longer.


 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market…





On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 4:31 PM, David Mazzaccaro 
 wrote:

Yes, 64GB per server.

 

 

From: Kramer, Jack [mailto:jack.kra...@cabs.msu.edu] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:45 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: moving to virtual 

 

I think you'll be fine with 6-core processors. Make sure you have as much RAM 
as your licensing permits in your hosts—you'll use RAM a lot faster than CPU.

 


Jack Kramer
Manager of Information Technology
Communications and Brand Strategy 

Michigan State University 

w: 517-884-1231 / c: 248-635-4955

 

From: David Mazzaccaro 
Reply-To: NT System Admin Issues 
Date: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues 
Subject: moving to virtual

 

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world,andhave acouple of 
questions…

1)I am trying to figure out if Ishould go with 8 core or 6 core 
processors in my3 hosts for myupcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I’m not sure I need 8 cores.

The layoutthat has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

Thehost serversI am looking at are either:

HPDL360 G82x Intel® Xeon® E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W) $5356 
each

HPDL360 G82x Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W) 
$10,061 each

I currentlyhave8 physical servers(Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0)that we 
will be P2V’d.

After I P2Vthe servers, the plan is to begincreating new Windows 2008 
R2 VMs andmigrating each server’s role(2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010, and Citrix 
XenApp 6.5).

I wantenough power to be able to run my existing8 servers in a virtual 
environmentand migratethem to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave some room 
for testingand growth.

2of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core 
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the“services” part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch, $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex,$6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k iseither too aggressive or simply not realistic. 
This is the same vendor who quoted me(3) singleprocessorservers, so I have to 
go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS) $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushingthe NetApp.

From what I have been told, I’llget better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in 
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Correct.



-Original Message-
From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 6:08 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 2:01 PM, Andrew S. Baker  wrote:

> Now, I have to ask.  Why 3 hosts?  You only have 8 systems to virtualize,
> plus some growth.  Define the reasonable range of growth for 1 year?  4 VMs?
> 8 VMs?Unless you said, "20 VMs", I'd be very much inclined to tell you
> to save yourself the hardware and licensing costs of one host server right
> now.

At a guess, it's because the Essentials Plus bundle specifies 6
processors with unlimited cores - that makes it a good fit for 3
dual-proc hosts, and getting new machines of the same type as the old
machine a year later will be, well, a bit problematic, I'd think.

Just a guess, though...

Kurt

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~   ~

---
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~   ~

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or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

I was thinking in terms of updates on servers.

Take a snapshot of the server, apply updates, test the server w/ the
updates installed.  Delete the snapshot.

Not sure which category of snapshot that falls under (or if I am even
using that term correctly).

 

 

 

 

 

From: Steven Peck [mailto:sep...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 6:00 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

errr...  Do you mean snapshots as in images, or snapshots as inthat
thing VMware can do?  If the second, be sparing of your use of snapshots
to approriate use cases.  To many times people are substituting
'snapshots as a means to rollback' in situations where pre-planning and
testing is more important (such as Databases, or AD DCs, etc) and then
dealing with the consequences of rolling back said snapshot 4 hours
later on a domain controller leading to a day of fun fun fun.

Steven Peck

http://www.blkmtn.org


 

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 1:39 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Dept of 1 here w/ almost 200 users.

So I need it to work, work well, and be supported by someone on the
outside.

 

For now backups will be done as they are today (physical box w/ tape
drive and BackupExec grabbing the data off each server).

The servers I am backing up will just be virtual instead of physical as
they are now.

Once my old physical servers are decommissioned, we will address backup
options.

First priority is to get my aging servers (6-7 yrs old) out of the
picture ASAP.  And grab snapshots of them.

 

 

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:57 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Initial thoughts, in no particular order: 

 

3 VM hosts for 8 servers seems excessive

You almost certainly won't need 8 cores.

RAM and disk IO tend to be bottlenecks before CPU does.

Why a SAN and not DAS?

If you really need shared storage consider the VMware VSA or HP P4000
VSA.

What are you doing for backups?

 

That is one hell of a whack of money for them to do stuff for you that,
respectfully, if you buy the kit and take your time I'm sure you could
do yourself and come out the other side having learned a heck of a lot.

 

Personally, and I'm only going off this single email I don't know the
history, but I would take a step back and perhaps take smaller steps
here before throwing that much money at it.

 

________

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 16 July 2012 8:36 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: moving to virtual

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I
have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
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wit

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Essentials Plus 

$4300 for the license and $1200 for support

 

 

 

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 5:08 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

What level of VMWare are you getting? 
John W. Cook 
Network Operations Manager 
Partnership for Strong Families
 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 04:39 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues  
Subject: RE: moving to virtual 
 

Dept of 1 here w/ almost 200 users.

So I need it to work, work well, and be supported by someone on the outside.

 

For now backups will be done as they are today (physical box w/ tape drive and 
BackupExec grabbing the data off each server).

The servers I am backing up will just be virtual instead of physical as they 
are now.

Once my old physical servers are decommissioned, we will address backup options.

First priority is to get my aging servers (6-7 yrs old) out of the picture 
ASAP.  And grab snapshots of them.

 

 

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:57 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Initial thoughts, in no particular order: 

 

3 VM hosts for 8 servers seems excessive

You almost certainly won't need 8 cores.

RAM and disk IO tend to be bottlenecks before CPU does.

Why a SAN and not DAS?

If you really need shared storage consider the VMware VSA or HP P4000 VSA.

What are you doing for backups?

 

That is one hell of a whack of money for them to do stuff for you that, 
respectfully, if you buy the kit and take your time I'm sure you could do 
yourself and come out the other side having learned a heck of a lot.

 

Personally, and I'm only going off this single email I don't know the history, 
but I would take a step back and perhaps take smaller steps here before 
throwing that much money at it.

 

____

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 16 July 2012 8:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: moving to virtual

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of questions…

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core processors in 
my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I’m not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel® Xeon® E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W) $5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W) $10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we will 
be P2V’d.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008 R2 VMs 
and migrating each server’s role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010, and Citrix 
XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual 
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave some room 
for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core 
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the “services part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.  This is 
the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I have to go 
back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

From what I have been told, I’ll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in the 
Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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MIRA Ltd

 

Watling Street, Nuneaton, Warwickshire, CV10 0TU, England

Registered in England and Wales No. 402570

VAT Registration  GB 100 1464 84

 

The contents of this e-mail are confidential and are solely for the use of the 
intended recipient.  If you receive this e-mail in error, please delete it and 
notify us either by e-mail, telephone or fax.  You should not copy, forward or 
otherwise disclose the content of the e-mail as this is prohibited

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

3 hosts will give me an n+1 configuration.

I assume I will need 2 hosts to run my environment, and having 3 will
allow for 1 to be down.

Unless you are saying 1 host is enough to run everything and the 2nd
host would still give me redundancy?

 

 

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 5:02 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

The 8 cores vs 6 cores is really not apples to apples in this case, and
while you will almost always be better off going with the best you can
afford at a given moment, the truth is that you'll be positively fine
with 6-cores.

 

The key, as others have already mentioned is RAM -- closely followed by
disk.  CPU is a bit further out.  Get tons of RAM.

 

Now, I have to ask.  Why 3 hosts?  You only have 8 systems to
virtualize, plus some growth.  Define the reasonable range of growth for
1 year?  4 VMs?  8 VMs?Unless you said, "20 VMs", I'd be very much
inclined to tell you to save yourself the hardware and licensing costs
of one host server right now.


We're running dozens of production VMs across a pair of quad-core host
servers. For 190 users, you'll be fine.

 

I second Brian on the NetApp recommendation.

 

As for the services part of the quote, why do you think the $28K is
unrealistic?  What are the quoted timeframes for the project?  What is
the proposed scope of work?


Regards,

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...





On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 3:36 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I
have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!

with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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.
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~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Yes, a LOT of cash…

3 different quotes, all are around $180k

 

 

 

 

From: Don Kuhlman [mailto:drkuhl...@yahoo.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 4:26 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: moving to virtual

 

That's what I was wondering about - the money - it seems like a heck of a lot 
of cash...

Don K

 



From: Paul Hutchings 
To: NT System Admin Issues  
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 2:56 PM
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Initial thoughts, in no particular order: 

 

3 VM hosts for 8 servers seems excessive

You almost certainly won't need 8 cores.

RAM and disk IO tend to be bottlenecks before CPU does.

Why a SAN and not DAS?

If you really need shared storage consider the VMware VSA or HP P4000 VSA.

What are you doing for backups?

 

That is one hell of a whack of money for them to do stuff for you that, 
respectfully, if you buy the kit and take your time I'm sure you could do 
yourself and come out the other side having learned a heck of a lot.

 

Personally, and I'm only going off this single email I don't know the history, 
but I would take a step back and perhaps take smaller steps here before 
throwing that much money at it.

