RE: KPI's for software developers
It seemed to work well. Team members could drill into the details of their scores and were constantly looking for ways to improve their work , interaction with internal clients etc Most of the team members had been there over 10 years. They had a policy that encouraged people to stay on the team if they wanted to. Developers could advance without having to leave the development team. They had some great developers who loved what they were doing. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Michael Minutillo Sent: Tuesday, 29 June 2010 11:05 AM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers Interesting. Did that work well? On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Leah Garrett mailto:leah.garr...@dfine.com.au>> wrote: At a place I worked out there was a team that used KPIs for development. There were about 15 people on the team. They were maintaining an internal application that ran the business. Their change request / bug tracking system had fields to score the change. The score fields had to be completed by three different people; the person completed the change, the code reviewer (peer from the team) as well as the internal client who requested the change. The scores were built by combining the score in a series of categories including quality and customer service. The change request / bug tracking system scores were used in annual reviews of individuals as well as for the team. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com>] On Behalf Of ben.robb...@jlta.com.au<mailto:ben.robb...@jlta.com.au> Sent: Tuesday, 29 June 2010 10:22 AM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> Subject: RE: KPI's for software developers Several years ago we outsourced development of several modules and got a horrible mess of spaghetti code in return. On more than one occasion we've fixed bugs purely by deleting code, without adding or changing any existing code. And refactoring parts of these modules often results in a 50% or greater reduction in the size of the code and the same functionality (except for the bugs). If I didn't know otherwise, I would have sworn they were being paid per line of code. Ben From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com>] On Behalf Of Corneliu I. Tusnea Sent: Monday, 28 June 2010 8:08 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers >> So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures >> himself on lines deleted. :) >> No name, but I think its a great idea! Are you talking about me again? :) I quite often measure my success rate by number of lines re-factored (which most often mean deleted). I consider a good achievement when I reduce the codebase I'm working by about 30-40% while adding 10-15% new functionality in those areas. Corneliu. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Stephen Price mailto:step...@littlevoices.com>> wrote: So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures himself on lines deleted. :) No name, but I think its a great idea! On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean mailto:david.k...@microsoft.com>> wrote: Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;) From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com>] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer [cid:image001.gif@01CB17A1.4FDCE040] Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 This email is intended for the named recipient only. The information it contains may be confidential or commercially sensitive. If you are not the intended recipient you must not reproduce or distribute any part of this email, disclose its contents to any other party, or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender immediately and delete the message from your computer. -- Michael M. Minutillo Indiscriminate Information Sponge Blog: http://wolfbyte-net.blogspot.com <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
Interesting. Did that work well? On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 8:50 AM, Leah Garrett wrote: > > > At a place I worked out there was a team that used KPIs for development. > > > > There were about 15 people on the team. They were maintaining an internal > application that ran the business. Their change request / bug tracking > system had fields to score the change. The score fields had to be completed > by three different people; the person completed the change, the code > reviewer (peer from the team) as well as the internal client who requested > the change. The scores were built by combining the score in a series of > categories including quality and customer service. > > > > The change request / bug tracking system scores were used in annual reviews > of individuals as well as for the team. > > > > > > > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *ben.robb...@jlta.com.au > *Sent:* Tuesday, 29 June 2010 10:22 AM > *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com > *Subject:* RE: KPI's for software developers > > > > Several years ago we outsourced development of several modules and got a > horrible mess of spaghetti code in return. On more than one occasion we've > fixed bugs purely by deleting code, without adding or changing any existing > code. > > > > And refactoring parts of these modules often results in a 50% or greater > reduction in the size of the code and the same functionality (except for the > bugs). If I didn't know otherwise, I would have sworn they were being paid > per line of code. > > > > Ben > > > -- > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Corneliu I. Tusnea > *Sent:* Monday, 28 June 2010 8:08 PM > *To:* ozDotNet > *Subject:* Re: KPI's for software developers > > >> So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures > himself on lines deleted. :) > > >> No name, but I think its a great idea! > > > > Are you talking about me again? :) > > I quite often measure my success rate by number of lines re-factored (which > most often mean deleted). I consider a good achievement when I reduce the > codebase I'm working by about 30-40% while adding 10-15% new functionality > in those areas. > > > > Corneliu. > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Stephen Price > wrote: > > So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures > himself on lines deleted. :) > > No name, but I think its a great idea! > > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean > wrote: > > Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and > soda they drink. ;) > > > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Moore > *Sent:* Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM > *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com > *Subject:* KPI's for software developers > > > > Hi all > > > > Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that > measure a software developers performance? > > > > Kind regards > > > > > > *Richard Moore > Analyst Programmer* > > [image: WSR-Signature.png] > > Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 > Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 > > 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 > Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 > > > > > > > > This email is intended for the named recipient only. The information it > contains may be confidential or commercially sensitive. If you are not the > intended recipient you must not reproduce or distribute any part of this > email, disclose its contents to any other party, or take any action in > reliance on it. If you have received this email in error, please contact the > sender immediately and delete the message from your computer. > > > -- Michael M. Minutillo Indiscriminate Information Sponge Blog: http://wolfbyte-net.blogspot.com <>
RE: KPI's for software developers
