[SLUG] X4 color depth at startup

[Aravind Naidu]

Hi,
I have sucessfully changed the XF86Config-4 file to start X at depth 16, but
this seems to work only if I do startx from the command line.

If I change the runlevel to 5 and start X automatically, it defaults to a
color depth of 8
Is there a parameter to prefdm(gdm) that I can pass to start at the color
depth of 16 ??

Running Mdk 7.1

-- Aravind



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[SLUG] questions... squid...

[Michael Fox]

Afternoon everybody,

Just want to put a few questions to those who have a little more experience
with some advance squid questions I may have.

We have 50/50 spread of users who are using locked down browsers while
another lot of users don't. The issue we are having is we want to identify
those users who don't bypass the squid server for local addresses.

What I'd like to do, is setup some rules on squid, that will deny clients
from in our company from accessing numerous servers/sites via the proxy, and
when they do, I want it to error out and give them a informative error page.

Can anyone confirm can something like this be done in squid's config using
rules of some sort? If so, anyone care to point me to some
documentation/examples?

If I could be cc'd directly at this email address, I'll be sure to get it
much quicker.

Thanks in advance.

Michael Fox



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[SLUG] Newbie having troubles with Diald

[Lindsay McPhee]

Hi all,
Please forgive if I have sent a message that is too long, but I thought
in order to get the assistance required I needed to supply all available
information.

I have installed Red Hat 6.1 and daild 0.99.4.  I  have several accounts
that a client needs to dial into at given times.  Account 1 is a 6am-6pm
business account - forced up for the 12 hours.  Outside those hours I
need to dial into account 2 on the same server - on demand.  The
problem:  I can dial - with error messages - and login but I cant start
PPP successfully!!  If I use /sbin/ifup ppp0 I get all the way. So I
figure it's to do with the connect script of the diald configuration.

any assistance greatfully appreciated.

The following is an extract from the /etc/messages log file.

Aug 21 12:59:42 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap0
Aug 21 12:59:42 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap1
Aug 21 12:59:42 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap2
Aug 21 12:59:42 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap3
Aug 21 12:59:43 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap4
Aug 21 12:59:43 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap5
Aug 21 12:59:43 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap6
Aug 21 12:59:43 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap7
Aug 21 12:59:44 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap8
Aug 21 12:59:44 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap9
Aug 21 12:59:44 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap10
Aug 21 12:59:45 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap11
Aug 21 12:59:45 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap12
Aug 21 12:59:45 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap13
Aug 21 12:59:45 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap14
Aug 21 12:59:46 eric modprobe: can't locate module tap15
Aug 21 12:59:46 eric diald[1513]: start sl0: SIOCSIFMETRIC: Operation
not supported
Aug 21 12:59:46 eric diald[1513]: Calling site 192.168.1.9
Aug 21 12:59:47 eric connect: Initializing Modem
Aug 21 12:59:48 eric connect: Dialing system
Aug 21 13:00:15 eric connect: Connected
Aug 21 13:00:15 eric connect: Loggin in
Aug 21 13:00:16 eric connect: Protocol started
Aug 21 13:00:16 eric diald[1513]: Connected to site 192.168.1.9
Aug 21 13:00:16 eric diald[1513]: Running pppd (pid = 1544).
Aug 21 13:00:16 eric modprobe: can't locate module char-major-108
Aug 21 13:00:17 eric kernel: PPP: version 2.3.7 (demand dialling)
Aug 21 13:00:17 eric kernel: PPP line discipline registered.
Aug 21 13:00:17 eric kernel: registered device ppp0
Aug 21 13:00:17 eric pppd[1544]: pppd 2.3.10 started by root, uid 0
Aug 21 13:00:17 eric pppd[1544]: Using interface ppp0
Aug 21 13:00:17 eric pppd[1544]: Connect: ppp0 <--> /dev/ttyS1
Aug 21 13:00:23 eric kernel: PPP BSD Compression module registered
Aug 21 13:00:23 eric kernel: PPP Deflate Compression module registered
Aug 21 13:00:24 eric pppd[1544]: local  IP address 203.57.114.143
Aug 21 13:00:24 eric pppd[1544]: remote IP address 203.57.114.129
Aug 21 13:00:24 eric diald[1513]: New addresses: local 203.57.114.143,
remote 203.57.114.129, broadcast 0.0.0.0
Aug 21 13:00:24 eric diald[1513]: start ppp0: SIOCSIFMETRIC: Operation
not supported


The following is my /etc/diald.conf.wdbc file  - for account 1
the /etc/diald.conf file is empty at this stage


restrict 6:01:00 17:59:00 1-5 * *
up

restrict 18:01:00 * 1-5 * *
or-restrict * * 6 * *
or-restrict * 6:00:00 0 * *
down

authsimple /etc/ppp/pap-secrets
mode ppp
connect /root/wdbcconnect
speed 115200
device /dev/ttyS1
local 192.168.1.8
remote 192.168.1.9
dynamic
include /usr/lib/diald/standard.filter
accounting-log /var/log/diald.log



The Following is my Connect script: /root/wdbcconnect - account 1



#!/bin/sh
# Copyright (c) 1996, Eric Schenk.
#
# This script is a connection script that
# uses the "message" facility of diald to communicate progress through
# the dialing process to a diald monitoring program such as dctrl or
diald-top.
# It also reports progress to the system logs. This can be useful if you

# are seeing failed attempts to connect and you want to know when and
why
# they are failing.
#
# This script requires the use of chat-1.9 or greater for full
# functionality. It should work with older versions of chat,
# but it will not be able to report the reason for a connection failure.