 

________

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 16 July 2012 8:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: moving to virtual

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of questions…

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core processors in 
my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I’m not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel® Xeon® E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W) $5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W) $10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we will 
be P2V’d.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008 R2 VMs 
and migrating each server’s role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010, and Citrix 
XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual 
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave some room 
for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core 
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the “services” part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.  This is 
the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I have to go 
back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

From what I have been told, I’ll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in the 
Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin



MIRA Ltd

 

Watling Street, Nuneaton, Warwickshire, CV10 0TU, England

Registered in England and Wales No. 402570

VAT Registration  GB 100 1464 84

 

The contents of this e-mail are confidential and are solely for the use of the 
intended recipient.  If you receive this e-mail in error, please delete it and 
notify us either by e-mail, telephone or fax.  You should not copy, forward or 
otherwise disclose the content of the e-mail as this is prohibited.

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.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Here is the SOW (for $38k)

 

* Hold a kickoff meeting (one hour; online; 2 resources)

* Review and assess Exchange Environment

* Confirm Active Directory readiness

* Create Discovery documentation (approx.. 4 pages)

* Prepare the Exchange 2010 design

* Provide recommendations for network planning, coexistence planning,
and policy planning

* Provide recommendations for auxiliary pieces of the architecture, such
as faxing and mobile devices

* Install and configure 3 VM hosts running VMWare vSphere 5

* Install Server 2008 R2 on physical server for Domain Controller
functionality

* Build 6 new Virtual Machines

* Install Server 2008 R2 on new VM's

* Update firmware on Dell Equallogic SAN

* Create Volumes and connect vSphere hosts to volumes

* Upgrade AD to 2008 R2 forest and domain levels

* Install and Configure AD 2008 R2 on one VM

* Install vCenter Server and configure HA on one VM

* Install Server 2008 R2 on three VM's for Citrix XenApp

* Install Citrix XenApp on three VM's

* Install up to 4 applications

* Publish up to 4 Applications

* Procure and install 1 UCC Certificate for the Exchange 2010
environment

* Implement the necessary prerequisites for Exchange 2010 installation

* Perform pre-implementation configuration of Exchange 2010 environment

* Storage setup for new environment (up to 2 Mail Databases)

* CAS/HT/MB Role Installation for 1 Multi-role server

* Modify Exchange 2003 to allow proxying from 2010

* Functionality testing

* Provide implementation issue remediation (up to 4 hours)

* Provide one 2-hour training session to CLIENT Exchange Admin for
MB/Public Folder migration

* Provide migration issue remediation (up to 2 hours)

* Physical to Virtual (P2V) existing servers in environment

* Retire the Exchange 2003 environment

* Retire 2003 Domain controllers (power down)

* Provide knowledge transfer to CLIENT Exchange/VM Admin (up to 4 hours)

* Provide Post-Implementation Support (up to 8 hours)

* Configure backups for all new machines

* Install anti-virus on all new VM's

* Provide As-Built Documentation of the environment (up to 4 pages)

* Planned onsite visit(s): 1

 

 

 

From: Brian Desmond [mailto:br...@briandesmond.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 4:23 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

I can't comment on the AD/Exchange services costs without knowing what's
in the scope of work.

 

As to the storage, the NetApp frame is going to offer you
*substantially* more functionality than the competing solution, IMO. I'd
strongly lean towards NetApp's offering especially looking at it as a
long term investment. 

 

Thanks,

Brian Desmond

br...@briandesmond.com <mailto:br...@briandesmond.com> 

 

w - 312.625.1438 | c   - 312.731.3132

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com
<mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com> ] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 2:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: moving to virtual

 

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I
have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these 

RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Essentials Plus only allows for 192 and 3 hosts (64GB per host)
I believe each server will have 8 NICs in it.
There are 3 of these "NC365T 4-PORT ETHERNET SERVER ADAPTER" at $440
each.

EX/AD - Yes, vendor will be doing that as well (with me).  
I have no other staff here. 





-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 4:07 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

More RAM. As much as the hosts can hold. Lots of NICs. You will
eventually
want to isolate traffic and the more NICs you have the easier it will
be.
Architect storage carefully. Disk I/O, being the slowest link in the
chain,
can really put you behind the 8-ball. Leave room for test environments.

Why so much for Exch/AD? Are you having a vendor do that or are you
doing
it? I've done a bunch of those. They're not that complex...

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  


-Original Message-
From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 12:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: moving to virtual

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions.

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors
in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x IntelR XeonR E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W) $5356
each

HP DL360 G8 2x IntelR XeonR E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061
each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2
VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010, and
Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some
room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This
is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I have
to
go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the
Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!


.


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin



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~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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RE: moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Dept of 1 here w/ almost 200 users.

So I need it to work, work well, and be supported by someone on the
outside.

 

For now backups will be done as they are today (physical box w/ tape
drive and BackupExec grabbing the data off each server).

The servers I am backing up will just be virtual instead of physical as
they are now.

Once my old physical servers are decommissioned, we will address backup
options.

First priority is to get my aging servers (6-7 yrs old) out of the
picture ASAP.  And grab snapshots of them.

 

 

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2012 3:57 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: moving to virtual

 

Initial thoughts, in no particular order: 

 

3 VM hosts for 8 servers seems excessive

You almost certainly won't need 8 cores.

RAM and disk IO tend to be bottlenecks before CPU does.

Why a SAN and not DAS?

If you really need shared storage consider the VMware VSA or HP P4000
VSA.

What are you doing for backups?

 

That is one hell of a whack of money for them to do stuff for you that,
respectfully, if you buy the kit and take your time I'm sure you could
do yourself and come out the other side having learned a heck of a lot.

 

Personally, and I'm only going off this single email I don't know the
history, but I would take a step back and perhaps take smaller steps
here before throwing that much money at it.

 

____

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 16 July 2012 8:36 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: moving to virtual

Greetings,

Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.

The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:

3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.

The host servers I am looking at are either:

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each

HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.

After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:

$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)

$38,000 (not itemized)

$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.

I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I
have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:

PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000

NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.

>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.

Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!


.

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---

moving to virtual

[David Mazzaccaro]

Greetings,
Getting  very close to moving into the VM world, and have a couple of
questions...

1) I am trying to figure out if I should go with 8 core or 6 core
processors in my 3 hosts for my upcoming VMware environment.
The price is about double.  And I'm not sure I need 8 cores.

The layout that has been quoted is as follows:
3 hosts connected to a PS4100XV SAN running VMware Essentials Plus Kit.
The host servers I am looking at are either:
HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2640 (6 core, 2.50 GHz, 15MB, 95W)
$5356 each
HP DL360 G8 2x Intel(r) Xeon(r) E5-2690 (8 core, 2.90 GHz, 20MB, 135W)
$10,061 each

I currently have 8 physical servers (Win2003, E2003, Citrix 4.0) that we
will be P2V'd.
After I P2V the servers, the plan is to begin creating new Windows 2008
R2 VMs and migrating each server's role (2008R2 domain, Exchange 2010,
and Citrix XenApp 6.5).

I want enough power to be able to run my existing 8 servers in a virtual
environment and migrate them to AD2008/E2010/XenApp as well as leave
some room for testing and growth.

2 of the vendors said 6 core is fine, another vendor is quoting 8 core
processors.

2) The quotes I have for the "services" part of this are:
$40,000 ($12k for AD/Exch,  $8k for XenApp 20k for VMware)
$38,000 (not itemized)
$28,000 ($11k for AD/Ex, $6k  XenApp, $11k for VM)

Do these sound legit?  I have ~190 users if that helps.
I really think 28k is either too aggressive or simply not realistic.
This is the same vendor who quoted me (3) single processor servers, so I
have to go back to them and tell them I want dual proc.

3) For the SAN, I have 2 options:
PS4100XV (12 600GB 15k SAS)  $23,000
NetApp FAS2240 (12 600GB 10k SAS) $22,000

I have 2 vendors pushing the PS4100XV, and the other pushing the NetApp.
>From what I have been told, I'll get better IOPS w/ the 15k drives in
the Equalogic.  And fuller feature set.
Any one w/ experiences w/ either of these models want to add their $.02?

This is a completely new world for me, so any help is appreciated!


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~   ~

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RE: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

[David Mazzaccaro]

One thing I forgot to mention about iPrism is that they offer a remote client 
that can protect your roaming laptops from wherever they may be getting online.
Seems to work well for us.


-Original Message-
From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2012 2:20 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

Do you tie you Internet Usage Policy to the warnings they do get and does it 
track it by user accurately? 

Z

Edward Ziots
CISSP, Security +, Network +
Security Engineer
Lifespan Organization
ezi...@lifespan.org


-Original Message-
From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2012 2:08 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

It doesn't prevent users from accepting every warning they get :-)

-Original Message-
From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org]
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2012 11:05 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

For those out there using various web filtering products ( Websense, Palo Alto, 
Iprism, etc etc) where do you feel that the current products are lacking 
(detection, coverage? Features) as it pertains to keeping malicious software 
from being downloaded to our corporate assets? 

Open for discussion in public or I would definitely like to hear your ideas in 
private also. 

Z

Edward Ziots
CISSP, Security +, Network +
Security Engineer
Lifespan Organization
ezi...@lifespan.org


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RE: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

[David Mazzaccaro]

Same here.
"other sites" as they are called w/ iPrism.


-Original Message-
From: Kennedy, Jim [mailto:kennedy...@elyriaschools.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2012 3:25 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

There are too many websites that are uncategorized.  They are not categorized 
as 'malware' or 'educational' or 'news' or anything. If you don't block 
uncategorized you are wide open to unknown sites. If you do block unknown you 
knock down a lot of good sites. That is the part that annoys me the most about 
web filtering.

