Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
2009/7/29 Ralf R. Radermacher fotor...@gmx.de: After using a K10D for a few years I find that the colours I'm getting from my new K-7 are a trifle odd, to put it mildly. Particularly my sky colours now look like 1950's bathroom tiles. Some awful cyanish cast that I have only had with the K10D in severely overexposed shots. Grey sky comes out with a distinct blueish cast. I'm shooting RAW and talking about what I get to see when I open the RAW files in Lightroom, with the same settings and exactly the same way I've done with my K10D files before. The camera is set to AWB, just like the K10D, as well. Colours space in both cases is Adobe RGB. Any suggestions? If you're capturing RAW format, whether DNG or PEF, color space setting in the camera is irrelevant. The issue is a camera calibration issue. Nothing to do with the technology of the sensor, or everything depending upon how you want to look at it.. but the difference between CMOS and CCD is not relevant. The issue is that Lightroom does not have any calibration tables for the K7 as yet, AFAIK. So the thing to do is get the DNG Profile Editor, shoot a couple of controlled tests with a Macbeth Color Checker or equivalent, and create a good calibration profile for it. Install that as the default to use when processing K7 RAW files and your colors should be accurate. -- Godfrey www.gdgphoto.com www.flickr.com/photos/gdgphoto www.twitter.com/godfreydigiorgi -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
On Jul 30, 2009, at 10:26, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: The issue is that Lightroom does not have any calibration tables for the K7 as yet, AFAIK. So the thing to do is get the DNG Profile Editor, shoot a couple of controlled tests with a Macbeth Color Checker or equivalent, and create a good calibration profile for it. Install that as the default to use when processing K7 RAW files and your colors should be accurate. That's a big 10-4.. the RAW files I shot with the k7 last night look HORRIBLE in Lightroom at the moment. Very bright, and a severe magenta shift. It figures that with something brand-new that it's not all sorted out in Adobe-land yet. Patience -Charles -- Charles Robinson - charl...@visi.com Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
Adobe has worked out K7 specs for PSCS4 ACR. RAW images open nicely in that converter. Paul On Jul 30, 2009, at 12:33 PM, Charles Robinson wrote: On Jul 30, 2009, at 10:26, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: The issue is that Lightroom does not have any calibration tables for the K7 as yet, AFAIK. So the thing to do is get the DNG Profile Editor, shoot a couple of controlled tests with a Macbeth Color Checker or equivalent, and create a good calibration profile for it. Install that as the default to use when processing K7 RAW files and your colors should be accurate. That's a big 10-4.. the RAW files I shot with the k7 last night look HORRIBLE in Lightroom at the moment. Very bright, and a severe magenta shift. It figures that with something brand-new that it's not all sorted out in Adobe-land yet. Patience -Charles -- Charles Robinson - charl...@visi.com Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
On Jul 30, 2009, at 1:22 PM, paul stenquist wrote: Adobe has worked out K7 specs for PSCS4 ACR. RAW images open nicely in that converter. Paul Lightroom 2.4 lists support for the K-7. Out of curiosity, is this the version used that renders the K-7 RAW files so poorly? On Jul 30, 2009, at 12:33 PM, Charles Robinson wrote: On Jul 30, 2009, at 10:26, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: The issue is that Lightroom does not have any calibration tables for the K7 as yet, AFAIK. So the thing to do is get the DNG Profile Editor, shoot a couple of controlled tests with a Macbeth Color Checker or equivalent, and create a good calibration profile for it. Install that as the default to use when processing K7 RAW files and your colors should be accurate. That's a big 10-4.. the RAW files I shot with the k7 last night look HORRIBLE in Lightroom at the moment. Very bright, and a severe magenta shift. It figures that with something brand-new that it's not all sorted out in Adobe-land yet. Patience -- Matthew Montgomery matt...@electricjunk.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
