Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
I actually think we don't pay for AIX licenses as long as we maintain our hardware support contract... which we're going to do anyways... Then again, we have a ton of Power and zOS systems... so maybe IBM is just throwing that in as a bonus. Totally possible, they gave me $100+K in free software because we said we were deciding between their software and a similar product by HP -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
I actually think we don't pay for AIX licenses as long as we maintain our hardware support contract... which we're going to do anyways... Then again, we have a ton of Power and zOS systems... so maybe IBM is just throwing that in as a bonus. Totally possible, they gave me $100+K in free software because we said we were deciding between their software and a similar product by HP -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
With no moving parts and no local operating system to manage, Sun Ray Clients provide a cost-effective, highly functional thin client alternative to desktop and laptop computers and reduce many of the problems associated with traditional desktop deployments. http://www.kintek.com.au/";>Web Design Brisbane -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> I have 7 sparc boxes at home. Before the end of > October, all but one of them will be sent to the > dump. The delay is because of recycling logistics > alone. What do you have? I might be interested in these... -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
I need to leave solaris 10 because oracle is unwilling to supply security updates unless I pay somewhere in the range of 4000 dollars year to update my systems. I am a professor and use my sun hardware to serve websites and databases to the public as well as operate sunray's for colleagues. According to the new licenses I can no longer use Solaris in non-commercial production environments. The only allowed uses are development and demonstration, nothing else. I have purchased licenses from Oracle for my SRSS (sunray) software updates, and purchased individual licenses for each of my sunray stations at a very reasonable price. However, I can not afford to offer Solaris 10 on those sunrays since 4000 dollars a year is way way way over my budget. Maybe 100-200 dollars a year I could do. no more. So, I have moved all of my apps to licenses that do not require arms and legs. I have tested srss5 on OpenIndiana and it works and that is where I am going. When Oracle wakes up maybe I will move back. The other option is by that time maybe I won't want to. Until that happens my students and colleagues will see OpenIndiana on their desktops rather than Oracle. Which is too bad. Particularly when you look at the history of Sun and where their first customers came from. Professors. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> Just updated my Ultra20 to openindiana from b134. > Flawless so far. Very nice > > Exactly the distro I was looking for (i.e. not much > changed from opensolaris). > > I tried nexenta and it is not what I want, I am sure > others want it though, so all power to them. I am > sure they were using it instead of opensolaris > already. > > Now I just have to figure out how to get my big iron > off of sol10 without headaches. Why? Solaris 10 is much more tested. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Just updated my Ultra20 to openindiana from b134. Flawless so far. Very nice Exactly the distro I was looking for (i.e. not much changed from opensolaris). I tried nexenta and it is not what I want, I am sure others want it though, so all power to them. I am sure they were using it instead of opensolaris already. Now I just have to figure out how to get my big iron off of sol10 without headaches. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> It is not about "freely licensed" but about being > freely redistributable. The key word is freely. If I own something, and I allow you to freely use it for any purpose (development only, redistribution, personal use, whatever) then how can you complain? I am not forcing you to use it, and I am not asking you to give me anything in return. > People are interested in OSS mostly because they like > to have things freely > redistributable. Please stop saying things like this. You don't speak for all people. I don't even believe you speak for a majority of people, but that's just my opinion. If YOU are interested in OSS mostly because YOU like to have things freely redistributable, then say that. Saying the license is unacceptable because it does not provide redistributable source code implies that Oracle has some sort of obligation to do so. They do not. They have obligations to their customers and to their shareholders. They seem to be doing well at meeting those obligations: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20100917-707612.html eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Eric Andersen wrote: > Things like: > > -stating a FREELY licensed binary distribution is simply unacceptable without > accompanying source It is not about "freely licensed" but about being freely redistributable. People are interested in OSS mostly because they like to have things freely redistributable. Jörg -- EMail:jo...@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin j...@cs.tu-berlin.de(uni) joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> I think it's fair if one uses software for absolutely > no cost has no place to request for something, but > with prior Sun and now Oracle, individual is just > below their radar. One can pay for patches and RTU > for your Windows and MacOSX, but reality is there > isn't a chance one can do the same with Sun/Oracle.. I agree. I am much more hopeful for the future today than I was when the deal closed, and when Open Solaris was cancelled. By offering a free development license and binary releases of development snapshots, Oracle is actively showing that they are looking to push Solaris as something other than soley a platform to run Sun/Oracle applications on Sun/Oracle hardware. If the community (non-customers who may or may not contribute in non-monetary ways) wants Oracle's good will and respect, they need to also respect Oracle's property and business decisions. Things like: -stating a FREELY licensed binary distribution is simply unacceptable without accompanying source -demanding free technical support for a free development release -stating that you are now going to throw all your SPARC boxes in the trash -bashing Oracle management and calling them names is childish and costs the "community" credibility and respect. If you're a customer and you feel that way, rant to Oracle directly, not through a community message forum. eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> > > Was