Re: [RCSE] Re: SASS HELP ALERT !! "Keeping Sixty Acres South for the Greater ...
Interesting, First, I am not soliciting the help of the electric flyers. Second, I did not come over to pick a fight. I came over to photograph all of the activity on 60 Acres South and to also take photographs of the empty 60 acres north. I did take pictures of the electrics that were flying out of the parking lot. I was confronted by an individual (electric pilot) who demanded that I not take a picture of him. I also took pictures off the rocket guys and the glider guys. That is why I came over, to photograph the disparity between use of 60 acres north and south in an effort to show King County that the soccer people treat the property like it is private property. I did try to provide some history of the field to some electric guys, but only after I was asked. I knew before I started talking that I was in a "no win" situation, but I decided to speak anyway. Unfortunately, I was continuously interrupted by comments like, who gave you the authority or it is a public property and I can do anything I want, many of them quite rude. No one wanted to let me finish. When I asked why can't electrics fly at Marymoor (the local power field) I heard comments like it is too far (just three miles away) or Merymoor has too many rules. It was obvious right off the bat, that most of the guys there were not interested in flying under established AMA rules or even knew what they were. In addition, the size of the electrics has grown from light weight park flyers to much larger aircraft. Someone even told me that I should not take any pictures of these larger aircraft because it will simply "fuel the fire." The glider guys have been the primary reason why soccer has not expanded into 60 acres south since 1984. If anyone of you would like to see the historical record, supported by hundreds of documents collected from County records and archives, I would be happy to show them to you. All you have to do is ask. RC has been a safe sport in King County for years. It has been that way for a simple reason. Every area where RC is flown (private or public property) is governed by a local club. These clubs make themselves responsible for promoting safe flying for a single reason. To make sure they can fly there in the future. The glider guys have been flying at 60 Acres South since 1968 without an incident. They take their safety very seriously and teach flying to new pilots every Wednesday night throughout the flying season. Come over any Wednesday night, Doug Brusig cooks up a mean burger, and its free. The glider guys main concern is that the unsafe flying occurring out of the parking lot could end all RC flying at that field. We also discussed that the glider guys have nowhere else to fly. Nothing large enough to support its launching equipment. On the other hand the electric's can fly just about anywhere. No one seemed to care. So even though I tried to discuss some history, discuss unsafe flying practices (using the parking lot full of cars as runway as an example), the response from the many of the electric pilots was hostile. No one asked what the rules are, no one asked why, no one wanted to discuss safety. The only response was a hostile one and typically along the lines of "because its a public park, I can do anything I want." Finally, Mikey, I wish you had volunteered your time to provide the legal help. It is not hard, but it is expensive and time consuming. If you had, you would have known that "Behavior like this" was not an issue discussed by either the glider guys or by King County before the court. If you would like to talk to the prosecutor that represented the county to confirm this, please let me know and I will have him give you a call. I have attached an article that was published entitled "NO FEAR." You might find it interesting. If anyone wants to call and discuss the issues, or meet me at the site, please give me a call. Sherman Knight 425-576-8777 In a message dated 5/6/2008 5:14:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: If you guys are serious about soliciting help, you will need to rein in Sherman a little bit. Him coming over & picking fights with the electric guys, with heated words exchanged, stupid political "you can't fly here anymore either" stuff, is not my idea of a great time at 60 acres, and makes all the words people say about "the glider guys" stick like glue. We're all out there to have a good time, guys. Most of the electric guys have the respect enough to check which board and generally stay out of your airspace. Please don't pick fights with us. Behavior like this, IMHO, is one of the major reasons that the judge decided for the county... Hope this helps. -- _Mikey_ _Mikey_'s Profile: http://www.rcgr
Re: [RCSE] Re: 72 MHz, 2.4GHz, and 100 models airborne simulaneously
In a message dated 5/6/2008 5:14:38 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: At the upcoming SEFF meet (electrics) they have organized a world record attempt of most RC planes in the air at once...in the past they were limited by the 50 channels and Hamm bands but this time they have allowed 40 2.4 ships to join in. Now that is the interesting thing and the part that most fits this thread...why only 40 2.4s? I guess Gordy missed the post concerning the SEFF 100 model world record so here it is again. Today (4 May) at the Southeast Electric Fun Fly 100 R/C models were airborne simultaneously for more than one minute. The pilots were spread out along a 1700 ft grass runway at Mac Hodges' private airfield in Andersonville, GA (site of the SEFF). Models were launched in 5 separate waves about 10 seconds apart and the minute timing began when the last model was airborne. Unofficially, the group included 53 2.4 Ghz systems and 47 72 Mhz systems. Unofficially, there were no problems with the 2.4 systems, but there were a few, undefined, problems with some 72 Mhz systems. There should be a full report on RC groups in a day or so and a published report in Model Aviation Magazine in a few months. There were about 115 pilots signed up but only 100 finished. I was proud to be a participant in this effort. Don Richmond San Diego, CA (Pensacola, FL for a few weeks) [EMAIL PROTECTED] _www.hilaunch.com_ (http://www.hilaunch.com/) **Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301)
[RCSE] gordys batteries
gee gordy i seem to remember that u launched with low batteries at the syosset contest last year with rather alarming results. paul bell ps. thanks to you who responded to my dlg wing request. i have one.