Matthew Montgomery matt...@electricjunk.com wrote: Lightroom 2.4 lists support for the K-7. Out of curiosity, is this the version used that renders the K-7 RAW files so poorly? Quite so. Here at least. Ralf -- Ralf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany Blog : http://the-real-fotoralf.blogspot.com Audio : http://aporee.org/maps/projects/fotoralf Web : http://www.fotoralf.de -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
On Jul 30, 2009, at 13:32, Matthew Montgomery wrote: On Jul 30, 2009, at 1:22 PM, paul stenquist wrote: Adobe has worked out K7 specs for PSCS4 ACR. RAW images open nicely in that converter. Paul Lightroom 2.4 lists support for the K-7. Out of curiosity, is this the version used that renders the K-7 RAW files so poorly? That's my experience, yes. I'm at 2.4. -Charles -- Charles Robinson - charl...@visi.com Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
- Original Message - From: Charles Robinson Subject: Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours? On Jul 30, 2009, at 13:32, Matthew Montgomery wrote: On Jul 30, 2009, at 1:22 PM, paul stenquist wrote: Adobe has worked out K7 specs for PSCS4 ACR. RAW images open nicely in that converter. Paul Lightroom 2.4 lists support for the K-7. Out of curiosity, is this the version used that renders the K-7 RAW files so poorly? That's my experience, yes. I'm at 2.4. I'm running 2.4 also. My K7 DNGs are perhaps a tad warmer than those from my K20, but it certainly isn't objectionable. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
William Robb war...@gmail.com wrote: I'm running 2.4 also. My K7 DNGs are perhaps a tad warmer than those from my K20, but it certainly isn't objectionable. Any tendency of blue skies veering towards cyan? This is my main prob. Difference between Lightroom 2.4 for Mac and Windows? Mac Dual G5 under 10.5.7 here. Ralf -- Ralf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany Blog : http://the-real-fotoralf.blogspot.com Audio : http://aporee.org/maps/projects/fotoralf Web : http://www.fotoralf.de -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
- Original Message - From: Ralf R. Radermacher Subject: Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours? Any tendency of blue skies veering towards cyan? This is my main prob. Difference between Lightroom 2.4 for Mac and Windows? Mac Dual G5 under 10.5.7 here. I'll have to check that for you. I won't be able to do so until later. I haven't shot anything yet with enough sky to tell me. I'm running Windows XP Pro, so there could very well be a difference between the two programs. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 1:38 PM, William Robbwar...@gmail.com wrote: Any tendency of blue skies veering towards cyan? This is my main prob. Difference between Lightroom 2.4 for Mac and Windows? Mac Dual G5 under 10.5.7 here. I'll have to check that for you. I won't be able to do so until later. I haven't shot anything yet with enough sky to tell me. I'm running Windows XP Pro, so there could very well be a difference between the two programs. Good to hear that LR 2.4 is supporting the K7 already ... I haven't been following it specifically on that count. It would also be interesting to hear if there are differences in the calibrations with out of the camera DNG vs PEF files too. In the end, however, pick up the DNG Profile Editor and create a calibration file that you like, set it up as the default, and you should be good to go. This is an amazingly powerful capability. -- Godfrey www.gdgphoto.com www.flickr.com/photos/gdgphoto www.twitter.com/godfreydigiorgi -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
Ralf, I'm not having any problems with Lightroom 2.4, but I installed the 2.3 to 2.4 upgrade at the same time I got the K-7. My recollection is that Adobe had me install the same fix as Paul S is using for PSCS4 ACR and RAW images. Hope this helps. Regards, Bob S. On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 1:22 PM, paul stenquistpnstenqu...@comcast.net wrote: Adobe has worked out K7 specs for PSCS4 ACR. RAW images open nicely in that converter. Paul On Jul 30, 2009, at 12:33 PM, Charles Robinson wrote: On Jul 30, 2009, at 10:26, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: The issue is that Lightroom does not have any calibration tables for the K7 as yet, AFAIK. So the thing to do is get the DNG Profile Editor, shoot a couple of controlled tests with a Macbeth Color Checker or equivalent, and create a good calibration profile for it. Install that as the default to use when processing K7 RAW files and your colors should be accurate. That's a big 10-4.. the RAW files I shot with the k7 last night look HORRIBLE in Lightroom at the moment. Very bright, and a severe magenta shift. It figures that with something brand-new that it's not all sorted out in Adobe-land yet. Patience -Charles -- Charles Robinson - charl...@visi.com Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
