date:20051122


  Paul, 

  I have three RCA Series 700 base stations and some CC20 remotes 
 to add to your 'collection.'  

  Please let me know when you'll be here to get them, 

  Neil 

Paul Finch wrote:
> 
> Robert,
> 
> I think those are the same reeds that are in a Motorola radio, at least in
> the Vibrasponder style (I think).  Man, I did not think anyone else had or
> knew anything about those old radios!  I have four of them here in storage
> and have been wondering what I am going to do with them.  They are really
> pretty good radios.
> 
> Paul
> WB5IDM





 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Wanted - Parts for RCA 500


  No they are not - although they look the same same as the 
 Motrac, Mocom-30 & 70, and Micor encoder reeds ... they are not 
 interchangeable. 

  The internal coupling is the difference. 

  The Motorola K-1000A series reeds seem to work ok though. 

  Neil - WA6KLA 


Paul Finch wrote:
> 
> Robert,
> 
> I think those are the same reeds that are in a Motorola radio, at least in
> the Vibrasponder style (I think).  Man, I did not think anyone else had or
> knew anything about those old radios!  I have four of them here in storage
> and have been wondering what I am going to do with them.  They are really
> pretty good radios.
> 
> Paul
> WB5IDM
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of georgiaskywarn
> Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:45 PM
> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Wanted - Parts for RCA 500
> 
> Looking a few things for a RCA 500 Repeater;
> pl reeds - 77hz
> Mic
> Please contact me direct.
> Thanks!
> Robert
> KD4YDC
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>





 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Wanted - Parts for RCA 500

2005-11-22 Thread Paul Finch

Robert,

I think those are the same reeds that are in a Motorola radio, at least in
the Vibrasponder style (I think).  Man, I did not think anyone else had or
knew anything about those old radios!  I have four of them here in storage
and have been wondering what I am going to do with them.  They are really
pretty good radios.

Paul
WB5IDM


-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of georgiaskywarn
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 8:45 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Wanted - Parts for RCA 500


Looking a few things for a RCA 500 Repeater;
pl reeds - 77hz
Mic
Please contact me direct.
Thanks!
Robert
KD4YDC









Yahoo! Groups Links













 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Flat audio -use of compressor

2005-11-22 Thread Kevin Custer

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

>See a blurb I wrote a few years ago on repeater-builder.com regarding
>audio processing in narrowband FM.
>

That would be here:


Kevin





 
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[Repeater-Builder] Wanted - Parts for RCA 500

2005-11-22 Thread georgiaskywarn

Looking a few things for a RCA 500 Repeater;
pl reeds - 77hz 
Mic 
Please contact me direct.
Thanks!
Robert
KD4YDC








 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] fs; UHF CIRCULATOR AND LOAD

2005-11-22 Thread Mark A. Holman







yeah i got your message but i replied in lower case btw happy turkey
day .

m

Ted Bleiman K9MDM - MDM Radio wrote:

  M/A 3 PORT CIRCULATOR AND LOAD  $165 + SHIPPING
  MDM
   
  SEE AT WWW.MDMRADIO.COM
   
  AND YES IT WAS MY INTENTION TO USE UPPER CASE
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Ted Bleiman K9MDM
  MDM Radio Ltd - 
  1629-B N. 31 st Ave 
Melrose Park, IL 60160 
708.681.0300 fax 708.681.9800 
  web http://www.mdmradio.com - 
  Check it now!!
   
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
   
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n:Holman;Mark A.
org:Harvest Assembly of God
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] CTCSS or DCS

2005-11-22 Thread Mark A. Holman

Say Kevin;
  If the interference is coming form a Part 15 device 
and IF  on a licensed ham freq. it is called a incidental radiator, the 
FCC does send NAL's.   research the ARRl web page for history of 
incidential radiators good info when you ask the owner to change 
channels or bands & the FCC mails NALs on that as well also monetary 
forfeitures can be assessed for failure to comply.

mark h.

Kevin & Natalia wrote:

>Hi All,
>
>We have run into a problem with some local interference getting into one of 
>our link radios.
>It is believed to be coming from one of the TV home transmitters, that one 
>can buy from the local appliance shops.
>It is producing a signal right on teh input of our link. I have put an extra 
>filter in line, but this did not fix it.
>I really do not want to do through the hassel of trying to get another set 
>of freqencies at this stage.
>Shoudl add that when the RX is receiving a signal from the TX link, it 
>overrides the interference nicely. The interference is just enough to open 
>the squelch.
>Have thought about putting either CTCSS, or a newer DCS TX/RX boards in the 
>link system.
>I have read somewhere that DCS is the better way to go. If this is the case, 
>where is the best place to purchase boards to fit inside our radios. We are 
>using Tait T345 and T346 gear.
>
>Any information will help point us in the right direction.
>
>Regards
>
>Kevin, ZL1KFM.
>
>
>
>
>
> 
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Mathew Quaife




Not me, but could have been.  I went to buy a piece of 7/8" hardline a few years back, thought the deal was to good to be, then found it was Radian.  No the other guy put up 150' of it, only to find it would not work.     Mathew  Chuck Kelsey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  So how much did you end up with? LOL.ChuckWB2EDVMathew Quaife wrote:> Just out of curiosity, where did the hardline come from, also, it is not > Radian by any chance? I heard of that happening once to a guy who > bought some cheap hardline, so he thought. Just kicking idea's around > here. > > Mathew>Yahoo! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go
 to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/  
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] GLB Id'er programming

2005-11-22 Thread Joe Montierth

--- Dan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Does any one have the proceedure for programming the
> GLB ID chips.. I 
> believe its just a 2713. I have the programmer but
> need help with the 
> code.
> 
> Dave N3CNJ
> 

The GLB ID'er used a 2716 eprom. The way it was
programmed was to start at address 0 and step up one
"bit" of the ID code at a time. The unit had 8 output
lines, but for simplicity it is easier to program all
of them the same.

A "0" in the programming produced a tone, a "1"
produced no tone. The addresses are stepped through at
a 10ms-100ms rate, depending on the code speed
desired.

You need to break the code desired down into dits,
dahs, and spaces, then program accordingly, leaving 2
blank bits at the beginning of the programming.

For example "SOS" would be "di di di   dah dah dah  
di di di" where each "di" would be one bit programmed
to 0, and each "dah" would be three consecutive bits
programmed to 0 (since a "dah" is three times longer
than a "di"). Spaces are programmed as a "1". Your
binary output, starting at memory add  and
advancing one address each time, would look like:

1101010111000100010001110101011

Once you program your desired ID, the rest of the chip
gets filled with "1"s. This is the default state when
you erase a 2716, its all 1s.