# Configuration parameters

# The initialization string for your modem

MODEM_INIT="ATZ"
# &C1&D2%C0"

# The phone number to dial
PHONE_NUMBER="phone number removed"

# The chat sequence to recognize that the remote system
# is asking for your user name.
USER_CHAT_SEQ="ogin:--ogin:--ogin:--ogin:--ogin:--ogin:--ogin:"

# The string to send in response to the request for your user name.
USER_NAME="account name removed"

# The chat sequence to recongnize that the remote system
# is asking for your password.
PASSWD_CHAT_SEQ="ssword:"

# The string to send in response to the request for your password.
PASSWORD="password removed"

# The prompt the remote system will give once you are logged in
# If you do not define this then the script will assume that
# there is no command to be issued to start up the re

Re: [SLUG] Copyright Amendment

[Conrad Parker]

On Sat, Aug 19, 2000 at 09:53:10AM +1000, Roland Turner wrote:
> John Wiltshire wrote:
> 
> > Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that the Copyright Amendment
> > Act currently back in the Senate has some relevance on the DeCSS /
> > LiViD work inside Australia.  I've not yet figured out whether it
> > expressly permits Open Sorce DVDs on Linux or denys it.  Does anyone
> > else have any idea?
> > 
> > 
>http://search.aph.gov.au/search/ParlInfo.ASP?Folder=BILLS&Criteria=bill_id:r910;seq_num:0;&action=bookmark
> 
> APH's search engine is a crock (it has sessions intrinsic to its URLs).
> Can you tell us what search string you used to get to it?

useful links are up at:

http://technocrat.net/966583745/index_html


It appears to be quite like [my impression, via slashdot, of] the DMCA
 -- not that that answers John's question. For example:

Objective (a)(ii) is to "ensure the efficient operation of relevant
industries in the online environment by ... providing a practical
enforcement regime for copyright owners"; but Objective (c) is to
"provide reasonable access and certainty for end users of copyrighted
material online". _Without_ the 'online' bit, it would seem that
choosing to use free software for the viewing of DVDs would be
reasonable.

The definitions of "circumvention device" and "technological
protection measure" are interesting. Weak "scrambling" would be covered
by law as such a protection measure (I take it it isn't now), and "any
device (including a computer program)" having limited or no use "other
than circumvention, or facilitating the circumvention, of" it would be
illegal -- which sounds very much like what we hear of the DMCA.

But, does DeCSS implement the "technological protection measure" for
DVDs? Surely all it does is ensure that a DVD has the required
copyright protection codes on it, and allow playback if it does.

OpenDVD: http://www.opendvd.org/

LiViD: http://www.linuxvideo.org/
  -- including OMS, an Linux DVD player (for hw decoder cards)

cf: there is a link to the DMCA on the OpenDVD site. Does anyone
know the corresponding definitions in it?



Conrad.


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RE: [SLUG] Re: Linux Certification

[George Vieira]

With all this in mind, this is why I have a web file version of my CV. This
is OS independant as I also have done work on MACs

Bit messy I know due to number of HTML files and GIFs but it works.

-Original Message-
From: Stuart Cooper [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, 21 August 2000 2:45
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [SLUG] Re: Linux Certification



   > ditto goes for demanding CV's in word .doc, etc, etc

   I find this an education issue also. How many recruiting mobs are there
who
   suggect you send your resume in Microsoft format?

All of them in my experience. You use a computer, you must have
Microsoft Word, right? A lot of them ask for Word Version 6 format, I
guess the file format from older versions is incompatible?? It wouldn't
suprise me if that was the case. Some agencies ask for word any
version- maybe they keep older versions running to read older files??
I don't know much about Microsoft products and I'm not about to start
now.

Have people on the list seen some of Bob Metcalfe's (of Ethernet fame)
flamebait about Open Source (which he calls 'Open Sores'; see- the
other side can make puns as well and you though Micro$oft was
devestating)? I'll never forget what he said about editors- "Emacs was
brilliant in the 70's, but today's programmers demand more. They need
Microsoft Word, which can't be written in a weekend no matter how much
Coke you drink". 

If companies ever send you word documents, hunt around them with
'strings' or a binary editor like weekend-Coke and you can often find
other information hidden in the structure, which I believe is a
consequence of them using the 'quick save' function which sort of
saves the undo stuff as well?? again, excuse the M$ ignorance. If you
do find something, ring the company back and tease them with this
secret knowledge. Tell them that there's a leak in their company,
which is true enough.

One agent I spoke to once asked me if I understood the ASC2 format
and I said no, I'd never heard of it. A minute after I hung up I
realised the lady was reading from a job spec which mentioned a format
called ASCII. She would have rung them back and said "he met the
requirements but he didn't know anything about the file format" and
the employers would have thought "he doesn't know ASCII? What a
joker!". Doesn't matter, wasn't keen on the job anyway, but watch out
for those all-knowing job agents! At least she knew some Roman
Numerals. I made a similar mistake myself in Tasmania when I got on a
bus and went to the "KGV" sports ground, which I pronounced to rhyme
with KGB. Everyone in Tasmania understands this as KG5- it's named
after King George V. 

I email agencies a plain text version of my resume and they import it
into Word and do what they want with it (which involves gratuitously
sticking the agency's logo on every page and completely stuffing up
the pagination- my resume and others I have seen have often appeared
out of the other end of a fax machine with final pages that have one
line of text on them, or a middle page with no text whatsoever beyond
the aforementioned logo). I always offer to fax through my resume
which is postscript from the original LaTeX (the way God intended) but
agencies are never that keen because they can't mangle it with their
own logo and information. Agencies will almost always remove your
personal contact details as well so that you can only be contacted
through them.

Obligatory certification remark: before Information Technology it was
only insane people who got certified, so not much has changed. Serious 
companies should be able to ask you a short quiz in the interview
which will give them an idea of your knowledge of a subject.

Stuart.