At a place I worked out there was a team that used KPIs for development. There were about 15 people on the team. They were maintaining an internal application that ran the business. Their change request / bug tracking system had fields to score the change. The score fields had to be completed by three different people; the person completed the change, the code reviewer (peer from the team) as well as the internal client who requested the change. The scores were built by combining the score in a series of categories including quality and customer service. The change request / bug tracking system scores were used in annual reviews of individuals as well as for the team. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of ben.robb...@jlta.com.au Sent: Tuesday, 29 June 2010 10:22 AM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com Subject: RE: KPI's for software developers Several years ago we outsourced development of several modules and got a horrible mess of spaghetti code in return. On more than one occasion we've fixed bugs purely by deleting code, without adding or changing any existing code. And refactoring parts of these modules often results in a 50% or greater reduction in the size of the code and the same functionality (except for the bugs). If I didn't know otherwise, I would have sworn they were being paid per line of code. Ben From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Corneliu I. Tusnea Sent: Monday, 28 June 2010 8:08 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers >> So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures >> himself on lines deleted. :) >> No name, but I think its a great idea! Are you talking about me again? :) I quite often measure my success rate by number of lines re-factored (which most often mean deleted). I consider a good achievement when I reduce the codebase I'm working by about 30-40% while adding 10-15% new functionality in those areas. Corneliu. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Stephen Price mailto:step...@littlevoices.com>> wrote: So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures himself on lines deleted. :) No name, but I think its a great idea! On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean mailto:david.k...@microsoft.com>> wrote: Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;) From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com>] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer [cid:image001.gif@01CB1776.84E87E00] Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 This email is intended for the named recipient only. The information it contains may be confidential or commercially sensitive. If you are not the intended recipient you must not reproduce or distribute any part of this email, disclose its contents to any other party, or take any action in reliance on it. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender immediately and delete the message from your computer. <>
RE: KPI's for software developers
Several years ago we outsourced development of several modules and got a
horrible mess of spaghetti code in return. On more than one occasion
we've fixed bugs purely by deleting code, without adding or changing any
existing code.
And refactoring parts of these modules often results in a 50% or greater
reduction in the size of the code and the same functionality (except for
the bugs). If I didn't know otherwise, I would have sworn they were
being paid per line of code.
Ben
From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
[mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Corneliu I. Tusnea
Sent: Monday, 28 June 2010 8:08 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers
>> So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who
measures himself on lines deleted. :)
>> No name, but I think its a great idea!
Are you talking about me again? :)
I quite often measure my success rate by number of lines
re-factored (which most often mean deleted). I consider a good
achievement when I reduce the codebase I'm working by about 30-40% while
adding 10-15% new functionality in those areas.
Corneliu.
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Stephen Price <
step...@littlevoices.com> wrote:
So what about the people who delete code? I know someone
who measures himself on lines deleted. :)
No name, but I think its a great idea!
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean <
david.k...@microsoft.com> wrote:
Definitely track it by the amount of code that
write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;)
From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:
ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Richard Moore
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM
To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com
Subject: KPI's for software developers
Hi all
Does anyone have any good useful key performance
indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance?
Kind regards
Richard Moore
Analyst Programmer
Ph: +61 7 3340 2500
Fx: +61 7 3340 2550
23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113
Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110
This email is intended for the named recipient only. The information it
contains may be confidential or commercially sensitive. If you are not the
intended recipient you must not reproduce or distribute any part of this email,
disclose its contents to any other party, or take any action in reliance on it.
If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender
immediately and delete the message from your computer.
<>
Re: KPI's for software developers
>> So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures himself on lines deleted. :) >> No name, but I think its a great idea! Are you talking about me again? :) I quite often measure my success rate by number of lines re-factored (which most often mean deleted). I consider a good achievement when I reduce the codebase I'm working by about 30-40% while adding 10-15% new functionality in those areas. Corneliu. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Stephen Price wrote: > So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures > himself on lines deleted. :) > No name, but I think its a great idea! > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean wrote: > >> Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix >> and soda they drink. ;) >> >> >> >> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: >> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Moore >> *Sent:* Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM >> *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com >> *Subject:* KPI's for software developers >> >> >> >> Hi all >> >> >> >> Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that >> measure a software developers performance? >> >> >> >> Kind regards >> >> >> >> >> >> *Richard Moore >> Analyst Programmer* >> >> [image: WSR-Signature.png] >> >> Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 >> Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 >> >> 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 >> Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 >> >> >> > > <>
RE: KPI's for software developers
Me tooBig trouble. What about a KPI based on the amount of rework directly attributable to the developer either because of bugs or poor coding (but not because the specs change)? The lower the number the better the result. My result would be extremely low. But only because I havn't done enough coding in the past 18 months to warrant the "programmer" part of my job title. :-( Simon From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Maddin, Peter Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 05:56 PM To: djones...@gmail.com; ozDotNet Subject: RE: KPI's for software developers I'm in trouble then Regards Peter Maddin From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of djones...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 3:46 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers Number of dilbert strips on the wall measures the developer/management dissatisfaction rate. Davy BBM pin:2589AEE0 This email (including all attachments) is confidential, may contain personal or legally privileged information and is intended solely for the named addressee. Confidentiality or privilege is not waived or lost because this email has been sent to you by mistake. If you have received it in error, please let us know by reply email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. This email is also subject to copyright. No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the written consent of the copyright owner. Any personal information in this email must be handled in accordance with the Privacy Act 1988 (Cth). Emails may be interfered with, may contain computer viruses or other defects and may not be successfully replicated on other systems. Pillar Administration makes no representations and gives no warranties in relation to these matters and does not accept liability for any loss or damage which may result from this email. If you have any doubts about the authenticity of an email purportedly sent by Pillar Administration, please contact us immediately.