Since the chip programs in hex, you will essentially
be writing "FF" or "00" in each address. Again,
writing "SOS" into the chip would look like this:

FF FF 00 FF 00 FF 00 FF FF FF 00 00 00 FF 00 00 00 FF
00 00 00 FF FF FF 00 FF 00 FF 00 FF FF FF FF 

That is all you need to program, the rest of the bits
in the chip will stay at "FF", which is the erased
position.

If you want to program different things on the
different lines, it becomes more complex, but I think
you see the pattern here.

Joe

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 12:07 AM 11/23/2005 -, you wrote:
>
>The performance of the circulator on the test 
>equipment is not a real world test.  In operation 
>the circulator will heat up and change value 
>quite a bit.  Much of operating a circulator is 
>about heat management. 

<---Yep. Just wait until all that RF coming down the feedline starts
toasting the circulator's load

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
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We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread skipp025


The performance of the circulator on the test 
equipment is not a real world test.  In operation 
the circulator will heat up and change value 
quite a bit.  Much of operating a circulator is 
about heat management. 

cheers,
skipp 

>  "Bob M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I looked at the duplexer with a spectrum analyzer and
> a return loss bridge. It's making spec (100dB
> rejection) on each side. PB loss is 1.1dB. I did
> notice that the return loss indication on the SA
> showed a very nice sharp deep null (over 60dB) when
> looking into one port, while the other port was quite
> rounded at the bottom and a lot wider, maybe only
> going down to -45dB. As the duplexer was not mine and
> is still under warranty and had just come back from
> being checked out by TxRx, I did not play with any of
> the tuning.
> 
> We also tried the repeater running on my spare Celwave
> 6-cavity pass/reject duplexer which has worked fine
> before. This didn't help the situation at all.
> 
> If the PA and duplexer weren't happy together,
> wouldn't I also get desense when running on the dummy
> load also? Remember it's perfectly happy on a 500w
> Bird load. We see no rise in signal level (down at
> -130dBm) on the receive port of the duplexer.
> 
> Bob M.
> ===
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > At 08:09 11/22/2005, you wrote:
> > >At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> > >
> > > >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one,
> > since
> > > >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
> > > >money to have it there.
> > >
> > ><---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50
> > ohm load to your xmtr,
> > >why do you think a circulator will make a
> > difference as far as desense is
> > >concerned?
> > >
> > >Ken
> > 
> > I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the
> > duplexer load it was 
> > TXing into.  Had massive desense unless there was a
> > circulator between the 
> > TX & duplexer.
> > 
> > Bob NO6B
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > 
> > 
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> __ 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] New Repater Sytem Help!!!

2005-11-22 Thread Andrew G.




Just so you don't have to spend more money on a new repeater after a few thunderstorms, a lightning arrestor is a must. A polyphaser is the arrestor of choice on our systems. The old feedline could be the problem as far as your coverage problems go.  Some things to help determine what you problem might be are:     Is there any desense between your TX and RX?  What kind of antenna are you using?  Terrain issue maybe?     Also I would see about measuring the power out of the coax at the antenna end and do a quick calculation on what your losses are. For a VHF repeater, 1/2" Andrews Heliax is a pretty good choice for VHF for the $$.      Andy
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

I don't think this is a dupe.

The amp IS a Henry 20in/200out job, brand new. It has
its own switching power supply mounted on the back. I
think they're using 24V MOSFETs now. My 10in/100out
amp uses ordinary 14VDC and bipolar transistors.

I didn't look directly at the PA output. I do remember
looking at signals on the duplexer's RX port at 449.5
MHz and had the span set for about 100 kHz and the
noise level was around -120dBm, probably limited by my
analyzer's settings. Keying the transmitter caused the
noise level to increase by 10dB (20dB with the 200w PA
in the circuit), so the problem isn't just present
with the PA. It may also have filtering problems, but
we haven't gone that far yet.

I found the transmit signal at 444.5 was down around
-60dBm, which makes perfect sense (20w = +43dBm, and
the duplexer has 100dB rejection; that gets me down to
-60dBm or so). I saw no other discrete signals (down
to the noise level) appear when we keyed the
transmitter.

The problem was not present when the repeater was
first put on the air about a month ago. It has gotten
progressively worse, to the point that it's nearly
20dB desense now on the tall antenna up near the cell
antennas.

The 7/8 coax was already at the site when the UHF
repeater connected to it. Whether it's bad or not will
be determined by someone with a site analyzer and/or a
visit to the top with a dummy load attached.

While there is a 17dB gain preamp with a bandpass
filter, it was NOT in the circuit during our tests
Sunday.

I think we also looked up near 890 MHz (2nd harmonic)
but only saw a rise in the baseline trace; no definite
signal appeared up there when the transmitter was
keyed.

We don't have any bandpass filters currently
available, but might be able to latch on to one if we
look hard enough.

I think we should go back up to the site and do some
more investigating with the spectrum analyzer to
answer some of the extremely detailed questions that
people are asking.

Bob M.
==
--- 'Jeff DePolo WN3A' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> 
> (having email "issues" today, so if this is a dupe,
> please ignore)
> 
> RE: cell mixes and 440 repeater
> 
> I had a 440 repeater at a site with no other UHF
> transmitters for
> probably a mile or two.  On an adjacent tower was a
> cell site (this was
> back in the early 90's AMPS days).  When certain
> cell channels were
> active I would get a mix product that fell on or
> near my receive
> frequency, manifesting as either feedback
> "squealing" or sudden
> increases in noise levels that made it sound like
> desense.  My
> transmitter was a Micor driving a GE 1/4 kW tube
> amp, the duplexer was a
> 4-cavity Antenna Specialists pass/reject, and rx was
> a Micor with an ARR
> GaAsFET.  I found that putting a harmonic notch
> filter (one of those
> little tunable Celwave jobs) on the output of the
> duplexer, tuned to the
> center of the cell site "B" carrier transmit band,
> got rid of all of the
> problems.  I didn't investigate further to determine
> if the mix was
> happening in my Tx, in the preamp, or the Rx.
> 
> Before spending money an isolator (which will also
> require a harmonic
> filter after it), you might try a cheap test using a
> shorted
> quarter-wave stub tee'd into the feedline at the
> output of your duplexer
> to see if it makes any improvement.  I'd suggest
> using a piece of 1/2"
> Heliax for the stub.
> 
> If you have a spare pass cavity (a real pass cavity,
> not pass/reject),
> you might experiment with it on the tx leg of your
> duplexer, and then on
> the rx leg, to help determine if you're experiencing
> a mix in your tx,
> or in your rx, or perhaps neither.  Keep in mind
> that what appears to be
> an overall increase in the noise floor might
> actually be a mix involving
> wideband digital cellular (e.g. CDMA).
> 
> FWIW, I've had substantial (and that's an
> understatement) problems with
> Henry SS amplifiers being unstable on VHF, UHF, and
> FM.  I've also
> received amplifiers from Henry that had the wrong
> low-pass filter in
> them - an FM amp with a LPF cutoff around 210 MHz
> comes to mind.  I also
> had a UHF 200 watt ham-band amp that was shipped
> with NO low pass filter
> in it.  When I called the factory to complain, I was
> told that Part 97
> had no spectral purity specifications for anything
> operating above 225
> MHz so they didn't bother with a filter.  The second
> harmonic was only
> about -30 dBc.  Eventually they took the amp back
> and put in an LPF.
> Take a real close look at the spectral output of the
> Henry while it's
> operating into the antenna system before spending
> any substantial time
> or money trying to fix a non-existant problem
> elsewhere in the system.
> 
>   --- Jeff

