Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Den John]

I absolutely agree with Ben's point about how both Rivendell and Crust have
tried to build up a subculture around their brands that is about more than
just the bikes.
At the same time, doing this helps people get an idea of what you can do
with the bikes they make, e.g. the way the Scapegoat is a model designed by
someone who does
a very specific sort of riding.

Couple more guitarist-frame builder connections:

Tom Ritchey > Tony Iommi: Played pivotal role in creation of entire genre.
Had to compete with a flamboyant frontman to get credit (Ozzy/Gary Fisher)
JP Weigle > Robert Fripp: Perfectionist with distinctive style. Not well
known outside the circle of cognoscenti

On Thu, 11 Feb 2021 at 19:43, Ben Miller  wrote:

> Okay, okay, I have to admit Johnny's comparisons of "Riv is to the Dead as
> Crust is to Bowie" got a laugh out of me. That and some of the other
> comments got me thinking a bit, Riv and Crust are more than just the bikes.
> Sure other bike companies were influenced by Grant: Surly, Velo Orange,
> Rawland, etc, but I'd make a case that they lack the personality that Riv
> and Crust have.
>
> Crust literally started because Matt made the bikes that he and his
> friends wanted to ride: Evasion/Matt, Scapegoat/The Goat, Cheeco/Angelica,
> and Romanceur/Ronnie. That's pretty bold and subversive in a Riv way. And
> these are bikes that definitely didn't exist in any other form at the time.
> In many ways, the Bombora which Russ used in the comparisons is the most
> "normal" bike in the Crust lineup (Dan from Bike Insights made a flowchart
> and to get to the Bombora the answer is "Man, I just want a bike. I'm not a
> weirdo")
>
> But even more than that, the team a Crust is then filled out with these
> personalities. Much like Riv highlighting their team through "Staff Bikes"
> and their Instagram account, Crust does that too with their Elevator to
> Hell videos. And both companies use their platform to raise awareness to
> causes they care about. Crust's sponsoring of the Slim One because they can
> and think it is the right thing to do is along the same lines as Riv's BRF
> experiment, though perhaps less controversial. And Grant being open about
> cash flow problems isn't that different from Crust taking a break over
> holidays and being open about feeling overwhelmed at the time.
>
> All this adds up to two companies that are almost as much about the people
> as the bikes. I find myself routing for Grant and Matt, hoping their
> projects work out even if I don't want that particular one for myself. I
> definitely can't say that about Surly or New Albion. In a way, both
> companies are a bit like custom builders because of that, you feel a
> personal connection. I think that is what the makes the Rivendell vs Crust
> comparison so unique.
>
> As far as guitarists: James Iha, Dave Navarro, John Frusciante. Yes, I am
> Gen X.
>
> (Disclaimer: I will tip my hat to Velo Orange, especially when Chris at
> the helm, feels like a company that had a real personal touch and a sense
> of humor)
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:44:58 AM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>
>> Just to clarify, I'm certainly not getting bent because I'm not a fan of
>> the video editing (or the content, for that matter.) And whether or not he
>> is making money, or is trying to make money, or is performing a public
>> service because he enjoys the luxury of enough free time to do so, is not
>> really relevant. He is obviously sincere in what he does and seems to have
>> a decent following. And good for him. After watching the video above, I
>> would not be able to use it to make a decision as to which bike might be
>> better for me. On the one hand, he refers to the Bombora as spicey and
>> sporty. On the other, he says the Riv's steering is quicker, but keeps
>> calling it relaxed and chill. Hard to tell, but it looks like maybe the
>> Bombora has more drop from saddle to bars. Who knows.
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 12:15:36 PM UTC-5 mrg...@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I love bike comparison videos of every kind. I want to see Rivs vs Rivs
>>> with some tiny difference, Riv vs Crusts, Surlys, carbon TT bikes,
>>> everything. I want to see "I took my Electra Townie to a pump track",
>>> "super-low-trail bike vs penny farthing for grocery getter", "55 Atlantis
>>> 29er vs 56 Atlantis 650b", "Same bike with 12 different handlebar setups",
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> I like what Russ at Path Less Pedaled is doing; he's all about the
>>> "non-competitive side of cycling" which aligns with RBW perfectly.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>> Austin TX
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 10:49:04 AM UTC-6 bjmi...@gmail.com
>>> wrote:
>>>
 If I had a YouTube channel and wanted people to watch, click the like
 button, subscribe, etc... I'd probably write titles that makes people want
 to click them. When I go shopping for a car, I don't get bent about car
 sales tactics that are there for a reason, even if they kind of annoy 

[RBW] Re: New look for rivbike.com and new News blog

[Joe Bernard]

It's Dave! Thanks for all the hard work on the new site and good to hear 
from you again man! ‍♂️

Joe Bernard 

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:56:21 PM UTC-8 Dave wrote:

> Hi Everyone, 
>
> Just a heads-up that we launched a new theme today for the rivbike.com 
> webstore. We enlarged the photos all around, spruced up the homepage, 
> improved the search, and updated a number of things for a smoother 
> experience on desktop and mobile. We hope you like it!
>
> The other big reveal is that the Blug, our newsy blog that has been on 
> Tumblr ever since 2010, has now moved within rivbike.com to 
> https://www.rivbike.com/blogs/news.   With that move, you now have one 
> site for all the latest product updates, news and Grant's blog. Just head 
> to the homepage.
>
> Enjoy and let us know what you think. 
>
> Dave Schonenberg
>
>

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[RBW] New look for rivbike.com and new News blog

[Rivendell GM Dave]

Hi Everyone, 

Just a heads-up that we launched a new theme today for the rivbike.com 
webstore. We enlarged the photos all around, spruced up the homepage, 
improved the search, and updated a number of things for a smoother 
experience on desktop and mobile. We hope you like it!

The other big reveal is that the Blug, our newsy blog that has been on 
Tumblr ever since 2010, has now moved within rivbike.com to 
https://www.rivbike.com/blogs/news.   With that move, you now have one site 
for all the latest product updates, news and Grant's blog. Just head to the 
homepage.

Enjoy and let us know what you think. 

Dave Schonenberg

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[RBW] Re: FS: Wheelset, marathon supreme tires, sugino triple crankset

[jeffbog...@hotmail.com]

Wheels and crankset sold. Tires still available for $80/pair - shipped

Jeff in Alabama

On Sunday, February 7, 2021 at 9:36:27 AM UTC-6 jeffbog...@hotmail.com 
wrote:

> Wheelset: 700 silver cr-18 rims, shimano hubs, 36 spokes, 8-10 speed --- 
> $95/set
> Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tires 700 x 50 --- $80/pair
> Sugino triple crankset, brand new in box --- $125
>
> Jeff
> Mobile, Alabama
>

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[RBW] Re: Experiences with Riv/Soma Clipper Crankset?

[Brett Callahan]

Michael, thanks for the links. That Stridsland chainring in particular is 
snazzy! I'd like to keep this bike as a triple, so as not to swap 
derailleurs and shifters or lose range, but I might pick one of those up 
for my quickbeam!

Joe, thanks. Good information. Another listmember reached out and offered a 
Sugino XD2 take-off to me, so I may go that route.  

I appreciate it, guys. 

Brett

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:56:48 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> That's a rebranded Sugino XD2 which has pedal-powered many many Rivs. I 
> think you would be happy with it. 
>
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:55:19 AM UTC-8 brettjc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Has anyone used the clipper triple that Riv is now selling? I believe 
>> it's imported by Soma. This one: 
>> https://www.rivbike.com/products/crank-akhdkgn2154sdg
>>
>> I have an older model Atlantis with a 94 bcd crankset that needs new 
>> rings and could use a new BB as well. Replacing the rings is trying my 
>> patience. I tracked down some Vuelta rings on ebay, which go for about $80. 
>> The nice looking TA ones are significantly more and the availability looks 
>> spotty. 
>>
>> The shiny triple isn't that much more, but I'm wondering if folks have 
>> used it and how experiences have been. 
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Brett in PDX
>>
>

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[RBW] WTB few parts for my Atlantis

[Hugh Smitham]

Hi Kind People,

Looking for a few bits and pieces to put my seafoam yacht afloat.

1. Paul Motolites, I have heard they're a pain to setup but they just look 
so good. Preference is silver but I'll entertain other colors.
2. S83 post in 26.8mm x 300mm
3. Down tube shifters. I've got some stem shifters coming from my buddy 
Ryan but I'd also like to try out the simplicity of down tube shifters.
4 650B x 48 Switchback Hill TC Tires. Or Schwabe G-one bite 11601057 54-584 
(27.5 x 2.10) SnakeSkin, TL EasyOneStar Black
5. Nitto Losco bar, God it just looks fantastic!

I that's it for now. 

Best Regards,

Hugh

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Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Joe Bernard]

Party on, Garth 



On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:34:10 PM UTC-8 Garth wrote:

> Ray Lynch . Nothing Above My Shoulders But The Evening
>
>  
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 6:26:42 PM UTC-5 Garth wrote:
>
>> Which is better . ahahahahahah\a ... that's good one !   
>> What's better mean ? 
>> (looking in the dictionary )
>> ( shrugs shoulders )
>> It's defined with more words. and each one of those words is defined 
>> by yet more words. Kinda wordy isn't it ? 
>>  smiling 
>> Lots of words but doesn't really say anything meaningful.
>> Yes.
>> Like an irresistible wabbit hole that goes nowhere.
>> The irresistible temptation . to ask  to quest .
>> And for what ?
>> The "ask" itself. The ask asks itself about itself   the quest quests 
>> about itself . the wonder wonders about itself . 
>> Thinking thinks about itself. 
>> BEING IS SELF
>>
>> George Winston  Autumn, December. 
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:16:08 PM UTC-5 Addison wrote:
>>
>>> Ah... Reckoner...one of my favorite songs from my favorite band.  And 
>>> one of the first songs I learned when I purchased my first guitar in 
>>> January 2020, PreCovid times.  This live version is still my favorite:
>>>
>>> https://youtu.be/2FMP-9bn9N8
>>>
>>> Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
>>>
>>> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
>>>  
>>>
>>> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>>>
>>> Portfolio and Blog 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 11:53 AM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>>
 My guitarist is Peter Frampton. Get his new instrumental album April 
 23rd, this is Reckoner, a Radiohead song. Enjoy!

 https://youtu.be/RHdj_-x_51c

 On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:40:59 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I responded to the original post which referred to the Crust as the 
> low trail bike. I didnt watch the video, it doesn't interest me and I 
> wasn't responding to its content. 
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 5:26:38 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>
>> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video 
>> that they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the 
>> "low 
>> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know 
>> what 
>> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>>
>> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>>
>>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he 
>>> said it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and 
>>> I 
>>> enjoyed the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he 
>>> gets 
>>> asked this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>>
>>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>>
>>> Tom Milani
>>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread 
 which is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting 
 to 
 the thread being a thread. 

 Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard 
 wrote:

> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered 
> the 
> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought 
> a 
> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
> that 
> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to 
> ride. 
>
> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>
>> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video 
>> with the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
>> " 
>>
>> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ 
>> comparing his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe 
>> less 
>> so than it could be? 
>>
>> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a 
>> lot. I know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and 
>> ride, 
>> so I do it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly 
>> due to 
>> Matt & Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the 
>> Rivendell 
>> aesthetic in mind. I think 

Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Garth]

Ray Lynch . Nothing Above My Shoulders But The Evening

 
On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 6:26:42 PM UTC-5 Garth wrote:

> Which is better . ahahahahahah\a ... that's good one !   
> What's better mean ? 
> (looking in the dictionary )
> ( shrugs shoulders )
> It's defined with more words. and each one of those words is defined 
> by yet more words. Kinda wordy isn't it ? 
>  smiling 
> Lots of words but doesn't really say anything meaningful.
> Yes.
> Like an irresistible wabbit hole that goes nowhere.
> The irresistible temptation . to ask  to quest .
> And for what ?
> The "ask" itself. The ask asks itself about itself   the quest quests 
> about itself . the wonder wonders about itself . 
> Thinking thinks about itself. 
> BEING IS SELF
>
> George Winston  Autumn, December. 
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:16:08 PM UTC-5 Addison wrote:
>
>> Ah... Reckoner...one of my favorite songs from my favorite band.  And one 
>> of the first songs I learned when I purchased my first guitar in January 
>> 2020, PreCovid times.  This live version is still my favorite:
>>
>> https://youtu.be/2FMP-9bn9N8
>>
>> Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
>>
>> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
>>  
>>
>> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>>
>> Portfolio and Blog 
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 11:53 AM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>
>>> My guitarist is Peter Frampton. Get his new instrumental album April 
>>> 23rd, this is Reckoner, a Radiohead song. Enjoy!
>>>
>>> https://youtu.be/RHdj_-x_51c
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:40:59 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 I responded to the original post which referred to the Crust as the low 
 trail bike. I didnt watch the video, it doesn't interest me and I wasn't 
 responding to its content. 


 On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 5:26:38 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:

> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>
> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>
> Laing
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>
>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he 
>> said it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I 
>> enjoyed the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he 
>> gets 
>> asked this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>
>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>
>> Tom Milani
>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread 
>>> which is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting 
>>> to 
>>> the thread being a thread. 
>>>
>>> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
 comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered 
 the 
 "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought 
 a 
 Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
 that 
 I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to 
 ride. 

 On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:

> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with 
> the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
> " 
>
> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ 
> comparing his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe 
> less 
> so than it could be? 
>
> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a 
> lot. I know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and 
> ride, 
> so I do it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due 
> to 
> Matt & Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the 
> Rivendell 
> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when 
> comparing the 
> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to 
> be 
> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 

Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Garth]

Which is better . ahahahahahah\a ... that's good one !   
What's better mean ? 
(looking in the dictionary )
( shrugs shoulders )
It's defined with more words. and each one of those words is defined by 
yet more words. Kinda wordy isn't it ? 
 smiling 
Lots of words but doesn't really say anything meaningful.
Yes.
Like an irresistible wabbit hole that goes nowhere.
The irresistible temptation . to ask  to quest .
And for what ?
The "ask" itself. The ask asks itself about itself   the quest quests 
about itself . the wonder wonders about itself . 
Thinking thinks about itself. 
BEING IS SELF

George Winston  Autumn, December. 


On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:16:08 PM UTC-5 Addison wrote:

> Ah... Reckoner...one of my favorite songs from my favorite band.  And one 
> of the first songs I learned when I purchased my first guitar in January 
> 2020, PreCovid times.  This live version is still my favorite:
>
> https://youtu.be/2FMP-9bn9N8
>
> Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
>
> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
>  
>
> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>
> Portfolio and Blog 
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 11:53 AM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>
>> My guitarist is Peter Frampton. Get his new instrumental album April 
>> 23rd, this is Reckoner, a Radiohead song. Enjoy!
>>
>> https://youtu.be/RHdj_-x_51c
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:40:59 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> I responded to the original post which referred to the Crust as the low 
>>> trail bike. I didnt watch the video, it doesn't interest me and I wasn't 
>>> responding to its content. 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 5:26:38 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>>>
 I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
 they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
 trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
 is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.

 One word on guitarists: Hendrix.

 Laing

 On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:

> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I 
> enjoyed 
> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>
> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>
> Tom Milani
> Alexandria, VA USA
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread 
>> which is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting 
>> to 
>> the thread being a thread. 
>>
>> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
>>> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered 
>>> the 
>>> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
>>> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
>>> that 
>>> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to 
>>> ride. 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>>>
 The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with 
 the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
 " 

 The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ 
 comparing his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe 
 less 
 so than it could be? 

 I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a 
 lot. I know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and 
 ride, 
 so I do it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due 
 to 
 Matt & Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the 
 Rivendell 
 aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when 
 comparing the 
 Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to 
 be 
 saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
 bikes 
 had. 

 Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail 
 compared to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. 
 Like 
 most thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). 

Re: [RBW] Re: Any Susie owners out there?

[Tim Baldwin]

Nice ride Joe! That gives me an idea of how the proportions of mine will 
look. I briefly tried 155 cranks but they felt strange and didn't last 
long. I used to ride 170 but but have been riding 165s for the past couple 
years. I have some of the Silver two piece cranks in 167 for the Susie. 
Wonder if I'll be able to feel the difference. I can feel it going from 165 
to 170. If Riv was set on doing odd sizes, I kind of wish they'd gone 163.

The look took a little while to grow on me but now I love the swoop. 
Looking forward to more stand over clearance when riding in snow or off 
road.   
On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 4:07:03 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:

> This is exactly my measurements and setup. I show a little more post 
> because I use short (152) cranks, but I have those Boscos WAY up there. I 
> can't emphasize enough what a great bike this is, which is funny because I 
> wasn't into them at *all *from looking at pictures. 
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 1:40:24 PM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>> Ash, my PBH is 80cm. I like my saddle a little lower than Grant's 
>> recommendation. I won't have much seatpost showing on the 53 but I like 
>> that look and it's easier to get the bars higher.
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:18:37 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Congrats Tim!  
>>>
>>> Curious what's your PBH.. 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, 10 February 2021 at 18:22:33 UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>>>
 Well after seeing all these great builds, I decided to pull the trigger 
 on a Susie frame this week. It was down to a blue 51 and an orange 53 
 since 
 I could fit either one. I went with the orange seeing as I have the blue 
 (well blue-green) covered with an Atlantis. Excited to build this bike up!

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 12:06:07 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu 
 wrote:

> Mark,
>
> As for seat post, I picked up a NOS Shimano black one on eBay.   
>  Thanks to Analog, I even got a powder coated black Mark's rack.  Haven't 
> had a chance to mount it yet.  Will post pictures once that's attached.   
> I 
> replaced the Bosco with Nitto B604AAF Promenade black from Soma.  So, 
> other 
> than the front derailleur, there's no noticeable chrome part.   There 
> doesn't seem to be any good FDs in black color out there.
>
> Ash
>
> On Tuesday, 9 February 2021 at 09:44:03 UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>
>> Great looking build, Ash. What black seat post are you planning to 
>> use? All black components but keeping the brown saddle would look pretty 
>> awesome.
>>
>> The swoop top tube is actually a big plus for me. In addition to 
>> being functional, that graceful line complements the fillet-brazed 
>> construction. It give the bicycles a distinctive character.
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: WTB Paul Canti Levers

[Tim Baldwin]

Joe, that is a very rad option. Looking forward to seeing those watermelon 
brakes setup. Now you got me thinking about another color option: put some 
Newbaums tape on the silver levers. Then I could rotate the colors. So many 
options these days.

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:38:44 PM UTC-6 Joe Bernard wrote:

> One option to consider will take a while but could be big fun and 
> something you weren't aware of: Analog Cycles can anodize Paul stuff just 
> about any color you can imagine. I have levers, Motolites and some other 
> bits on order for my RBW Blue Susie/Wolbis..it's going to be a "watermelon 
> mix", light lime green and deep-almost-red pink. Not cheap but so rad! 
>
> Joe "rad guy" Bernard
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 1:18:10 PM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>>
>> Paul is out of stock at the moment. I'm ordering purple touring cantis 
>> for my orange Susie and was going to get matching levers. Seeing if anyone 
>> has any fun colored Paul levers they're not using. I did find a pair in 
>> silver at Ben's cycle so I may just go that route.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Tim B in Chicago
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Any Susie owners out there?

[Tim Baldwin]

Ash, my PBH is 80cm. I like my saddle a little lower than Grant's 
recommendation. I won't have much seatpost showing on the 53 but I like 
that look and it's easier to get the bars higher.

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 3:18:37 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu wrote:

>
> Congrats Tim!  
>
> Curious what's your PBH.. 
>
>
> On Wednesday, 10 February 2021 at 18:22:33 UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>> Well after seeing all these great builds, I decided to pull the trigger 
>> on a Susie frame this week. It was down to a blue 51 and an orange 53 since 
>> I could fit either one. I went with the orange seeing as I have the blue 
>> (well blue-green) covered with an Atlantis. Excited to build this bike up!
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 12:06:07 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Mark,
>>>
>>> As for seat post, I picked up a NOS Shimano black one on eBay.Thanks 
>>> to Analog, I even got a powder coated black Mark's rack.  Haven't had a 
>>> chance to mount it yet.  Will post pictures once that's attached.   I 
>>> replaced the Bosco with Nitto B604AAF Promenade black from Soma.  So, other 
>>> than the front derailleur, there's no noticeable chrome part.   There 
>>> doesn't seem to be any good FDs in black color out there.
>>>
>>> Ash
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, 9 February 2021 at 09:44:03 UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>>>
 Great looking build, Ash. What black seat post are you planning to use? 
 All black components but keeping the brown saddle would look pretty 
 awesome.

 The swoop top tube is actually a big plus for me. In addition to being 
 functional, that graceful line complements the fillet-brazed construction. 
 It give the bicycles a distinctive character.




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[RBW] Re: WTB Paul Canti Levers

[Joe Bernard]

One option to consider will take a while but could be big fun and something 
you weren't aware of: Analog Cycles can anodize Paul stuff just about any 
color you can imagine. I have levers, Motolites and some other bits on 
order for my RBW Blue Susie/Wolbis..it's going to be a "watermelon mix", 
light lime green and deep-almost-red pink. Not cheap but so rad! 

Joe "rad guy" Bernard

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 1:18:10 PM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:

>
> Paul is out of stock at the moment. I'm ordering purple touring cantis for 
> my orange Susie and was going to get matching levers. Seeing if anyone has 
> any fun colored Paul levers they're not using. I did find a pair in silver 
> at Ben's cycle so I may just go that route.
>
> Thanks,
> Tim B in Chicago
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Any Susie owners out there?

[Ashwath Akirekadu]

Congrats Tim!  

Curious what's your PBH.. 