More specifically, Adobe recommended installing an update to get Photoshop Elements 7.0 to recognize K-7 DNG's. I'm running PS Elements 5.0 but did the upgrade anyway. Colors are fine in both Lightroom 2.4 and Elements 5.0 on my Windows machine. Regards, Bob S. On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 11:19 PM, Bob Sullivanrf.sulli...@gmail.com wrote: Ralf, I'm not having any problems with Lightroom 2.4, but I installed the 2.3 to 2.4 upgrade at the same time I got the K-7. My recollection is that Adobe had me install the same fix as Paul S is using for PSCS4 ACR and RAW images. Hope this helps. Regards, Bob S. On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 1:22 PM, paul stenquistpnstenqu...@comcast.net wrote: Adobe has worked out K7 specs for PSCS4 ACR. RAW images open nicely in that converter. Paul On Jul 30, 2009, at 12:33 PM, Charles Robinson wrote: On Jul 30, 2009, at 10:26, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: The issue is that Lightroom does not have any calibration tables for the K7 as yet, AFAIK. So the thing to do is get the DNG Profile Editor, shoot a couple of controlled tests with a Macbeth Color Checker or equivalent, and create a good calibration profile for it. Install that as the default to use when processing K7 RAW files and your colors should be accurate. That's a big 10-4.. the RAW files I shot with the k7 last night look HORRIBLE in Lightroom at the moment. Very bright, and a severe magenta shift. It figures that with something brand-new that it's not all sorted out in Adobe-land yet. Patience -Charles -- Charles Robinson - charl...@visi.com Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
CMOS vs. CCD colours?
After using a K10D for a few years I find that the colours I'm getting from my new K-7 are a trifle odd, to put it mildly. Particularly my sky colours now look like 1950's bathroom tiles. Some awful cyanish cast that I have only had with the K10D in severely overexposed shots. Grey sky comes out with a distinct blueish cast. I'm shooting RAW and talking about what I get to see when I open the RAW files in Lightroom, with the same settings and exactly the same way I've done with my K10D files before. The camera is set to AWB, just like the K10D, as well. Colours space in both cases is Adobe RGB. Any suggestions? Ralf -- Ralf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany Blog : http://the-real-fotoralf.blogspot.com Audio : http://aporee.org/maps/projects/fotoralf Web : http://www.fotoralf.de -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 07:50:54PM +0200, Ralf R. Radermacher scripsit: [sky looks like bathroom tile] The camera is set to AWB, just like the K10D, as well. Colours space in both cases is Adobe RGB. The times I've seen something like that have been the white balance being set to tungsten in the processing software when it was an open shade outdoor shot; switching off of tungsten to the camera white balance setting fixed it. 'd be looking to make sure that the K7 was known to the software *and* that the exposure setting was defaulting to automatic, so that the camera exposure and white balance are being used, rather than some set of values being remembered from last time. -- Graydon -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
2009/7/29 Ralf R. Radermacher fotor...@gmx.de: After using a K10D for a few years I find that the colours I'm getting from my new K-7 are a trifle odd, to put it mildly. Particularly my sky colours now look like 1950's bathroom tiles. Some awful cyanish cast that I have only had with the K10D in severely overexposed shots. Grey sky comes out with a distinct blueish cast. I didn't think that LightRoom had support for K-7 RAW files yet. This sounds like exactly what happened when I tried my K20D RAWs before the LR support was there. Once they had it, everything worked fine. -Tim -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