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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread 'Jeff DePolo WN3A'


(having email "issues" today, so if this is a dupe, please ignore)

RE: cell mixes and 440 repeater

I had a 440 repeater at a site with no other UHF transmitters for
probably a mile or two.  On an adjacent tower was a cell site (this was
back in the early 90's AMPS days).  When certain cell channels were
active I would get a mix product that fell on or near my receive
frequency, manifesting as either feedback "squealing" or sudden
increases in noise levels that made it sound like desense.  My
transmitter was a Micor driving a GE 1/4 kW tube amp, the duplexer was a
4-cavity Antenna Specialists pass/reject, and rx was a Micor with an ARR
GaAsFET.  I found that putting a harmonic notch filter (one of those
little tunable Celwave jobs) on the output of the duplexer, tuned to the
center of the cell site "B" carrier transmit band, got rid of all of the
problems.  I didn't investigate further to determine if the mix was
happening in my Tx, in the preamp, or the Rx.

Before spending money an isolator (which will also require a harmonic
filter after it), you might try a cheap test using a shorted
quarter-wave stub tee'd into the feedline at the output of your duplexer
to see if it makes any improvement.  I'd suggest using a piece of 1/2"
Heliax for the stub.

If you have a spare pass cavity (a real pass cavity, not pass/reject),
you might experiment with it on the tx leg of your duplexer, and then on
the rx leg, to help determine if you're experiencing a mix in your tx,
or in your rx, or perhaps neither.  Keep in mind that what appears to be
an overall increase in the noise floor might actually be a mix involving
wideband digital cellular (e.g. CDMA).

FWIW, I've had substantial (and that's an understatement) problems with
Henry SS amplifiers being unstable on VHF, UHF, and FM.  I've also
received amplifiers from Henry that had the wrong low-pass filter in
them - an FM amp with a LPF cutoff around 210 MHz comes to mind.  I also
had a UHF 200 watt ham-band amp that was shipped with NO low pass filter
in it.  When I called the factory to complain, I was told that Part 97
had no spectral purity specifications for anything operating above 225
MHz so they didn't bother with a filter.  The second harmonic was only
about -30 dBc.  Eventually they took the amp back and put in an LPF.
Take a real close look at the spectral output of the Henry while it's
operating into the antenna system before spending any substantial time
or money trying to fix a non-existant problem elsewhere in the system.

--- Jeff


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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Chuck Kelsey

So how much did you end up with? LOL.

Chuck
WB2EDV




Mathew Quaife wrote:
> Just out of curiosity, where did the hardline come from, also, it is not 
> Radian by any chance?  I heard of that happening once to a guy who 
> bought some cheap hardline, so he thought.  Just kicking idea's around 
> here. 
>  
> Mathew
>





 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Flat audio -use of compressor

2005-11-22 Thread jeff


4 ms attack and 100 ms decay is more like a fast limiter than a
compressor.  4 ms is only 2 cycles at 500 Hz which is in the "meat" of
the voice region.

Unless you use a de-emphasis network and low-pass filter in the side
chain you're not going to be happy with the compressor even if you
slowed down the time constants.  The response "tilt" that you have when
running "flat audio" (really preemphasized audio) through the compressor
combined with the HF noise that's present any time the signal is
anything less than DFQ will drive it into excessive gain reduction.  You
didn't say what the design of the control stage was, but judging by the
attack time, I'm guessing it's a peak detector which would likely
exacerbate the problem with regard to the HF noise response.

See a blurb I wrote a few years ago on repeater-builder.com regarding
audio processing in narrowband FM for some more info.

--- Jeff


> -Original Message-
> From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of bradley glen
> Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 5:19 PM
> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Flat audio -use of compressor
> 
> 
> Good Day
> 
> I would like to have comment on the use of the
> compressor on the repeater hardware between the rx and
> tx units , with that repeater run up using the "flat
> audio principle."
> 
> What will happen to the existing audio's attack/decay
> stats?
> 
> The expeimental unit made for this test- specs for
> 4ms/100ms Attack/Decay repectively .
> 
> Thanks Brad
> 
> 
>   
> __
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Flat audio -use of compressor

2005-11-22 Thread jeff


4 ms attack and 100 ms decay is more in line with a fast limiter than a
compressor.  4 ms is only 2 cycles at 500 Hz  (the meat of the voice
region).

Unless you use a de-emphasis network and low-pass filter in the side
chain you're not going to be happy with the compressor even if you
slowed down the time constants to make it act more like a compressor.
The response "tilt" that you have when running "flat audio" (really
preemphasized audio) through the compressor combined with the HF noise
that's present any time the signal is anything less than DFQ will drive
it into excessive gain reduction.

See a blurb I wrote a few years ago on repeater-builder.com regarding
audio processing in narrowband FM.


--- Jeff


> -Original Message-
> From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of bradley glen
> Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 5:19 PM
> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Flat audio -use of compressor
> 
> 
> Good Day 
> 
> I would like to have comment on the use of the
> compressor on the repeater hardware between the rx and
> tx units , with that repeater run up using the "flat
> audio principle."
> 
> What will happen to the existing audio's attack/decay
> stats?
> 
> The expeimental unit made for this test- specs for
> 4ms/100ms Attack/Decay repectively .
> 
> Thanks Brad 
> 
> 
>   
> __ 
> Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. 
http://farechase.yahoo.com




 
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[Repeater-Builder] Flat audio -use of compressor

2005-11-22 Thread bradley glen

Good Day 

I would like to have comment on the use of the
compressor on the repeater hardware between the rx and
tx units , with that repeater run up using the "flat
audio principle."

What will happen to the existing audio's attack/decay
stats?

The expeimental unit made for this test- specs for
4ms/100ms Attack/Decay repectively .

Thanks Brad 



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[Repeater-Builder] wanted vhf 2m duplexer

2005-11-22 Thread carlos quinones

Hi name is Carlos i am from Puerto Rico and i am
looking for a duplexer for my 2m repeater.