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Re: [SLUG] Linux Certification

[DaZZa]

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, marty wrote:

> i was wondering about certifications...  i have no qualifications because
> i learnt for myself how to build, configure and test hardware and how to
> setup, use, network (etc.) linux...  but how do i prove that to an
> employer without taking one of these exams, so as to have a piece of paper
> to wave around ??  also, how do i assess whether my skills are of a
> sufficient level (a doubt i have, hence why i haven't gone IT job hunting)
> without getting someone to check my competency ??

www.brainbench.com

They have a series of exams on different subjects that you can do, and get
a rating on.

Not sure if they cost money - the only times I've done it has been at the
referral of a recruitment agency - but they're recognised, at least by the
agencies, and they pass on recommendations based on them.

DAZZa



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Re: [SLUG] Re: Linux Certification

[Stuart Cooper]

   > ditto goes for demanding CV's in word .doc, etc, etc

   I find this an education issue also. How many recruiting mobs are there who
   suggect you send your resume in Microsoft format?

All of them in my experience. You use a computer, you must have
Microsoft Word, right? A lot of them ask for Word Version 6 format, I
guess the file format from older versions is incompatible?? It wouldn't
suprise me if that was the case. Some agencies ask for word any
version- maybe they keep older versions running to read older files??
I don't know much about Microsoft products and I'm not about to start
now.

Have people on the list seen some of Bob Metcalfe's (of Ethernet fame)
flamebait about Open Source (which he calls 'Open Sores'; see- the
other side can make puns as well and you though Micro$oft was
devestating)? I'll never forget what he said about editors- "Emacs was
brilliant in the 70's, but today's programmers demand more. They need
Microsoft Word, which can't be written in a weekend no matter how much
Coke you drink". 

If companies ever send you word documents, hunt around them with
'strings' or a binary editor like weekend-Coke and you can often find
other information hidden in the structure, which I believe is a
consequence of them using the 'quick save' function which sort of
saves the undo stuff as well?? again, excuse the M$ ignorance. If you
do find something, ring the company back and tease them with this
secret knowledge. Tell them that there's a leak in their company,
which is true enough.

One agent I spoke to once asked me if I understood the ASC2 format
and I said no, I'd never heard of it. A minute after I hung up I
realised the lady was reading from a job spec which mentioned a format
called ASCII. She would have rung them back and said "he met the
requirements but he didn't know anything about the file format" and
the employers would have thought "he doesn't know ASCII? What a
joker!". Doesn't matter, wasn't keen on the job anyway, but watch out
for those all-knowing job agents! At least she knew some Roman
Numerals. I made a similar mistake myself in Tasmania when I got on a
bus and went to the "KGV" sports ground, which I pronounced to rhyme
with KGB. Everyone in Tasmania understands this as KG5- it's named
after King George V. 

I email agencies a plain text version of my resume and they import it
into Word and do what they want with it (which involves gratuitously
sticking the agency's logo on every page and completely stuffing up
the pagination- my resume and others I have seen have often appeared
out of the other end of a fax machine with final pages that have one
line of text on them, or a middle page with no text whatsoever beyond
the aforementioned logo). I always offer to fax through my resume
which is postscript from the original LaTeX (the way God intended) but
agencies are never that keen because they can't mangle it with their
own logo and information. Agencies will almost always remove your
personal contact details as well so that you can only be contacted
through them.

Obligatory certification remark: before Information Technology it was
only insane people who got certified, so not much has changed. Serious 
companies should be able to ask you a short quiz in the interview
which will give them an idea of your knowledge of a subject.

Stuart.


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Re: [SLUG] Browser for X under 24Mb

[Jamie Honan]

>I've been using w3m for console stuff.  It renders tables and
>frames quite well (can even do slashdot, for example), and the
>navigation is easier to figure out than lynx.
>
>None of these non-netscape browsers seem to be able to do HTTPS,
>which is a pain.

w3m does https, README says experimental. (Might have to compile
yourself)

Jamie



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RE: [SLUG] mounting unusual filesystems

[Jill Rowling]

Hi Daniel (and others),

In summary: special hardware required.

Good grief, this takes me back to undergrad days at UTS.
For my "major project" in my last year at Elec Eng, I make a disk controller
which was able to read the headers on Apple ][ disks on a CP/M machine.
It had to be done in hardware because Apple ][ disks do not use IBM disk
formats.
They use a running XOR system rather than a CRC block.
My hardware used a WD2973 (I think) disk controller chip simply to position
the head at a specific track.
The bitstream coming from the floppy drive went past an array of comparitors
which were pre-loaded with the Apple ][ standard headers by my software
(Z-80 assembler of course in those days) so in effect you:
- Seek to desired track (write to controller)
- search for start of sector (punched index hole) by reading the value
coming back from the controller
- Pre-load the comparitor array with Apple ][ header information
- search for start of header by reading the array status
- Pre-load the comparitor with Apple ][ data mask bits
- search for data blocks
- compute XOR on the fly
- make some decisions about whether the sector was readable or not

References might be kicking around your local library or museum :) but I
used the Sams books "beneath Apple DOS" and "Beneath Apple ProDOS" which
spells out the headers and disk encoding scheme very well.
Having read it, I can understand why IBM header format (used by most
spinning media these days) is a million times better.

Apple ProDOS headers were much more sensible but I think the disks I was
working on (Apple ][ DOS) were only 256k single sided so we used flippy
disks.
Yuk - 6 disks just for the C compiler.

Regards,

Jill.

___
Jill Rowling
Snr Design Engineer & Unix System Administrator
Electronic Engineering Department, Aristocrat Technologies Australia
3rd Floor, 77 Dunning Ave Rosebery NSW 2018
Phone:  (02) 9697-4484  Fax:(02) 9663-1412
Email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 


-Original Message-
From: Daniel Freedman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
In looking at the below response, I'm thinking that maybe I wasn't clear
in my last message. I know the fs of the floppies that I need to access,
some are formatted with AppleIIgs and some with an old MacOS (probably
around version 5 or 6, circa 1991).  Can Linux recognize these
filesystems, either natively or using additional code?


