Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 03:21:43PM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from Qmail > has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. Are you talking about the Received: or the Date: header? Greetz, Peter.
Re: Qmail and time zone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from Qmail > has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often crosses timezone boundaries, and having the received headers *all* use GMT would make it much easier to follow. The timezone information is only available in rather system-dependent ways through the standard C library, and Dan has chosen to completely avoid the standard C library for security and performance reasons. -- David Dyer-Bennet / Welcome to the future! / [EMAIL PROTECTED] SF: http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ Minicon: http://www.mnstf.org/minicon/ Photos: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 03:57:32PM -0600, David Dyer-Bennet mumbled: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > > > How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > > messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from Qmail > > has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. > > Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but > it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often Actually that's not quit true. On my OpenBSD system I set my timezone in the kernel configuration. If you look in the headers of this mail you will see I have GMT+1 (MET). Not sure how, if possible, you set the timezone with a "hard" value on a Linux system. /Martin
Re: Qmail and time zone
Aargh! Nevermind, I just realized why I did set a hardvalue in the kernel config. I did this so that qmail would show the time as GMT and not MET ie. qmail used the MET time which is GMT+1 but it still wrote it as -. When setting a hard value of -60 in the kernel the error was fixed. Sorry about confusing things a bit... /M On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 11:44:50PM +0100, Martin Akesson mumbled: > On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 03:57:32PM -0600, David Dyer-Bennet mumbled: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > > > > > How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > > > messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from Qmail > > > has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. > > > > Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but > > it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often > > Actually that's not quit true. On my OpenBSD system I set my timezone > in the kernel configuration. If you look in the headers of this mail > you will see I have GMT+1 (MET). > > Not sure how, if possible, you set the timezone with a "hard" value on a > Linux system. > > /Martin
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 11:44:50PM +0100, Martin Akesson wrote: [snip] > > Actually that's not quit true. On my OpenBSD system I set my timezone > in the kernel configuration. If you look in the headers of this mail > you will see I have GMT+1 (MET). That's not the kernel configuration. And you are confusing stuff: the Date header can very well be in your own timezone. Any machine writing Received headers in something not GMT is confused, however. Any user requesting so is confused, too. > Not sure how, if possible, you set the timezone with a "hard" value on a > Linux system. Same as on OpenBSD. It's in the libc. Greetz, Peter.
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 05:08:43PM -0500, Kari Suomela mumbled: > DB> Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but > DB> it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often > DB> crosses timezone boundaries, and having the received headers *all* > DB> use > > This is very annoying! I've spent lots of time training the users to > configure their clients properly, and now my qmail server sends out > garbage, which defeats the purpose. :( > I dont see where the problem is. The client can only set the 'Date:' headers anyway. The 'Received:' headers on the other hand are set by the MDA and should all use the same timezone, GMT. The users will never see these headers anyway and most ISPs will only be happy with this configuration, atleast I know I would be. /M
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 05:08:43PM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > > Thursday March 01 2001 15:57, David Dyer-Bennet wrote to All: > > > >> How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > >> messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from > >> Qmail has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. > > DB> Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but > DB> it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often > DB> crosses timezone boundaries, and having the received headers *all* > DB> use > > This is very annoying! I've spent lots of time training the users to > configure their clients properly, and now my qmail server sends out > garbage, which defeats the purpose. :( > You have users who read Recieved: headers regularly? Why? At any rate, it really ticks me off when