On Wednesday, 10 February 2021 at 18:22:33 UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:

> Well after seeing all these great builds, I decided to pull the trigger on 
> a Susie frame this week. It was down to a blue 51 and an orange 53 since I 
> could fit either one. I went with the orange seeing as I have the blue 
> (well blue-green) covered with an Atlantis. Excited to build this bike up!
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 12:06:07 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu 
> wrote:
>
>> Mark,
>>
>> As for seat post, I picked up a NOS Shimano black one on eBay.Thanks 
>> to Analog, I even got a powder coated black Mark's rack.  Haven't had a 
>> chance to mount it yet.  Will post pictures once that's attached.   I 
>> replaced the Bosco with Nitto B604AAF Promenade black from Soma.  So, other 
>> than the front derailleur, there's no noticeable chrome part.   There 
>> doesn't seem to be any good FDs in black color out there.
>>
>> Ash
>>
>> On Tuesday, 9 February 2021 at 09:44:03 UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>>
>>> Great looking build, Ash. What black seat post are you planning to use? 
>>> All black components but keeping the brown saddle would look pretty awesome.
>>>
>>> The swoop top tube is actually a big plus for me. In addition to being 
>>> functional, that graceful line complements the fillet-brazed construction. 
>>> It give the bicycles a distinctive character.
>>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] WTB Paul Canti Levers

[Tim Baldwin]

Paul is out of stock at the moment. I'm ordering purple touring cantis for 
my orange Susie and was going to get matching levers. Seeing if anyone has 
any fun colored Paul levers they're not using. I did find a pair in silver 
at Ben's cycle so I may just go that route.

Thanks,
Tim B in Chicago


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Re: [RBW] Re: Any Susie owners out there?

[Tim Baldwin]

Thanks Jared. I really like the looks of your setup with the Tosco bars. I 
have Persuader bars on my Atlantis and I really like them on there. I think 
they would be quite a stretch on the Susie unless using a very short stem. 
I do miss having a swept back bar bike so that's what lead me to the Susie.

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:05:52 AM UTC-6 duh...@gmail.com wrote:

> Congrats Tim, you're gonna love her!
>
> I'd have gone orange if I could've, looking forward to seeing your build.
>
> Jared
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:22:33 PM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:
>
>> Well after seeing all these great builds, I decided to pull the trigger 
>> on a Susie frame this week. It was down to a blue 51 and an orange 53 since 
>> I could fit either one. I went with the orange seeing as I have the blue 
>> (well blue-green) covered with an Atlantis. Excited to build this bike up!
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 12:06:07 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Mark,
>>>
>>> As for seat post, I picked up a NOS Shimano black one on eBay.Thanks 
>>> to Analog, I even got a powder coated black Mark's rack.  Haven't had a 
>>> chance to mount it yet.  Will post pictures once that's attached.   I 
>>> replaced the Bosco with Nitto B604AAF Promenade black from Soma.  So, other 
>>> than the front derailleur, there's no noticeable chrome part.   There 
>>> doesn't seem to be any good FDs in black color out there.
>>>
>>> Ash
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, 9 February 2021 at 09:44:03 UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>>>
 Great looking build, Ash. What black seat post are you planning to use? 
 All black components but keeping the brown saddle would look pretty 
 awesome.

 The swoop top tube is actually a big plus for me. In addition to being 
 functional, that graceful line complements the fillet-brazed construction. 
 It give the bicycles a distinctive character.




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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: large Riv All Rounder 26” wheels

[Jim M.]

Well, Mt Airy bikes has had a 59 for at least 10 years. It's bike number 
3804, and you can search for it here:
https://www.bike123.com/bike-list/

I've been very tempted by this bike but he was always asking more than I 
wanted to pay. 

good luck
jim m
walnut creek, ca


On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 10:33:12 AM UTC-8 Steven Sweedler wrote:

> If it only had 26” wheels 
>
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 11:32 AM Matthew Williams  
> wrote:
>
>> Here you go:
>>
>> Sam Hillborne All-Rounder
>> 59cm
>> $1800
>> Indianapolis, IN
>>
>>
>> https://indianapolis.craigslist.org/bik/d/indianapolis-rivendell-sam-hillborne/7262147196.html
>>
>> [image: 00b0b_iYzRTdsdfFR_1320MM_1200x900.jpg]
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:02:47 PM UTC-8 Steven Sweedler wrote:
>>
>>> Apologies for the cross post, this is my annual appeal looking for my 
>>> holy grail. 60 cm square or close, will consider any and all, frame set 
>>> preferred. Steve
>>> Tucson
>>>
>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Steven Sweedler
>>> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
> -- 
> Steven Sweedler
> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Addison Wilhite]

Ah... Reckoner...one of my favorite songs from my favorite band.  And one
of the first songs I learned when I purchased my first guitar in January
2020, PreCovid times.  This live version is still my favorite:

https://youtu.be/2FMP-9bn9N8

Addison Wilhite, M.A.

Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 

*“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*

Portfolio and Blog 


On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 11:53 AM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> My guitarist is Peter Frampton. Get his new instrumental album April 23rd,
> this is Reckoner, a Radiohead song. Enjoy!
>
> https://youtu.be/RHdj_-x_51c
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:40:59 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I responded to the original post which referred to the Crust as the low
>> trail bike. I didnt watch the video, it doesn't interest me and I wasn't
>> responding to its content.
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 5:26:38 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that
>>> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low
>>> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what
>>> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>>>
>>> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>>>
 FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said
 it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed
 the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked
 this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?

 And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd
 never heard of him but will now check him out.

 Tom Milani
 Alexandria, VA USA

 On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread
> which is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to
> the thread being a thread.
>
> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a
>> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the
>> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a
>> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
>> that
>> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to
>> ride.
>>
>> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>>
>>> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with
>>> the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?
>>> "
>>>
>>> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing
>>> his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than 
>>> it
>>> could be?
>>>
>>> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot.
>>> I know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so 
>>> I
>>> do it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to 
>>> Matt &
>>> Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell
>>> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing 
>>> the
>>> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be
>>> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
>>> bikes
>>> had.
>>>
>>> Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail
>>> compared to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like
>>> most thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your 
>>> hot
>>> take on the two?
>>>
>>> I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and
>>> important stuff for the bike industry. What I think would be really
>>> interesting collaboration between Grant and Matt. Maybe something along 
>>> the
>>> lines of the Soma San Marcos, but both providing inputs. That'd be 
>>> really
>>> cool!
>>>
>> --
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> 
> .
>

Re: [RBW] Re: Paul Racers on a Cheviot?

[Joe Bernard]

Another funny anecdote from my brakes convo with Will is he wasn't 
convinced the Racer stopped any harder than a 559. Of course we're talking 
about a young man who rides impossibly steep trails at Mt. Diablo on a 
2-speed Mixte with road brakes. I think Will can hop on anything and make 
it go and stop without ever noticing how he did it! 



On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:48:47 AM UTC-8 Justin Kennedy wrote:

> Thanks for everyone's input. A front Paul Racer is already on order. 
>
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 12:08 PM RichS  wrote:
>
>> Hello Justin:
>>
>> Another vote for the centerpull front / R559 sidepull rear setup. Works 
>> very nicely on my Sam. The centerpull provided better clearance for a front 
>> fender. 
>> Adding to the props for Paul Racers, they will definitely stop you NOW.
>>
>> Best,
>> Rich in ATL
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 9:03:45 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Laing, I'm probably going to start by replacing the defective 
>>> front R559 with a Paul Racer and see how it goes leaving the rear R559 in 
>>> place. 
>>> I agree -- don't love the look of adding extraneous clamps etc and I 
>>> really don't like the look of a rear center-pull cable straddling the seat 
>>> tube for some 
>>> reason. Thanks for your input. 
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 4:17 PM lconley  wrote:
>>>
 There can be some very good reasons for using a centerpull on the front 
 and a sidepull on the rear: 
 1. Centerpulls generally give more clearance which is almost always a 
 bigger issue on the front than the rear. Especially true with fenders.
 2. Sidepulls sometimes fit better on the rear, especially on mixte type 
 frames with offset cable stops - I try not to clamp things to by frame 
 unless there is no other way. On my Rosco Bubbe V1, there is insufficient 
 distance from a cable hanger to the straddle cable to use a center pull.
 3. You don't really need the additional baking power of a centerpull on 
 the rear, locking up the rear wheel is not the fastest way to stop.

 I run the Dia-Compe DC610-N centerpull front, Tektro R559 sidepull rear 
 combo on both my Rosco Bubbe and Betty Foy.

 Laing

 [image: Resized_20200330_120439.jpeg]
 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 3:22:34 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy 
 wrote:

> Ha! It's pretty awesome/astounding how jalopy-ish some of the Riv 
> staff bikes look. Will might take the cake in that department with 
> this orange Chev 
>  which 
> coicidentally has the same Racer-in-the-front, R559-in-the-rear set up. 
> That hacked off front fender is   
>
> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 2:58 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>
>> Justin,
>>
>> For informational purposes only because everyone has already answered 
>> that Racers work front and rear: I asked Will about his front Racer once 
>> and he said it's there because he had a front one and felt like using 
>> it. 
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:34:03 AM UTC-8 Justin Kennedy 
>> (Brooklyn, NY) wrote:
>>
>>> I've used Tektro R559's on my Cheviot from the start but was 
>>> recently considering upgrading to something different due to a slight 
>>> but 
>>> annoying mechanical issue on the front caliper. (The release lock is 
>>> stuck 
>>> so in order to remove the front tire, I have to fully deflate and 
>>> squeeze 
>>> it between the pads.)
>>>
>>> I noticed on Will's Staff Bikes page that he has a Paul Racer on 
>>> this Chev 
>>> 
>>>  
>>> but only up front. Guessing it's because the rear geometry wouldn't 
>>> allow a 
>>> hanger placement for a center pull?  
>>>
>>> Has anyone else used this set up? Do Paul Racers have clearance for 
>>> 700c x 50mm tires? The tires in Will's pic look pretty wide and he's 
>>> running a fender too so it seems like there would be plenty of room. 
>>> Thoughts?
>>>
>> -- 
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>>
>
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> -- 

[RBW] Re: Experiences with Riv/Soma Clipper Crankset?

[Joe Bernard]

That's a rebranded Sugino XD2 which has pedal-powered many many Rivs. I 
think you would be happy with it. 



On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:55:19 AM UTC-8 brettjc...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Has anyone used the clipper triple that Riv is now selling? I believe it's 
> imported by Soma. This one: 
> https://www.rivbike.com/products/crank-akhdkgn2154sdg
>
> I have an older model Atlantis with a 94 bcd crankset that needs new rings 
> and could use a new BB as well. Replacing the rings is trying my patience. 
> I tracked down some Vuelta rings on ebay, which go for about $80. The nice 
> looking TA ones are significantly more and the availability looks spotty. 
>
> The shiny triple isn't that much more, but I'm wondering if folks have 
> used it and how experiences have been. 
>
> Cheers,
> Brett in PDX
>

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[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Joe Bernard]

My guitarist is Peter Frampton. Get his new instrumental album April 23rd, 
this is Reckoner, a Radiohead song. Enjoy!

https://youtu.be/RHdj_-x_51c

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:40:59 AM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I responded to the original post which referred to the Crust as the low 
> trail bike. I didnt watch the video, it doesn't interest me and I wasn't 
> responding to its content. 
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 5:26:38 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>
>> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
>> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
>> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
>> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>>
>> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>>
>>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
>>> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed 
>>> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
>>> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>>
>>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>>
>>> Tom Milani
>>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which 
 is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the 
 thread being a thread. 

 Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
> that 
> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 
>
> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>
>> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with 
>> the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
>> " 
>>
>> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing 
>> his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than 
>> it 
>> could be? 
>>
>> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. 
>> I know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so 
>> I 
>> do it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to Matt 
>> & 
>> Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell 
>> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing 
>> the 
>> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be 
>> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
>> bikes 
>> had. 
>>
>> Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail compared 
>> to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like most 
>> thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your hot 
>> take 
>> on the two?
>>
>> I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and 
>> important stuff for the bike industry. What I think would be really 
>> interesting collaboration between Grant and Matt. Maybe something along 
>> the 
>> lines of the Soma San Marcos, but both providing inputs. That'd be 
>> really 
>> cool!
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Sackville Sacks are a good deal

[Ben Mihovk]

I love all the small hand-made bag companies in this thread! I still would 
rather get Sackville, personally, but they're all very nice.

In a perfect world, Artifact Bags (right here in Omaha!) would make bicycle 
bags, but I've e-mailed and asked in person and am always told, "no." Oh 
well. 

Ben 

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 1:05:24 PM UTC-6 chase@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Just wanted to throw into the mix, that I recently had a beautiful custom 
> saddlebag made by Waxwing in Vermont. www.waxwingbagco.com
> Everything about the experience was awesome and the bag came out great!
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:53:27 AM UTC-5 bjmi...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Huh...I got a different response from Spencer, but I think you can put 
>> his together with Will's and see what's happening.
>>
>> Spencer told me, and I paraphrase, I don't have an answer because it 
>> could be a month, it could be three months. He was very polite, 
>> though...hard to capture that in my paraphrase.
>>
>> Ben "not going to buy panniers from Swift...probably not...maybe..." in 
>> Omaha 
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 6:45 AM Howard Ramsay  wrote:
>>
>>> I asked this week. Reply here ->  Hi Howard,
>>>
>>> We're waiting on a rear rack to be developed that will determine how the 
>>> bags attach. We're working on 'em!
>>> -will
>>>
>>> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 2:14:24 PM UTC-6 Gary L wrote:
>>>
 I love sackvilles too, and they are a spectacular deal, but if you want 
 to go all in on handmade bags, check out Fogg bags. They are made by a 
 great couple in southern France. I have one and it is exquisite.
 https://www.foggspecialistbags.com/

 And I too am waiting for the backabikes to be back in stock.

 On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 11:43:24 AM UTC-5 Berkeleyan wrote:

> Indeed, I've carried my Scotch, as well as my beer, in a grid-grey 
> Sackville bag, and enjoyed both the riding and the imbibing. And my 
> Scottish friends all agree.
>
> - Andrew, Berkeley
>
> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 7:23:30 AM UTC-8 Edwin W wrote:
>
>> Especially when you compare them to some alternatives, like this $745 
>> Scotch bag!
>> https://www.westleyrichards.com/us/scotch-bag-in-forest-green
>>
>> Enjoying flat, grabby, and jumbo grabby sacks,
>>
>> Edwin
>>
> -- 
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>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/8b12d6a4-cdb4-43db-8dbd-5e2a5e92a6c0n%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Joe Bernard]

I responded to the original post which referred to the Crust as the low 
trail bike. I didnt watch the video, it doesn't interest me and I wasn't 
responding to its content. 


On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 5:26:38 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:

> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>
> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>
> Laing
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>
>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
>> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed 
>> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
>> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>
>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>
>> Tom Milani
>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which 
>>> is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the 
>>> thread being a thread. 
>>>
>>> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
 comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
 "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
 Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way that 
 I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 

 On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:

> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with the 
> provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
> " 
>
> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing 
> his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than 
> it 
> could be? 
>
> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. I 
> know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so I 
> do 
> it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to Matt & 
> Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell 
> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing 
> the 
> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be 
> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
> bikes 
> had. 
>
> Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail compared 
> to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like most 
> thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your hot 
> take 
> on the two?
>
> I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and 
> important stuff for the bike industry. What I think would be really 
> interesting collaboration between Grant and Matt. Maybe something along 
> the 
> lines of the Soma San Marcos, but both providing inputs. That'd be really 
> cool!
>


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[RBW] Re: Experiences with Riv/Soma Clipper Crankset?

[Michael Morrissey]

Get a 94 BCD 1x chainring:

https://www.stridsland.com/shop/94-bcd-5-bolt-chainring/

https://www.wolftoothcomponents.com/products/94-bcd-for-5-arm-cranks

They are nice and low for going slow.

m

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 12:55:19 PM UTC-5 brettjc...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Has anyone used the clipper triple that Riv is now selling? I believe it's 
> imported by Soma. This one: 
> https://www.rivbike.com/products/crank-akhdkgn2154sdg
>
> I have an older model Atlantis with a 94 bcd crankset that needs new rings 
> and could use a new BB as well. Replacing the rings is trying my patience. 
> I tracked down some Vuelta rings on ebay, which go for about $80. The nice 
> looking TA ones are significantly more and the availability looks spotty. 
>
> The shiny triple isn't that much more, but I'm wondering if folks have 
> used it and how experiences have been. 
>
> Cheers,
> Brett in PDX
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Sackville Sacks are a good deal

[Chase Granoff]

Just wanted to throw into the mix, that I recently had a beautiful custom 
saddlebag made by Waxwing in Vermont. www.waxwingbagco.com
Everything about the experience was awesome and the bag came out great!

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 11:53:27 AM UTC-5 bjmi...@gmail.com wrote:

> Huh...I got a different response from Spencer, but I think you can put his 
> together with Will's and see what's happening.
>
> Spencer told me, and I paraphrase, I don't have an answer because it could 
> be a month, it could be three months. He was very polite, though...hard to 
> capture that in my paraphrase.
>
> Ben "not going to buy panniers from Swift...probably not...maybe..." in 
> Omaha 
>
> On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 6:45 AM Howard Ramsay  wrote:
>
>> I asked this week. Reply here ->  Hi Howard,
>>
>> We're waiting on a rear rack to be developed that will determine how the 
>> bags attach. We're working on 'em!
>> -will
>>
>> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 2:14:24 PM UTC-6 Gary L wrote:
>>
>>> I love sackvilles too, and they are a spectacular deal, but if you want 
>>> to go all in on handmade bags, check out Fogg bags. They are made by a 
>>> great couple in southern France. I have one and it is exquisite.
>>> https://www.foggspecialistbags.com/
>>>
>>> And I too am waiting for the backabikes to be back in stock.
>>>
>>> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 11:43:24 AM UTC-5 Berkeleyan wrote:
>>>
 Indeed, I've carried my Scotch, as well as my beer, in a grid-grey 
 Sackville bag, and enjoyed both the riding and the imbibing. And my 
 Scottish friends all agree.

 - Andrew, Berkeley

 On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 7:23:30 AM UTC-8 Edwin W wrote:

> Especially when you compare them to some alternatives, like this $745 
> Scotch bag!
> https://www.westleyrichards.com/us/scotch-bag-in-forest-green
>
> Enjoying flat, grabby, and jumbo grabby sacks,
>
> Edwin
>
 -- 
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/8b12d6a4-cdb4-43db-8dbd-5e2a5e92a6c0n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] 11 speed with Silver DT shifters works great!

[Patrick Moore]

Good to know; I know others have reported the same experience, but it's
good to have volume of evidence. I don't have plans to go to 11 (I use 10),
but who knows.


On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 3:01 PM Andrew Turner 
wrote:

> I'm sure to most, this is a 'no duh' situation but throwing my hat in for
> the approval vote regardless. If there are any die-hard 9 speed friction
> fans out there like me, this might be of interest.
> Before I thought:
>
> A) the Silver DT shifters don't pull enough cable to fit 11 speed
> B) I'd be spending the majority of the ride feathering the gears
>
> Wrong and wrong. It works shockingly well, perhaps even better than 8-9
> speeds perhaps because there's simply less room to mess it up. Now I
> probably wouldn't enjoy it as much with shifters that didn't utilize the
> ratcheting system since I can feel how the ratchet sorta auto-corrects the
> right engagement point when I'm changing gears but that's a topic of
> personal taste.
>
> My setup is an Ultegra 6800 long cage rear mech, 11 speed chain, 11-34 105
> cassette, and a Grand Cru 50.4 46-30 crankset.
>
> Obviously the downside of all this is cost but if anyone was building up
> something new and was 11 speed friction curious, give it a shot!
>
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> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Ben Miller]

Okay, okay, I have to admit Johnny's comparisons of "Riv is to the Dead as 
Crust is to Bowie" got a laugh out of me. That and some of the other 
comments got me thinking a bit, Riv and Crust are more than just the bikes. 
Sure other bike companies were influenced by Grant: Surly, Velo Orange, 
Rawland, etc, but I'd make a case that they lack the personality that Riv 
and Crust have. 

Crust literally started because Matt made the bikes that he and his friends 
wanted to ride: Evasion/Matt, Scapegoat/The Goat, Cheeco/Angelica, and 
Romanceur/Ronnie. That's pretty bold and subversive in a Riv way. And these 
are bikes that definitely didn't exist in any other form at the time. In 
many ways, the Bombora which Russ used in the comparisons is the most 
"normal" bike in the Crust lineup (Dan from Bike Insights made a flowchart 
and to get to the Bombora the answer is "Man, I just want a bike. I'm not a 
weirdo")

But even more than that, the team a Crust is then filled out with these 
personalities. Much like Riv highlighting their team through "Staff Bikes" 
and their Instagram account, Crust does that too with their Elevator to 
Hell videos. And both companies use their platform to raise awareness to 
causes they care about. Crust's sponsoring of the Slim One because they can 
and think it is the right thing to do is along the same lines as Riv's BRF 
experiment, though perhaps less controversial. And Grant being open about 
cash flow problems isn't that different from Crust taking a break over 
holidays and being open about feeling overwhelmed at the time. 

All this adds up to two companies that are almost as much about the people 
as the bikes. I find myself routing for Grant and Matt, hoping their 
projects work out even if I don't want that particular one for myself. I 
definitely can't say that about Surly or New Albion. In a way, both 
companies are a bit like custom builders because of that, you feel a 
personal connection. I think that is what the makes the Rivendell vs Crust 
comparison so unique. 

As far as guitarists: James Iha, Dave Navarro, John Frusciante. Yes, I am 
Gen X.