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RE: [SLUG] Re: Linux Certification

[Des Wass]

> -Original Message-
> From: Angus Lees [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> 
> i see this as being a good way to test the employer. if they insist on
> a redhat (or some other) certification, and ignore whatever other work
> you have done, they probably aren't a good place to work.

I agree, however, it is more than likely that they have no idea what RHCE
is. Certification of any sort - including NT seems to be more a *keeping up
with the Jones'* rather than a company really employees who know their
stuff.

I know of MCSE guys who are glorified Help Desk staff - only because the
company insisted that all employees have a) Tertiary Education and b) MCSE.

And we all know that someone who has been out there *doing it* for 10 years
is more qualified than any piece of paper.
 
> ditto goes for demanding CV's in word .doc, etc, etc

I find this an education issue also. How many recruiting mobs are their who
suggect you send your resume in Microsoft format?
 
> remember - in IT the supply/demand is the other way around: the
> employer needs us more than we need them, so its really us
> interviewing/choosing them.

Maybe so, but until there are more of us who realise this thant those who
get the piece of paper, and the more there are of us in a position to employ
people who know what they're doing through experience, we still have to
*play the game* somewhat.

> (of course, none of this applies if you are selling yourself directly
> to clients)

I think this can be a much easier sell sometimes.

FWIW,
Des.


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RE: [SLUG] Linux Certification

[Stephen Mills]

>What I am concerned about is that if by doing a RedHat endorsed course, I 
>would be exposed to RedHat tools that wouldn't apply to Un*x in general, 
>such as the rpm system and GUI-based configuration tools.
>Any experiences with these programs would really be appreciated.

Ive done the RHCE - yes you must know RPM, I can't go into too much detail
(or Redhat will give me a boot up the behind) but if you know your Linux
very well, you shouldnt have much trouble

Good thing is, you can use any tools on the standard Redhat distro you wish
to get the job done - thats all I can really say :)

Stephen


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[SLUG] Re: Linux Certification

[Angus Lees]

On Mon, Aug 21, 2000 at 12:38:44PM +1000, marty wrote:
> i was wondering about certifications...  i have no qualifications because
> i learnt for myself how to build, configure and test hardware and how to
> setup, use, network (etc.) linux...  but how do i prove that to an
> employer without taking one of these exams, so as to have a piece of paper
> to wave around ??

i see this as being a good way to test the employer. if they insist on
a redhat (or some other) certification, and ignore whatever other work
you have done, they probably aren't a good place to work.

ditto goes for demanding CV's in word .doc, etc, etc

if i was to interview you, i'd be much more interested in what you
knew, understood and had done. most importantly - how well you can
learn on your own. a certificate from one of these "courses" doesn't
necessarily count for much.


remember - in IT the supply/demand is the other way around: the
employer needs us more than we need them, so its really us
interviewing/choosing them.



(of course, none of this applies if you are selling yourself directly
to clients)

-- 
 - Gus


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Re: [SLUG] Linux Certification

[Andrew Macks]

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, marty wrote:

> i was wondering about certifications...  i have no qualifications because
> i learnt for myself how to build, configure and test hardware and how to
> setup, use, network (etc.) linux...  but how do i prove that to an
> employer without taking one of these exams, so as to have a piece of paper
> to wave around ??  also, how do i assess whether my skills are of a
> sufficient level (a doubt i have, hence why i haven't gone IT job hunting)
> without getting someone to check my competency ??

Shrugs, after a while of speaking on this list I gather you'll have many
people to vouch for you if your knowledge of the OS is really as good as
you think it is.  InstallFests, etc are all good experience, and qualify
as experience on your resume.  If you can convince your local school,
hospital, or Pizza Haven to consider Linux, then you'll also have their
certification of what you can do.  All of the above would rate more highly
in my book than a certification.  A certification is a very indirect way
of saying "This person knows something..".  A reference is a very personal
way of saying "This guy knows his stuff!".  Which would you pick out of
the two?

Sure, there are still lots of companies who simply make judgements based
on pieces of paper such as certifications, but there are also a lot more
now than there used to be who are willing to accept that you know what you
know, (being able to prove it helps), and I think you'll be okay.

I left after Year 10 (a few years back :P) to continue learning computer
related stuff (have been running a Computer Sales business and still am),
and now work for a company in the US you may have heard of called
freshmeat.  Anyhow, freshmeat is probably a unique example, but if you
develop a reputation of knowing your stuff, you'll generally find that
people will learn of that reputation, and hopefully choose to employ you
based merely on that, and perhaps a small demonstration just to convince
the local sysadmin :P

Andrew.

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Re: [SLUG] Linux Certification

[marty]

> 
> 
> That's my main fear about certification.  Lots of people being taught to
> use a GUI which is very non-standard, or even just taught the basics of
> using a computer/OS rather than mastering it.  They shouldn't be taught
> how to do things, but more how to find things and work them out for
> themselves, the basic structure of Linux, how it's designed, how it works.
> 
> It would be like all these Microsoft MSCE people.  How many of them know
> anything about Windows' application design?  Or even just the registry
> structure?  (Is there a registry structure? :P)  But seriously, even
> though one could argue, "But why would they need to know that?", I don't
> think you deserve a certificate of creditation for anything less than
> that.  You should be expected to know at least a bit of everything.
> 
> 

this isn't really a response to the rant, but...

i was wondering about certifications...  i have no qualifications because
i learnt for myself how to build, configure and test hardware and how to
setup, use, network (etc.) linux...  but how do i prove that to an
employer without taking one of these exams, so as to have a piece of paper
to wave around ??  also, how do i assess whether my skills are of a
sufficient level (a doubt i have, hence why i haven't gone IT job hunting)
without getting someone to check my competency ??