Carlos Quinones
  WP4MXB
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: www.wp4mxb.net











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RE: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A low-pass filter

Bad cal data on the network analyzer...  and the Tunwall leads are poor test
leads.  Good for AM ATU's and not much more. Used good cables, and did a
thru-transmission test...  I had to cut the inductors ever so slightly..
but things started looking more like I had expected in the first place.  I
also found 3 cold solder joints from Moto inside the assembly..

mike

-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Bob M.
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 4:07 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A low-pass filter


Well, tell us how.

Or was it operator error?

Bob M.
==
--- Mike Perryman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> nevermind...  solved it  0.3dB insertion loss now...
> mike
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf
> Of Mike Perryman
> Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 12:51 PM
> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A
> low-pass filter
>
>
> A question for the Micor Guru's of the group...
>
> I am in process of converting a low-band Micor to 6m
> and have a quick
> question..  the only docs I have found for tuning
> the low-pass filter to 6m
> meters is to tune for minimum insertion loss...
>
> What constitutes an acceptable value for insertion
> loss?
>
> I am not happy with the current -0.68dB to 0.7dB @
> 51.9MHz figure I have
> obtained.  And if I scroll the marker over to around
> 28MHz, I see it drops
> to around -0.4dB.  Is it worth the trouble to
> optimize this filter?  Or will
> the exciter generally make enough signal that I
> shouldn't worry about it and
> move on?  It took a little twiddling to get it to
> this point..  but not
> opposed to continuing for better numbers..
>
> Any takers on this one?
>
> Thanks,
> mike



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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

I don't know the brand or where it came from, except
that it's supposed to be new stuff. Everything else is
brand new and ordered specifically for the amateur
band.

Bob M.
==
--- Mathew Quaife <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Just out of curiosity, where did the hardline come
> from, also, it is not Radian by any chance?  I heard
> of that happening once to a guy who bought some
> cheap hardline, so he thought.  Just kicking idea's
> around here.  
>
>   Mathew
>   
> 
> "Bob M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>   I looked at the duplexer with a spectrum analyzer
> and
> a return loss bridge. It's making spec (100dB
> rejection) on each side. PB loss is 1.1dB. I did
> notice that the return loss indication on the SA
> showed a very nice sharp deep null (over 60dB) when
> looking into one port, while the other port was
> quite
> rounded at the bottom and a lot wider, maybe only
> going down to -45dB. As the duplexer was not mine
> and
> is still under warranty and had just come back from
> being checked out by TxRx, I did not play with any
> of
> the tuning.
> 
> We also tried the repeater running on my spare
> Celwave
> 6-cavity pass/reject duplexer which has worked fine
> before. This didn't help the situation at all.
> 
> If the PA and duplexer weren't happy together,
> wouldn't I also get desense when running on the
> dummy
> load also? Remember it's perfectly happy on a 500w
> Bird load. We see no rise in signal level (down at
> -130dBm) on the receive port of the duplexer.
> 
> Bob M.
> ===
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > At 08:09 11/22/2005, you wrote:
> > >At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> > >
> > > >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one,
> > since
> > > >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste
> of
> > > >money to have it there.
> > >
> > ><---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant
> 50
> > ohm load to your xmtr,
> > >why do you think a circulator will make a
> > difference as far as desense is
> > >concerned?
> > >
> > >Ken
> > 
> > I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the
> > duplexer load it was 
> > TXing into. Had massive desense unless there was a
> > circulator between the 
> > TX & duplexer.
> > 
> > Bob NO6B




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RE: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A low-pass filter

Well, tell us how.

Or was it operator error?

Bob M.
==
--- Mike Perryman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> nevermind...  solved it  0.3dB insertion loss now...
> mike
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf
> Of Mike Perryman
> Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 12:51 PM
> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A
> low-pass filter
> 
> 
> A question for the Micor Guru's of the group...
> 
> I am in process of converting a low-band Micor to 6m
> and have a quick
> question..  the only docs I have found for tuning
> the low-pass filter to 6m
> meters is to tune for minimum insertion loss...
> 
> What constitutes an acceptable value for insertion
> loss?
> 
> I am not happy with the current -0.68dB to 0.7dB @
> 51.9MHz figure I have
> obtained.  And if I scroll the marker over to around
> 28MHz, I see it drops
> to around -0.4dB.  Is it worth the trouble to
> optimize this filter?  Or will
> the exciter generally make enough signal that I
> shouldn't worry about it and
> move on?  It took a little twiddling to get it to
> this point..  but not
> opposed to continuing for better numbers..
> 
> Any takers on this one?
> 
> Thanks,
> mike



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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

The inside jumper is 1/2 inch Heliax. We put the dummy
load at the end of that and had no desense either.

The outside jumper is whatever came with the Super
Stationmaster antenna, hopefully good quality RG-214,
but I don't know what they normally supply.

Bob M.
==
--- Bob Dengler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> At 11/22/2005 11:04 AM, you wrote:
> 
> >If it weren't so hard to move, we'd take the entire
> >repeater to my site and connect it to my coax and
> >identical antenna. Unfortunately, that still tells
> us
> >it's a problem with the existing coax/antenna
> setup.
> >Could be a connector. Could be the short jumper
> from
> >the coax to the antenna.
> >
> >Bob M.
> 
> If that jumper is RG-213, RG-8 or any non
> silver-plated braided coax I'd 
> highly suspect that to be the cause.  Also check the
> jumper from the 
> antenna port of the duplexer to the hardline.  That
> was where our problem 
> was, as we took care to use good feedline outside
> but got lazy on the final 
> step of the internal hookup & used a short length of
> RG-213.
> 
> Bob NO6B




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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Mathew Quaife




Just out of curiosity, where did the hardline come from, also, it is not Radian by any chance?  I heard of that happening once to a guy who bought some cheap hardline, so he thought.  Just kicking idea's around here.       Mathew  "Bob M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  I looked at the duplexer with a spectrum analyzer anda return loss bridge. It's making spec (100dBrejection) on each side. PB loss is 1.1dB. I didnotice that the return loss indication on the SAshowed a very nice sharp deep null (over 60dB) whenlooking into one port, while the other port was quiterounded at the bottom and a lot wider, maybe onlygoing down to -45dB. As the duplexer was not mine andis still under warranty and had just come back frombeing checked out by TxRx, I did not play with
 any ofthe tuning.We also tried the repeater running on my spare Celwave6-cavity pass/reject duplexer which has worked finebefore. This didn't help the situation at all.If the PA and duplexer weren't happy together,wouldn't I also get desense when running on the dummyload also? Remember it's perfectly happy on a 500wBird load. We see no rise in signal level (down at-130dBm) on the receive port of the duplexer.Bob M.===--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:> At 08:09 11/22/2005, you wrote:> >At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:> >> > >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one,> since> > >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of> > >money to have it there.> >> ><---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50> ohm load to your xmtr,> >why do you think a circulator will make a>
 difference as far as desense is> >concerned?> >> >Ken> > I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the> duplexer load it was > TXing into. Had massive desense unless there was a> circulator between the > TX & duplexer.> > Bob NO6B> > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > __ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.http://farechase.yahoo.comYahoo! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load


  ... only when you hold it out the window ... 