Re: KPI's for software developers
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 1:55 AM, David Kean wrote: > > Just to clarify – I wasn’t being serious. Are you allowed to state the metrics that are used at your company? I would assume that it is one of the most metric'd-up companies in existance. Though I suppose it would be better for this topic to die. But I'm surprised that in all such discussions, I never see exactly the metrics Microsoft uses. I assume they're purposefully private. Oh well. I'll stop talking about this. I'm boring even myself. -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
RE: KPI's for software developers
Just to clarify - I wasn't being serious. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of James Chapman-Smith Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 1:48 AM To: 'ozDotNet' Subject: RE: KPI's for software developers Hi Richard & David, I'd be wary about using "amount of code" & "bugs they fix" as KPI's. IMHO both are terrible as far as KPI's. Here's why: It's my experience that there are two main things that create bugs - code & documentation. The more code you write the more bugs you'll get (and the number of bugs for each extra line increases as you go). Documentation is just a bug accelerator. If a client reads that a textbox is 67 pixels wide and yours in only 63 then you have a bug. It's best not to have written that amount of detail. Now, if you reward coders by using the "amount of code" as a positive KPI then you are in fact generating more bugs. If you then reward coders further by counting bugs fixed as a positive KPI then you are further encouraging large amounts of sloppy code writing. So, "amount of code" & "bugs they fix" KPI's just encourage lots of sloppy coding. I do, however, agree that "soda they drink" is an excellent KPI. :) If I were pressed for actually cool KPI I would suggest "Ratio of Test Code to Production Code", "Percentage of Code coverage" & "Feature Burn Rate". Cheers. James. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of David Kean Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 10:15 To: ozDotNet Subject: RE: KPI's for software developers Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;) From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer [WSR-Signature.png] Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 12:18 AM, Matt Siebert wrote: > Maybe the independent estimates are way off and developer A takes all kinds > of shortcuts that will result in bugs and unmaintainable code while > developer B handles the overlooked details and implements a much higher > quality solution that requires minimal rework down the line. > > There can be massive variations in scope and complexity from one task to > another. I'd argue that comparing developers against independent estimates > could only be meaningful if the developers are working on the same task > independently. Even then, the results could still be influenced by many > other external factors. Agreed, it's a bad approach. > IMHO a time based metric is conducive to sloppy code which will require > costly rework. Sure, we have to deliver things on time, but everyone needs > to understand that **estimates** are just that and may need to be revised as > work progresses on the task, and this can cause the delivery date to change. > > Also, estimates generally focus on the effort required, not the elapsed > time to complete the task - i.e. an estimate of 'two weeks' effort doesn't > mean the task will be completed in two weeks from now because some of that > time will be taken up by meetings, administrivia, etc. > > I think a true measure of performance would have to take into account the > quality of the solution provided yes. Of course, a KPI, from an external point of view, *is* the quality of the solution. It's basically the definition of quality. > (for code monkeys this may just be the > quality of the code, but for developers it involves other things like > whether the solution correctly addresses the problem) as well as time and > how well the task was managed - did the estimates need to be revised? were > they revised? was this communicated effectively? was there anything beyond > the developer's control that impacted these measures? Of course, a lot of > this is fairly subjective. > > I'd be wary of somebody asking for such KPIs as it shows that they don't > really understand the development process, and that could be a big problem > if they're steering the ship in a software company... -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
Re: KPI's for software developers
Maybe the independent estimates are way off and developer A takes all kinds of shortcuts that will result in bugs and unmaintainable code while developer B handles the overlooked details and implements a much higher quality solution that requires minimal rework down the line. There can be massive variations in scope and complexity from one task to another. I'd argue that comparing developers against independent estimates could only be meaningful if the developers are working on the same task independently. Even then, the results could still be influenced by many other external factors. IMHO a time based metric is conducive to sloppy code which will require costly rework. Sure, we have to deliver things on time, but everyone needs to understand that **estimates** are just that and may need to be revised as work progresses on the task, and this can cause the delivery date to change. Also, estimates generally focus on the effort required, not the elapsed time to complete the task - i.e. an estimate of 'two weeks' effort doesn't mean the task will be completed in two weeks from now because some of that time will be taken up by meetings, administrivia, etc. I think a true measure of performance would have to take into account the quality of the solution provided (for code monkeys this may just be the quality of the code, but for developers it involves other things like whether the solution correctly addresses the problem) as well as time and how well the task was managed - did the estimates need to be revised? were they revised? was this communicated effectively? was there anything beyond the developer's control that impacted these measures? Of course, a lot of this is fairly subjective. I'd be wary of somebody asking for such KPIs as it shows that they don't really understand the development process, and that could be a big problem if they're steering the ship in a software company... On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:17 PM, Jeff Sinclair < jeff.sinclair.em...@gmail.com> wrote: > How about, on any piece of work have someone external make estimates of the > time required. > These are not revealed to the developers. > If everyone is measured against those estimates, even if they are always > wrong, you can at least compare developers. > Obviously there will be some degree of variation in the accuracy of the > estimates but it will give an idea. > If developer A always takes 50% roughly longer than the estimate and > developer B take 150% long it easier to see which developer is performing > better. > > Jeff > > > -Original Message- > From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] > On Behalf Of silky > Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 4:52 PM > To: ozDotNet > Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 6:48 PM, James Chapman-Smith > wrote: > > [...] > > > If I were pressed for actually cool KPI I would suggest “Ratio of Test > Code to Production Code”, “Percentage of Code coverage” & “Feature Burn > Rate”. > > It shouldn't need to be pointed out that these are equally flawed (if > not more so, with 'ratio of test to production'). > > > > Cheers. > > James. > > -- > silky > > http://www.programmingbranch.com > >