later
marty

"I can't buy what I want because it's free. Can't be what they want
because I'm me." - Corduroy, Pearl Jam



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[SLUG] Re: Keyboard repeat disable

[Angus Lees]

On Wed, Aug 16, 2000 at 09:17:32AM +1000, Peter Vogel wrote:
> Is there a common way of diabling the repeat on an average PC-AT
> keyboard, from the keyboard?

xset r off

(at least under X)

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Re: [SLUG] Linux Certification

[Andrew Macks]

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Alex wrote:

> I would really like to hear about SLUG attendee's experience with Linux 
> certfication programs, such as LPI, RHCE, the GNU one...
> I'm not really concerned about the recognition of a certificate, as long as 
> by doing the course(s), skills can be acquired to administer and 
> troubleshoot a Un*x driven site.
> What I am concerned about is that if by doing a RedHat endorsed course, I 
> would be exposed to RedHat tools that wouldn't apply to Un*x in general, 
> such as the rpm system and GUI-based configuration tools.
> Any experiences with these programs would really be appreciated.



That's my main fear about certification.  Lots of people being taught to
use a GUI which is very non-standard, or even just taught the basics of
using a computer/OS rather than mastering it.  They shouldn't be taught
how to do things, but more how to find things and work them out for
themselves, the basic structure of Linux, how it's designed, how it works.

It would be like all these Microsoft MSCE people.  How many of them know
anything about Windows' application design?  Or even just the registry
structure?  (Is there a registry structure? :P)  But seriously, even
though one could argue, "But why would they need to know that?", I don't
think you deserve a certificate of creditation for anything less than
that.  You should be expected to know at least a bit of everything.



Andypoo.

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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[DaZZa]

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Dave Fitch wrote:

> > As for ISDN being easier - the investment in TE is probably equal to
> > dialups,
> 
> I think it's cheaper, but of more benefit to the ISP is no modem
> incompatibility problems etc, it cuts out the A-D conversions,
> a straight digital pipe you run PPP over.

I doubt it'd be cheaper - as Umar pointed out, similar equiptment is used
- and I'd actually think it would be more expensive, given what I've seen
of Cisco's products {for example, a 3640 with a PRI and 30 modems for
accepting "dial up" connections as opposed to a 2620 with a PRI for just
accepting "data" calls. The distinction being that to accept calls from
POTS services using 65/33k6 modems, there must still be a modem involved,
whereas to accept a straight ISDN data call there doesn't have to be.

> > byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
> > given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
> > dropped off if they're abusing.
> 
> well I've heard that argument before too but never really agreed
> with it.  If the ISP's pricing model is done properly there's no
> problem.  Eg. charge by the Mb, or impose a monthly download limit
> etc.  I agree that given the speed (or lack thereof) of modem
> connections it seems "safer" but (a) 64k ISDN not that much faster
> and (b) with the growth of cable and xDSL and others, ISPs will have
> to get used to it sooner or later.

How many ISP's do it properly, though? :-) "Flat rate" access is the
commonest claim - and only because they know how much can be sucked down a
56k modem in a month, and gamble on not everyone actually doing it.

As for 64k not being much faster - well, 64k full duplex would be about
20k faster downstream, and at least 30k faster upstream, for me. My best
modem connections are 46k/31k6 - 64k full duplex would be a blessing.

> At one stage I considered "casual" dialup ISDN rather than modem
> (probably 128K) but it's really telstra's pricing that puts the
> kybosh on that, not the ISP.  The only vaguely cost effective
> ISDN (IMO) is the "onramp home highway" service then run "data
> over voice" to get the 22/25c untimed connections whilst still
> getting more or less ISDN speeds but that requires a cooperative
> ISP willing to do some "special" configuration at their end.

No argument on that one - Telstra has priced ISDN out of the market for
most people. When you compare the prices in the USA to what we pay.
{sigh}.

DaZZa



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[SLUG] Linux Certification

[Alex]

Hi,
I would really like to hear about SLUG attendee's experience with Linux 
certfication programs, such as LPI, RHCE, the GNU one...
I'm not really concerned about the recognition of a certificate, as long as 
by doing the course(s), skills can be acquired to administer and 
troubleshoot a Un*x driven site.
What I am concerned about is that if by doing a RedHat endorsed course, I 
would be exposed to RedHat tools that wouldn't apply to Un*x in general, 
such as the rpm system and GUI-based configuration tools.
Any experiences with these programs would really be appreciated.

Regards,
Alex

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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[DaZZa]

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Umar Goldeli wrote:

> > dialups, byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
> > given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
> > dropped off if they're abusing.
> 
> Most ISP's nowadays use the same gear for their normal dialups as well as
> their ISDN connections - in fact - if they support 56k - they most
> definitely already have the gear for supporting isdn.

Not necessarily - but possibly. :)

> The term "permanent" with respects to isdn - is not really correct - it's
> always semi-perm - due to the nature of isdn - i.e. a call must be made -
> i.e. it's not "hardwired" like services such as DDS Fastway or a Megalink
> for example. 

Semantics - effectively, even a semi-permanent ISDN call is closer to
permanent than a POTS dialup. Yes, it's a circuit switched connection -
but it's designed to be "permanently" connected, whereas POTS is not.

> Hence, the procedure for disconnecting an isdn call is exactly the same as
> for bumping a normal dialin user. 

I was actually referring to the fact that MOST {happy, Dave? :-)} ISP's
use ISDN dialups for their "permanent" commections as opposed to their
dialups, and don't generally bounce them for being online over a session
limit or some such like - again, comparing to "normal" dial ups.