  Neil 


Ken Arck wrote:
> 
> At 09:09 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> >
> >  The resistive load isn't an antenna either.
> 
> <---I generally face little resistance when it comes to antennae...
> 
> Ken





 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A low-pass filter

nevermind...  solved it  0.3dB insertion loss now...
mike

-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Mike Perryman
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 12:51 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A low-pass filter

A question for the Micor Guru's of the group...

I am in process of converting a low-band Micor to 6m and have a quick
question..  the only docs I have found for tuning the low-pass filter to 6m
meters is to tune for minimum insertion loss...

What constitutes an acceptable value for insertion loss?

I am not happy with the current -0.68dB to 0.7dB @ 51.9MHz figure I have
obtained.  And if I scroll the marker over to around 28MHz, I see it drops
to around -0.4dB.  Is it worth the trouble to optimize this filter?  Or will
the exciter generally make enough signal that I shouldn't worry about it and
move on?  It took a little twiddling to get it to this point..  but not
opposed to continuing for better numbers..

Any takers on this one?

Thanks,
mike

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[Repeater-Builder] fs; UHF CIRCULATOR AND LOAD

2005-11-22 Thread Ted Bleiman K9MDM - MDM Radio




M/A 3 PORT CIRCULATOR AND LOAD  $165 + SHIPPING  MDM     SEE AT WWW.MDMRADIO.COM     AND YES IT WAS MY INTENTION TO USE UPPER CASE








Ted Bleiman K9MDM
MDM Radio Ltd - 1629-B N. 31 st Ave Melrose Park, IL 60160 708.681.0300 fax 708.681.9800 web http://www.mdmradio.com - 
Check it now!!
 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Bob Dengler

At 11/22/2005 11:04 AM, you wrote:

>If it weren't so hard to move, we'd take the entire
>repeater to my site and connect it to my coax and
>identical antenna. Unfortunately, that still tells us
>it's a problem with the existing coax/antenna setup.
>Could be a connector. Could be the short jumper from
>the coax to the antenna.
>
>Bob M.

If that jumper is RG-213, RG-8 or any non silver-plated braided coax I'd 
highly suspect that to be the cause.  Also check the jumper from the 
antenna port of the duplexer to the hardline.  That was where our problem 
was, as we took care to use good feedline outside but got lazy on the final 
step of the internal hookup & used a short length of RG-213.

Bob NO6B

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Bob Dengler

At 11/22/2005 10:46 AM, you wrote:
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the
> > duplexer load it was TXing into.
>
>The duplexer shouldn't be the load...

I should have left the word "load" out.  Technically the "load" was the 
duplexer followed by a 50 ohm termination.

>
>
> > Had massive desense unless there was a circulator
> > between the TX & duplexer.
>
>Would have been better to provide a proper 50
>system through the duplexer to the antenna... but
>one has to do what one has to do...

It was; sorry for the confusion.

Bob NO6B






 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

The antenna/coax is showing 0.05w reflected (1/2 of
the first minor division) on a 5W element in a Bird 43
with 200 watts feeding the duplexer. From a purely
VSWR standpoint, that's acceptable. Whether or not
it's 50 ohms is something we did not check yet.

Future steps include sweeping the antenna/coax with a
site analyzer, then maybe hauling another antenna and
a dummy load up to the top of the pole and
substituting these for the existing antenna to see
which one is giving us problems.

I can't speak for the impedances of the PA's output or
the receiver's input. I used a known good 50 ohm load
when I checked the unit at my house. I didn't check
all the ports by feeding power into them and checking
for reflected power.

Another antenna at the site mounted on the roof does
not produce desense.

If it weren't so hard to move, we'd take the entire
repeater to my site and connect it to my coax and
identical antenna. Unfortunately, that still tells us
it's a problem with the existing coax/antenna setup.
Could be a connector. Could be the short jumper from
the coax to the antenna.

Bob M.
==
--- Ken Arck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> At 10:47 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> 
> >If anything is coming back down the antennaand
> through
> >the duplexer and mixing in the PA, the circulator
> will
> >prevent or reduce that effect.
> 
> <---Absolutely correct. BUT that is not the same
> thing as desense nor are
> the symptoms the same.
> 
> You said the duplexer, taken to a different site,
> didn't show any desense,
> I'd suspect VSWR on some port, be it the antenna,
> rcvr or xmtr one
> (presenting other than the exact same load on ANY
> port of a duplexer
> between its tuning and deployment WILL detune it.
> That is why it's best to
> be sure there is a 50 ohm load on each port).
> 
> Ken
>
--
> President and CTO - Arcom Communications
> Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and
> accessories.
> http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
> We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
> We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
> AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
> http://www.irlp.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 10:54 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>If the PA and duplexer weren't happy together,
>wouldn't I also get desense when running on the dummy
>load also? Remember it's perfectly happy on a 500w
>Bird load. 

<---You answered your own question. Suspect the antenna, feedline or both.

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
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We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 10:47 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:

>If anything is coming back down the antennaand through
>the duplexer and mixing in the PA, the circulator will
>prevent or reduce that effect.

<---Absolutely correct. BUT that is not the same thing as desense nor are
the symptoms the same.

You said the duplexer, taken to a different site, didn't show any desense,
I'd suspect VSWR on some port, be it the antenna, rcvr or xmtr one
(presenting other than the exact same load on ANY port of a duplexer
between its tuning and deployment WILL detune it. That is why it's best to
be sure there is a 50 ohm load on each port).

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

I looked at the duplexer with a spectrum analyzer and
a return loss bridge. It's making spec (100dB
rejection) on each side. PB loss is 1.1dB. I did
notice that the return loss indication on the SA
showed a very nice sharp deep null (over 60dB) when
looking into one port, while the other port was quite
rounded at the bottom and a lot wider, maybe only
going down to -45dB. As the duplexer was not mine and
is still under warranty and had just come back from
being checked out by TxRx, I did not play with any of
the tuning.

We also tried the repeater running on my spare Celwave
6-cavity pass/reject duplexer which has worked fine
before. This didn't help the situation at all.

If the PA and duplexer weren't happy together,
wouldn't I also get desense when running on the dummy
load also? Remember it's perfectly happy on a 500w
Bird load. We see no rise in signal level (down at
-130dBm) on the receive port of the duplexer.