RE: KPI's for software developers
How about, on any piece of work have someone external make estimates of the time required. These are not revealed to the developers. If everyone is measured against those estimates, even if they are always wrong, you can at least compare developers. Obviously there will be some degree of variation in the accuracy of the estimates but it will give an idea. If developer A always takes 50% roughly longer than the estimate and developer B take 150% long it easier to see which developer is performing better. Jeff -Original Message- From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of silky Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 4:52 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 6:48 PM, James Chapman-Smith wrote: [...] > If I were pressed for actually cool KPI I would suggest Ratio of Test Code to Production Code, Percentage of Code coverage & Feature Burn Rate. It shouldn't need to be pointed out that these are equally flawed (if not more so, with 'ratio of test to production'). > Cheers. > James. -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com
Re: KPI's for software developers
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 6:48 PM, James Chapman-Smith wrote: [...] > If I were pressed for actually cool KPI I would suggest “Ratio of Test Code > to Production Code”, “Percentage of Code coverage” & “Feature Burn Rate”. It shouldn't need to be pointed out that these are equally flawed (if not more so, with 'ratio of test to production'). > Cheers. > James. -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com
RE: KPI's for software developers
Hi Richard & David, I'd be wary about using "amount of code" & "bugs they fix" as KPI's. IMHO both are terrible as far as KPI's. Here's why: It's my experience that there are two main things that create bugs - code & documentation. The more code you write the more bugs you'll get (and the number of bugs for each extra line increases as you go). Documentation is just a bug accelerator. If a client reads that a textbox is 67 pixels wide and yours in only 63 then you have a bug. It's best not to have written that amount of detail. Now, if you reward coders by using the "amount of code" as a positive KPI then you are in fact generating more bugs. If you then reward coders further by counting bugs fixed as a positive KPI then you are further encouraging large amounts of sloppy code writing. So, "amount of code" & "bugs they fix" KPI's just encourage lots of sloppy coding. I do, however, agree that "soda they drink" is an excellent KPI. J If I were pressed for actually cool KPI I would suggest "Ratio of Test Code to Production Code", "Percentage of Code coverage" & "Feature Burn Rate". Cheers. James. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of David Kean Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 10:15 To: ozDotNet Subject: RE: KPI's for software developers Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;) From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer WSR-Signature.png Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 5:55 PM, Maddin, Peter wrote: > I’m in trouble then You could always just wear a golden sombrero and occasionally say 'beagle beagle beagle'. The stats on someone with those properties dying in a hospital have got to be fairly low. > Regards Peter Maddin > Applications Development Officer > PathWest Laboratory Medicine WA > Phone : +618 9473 3944 > Fax : +618 9473 3982 > E-Mail : peter.mad...@pathwest.wa.gov.au -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
RE: KPI's for software developers
I'm in trouble then Regards Peter Maddin Applications Development Officer PathWest Laboratory Medicine WA Phone : +618 9473 3944 Fax : +618 9473 3982 E-Mail : peter.mad...@pathwest.wa.gov.au The contents of this e-mail transmission outside of the WAGHS network are intended solely for the named recipient's), may be confidential, and may be privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure in the public interest. The use, reproduction, disclosure or distribution of the contents of this e-mail transmission by any person other than the named recipient(s) is prohibited. If you are not a named recipient please notify the sender immediately. From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of djones...@gmail.com Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 3:46 PM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers Number of dilbert strips on the wall measures the developer/management dissatisfaction rate. Davy BBM pin:2589AEE0 From: Eddie de Bear Sender: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com Date: Fri, 25 Jun 2010 11:28:03 +1000 To: ozDotNet ReplyTo: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers lol, one of the places I worked (years ago) that happened. I didn't write the code, but I was told to run it through an obfuscator before the code was handed over. The main reason was to strip out all the comments AND nasty variable names.. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:18 AM, David Richards mailto:ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com>> wrote: Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) David "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear mailto:eddie.deb...@gmail.com>> wrote: Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a good way to go ;) -- Eddie de Bear Mob: 0417066315 Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com<mailto:eddie_deb...@hotmail.com> Skype: eddiedebear
Re: KPI's for software developers
Number of dilbert strips on the wall measures the developer/management dissatisfaction rate. Davy BBM pin:2589AEE0 -Original Message- From: Eddie de Bear Sender: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com Date: Fri, 25 Jun 2010 11:28:03 To: ozDotNet Reply-To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers lol, one of the places I worked (years ago) that happened. I didn't write the code, but I was told to run it through an obfuscator before the code was handed over. The main reason was to strip out all the comments AND nasty variable names.. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:18 AM, David Richards < ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com> wrote: > Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you > have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. > Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) > > David > > "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes > will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" > -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear wrote: > >> Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a >> good way to go ;) >> >> > -- Eddie de Bear Mob: 0417066315 Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com Skype: eddiedebear