Solaris a successful product before Sun open > > sourced everything? How much has the enterprise > > market changed since then? > > > > Wrong question: the right question would be how > many > > users would Solaris use > > now, if it had not been opensourced. > > Can we change it to how many PAYING CUSTOMERS would > use Solaris now if it had not been opensourced? I > think that is a legitimate question, but probably not > one that anyone can actually answer. Estimates? > Anyone? > These OSS/adoption rate/commercially success question are becoming more and more rhetorical.. but lead to nowhere, reality is Sun is sold, opensolaris distribution is no more. > Users like me do not contribute to Oracle's bottom > line, and source code had nothing to do with my > decision to use Solaris. hmm. I don't see there is any way actually, you (or me or anyone on a "freeloader" scale) can contribute to Oracle monetary wise, even if willing to. I think it's fair if one uses software for absolutely no cost has no place to request for something, but with prior Sun and now Oracle, individual is just below their radar. One can pay for patches and RTU for your Windows and MacOSX, but reality is there isn't a chance one can do the same with Sun/Oracle.. > > eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> > Was Solaris a successful product before Sun open > sourced everything? How much has the enterprise > market changed since then? > > Wrong question: the right question would be how many > users would Solaris use > now, if it had not been opensourced. Can we change it to how many PAYING CUSTOMERS would use Solaris now if it had not been opensourced? I think that is a legitimate question, but probably not one that anyone can actually answer. Estimates? Anyone? Users like me do not contribute to Oracle's bottom line, and source code had nothing to do with my decision to use Solaris. eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Eric Andersen wrote: > Was Solaris a successful product before Sun open sourced everything? How > much has the enterprise market changed since then? Wrong question: the right question would be how many users would Solaris use now, if it had not been opensourced. Jörg -- EMail:jo...@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin j...@cs.tu-berlin.de(uni) joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> Delaying source release and the sort of ARC cases > that were previously open reduces participation; not > only contribution, but useful feedback. I can't > guess > whether e.g. Apple, FreeBSD, or Nexenta using some of > the > OpenSolaris code cuts into Oracle's profits, although > since > Oracle seems to only be interested in customers with > deep > pockets, I'd be inclined to suspect that while it may > make > some difference, the difference is not large, and may > not > be worth the lost good will. > > Separate from that is the issue of the license being > free > _only_ for the purposes of developing, testing, or > presentation > of developer apps. Desktops, and student and home > user access > (at low or no cost to those groups) are essential to > holding and > growing mindshare, some of which eventually become > paying customers, > and most of which wouldn't be able to pay something > like $1000 per > year per socket anyway. It's not lost revenue, it's > cheap (the cost of > the download bandwidth) advertising! How did that mindshare, good will, and free advertising help Sun be successful? What other companies that compete with Solaris in the enterprise market offer their products for free desktop, education, home or development use? Do they offer free access to their source code? Was Solaris a successful product before Sun open sourced everything? How much has the enterprise market changed since then? eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> Delaying source release and the sort of ARC cases > that were previously open reduces participation; not > only contribution, but useful feedback. I can't > guess > whether e.g. Apple, FreeBSD, or Nexenta using some of > the > OpenSolaris code cuts into Oracle's profits, although > since > Oracle seems to only be interested in customers with > deep > pockets, I'd be inclined to suspect that while it may > make > some difference, the difference is not large, and may > not > be worth the lost good will. > > Separate from that is the issue of the license being > free > _only_ for the purposes of developing, testing, or > presentation > of developer apps. Desktops, and student and home > user access > (at low or no cost to those groups) are essential to > holding and > growing mindshare, some of which eventually become > paying customers, > and most of which wouldn't be able to pay something > like $1000 per > year per socket anyway. It's not lost revenue, it's > cheap (the cost of > the download bandwidth) advertising! How did that mindshare, good will, and free advertising help Sun be successful? What other companies that compete with Solaris in the enterprise market offer their products for free desktop, education, home or development use? Do they offer free access to their source code? Was Solaris a successful product before Sun open sourced everything? How much has the enterprise market changed since then? eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> On 9/14/10, Eric Andersen wrote: > > > Whatever Apple does or doesn't do, the point I was > trying to make was that a > > whole lot of people are willing to not only accept, > but pay for an operating > > system that is closed source. A very large amount > of OS X source code is > > open and freely available, so it was a bad example > of that point. > > The new Solaris and its impending source drops bear > more resemblance > to OS X than they do to something completely closed > source like > Windows. If you want Windows source you have to be > either a > billionaire, a large nation/state, or both. And > several billion seats > of Windows is enough proof that people are willing to > pay for an OS > regardless of whether its source is available or even > marginally > functional. I think the real point that everyone is > missing is that > despite everyone's hurt feelings this decision has > been made in order > to keep Solaris viable and profitable -- something > that Sun was > obviously unable to do for much of the past decade. > > -Gary Delaying source release and the sort of ARC cases that were previously open reduces participation; not only contribution, but useful feedback. I can't guess whether e.g. Apple, FreeBSD, or Nexenta using some of the OpenSolaris code cuts into Oracle's profits, although since Oracle seems to only be interested in customers with deep pockets, I'd be inclined to suspect that while it may make some difference, the difference is not large, and may not be worth the lost good will. Separate from that is the issue of the license being free _only_ for the purposes of developing, testing, or presentation of developer apps. Desktops, and student and home user access (at low or no cost to those groups) are essential to holding and growing mindshare, some of which eventually become paying customers, and most of which wouldn't be able to pay something like $1000 per year per socket anyway. It's not lost revenue, it's cheap (the cost of the download bandwidth) advertising! -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