-Original Message-
From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, June 19, 2012 2:06 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Web Filtering hits and misses, your ideas?

For those out there using various web filtering products ( Websense, Palo Alto, 
Iprism, etc etc) where do you feel that the current products are lacking 
(detection, coverage? Features) as it pertains to keeping malicious software 
from being downloaded to our corporate assets? 

Open for discussion in public or I would definitely like to hear your ideas in 
private also. 

Z

Edward Ziots
CISSP, Security +, Network +
Security Engineer
Lifespan Organization
ezi...@lifespan.org


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RE: Semi-OT: UPSes Other Than APC

[David Mazzaccaro]

Hijacking this for moment...

 

"if the batteries are replaced on a regularly scheduled basis"...

 

What do you see as a good regularly scheduled basis?  

I have been running the same batteries in my 3000's for 7 years...

 

 

 

From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 11:37 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Semi-OT: UPSes Other Than APC

 

Well that's kind of like saying you want to look at other makes of cars
because your battery died really quickly in your Ford, or you wanted to
get away from your Sony laptop because the battery crapped. APC doesn't
make batteries, that's outsourced. I've never had an issue with an APC
unit itself and if the batteries are replaced on a regularly scheduled
basis (read - not when they're dead and swelling up in the unit) you
should not see any issues.

 

John W. Cook

System Administrator

Partnership For Strong Families

5950 NW 1st Place

Gainesville, Fl 32607

Office (352) 244-1610

Cell (352) 215-6944

 

MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4

 

 

From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 11:25 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Semi-OT: UPSes Other Than APC

 

We've been an APC shop here for a long time, but lately I've been
thinking of trying something else. I've not been impressed with the
battery life of our UPSes, and APC only warrants them for a year. We had
a battery that sat in a closet for a while, and when we opened it to use
it we found that it had leaked. This was clearly a defective battery,
and thankfully it wasn't in a UPS-but APC refused to replace it because
it was just over a year old. I should add, it was just over a year since
it was *manufactured*. Not that we had had it for that long. But we had
no proof of purchase, and APC was unwilling to help.

 

Minuteman advertises three-year warranties on its batteries (at least
the ones in the higher-end models, it looks like). Our reseller has also
suggested CyberPower.

 

Does anyone have any experience with brands other than APC? I'm looking
for warnings or recommendations.

 

 

 

John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP

MIS Department

Taylor County School District

www.taylor.k12.fl.us

 

 

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represent those of the company. Warning: Although precautions have been
taken to make sure no viruses are present in this email, the company
cannot accept responsibility for any loss or damage that arise from the
use of this email or attachments.

 



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RE: Cancel wsus clients downloading updates

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thx! I'll check that out.
It seems that stopping the AU services on the clients didn't stop the
downloads in process.
They did finally finish, but slowed everything to a crawl while they
were downloading.


-Original Message-
From: Ken Schaefer [mailto:k...@adopenstatic.com] 
Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2012 10:34 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Cancel wsus clients downloading updates

I don't think so - the BITS service is the one downloading the updates.
You can use bitsadmin.exe to see what's in the queue and kill them (from
the client side)

Cheers
Ken

-Original Message-
From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 24 May 2012 10:11 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Cancel wsus clients downloading updates

Will stopping the "automatic updates" service on a windows xp client
stop a download that is already in progress from my wsus server?
Latest batch of .net updates are large and killing my wan.
I'd like to cancel a few clients who already started downloading updates
from wsus.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
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RE: Cancel wsus clients downloading updates

[David Mazzaccaro]

WSUS server is at my main site, I have remote sites w/ clients (XP &
Win7) that pull from it over my WAN.

As you can see from the graph, it was a rough morning... this is my T1
circuit at my main site.

All my remote sites also come back here on their own T1 lines.

 

 

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2012 10:28 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Cancel wsus clients downloading updates

 

Where is the WSUS server relative to the clients in question?


ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...





On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 10:10 AM, David Mazzaccaro <
david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com> wrote:

Will stopping the "automatic updates" service on a windows xp client
stop a download that is already in progress from my wsus server?
Latest batch of .net updates are large and killing my wan.
I'd like to cancel a few clients who already started downloading updates
from wsus.



~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
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Cancel wsus clients downloading updates

[David Mazzaccaro]

Will stopping the "automatic updates" service on a windows xp client stop a 
download that is already in progress from my wsus server?
Latest batch of .net updates are large and killing my wan.
I'd like to cancel a few clients who already started downloading updates from 
wsus.


--
Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld

.

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RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Do you have a secondary SAN in case there is a problem w/ it?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 3:32 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

I don't have vmotion, they're assigned to specific hosts, and are all on
the SAN.  So, if a host fails, or I need to do maintenance I can down
the guest and migrate it to another host.  This works for hosts that
aren't mission critical or can survive some downtime window during
standard business hours without people noticing or howling too much.

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 2:51 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

How does that work  now?

Are the 11 guests distributed dynamically across the 3 hosts?  Or are
they dedicated to specific hosts always?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 2:32 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

I have 11 guests.  I have three hosts so I can survive a host failure
without squeezing the resources on the remaining hosts too much.

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 2:24 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

How many VMs are you able to run on each of your 3 hosts?

With only 10 physical servers now.. I am wondering if 3 hosts are going
to be overkill.

Even with a play/test environment of another 10 servers Are 3 hosts
a waste?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 1:05 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Yes!

 

By physical boxes, we'll presume a box that's running as a DC, and not
your hosts as Scott pithily responded... :-)  And you may as well run a
physical box for your vCenter if you're going to maintain a solid box
for DC.

 

The idea behind physical boxes, is it gives you something to
authenticate against and bring your environment back online.  At your
size (three hosts, which is what I'm running) you probably don't need
it, and can authenticate into the hosts and then start the guests that
way.

 

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 12:30 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 

Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?


No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.


From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issu

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

I'm thinking knocking 1 host off the quote would save me $25k - enough
for a 2nd SAN to be placed in a secondary site.

 

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 2:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Yes, unless your hosts are small, or your guests are huge.

 

10 guests would only need 2 hosts for redundancy purposes.


ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...





On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 2:24 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

How many VMs are you able to run on each of your 3 hosts?

With only 10 physical servers now.. I am wondering if 3 hosts are going
to be overkill.

Even with a play/test environment of another 10 servers Are 3 hosts
a waste?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 1:05 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Yes!

 

By physical boxes, we'll presume a box that's running as a DC, and not
your hosts as Scott pithily responded... :-)  And you may as well run a
physical box for your vCenter if you're going to maintain a solid box
for DC.

 

The idea behind physical boxes, is it gives you something to
authenticate against and bring your environment back online.  At your
size (three hosts, which is what I'm running) you probably don't need
it, and can authenticate into the hosts and then start the guests that
way.

 

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 12:30 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?

No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.


From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Someone else asked about this, but I didn't see a reply (although
Postini frequently blocks messages from this list)... What factors led
to you choosing VMware over Hyper-V?



John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP
MIS Department
Taylor County School District
www.taylor.k12.fl.us



- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

That is awesome.

What are the hardware specs of the DL380?

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 2:43 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

FWIW I can run our entire infrastructure (and do when I'm doing host
maintenance) on a single DL380. 

 

That's around 43 VM's including Exchange 2010, our AD and our primary
file server. 

____

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 16 April 2012 7:24 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

How many VMs are you able to run on each of your 3 hosts?

With only 10 physical servers now.. I am wondering if 3 hosts are going
to be overkill.

Even with a play/test environment of another 10 servers Are 3 hosts
a waste?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 1:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Yes!

 

By physical boxes, we'll presume a box that's running as a DC, and not
your hosts as Scott pithily responded... :-)  And you may as well run a
physical box for your vCenter if you're going to maintain a solid box
for DC.

 

The idea behind physical boxes, is it gives you something to
authenticate against and bring your environment back online.  At your
size (three hosts, which is what I'm running) you probably don't need
it, and can authenticate into the hosts and then start the guests that
way.

 

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 12:30 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?

No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.

From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Someone else asked about this, but I didn't see a reply (although
Postini frequently blocks messages from this list)... What factors led
to you choosing VMware over Hyper-V?



John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP
MIS Department
Taylor County School District
www.taylor.k12.fl.us



- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Su

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

How does that work  now?

Are the 11 guests distributed dynamically across the 3 hosts?  Or are
they dedicated to specific hosts always?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 2:32 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

I have 11 guests.  I have three hosts so I can survive a host failure
without squeezing the resources on the remaining hosts too much.

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 2:24 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

How many VMs are you able to run on each of your 3 hosts?

With only 10 physical servers now.. I am wondering if 3 hosts are going
to be overkill.

Even with a play/test environment of another 10 servers Are 3 hosts
a waste?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 1:05 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Yes!

 

By physical boxes, we'll presume a box that's running as a DC, and not
your hosts as Scott pithily responded... :-)  And you may as well run a
physical box for your vCenter if you're going to maintain a solid box
for DC.

 

The idea behind physical boxes, is it gives you something to
authenticate against and bring your environment back online.  At your
size (three hosts, which is what I'm running) you probably don't need
it, and can authenticate into the hosts and then start the guests that
way.

 

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 12:30 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?