Bob M.
===
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> At 08:09 11/22/2005, you wrote:
> >At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> >
> > >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one,
> since
> > >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
> > >money to have it there.
> >
> ><---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50
> ohm load to your xmtr,
> >why do you think a circulator will make a
> difference as far as desense is
> >concerned?
> >
> >Ken
> 
> I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the
> duplexer load it was 
> TXing into.  Had massive desense unless there was a
> circulator between the 
> TX & duplexer.
> 
> Bob NO6B
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 06:41 PM 11/22/2005 -, you wrote:

>Because all that unmatched "stray rf" is very often 
>looking for some place betta' (or worse) to go.  
>
> though I wouldn't qualify it as a fix for desense.

<---That's my point. The symptoms (and causes) of intermod are not the same
as the symptoms (and causes) of desense.

I can see a circulator being used to present a non-reactive load to a PA
(which may settle it down and remove *it* as a cause a desense) but not due
to a circulator's moreknown? function

Ken
--
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Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] CTCSS or DCS

This repeater is in the middle of nowhere. The nearest
house is at least 1/2 mile away. No link radios are
involved. The repeater itself, when connected to the
antenna, is the only thing putting out energy on 444.5
MHz. We see a rise in noise level on the receiver port
of the duplexer when the transmitter is on, and this
is not present when the repeater is feeding a dummy
load.

Thanks for the thought, however.

Bob M.
==
--- Kevin & Natalia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hi All,
> 
> We have run into a problem with some local
> interference getting into one of 
> our link radios.
> It is believed to be coming from one of the TV home
> transmitters, that one 
> can buy from the local appliance shops.
> It is producing a signal right on teh input of our
> link. I have put an extra 
> filter in line, but this did not fix it.
> I really do not want to do through the hassel of
> trying to get another set 
> of freqencies at this stage.
> Shoudl add that when the RX is receiving a signal
> from the TX link, it 
> overrides the interference nicely. The interference
> is just enough to open 
> the squelch.
> Have thought about putting either CTCSS, or a newer
> DCS TX/RX boards in the 
> link system.
> I have read somewhere that DCS is the better way to
> go. If this is the case, 
> where is the best place to purchase boards to fit
> inside our radios. We are 
> using Tait T345 and T346 gear.
> 
> Any information will help point us in the right
> direction.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Kevin, ZL1KFM.

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

If anything is coming back down the antennaand through
the duplexer and mixing in the PA, the circulator will
prevent or reduce that effect.

Bob M.
==
--- Ken Arck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> 
> >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one,
> since
> >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
> >money to have it there.
> 
> <---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50
> ohm load to your xmtr,
> why do you think a circulator will make a difference
> as far as desense is
> concerned?
> 
> Ken
>
--
> President and CTO - Arcom Communications
> Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and
> accessories.
> http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
> We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
> We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
> AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread skipp025

> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the 
> duplexer load it was TXing into. 

The duplexer shouldn't be the load...  

> Had massive desense unless there was a circulator 
> between the TX & duplexer.

Would have been better to provide a proper 50 
system through the duplexer to the antenna... but 
one has to do what one has to do... 

And the addition of the circulator can deal with a
number of Demons...

cheers, 
skipp 

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

No, that has not been done. He did try a different
Kenwood repeater - no help. He brought his duplexer to
another site - no desense. He tried a different
duplexer at his site - desense.

The intermod with the cell system is a strong
candidate. His antenna is on top of the platform that
the cell antennas are mounted around the perimeter.

The entire repeater is in a 5ft tall Motorola cabinet
and probably weighs 100 pounds. Moving it would be
possible but not easy. The problem is: after he moves
it and has no desense, how does he fix the situation
at his current site?

Thanks for the suggestion, however. I'm passing all
info on to the trustee.

Bob M.
==
--- Mathew Quaife <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Bob, just a suggestion, has he taken the repeater
> away from the site, hooked it to another antenna to
> see if he might be riding along a frequency there at
> the tower site.  He could be pulling something in
> from a second harmonic there.  The only reason I
> mention this, is a friend of mine had a 440 repeater
> at a cell site and had something similiar happen. 
> He took it to another antenna, and the problem was
> gone.  I know he ended up installing a circulator,
> but I also think the cell site ended up installing a
> peice of equipment, but not sure what they put in. 
> That was about three years ago, and the whole entire
> crew is gone, so not sure if I could find out what
> they installed.
>
>   Mathew
>   
> 
> "Bob M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>   Hi. A local UHF repeater is having massive desense
> problems. Everything is clean with a dummy load
> attached to the duplexer, so we know it's a problem
> with the connectors, coax, antenna, or jumper
> between
> the two. This is a two-month-old system at a
> cellphone
> site; nothing else there. The repeater is the only
> thing on 444.5 MHz.
> 
> I'd like to try a circulator before buying one,
> since
> if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
> money to have it there. I would agree however that
> its
> presence would be mandatory if this was a busy site,
> but for now it's just his repeater and all the
> cellphone equipment.
> 
> He's running 200 watts out of a Henry amp, through a
> TxRx 4-section duplexer. We see a 20dB rise in the
> noise level at the Rx port when the transmitter
> comes
> on, with the system connected to the coax/antenna.
> Absolutely no change with a good dummy load attached
> to the duplexer's output. We even have desense with
> the 20 watts out of the exciter (power amp
> bypassed).
> The antenna is a super stationmaster cut for the
> 440-450 band. The coax is 7/8 and there's about 150
> ft
> of it.
> 
> So if someone has a circulator and reject load that
> would be rated for 200 watts to pass through it,
> please contact me. If there's a way we could try it,
> and buy it if it helps the situation, that would be
> ideal.
> 
> Thanks.
> Bob M.
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread skipp025

Because all that unmatched "stray rf" is very often 
looking for some place betta' (or worse) to go.  

 though I wouldn't qualify it as a fix for desense.

cheers,
skipp 

> Ken Arck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> 
> >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one, since
> >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
> >money to have it there.
> 
> <---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50 ohm load 
> to your xmtr, why do you think a circulator will make a 
> difference as far as desense is concerned?
> 
> Ken
> 







 
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[Repeater-Builder] tuning a TFB6024A low-pass filter

A question for the Micor Guru's of the group...

I am in process of converting a low-band Micor to 6m and have a quick
question..  the only docs I have found for tuning the low-pass filter to 6m
meters is to tune for minimum insertion loss...

What constitutes an acceptable value for insertion loss?

I am not happy with the current -0.68dB to 0.7dB @ 51.9MHz figure I have
obtained.  And if I scroll the marker over to around 28MHz, I see it drops
to around -0.4dB.  Is it worth the trouble to optimize this filter?  Or will
the exciter generally make enough signal that I shouldn't worry about it and
move on?  It took a little twiddling to get it to this point..  but not
opposed to continuing for better numbers..