On 9/14/10, Eric Andersen wrote: > Whatever Apple does or doesn't do, the point I was trying to make was that a > whole lot of people are willing to not only accept, but pay for an operating > system that is closed source. A very large amount of OS X source code is > open and freely available, so it was a bad example of that point. The new Solaris and its impending source drops bear more resemblance to OS X than they do to something completely closed source like Windows. If you want Windows source you have to be either a billionaire, a large nation/state, or both. And several billion seats of Windows is enough proof that people are willing to pay for an OS regardless of whether its source is available or even marginally functional. I think the real point that everyone is missing is that despite everyone's hurt feelings this decision has been made in order to keep Solaris viable and profitable -- something that Sun was obviously unable to do for much of the past decade. -Gary ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> 2010/9/14 Gary : > > On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 1:34 PM, Eric Andersen > wrote: > >> I concede that OS X was a poor example for the > point I'm trying to make. > > > > Actually, it's a pretty fair comparison. Apple does > not release their > > source to unregistered developers until after a > patch release is made > > available to the general public. > > Not exactly. > Apple does not release their source to _anybody_ > until after the > binary release, be it major or minor, is made > available to the public. Whatever Apple does or doesn't do, the point I was trying to make was that a whole lot of people are willing to not only accept, but pay for an operating system that is closed source. A very large amount of OS X source code is open and freely available, so it was a bad example of that point. eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
2010/9/14 Gary : > On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 1:34 PM, Eric Andersen wrote: >> I concede that OS X was a poor example for the point I'm trying to make. > > Actually, it's a pretty fair comparison. Apple does not release their > source to unregistered developers until after a patch release is made > available to the general public. Not exactly. Apple does not release their source to _anybody_ until after the binary release, be it major or minor, is made available to the public. Cheers! -f ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 1:34 PM, Eric Andersen wrote: > I concede that OS X was a poor example for the point I'm trying to make. Actually, it's a pretty fair comparison. Apple does not release their source to unregistered developers until after a patch release is made available to the general public. -Gary ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> I also paid my OS X licenses, both at home and at > work. But I'm not using OS X > for anything one might consider five nines, whereas > Solaris... > > And, if you aren't aware of it: > > http://www.opensource.apple.com/ I concede that OS X was a poor example for the point I'm trying to make. Perhaps better examples would be AIX or HP-UX. Does IBM or HP make these free to use for educational purposes? Do they offer the source code for free? Maybe they do, I honestly don't know. eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> For those of us using Solaris in production, having > access to the source code, > coupled with DTrace, has made our lives much, much > easier. Punching down into > weird problems becomes possible without a lot of > blood and cargo culting. > > It's nice that you're happy using Solaris for free (I > pay for my support > contracts), but having such an incredibly useful > resource for Getting Work Done > pulled or just hamstrung, is pretty painful. > > I say hamstrung as source drops will still occur > after releases, in theory; > previously dropped source should, hopefully, continue > to be accessible. And for > my Enterprisey customers, that will almost certainly > be good enough. > > There are also several large orangizations who > require bleeding edge in their > production. Having access to the latest source for > not only finding and > reporting problems, but submitting patches back > upstream, was really helpful. > > I also paid my OS X licenses, both at home and at > work. But I'm not using OS X > for anything one might consider five nines, whereas > Solaris... I absolutely understand your position. If lack of, or insufficient access to source code is a deal breaker for a good number of paying customers, then Oracle will have to address that issue. This thread was about the new OTN license covering Solaris 10 and Solaris Express. If Oracle is going to allow people to use their software for free, that's a good thing, even if it might not be as "good" as what Sun gave away for free. I am really shocked that there are people complaining about this. There was some guy on another thread asking if Oracle was going to provide him with tech support for Solaris Express for free! If you're a paying customer and don't feel like you're getting the level of support you paid good money for, by all means, complain about it. If you're using something that someone is letting you use at absolutely no cost (i.e. a freeloader like me), whether it's in a production environment or not, you have no room for complaint. I don't think Oracle wants to lose customers, they just want to make a profit on the billions they invested in buying Sun. I think that the decision to kill OpenSolaris, and offer Solaris Express under a different license, was made mostly to prevent people from using their software (and source code) to make money without paying them. The decision to still offer a free, uncrippled version of Solaris for educational/home use is a very kind gesture in my book, regardless of whether or not it was done for strictly business reasons (as I'm sure it was). I hope Oracle addresses your issues. Perhaps some future license will give you the tools you need to more effectively do your job at a fair cost. I'm sorry, I'm just blown away that Oracle is offering free personal use of their enterprise operating system, and there are people suggesting they should get source code, patches, and tech support for free as well... eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