No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.


From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Someone else asked about this, but I didn't see a reply (although
Postini frequently blocks messages from this list)... What factors led
to you choosing VMware over Hyper-V?



John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP
MIS Department
Taylor County School District
www.taylor.k12.fl.us



- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 ph

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

How many VMs are you able to run on each of your 3 hosts?

With only 10 physical servers now.. I am wondering if 3 hosts are going
to be overkill.

Even with a play/test environment of another 10 servers Are 3 hosts
a waste?

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 1:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Yes!

 

By physical boxes, we'll presume a box that's running as a DC, and not
your hosts as Scott pithily responded... :-)  And you may as well run a
physical box for your vCenter if you're going to maintain a solid box
for DC.

 

The idea behind physical boxes, is it gives you something to
authenticate against and bring your environment back online.  At your
size (three hosts, which is what I'm running) you probably don't need
it, and can authenticate into the hosts and then start the guests that
way.

 

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 12:30 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?

No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.

From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Someone else asked about this, but I didn't see a reply (although
Postini frequently blocks messages from this list)... What factors led
to you choosing VMware over Hyper-V?



John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP
MIS Department
Taylor County School District
www.taylor.k12.fl.us



- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k s

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

LOL... 

 

From: Crawford, Scott [mailto:crawfo...@evangel.edu] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

> You don't need any physical boxes at all.  Period.

 

I'd at least want some hosts J

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:30 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?

No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.

From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Someone else asked about this, but I didn't see a reply (although
Postini frequently blocks messages from this list)... What factors led
to you choosing VMware over Hyper-V?



John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP
MIS Department
Taylor County School District
www.taylor.k12.fl.us



- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that IS

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Speaking of domain controllers, I am being told 2 different things...

1) ALWAYS keep a single DC physical.  You can certainly have virtual
DCs, but you must have at least 1 physical.

2) Virtualize everything you can. You don't need any physical boxes at
all.  Period.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 11:55 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

>> Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?

No, you don't have to back them up individually.   Lots of 3rd party
options here.


>> No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a
"fun" situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Your Hyper-V server need not be a domain member.

 

ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...





On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 11:41 AM, Paul Hutchings
 wrote:

I've only used VMware so I'm more than happy to be corrected here, but
in no particular order:

Single ISO takes you from bare metal to working server.
No third party drivers needed for things like MPIO and NIC teaming.
Single management tool.
Single management server (vCenter) gives visibility to your entire
VMware infrastructure.
Single "thing" to point backups at - I believe you have to backup
Hyper-V boxes individually?
No dependency on the domain being present which can put you in a "fun"
situation if you have to power everything off and on again.

Outside of usability you then have:

Pretty much any virtual appliance you care to name will come natively in
VMDK/OVF format
Tons of vCenter add-ins

I'm very interested in Hyper-V with Windows Server 8 and for us the
timing falls nicely with our SAN and server refresh, but honestly the
only reason I can see for looking at moving would be license costs -
VMware works out expensive if you have more than a few hosts and want
more than the basics.

From: John Hornbuckle [john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 3:39 PM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Is the consensus that VMware is easier to use than Hyper-V?

I've only used the latter, so I can't judge.



John


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:36 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'd assume ease of use and market leader.

-Original Message-
From: John Hornbuckle [mailto:john.hornbuc...@taylor.k12.fl.us]
Sent: 16 April 2012 14:16
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Someone else asked about this, but I didn't see a reply (although
Postini frequently blocks messages from this list)... What factors led
to you choosing VMware over Hyper-V?



John Hornbuckle, MSMIS, PMP
MIS Department
Taylor County School District
www.taylor.k12.fl.us



- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Ah... yes, that is exactly what I am doing now.

I will absolutely look into this.  Thank you.



-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I meant more in terms of what backup software are you using?

If you're currently doing backups of your physical boxes you're most
likely doing it using traditional agents that sit on the boxes and do
file or application level backups?

Of course you can continue to do that, but you're missing one of the
biggest benefits of virtualisation if you're not complementing it (or in
some cases replacing it) with taking image level backups of the entire
VM.

It's something you should definitely look into, not least because, well
it's backups so it's probably the most important part of the whole
setup, but also because if you do go the Netapp route they also offer a
lot of software tools (at a cost) that your backup software may be
compatible with - basically you want to check it out prior to any
purchase to avoid any surprises down the line (particularly as Netapp
aren't the cheapest in terms of software licenses if you need to buy
anything down the line).
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 8:44 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I assume I will back up to tape?


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:29 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

What are you doing to backup your VM's?
____
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 8:06 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Wow. This is perfect.
You probably just saved me some serious coin.
Thank you!!!


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

vSphere will see all the RAM, but the amount you'll be able to use
(assuming vSphere 5) is licensed/controlled by your vRAM entitlement.

It's one of the biggest and most contentious changes moving from 4.1 to
5.

Here's VMware's licensing paper which lists it in all its glorious
detail:

http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/vsphere_pricing.pdf

So in a nutshell, yes, you'll have almost 600gb of RAM but will only be
able to use 1/3rd of it without ponying up for more licenses.  Nice eh?!

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 7:26 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain 

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Another reason I love this list!

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 4:04 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Better we burst your bubble now than after you've received everything...
:-)

On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 3:45 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

True.  

Sigh...

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:35 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Sure but a good VAR should catch things like this before a proposal goes
out the door. If you said max the RAM the licensing should support it. 



On Friday, April 13, 2012, David Mazzaccaro wrote:

Good point, thanks.

I may recall having said to them "just max the RAM in the hosts".

I'll see what they come back with now.

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:12 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Hold your VAR's feet to the fire!  I would've configured the three hosts
such that any two hit the vRAM entitlement limit when fully utilized,
allowing you to handle the loss of one host.  

 

Does that make sense?

On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 2:53 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Thx, getting clarification on this now...



-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org]

Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:41 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

IIRC VMWare licensing only counts against running virtual machines, you
may have 48 Gb of memory allocated to all the guests running on a single
host but you're fine if only 32Gb  of allocated memory are live ie
running.
You have WAY overkilled the memory installation.

 John W. Cook
Network Operations Manager
Partnership For Strong Families
5950 NW 1st Place
Gainesville, Fl 32607
Office (352) 244-1610  
Cell (352) 215-6944  
MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4


-Original Message-

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]

Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:27 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
<http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7
&%0d%0aCat=RAM> 
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
S


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint 

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Interesting...
Thx!


-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:47 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I think he meant how are you going to backup your VMDK files.
Read this
http://kb.vmware.com/selfservice/microsites/search.do?language=en_US&cmd
=displayKC&externalId=1016407

 John W. Cook
Network Operations Manager
Partnership For Strong Families
5950 NW 1st Place
Gainesville, Fl 32607
Office (352) 244-1610
Cell (352) 215-6944
MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4


-Original Message-
From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I assume I will back up to tape?


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:29 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

What are you doing to backup your VM's?
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 8:06 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Wow. This is perfect.
You probably just saved me some serious coin.
Thank you!!!


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

vSphere will see all the RAM, but the amount you'll be able to use
(assuming vSphere 5) is licensed/controlled by your vRAM entitlement.

It's one of the biggest and most contentious changes moving from 4.1 to
5.

Here's VMware's licensing paper which lists it in all its glorious
detail:

http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/vsphere_pricing.pdf

So in a nutshell, yes, you'll have almost 600gb of RAM but will only be
able to use 1/3rd of it without ponying up for more licenses.  Nice eh?!

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 7:26 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?
>

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

True.  

Sigh...

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:35 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Sure but a good VAR should catch things like this before a proposal goes
out the door. If you said max the RAM the licensing should support it. 

On Friday, April 13, 2012, David Mazzaccaro wrote:

Good point, thanks.

I may recall having said to them "just max the RAM in the hosts".

I'll see what they come back with now.

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com
 ] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:12 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Hold your VAR's feet to the fire!  I would've configured the three hosts
such that any two hit the vRAM entitlement limit when fully utilized,
allowing you to handle the loss of one host.  

 

Does that make sense?

On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 2:53 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Thx, getting clarification on this now...



-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:41 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

IIRC VMWare licensing only counts against running virtual machines, you
may have 48 Gb of memory allocated to all the guests running on a single
host but you're fine if only 32Gb  of allocated memory are live ie
running.
You have WAY overkilled the memory installation.

 John W. Cook
Network Operations Manager
Partnership For Strong Families
5950 NW 1st Place
Gainesville, Fl 32607
Office (352) 244-1610
Cell (352) 215-6944
MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4


-Original Message-

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]

Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:27 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).
____
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
<http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7
&%0d%0aCat=RAM> 
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
S


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
 
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

I assume I will back up to tape?


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:29 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

What are you doing to backup your VM's?
____
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 8:06 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

Wow. This is perfect.
You probably just saved me some serious coin.
Thank you!!!


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

vSphere will see all the RAM, but the amount you'll be able to use
(assuming vSphere 5) is licensed/controlled by your vRAM entitlement.

It's one of the biggest and most contentious changes moving from 4.1 to
5.

Here's VMware's licensing paper which lists it in all its glorious
detail:

http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/vsphere_pricing.pdf

So in a nutshell, yes, you'll have almost 600gb of RAM but will only be
able to use 1/3rd of it without ponying up for more licenses.  Nice eh?!
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 7:26 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).
____
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?
>
>
>
> .
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <htt

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Good point, thanks.