SMTP servers use local timezone values in Recieved: headers -- try tracing a message that got to you from Finland across a good five or six servers that _all_ use local timezones, doing the GMT math by hand, to see how long the message took to get to you. No fscking fun at _all_. Using GMT in Recieved: headers means that it's _very_ easy to find out exactly how long it took to get to you, and where any delays might have been (and what else is the date in the Recieved: header for?). Doing the simple math to convert it all to your local timezone should be trivial, you only need to do it once. > DB> The timezone information is only available in rather > DB> system-dependent > DB> ways through the standard C library, and Dan has chosen to > DB> completely > DB> avoid the standard C library for security and performance reasons. > > Whatever that means. Sendmail is doing it ok, so it can't be that hard > to implement. > > KS > > I imagine that it's trickier than you think if you're avoiding standard C libraries, and most sysadmins (which is who I thought Recieved: headers were for) seem to prefer GMT anyway Is your problem actually with the Recieved: headers, or 'Date:'? -- Greg White Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable. -- John F. Kennedy
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, 01 Mar 2001 17:08:43 EST, wrote: > This is very annoying! I've spent lots of time training the users to > configure their clients properly, and now my qmail server sends out > garbage, which defeats the purpose. :( What did you train your users to do? They should be putting in a correct Date header with the right timezone information---if they aren't retrain them. Most users won't ever look at the rest of the headers such as Received and it is more appropriate that they are in UTC/GMT. Andy
Re: Qmail and time zone
Martin Akesson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes on 1 March 2001 at 23:44:50 +0100 > On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 03:57:32PM -0600, David Dyer-Bennet mumbled: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > > > > > How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > > > messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from Qmail > > > has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. > > > > Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but > > it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often > > Actually that's not quit true. On my OpenBSD system I set my timezone > in the kernel configuration. If you look in the headers of this mail > you will see I have GMT+1 (MET). > > Not sure how, if possible, you set the timezone with a "hard" value on a > Linux system. The date line is zone +1, but the received line is zone 0, which is exactly what I'd expect (the date line being put in by the MUA, not qmail). Just like in my headers (except it's be -6 here). -- David Dyer-Bennet / Welcome to the future! / [EMAIL PROTECTED] SF: http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ Minicon: http://www.mnstf.org/minicon/ Photos: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/
Re: Qmail and time zone
Kari Suomela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from Qmail > has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. In Received: headers? - is the proper time zone. In the Date: field? Have your MUA insert the date field. qmail won't touch it then. BTW, it's "qmail", not "Qmail". Charles -- --- Charles Cazabon<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> GPL'ed software available at: http://www.qcc.sk.ca/~charlesc/software/ Any opinions expressed are just that -- my opinions. ---
RE: Qmail and time zone
What are you using to send these test messages? > MA> I dont see where the problem is. The client can only set the > MA> 'Date:' > MA> headers anyway. The 'Received:' headers on the other hand are set > MA> by > > So, pls explain this, and tell me, how I can get the received messages > to display the correct time: > > 1. Message from a qmail server: ... > Sendmail inserts the correct TZ on the "Date" line, but qmail does not! > > KS
Re: Qmail and time zone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > Thursday March 01 2001 15:57, David Dyer-Bennet wrote to All: > > > >> How do I get Qmail to include the proper time zone info in the > >> messages? My sendmail machines have it, but anything coming from > >> Qmail has -. The machines are otherwise identical RH 7.0 boxes. > > DB> Basically, you won't. Qmail is putting in the time correctly, but > DB> it's stating it in GMT. This is actually more useful; mail often > DB> crosses timezone boundaries, and having the received headers *all* > DB> use > > This is very annoying! I've spent lots of time training the users to > configure their clients properly, and now my qmail server sends out > garbage, which defeats the purpose. :( It's not garbage; it's correct. It just doesn't use the local timezone. In the list of received headers, where a message often passes through servers in different timezones, having everything in GMT is *more* useful IMHO. > DB> The timezone information is only available in rather > DB> system-dependent > DB> ways through the standard C library, and Dan has chosen to > DB> completely > DB> avoid the standard C library for security and performance reasons. > > Whatever that means. Sendmail is doing it ok, so it can't be that hard > to implement. It means that it would either compromise the security of qmail, or else require lots of extra code to handle various systems local conventions, to change this behavior. It's not hard to do; it IS hard to do *well*. -- David Dyer-Bennet / Welcome to the future! / [EMAIL PROTECTED] SF: http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ Minicon: http://www.mnstf.org/minicon/ Photos: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/