+-- | On 2010-09-14 09:52:20, Eric Andersen wrote: | | I can only speak for myself, but I could really care less about having access to the source code. I am actually pretty stoked that Oracle seems like they are going to continue allowing me to use their OS for free. Details still seem to be pretty scant, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. | | I actually paid money for my Windows 7 and Mac OS X licenses, and neither of those comes with the source code. A binary only distribution will suit my personal needs just fine. For those of us using Solaris in production, having access to the source code, coupled with DTrace, has made our lives much, much easier. Punching down into weird problems becomes possible without a lot of blood and cargo culting. It's nice that you're happy using Solaris for free (I pay for my support contracts), but having such an incredibly useful resource for Getting Work Done pulled or just hamstrung, is pretty painful. I say hamstrung as source drops will still occur after releases, in theory; previously dropped source should, hopefully, continue to be accessible. And for my Enterprisey customers, that will almost certainly be good enough. There are also several large orangizations who require bleeding edge in their production. Having access to the latest source for not only finding and reporting problems, but submitting patches back upstream, was really helpful. I also paid my OS X licenses, both at home and at work. But I'm not using OS X for anything one might consider five nines, whereas Solaris... And, if you aren't aware of it: http://www.opensource.apple.com/ Cheers. -- bdha cyberpunk is dead. long live cyberpunk. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> I believe that binary distros have been accepted only > because there was source. I can only speak for myself, but I could really care less about having access to the source code. I am actually pretty stoked that Oracle seems like they are going to continue allowing me to use their OS for free. Details still seem to be pretty scant, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I actually paid money for my Windows 7 and Mac OS X licenses, and neither of those comes with the source code. A binary only distribution will suit my personal needs just fine. eric -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Have you checked in on the Sun Ray users mailing list? http://wiki.sun-rays.org/index.php/Sun_Ray_Community Their most recent OS howto appears to be for Debian... http://wiki.sun-rays.org/index.php/How_To_Section -Gary ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Yeah, I know My problem is I need something that will just sit and run and when I need to update it wont break the sun-rays. I like ubuntu because potentially the lts release should do that. I may end up with centos on there since it looks like a modern ubuntu may not work as well as I hoped. Of course I would rather do openindiana but that will require somebody else figuring out how to fix srss to get it running. That will take time I may not have. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> Now, instead of my students seeing ORACLE > on their workstations, they will see UBUNTU. Their > call. Seems absolutely self defeating to me but I > guess we do not count. If that is the case I will > just move on. Pay for what I can still afford and > just turn my back on what I have really grown to > enjoy. > > Let me tell you how sick I am of going back to > etc/init.d eww Ubuntu,(please excuse me if that is your favorite distro.) may i suggest to wait till tuesday to see if you like OpenIndiana, i understand it's the continuation of opensolris at b147 and if you like that install it on your students workstations, and if you have to use linux, i recommend my favorite distro: Gentoo linux:-) http://www.gentoo.org/ -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> As far as ORACLE offers OS and other SUN's > technologies for free to use it and develop, > I'm happy with that and believe most of the people. > If it is not enough for some developer > then, I personally congratulate to him/her, and I > believe that ORACLE would be more than > happy to become their Senior Engineer employee. > Hope I was clear with my thoughts. they offer those software for free, only for evaluation use only but if you want to use them in production you have to buy either a license and/ or a subscription and they are not cheap, i'm sure i can't afford them. I think now It's a hard time for being a solaris kernel developer and companies using solaris code, unless they pay up, since newer solaris source code is no longer being made available to download. it was good thing that illumos came about, i think many companies using solaris code and solaris kernel devs will join illumos:-). -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
I think you may be right but I can't take that chance. I run websites and databases for 'real' institutions that would be monitored for license infringements (even if my applications are non-commercial and they institutions are non-commercial). If I were running this out of my house then I would do as you say, but as I am affiliated with other entities that are 'checked' for compliance i can not afford to take that chance. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Again agree, but with few additional thoughts. I was looking how many people outside SUN actually has been delivering source into Nevada? Not so much, actually. For *any* develiper, starting to do bugfix-ing, for example, is very hards since it has to learn a lot of stuffs before any real coding begun. The *real* benefit of open-souced Solaris was for other companies since theirengineers could learn new technology for *free*, even incorporating it into their OS-es or embedded systems. I hold that I know software engineering, even thought I'm telecommunications engineer, and it took so much of my time learning how some stuffs work. Linux is open source but who are developers developing it? Predominantly software engineers interested in some features they would like to add to Linux so *their* products could work. Since they have to release everything under GPL - it means that they have to share it with others so other company's engineers could improve/modify it and use it for benefits of their own company. At the end of the story it is just different business model than one with licenses.I still believe that it is more advanced that "traditional" one, but in Solaris case maybe it is not - there are not so much stakeholders willing to improve Solaris as there are stakeholders willing to incorporate pieces of Solaris existing source code into their products. Personally, I'm at least 5 years far from the phase when I will know *each* system call, whole mechanics inside ZFS, and other stuffs already outsourced. As far as ORACLE offers OS and other SUN's technologies for free to use it and develop, I'm happy with that and believe most of the people. If it is not enough for some developer then, I personally congratulate to him/her, and I believe that ORACLE would be more than happy to become their Senior Engineer employee. Hope I was clear with my thoughts. Regards, Uros Nedic Belgrade, Serbia > Date: Sun, 12 Sep 2010 14:29:39 +0200 > From: joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de > To: ur...