Re: KPI's for software developers
On 25 June 2010 12:43, Michael Minutillo wrote: > I am never going to a hospital again Having been in one last week, I can only agree. Sleep deprivation as a means of torture has *nothing* on what a hospital will do to you. -- Meski "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure, you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
Re: KPI's for software developers
On 6/25/10, Simon Haigh wrote: > The "management" answer to this question is "Ask the Project Manager". > The correct answer may (or may not) be entirely different. Yeah exactly, I agree with this also. As your saying, the best option is to put someone knowledgeable close to the people and have them produce a report. But still, as more people exist upwards and leftwards, the report needs to be summarised. -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
RE: KPI's for software developers
The "management" answer to this question is "Ask the Project Manager". The correct answer may (or may not) be entirely different. Simon > Consider the question instead "What is the best way to get a summary > of a given projects status and in a fashion that allows the estimates > to be predicted to the most accurate degree?" >-- >silky This email (including all attachments) is confidential, may contain personal or legally privileged information and is intended solely for the named addressee. Confidentiality or privilege is not waived or lost because this email has been sent to you by mistake. If you have received it in error, please let us know by reply email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. This email is also subject to copyright. No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the written consent of the copyright owner. Any personal information in this email must be handled in accordance with the Privacy Act 1988 (Cth). Emails may be interfered with, may contain computer viruses or other defects and may not be successfully replicated on other systems. Pillar Administration makes no representations and gives no warranties in relation to these matters and does not accept liability for any loss or damage which may result from this email. If you have any doubts about the authenticity of an email purportedly sent by Pillar Administration, please contact us immediately.
Re: KPI's for software developers
On 6/25/10, Michael Ridland wrote: > What about hiring self motivated people, that can manage themselves? You can > trust and build a real relationship with with? Well sure, that's obvious. But it doesn't even matter. KPI's are about companies getting sufficiently large that the top level managers want a nice "overview" of "progress". You don't need them in smaller companies, where the staff and projects are all well known and small. Consider the question instead "What is the best way to get a summary of a given projects status and in a fashion that allows the estimates to be predicted to the most accurate degree?" -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
Re: KPI's for software developers
On 6/25/10, Simon Haigh wrote: > Only if the "concluded" project meets all the requirements (Assuming the > full requirements were actually captured in the first place) > > Simon (Can you guess what I spent last week doing?) :) Agreed, this is the flaw with this system. But it's the "easiest" flaw to resolve, I think. It also needs to be resolved in any project anyway, for the happy outcome to be achieved, so the faster it's sorted the better. -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
Re: KPI's for software developers
What about hiring self motivated people, that can manage themselves? You can trust and build a real relationship with with? On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Simon Haigh wrote: > Only if the "concluded" project meets all the requirements (Assuming the > full requirements were actually captured in the first place) > > Simon (Can you guess what I spent last week doing?) > > > A project delivered on time *is* directly useful. > > > >-- > >silky > > > > > This email (including all attachments) is confidential, may contain > personal or legally privileged information and is intended solely for the > named addressee. Confidentiality or privilege is not waived or lost because > this email has been sent to you by mistake. If you have received it in > error, please let us know by reply email, delete it from your system and > destroy any copies. > This email is also subject to copyright. No part of it should be > reproduced, adapted or communicated without the written consent of the > copyright owner. Any personal information in this email must be handled in > accordance with the Privacy Act 1988 (Cth). > Emails may be interfered with, may contain computer viruses or other > defects and may not be successfully replicated on other systems. Pillar > Administration makes no representations and gives no warranties in relation > to these matters and does not accept liability for any loss or damage which > may result from this email. > If you have any doubts about the authenticity of an email purportedly sent > by Pillar Administration, please contact us immediately. > > >
RE: KPI's for software developers
Only if the "concluded" project meets all the requirements (Assuming the full requirements were actually captured in the first place) Simon (Can you guess what I spent last week doing?) > A project delivered on time *is* directly useful. > >-- >silky This email (including all attachments) is confidential, may contain personal or legally privileged information and is intended solely for the named addressee. Confidentiality or privilege is not waived or lost because this email has been sent to you by mistake. If you have received it in error, please let us know by reply email, delete it from your system and destroy any copies. This email is also subject to copyright. No part of it should be reproduced, adapted or communicated without the written consent of the copyright owner. Any personal information in this email must be handled in accordance with the Privacy Act 1988 (Cth). Emails may be interfered with, may contain computer viruses or other defects and may not be successfully replicated on other systems. Pillar Administration makes no representations and gives no warranties in relation to these matters and does not accept liability for any loss or damage which may result from this email. If you have any doubts about the authenticity of an email purportedly sent by Pillar Administration, please contact us immediately.