I may recall having said to them "just max the RAM in the hosts".

I'll see what they come back with now.

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 3:12 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Hold your VAR's feet to the fire!  I would've configured the three hosts
such that any two hit the vRAM entitlement limit when fully utilized,
allowing you to handle the loss of one host.  

 

Does that make sense?

On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 2:53 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Thx, getting clarification on this now...



-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:41 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

IIRC VMWare licensing only counts against running virtual machines, you
may have 48 Gb of memory allocated to all the guests running on a single
host but you're fine if only 32Gb  of allocated memory are live ie
running.
You have WAY overkilled the memory installation.

 John W. Cook
Network Operations Manager
Partnership For Strong Families
5950 NW 1st Place
Gainesville, Fl 32607
Office (352) 244-1610  
Cell (352) 215-6944  
MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4


-Original Message-

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]

Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:27 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).

From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
<http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7
&%0d%0aCat=RAM> 
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?
>
>
>
> .
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
> <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to li

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Wow. This is perfect.
You probably just saved me some serious coin.
Thank you!!!


-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:45 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

vSphere will see all the RAM, but the amount you'll be able to use
(assuming vSphere 5) is licensed/controlled by your vRAM entitlement.

It's one of the biggest and most contentious changes moving from 4.1 to
5.

Here's VMware's licensing paper which lists it in all its glorious
detail:

http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/vsphere_pricing.pdf

So in a nutshell, yes, you'll have almost 600gb of RAM but will only be
able to use 1/3rd of it without ponying up for more licenses.  Nice eh?!
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 7:26 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?
>
>
>
> .
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


--
MIRA Ltd

Watling Street, Nuneaton, Warwickshire, CV10 0TU, England
Registered in England and Wales No. 402570
VAT Registration  GB 100 1464 84

The contents of this e-mail are confidential and are solely for the use
of the 

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thx, getting clarification on this now...


-Original Message-
From: John Cook [mailto:john.c...@pfsf.org] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:41 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

IIRC VMWare licensing only counts against running virtual machines, you
may have 48 Gb of memory allocated to all the guests running on a single
host but you're fine if only 32Gb  of allocated memory are live ie
running.
You have WAY overkilled the memory installation.

 John W. Cook
Network Operations Manager
Partnership For Strong Families
5950 NW 1st Place
Gainesville, Fl 32607
Office (352) 244-1610
Cell (352) 215-6944
MCSE, MCP+I, MCTS, CompTIA A+, N+, VSP4, VTSP4


-Original Message-----
From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:27 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb).
________
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?
>
>
>
> .
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
> <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


--
MIRA Ltd

Watling Street, Nuneaton, Warwickshire, CV10 0TU, England Registered in
England and Wales No. 402570 VAT Registration  GB 100 1464 84

The contents of this e-mail are confidential and are solely for the use
of the intended recipient.  If you receive this e-mail in error, please
delete it 

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

So, even though I will have 588GB of RAM across all 3 hosts, VMware is
only going to see and utilize 192GB?





-Original Message-
From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 2:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

OK one more thing:

vSphere Essentials Plus gives you 6 socket licenses for vSphere
Standard.

Each license gives you 32gb of vRAM entitlement.

6 x 32 = 192gb vRAM across all three hosts.

So 196gb per host seems slightly excessive (consider we can and
occasionally do run around 50 VM's on one host with 144gb). 
____
From: David Mazzaccaro [david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
Sent: 13 April 2012 5:54 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
>
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
>
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
>
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
>
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
>
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter
>
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
>
> $40k services
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
>
> Total: $185,000
>
> Sound good?
>
>
>
> .
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


--
MIRA Ltd

Watling Street, Nuneaton, Warwickshire, CV10 0TU, England
Registered in England and Wales No. 402570
VAT Registration  GB 100 1464 84

The contents of this e-mail are confidential and are solely for the use
of the intended recipient.  If you receive this e-mail in error, please
delete it and notify us either by e-mail, telephone or fax.  You should
not copy, forward or otherwise disclose the content of the e-mail as
this is prohibited.


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

LOL
Yes, that is per host.. and it is HP memory (hence the premium)


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:42 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

I'm a penny-pincher, and I saw a only one thing that really stuck out...

> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Ouch! Is that 196 Gig per computer, or total for the 3 servers? Even if
it's 196 per computer, Crucial can get you that much ram for $8100... As
long as I'm looking at the right memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=ProLiant%20DL380%20G7&;
Cat=RAM
48GB Kit - ($899.99 each) * 3 for each server ($2699.97) * 3 servers =
$8099.91

Hey, I just saved you $36k! Can I get a commission for that?
Sm:)e.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: David Mazzaccaro
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 13 Apr 2012
08:38:47 -0700
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!


> Just got the ok to move forward with VMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.
> I have 10 physical servers, and it looks like this will be the
solution:
> 
> 3 hosts: ($21k each)
> HP DL380 G7 E5660
> Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored
> 196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone
> Quad port gig adapter
> 
> 2 Switches: ($1,800 each)
> HP 2910
> 
> 1 SAN ($22,700)
> NetApp 2240
> 12 x 600GB
> 
> VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)
> 
> 6 Windows licenses ($13,600):
> Server 2008 Datacenter 
> 
> Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)
> 
> $40k services 
> Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
> Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers
> 
> Total: $185,000
> 
> Sound good?
> 
> 
> 
> .
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
> 
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

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RE: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

[David Mazzaccaro]

Not sure... Here's the line item:

 

MW2ZPSA0001

XENAPP ADVANCED X1CCU W/ SA 1 CONCURRENT USER W/ SA EASY LIC

 

 

 

 

From: Webster [mailto:webs...@carlwebster.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 12:29 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

What version of XenApp?

 

 

Carl Webster

Consultant and Citrix Technology Professional

http://www.CarlWebster.com <http://www.carlwebster.com/> 

 

From: David Mazzaccaro 
Subject: Hooray, I'm moving to VMware!

 

Just got the ok to move forward withVMware/Citrix/Domain upgrade.

I have 10 physical servers, and it lookslikethis will be the solution:

3hosts: ($21k each)

HP DL380 G7E5660

Pair of 146 15k drives mirrored

196 G RAM <- this was $45k alone

Quad port gig adapter

2 Switches: ($1,800 each)

HP 2910

1 SAN($22,700)

NetApp 2240

12 x 600GB

VSphere Essentials Plus ($5,200)

6Windows licenses ($13,600):

Server2008 Datacenter 

Windows/Xenapp licenses ($26,000)

$40k services

Install/config SAN, switches, hosts, VMware, new Citrix farm, 2008
Domain upgrade, P2V existing servers

Total: $185,000

Sound good?

 

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RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thx

I actually did bring that up... and they said for $30 you grab a few
extras to have on hand.

 

 

From: Erik Goldoff [mailto:egold...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 1:16 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

one thing to remember about USB memory sticks, they have a finite life.
A limited number of write cycles, you use them as a system drive with
swap/paging and primary temp folders, and you'll find out how quickly
they will start to fail.

Ask the vendor how they support/warranty the drive failures ...

On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 12:50 PM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

I am still researching and meeting w/ vendors.

One thing that has just come up w/ a particular vendor.

They are telling me that they would put in 3 hosts, w/ no hard drives
and that VMware would run off a USB stick???

This sounds pretty cheesy to me... is this common practice?

What are the pros/cons to USB stick vs a pair of mirrored drives on the
hosts?

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2012 10:44 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

The reality here is that you're not going to spend $130k on a
virtualisation solution and not want to add more VM's,

 

Honestly, just add DataCenter from the get-go - you'll make use of it I
guarantee it.

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 15 March 2012 14:03
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

I admit it was a while back, it may have changed, or my understanding
was incorrect.  Or someone told me that and I read it that way.  In any
event, I think 12 total servers for his environment may be a bit low...
Or it may not be.  With Datacenter licensing, if he loses a host, he can
move the guests to the other machines and do some back of the hand
guestimate based on load balancing not licensing.



 

On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 10:51 PM, Ken Schaefer 
wrote:

No this is incorrect. Check the Microsoft Windows Server licensing
guide:

http://download.microsoft.com/download/0/D/9/0D9DDF52-A855-487B-9B74-5A0
9A9389551/Windows%20Server%20System%20Center%20and%20Forefront%20Pricing
%20and%20Licensing%20Guide.pdf

 

You can move individual VOSE licenses between Enterprise Hosts, provided
that no host ends up exceeding the 1 POSE + 4 VOSE limit per enterprise
license. For more than 4 VOSEs on a physical host, you need 2 (or more)
enterprise licenses.

 

Check out page 8 on the document above - has this exact example in a
diagram.

 

Cheers

Ken

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 15 March 2012 1:24 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

It's even a more (unenforcebly) stringent than that.  If you run 4 VMs
on 3 hosts with enterprise server on each host, you power down two and
do a switch, you're in a licensing violation situation.  Technically,
you have to move all 3 from one host to another.  So single licensing or
Datacenter, or some oddball combination of single licenses and
enterprise licenses (DAMHIKT).

 

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the way I read the license.
And I prefer to play it straight/conservative.  I'll look forward to
your response in about 4-6 hours.