@live.com; unixcons...@yahoo.com; > opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org; kjard...@yahoo.com > Subject: Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license > > Uros Nedic wrote: > >> >> If would Solaris Express follow some regular release cycle, (half a year, >> for example) >> then some of us could adapt ourselves to use binary-only releases, and form >> UGs around >> Solaris Express releases. > > I believe that binary distros have been accepted only because there was > source. > > By stopping source updated, Oracle may have aroused things that did never > happen the way Sun did manage OpenSolaris. > > Jörg > > -- > EMail:jo...@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin > j...@cs.tu-berlin.de (uni) > joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ > URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Uros Nedic wrote: > > If would Solaris Express follow some regular release cycle, (half a year, for > example) > then some of us could adapt ourselves to use binary-only releases, and form > UGs around > Solaris Express releases. I believe that binary distros have been accepted only because there was source. By stopping source updated, Oracle may have aroused things that did never happen the way Sun did manage OpenSolaris. Jörg -- EMail:jo...@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin j...@cs.tu-berlin.de(uni) joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
If would Solaris Express follow some regular release cycle, (half a year, for example) then some of us could adapt ourselves to use binary-only releases, and form UGs around Solaris Express releases. As I said once in one of mine previous posts, if Larry wants to give some money in charity purposes, then he could certainly sponsor something which is tightly related to its main business - UGs infrastructure. What I mean by that - he could say that each ORACLE representative has to give some meeting room when they are not using in it, once a week, just for UGs activities for 2-3h. He could sponsor artwork of Solaris Express, production of CDs, so we could give them to the people, T-Shirts, laptop stickers, panels, etc. UGs have no funds to sponsor it. What we can do is to organize ourselves and others to promote Solaris Express, and speak about technologies it offers. It is again win-win position, we are learning about new stuffs and ORACLE increases impact of its technologies. Uros NedicBelgrade, Serbia > Date: Sat, 11 Sep 2010 20:46:53 -0700 > From: unixcons...@yahoo.com > To: kjard...@yahoo.com; opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org > Subject: Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license > > Hi, > > I really think people like you are reading too much into the license and over > reacting. So Oracle is going to give Solaris, Solaris Express, etc away for > free > for non-Production use. They say things like it's free for development, > testing, > etc. Why is this not flexible enough? Hell, just say you're writing a script > or > compiling stuff. Do you really think Oracle has time to chase after every > single > copy out there??? I mean come on! You're over reacting like tin-foil hat > paranoid freaktards! > > The bottom line is that Oracle wants people to pay if they are using it for > PRODUCTION USE! Will they expect people to pay for updates? I have no doubt > they'll charge support contacts for people who will want daily IPS depot > updates. What's wrong with that? Is that any different from RHEL or AIX? Just > because they don't specifically list using it as a desktop, home media server, > or a toaster, doesn't mean they are after you for money or going to take you > to > court. I think some people are taking this license too literally, and that's > just plain stupid. I've read it enough times to say I see nothing wrong with > SA's, developers, testers, enthusiasts using it. So what's the big deal??? > > *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > Octave J. Orgeron > Solaris Virtualization Architect and Consultant > Web: http://unixconsole.blogspot.com > E-Mail: unixcons...@yahoo.com > *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > > > > - Original Message ---- > From: Daniel Kjar > To: opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org > Sent: Sat, September 11, 2010 7:37:52 PM > Subject: Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license > > To give you an idea of how self destructive this is, I am now moving all of my > operations to ubuntu (not my opensolaris desktop/file server though!). Today I > was able to get my sunrays running on 9.10 and tomorrow I will move them up to > 10.04. I can buy licenses for my sunrays for 100 dollars a pop, and patches > from oracle for 100 dollars a year. I cannot afford 2000 dollars a year for my > Blade and my X2200 for solaris. I would use it if I could but since I saw that > license today I am out of luck and will remove solaris from all of my > computers. I hope one of the new openindianas is straight up compatible with > srss 4.2 but I can't count on it. I am running an older version of 10 on my > x2200 so I should still be ok with the license for the moment. > > I am a professor and all of my work is non-commercial and I require no support > besides security updates. I would pay for those just as I pay for them with my > sunrays. Now, instead of my students seeing ORACLE on their workstations, they > will see UBUNTU. Their call. Seems absolutely self defeating to me but I guess > we do not count. If that is the case I will just move on. Pay for what I can > still afford and just turn my back on what I have really grown to enjoy. > > > Let me tell you how sick I am of going back to etc/init.d > -- > This message posted from opensolaris.org > ___ > opensolaris-discuss mailing list > opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org > > > > > ___ > opensolaris-discuss mailing list > opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