Any takers on this one?

Thanks,
mike





 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] CTCSS or DCS

My 2 cents worth...
A filter is not going to help if it is on your input.

Depending upon how much signal you have from your remote site, I would think
increasing the squelch level to the point that the un-wanted signal will not
open the squelch, but low enough that your remote site can still get in
would be an easy way to deal with it for now.  Assuming you have enough
signal to quiet the receiver effectively without IX from the TV transmitter
causing problems.  You mentioned that your remote site covers it
effectively?

I notice you are a ZL, and I don't know what the rules are there...  over
here in the US it would be classified as a Part-15 device.  In the US a
Part-15 device cannot cause IX to a licensed service, and must accept any
IX.

Best neighborly bet is to hunt down the offending device, and see if it can
be set to another frequency.  If the party was un-cooperative, you file an
official complaint, and then they get an official letter from the FCC
instructing them to cease operation of the device.  But as I said..  not
sure of the rules in ZL-land.

I have the exact same issue on 6m in my neighborhood..  on 50.247 there is a
"rabbit" generating a wide-band FM signal...  and haven't had oppurtinuty to
hunt it down yet.  I can clearly hear the audio from someone
channel-surfing.  I have noticed that if I bring my beams on azimuth (700w
in a 2 x 6el phased stack), and run WSJT for a while...  it goes away.  But
it always comes back.

good luck,
mike


-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Kevin & Natalia
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 11:12 AM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] CTCSS or DCS


Hi All,

We have run into a problem with some local interference getting into one of
our link radios.
It is believed to be coming from one of the TV home transmitters, that one
can buy from the local appliance shops.
It is producing a signal right on teh input of our link. I have put an extra
filter in line, but this did not fix it.
I really do not want to do through the hassel of trying to get another set
of freqencies at this stage.
Shoudl add that when the RX is receiving a signal from the TX link, it
overrides the interference nicely. The interference is just enough to open
the squelch.
Have thought about putting either CTCSS, or a newer DCS TX/RX boards in the
link system.
I have read somewhere that DCS is the better way to go. If this is the case,
where is the best place to purchase boards to fit inside our radios. We are
using Tait T345 and T346 gear.

Any information will help point us in the right direction.

Regards

Kevin, ZL1KFM.






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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 09:09 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>
>  The resistive load isn't an antenna either. 

<---I generally face little resistance when it comes to antennae...

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
http://www.irlp.net




 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load


  The resistive load isn't an antenna either. 

  Neil 

Ken Arck wrote:
> 
> At 08:15 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
> >I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the duplexer load 
> >it was TXing into.  Had massive desense unless there was a 
> >circulator between the TX & duplexer.
> 
> <---Makes sense. I know all about PA's driving a reactive load :-)
> 
> Ken --





 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: what is the Flat audio ? and what is the applicaion for it

2005-11-22 Thread Chris Huber

Could it be opposite of Sharp audio???

Chris n6icw

At 08:26 PM 11/21/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>No, Ken. Flat audio is what you get when your HT is run over by
a
>pavement roller.
<---Unless it's a vibrating pager that is run over. Then you have a
pancake
motor.
Ken

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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 08:15 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the duplexer load it was 
>TXing into.  Had massive desense unless there was a circulator between the 
>TX & duplexer.

<---Makes sense. I know all about PA's driving a reactive load :-)

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
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http://www.irlp.net




 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 04:27 PM 11/22/2005 +, you wrote:
 
>Well, for one it will limit any locally generated mixing products 
>resulting from rectification in the PA transistors.

<---Yes it will. But that is not the cause of desense, that is one of the
causes of intermodulation products.

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
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We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Kris Kirby

On Tue, 22 Nov 2005, Ken Arck wrote:
> >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one, since if it doesn't 
> >help the situation, it's a waste of money to have it there.
> 
> <---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50 ohm load to your 
> xmtr, why do you think a circulator will make a difference as far as 
> desense is concerned?

Well, for one it will limit any locally generated mixing products 
resulting from rectification in the PA transistors.

--
Kris Kirby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   "BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING YOU!"
 This message brought to you by the US Department of Homeland Security
 and the now-permanent PATRIOT Act




 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread no6b

At 08:09 11/22/2005, you wrote:
>At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:
>
> >I'd like to try a circulator before buying one, since
> >if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
> >money to have it there.
>
><---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50 ohm load to your xmtr,
>why do you think a circulator will make a difference as far as desense is
>concerned?
>
>Ken

I once had an Exec II RFPA that didn't "like" the duplexer load it was 
TXing into.  Had massive desense unless there was a circulator between the 
TX & duplexer.

Bob NO6B

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[Repeater-Builder] CTCSS or DCS

2005-11-22 Thread Kevin & Natalia

Hi All,

We have run into a problem with some local interference getting into one of 
our link radios.
It is believed to be coming from one of the TV home transmitters, that one 
can buy from the local appliance shops.
It is producing a signal right on teh input of our link. I have put an extra 
filter in line, but this did not fix it.
I really do not want to do through the hassel of trying to get another set 
of freqencies at this stage.
Shoudl add that when the RX is receiving a signal from the TX link, it 
overrides the interference nicely. The interference is just enough to open 
the squelch.
Have thought about putting either CTCSS, or a newer DCS TX/RX boards in the 
link system.
I have read somewhere that DCS is the better way to go. If this is the case, 
where is the best place to purchase boards to fit inside our radios. We are 
using Tait T345 and T346 gear.

Any information will help point us in the right direction.

Regards

Kevin, ZL1KFM.





 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

At 06:00 AM 11/22/2005 -0800, you wrote:

>I'd like to try a circulator before buying one, since
>if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
>money to have it there.

<---Aside from presenting a pretty much constant 50 ohm load to your xmtr,
why do you think a circulator will make a difference as far as desense is
concerned?