Re: KPI's for software developers
I've also heard that the death rate goes down when doctors go on strike. *scary* On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:43 AM, Michael Minutillo < michael.minuti...@gmail.com> wrote: > I am never going to a hospital again > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:38 AM, Greg Harris < > g...@harrisconsultinggroup.com> wrote: > >> This is going to cause a few mad Friday tangents…. >> >> >> >> If you have ever worked on a sales performance recognition system that >> allows for any flexibility beyond the total of who sold how much in dollar >> terms when, you will have seen that there quickly starts to be manipulation >> of the input data to affect the recognition outcome (rewards). >> >> >> >> e.g. look at all the sales people who are running around just now to meet >> their end of financial year goals, where the sales will be quietly credited >> back into the system at the beginning of the next financial year! >> >> >> >> If sales people (who have a far lower average IQ) than programmers can >> manipulate the system to meet their personal goals, what are programmers >> going to do? >> >> >> >> But I would also say, if you cannot measure it, you cannot manage it! >> >> >> >> But take care with your stats, statistics show that far more people die in >> hospital than in the community as a whole, so if you are sick, you should >> avoid going to hospital! WRONG! (for the sales people in the room, the >> reason more people die in hospital is because it has a biased population, >> sick people, who have a higher probability of dying) >> >> >> >> Have fun on Friday >> >> Greg H >> > > > > -- > Michael M. Minutillo > Indiscriminate Information Sponge > Blog: http://wolfbyte-net.blogspot.com >
Re: KPI's for software developers
On 6/25/10, Greg Harris wrote: > This is going to cause a few mad Friday tangents…. > > If you have ever worked on a sales performance recognition system that > allows for any flexibility beyond the total of who sold how much in dollar > terms when, you will have seen that there quickly starts to be manipulation > of the input data to affect the recognition outcome (rewards). > > e.g. look at all the sales people who are running around just now to meet > their end of financial year goals, where the sales will be quietly credited > back into the system at the beginning of the next financial year! > > If sales people (who have a far lower average IQ) than programmers can > manipulate the system to meet their personal goals, what are programmers > going to do? FWIW, not only is this a pretty offensive comment, it also doesn't logically follow that someone who is "smarter" will be "more dishonest". But it is a fact that any system needs to consider how it can be 'gamed', and to what degree that is expected. That's why, IMHO, the most appropriate one is where the limits can be controlled by management trivially (i.e. time estimates) and the result is directly useful. More code isn't directly useful. Less code isn't directly useful. A project delivered on time *is* directly useful. > But I would also say, if you cannot measure it, you cannot manage it! > > But take care with your stats, statistics show that far more people die in > hospital than in the community as a whole, so if you are sick, you should > avoid going to hospital! WRONG! (for the sales people in the room, the > reason more people die in hospital is because it has a biased population, > sick people, who have a higher probability of dying) > > Have fun on Friday > > Greg H -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
Re: KPI's for software developers
I am never going to a hospital again On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:38 AM, Greg Harris < g...@harrisconsultinggroup.com> wrote: > This is going to cause a few mad Friday tangents…. > > > > If you have ever worked on a sales performance recognition system that > allows for any flexibility beyond the total of who sold how much in dollar > terms when, you will have seen that there quickly starts to be manipulation > of the input data to affect the recognition outcome (rewards). > > > > e.g. look at all the sales people who are running around just now to meet > their end of financial year goals, where the sales will be quietly credited > back into the system at the beginning of the next financial year! > > > > If sales people (who have a far lower average IQ) than programmers can > manipulate the system to meet their personal goals, what are programmers > going to do? > > > > But I would also say, if you cannot measure it, you cannot manage it! > > > > But take care with your stats, statistics show that far more people die in > hospital than in the community as a whole, so if you are sick, you should > avoid going to hospital! WRONG! (for the sales people in the room, the > reason more people die in hospital is because it has a biased population, > sick people, who have a higher probability of dying) > > > > Have fun on Friday > > Greg H > -- Michael M. Minutillo Indiscriminate Information Sponge Blog: http://wolfbyte-net.blogspot.com
Re: KPI's for software developers
This is going to cause a few mad Friday tangents…. If you have ever worked on a sales performance recognition system that allows for any flexibility beyond the total of who sold how much in dollar terms when, you will have seen that there quickly starts to be manipulation of the input data to affect the recognition outcome (rewards). e.g. look at all the sales people who are running around just now to meet their end of financial year goals, where the sales will be quietly credited back into the system at the beginning of the next financial year! If sales people (who have a far lower average IQ) than programmers can manipulate the system to meet their personal goals, what are programmers going to do? But I would also say, if you cannot measure it, you cannot manage it! But take care with your stats, statistics show that far more people die in hospital than in the community as a whole, so if you are sick, you should avoid going to hospital! WRONG! (for the sales people in the room, the reason more people die in hospital is because it has a biased population, sick people, who have a higher probability of dying) Have fun on Friday Greg H
Re: KPI's for software developers
Shouldn't that be LoC * (sodas / bugs)? Otherwise increases in bugs or decreases in sodas is good. Or is this a golf metric? On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Craig van Nieuwkerk wrote: > KPI = LoC * (bugs / sodas) > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:44 AM, David Kean wrote: > >> Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix >> and soda they drink. ;) >> >> >> >> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: >> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Moore >> *Sent:* Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM >> *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com >> *Subject:* KPI's for software developers >> >> >> >> Hi all >> >> >> >> Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that >> measure a software developers performance? >> >> >> >> Kind regards >> >> >> >> >> >> *Richard Moore >> Analyst Programmer* >> >> [image: WSR-Signature.png] >> >> Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 >> Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 >> >> 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 >> Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 >> >> >> > > -- Michael M. Minutillo Indiscriminate Information Sponge Blog: http://wolfbyte-net.blogspot.com <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