On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 11:00 AM, Miller Bonnie L.
 wrote:

And I'm not familiar with the HP hardware, so it's very possible they
can-I just didn't see anything about clustering in the original post.

 

Why it's important is one thing MS had told us is if you are planning on
clustering, in an environment like this, you are out of compliance with
licensing as soon as you migrate the 5th VM over to a server that is
only running Enterprise edition (such as to down one of the 3 servers
for patching).  That is of course, unless you own separate individual
server licenses for those VMs.

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 1:50 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

I have VM hosts at home that can support 6-8 hosts easily.

 

At the office, we have hosts that can support 15-20 VMs pretty easily.
Of course, this depends on the workload of the boxes, but for all but
the most extreme workloads, this is probably doable.

 

If you build each host to support 30-40% more VMs than normal, then you
can suffer a failure of one of them without great difficulty.


ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 1:59 PM, Miller Bonnie L.
 wrote:

I don't see any mention of failover clustering.  Right now, how much do
you lose if one server is down?  How much would you lose if 4 servers
were down instead?

 

Just a thought, but you could add another host server, or stick with
three, run datacenter, and build them with enough guts to run 6 VMs
each.  That also gives yo

RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

I am still researching and meeting w/ vendors.

One thing that has just come up w/ a particular vendor.

They are telling me that they would put in 3 hosts, w/ no hard drives
and that VMware would run off a USB stick???

This sounds pretty cheesy to me... is this common practice?

What are the pros/cons to USB stick vs a pair of mirrored drives on the
hosts?

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2012 10:44 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

The reality here is that you're not going to spend $130k on a
virtualisation solution and not want to add more VM's,

 

Honestly, just add DataCenter from the get-go - you'll make use of it I
guarantee it.

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 15 March 2012 14:03
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

I admit it was a while back, it may have changed, or my understanding
was incorrect.  Or someone told me that and I read it that way.  In any
event, I think 12 total servers for his environment may be a bit low...
Or it may not be.  With Datacenter licensing, if he loses a host, he can
move the guests to the other machines and do some back of the hand
guestimate based on load balancing not licensing.



 

On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 10:51 PM, Ken Schaefer 
wrote:

No this is incorrect. Check the Microsoft Windows Server licensing
guide:

http://download.microsoft.com/download/0/D/9/0D9DDF52-A855-487B-9B74-5A0
9A9389551/Windows%20Server%20System%20Center%20and%20Forefront%20Pricing
%20and%20Licensing%20Guide.pdf

 

You can move individual VOSE licenses between Enterprise Hosts, provided
that no host ends up exceeding the 1 POSE + 4 VOSE limit per enterprise
license. For more than 4 VOSEs on a physical host, you need 2 (or more)
enterprise licenses.

 

Check out page 8 on the document above - has this exact example in a
diagram.

 

Cheers

Ken

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 15 March 2012 1:24 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

It's even a more (unenforcebly) stringent than that.  If you run 4 VMs
on 3 hosts with enterprise server on each host, you power down two and
do a switch, you're in a licensing violation situation.  Technically,
you have to move all 3 from one host to another.  So single licensing or
Datacenter, or some oddball combination of single licenses and
enterprise licenses (DAMHIKT).

 

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the way I read the license.
And I prefer to play it straight/conservative.  I'll look forward to
your response in about 4-6 hours.

On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 11:00 AM, Miller Bonnie L.
 wrote:

And I'm not familiar with the HP hardware, so it's very possible they
can-I just didn't see anything about clustering in the original post.

 

Why it's important is one thing MS had told us is if you are planning on
clustering, in an environment like this, you are out of compliance with
licensing as soon as you migrate the 5th VM over to a server that is
only running Enterprise edition (such as to down one of the 3 servers
for patching).  That is of course, unless you own separate individual
server licenses for those VMs.

 

From: Andrew S. Baker [mailto:asbz...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 1:50 PM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

I have VM hosts at home that can support 6-8 hosts easily.

 

At the office, we have hosts that can support 15-20 VMs pretty easily.
Of course, this depends on the workload of the boxes, but for all but
the most extreme workloads, this is probably doable.

 

If you build each host to support 30-40% more VMs than normal, then you
can suffer a failure of one of them without great difficulty.


ASB

http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker

Harnessing the Advantages of Technology for the SMB market...

 

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 1:59 PM, Miller Bonnie L.
 wrote:

I don't see any mention of failover clustering.  Right now, how much do
you lose if one server is down?  How much would you lose if 4 servers
were down instead?

 

Just a thought, but you could add another host server, or stick with
three, run datacenter, and build them with enough guts to run 6 VMs
each.  That also gives you the ability to spin up test servers, etc, as
you mentioned.

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 8:04 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: New to virtualization

 

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would ho

RE: Adding an Exchange 2003 Front End server?

[David Mazzaccaro]

No DMZ.

Look at this pic:

http://www.msexchange.org/tutorials/Demystifying-OWA-2003-FEBE-Logon-Pro
cess.html

 

 

 

 

From: itli...@imcu.com [mailto:itli...@imcu.com] 
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2012 3:15 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Adding an Exchange 2003 Front End server?

 

I currently only have one Exchange 2003 standard server in my
environment.

I would like to add an Exchange 2003 standard front endserver in a DMZ I
am creating.

What do I need to do?

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
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RE: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management list...

[David Mazzaccaro]

Should have mentioned... about 12 servers here.


-Original Message-
From: Kennedy, Jim [mailto:kennedy...@elyriaschools.org] 
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2012 12:23 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management list...

WSUS. Set to download but not install. Then I RDP and hit install. Saves quite 
a bit of time since they are already downloaded. An improvement over what you 
are doing, but still not perfect of course. But I am in full control that way. 
We are smaller than many people here. About 40 servers.

-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org] 
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2012 12:21 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management list...

What do you guys use to patch servers? I'm still in the "RDP to the server and 
run Windows Update" camp. I'd love a free solution to do this en-mass, if 
somebody knows one.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: Kurt Buff
[mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 16 Mar 2012
08:03:50 -0700
Subject: Re: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management list...


> Unfortunately, I can't move quite that fast. We're pretty much a 24x5 
> shop, with offices overseas, and I have to give more notice than 
> "patching now, please log off".  At least I have most weekends to do 
> this kind of thing...
> 
> Kurt
> 
> On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 07:24, Kennedy, Jim 
>  wrote:
> > I am all done!  Neeener neener.  :)
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, March 16, 2012 10:24 AM
> > To: NT System Admin Issues
> > Subject: Re: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management
> list...
> >
> > Yeah, I'm pushing this out as fast as I can - I'll be patching 
> > servers
> tonight, and the rest of the workstations next week.
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 07:14, James Rankin  wrote:
> >> ...http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows-RDP-Vulnerability-Exploit
> >> -Co
> >> de-Confirmed-259060.shtml
> >>
> >
> > ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
>   ~
> >
> > ---
> > To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> > or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> > with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
> >
> > ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ 
> >   ~
> >
> > ---
> > To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> > or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> > with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
> 
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ 
>   ~
> 
> ---
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> 

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  ~

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RE: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management list...

[David Mazzaccaro]

That is what I do as well.
I use WSUS for all the desktops/laptops.. but the servers I want to do manually.


-Original Message-
From: Matthew W. Ross [mailto:mr...@ephrataschools.org] 
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2012 12:05 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management list...

What do you guys use to patch servers? I'm still in the "RDP to the server and 
run Windows Update" camp. I'd love a free solution to do this en-mass, if 
somebody knows one.


--Matt Ross
Ephrata School District


- Original Message -
From: Kurt Buff
[mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
To: NT System Admin Issues
[mailto:ntsysadmin@lyris.sunbelt-software.com]
Sent: Fri, 16 Mar 2012
08:03:50 -0700
Subject: Re: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch
Management list...


> Unfortunately, I can't move quite that fast. We're pretty much a 24x5
> shop, with offices overseas, and I have to give more notice than
> "patching now, please log off".  At least I have most weekends to do
> this kind of thing...
> 
> Kurt
> 
> On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 07:24, Kennedy, Jim
>  wrote:
> > I am all done!  Neeener neener.  :)
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Kurt Buff [mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, March 16, 2012 10:24 AM
> > To: NT System Admin Issues
> > Subject: Re: In case anyone didn't see this on the Patch Management
> list...
> >
> > Yeah, I'm pushing this out as fast as I can - I'll be patching servers
> tonight, and the rest of the workstations next week.
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 16, 2012 at 07:14, James Rankin  wrote:
> >> ...http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows-RDP-Vulnerability-Exploit-Co
> >> de-Confirmed-259060.shtml
> >>
> >
> > ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
>   ~
> >
> > ---
> > To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> > or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> > with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
> >
> > ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> > ~   ~
> >
> > ---
> > To manage subscriptions click here:
> http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> > or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> > with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
> 
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~   ~
> 
> ---
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> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
> 
> 

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RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Yes, they told me that is part of the setup.

 

 

From: Matthew B Ames [mailto:matthew.a...@qinetiq.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:40 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

Best hope your NetApp is connected via some means to the internet (or
whatever black magic the NetApp uses to talk back to the mothership so
they can send you an email).