Ken
--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
We offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
We are now an authorized Telewave Dealer!
AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
http://www.irlp.net




 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

2005-11-22 Thread Mathew Quaife

Bob, just a suggestion, has he taken the repeater away from the site, hooked it to another antenna to see if he might be riding along a frequency there at the tower site. He could be pulling something in from a second harmonic there. The only reason I mention this, is a friend of mine had a 440 repeater at a cell site and had something similiar happen. He took it to another antenna, and the problem was gone. I know he ended up installing a circulator, but I also think the cell site ended up installing a peice of equipment, but not sure what they put in. That was about three years ago, and the whole entire crew is gone, so not sure if I could find out what they installed. Mathew "Bob M." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi. A local UHF repeater is having massive
desenseproblems. Everything is clean with a dummy loadattached to the duplexer, so we know it's a problemwith the connectors, coax, antenna, or jumper betweenthe two. This is a two-month-old system at a cellphonesite; nothing else there. The repeater is the onlything on 444.5 MHz.I'd like to try a circulator before buying one, sinceif it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste ofmoney to have it there. I would agree however that itspresence would be mandatory if this was a busy site,but for now it's just his repeater and all thecellphone equipment.He's running 200 watts out of a Henry amp, through aTxRx 4-section duplexer. We see a 20dB rise in thenoise level at the Rx port when the transmitter comeson, with the system connected to the coax/antenna.Absolutely no change with a good dummy load attachedto the duplexer's output. We even have desense withthe 20 watts out of the exciter (power amp
bypassed).The antenna is a super stationmaster cut for the440-450 band. The coax is 7/8 and there's about 150 ftof it.So if someone has a circulator and reject load thatwould be rated for 200 watts to pass through it,please contact me. If there's a way we could try it,and buy it if it helps the situation, that would beideal.Thanks.Bob M.__ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.http://farechase.yahoo.comYahoo! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Digest Number 3456

Those switches are not available from Motorola - I had
one with the same problem. Eventually I bought a junk
meter with other parts missing and swapped the
switches.

They're just SPDT switches that happen to mount
vertically with a support bracket that solders into
the circuit board. I've seen other switches just like
it that might possibly work. I know several companies
that can make them; the problem is buying a small
quantity.

Bob M.
==
--- "Clarke, Tom   VX-20 OPS"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Thanks for the info!  This one is in good condition,
> except that
> the four programming switches have had the bat
> handles broken off! Strange.
> Another project!
> 
> 73 Tom/W4OKW
> 
> snip---
> As previously mentioned, that is a digital metering
> panel (DMP) for an MSF5000 station. 
> snip---
> Either meter is highly desirable when working on
> MSF5000s, however the DMP gives you a much better
> look
> at the inner workings of the station, and also lets
> you activate certain conditions such as manual PTT
> or
> PL disable, via four data switches under the LEDs.
> 
> Bob M.

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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Digest Number 3456

2005-11-22 Thread Clarke, Tom VX-20 OPS

Thanks for the info!  This one is in good condition, except that
the four programming switches have had the bat handles broken off! Strange.
Another project!

73 Tom/W4OKW

snip---
As previously mentioned, that is a digital metering
panel (DMP) for an MSF5000 station. 
snip---
Either meter is highly desirable when working on
MSF5000s, however the DMP gives you a much better look
at the inner workings of the station, and also lets
you activate certain conditions such as manual PTT or
PL disable, via four data switches under the LEDs.

Bob M.
==




 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Service Manuals

2005-11-22 Thread wvines

Check out www.batlabs.com

They may have the manual(s). If not, they will have some other good info
for your radios.

William Vines

- Original Message -
From: Frederick Wong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Monday, November 21, 2005 7:43 pm
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Service Manuals

> I would like to know if any of u have or know any ways
> to get these radios' service manuals: GM300,
> GM950e/i/plus, GM338. All are Motorola radios. 
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Fred







 
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[Repeater-Builder] Looking for a UHF Circulator and load

Hi. A local UHF repeater is having massive desense
problems. Everything is clean with a dummy load
attached to the duplexer, so we know it's a problem
with the connectors, coax, antenna, or jumper between
the two. This is a two-month-old system at a cellphone
site; nothing else there. The repeater is the only
thing on 444.5 MHz.

I'd like to try a circulator before buying one, since
if it doesn't help the situation, it's a waste of
money to have it there. I would agree however that its
presence would be mandatory if this was a busy site,
but for now it's just his repeater and all the
cellphone equipment.

He's running 200 watts out of a Henry amp, through a
TxRx 4-section duplexer. We see a 20dB rise in the
noise level at the Rx port when the transmitter comes
on, with the system connected to the coax/antenna.
Absolutely no change with a good dummy load attached
to the duplexer's output. We even have desense with
the 20 watts out of the exciter (power amp bypassed).
The antenna is a super stationmaster cut for the
440-450 band. The coax is 7/8 and there's about 150 ft
of it.

So if someone has a circulator and reject load that
would be rated for 200 watts to pass through it,
please contact me. If there's a way we could try it,
and buy it if it helps the situation, that would be
ideal.

Thanks.
Bob M.



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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Flash Technology Tower Lighting

2005-11-22 Thread Joel Mele






Doug:
 
I hope your ham group is not responsible for the maintenance 
of the Flash Tech system.
 
Flash Tech is having "heaps" of problems with their 
systems.
 
In fact, I am currently changing out a four year old Flash 
Tech system on a 500 ft tower.
 
If you have the option, "run away" from the Flash Tech system 
as fast as you can.
 
If you would like to discuss your problems, contact me direct 
or call 252-249-2344
 
Regards...Joel, W4SLH
Pamlico Tower Leasing Co

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Paul Finch 
  
  To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com 
  
  Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 5:18 
  PM
  Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Flash 
  Technology Tower Lighting
  
  Doug,
   
  Join 
  the Tower Pro group, it is not for Hams though.  Ask any question you 
  want about towers, no Ham stuff though,
   
  Paul
   
  
-Original Message-From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com]On 
Behalf Of Doug ZastrowSent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 10:42 
AMTo: Repeater-Builder@Yahoogroups.comSubject: 
[Repeater-Builder] Flash Technology Tower Lighting
Hello All,
 
In return for free tower space our ham club baby 
sits a 360 ft. guyed tower.  Looking for anyone with 
real-world experience with Flash Technology FH-324 red/white flash tower 
obstruction lighting.
 
In the 18 month period following new installation all 
three red 'beacons' have failed.  Tower mounted flash heads have a 
coupling transformer, trigger transformer, RC network and flash 
tube.
 
In red beacon failures how often has trouble been in 
components *other* than the flash tube?
 
Is it true red flash tube shelf-life is six months or 
less?
 
What has the real-world life expectancy (in operation) of 
the red flash tubes been?
 
FYI, trouble was isolated to the flash heads by swapping 
cables at the Power Controllers.  Trouble stayed with the flash 
head.  Flash heads failed in succession over a period of 4-5 
months.
 
Moderator: If this is too far OT don't hesitate to 
kill.
 
TIA...
 
 
Doug Zastrow
 
 













  




  
  
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Service Manuals

2005-11-22 Thread KONSTANTINOS INTZELIS




 Hello there my friend.Have you searched in www.mods.dk
  ?Take a look there and maybe you can find anything
 
73 de SW9KIO
HELLAS 
On 11/22/05, Frederick Wong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I would like to know if any of u have or know any waysto get these radios' service manuals: GM300,
GM950e/i/plus, GM338. All are Motorola radios.Thank youFred__Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
http://farechase.yahoo.comYahoo! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
   http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/














  




  
  
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: what is the Flat audio ? and what is the applicaion for it