On 6/25/10, Tiang Cheng wrote: > I have some pretty awesome KPIs > > > 1) Deliver on project A by Feb > > 2) Deliver on project B by March > > 3) Deliver on project C by May > > 4) Fix all bugs assigned in a timely manner > > From a business perspective, they don't care how many bugs/LoC I create, or > how many youtube videos I watch. As long as the work gets done, I'm > performing. I like this measurement system because it's simple, clear and > easy to know when I'm performing, or when I'm not. Agreed (well, with the general goal of meeting quoted times). The hardest thing about this style is it must account for changes in the projects. But I do agree, it's by far the superior approach. > Tiang -- silky http://www.programmingbranch.com/
Re: KPI's for software developers
KPI = LoC * (bugs / sodas) On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:44 AM, David Kean wrote: > Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix > and soda they drink. ;) > > > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Moore > *Sent:* Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM > *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com > *Subject:* KPI's for software developers > > > > Hi all > > > > Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that > measure a software developers performance? > > > > Kind regards > > > > > > *Richard Moore > Analyst Programmer* > > [image: WSR-Signature.png] > > Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 > Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 > > 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 > Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 > > > <>
RE: KPI's for software developers
I have some pretty awesome KPIs 1) Deliver on project A by Feb 2) Deliver on project B by March 3) Deliver on project C by May 4) Fix all bugs assigned in a timely manner >From a business perspective, they don't care how many bugs/LoC I create, or >how many youtube videos I watch. As long as the work gets done, I'm >performing. I like this measurement system because it's simple, clear and easy >to know when I'm performing, or when I'm not. Tiang From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 8:40 AM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer [cid:image001.gif@01CB144D.F6B9F350] Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
Objective metrics are a PITA because you end up skewing the resulting effort to favor the metric. Here are some with their negative effects lines of code => prefer long code to reusable code. Copy and Paste is a cash-cow # builds broken / some period => don't check in very frequently which results in harder integrations and more rework avg difference between estimate and actuals => pad your estimates out and then make sure it takes that long passing unit tests written=> lots of useless brittle tests bugs found during code review=>code reviews somehow don't get done** ** Actually this metric can be OK if you are rewarding the finder and not punishing the author (although this could lead to a buddy system where one dev leaves in bugs for their mates to find). Just be aware that this works for a while and then the quality of the code goes up and the metric will probably dip back down. What is the intent of collecting the metrics? Is it for a standalone performance evaluation or a long-running improvement monitoring thing? Is there a concern to be addressed? Or is it just Friday? On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 9:28 AM, Eddie de Bear wrote: > lol, one of the places I worked (years ago) that happened. I didn't write > the code, but I was told to run it through an obfuscator before the code was > handed over. The main reason was to strip out all the comments AND nasty > variable names.. > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:18 AM, David Richards < > ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com> wrote: > >> Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you >> have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. >> Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) >> >> David >> >> "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes >> will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" >> -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama >> >> >> On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear wrote: >> >>> Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a >>> good way to go ;) >>> >>> >> > > > -- > Eddie de Bear > Mob: 0417066315 > Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com > Skype: eddiedebear > -- Michael M. Minutillo Indiscriminate Information Sponge Blog: http://wolfbyte-net.blogspot.com
Re: KPI's for software developers
I was working remotely for 18months or so. (Perth to Qld) Boss seemed pretty happy with me and I only showed up a couple of times. :) You could change that to: Checks code in - Good. Doesn't check anything in - Bad On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 9:49 AM, Heinrich Breedt wrote: > they show up work - good > they dont show up for work - not good > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:28 AM, Eddie de Bear wrote: > >> lol, one of the places I worked (years ago) that happened. I didn't write >> the code, but I was told to run it through an obfuscator before the code was >> handed over. The main reason was to strip out all the comments AND nasty >> variable names.. >> >> On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:18 AM, David Richards < >> ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com> wrote: >> >>> Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you >>> have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. >>> Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) >>> >>> David >>> >>> "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes >>> will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" >>> -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear >>> wrote: >>> Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a good way to go ;) >>> >> >> >> -- >> Eddie de Bear >> Mob: 0417066315 >> Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com >> Skype: eddiedebear >> > > > > -- > Heinrich Breedt > > “Do not wait to strike till the iron is hot; but make it hot by striking.” > - William B. Sprague >
Re: KPI's for software developers
they show up work - good they dont show up for work - not good On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:28 AM, Eddie de Bear wrote: > lol, one of the places I worked (years ago) that happened. I didn't write > the code, but I was told to run it through an obfuscator before the code was > handed over. The main reason was to strip out all the comments AND nasty > variable names.. > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:18 AM, David Richards < > ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com> wrote: > >> Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you >> have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. >> Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) >> >> David >> >> "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes >> will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" >> -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama >> >> >> On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear wrote: >> >>> Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a >>> good way to go ;) >>> >>> >> > > > -- > Eddie de Bear > Mob: 0417066315 > Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com > Skype: eddiedebear > -- Heinrich Breedt “Do not wait to strike till the iron is hot; but make it hot by striking.” - William B. Sprague
Re: KPI's for software developers