Hi, I really think people like you are reading too much into the license and over reacting. So Oracle is going to give Solaris, Solaris Express, etc away for free for non-Production use. They say things like it's free for development, testing, etc. Why is this not flexible enough? Hell, just say you're writing a script or compiling stuff. Do you really think Oracle has time to chase after every single copy out there??? I mean come on! You're over reacting like tin-foil hat paranoid freaktards! The bottom line is that Oracle wants people to pay if they are using it for PRODUCTION USE! Will they expect people to pay for updates? I have no doubt they'll charge support contacts for people who will want daily IPS depot updates. What's wrong with that? Is that any different from RHEL or AIX? Just because they don't specifically list using it as a desktop, home media server, or a toaster, doesn't mean they are after you for money or going to take you to court. I think some people are taking this license too literally, and that's just plain stupid. I've read it enough times to say I see nothing wrong with SA's, developers, testers, enthusiasts using it. So what's the big deal??? *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Octave J. Orgeron Solaris Virtualization Architect and Consultant Web: http://unixconsole.blogspot.com E-Mail: unixcons...@yahoo.com *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* - Original Message From: Daniel Kjar To: opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org Sent: Sat, September 11, 2010 7:37:52 PM Subject: Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license To give you an idea of how self destructive this is, I am now moving all of my operations to ubuntu (not my opensolaris desktop/file server though!). Today I was able to get my sunrays running on 9.10 and tomorrow I will move them up to 10.04. I can buy licenses for my sunrays for 100 dollars a pop, and patches from oracle for 100 dollars a year. I cannot afford 2000 dollars a year for my Blade and my X2200 for solaris. I would use it if I could but since I saw that license today I am out of luck and will remove solaris from all of my computers. I hope one of the new openindianas is straight up compatible with srss 4.2 but I can't count on it. I am running an older version of 10 on my x2200 so I should still be ok with the license for the moment. I am a professor and all of my work is non-commercial and I require no support besides security updates. I would pay for those just as I pay for them with my sunrays. Now, instead of my students seeing ORACLE on their workstations, they will see UBUNTU. Their call. Seems absolutely self defeating to me but I guess we do not count. If that is the case I will just move on. Pay for what I can still afford and just turn my back on what I have really grown to enjoy. Let me tell you how sick I am of going back to etc/init.d -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
+-- | On 2010-09-11 17:37:52, Daniel Kjar wrote: | | I am a professor and all of my work is non-commercial and I require no support besides security updates. I would pay for those just as I pay for them with my sunrays. Now, instead of my students seeing ORACLE on their workstations, they will see UBUNTU. Their call. Seems absolutely self defeating to me but I guess we do not count. If that is the case I will just move on. Pay for what I can still afford and just turn my back on what I have really grown to enjoy. | | Let me tell you how sick I am of going back to etc/init.d Ubuntu uses Upstart these days. init.d is legacy. Check out Fedora and RHEL, though... FC14 will have systemd, which looks very progressive (if slightly crazy, but maybe in a good way): http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/systemd.html Cheers. -- bdha cyberpunk is dead. long live cyberpunk. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
To give you an idea of how self destructive this is, I am now moving all of my operations to ubuntu (not my opensolaris desktop/file server though!). Today I was able to get my sunrays running on 9.10 and tomorrow I will move them up to 10.04. I can buy licenses for my sunrays for 100 dollars a pop, and patches from oracle for 100 dollars a year. I cannot afford 2000 dollars a year for my Blade and my X2200 for solaris. I would use it if I could but since I saw that license today I am out of luck and will remove solaris from all of my computers. I hope one of the new openindianas is straight up compatible with srss 4.2 but I can't count on it. I am running an older version of 10 on my x2200 so I should still be ok with the license for the moment. I am a professor and all of my work is non-commercial and I require no support besides security updates. I would pay for those just as I pay for them with my sunrays. Now, instead of my students seeing ORACLE on their workstations, they will see UBUNTU. Their call. Seems absolutely self defeating to me but I guess we do not count. If that is the case I will just move on. Pay for what I can still afford and just turn my back on what I have really grown to enjoy. Let me tell you how sick I am of going back to etc/init.d -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
>
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
>
>
> On 9/10/2010 6:11 PM, Edward Martinez wrote:
> > It appears this is the license Solaris 11 Express
> wil be under and it's
> solaris 10 new license, an OTN lincese.
> >
> >
> http://c0t0d0s0.org/archives/6891-Licensing-Change-for
> -Solaris-10-and-Solaris-Cluster.html
>
> I find this section of the license even more
> interesting:
>
> > Open Source Software
> > "Open Source" software - software available without
> charge for use,
> > modification and distribution - is often licensed
> under terms that
> > require the user to make the user's modifications
> to the Open Source
> > software or any software that the user 'combines'
> with the Open
> > Source software freely available in source code
> form. If you use
> > Open Source software in conjunction with the
> Programs (or if you
> > plan on licensing your own application under an
> Open Source
> > license), you must ensure that your use does not:
> (i) create, or
> > purport to create, obligations with respect to the
> Oracle Programs;
> > or (ii) grant, or purport to grant, to any third
> party any rights to
> > or immunities under our intellectual property or
> proprietary rights
> > in the Oracle Programs. For example, you may not
> develop a software
> > program using an Oracle program and an Open Source
> program where
> > such use results in a program file(s) that contains
> code from both
> > the Oracle program and the Open Source program
> (including without
> > limitation libraries) if the Open Source program is
> licensed under a
> > license that requires any "modifications" be made
> freely available.