(Disclaimer: I will tip my hat to Velo Orange, especially when Chris at the 
helm, feels like a company that had a real personal touch and a sense of 
humor) 

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:44:58 AM UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:

> Just to clarify, I'm certainly not getting bent because I'm not a fan of 
> the video editing (or the content, for that matter.) And whether or not he 
> is making money, or is trying to make money, or is performing a public 
> service because he enjoys the luxury of enough free time to do so, is not 
> really relevant. He is obviously sincere in what he does and seems to have 
> a decent following. And good for him. After watching the video above, I 
> would not be able to use it to make a decision as to which bike might be 
> better for me. On the one hand, he refers to the Bombora as spicey and 
> sporty. On the other, he says the Riv's steering is quicker, but keeps 
> calling it relaxed and chill. Hard to tell, but it looks like maybe the 
> Bombora has more drop from saddle to bars. Who knows. 
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 12:15:36 PM UTC-5 mrg...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I love bike comparison videos of every kind. I want to see Rivs vs Rivs 
>> with some tiny difference, Riv vs Crusts, Surlys, carbon TT bikes, 
>> everything. I want to see "I took my Electra Townie to a pump track", 
>> "super-low-trail bike vs penny farthing for grocery getter", "55 Atlantis 
>> 29er vs 56 Atlantis 650b", "Same bike with 12 different handlebar setups", 
>> etc.  
>>
>> I like what Russ at Path Less Pedaled is doing; he's all about the 
>> "non-competitive side of cycling" which aligns with RBW perfectly. 
>>
>> Mike 
>> Austin TX
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 10:49:04 AM UTC-6 bjmi...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> If I had a YouTube channel and wanted people to watch, click the like 
>>> button, subscribe, etc... I'd probably write titles that makes people want 
>>> to click them. When I go shopping for a car, I don't get bent about car 
>>> sales tactics that are there for a reason, even if they kind of annoy me. I 
>>> know I'm trying to be manipulated online with YouTube titles, I recognize 
>>> it, and I accept that it's something they have to do. 
>>>
>>> As for the aesthetic of the edits being rough, I don't know if this is 
>>> the case or not, but I think it's intentional. Russ has a background in 
>>> film and photography, so I have to think that producing videos with that 
>>> jumpiness is intended. 
>>>
>>> I'm not saying it's good or bad, but the jumpy edits could be argued to 
>>> be good because they do create a feeling of energy/excitement by 
>>> eliminating long pauses. 
>>>
>>> I could be (and usually am) totally wrong and Russ just throws these 
>>> together without thinking about it. But I think knowing his tendencies and 
>>> background, I'd say he means to do 

[RBW] Experiences with Riv/Soma Clipper Crankset?

[Brett Callahan]

Has anyone used the clipper triple that Riv is now selling? I believe it's 
imported by Soma. This one: 
https://www.rivbike.com/products/crank-akhdkgn2154sdg

I have an older model Atlantis with a 94 bcd crankset that needs new rings 
and could use a new BB as well. Replacing the rings is trying my patience. 
I tracked down some Vuelta rings on ebay, which go for about $80. The nice 
looking TA ones are significantly more and the availability looks spotty. 

The shiny triple isn't that much more, but I'm wondering if folks have used 
it and how experiences have been. 

Cheers,
Brett in PDX

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Re: [RBW] Re: Paul Racers on a Cheviot?

[Justin Kennedy]

Thanks for everyone's input. A front Paul Racer is already on order.

On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 12:08 PM RichS  wrote:

> Hello Justin:
>
> Another vote for the centerpull front / R559 sidepull rear setup. Works
> very nicely on my Sam. The centerpull provided better clearance for a front
> fender.
> Adding to the props for Paul Racers, they will definitely stop you NOW.
>
> Best,
> Rich in ATL
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 9:03:45 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy wrote:
>
>> Thanks Laing, I'm probably going to start by replacing the defective
>> front R559 with a Paul Racer and see how it goes leaving the rear R559 in
>> place.
>> I agree -- don't love the look of adding extraneous clamps etc and I
>> really don't like the look of a rear center-pull cable straddling the seat
>> tube for some
>> reason. Thanks for your input.
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 4:17 PM lconley  wrote:
>>
>>> There can be some very good reasons for using a centerpull on the front
>>> and a sidepull on the rear:
>>> 1. Centerpulls generally give more clearance which is almost always a
>>> bigger issue on the front than the rear. Especially true with fenders.
>>> 2. Sidepulls sometimes fit better on the rear, especially on mixte type
>>> frames with offset cable stops - I try not to clamp things to by frame
>>> unless there is no other way. On my Rosco Bubbe V1, there is insufficient
>>> distance from a cable hanger to the straddle cable to use a center pull.
>>> 3. You don't really need the additional baking power of a centerpull on
>>> the rear, locking up the rear wheel is not the fastest way to stop.
>>>
>>> I run the Dia-Compe DC610-N centerpull front, Tektro R559 sidepull rear
>>> combo on both my Rosco Bubbe and Betty Foy.
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> [image: Resized_20200330_120439.jpeg]
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 3:22:34 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy wrote:
>>>
 Ha! It's pretty awesome/astounding how jalopy-ish some of the Riv staff
 bikes look. Will might take the cake in that department with this
 orange Chev
  which
 coicidentally has the same Racer-in-the-front, R559-in-the-rear set up.
 That hacked off front fender is 

 On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 2:58 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Justin,
>
> For informational purposes only because everyone has already answered
> that Racers work front and rear: I asked Will about his front Racer once
> and he said it's there because he had a front one and felt like using it.
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:34:03 AM UTC-8 Justin Kennedy
> (Brooklyn, NY) wrote:
>
>> I've used Tektro R559's on my Cheviot from the start but was recently
>> considering upgrading to something different due to a slight but annoying
>> mechanical issue on the front caliper. (The release lock is stuck so in
>> order to remove the front tire, I have to fully deflate and squeeze it
>> between the pads.)
>>
>> I noticed on Will's Staff Bikes page that he has a Paul Racer on
>> this Chev
>> 
>> but only up front. Guessing it's because the rear geometry wouldn't 
>> allow a
>> hanger placement for a center pull?
>>
>> Has anyone else used this set up? Do Paul Racers have clearance for
>> 700c x 50mm tires? The tires in Will's pic look pretty wide and he's
>> running a fender too so it seems like there would be plenty of room.
>> Thoughts?
>>
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a4ea0f3b-5e38-4302-bf69-ffe62f294157n%40googlegroups.com
>>> 

[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Mark Roland]

Just to clarify, I'm certainly not getting bent because I'm not a fan of 
the video editing (or the content, for that matter.) And whether or not he 
is making money, or is trying to make money, or is performing a public 
service because he enjoys the luxury of enough free time to do so, is not 
really relevant. He is obviously sincere in what he does and seems to have 
a decent following. And good for him. After watching the video above, I 
would not be able to use it to make a decision as to which bike might be 
better for me. On the one hand, he refers to the Bombora as spicey and 
sporty. On the other, he says the Riv's steering is quicker, but keeps 
calling it relaxed and chill. Hard to tell, but it looks like maybe the 
Bombora has more drop from saddle to bars. Who knows. 

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 12:15:36 PM UTC-5 mrg...@gmail.com wrote:

> I love bike comparison videos of every kind. I want to see Rivs vs Rivs 
> with some tiny difference, Riv vs Crusts, Surlys, carbon TT bikes, 
> everything. I want to see "I took my Electra Townie to a pump track", 
> "super-low-trail bike vs penny farthing for grocery getter", "55 Atlantis 
> 29er vs 56 Atlantis 650b", "Same bike with 12 different handlebar setups", 
> etc.  
>
> I like what Russ at Path Less Pedaled is doing; he's all about the 
> "non-competitive side of cycling" which aligns with RBW perfectly. 
>
> Mike 
> Austin TX
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 10:49:04 AM UTC-6 bjmi...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> If I had a YouTube channel and wanted people to watch, click the like 
>> button, subscribe, etc... I'd probably write titles that makes people want 
>> to click them. When I go shopping for a car, I don't get bent about car 
>> sales tactics that are there for a reason, even if they kind of annoy me. I 
>> know I'm trying to be manipulated online with YouTube titles, I recognize 
>> it, and I accept that it's something they have to do. 
>>
>> As for the aesthetic of the edits being rough, I don't know if this is 
>> the case or not, but I think it's intentional. Russ has a background in 
>> film and photography, so I have to think that producing videos with that 
>> jumpiness is intended. 
>>
>> I'm not saying it's good or bad, but the jumpy edits could be argued to 
>> be good because they do create a feeling of energy/excitement by 
>> eliminating long pauses. 
>>
>> I could be (and usually am) totally wrong and Russ just throws these 
>> together without thinking about it. But I think knowing his tendencies and 
>> background, I'd say he means to do it.
>>
>> If it turns you off, that's totally fair and I'm not saying it shouldn't. 
>> He reminds me of John Green's YouTube videos...same kind of editing, no 
>> dead space, frenetic and fast paced energy, etc... 
>>
>> Ben "not an expert on video editing theory" in Omaha 
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:59:14 AM UTC-6 Mark Roland wrote:
>>
>>> Laing wrote:* I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on 
>>> a video that they did not watch. *
>>> The PLP post is titled Rivendell vs. Crust. Which is Better?  There are 
>>> no models in the title, and that is what brings it to the realm of 
>>> clickbait. The OP also states right up front that the video is less 
>>> provocative.  Generally, Rivendell vs. Crust, some of the qualities that 
>>> separate them are disc brakes, more conventional chainstay lengths, and 
>>> yes, low trail. Based on the thrust of the thread starter, I would say 
>>> perfectly legitimate to comment without bothering to watch the actual video 
>>> referenced. Obviously a Sam Hillborne does not qualify as low trail. It may 
>>> be lower trail than bike x, but not low trail. I did find it mildly amusing 
>>> that he was noting the differences between 42.5 and 45.5 chainstays. He 
>>> should try a Susie!
>>>
>>> From an aesthetic point of view, I find his videos hard to watch due to 
>>> the editing/splicing. I wish he would let the camera roll through a bit 
>>> more--maybe he could have a cheat board of notes if he can't talk 
>>> extemporaneously. As it is, the video is noticeably spliced after every 
>>> sentence or two.  Maybe this is normal these days with vlogs, and it's just 
>>> me being old. Oh well.
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:26:38 AM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>>>
 I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
 they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
 trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
 is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.

 One word on guitarists: Hendrix.

 Laing

 On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:

> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I 
> enjoyed 
> the video and don't consider it 

[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Mike Packard]

I love bike comparison videos of every kind. I want to see Rivs vs Rivs 
with some tiny difference, Riv vs Crusts, Surlys, carbon TT bikes, 
everything. I want to see "I took my Electra Townie to a pump track", 
"super-low-trail bike vs penny farthing for grocery getter", "55 Atlantis 
29er vs 56 Atlantis 650b", "Same bike with 12 different handlebar setups", 
etc.  

I like what Russ at Path Less Pedaled is doing; he's all about the 
"non-competitive side of cycling" which aligns with RBW perfectly. 