lol, one of the places I worked (years ago) that happened. I didn't write the code, but I was told to run it through an obfuscator before the code was handed over. The main reason was to strip out all the comments AND nasty variable names.. On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:18 AM, David Richards < ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com> wrote: > Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you > have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. > Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) > > David > > "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes > will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" > -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama > > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear wrote: > >> Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a >> good way to go ;) >> >> > -- Eddie de Bear Mob: 0417066315 Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com Skype: eddiedebear
Re: KPI's for software developers
Until you later find out the client also bought the source code and you have to give it to them. I've had this happen with a couple of projects. Fortunately, I'm a polite commentor. :) David "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!" -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:11, Eddie de Bear wrote: > Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a > good way to go ;) > >
Re: KPI's for software developers
Ratio of Code to Coments complaining about the client.. That's always a good way to go ;) On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:55 AM, Richard Moore < richard.mo...@worldsmartretail.com.au> wrote: > I assume that was a bit tongue in cheek, and I prefer coffee to soda!! > > > > They are all good points that have been raised but we don’t work in a > closed system where those numbers across developers are equal. > > > > IMHO development is as just as much “art” as it is science so how do you > objectively measure art? > > > > There are plenty of subjective measures but what about objective ones? > > > > > > *From:* Stephen Price [mailto:step...@littlevoices.com] > *Sent:* Friday, 25 June 2010 10:51 AM > *To:* ozDotNet > *Subject:* Re: KPI's for software developers > > > > So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures > himself on lines deleted. :) > > No name, but I think its a great idea! > > On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean > wrote: > > Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and > soda they drink. ;) > > > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Moore > *Sent:* Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM > *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com > *Subject:* KPI's for software developers > > > > Hi all > > > > Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that > measure a software developers performance? > > > > Kind regards > > > > > > *Richard Moore > Analyst Programmer* > > [image: WSR-Signature.png] > > Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 > Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 > > 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 > Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 > > > > > -- Eddie de Bear Mob: 0417066315 Messenger: eddie_deb...@hotmail.com Skype: eddiedebear <>
RE: KPI's for software developers
I assume that was a bit tongue in cheek, and I prefer coffee to soda!! They are all good points that have been raised but we don't work in a closed system where those numbers across developers are equal. IMHO development is as just as much "art" as it is science so how do you objectively measure art? There are plenty of subjective measures but what about objective ones? From: Stephen Price [mailto:step...@littlevoices.com] Sent: Friday, 25 June 2010 10:51 AM To: ozDotNet Subject: Re: KPI's for software developers So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures himself on lines deleted. :) No name, but I think its a great idea! On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean wrote: Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;) From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
So what about the people who delete code? I know someone who measures himself on lines deleted. :) No name, but I think its a great idea! On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:44 AM, David Kean wrote: > Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix > and soda they drink. ;) > > > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Richard Moore > *Sent:* Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM > *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com > *Subject:* KPI's for software developers > > > > Hi all > > > > Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that > measure a software developers performance? > > > > Kind regards > > > > > > *Richard Moore > Analyst Programmer* > > [image: WSR-Signature.png] > > Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 > Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 > > 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 > Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 > > > <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
It is very difficult to quantify programmer performance because no 2 jobs and no 2 clients are the same. More code doesn't always mean better quality code. Counting numbers of bugs is open to manipulation and a high number of bugs is not always the developers fault. As a general guide if we look at things like adherence to company standards and practices, client satisfaction, and the number of avoidable errors, though there's nothing formal in place. On 25 June 2010 10:40, Richard Moore wrote: > Hi all > > > > Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that > measure a software developers performance? > > > > Kind regards > > > > > > *Richard Moore > Analyst Programmer* > > [image: WSR-Signature.png] > > Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 > Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 > > 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 > Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 > > > <>
Re: KPI's for software developers
WTF's/Minute is a good measure. Sorry it's Friday. Ok ok, some serious things that could be measured would be lines of code/bugs covered in code inspections. MS exams passed. Unit tests written, percentage code covered. If there are bugs/defects, then the number of those fixed. If working agile then, number of tasks completed. It probably has to be something they are already doing now, that can be measured. No point in measuring their performance on something they are not doing (even if its something you'd like them to do). I've never liked KPI's mainly because I feel like I'm being judged and assessed. (which you are). Often a good idea to ask the person/people being measured what they think their KPI's should be. You then get a view of what they think they do in their jobs. cheers, Stephen On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:40 AM, Richard Moore < richard.mo...@worldsmartretail.com.au> wrote: > Hi all > > > > Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that > measure a software developers performance? > > > > Kind regards > > > > > > *Richard Moore > Analyst Programmer* > > [image: WSR-Signature.png] > > Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 > Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 > > 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 > Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 > > > <>
RE: KPI's for software developers
Definitely track it by the amount of code that write, the bugs they fix and soda they drink. ;) From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On Behalf Of Richard Moore Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 5:40 PM To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com Subject: KPI's for software developers Hi all Does anyone have any good useful key performance indicators (KPI) that measure a software developers performance? Kind regards Richard Moore Analyst Programmer [WSR-Signature.png] Ph: +61 7 3340 2500 Fx: +61 7 3340 2550 23 Hi-Tech Court, Eight Mile Plains, Qld 4113 Locked Bag 38, Acacia Ridge, Qld 4110 <>