Re: Qmail and time zone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > Thursday March 01 2001 19:23, Chris Bolt wrote to All: > > > CB> What are you using to send these test messages? > > These examples were both sent by: > > 'last kari | mail ' > > It'll be different, if I use a client, which inserts the time zone. > Exactly. For that matter, it'd be different if you viewed the messages through a client that displayed times in headers in current timezone, too. -- David Dyer-Bennet / Welcome to the future! / [EMAIL PROTECTED] SF: http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ Minicon: http://www.mnstf.org/minicon/ Photos: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/
Re: Qmail and time zone
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kari Suomela) writes: > Thursday March 01 2001 21:08, David Dyer-Bennet wrote to All: > > >> It'll be different, if I use a client, which inserts the time zone. > >> > > DB> Exactly. For that matter, it'd be different if you viewed the > DB> messages through a client that displayed times in headers in > DB> current > DB> timezone, too. > > No, it's not! That's how I noticed it. Someone was blaming my client > for it, but the problem is the same with all of them. I have tested it > with various Netscapes, Outlook 98, Outlook 2000, Outlook Express, > PMMail Pro 2000, Sqwebmail and Adjewebmail. That's because you didn't use a client which adjusts header timestamps, though. -- David Dyer-Bennet / Welcome to the future! / [EMAIL PROTECTED] SF: http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/ Minicon: http://www.mnstf.org/minicon/ Photos: http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Thu, Mar 01, 2001 at 09:43:07PM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > These examples were both sent by: > > 'last kari | mail ' I don't know about RedHat but I have added the following line in /etc/mail.rc of my non-RedHat linux system: set sendmail=/var/qmail/bin/datemail It's explained in /var/qmail/doc/FAQ, paragraph 6.1.
Re: Qmail and time zone
Kari Suomela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>> It'll be different, if I use a client, which inserts the time zone. > >> Exactly. For that matter, it'd be different if you viewed the messages >> through a client that displayed times in headers in current timezone, too. > > No, it's not! That's how I noticed it. Someone was blaming my client for it, > but the problem is the same with all of them. I have tested it with various > Netscapes, Outlook 98, Outlook 2000, Outlook Express, PMMail Pro 2000, > Sqwebmail and Adjewebmail. All those clients are broken, then. A non-broken client will translate timestamps in the headers of a message to local time if you configure it that way. And no, the idea that all the major proprietary MUAs are simultaneously broken is not farfetched. Not by a long shot. Charles -- --- Charles Cazabon<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> GPL'ed software available at: http://www.qcc.sk.ca/~charlesc/software/ Any opinions expressed are just that -- my opinions. ---
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Sat, Mar 03, 2001 at 11:28:30PM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > > Thursday March 01 2001 22:41, David Dyer-Bennet wrote to All: > > >> No, it's not! That's how I noticed it. Someone was blaming my > > client > >> for it, but the problem is the same with all of them. I have tested > >> it with various Netscapes, Outlook 98, Outlook 2000, Outlook > >> Express, PMMail Pro 2000, Sqwebmail and Adjewebmail. > > DB> That's because you didn't use a client which adjusts header > DB> timestamps, though. > > I am not talking about clients! Mail generated on a qmail server > doesn't have proper date headers, whereas mail coming from a sendmail > server does. Er, what do you mean by "proper date headers" and how are you sure you definition of "proper date headers" isn't being met by qmail? I suspect what is happening is that qmail is creating Date: headers that are UTC based and you are used to seeing Date: headers in your local time zone. Are you sure that what qmail is doing is incorrect or is it's possible that it's legal according to the standards, but just that it's different from what you want? If it's legal according to the standards, but differs from what you expect, what's your problem exactly? As others have said, qmail only puts a Date: header in if one isn't already present, so you can easily override the default by using a program that puts in a Date: field. Regards.