Mike 
Austin TX


On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 10:49:04 AM UTC-6 bjmi...@gmail.com wrote:

> If I had a YouTube channel and wanted people to watch, click the like 
> button, subscribe, etc... I'd probably write titles that makes people want 
> to click them. When I go shopping for a car, I don't get bent about car 
> sales tactics that are there for a reason, even if they kind of annoy me. I 
> know I'm trying to be manipulated online with YouTube titles, I recognize 
> it, and I accept that it's something they have to do. 
>
> As for the aesthetic of the edits being rough, I don't know if this is the 
> case or not, but I think it's intentional. Russ has a background in film 
> and photography, so I have to think that producing videos with that 
> jumpiness is intended. 
>
> I'm not saying it's good or bad, but the jumpy edits could be argued to be 
> good because they do create a feeling of energy/excitement by eliminating 
> long pauses. 
>
> I could be (and usually am) totally wrong and Russ just throws these 
> together without thinking about it. But I think knowing his tendencies and 
> background, I'd say he means to do it.
>
> If it turns you off, that's totally fair and I'm not saying it shouldn't. 
> He reminds me of John Green's YouTube videos...same kind of editing, no 
> dead space, frenetic and fast paced energy, etc... 
>
> Ben "not an expert on video editing theory" in Omaha 
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:59:14 AM UTC-6 Mark Roland wrote:
>
>> Laing wrote:* I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on 
>> a video that they did not watch. *
>> The PLP post is titled Rivendell vs. Crust. Which is Better?  There are 
>> no models in the title, and that is what brings it to the realm of 
>> clickbait. The OP also states right up front that the video is less 
>> provocative.  Generally, Rivendell vs. Crust, some of the qualities that 
>> separate them are disc brakes, more conventional chainstay lengths, and 
>> yes, low trail. Based on the thrust of the thread starter, I would say 
>> perfectly legitimate to comment without bothering to watch the actual video 
>> referenced. Obviously a Sam Hillborne does not qualify as low trail. It may 
>> be lower trail than bike x, but not low trail. I did find it mildly amusing 
>> that he was noting the differences between 42.5 and 45.5 chainstays. He 
>> should try a Susie!
>>
>> From an aesthetic point of view, I find his videos hard to watch due to 
>> the editing/splicing. I wish he would let the camera roll through a bit 
>> more--maybe he could have a cheat board of notes if he can't talk 
>> extemporaneously. As it is, the video is noticeably spliced after every 
>> sentence or two.  Maybe this is normal these days with vlogs, and it's just 
>> me being old. Oh well.
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:26:38 AM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>>
>>> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
>>> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
>>> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
>>> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>>>
>>> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>>>
>>> Laing
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>>>
 FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
 it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I 
 enjoyed 
 the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
 this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?

 And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
 never heard of him but will now check him out.

 Tom Milani
 Alexandria, VA USA

 On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread 
> which is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to 
> the thread being a thread. 
>
> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
>> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
>> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
>> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy 

Re: [RBW] Re: Paul Racers on a Cheviot?

[RichS]

Hello Justin:

Another vote for the centerpull front / R559 sidepull rear setup. Works 
very nicely on my Sam. The centerpull provided better clearance for a front 
fender. 
Adding to the props for Paul Racers, they will definitely stop you NOW.

Best,
Rich in ATL

On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 9:03:45 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy wrote:

> Thanks Laing, I'm probably going to start by replacing the defective front 
> R559 with a Paul Racer and see how it goes leaving the rear R559 in place. 
> I agree -- don't love the look of adding extraneous clamps etc and I 
> really don't like the look of a rear center-pull cable straddling the seat 
> tube for some 
> reason. Thanks for your input. 
>
> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 4:17 PM lconley  wrote:
>
>> There can be some very good reasons for using a centerpull on the front 
>> and a sidepull on the rear: 
>> 1. Centerpulls generally give more clearance which is almost always a 
>> bigger issue on the front than the rear. Especially true with fenders.
>> 2. Sidepulls sometimes fit better on the rear, especially on mixte type 
>> frames with offset cable stops - I try not to clamp things to by frame 
>> unless there is no other way. On my Rosco Bubbe V1, there is insufficient 
>> distance from a cable hanger to the straddle cable to use a center pull.
>> 3. You don't really need the additional baking power of a centerpull on 
>> the rear, locking up the rear wheel is not the fastest way to stop.
>>
>> I run the Dia-Compe DC610-N centerpull front, Tektro R559 sidepull rear 
>> combo on both my Rosco Bubbe and Betty Foy.
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> [image: Resized_20200330_120439.jpeg]
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 3:22:34 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy wrote:
>>
>>> Ha! It's pretty awesome/astounding how jalopy-ish some of the Riv staff 
>>> bikes look. Will might take the cake in that department with this 
>>> orange Chev 
>>>  which 
>>> coicidentally has the same Racer-in-the-front, R559-in-the-rear set up. 
>>> That hacked off front fender is   
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 2:58 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>>
 Justin,

 For informational purposes only because everyone has already answered 
 that Racers work front and rear: I asked Will about his front Racer once 
 and he said it's there because he had a front one and felt like using it. 

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:34:03 AM UTC-8 Justin Kennedy 
 (Brooklyn, NY) wrote:

> I've used Tektro R559's on my Cheviot from the start but was recently 
> considering upgrading to something different due to a slight but annoying 
> mechanical issue on the front caliper. (The release lock is stuck so in 
> order to remove the front tire, I have to fully deflate and squeeze it 
> between the pads.)
>
> I noticed on Will's Staff Bikes page that he has a Paul Racer on this 
> Chev 
> 
>  
> but only up front. Guessing it's because the rear geometry wouldn't allow 
> a 
> hanger placement for a center pull?  
>
> Has anyone else used this set up? Do Paul Racers have clearance for 
> 700c x 50mm tires? The tires in Will's pic look pretty wide and he's 
> running a fender too so it seems like there would be plenty of room. 
> Thoughts?
>
 -- 

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 .

>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> (c) 347-325-2640 <(347)%20325-2640>
>>> justink...@gmail.com
>>> www.justin-kennedy.com
>>>
>> -- 
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a4ea0f3b-5e38-4302-bf69-ffe62f294157n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
> (c) 

Re: [RBW] Re: Sackville Sacks are a good deal

[Ben Mihovk]

Huh...I got a different response from Spencer, but I think you can put his
together with Will's and see what's happening.

Spencer told me, and I paraphrase, I don't have an answer because it could
be a month, it could be three months. He was very polite, though...hard to
capture that in my paraphrase.

Ben "not going to buy panniers from Swift...probably not...maybe..." in
Omaha

On Thu, Feb 11, 2021 at 6:45 AM Howard Ramsay  wrote:

> I asked this week. Reply here ->  Hi Howard,
>
> We're waiting on a rear rack to be developed that will determine how the
> bags attach. We're working on 'em!
> -will
>
> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 2:14:24 PM UTC-6 Gary L wrote:
>
>> I love sackvilles too, and they are a spectacular deal, but if you want
>> to go all in on handmade bags, check out Fogg bags. They are made by a
>> great couple in southern France. I have one and it is exquisite.
>> https://www.foggspecialistbags.com/
>>
>> And I too am waiting for the backabikes to be back in stock.
>>
>> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 11:43:24 AM UTC-5 Berkeleyan wrote:
>>
>>> Indeed, I've carried my Scotch, as well as my beer, in a grid-grey
>>> Sackville bag, and enjoyed both the riding and the imbibing. And my
>>> Scottish friends all agree.
>>>
>>> - Andrew, Berkeley
>>>
>>> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 7:23:30 AM UTC-8 Edwin W wrote:
>>>
 Especially when you compare them to some alternatives, like this $745
 Scotch bag!
 https://www.westleyrichards.com/us/scotch-bag-in-forest-green

 Enjoying flat, grabby, and jumbo grabby sacks,

 Edwin

>>> --
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[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Ben Mihovk]

If I had a YouTube channel and wanted people to watch, click the like 
button, subscribe, etc... I'd probably write titles that makes people want 
to click them. When I go shopping for a car, I don't get bent about car 
sales tactics that are there for a reason, even if they kind of annoy me. I 
know I'm trying to be manipulated online with YouTube titles, I recognize 
it, and I accept that it's something they have to do. 

As for the aesthetic of the edits being rough, I don't know if this is the 
case or not, but I think it's intentional. Russ has a background in film 
and photography, so I have to think that producing videos with that 
jumpiness is intended. 

I'm not saying it's good or bad, but the jumpy edits could be argued to be 
good because they do create a feeling of energy/excitement by eliminating 
long pauses. 

I could be (and usually am) totally wrong and Russ just throws these 
together without thinking about it. But I think knowing his tendencies and 
background, I'd say he means to do it.

If it turns you off, that's totally fair and I'm not saying it shouldn't. 
He reminds me of John Green's YouTube videos...same kind of editing, no 
dead space, frenetic and fast paced energy, etc... 

Ben "not an expert on video editing theory" in Omaha 


On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:59:14 AM UTC-6 Mark Roland wrote:

> Laing wrote:* I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a 
> video that they did not watch. *
> The PLP post is titled Rivendell vs. Crust. Which is Better?  There are no 
> models in the title, and that is what brings it to the realm of clickbait. 
> The OP also states right up front that the video is less provocative.  
> Generally, Rivendell vs. Crust, some of the qualities that separate them 
> are disc brakes, more conventional chainstay lengths, and yes, low trail. 
> Based on the thrust of the thread starter, I would say perfectly legitimate 
> to comment without bothering to watch the actual video referenced. 
> Obviously a Sam Hillborne does not qualify as low trail. It may be lower 
> trail than bike x, but not low trail. I did find it mildly amusing that he 
> was noting the differences between 42.5 and 45.5 chainstays. He should try 
> a Susie!
>
> From an aesthetic point of view, I find his videos hard to watch due to 
> the editing/splicing. I wish he would let the camera roll through a bit 
> more--maybe he could have a cheat board of notes if he can't talk 
> extemporaneously. As it is, the video is noticeably spliced after every 
> sentence or two.  Maybe this is normal these days with vlogs, and it's just 
> me being old. Oh well.
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:26:38 AM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>
>> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
>> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
>> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
>> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>>
>> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>>
>>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
>>> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed 
>>> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
>>> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>>
>>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>>
>>> Tom Milani
>>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which 
 is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the 
 thread being a thread. 

 Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
> that 
> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 
>
> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>
>> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with 
>> the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
>> " 
>>
>> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing 
>> his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than 
>> it 
>> could be? 
>>
>> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. 
>> I know that their the only two 

[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Philip Barrett]

Path Less Pedalled is one of the good guys and I think Russ works alone out 
of his (unheated) garage in Montana which may account for some of the 
editing trickery? Personally I find it great that there is so much great 
stuff to watch out there for absolutely no cost, most of these creators are 
making maybe a few bucks a month doing this. If I don't agree with a 
channel I just click through.

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 9:59:14 AM UTC-6 Mark Roland wrote:

> Laing wrote:* I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a 
> video that they did not watch. *
> The PLP post is titled Rivendell vs. Crust. Which is Better?  There are no 
> models in the title, and that is what brings it to the realm of clickbait. 
> The OP also states right up front that the video is less provocative.  
> Generally, Rivendell vs. Crust, some of the qualities that separate them 
> are disc brakes, more conventional chainstay lengths, and yes, low trail. 
> Based on the thrust of the thread starter, I would say perfectly legitimate 
> to comment without bothering to watch the actual video referenced. 
> Obviously a Sam Hillborne does not qualify as low trail. It may be lower 
> trail than bike x, but not low trail. I did find it mildly amusing that he 
> was noting the differences between 42.5 and 45.5 chainstays. He should try 
> a Susie!
>
> From an aesthetic point of view, I find his videos hard to watch due to 
> the editing/splicing. I wish he would let the camera roll through a bit 
> more--maybe he could have a cheat board of notes if he can't talk 
> extemporaneously. As it is, the video is noticeably spliced after every 
> sentence or two.  Maybe this is normal these days with vlogs, and it's just 
> me being old. Oh well.
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:26:38 AM UTC-5 lconley wrote:
>
>> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
>> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
>> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
>> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>>
>> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>>
>> Laing
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>>
>>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
>>> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed 
>>> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
>>> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>>
>>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>>
>>> Tom Milani
>>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>>
>>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which 
 is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the 
 thread being a thread. 

 Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way 
> that 
> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 
>
> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>
>> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with 
>> the provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
>> " 
>>
>> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing 
>> his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than 
>> it 
>> could be? 
>>
>> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. 
>> I know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so 
>> I 
>> do it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to Matt 
>> & 
>> Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell 
>> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing 
>> the 
>> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be 
>> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
>> bikes 
>> had. 
>>
>> Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail compared 
>> to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like most 
>> thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your hot 
>> take 
>> on the two?
>>
>> I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and 
>> important stuff for the bike 

[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Mark Roland]

 Laing wrote:* I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a 
video that they did not watch. *
The PLP post is titled Rivendell vs. Crust. Which is Better?  There are no 
models in the title, and that is what brings it to the realm of clickbait. 
The OP also states right up front that the video is less provocative.  
Generally, Rivendell vs. Crust, some of the qualities that separate them 
are disc brakes, more conventional chainstay lengths, and yes, low trail. 
Based on the thrust of the thread starter, I would say perfectly legitimate 
to comment without bothering to watch the actual video referenced. 
Obviously a Sam Hillborne does not qualify as low trail. It may be lower 
trail than bike x, but not low trail. I did find it mildly amusing that he 
was noting the differences between 42.5 and 45.5 chainstays. He should try 
a Susie!

>From an aesthetic point of view, I find his videos hard to watch due to the 
editing/splicing. I wish he would let the camera roll through a bit 
more--maybe he could have a cheat board of notes if he can't talk 
extemporaneously. As it is, the video is noticeably spliced after every 
sentence or two.  Maybe this is normal these days with vlogs, and it's just 
me being old. Oh well.

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:26:38 AM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

> I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that 
> they did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low 
> trail" bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what 
> is in it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.
>
> One word on guitarists: Hendrix.
>
> Laing
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:
>
>> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
>> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed 
>> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
>> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>>
>> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd 
>> never heard of him but will now check him out.
>>
>> Tom Milani
>> Alexandria, VA USA
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which 
>>> is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the 
>>> thread being a thread. 
>>>
>>> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
 comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
 "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
 Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way that 
 I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 

 On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:

> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with the 
> provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
> " 
>
> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing 
> his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than 
> it 
> could be? 
>
> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. I 
> know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so I 
> do 
> it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to Matt & 
> Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell 
> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing 
> the 
> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be 
> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
> bikes 
> had. 
>
> Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail compared 
> to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like most 
> thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your hot 
> take 
> on the two?
>
> I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and 
> important stuff for the bike industry. What I think would be really 
> interesting collaboration between Grant and Matt. Maybe something along 
> the 
> lines of the Soma San Marcos, but both providing inputs. That'd be really 
> cool!
>


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Re: [RBW] Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[Den John]

OK, since we're off topic anyway, which companies/individual framebuilders 
can be compared with which classic rock bands/musicians? Here's a couple of 
attempts:

Riv> Grateful Dead: fanatically loyal fanbase, plus lots of people who just 
don't get it man.
Surly> Fleetwood Mac. Tend to get dismissed as lightweight pop, but did 
some innovative stuff in their time.
Bruce Gordon> John Lydon. Bit scary, tends to rub people up the wrong way, 
but a major influence.
Crust> David Bowie. Flirting with all kinds of different identities. A bit 
erratic but always good quality. 

Johnny in Belgium

On Thursday, 11 February 2021 at 15:53:40 UTC+1 Eric Daume wrote:

> I’ve had a lot of bikes pass through my garage, but my rSogn is one of the 
> few I regret selling. 
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021, Mark Roland  wrote:
>
>> Sorry, cut off the fork legs! Re: current models. I don't think there are 
>> any. Didn't they implode a few years back? (One more non-Riv element to the 
>> Nord--43mm chainstays across all sizes.)
>>
>> [image: IMG_0113.JPG]
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 12:40:18 AM UTC-5 Jason Fuller wrote:
>>
>>> I miss the days when Rawland did curved fork legs :(  Such gorgeous 
>>> frames.  I am sure the current models ride nice but just not the same. 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 9:35 PM Mark Roland  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I agree with Mark S. that the title is just silly clickbait and don't 
 have much interest in watching. I'm sure the video itself is more nuanced, 
 but still not that interested. Crust makes some interesting bicycles, and 
 they appeal to all the people who complain that Rivendell won't do disc 
 brakes or low trail--almost a market sitting there waiting to be provided 
 to. 

 I guess there have been some almost blatant attempts at copying, but 
 that is not necessarily a bad thing, especially if it captures enough of 
 the good but maybe at a lower price point. Also, everyone "copies" --Grant 
 did not reinvent the wheel. However, he took designs (and materials) that 
 had fallen from favor and continued developing them. I think his designs 
 of 
 the last five years are his most radical and successful. One way I know 
 they are the most radical is that it's much harder to find a vintage 
 platform to build up a wanna-be Rivendell--there just isn't anything out 
 there that is close. The way I know they are successful is I own three of 
 them. 

 By the way, the Rawland  Nordavinden  mentioned above, other than being 
 steel, is not particularly Rivish. It uses standard size tubing and it has 
 a barely sloped 7/4/7 top tube and a low trail geometry. It is much more 
 in 
 the vein of a Bicycle Quarterly Rando machine. I had the pleasure of being 
 part of the online design crew that helped develop Rawland's previous 
 offering, the rSogn. It too had a lightweight, standard diameter top tube 
 and low trail design. The main differences were all sizes were 650b, more 
 sloped tt, clearance for wider tires, threadless, beefier fork, and 
 cantilever brakes. Here's mine (since sold, replaced by a L'avecaise, also 
 since sold):

 [image: IMG_0127.JPG]

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 11:36:38 PM UTC-5 Ben Miller wrote:

> Well, I guess this thread has gone entirely OT.
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:03:33 PM UTC-8 Robert Tilley 
> wrote:
>
>> Richard Thompson is of the best I’ve seen. And a great songwriter. 
>> Right now I’m leaning towards Robert Fripp but it’s hard to argue 
>> against 
>> Thompson. 
>>
>> As far as bikes go, for me old Riv > Crust while Crust > new Riv. I 
>> can’t really get into a lot of the newer frames Riv has put out but I 
>> love 
>> the older models. I’m a Riv retrogrouch I guess.
>>
>> Robert Tilley
>> San Diego, CA
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Feb 10, 2021, at 11:47 AM, Mike Godwin  wrote:
>>
>> Actually its Richard Thompson
>>
>>
>> Mike SLO CA
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:17:49 AM UTC-8 Jason Fuller 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Totally agree on the Crust / Riv collaboration frame. That would be 
>>> really neat. I love the idea of single-batch collaboration runs like 
>>> this, 
>>> and it would be cool to see more of them.  I tried to publicly connect 
>>> Ocean Air Cycles and Rivendell to spark a MIT run of their Rambler 
>>> frameset 
>>> but it didn't work haha. 
>>>
>>> I imagine that collaborative frame being fairly sporty tubing but 
>>> tons of tire clearance, and pretty long in the TT for upright bars or 
>>> zero-reach drop setups 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, 9 February 2021 at 20:03:14 UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>>>

 I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and 

Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Clem Smith Jr. L 59cm Mustard

[Ray]

Joe -- That's very interesting. I don't think that would have done it in my 
case, but it's good to know for the future.

Collin -- Yes! It is the one you sold me. No worries, I got it sorted out 
and thanks again. Some might disagree with this move, but I actually had my 
LBS ream out just a small amount of material from the downtube so that a 
27mm fit the lug/clamp as well. I did talk to someone at Riv who generously 
offered to do the same knurling for free even though it was secondhand. But 
I change my fit too often and sometimes my partner or guests borrow my 
bikes so I wanted it to function at more than just one height. All worked 
out in the end--no issues at all anymore.

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 7:17:42 AM UTC-6 Mark Roland wrote:

> At that price, shipped overseas (again) you could start to consider a 
> Susie. Truly beautiful bikes in person, and can do everything a Clem can, 
> plus a bit more tire room.  Considering how long you will have the bike, 
> worth it no question. Also splits the difference top tube-wise between a 
> Clem L and a Clem H!
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:22:30 PM UTC-5 BRETT ROBINSON wrote:
>
>> Whoa, nice. Quite the premium for mustard, but may go this route if 
>> nothing better pops up. Thanks!
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 2:07:23 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>> Ding! wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> https://global.bluelug.com/rivendell-clem-smith-jr-frame-set-h-style-mustard.html
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>> On Feb 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, BRETT ROBINSON  wrote:
>>>
>>> In that case, anyone have a 59cm Clementine/Clem L (any color), OR, a 
>>> 59cm Clem H in mustard? Wanting a step through but I'd consider a 59 H in 
>>> mustard.
>>>
>>>
>>> Also interested in a Rosco Bubbe mixte if anyone is selling.
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:12:25 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Brett,

 No mustard L's that I'm aware of. My recollection is there was a 
 mustard H and orange L in that batch. 

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:05:06 PM UTC-8 BRETT ROBINSON 
 wrote:

> Leah
>
> It's well loved, does duty most days as a school bus or errand runner.
>
> By the way, anyone know if 59cm Clem L in mustard was a combo Riv 
> produced? Realizing I've never seen a pic of one. Did they only make this 
> in the H version, or are there L's floating around out there?
>
> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 7:52:47 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding 
> Ding! wrote:
>
>>
>> Things That Warm the Heart of Leah Peterson: that’s where to file 
>> this. ♥️ I’m so glad the Betty is loved. That was at the top of my list. 
>> L
>> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 7:19:15 PM UTC-8 BRETT ROBINSON wrote:
>>
>>> Looking for a 59 cm Clem L, in mustard (butterscotch? butternut? 
>>> whatever it's called, you know the one!). My wife is tired of me 
>>> stealing 
>>> her Betty Foy that I bought for her from bicyclebelle last year.
>>
>> -- 
>>>
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/KGlZjEd8kbA/unsubscribe
>>> .
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to 
>>> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/396ac886-3f7e-4269-8741-59d06112fec7n%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

[lconley]

I get a big kick out of all the people with commentary on a video that they 
did not watch. As Tom pointed out, the Sam Hillborne is the "low trail" 
bike in this comparison - you need to watch the video to know what is in 
it. Note that I have one Crust (Scapegoat) and 12 Rivendells.

One word on guitarists: Hendrix.

Laing

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 8:09:04 AM UTC-5 Tom M wrote:

> FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said 
> it's 76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed 
> the video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked 
> this type of question all the time, so why not do a video?
>
> And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd never 
> heard of him but will now check him out.
>
> Tom Milani
> Alexandria, VA USA
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which 
>> is the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the 
>> thread being a thread. 
>>
>> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a 
>>> comparison, it's two very different approaches to what is considered the 
>>> "right" way for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a 
>>> Crust Lightning Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way that 
>>> I do *not *like low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>>>
 The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with the 
 provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
 " 

 The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing 
 his Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than it 
 could be? 