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: 13 March 2012 18:08
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

"NetApp makes good SANs, and their support is great!  (A drive starts to
go bad, and you get an email from support asking where to ship it to,
etc.  Sometimes that is the first and perhaps only indication something
is going wrong.)"

 

That is GREAT to hear, thx

 

 

 

 

From: Richard McClary [mailto:richard.mccl...@aspca.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:54 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

I'm really just getting started here myself, but...

 

VM NICs  connect to real ESX NICs, and you will need some ESX NICs for
redundancy, for management, for a possible DMZ in the future, etc.  Oh
yeah - the ESX hosts need NICs for the iSCSI connection to the
datastore.  Figure on getting some dedicated network switches as well
and work out some subnetting (so the management, kernel, and other
connections are not a part of your main LAN).

 

NetApp makes good SANs, and their support is great!  (A drive starts to
go bad, and you get an email from support asking where to ship it to,
etc.  Sometimes that is the first and perhaps only indication something
is going wrong.)

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 10:04 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: New to virtualization

 

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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~ Finally, powerful en

RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Excellent!

Thank you very much.

 

From: James Rankin [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 5:04 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

If you use VMWare, you'll have a VirtualCenter system that manages all
of your hosts and clusters. Some people keep this physical, but you can
virtualize this management system as well.

http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi3_vc_in_vm.pdf

I'd recommend doing a "parallel" migration for your Citrix users, i.e.
stand up a XenApp 6.5 farm, install the same applications as your old
garm, and allow the users access to both new and old farms through a
single Web Interface (Mr Webster's blog has a good article on doing
this). Then you can get some test users to try the "new" apps, get some
feel for the metrics of your new virtualized systems, and be able to
instantly roll them back to the old farm if you hit any issues.

On 13 March 2012 18:12, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Thanks,

Right now I have 3 DL360s (dual proc, 4GB, 32bit) for 75 Citrix users
and they are taxed pretty hard.

I always get alerts for CPU and RAM, and if I physically check the
boxes, they usually say 200M free of ram, w/ 6GB pagefile in use.

 

What do you mean by "Virtualizing VirtualCenter"?

 

 

 

From: James Rankin [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:48 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

Nothing wrong with virtualizing your Citrix kit, but another thing
you'll need to remember the latest Citrix XenApp version (soon to be the
only supported one, by July 2013) is 64-bit only, so you'll need to do
some heavy app testing to make sure everything will work OK. If it
doesn't, you'll have to invest in some other way of getting at those
apps (VDI, VM Hosted Apps, etc.) Obviously you won't get as many users
on a virtual XenApp system as you do on a physical one (unless your
physical ones are highly underpowered) - I've seen round about 30-40
users per box being a ballpark figure dependent on the RAM and
processing power you throw at the VMs.

The only thing you really maybe need to leave physical is a DNS server,
maybe a DC if you want to be able to log in to the domain when
everything else is down. Virtualizing VirtualCenter (if you go the
VMWare route) isn't that much of an issue.

On 13 March 2012 15:04, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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"On two occasions...I have been asked, 'Pray, Mr Babbage, if you put
into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am
not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could
provoke such a question."

* IMPORTANT INFORMATION/DISCLAIMER *

This document should be read only by those persons to whom it is
addressed. If you have received this message it was obviously addressed
to you

RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

David: of the physical servers, if you had your druthers and could
isolate the tasks out to an individual server, how many servers would
you really have?  Or are all those servers only doing one task, already?

Well, my first Domain Controller (up until last week, was my ONLY DC) is
doing all this:

Windows Server 2003 Standard SP2

Domain Controller (holds all 5 FSMO roles)

Global Catalog

DNS

WSUS 

File Shares (My Documents redirection, all shared drives)

GFI Vipre Antimalware server

Symantec Backup Exec 10d 

 

The remaining boxes are pretty much dedicated:

BES (dedicated)

OWA (dedicated)

Exchange 2003 (dedicated)

3 Citrix 4.0 servers (dedicated)

SCO UNIX billing server (dedicated)

MAS200 (also Citrix licensing server, web interface server, terminal
services profile storage)

Document imaging (also my 2nd DC, and print server)

 

 

 

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 2:49 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

If I were doing licensing from scratch, I'd go Datacenter, even
accounting for the CPU licensing, it's not all that much more.  The
ability to add and move servers, "thinly" provision servers, etc makes a
a much more robust environment.

 

When I say thinly provision servers, I mean, making a server responsible
for only one task, such as AV management, BES, whatever, without putting
additional duties on it as is common in a physical server environment.

 

David: of the physical servers, if you had your druthers and could
isolate the tasks out to an individual server, how many servers would
you really have?  Or are all those servers only doing one task, already?

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 12:20 PM, Ralph Smith
 wrote:

"However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? "

Datacenter is licensed per CPU - those are dual CPU servers so you would
need 6 Datacenter licenses.

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:04 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: New to virtualization

 

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog

RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thanks for the link!

I will inquire about virtual clustering, initially I was just thinking
of hosting stand alone hosts...

 

 

From: Steven Peck [mailto:sep...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 2:02 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

The others have given some good suggestions.  Mine is download ESXi and
play with it (And HyperV).  Spend the time now because VMware is
currently vey expensive and your environment sounds within the bounds of
HyperV and if you find real savings there you can spend it doing some
upgrades (AD, Exchange, Citrix)

 

You can virtualize everything.  It does complicate getting your
environment back up if you have an unexpected outage (UPS dies, catches
fire, repairs don't go well and you get a call at 2am regarding an
unexpected outage but I digress).  Even though it 'complicates' things,
it's certainly still do-able.  With VMware you just have to connect to
your hosts individually until you get one with the DC on it and get it
powered up before you bring everything else up.  Having a physical DC is
a nice to have as you can ensure it's powered up first and life is
easier but it's not necessary, just really really nice.  (One of our
more isolated evironments as about 40 guests on 3 hosts and completely
virtual including DCs with above referenced annoyances).

 

If you go with VMware you are licensing both Microsoft and VMware per
host and VMware has the fun new memory based price model.  If you look
at the costs you may find that just using HyperV then Windows Datacenter
license may come out equal and grants you more flexibility regarding
guest systems.  System Center 2012 suite of products is coming out any
day now so there is a lot of 'free training' offered via marketing (see
some earlier threads).  

 

Are you looking at virtual clustering for uptime SLA's or were you just
hosting stand alone hosts?

 

http://systemcenteruniverse.com/Agenda  <-- look at the SCVMM
presentation.  

 

Just some thoguhts

Steven Peck

http://www.blkmtn.org

 


 

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 8:04 AM, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

The total $130k proposal does include 200 W2008 CALs, 75 Citrix Xenapp
licenses, new PIX ASA firewall, and ~$40k of services.

It would also bring my domain up to 2008 R2, a new Citrix XenApp farm.

 

 

 

 

From: Paul Hutchings [mailto:paul.hutchi...@mira.co.uk] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:45 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

If it were me, given the limited details (no mention of IOPs), I would
be looking at the new G8 HP or 12g Dell servers that can take a lot more
spindles, with a view to using DAS and running a Virtual SAN under
VMware.

 

DataCenter is the way to go ideally as you will end up with more VM's
than you expected to and an Enterprise license doesn't (I think) allow
you to shift VM's around if you follow it strictly.

 

Spend some of your money on CALs and infrastructure rather than blowing
the lot on running a 10 year old OS on a spanky new hardware SAN IMO.

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: 13 March 2012 15:04
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: New to virtualization

 

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thanks

I will check out VM vx HyperV as well as Fiber vs iscsi.

 

 

From: Christopher Bodnar [mailto:christopher_bod...@glic.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:47 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

At a high level you have all the components you need. 

Boxes to run ESX 
SAN 
Licensing 

The specifics are open to debate based on your environment. All of the things 
you pointed out are variables that only you can make an informed decision about 
based on the current environment and how you see it evolving over the next ~3 
years. 

Storage for the SAN
Number of new servers added to the environment 
Capacity of current infrastructure 

Some things to think about. 

FC vs iSCSI. 
VMWare vs HyperV 
Disaster Recovery 

In a smaller environment where you may not necessarily need all the bells and 
whistles, Hyper-V is very attractive and may save you $$$. Also I highly 
recommend going to the Data Center license if you can, then  you are covered 
for the OS licenses if you do decide to spin up more boxes. 



Christopher Bodnar 
Enterprise Achitect I, Corporate Office of Technology 

Tel 610-807-6459  
3900 Burgess Place, Bethlehem, PA 18017 
christopher_bod...@glic.com   

 

The Guardian Life Insurance Company of America

www.guardianlife.com <http://www.guardianlife.com/>  








From:    "David Mazzaccaro"  
To:"NT System Admin Issues"  
Date:03/13/2012 11:33 AM 
Subject:New to virtualization 






Hi all, 

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure into the 
virtual world. 

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old 

Windows 2003 domain 

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm 

~190 users 

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here’s what they are 
recommending: 

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000 

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of storage 
for the VMs) ~$20,000 

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200 

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to run 4 
Windows 2008 VMs each) 

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN, and the 
3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the host’s CPU, RAM, 
NIC, etc.)… right? 

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have started 
the conversation along the same path as above. 

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?   

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and the 
host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet) 

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?   

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)? 

Shouldn’t something be left physical? 