> (btw - I'm talking about modern integrated access platforms like cisco
> 5260's, Ericsson Tigri etc etc.. not the old fashioned, grab a TA220 and
> stick it into a 2501 method - but even so, the above still applies :)

What's wrong with a TA and a 2500? :) Hell, what's wrong with an NT1 and a
2503? :-)

DaZZa



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Re: [SLUG] The dreaded Signal 11 [FURTHER]

[Howard Lowndes]

Well, I managed to put memtester onto the sus box and the mem came 
up clean.

I wondered whether there might be an incompat between ssh 1.2.27
running on the source box and openssh running on the sus box.

I changed the ssh on the sus box to 1.2.27 and all worked well.

One to note.

-- 
Howard.
__
LANNet Computing Associates 

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Howard Lowndes wrote:

> I am trying to do a secure copy "scp" between two machine and I get an
> error from the other box:
> 
> Command terminated on signal 11.
> lost connection
> 
> Is this likely to be the dreaded memory problem cos I can ssh to it OK.
> 
> 



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Re: [SLUG] The dreaded Signal 11

[marty]

> Command terminated on signal 11.
> lost connection

sig 11 is almost certainly flaky hardware (especially ram)...

later
marty

"I can't buy what I want because it's free. Can't be what they want
because I'm me." - Corduroy, Pearl Jam



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Re: [SLUG] Network card data

[Damien Curtain]

If memory recalls correctly these might be the modules your after, for
the rest of the info you need your in the best position to look at the
cards and work out the io etc...

> The first card is an Accton P/N: 142650-400 REV:01D which has a large
> chip marked MPXT 448AJ24391150

ne

> The second is from Racal-Datacom and carries a sticker on one side with
> the numbers 625-0331-01 REV AB and on the other side a sticker
> 620-0331-01 REV AB.  The chip on this card is an AMD chip AM79C960KC

lance

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[SLUG] The dreaded Signal 11

[Howard Lowndes]

I am trying to do a secure copy "scp" between two machine and I get an
error from the other box:

Command terminated on signal 11.
lost connection

Is this likely to be the dreaded memory problem cos I can ssh to it OK.

-- 
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__
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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[Umar Goldeli]

> But if you, as an ISP, were only going to support customers
> connecting via ISDN you'd buy a simpler/cheaper access server.
> Those cisco ones with 60 x 56k modems cost a fortune compared
> to say a 25xx/26xx router.

Bingo. (just maybe not the 25xx bit :)

But yes, for example, you can get a *huge* 11-slot Tigris chassis loaded
with about 1000 B channels worth of ISDN controllers for about the same
price as the same chassis loaded with only a handful of DSP cards.

//umar.



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[SLUG] Network card data

[Ken Caldwell]

Hi,
I have a couple of network cards that I would like to try out but have
no data for.  My searches this morning seem to turn up lots of leads but
none seem to get me anywhere in the end.

The first card is an Accton P/N: 142650-400 REV:01D which has a large
chip marked MPXT 448AJ24391150

The second is from Racal-Datacom and carries a sticker on one side with
the numbers 625-0331-01 REV AB and on the other side a sticker
620-0331-01 REV AB.  The chip on this card is an AMD chip AM79C960KC

Does any one know which kernel modules are required for these cards?

TIA

Ken


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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[Dave Fitch]

Umar Goldeli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > As for ISDN being easier - the investment in TE is probably equal to
> > dialups, byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
> > given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
> > dropped off if they're abusing.
> 
> Most ISP's nowadays use the same gear for their normal dialups as well as
> their ISDN connections - in fact - if they support 56k - they most
> definitely already have the gear for supporting isdn.

it means they already have ISDN lines coming in so you just
get a port without a 56k modem on it (I would imagine).

But if you, as an ISP, were only going to support customers
connecting via ISDN you'd buy a simpler/cheaper access server.
Those cisco ones with 60 x 56k modems cost a fortune compared
to say a 25xx/26xx router.

Dave.


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[SLUG] Duplicating a HDD

[Doug Stalker]

Scenario:  I have two HDDs that are identical (same brand, model, size,
etc) and I want to make one a copy of the other.  At the moment I'm just
plaicng them both into a system, booting up from a disk with TOMSRTBT on
it, and running dd if=/dev/hdc of=/dev/hda.  This works, but takes a
long time - it has to copy all the blank space on the HDD as well, and
the particular systems I'm using for this are *very* slow with HDD
access.

How could I do this quicker?

The source disk has only one ext2 partition and a swap partition on it.
If I just partiton the target disk the same way as the source disk I can
copy the files over, which should take care of the ext and swap
partitions, but how do I duplicate the boot sector of the HDD?

 - Doug


--
_
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 Ericsson Australia - Level 5, 184 The Broadway, Sydney 2000
  Ph: +61-416-085-390   Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]




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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[John Ferlito]

On Mon, Aug 21, 2000 at 11:43:15AM +1000, Umar Goldeli wrote:
> > As for ISDN being easier - the investment in TE is probably equal to
> > dialups, byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
> > given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
> > dropped off if they're abusing.
> 
> Most ISP's nowadays use the same gear for their normal dialups as well as
> their ISDN connections - in fact - if they support 56k - they most
> definitely already have the gear for supporting isdn.
> 
Acually the ISDN always works out cheaper for the ISP. Since the ISDN
call is purely digital you don't need to buy DSP cards for your access servers. Which
on Ciscos work out to about $20k per 120 channels.

Assuming people are paying by the meg than ISDN is always a better deal for 
the ISP.
By the hour it's not since you can pull a bit more down over ISDN than modem.

-- 
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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[Dave Fitch]

DaZZa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Dave Fitch wrote:
> > > Add to this the fact that ISP's charge _much_ more for a 64k ISDN account
> > > {$500 a month, roughly?} than they do for two dialup accounts {2 x $50 a
> > > month?}, and ISDN comes out behind.
> > 
> > make that "most ISPs".  There are some that charge the same $ per
> > hour charge or $ per Mb regardless of whether it's PSTN or ISDN
> > you're connecting via (eg. www.albury.net.au).  In many ways a
> > customer using ISDN is easier and cheaper for the ISP I would've
> > thought.
> 
> OK, I accept the qualification. :-)
> 
> As for ISDN being easier - the investment in TE is probably equal to
> dialups,

I think it's cheaper, but of more benefit to the ISP is no modem
incompatibility problems etc, it cuts out the A-D conversions,
a straight digital pipe you run PPP over.

> byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
> given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
> dropped off if they're abusing.

well I've heard that argument before too but never really agreed
with it.  If the ISP's pricing model is done properly there's no
problem.  Eg. charge by the Mb, or impose a monthly download limit
etc.  I agree that given the speed (or lack thereof) of modem
connections it seems "safer" but (a) 64k ISDN not that much faster
and (b) with the growth of cable and xDSL and others, ISPs will have
to get used to it sooner or later.

At one stage I considered "casual" dialup ISDN rather than modem
(probably 128K) but it's really telstra's pricing that puts the
kybosh on that, not the ISP.  The only vaguely cost effective
ISDN (IMO) is the "onramp home highway" service then run "data
over voice" to get the 22/25c untimed connections whilst still
getting more or less ISDN speeds but that requires a cooperative
ISP willing to do some "special" configuration at their end.

Dave.


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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[Umar Goldeli]

> As for ISDN being easier - the investment in TE is probably equal to
> dialups, byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
> given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
> dropped off if they're abusing.

Most ISP's nowadays use the same gear for their normal dialups as well as
their ISDN connections - in fact - if they support 56k - they most
definitely already have the gear for supporting isdn.

The term "permanent" with respects to isdn - is not really correct - it's
always semi-perm - due to the nature of isdn - i.e. a call must be made -
i.e. it's not "hardwired" like services such as DDS Fastway or a Megalink
for example. 

Hence, the procedure for disconnecting an isdn call is exactly the same as
for bumping a normal dialin user. 

(btw - I'm talking about modern integrated access platforms like cisco
5260's, Ericsson Tigri etc etc.. not the old fashioned, grab a TA220 and
stick it into a 2501 method - but even so, the above still applies :)


//umar.



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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[DaZZa]

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000, Dave Fitch wrote:

> > Add to this the fact that ISP's charge _much_ more for a 64k ISDN account
> > {$500 a month, roughly?} than they do for two dialup accounts {2 x $50 a
> > month?}, and ISDN comes out behind.
> 
> make that "most ISPs".  There are some that charge the same $ per
> hour charge or $ per Mb regardless of whether it's PSTN or ISDN
> you're connecting via (eg. www.albury.net.au).  In many ways a
> customer using ISDN is easier and cheaper for the ISP I would've
> thought.

OK, I accept the qualification. :-)

As for ISDN being easier - the investment in TE is probably equal to
dialups, byt tyhe provision for abuse in downloading is _much_ higher,
given that ISDN connections are usually permanent, and dialups can be
dropped off if they're abusing.

DaZZa



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Re: [SLUG] multi-link PPP

[Dave Fitch]

DaZZa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Add to this the fact that ISP's charge _much_ more for a 64k ISDN account
> {$500 a month, roughly?} than they do for two dialup accounts {2 x $50 a
> month?}, and ISDN comes out behind.

make that "most ISPs".  There are some that charge the same $ per
hour charge or $ per Mb regardless of whether it's PSTN or ISDN
you're connecting via (eg. www.albury.net.au).  In many ways a
customer using ISDN is easier and cheaper for the ISP I would've
thought.

Dave.


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Re: [SLUG] Browser for X under 24Mb

[Andrew Reilly]

On Sat, Aug 19, 2000 at 02:51:09PM +1000, Jeff Waugh wrote:
> > Looking for recommendations for a browser that can run under X running
> > on a 24Mb machine. The user is a begineer. gui preferred. Windows
> > Manager is Fwm???

How about Mosaic?  It doesn't do all of the modern stuff, but it
still _looks_ a bit like Netscape.  I used to run it on a 4M 486
while I was at Uni, so it can't be that bad.

> Encompass:
>   http://www.geocities.com/lordzephyroth/encompass.html
> 
> Based on gtkhtml, so it ought to be reasonably tight. Looks like a nice
> simple GUI browser, though I must admit I haven't tried it.

Well, the web page says small and light, but my system has just
dragged bonobo and all of that parephenalia in (I'm building it
now), so how light can it be?

[Update: it's running now.  Seems to be very early days yet.
The edit|preferences menu doesn't have options to configure a
proxy, or anything else for that matter; the bookmaks option
doesn't seem to work; it has some fairly serious rendering bugs,
and it's crashed once so far...  However, it _is_ fast, and it _is_
small.  I've just gone through my list of usual pages, and
sitting on slashdot it still has a VM footprint of under 11M,
and an RSS of about 8M.  Great work guys!  It's also a hell of a
lot faster than gecko/mozilla.]

> Galeon:
>   http://galeon.sourceforge.net/
> 
> Galeon may be appropriate too, using the Mozilla rendering engine, Gecko.

This looks good.  The rendering is much faster than older
versions of Mozilla that I've tried.  It crashes pretty easily
for me, though.  Actually, I wonder whether that's an
XFree86-4.0/ttfont artifact, because it was running pretty
reliably through a VNC connection, and XVNC is based on
XFree86-3.3.6.

Galeon isn't small, though.  After opening and grabbing it's
home page (the GNOME home site) it had a VM footprint of 32M and
a running set size of 25M...

> Oh, and I *heartliy* recommend Links as a good console browser. It contains
> almost all the useful features you'd expect from a graphical browser
> (colour, background downloading, etc), but kicks the proverbial when it
> comes to speed.

I've been using w3m for console stuff.  It renders tables and
frames quite well (can even do slashdot, for example), and the
navigation is easier to figure out than lynx.