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Sun, Mar 04, 2001 at 05:36:17AM +, Mark Delany wrote: > On Sat, Mar 03, 2001 at 11:28:30PM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > > > > Thursday March 01 2001 22:41, David Dyer-Bennet wrote to All: > > > > >> No, it's not! That's how I noticed it. Someone was blaming my > > > client > > >> for it, but the problem is the same with all of them. I have tested > > >> it with various Netscapes, Outlook 98, Outlook 2000, Outlook > > >> Express, PMMail Pro 2000, Sqwebmail and Adjewebmail. > > > > DB> That's because you didn't use a client which adjusts header > > DB> timestamps, though. > > > > I am not talking about clients! Mail generated on a qmail server > > doesn't have proper date headers, whereas mail coming from a sendmail > > server does. > > Er, what do you mean by "proper date headers" and how are you sure you > definition of "proper date headers" isn't being met by qmail? > > I suspect what is happening is that qmail is creating Date: headers > that are UTC based and you are used to seeing Date: headers in your > local time zone. Are you sure that what qmail is doing is incorrect or > is it's possible that it's legal according to the standards, but just > that it's different from what you want? And if it puts the Date header in your local time, what happens when you send mail to someone on the other side of the planet, or, for that matter, in the next time zone? Chris PGP signature
Re: Qmail and time zone
I tried to "fix" this once, succeeded, then decided it was Not A Good Thing, and changed it back. IIRC, some amount of fiddling with the hardware clock and the time zone settings in the OS (Linux here) resulted in "correct" timestamps on mail as well as correct timstamps elsewhere. I think I just said I was in Grenwich. It seems to me that there are standards, damn standards, and The Way Things Are. Email I get from diverse global origins (eg, this list) NEVER sorts properly on the actual UTC transmission time due to the variety ways dates are stamped on messages by assorted MUAs/MTAs. my $0.02 --Pete > On Sun, Mar 04, 2001 at 05:36:17AM +, Mark Delany wrote: > > On Sat, Mar 03, 2001 at 11:28:30PM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > > > > > > Thursday March 01 2001 22:41, David Dyer-Bennet wrote to All: > > > > > > >> No, it's not! That's how I noticed it. Someone was blaming my > > > > client > > > >> for it, but the problem is the same with all of them. I have tested > > > >> it with various Netscapes, Outlook 98, Outlook 2000, Outlook > > > >> Express, PMMail Pro 2000, Sqwebmail and Adjewebmail. > > > > > > DB> That's because you didn't use a client which adjusts header > > > DB> timestamps, though. > > > > > > I am not talking about clients! Mail generated on a qmail server > > > doesn't have proper date headers, whereas mail coming from a sendmail > > > server does. > > > > Er, what do you mean by "proper date headers" and how are you sure you > > definition of "proper date headers" isn't being met by qmail? > > > > I suspect what is happening is that qmail is creating Date: headers > > that are UTC based and you are used to seeing Date: headers in your > > local time zone. Are you sure that what qmail is doing is incorrect or > > is it's possible that it's legal according to the standards, but just > > that it's different from what you want? > > And if it puts the Date header in your local time, what happens when you send > mail to someone on the other side of the planet, or, for that matter, in the > next time zone? > > Chris >
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Sun, Mar 04, 2001 at 09:43:28AM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > > MD> As others have said, qmail only puts a Date: header in if one > MD> isn't > MD> already present, > > That's probably what it should be doing, except it's not doing it > right. The Date header should include the TZ, i.e. GMT offset. Why do you keep saying this? Where does it say that the Date header should be in your local time zone? Why would it be better if it were? Chris PGP signature
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Sun, Mar 04, 2001 at 09:43:28AM -0500, Kari Suomela wrote: > > Sunday March 04 2001 05:36, Mark Delany wrote to Kari Suomela: > > > MD> As others have said, qmail only puts a Date: header in if one > MD> isn't > MD> already present, > > That's probably what it should be doing, except it's not doing it > right. According to which particular standard? > The Date header should include the TZ, i.e. GMT offset. According to which particular standard? Btw. Personal preference does not count as a standard. Regards.