> > You also may not combine the Oracle program with
> programs licensed
> > under the GNU General Public License ("GPL") in any
> manner that
> > could cause, or could be interpreted or asserted to
> cause, the
> > Oracle program or any modifications thereto to
> become subject to the
> > terms of the GPL.
> >
> They make it sound like they feel threatened by
> OpenSource software,
> the GPL in particular. While I have no love for the
> GPL, I've never
> thought that any OSS license would create the need
> for language like that.
>
>-Kyle
It doesn't seem reasonable to me that some of that language is
necessary from the standpoint of defending their own licences.
In a perverse way though, it may help customers insofar as it
warns them off of a path of mingling GPL and non-GPL code
in (according to some interpretations) forbidden ways.
It's offensive sounding language, but I'm not sure it has much in
the way of practical consequences. More bothersome to me is
that non-profit non-development personal use seems to me to
be utterly excluded. How many developers that cannot afford
a license can afford a dedicated system that they can only use
for development, testing, and demonstration of their apps, and
not double as a desktop or home file server or something?
To fully comply would just about limit one to running x86 under
VirtualBox or VMware or the like, only when needed for the
stated purpose. And what about self-education and familiarization?
Realistically that should be part of development or of any other usage,
continually.
Excluding uses that would never have been a cash cow anyway doesn't
create more profit, it creates less, by closing a path whereby those
uses might have been the start of a progression into a paying customer.
--
This message posted from opensolaris.org
___
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Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
On Sep 11, 2010, at 6:59 AM, Kyle McDonald wrote: >> > They make it sound like they feel threatened by OpenSource software, the GPL > in particular. While I have no love for the GPL, I've never thought that any > OSS license would create the need for language like that. It's probably much less sinister than it appears on first glance. My guess is that they're merely trying to avoid conflicts with patent trolls. It reminds me of when Caldera Linux released a bunch of System V source under a GPL license then years later as SCO tried to claim all of Linux was trampling on their intellectual property. -Gary___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
On 9/10/2010 6:11 PM, Edward Martinez wrote:
> It appears this is the license Solaris 11 Express wil be under and it's
solaris 10 new license, an OTN lincese.
>
> http://c0t0d0s0.org/archives/6891-Licensing-Change-for-Solaris-10-and-Solaris-Cluster.html
I find this section of the license even more interesting:
> Open Source Software
> "Open Source" software - software available without charge for use,
> modification and distribution - is often licensed under terms that
> require the user to make the user's modifications to the Open Source
> software or any software that the user 'combines' with the Open
> Source software freely available in source code form. If you use
> Open Source software in conjunction with the Programs (or if you
> plan on licensing your own application under an Open Source
> license), you must ensure that your use does not: (i) create, or
> purport to create, obligations with respect to the Oracle Programs;
> or (ii) grant, or purport to grant, to any third party any rights to
> or immunities under our intellectual property or proprietary rights
> in the Oracle Programs. For example, you may not develop a software
> program using an Oracle program and an Open Source program where
> such use results in a program file(s) that contains code from both
> the Oracle program and the Open Source program (including without
> limitation libraries) if the Open Source program is licensed under a
> license that requires any "modifications" be made freely available.
> You also may not combine the Oracle program with programs licensed
> under the GNU General Public License ("GPL") in any manner that
> could cause, or could be interpreted or asserted to cause, the
> Oracle program or any modifications thereto to become subject to the
> terms of the GPL.
>
They make it sound like they feel threatened by OpenSource software,
the GPL in particular. While I have no love for the GPL, I've never
thought that any OSS license would create the need for language like that.