 I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. I 
 know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so I do 
 it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to Matt & 
 Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell 
 aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing 
 the 
 Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be 
 saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust 
 bikes 
 had. 

 Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail compared 
 to Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like most 
 thing's not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your hot 
 take 
 on the two?

 I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and important 
 stuff for the bike industry. What I think would be really interesting 
 collaboration between Grant and Matt. Maybe something along the lines of 
 the Soma San Marcos, but both providing inputs. That'd be really cool!

>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Clem Smith Jr. L 59cm Mustard

[Mark Roland]

At that price, shipped overseas (again) you could start to consider a 
Susie. Truly beautiful bikes in person, and can do everything a Clem can, 
plus a bit more tire room.  Considering how long you will have the bike, 
worth it no question. Also splits the difference top tube-wise between a 
Clem L and a Clem H!

On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:22:30 PM UTC-5 BRETT ROBINSON wrote:

> Whoa, nice. Quite the premium for mustard, but may go this route if 
> nothing better pops up. Thanks!
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 2:07:23 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding 
> Ding! wrote:
>
>>
>> https://global.bluelug.com/rivendell-clem-smith-jr-frame-set-h-style-mustard.html
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Feb 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, BRETT ROBINSON  wrote:
>>
>> In that case, anyone have a 59cm Clementine/Clem L (any color), OR, a 
>> 59cm Clem H in mustard? Wanting a step through but I'd consider a 59 H in 
>> mustard.
>>
>>
>> Also interested in a Rosco Bubbe mixte if anyone is selling.
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:12:25 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Brett,
>>>
>>> No mustard L's that I'm aware of. My recollection is there was a mustard 
>>> H and orange L in that batch. 
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:05:06 PM UTC-8 BRETT ROBINSON wrote:
>>>
 Leah

 It's well loved, does duty most days as a school bus or errand runner.

 By the way, anyone know if 59cm Clem L in mustard was a combo Riv 
 produced? Realizing I've never seen a pic of one. Did they only make this 
 in the H version, or are there L's floating around out there?

 On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 7:52:47 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding 
 Ding! wrote:

>
> Things That Warm the Heart of Leah Peterson: that’s where to file 
> this. ♥️ I’m so glad the Betty is loved. That was at the top of my list. 
> L
> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 7:19:15 PM UTC-8 BRETT ROBINSON wrote:
>
>> Looking for a 59 cm Clem L, in mustard (butterscotch? butternut? 
>> whatever it's called, you know the one!). My wife is tired of me 
>> stealing 
>> her Betty Foy that I bought for her from bicyclebelle last year.
>
> -- 
>>
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/KGlZjEd8kbA/unsubscribe
>> .
>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to 
>> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/396ac886-3f7e-4269-8741-59d06112fec7n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Paul Racers on a Cheviot?

[Mark Roland]

Laing wrote: *There can be some very good reasons for using a centerpull on 
the front and a sidepull on the rear: 1., 2., 3, *

4. They are expensive as heck, so running one saves you lots of money. 


On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 4:17:24 PM UTC-5 lconley wrote:

> There can be some very good reasons for using a centerpull on the front 
> and a sidepull on the rear: 
> 1. Centerpulls generally give more clearance which is almost always a 
> bigger issue on the front than the rear. Especially true with fenders.
> 2. Sidepulls sometimes fit better on the rear, especially on mixte type 
> frames with offset cable stops - I try not to clamp things to by frame 
> unless there is no other way. On my Rosco Bubbe V1, there is insufficient 
> distance from a cable hanger to the straddle cable to use a center pull.
> 3. You don't really need the additional baking power of a centerpull on 
> the rear, locking up the rear wheel is not the fastest way to stop.
>
> I run the Dia-Compe DC610-N centerpull front, Tektro R559 sidepull rear 
> combo on both my Rosco Bubbe and Betty Foy.
>
> Laing
>
> [image: Resized_20200330_120439.jpeg]
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 3:22:34 PM UTC-5 Justin Kennedy wrote:
>
>> Ha! It's pretty awesome/astounding how jalopy-ish some of the Riv staff 
>> bikes look. Will might take the cake in that department with this orange 
>> Chev  which 
>> coicidentally has the same Racer-in-the-front, R559-in-the-rear set up. 
>> That hacked off front fender is   
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 2:58 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:
>>
>>> Justin,
>>>
>>> For informational purposes only because everyone has already answered 
>>> that Racers work front and rear: I asked Will about his front Racer once 
>>> and he said it's there because he had a front one and felt like using it. 
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:34:03 AM UTC-8 Justin Kennedy 
>>> (Brooklyn, NY) wrote:
>>>
 I've used Tektro R559's on my Cheviot from the start but was recently 
 considering upgrading to something different due to a slight but annoying 
 mechanical issue on the front caliper. (The release lock is stuck so in 
 order to remove the front tire, I have to fully deflate and squeeze it 
 between the pads.)

 I noticed on Will's Staff Bikes page that he has a Paul Racer on this 
 Chev 
 
  
 but only up front. Guessing it's because the rear geometry wouldn't allow 
 a 
 hanger placement for a center pull?  

 Has anyone else used this set up? Do Paul Racers have clearance for 
 700c x 50mm tires? The tires in Will's pic look pretty wide and he's 
 running a fender too so it seems like there would be plenty of room. 
 Thoughts?

>>> -- 
>>>
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
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>>> .
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>>> rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>>
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e86b401e-2baa-49d3-9f79-515392c3426cn%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> (c) 347-325-2640 <(347)%20325-2640>
>> justink...@gmail.com
>> www.justin-kennedy.com
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better?

['Tom M' via RBW Owners Bunch]

FWIW, the particular Crust Russ is reviewing isn't low trail — he said it's 
76 or 75 mm. I don't have a particular dog in the fight, and I enjoyed the 
video and don't consider it click-bait. As Russ said, he gets asked this 
type of question all the time, so why not do a video?

And re: guitarists—thanks to Philip for the Rory Gallagher link. I'd never 
heard of him but will now check him out.

Tom Milani
Alexandria, VA USA

On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 2:18:44 AM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Which - to be clear - is my response to the premise of the thread which is 
> the premise of the Path Less Pedaled thing. I'm not objecting to the thread 
> being a thread. 
>
> Joe "let me say this about that" Bernard
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 10:02:16 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I don't think a Riv vs. anything low trail really counts as a comparison, 
>> it's two very different approaches to what is considered the "right" way 
>> for a bicycle to handle. But my bias is extreme, I bought a Crust Lightning 
>> Bolt (disc) and hoo boy did I learn the expensive way that I do *not *like 
>> low trail. Rivs ride the way I need my bikes to ride. 
>>
>> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 8:03:14 PM UTC-8 Ben Miller wrote:
>>
>>> The "Path Less Pedaled" YouTube channel just released a video with the 
>>> provocative title "Rivendell vs Crust! Which is Better? 
>>> " 
>>>
>>> The actual video is a lot less provocative. Basically Russ comparing his 
>>> Hillborne to his Bombora. Still interesting, but maybe less so than it 
>>> could be? 
>>>
>>> I imagine Crust and Rivendell must get compared to each other a lot. I 
>>> know that their the only two bike frames I currently own and ride, so I do 
>>> it more or less constantly. I imagine that this is partly due to Matt & 
>>> Bene purposefully designing the Romanceur frame with the Rivendell 
>>> aesthetic in mind. I think Russ sort of touches on that, when comparing the 
>>> Bombora to the All City and the Hillborne to the Richtey. He seems to be 
>>> saying, the Ritchey/All City aesthetic lacked something the Riv/Crust bikes 
>>> had. 
>>>
>>> Anyways, I think of Crust as threadless, disc, and low trail compared to 
>>> Rivendell with rim brakes, quill stems, and high trail. Like most thing's 
>>> not hard and fast (see: Canti Lightning Bolt). What's your hot take on the 
>>> two?
>>>
>>> I think both bike companies are really doing some amazing and important 
>>> stuff for the bike industry. What I think would be really interesting 
>>> collaboration between Grant and Matt. Maybe something along the lines of 
>>> the Soma San Marcos, but both providing inputs. That'd be really cool!
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Sackville Sacks are a good deal

[Howard Ramsay]

I asked this week. Reply here ->  Hi Howard,

We're waiting on a rear rack to be developed that will determine how the 
bags attach. We're working on 'em!
-will

On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 2:14:24 PM UTC-6 Gary L wrote:

> I love sackvilles too, and they are a spectacular deal, but if you want to 
> go all in on handmade bags, check out Fogg bags. They are made by a great 
> couple in southern France. I have one and it is exquisite.
> https://www.foggspecialistbags.com/
>
> And I too am waiting for the backabikes to be back in stock.
>
> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 11:43:24 AM UTC-5 Berkeleyan wrote:
>
>> Indeed, I've carried my Scotch, as well as my beer, in a grid-grey 
>> Sackville bag, and enjoyed both the riding and the imbibing. And my 
>> Scottish friends all agree.
>>
>> - Andrew, Berkeley
>>
>> On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 7:23:30 AM UTC-8 Edwin W wrote:
>>
>>> Especially when you compare them to some alternatives, like this $745 
>>> Scotch bag!
>>> https://www.westleyrichards.com/us/scotch-bag-in-forest-green
>>>
>>> Enjoying flat, grabby, and jumbo grabby sacks,
>>>
>>> Edwin
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Any Susie owners out there?

[Jared Wilson]

Congrats Tim, you're gonna love her!

I'd have gone orange if I could've, looking forward to seeing your build.

Jared

On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:22:33 PM UTC-8 Tim Baldwin wrote:

> Well after seeing all these great builds, I decided to pull the trigger on 
> a Susie frame this week. It was down to a blue 51 and an orange 53 since I 
> could fit either one. I went with the orange seeing as I have the blue 
> (well blue-green) covered with an Atlantis. Excited to build this bike up!
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 12:06:07 PM UTC-6 Ashwath Akirekadu 
> wrote:
>
>> Mark,
>>
>> As for seat post, I picked up a NOS Shimano black one on eBay.Thanks 
>> to Analog, I even got a powder coated black Mark's rack.  Haven't had a 
>> chance to mount it yet.  Will post pictures once that's attached.   I 
>> replaced the Bosco with Nitto B604AAF Promenade black from Soma.  So, other 
>> than the front derailleur, there's no noticeable chrome part.   There 
>> doesn't seem to be any good FDs in black color out there.
>>
>> Ash
>>
>> On Tuesday, 9 February 2021 at 09:44:03 UTC-8 Mark Roland wrote:
>>
>>> Great looking build, Ash. What black seat post are you planning to use? 
>>> All black components but keeping the brown saddle would look pretty awesome.
>>>
>>> The swoop top tube is actually a big plus for me. In addition to being 
>>> functional, that graceful line complements the fillet-brazed construction. 
>>> It give the bicycles a distinctive character.
>>>
>>>
>>>

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