RE: Qmail and time zone
>From Kari's header: > Received: (qmail 1259 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2001 05:15:11 - > Received: from kb2.ksbase.com (HELO k4.ksbase.com) (216.126.66.211) by > kb3.ksbase.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2001 05:15:11 - > Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 23:28:30 -0500 > I am not talking about clients! Mail generated on a qmail server > doesn't have proper date headers, whereas mail coming from a sendmail > server does. and > That's probably what it should be doing, except it's not doing it > right. The Date header should include the TZ, i.e. GMT offset. Meseems you've got a perfectly reasonable Date: line... As a matter of fact, all your messages have a -0500 offset in the Date: line. What are you blathering about? Stefaan -- How's it supposed to get the respect of management if you've got just one guy working on the project? It's much more impressive to have a battery of programmers slaving away. -- Jeffrey Hobbs (comp.lang.tcl)
RE: Qmail and time zone
On Sun, 04 Mar 2001 22:44:45 +0100 (MET), Stefaan A Eeckels wrote: >From Kari's header: > >> Received: (qmail 1259 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2001 05:15:11 - >> Received: from kb2.ksbase.com (HELO k4.ksbase.com) (216.126.66.211) by >> kb3.ksbase.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2001 05:15:11 - >> Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 23:28:30 -0500 > > >> I am not talking about clients! Mail generated on a qmail server >> doesn't have proper date headers, whereas mail coming from a sendmail >> server does. > >and > >> That's probably what it should be doing, except it's not doing it >> right. The Date header should include the TZ, i.e. GMT offset. > > >Meseems you've got a perfectly reasonable Date: line... >As a matter of fact, all your messages have a -0500 offset in the >Date: line. What are you blathering about? Stefaan, the line that worries me in that snip you quoted was the one containing -. A negative GMT or UTC or whatever you call it means that there is a difficulty with the timezone on the local machine (IIRC RFC822) and due to an error in RFC822 definition of Military TZ codes (reversed offset from UTC) RFC1123 suggests the use of - should be substituted for all Mil TZs. Does this have any bearing on his problem? I don't know as I have not been following it in detail. The - just hit my eye. FWIW In the beginning was The Word and The Word was Content-type: text/plain The Word of Rod.
Re: Qmail and time zone
Kari Suomela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote on Sun, 04 Mar 2001: > That's probably what it should be doing, except it's not doing it > right. The Date header should include the TZ, i.e. GMT offset. "Should" as in "you want" (as has been pointed out). Anyway, to me it appears that a simple perl script (or whatever) could be used to fix this "problem". Simply make the script call the real qmail-inject or qmail sendmail wrapper, then first print out the Date header (in whatever format/timezone/etc.) and finally copy all of the input to output. I'm even volunteering to write this perl script for you, if you don't know how to do it yourself, or can't find anyone else to do it for you. (If you need me to write it for you, please contact me in private.) Hope this helps, Mikko -- // Mikko Hänninen, aka. Wizzu // [EMAIL PROTECTED] // http://www.wizzu.com/ // The Corrs list maintainer // net.freak// DALnet IRC operator/ // Interests: roleplaying, Linux, the Net, fantasy & scifi, the Corrs/ "Personally, I want my computer's memory to be more reliable than mine." /.
Re: Qmail and time zone
Mikko Hänninen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > Anyway, to me it appears that a simple perl script (or whatever) could > be used to fix this "problem". Simply make the script call the real > qmail-inject or qmail sendmail wrapper, then first print out the Date > header (in whatever format/timezone/etc.) and finally copy all of the > input to output. > > I'm even volunteering to write this perl script for you, if you don't > know how to do it yourself, or can't find anyone else to do it for you. > (If you need me to write it for you, please contact me in private.) Don't bother. The program already exists in the qmail distribution. It's called `datemail'. http://cr.yp.to/qmail/faq/muas.html#mailx Ian
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Mon, Mar 05, 2001 at 10:40:12PM +0200, Mikko Hänninen wrote: > Anyway, to me it appears that a simple perl script (or whatever) could > be used to fix this "problem". Simply make the script call the real > qmail-inject or qmail sendmail wrapper, then first print out the Date > header (in whatever format/timezone/etc.) and finally copy all of the > input to output. Why not use /var/qmail/bin/predate?