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?   

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me… 

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3 Windows 
Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs. 

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small increase in 
price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better patch 
deployment? 

Thx 


. 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
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<>

RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Thanks,

Right now I have 3 DL360s (dual proc, 4GB, 32bit) for 75 Citrix users
and they are taxed pretty hard.

I always get alerts for CPU and RAM, and if I physically check the
boxes, they usually say 200M free of ram, w/ 6GB pagefile in use.

 

What do you mean by "Virtualizing VirtualCenter"?

 

 

 

From: James Rankin [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:48 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: New to virtualization

 

Nothing wrong with virtualizing your Citrix kit, but another thing
you'll need to remember the latest Citrix XenApp version (soon to be the
only supported one, by July 2013) is 64-bit only, so you'll need to do
some heavy app testing to make sure everything will work OK. If it
doesn't, you'll have to invest in some other way of getting at those
apps (VDI, VM Hosted Apps, etc.) Obviously you won't get as many users
on a virtual XenApp system as you do on a physical one (unless your
physical ones are highly underpowered) - I've seen round about 30-40
users per box being a ballpark figure dependent on the RAM and
processing power you throw at the VMs.

The only thing you really maybe need to leave physical is a DNS server,
maybe a DC if you want to be able to log in to the domain when
everything else is down. Virtualizing VirtualCenter (if you go the
VMWare route) isn't that much of an issue.

On 13 March 2012 15:04, David Mazzaccaro
 wrote:

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin




-- 
"On two occasions...I have been asked, 'Pray, Mr Babbage, if you put
into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am
not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could
provoke such a question."

* IMPORTANT INFORMATION/DISCLAIMER *

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you are a mindless cretin; either way, you should immediately kill
yourself and destroy your computer (not necessarily in that order). Once
you have taken this action, please contact us.. no, sorry, you can't use
your computer, because you just destroyed it, and possibly also
committed suicide afterwards, but I am starting to digress.. 

The originator of this email is not liable for the transmission of the
information contained in this communication. Or are they? Either way
it's a pretty dull legal query and frankly one I'm not going to dwell
on. But should you have nothing better to do, please feel free to
ruminate on it, and please pass on any concrete conclusions should you
find them. However, if you pass them on via email, be sure to include a
disclaim

RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Ah, right... 6.

I think it would still be a minimal increase in the overall $130k quote.

Good catch! Thank you.

 

 

 

 

From: Ralph Smith [mailto:m...@gatewayindustries.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 12:20 PM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

"However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? "

Datacenter is licensed per CPU - those are dual CPU servers so you would
need 6 Datacenter licenses.

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:04 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: New to virtualization

 

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

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.
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RE: New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

"NetApp makes good SANs, and their support is great!  (A drive starts to
go bad, and you get an email from support asking where to ship it to,
etc.  Sometimes that is the first and perhaps only indication something
is going wrong.)"

 

That is GREAT to hear, thx

 

 

 

 

From: Richard McClary [mailto:richard.mccl...@aspca.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:54 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: New to virtualization

 

I'm really just getting started here myself, but...

 

VM NICs  connect to real ESX NICs, and you will need some ESX NICs for
redundancy, for management, for a possible DMZ in the future, etc.  Oh
yeah - the ESX hosts need NICs for the iSCSI connection to the
datastore.  Figure on getting some dedicated network switches as well
and work out some subnetting (so the management, kernel, and other
connections are not a part of your main LAN).

 

NetApp makes good SANs, and their support is great!  (A drive starts to
go bad, and you get an email from support asking where to ship it to,
etc.  Sometimes that is the first and perhaps only indication something
is going wrong.)

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 10:04 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: New to virtualization

 

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old

Windows 2003 domain

Exchange 2003 

Citrix 4.0 farm

~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:

(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000

(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000

VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200

(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?

I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  

It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)

Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  

Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?

Shouldn't something be left physical?

Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  

Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.

However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 

Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

 


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and may contain legally privileged and/or confidential information. If
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RE: PC lifecycle?

[David Mazzaccaro]

I am thinking (hoping) he missed a "-" in there... 

(2-4 yrs old)

?

 

 

From: James Rankin [mailto:kz2...@googlemail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:29 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: PC lifecycle?

 

PCs from 1988? Holy cow

On 13 March 2012 14:42, David Lum  wrote:

That's is how I sold my client on an SBS swing to new hardware, along
the lines of:

"if your average employee compensation is xx/hr  and they are waiting nn
mins/day for the machine to boot and nn/mins/day while the server is
processing something the cost is $$/employee/day. If new
hardware/software cuts the total employee "wait" time by nn mins/day
then multiplying that by xx/hr you gain $$/day of production.

 

My client wanted to upgrade 10 of their 17 PC's (their PC's are 24yrs
old) to speed things up -but it was their SBS server that was getting
flattened (SATA drives running Exchange and SQL!), I said if they spent
that money on a new server instead (old was is a PE840) the'd see ROI in
under six months.

 

Yesterday was their first day on the their new server and one
maintenance job they would run at the end of the day went from 20
minutes to just under 5. That alone is 1hr 15mins/week gained  for that
one employee. ~$100/mo saved right there.

 

If employee's are idle waiting for the system to do something, that's
generally time they are not adding value.

 

Dave

 

From: Jonathan Link [mailto:jonathan.l...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 6:39 AM


To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: Re: PC lifecycle?

 

You have to work the numbers.  How much downtime/lost productivity.
It's dependent on the situation.  As I said, our computers are in the
hands of revenue producers.  When they're down, they aren't billing
their time.  They either have to make it up (morale issue) or it is lost
productivity (money issue).  At current billing rates, it doesn't take
long for an hour or two of downtime to justify some additional upfront
expense.  If these are office drones, it's a bit harder to justify it
from a cost-benefit perspective.

 

YMMV.


 

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 8:53 AM, Harry Singh  wrote:

To those who interface directly with your CFO/CEO or are the decision
maker, what reasoning/justification did you provide in order to shorten
the length of the refresh? I'm at a place that looks to refresh close to
5-6 years, and that's even  a fight sometimes. I know there is a wide
range of IT Pros here so curious to see if any actually had to "fight"
for a 3-4 year refresh or you've been lucky enough to work for a company
which pursues an aggressive refresh policy. 

Also, those that buy a refurb with 3 yr maintenance -- what's your
target margin of savings compared against buying a new machine? In other
words, if a new machine would cost $800 what's your target price for a
refurb? 



On Monday, March 12, 2012, Brian Desmond  wrote:
> My customers vary from 3-5, err'ing to the left. Whatever the choice,
they generally have maintenance on the hardware.
>
>  
>
> Thanks,
>
> Brian Desmond
>
> br...@briandesmond.com
>
>  
>
> w - 312.625.1438 | c   - 312.731.3132
>
>  
>
> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonmobility.com]
> Sent: Friday, March 09, 2012 12:13 PM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: PC lifecycle?
>
>  
>
> How long do you folks keep PCs and laptops in your organizations?
>
> 4? 5? 6 years?
>
> My oldest are a few from 2006.
>
> I am thinking I should start replacing after they hit 5 years (4 years
if heavy user/issues).
>
> I know it will depend on the business environment...I'm just trying to
get some idea as to what others do.
>
> Thx
>
> .
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
> ---
> To manage subscriptions click here:
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
> or send an email to listmana...@lyris.sunbeltsoftware.com
> with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin 

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---
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN&#

New to virtualization

[David Mazzaccaro]

Hi all,

I am starting to investigate moving our aging network infrastructure
into the virtual world.

~ 10 servers, 6-7 years old
Windows 2003 domain
Exchange 2003 
Citrix 4.0 farm
~190 users

After some initial discussions w/ a reseller, here's what they are
recommending:
(3) DL 380 G7 servers (to host the VMs) ~$18,000
(1) Net App FAS2240 (this is the SAN that would host 12 600GB drives of
storage for the VMs) ~$20,000
VMWare essentials plus kit (VMware software) ~$5200
(3) MS Windows 2008 R2 Enterprise (this would allow the 3 HP servers to
run 4 Windows 2008 VMs each)

I guess the way it would work is that the VMs would reside on the SAN,
and the 3 hosts would call up the SAN to load each VM utilizing the
host's CPU, RAM, NIC, etc.)... right?
I have meetings scheduled w/ 2 other vendors, but verbally both have
started the conversation along the same path as above.

Being very new to VM, does the above scenario seem to make sense?  
It is hard for me to imagine all that traffic going between the SAN and
the host servers w/o creating a huge bottleneck (over gig Ethernet)
Do people recommend virtualizing every server?  
Domain controllers? Exchange? Citrix farm (4 server)?
Shouldn't something be left physical?
Is 7 TB of storage enough (probably only 3 usable after array config)?  
Is the net app a decent appliance? $20k sounds cheap to me...

I have done a little more reading, and from what I understand w/ 3
Windows Enterprise licenses, I would be limiting myself to 12 VMs.
However, if I went w/ 3 Windows Datacenter licenses, for a small
increase in price - I would get unlimited VMs? 
Which would allow for actually having a testing environment, and better
patch deployment?

Thx


.
~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~   ~

---
To manage subscriptions click here: 
http://lyris.sunbelt-software.com/read/my_forums/
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with the body: unsubscribe ntsysadmin