-Kyle
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Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
It's pretty hard to care about a company that craps all over it's development community. About all I expect these days is that they'll do more to make me recommend other choices in the enterprise than their products. But hey, that's just business right? New license sleaze just means more reasons not to choose their products. They can't honor past agreements, so it's not reasonable to expect them to honor the new crap they roll out today a year from now. After all the legion of sleazy lawyers they employ need something to do with their time, and there's nothing better for them to do than figure out new ways to screw customers out of money. I have zero respect for Oracle's management. I don't trust them, I know too much about the companies internal culture of back stabbing to want to do business with them in the first place. Since it extends itself very frequently to customer relationships, as has been illustrated by their nasty treatment of the OpenSolaris community, well it's just more proof that doing business with this company is a serious mistake for anyone. What is obvious is that they're too self-involved to see the permanent harm they've done to their own market. Mistakes like that come from group think, and they can't be easily undone. I have 7 sparc boxes at home. Before the end of October, all but one of them will be sent to the dump. The delay is because of recycling logistics alone. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> So write some shell scripts, compile some software, > test some software. That > should be more than enough to meet the requirements;) > > *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > Octave J. Orgeron > Solaris Virtualization Architect and Consultant > Web: http://unixconsole.blogspot.com > E-Mail: unixcons...@yahoo.com > *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*- i do that on solaris! so i guess that counts as "developing" and "testing". I'm covered.:-) -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
So write some shell scripts, compile some software, test some software. That should be more than enough to meet the requirements;) *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Octave J. Orgeron Solaris Virtualization Architect and Consultant Web: http://unixconsole.blogspot.com E-Mail: unixcons...@yahoo.com *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* - Original Message From: Dmitry G. Kozhinov To: opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org Sent: Sat, September 11, 2010 1:36:06 AM Subject: Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license > Solaris 10 can be used for strictly self-educational purposes.. Not even for self-education. The (developer) license text at http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/licenses/solaris-cluster-express-license-167852.html says: "only for the purpose of developing, testing, prototyping and demonstrating your applications, and not for any other purpose." Dmitry. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> Solaris 10 can be used for strictly self-educational purposes.. Not even for self-education. The (developer) license text at http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/licenses/solaris-cluster-express-license-167852.html says: "only for the purpose of developing, testing, prototyping and demonstrating your applications, and not for any other purpose." Dmitry. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
On 9/10/2010 4:25 PM, Edward Martinez wrote: Solaris 10 can be used for strictly self-educational purposes.. From this Oralcle site reads out: Developers: All software downloads are free, and most come with a Developer License that allows you to use full versions of the products at no charge while developing and prototyping your applications, or for strictly self-educational purposes. http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/indexes/downloads/index.html Solaris is included and it's released under the developer license. I think Oracle knows since Solaris is a free download all sorts people will download it but i think oracle will only go after with warnings and lawsuits at companies using it in "production" without a support contracts. I'm currently using the latest solaris 10 release, at home, for strictly self educational purposes to earn all of Oracle Solaris certs. [Note: I'm not speaking for Oracle, and I'm not a License Lawyer. I'm just reading and quoting from the relevant sections] The Developer License from Technet DOES NOT cover the Solaris downloads. Also, note that it isn't covering OpenSolaris, or Solaris Next, or Solaris Express, or whatever we're calling it this month. The Technet download is for Solaris 10 ONLY. The license granted for Solaris 10 is here: http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/licenses/solaris-cluster-express-license-167852.html It's pretty explicit - you can only use it to develop and prototype applications. No other use is allowed. You do get a "perpetual" license for such purposes, but the license explicitly states that as soon as you start to use it for anything other than application development and prototyping, it's no longer valid. I don't know if device driver or OS development falls under this license. But, it certainly doesn't allow for use in anything other than a development scenario. What type of entity you are doesn't matter. Note that this gets hideously confusing, since Oracle/Sun has two things covering Solaris: the "License" (https://cds.sun.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/CDS-CDS_SMI-Site/en_US/-/USD/ViewLicense-Start) and the "Entitlement" (http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/licenses/solaris-cluster-express-license-167852.html). NEVER assume something with Oracle, unless it is explicitly stated somewhere. I think we still need to take that bit of knowledge to heart. Assuming a not-yet-available "product" will be licensed a certain way is certainly foolhardy. -- Erik Trimble Java System Support Mailstop: usca22-123 Phone: x17195 Santa Clara, CA ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
> On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 6:11 PM, Edward Martinez > wrote: > > It appears this is the license Solaris 11 Express > wil be under and it's solaris 10 new license, an > OTN lincese. > > > > > http://c0t0d0s0.org/archives/6891-Licensing-Change-for > -Solaris-10-and-Solaris-Cluster.html > > This looks good to start with, but I leaves me > wondering if certain > uses of the software that are both non-commercial but > ALSO outside the > scope of the license grant (such as using Solaris to > run a home > network sever or to serve as a desktop OS on an old > piece of SPARC > hardware or something used for hobbyist purposes) is > allowed under the > perpetual license or if such a things are now > forbidded without a paid > license. > > Mike > ___ > opensolaris-discuss mailing list > opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org > Solaris 10 can be used for strictly self-educational purposes.. >From this Oralcle site reads out: Developers: All software downloads are free, and most come with a Developer License that allows you to use full versions of the products at no charge while developing and prototyping your applications, or for strictly self-educational purposes. http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/indexes/downloads/index.html Solaris is included and it's released under the developer license. I think Oracle knows since Solaris is a free download all sorts people will download it but i think oracle will only go after with warnings and lawsuits at companies using it in "production" without a support contracts. I'm currently using the latest solaris 10 release, at home, for strictly self educational purposes to earn all of Oracle Solaris certs. -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 6:11 PM, Edward Martinez wrote: > It appears this is the license Solaris 11 Express wil be under and it's > solaris 10 new license, an OTN lincese. > > http://c0t0d0s0.org/archives/6891-Licensing-Change-for-Solaris-10-and-Solaris-Cluster.html This looks good to start with, but I leaves me wondering if certain uses of the software that are both non-commercial but ALSO outside the scope of the license grant (such as using Solaris to run a home network sever or to serve as a desktop OS on an old piece of SPARC hardware or something used for hobbyist purposes) is allowed under the perpetual license or if such a things are now forbidded without a paid license. Mike ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
[osol-discuss] Solaris 10,Oracle Solaris Express new license
It appears this is the license Solaris 11 Express wil be under and it's solaris 10 new license, an OTN lincese. http://c0t0d0s0.org/archives/6891-Licensing-Change-for-Solaris-10-and-Solaris-Cluster.html -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