Ralf R. Radermacher wrote: After using a K10D for a few years I find that the colours I'm getting from my new K-7 are a trifle odd, to put it mildly. Particularly my sky colours now look like 1950's bathroom tiles. Some awful cyanish cast that I have only had with the K10D in severely overexposed shots. Grey sky comes out with a distinct blueish cast. I'm shooting RAW and talking about what I get to see when I open the RAW files in Lightroom, with the same settings and exactly the same way I've done with my K10D files before. The camera is set to AWB, just like the K10D, as well. Colours space in both cases is Adobe RGB. Any suggestions? Ralf I'd suggest playing with camera profiles and calibration in ACR http://is.gd/1T4g9 I tweaked the settings for my K100Ds and got better noise performance and what I thought were better colours (a little less magenta, I think). -bmw -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
Ralf, Do you shoot PEF? If you do, maybe it's worth an exposure to test if DNG is any different, just to test if the software has got the file format wrong. Notice also that Pentax has sometimes been criticised for producing a magenta cast in low colour temp settings, and with the K-7 there's a menu option to turn this on or off. That may make a difference for your nightscapes, at least. I'm sorry I don't have the K-7 close by right now. I suspect you'll be able to dig out the exact number of that setting before I do. Jostein 2009/7/29 Ralf R. Radermacher fotor...@gmx.de: After using a K10D for a few years I find that the colours I'm getting from my new K-7 are a trifle odd, to put it mildly. Particularly my sky colours now look like 1950's bathroom tiles. Some awful cyanish cast that I have only had with the K10D in severely overexposed shots. Grey sky comes out with a distinct blueish cast. I'm shooting RAW and talking about what I get to see when I open the RAW files in Lightroom, with the same settings and exactly the same way I've done with my K10D files before. The camera is set to AWB, just like the K10D, as well. Colours space in both cases is Adobe RGB. Any suggestions? Ralf -- Ralf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany Blog : http://the-real-fotoralf.blogspot.com Audio : http://aporee.org/maps/projects/fotoralf Web : http://www.fotoralf.de -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- http://www.alunfoto.no/galleri/ http://alunfoto.blogspot.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
AlunFoto alunf...@gmail.com wrote: Do you shoot PEF? No, it's DNG in both cases and the WB in Lightroom is set to as shot. Notice also that Pentax has sometimes been criticised for producing a magenta cast in low colour temp settings, and with the K-7 there's a menu option to turn this on or off. That may make a difference for your nightscapes, at least. My current troubles are mostly with normal sunlit skies. The lighting situatiuons in my nightshots are usually far too complex to be corrected by a simple colour temp adjustment. I'm sorry I don't have the K-7 close by right now. I suspect you'll be able to dig out the exact number of that setting before I do. My suspicions went rather in the direction of CCD vs. CMOS behaviour. I had a K20D for two weeks, just before I got the K-7, and I had similar troubles getting the sky to look right. Ralf -- Ralf R. Radermacher - DL9KCG - Köln/Cologne, Germany Blog : http://the-real-fotoralf.blogspot.com Audio : http://aporee.org/maps/projects/fotoralf Web : http://www.fotoralf.de -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
PSCS4 supports K7 RAW files, and they open looking very normal and nice in that software's ACR converter. The k7 files generally don't require as much tweaking as did those from the K20D, although that's primarily the result of more predictable exposure. Paul On Jul 29, 2009, at 2:59 PM, Tim Bray wrote: 2009/7/29 Ralf R. Radermacher fotor...@gmx.de: After using a K10D for a few years I find that the colours I'm getting from my new K-7 are a trifle odd, to put it mildly. Particularly my sky colours now look like 1950's bathroom tiles. Some awful cyanish cast that I have only had with the K10D in severely overexposed shots. Grey sky comes out with a distinct blueish cast. I didn't think that LightRoom had support for K-7 RAW files yet. This sounds like exactly what happened when I tried my K20D RAWs before the LR support was there. Once they had it, everything worked fine. -Tim -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: CMOS vs. CCD colours?
What happens if you shoot a greycard and color balance in PS? -- The first step is learning to take great photos, the second step is learning to throw away ones that are merely good. Larry Colen l...@red4est.comhttp://www.red4est.com/lrc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