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Mon, Mar 05, 2001 at 10:40:34PM +0200, Mikko Hänninen wrote: [snip] > Anyway, to me it appears that a simple perl script (or whatever) could > be used to fix this "problem". Simply make the script call the real > qmail-inject or qmail sendmail wrapper, then first print out the Date > header (in whatever format/timezone/etc.) and finally copy all of the > input to output. /var/qmail/bin/datemail ? Greetz, Peter.
Re: Qmail and time zone
On Mon, Mar 05, 2001 at 11:03:52PM +0200, Mikko Hänninen wrote: > I've not used predate, how does that differ from datemail? (No, I > couldn't find any documentation on it...) predate is one component of datemail (check the /var/qmail/bin/datemail script). predate reads data from fd 0. It prepends an RFC compliant Date: header to this data and passes it to a child program such as /var/qmail/bin/sendmail (or cat, if you are curious about predate).
RE: Qmail and time zone
On 04-Mar-2001 Rod... Whitworth wrote: > Does this have any bearing on his problem? I don't know as I have not > been following it in detail. The - just hit my eye. The - is in the MTA generated Received: lines. AFAIK, it's the standard way to indicate "no offset from UTC". Stefaan -- How's it supposed to get the respect of management if you've got just one guy working on the project? It's much more impressive to have a battery of programmers slaving away. -- Jeffrey Hobbs (comp.lang.tcl)
RE: Qmail and time zone
On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:40:29 +0100 (MET), Stefaan A Eeckels wrote: On 04-Mar-2001 Rod... Whitworth wrote: > Does this have any bearing on his problem? I don't know as I have not > been following it in detail. The - just hit my eye. The - is in the MTA generated Received: lines. AFAIK, it's the standard way to indicate "no offset from UTC". What standard are you quoting? RFC822 says that UT representation is + RFC1123 point out that 822 gets MIL tz codes bass-ackwards so - should be used as defined in 822 as operational difficulty or invalid tz code. This is off the top-of-the-head but if you persist I'll cut and paste quotes! ~|^ >From a land where we have to watch out for Northern hemisphere biased ideas about Daylight Saving /Summer Time reversals. >From the land "down under": Australia. Do we look from up over?
RE: Qmail and time zone
On 06-Mar-2001 Rod... Whitworth wrote: > On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:40:29 +0100 (MET), Stefaan A Eeckels wrote: > > On 04-Mar-2001 Rod... Whitworth wrote: > > Does this have any bearing on his problem? I don't know as I have not > > been following it in detail. The - just hit my eye. > > The - is in the MTA generated Received: lines. AFAIK, it's > the standard way to indicate "no offset from UTC". > > > What standard are you quoting? > RFC822 says that UT representation is + > RFC1123 point out that 822 gets MIL tz codes bass-ackwards so - > should be used as defined in 822 as operational difficulty or invalid > tz code. According to D J Bernstein (from http://cr.yp.to/immhf/date.html#timestamp ): : The time shown is the creator's local time. The time shown, minus the zone shown, is : the actual time in UTC. : : Exception: a zone of - indicates that the local time is unavailable or :meaningless, : and that the time shown is the actual time in UTC. : (In contrast, a zone of + indicates that the times hown is both local time and : actual time in UTC.) This special meaning of - was not specified in 822, but it :is being : widely used and is mentioned in 822bis. : : Note that, in a few areas of the world, the difference between local time and UTC is : almost never an exact multiple of 1 minute. : Implementors can still use - safely in this case. Stefaan -- How's it supposed to get the respect of management if you've got just one guy working on the project? It's much more impressive to have a battery of programmers slaving away. -- Jeffrey Hobbs (comp.lang.tcl)