None of these non-netscape browsers seem to be able to do HTTPS,
which is a pain.  I wonder if it's just an issue of a compile
time option.  I have the openssl libraries installed, so they
would have been found if needed.

-- 
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Re: [SLUG] Browser for X under 24Mb

[Andrew Reilly]

On Sat, Aug 19, 2000 at 02:34:28PM +1000, Terry Collins wrote:
> Looking for recommendations for a browser that can run under X running
> on a 24Mb machine. The user is a begineer. gui preferred. Windows
> Manager is Fwm???

Well, GUI browsers for X don't get any smaller than chimera, or
chimera2 (1.70p0 ftp://ftp.cs.unlv.edu/pub/chimera/ and 2.0a19
ftp://ftp.cs.unlv.edu/pub/chimera-alpha/).

On the other hand, you won't find a browser that supports fewer
features, or breaks as often, either...

Chimera is really weird from that point of view.  It was one of
the first browsers ever, and still seems to have two threads of
development, and still works really badly...

Don't know why I brought it up, really...

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RE: [SLUG] Modem Problem

[George Vieira]

Can you run minicom and see if the modem responds OK?
Do an ATZ and check that it returns an OK message back.
What are you running to get this error, PPP dial up or something else?

-Original Message-
From: Richard Blackburn [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, 21 August 2000 5:49
To: Sydney Linux Users Group
Subject: [SLUG] Modem Problem


Finally getting in back together after hardware headache. Had to
reinstall RH6.2 (never denigrate backups). Now modem won't go. Says
'failed to activate with error 4'. What is error 4 or how to I find out?
Thanks
Richard


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RE: [SLUG] Modem Problem

[Dave Kempe]

Try tail /var/log/messages

that will tell you where pppd died a bit better.

For a more interactive approach use a -f after that.

I think your connect script is failing... Does the handshake finish properly
and sound ok?

dave


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> Richard Blackburn
> Sent: Monday, 21 August 2000 5:49 AM
> To: Sydney Linux Users Group
> Subject: [SLUG] Modem Problem
>
>
> Finally getting in back together after hardware headache. Had to
> reinstall RH6.2 (never denigrate backups). Now modem won't go. Says
> 'failed to activate with error 4'. What is error 4 or how to I find out?
> Thanks
> Richard
>
>
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> More Info: http://slug.org.au/lists/listinfo/slug
>



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[SLUG] Modem Problem

[Richard Blackburn]

Finally getting in back together after hardware headache. Had to
reinstall RH6.2 (never denigrate backups). Now modem won't go. Says
'failed to activate with error 4'. What is error 4 or how to I find out?
Thanks
Richard


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[SLUG] OT: Musical Interns Mock MS

[Alexander Else]

Musical Interns Mock MS
by Katie Dean 3:00 a.m. Aug. 19, 2000 PDT

Rarely are employees celebrated for poking fun at the boss. But at 
Microsoft, a clever group of interns parodied their company leaders and 
were rewarded for their efforts.

The .NUTs (pronounced dot-nuts) are an all-male a cappella group that sings 
Microsoft parody songs like "Sue Me Baby One More Time."


http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,38220,00.html

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Alexander Else
http://cyberchrist.org



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[SLUG] distributed gene annotation

[ken]

http://www.sciam.com/2000/0900issue/0900scicit2.html

Mentions Distributed Sequence Annotation System (DAS) by Lincoln Stein (Perl
hacker) for gathering annotation corrections from all over. Open Source and
Linux get a mention too.

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[SLUG] Re: What are components?

[Jamie Honan]

> how do components/plugins ease code re-use?

> surely they are all the same as using dlopen and a function call?

A couple of things here:

plugins often seem to imply some software which displays
something (i.e. a sub-window). Another sense of a plugin that
I see is much more dependancy on the calling environment
than you would normally expect from a shared library. (E.g. expecting
functions in the caller to be present, c.f. Apache modules, GIMP
plugins etc.)

In a sense you have a blob of functionality, and you draw a line
somewhere in the middle, some functionality on one side, some on the
other. You want to make the strings crossing the line minimal, sensible
and optimal. A partitioning problem.

>either way you have to have an agreed function name, arguments and
>return value. the only way of really avoiding that is something like
>what perl does, by autoconverting ints/strings and allowing hashes of
>argument pairs to be passed(*).

Some of this is what I think is 'agreed names'. It seems to
be not so much a fixed name, but you search for a target that
fulfills a name. Complicated stuff, but is it neccesary? CORBA
has lots of this.

converting parameters and structures is what some people call 
marshalling, which is the stuff of the gourd and the sandal.

Hence XML folk have RPC data in XML format. There are endless other
varieties. My current personal favorite is a thing called
sexp, invented by Rivest of MD5 and encryption fame. Looks like
lisp data.

Small manifesto atteched at end, for the interested.

>(this is, of course, assuming that binary compatibility isn't
>important.. and, well, it isn't)

Not sure of what your getting at here...

Jamie


Here are the design goals for S-expressions:

  -- generality: S-expressions should be good at representing arbitrary
 data.

  -- readability: it should be easy for someone to examine and 
 understand the structure of an S-expression.

  -- economy: S-expressions should represent data compactly.

  -- tranportability: S-expressions should be easy to transport
 over communication media (such as email) that are known to be
 less than perfect.

  -- flexibility: S-expressions should make it relatively simple to
 modify and extend data structures.

  -- canonicalization: it should be easy to produce a unique 
 "canonical" form of an S-expression, for digital signature purposes.

  -- efficiency: S-expressions should admit in-memory representations
 that allow efficient processing.





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Re: [SLUG] mounting unusual filesystems

[Nick Croft]

apolopgies..
In my last post I said `get xhfs'. I think I meant `htools', a hfs
equivalen to mtools.

The command line I gave works as long as you have MacOS supported in your
kernel.

Nick



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