[RCSE] Re: SASS HELP ALERT !! "Keeping Sixty Acres South for the Greater Community'sGood"
I got replies back from two of the commisioners. You? -- dougalert dougalert's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=24060 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=851726 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: SASS HELP ALERT !! "Keeping Sixty Acres South for the Greater Community'sGood"
If you guys are serious about soliciting help, you will need to rein in Sherman a little bit. Him coming over & picking fights with the electric guys, with heated words exchanged, stupid political "you can't fly here anymore either" stuff, is not my idea of a great time at 60 acres, and makes all the words people say about "the glider guys" stick like glue. We're all out there to have a good time, guys. Most of the electric guys have the respect enough to check which board and generally stay out of your airspace. Please don't pick fights with us. Behavior like this, IMHO, is one of the major reasons that the judge decided for the county... Hope this helps. -- _Mikey_ _Mikey_'s Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=204221 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=851726 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Arthur's new e-mail address
Arthur's new E-mail address if you care. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Re: 72 MHz, 2.4GHz, latency and you...
Today I was using a 9303 2.4 system thermaling a Supra at the Syosset NY field, the systems reaction speed didn't help much when my batteries ran out :-(. Lucked out with just a ding or two...but the worse part was I didn't get one of the two last 30 minute flights I need to complete the Silver level of the Canadian Soaring Society. You need 6 30's on a short landing tape (or you can sub 6 60min slope flights, 6 2min precision flights (+/- 2 seconds) with short landings. A 1K Goal and Return too. The air was there but the sink cycles kept killing the flights at 25mins :-(. I wiggled the sticks really fast but it didn't help ;-). This Latency thread is a good one, the more we can learn about the new digital systems the better. At the upcoming SEFF meet (electrics) they have organized a world record attempt of most RC planes in the air at once...in the past they were limited by the 50 channels and Hamm bands but this time they have allowed 40 2.4 ships to join in. Now that is the interesting thing and the part that most fits this thread...why only 40 2.4s? By the way I ran a test today with some Germans who had a UAV system working a quad rotor recon ship...about 1meter diameter ship, likely about 1/4 million+ for the system. It uses 900mhz (just under actually) for control and 2.4 for the video feed back, but fairly strong output. They were very interested to see if it would bother my system or mine theirs...but no effect (according to their data and my Flight Log). Gordy -- Gordysoar Gordysoar's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=12801 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856574 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: 72 MHz, 2.4GHz, latency and you...
One more thing that I discovered yesterday trying to make that 30 all day. My elevator servo stopped working in flight, and I managed to 'land' it three times using flaps to loop it down to flat tall grass landings and once to a soft dirt dork. That Supra is one tough airframe. But in all that, something really important and valuable came out of those 'crashes'. When I did tests using all the ideas guys had used to adapt 2.4 to carbon nose cone fuses, I found that the simplest and 'best' was Don Barker's Sputnik install. The 4 extended whisker routed out behind the nose cone lip at 10-2-4-8 o'clock around its circumference. I tried to make it 'not' work, and tried to improve on it using the advice of -2.4 Techs- and using special 2.4 extension antenna wires. In the end, Don's was as good as it gets...and again simple. The Flight Log data was repeated time after time..and all good. But about a month or so back I flew at a contest in Orlando...calm air, warm temps, 8min tasks should have been a no brainier but for some reason my Supra was not 'flying'. The best I could do was 3 1/2min out of 4 rounds! It just wasn't listening..the funny thing was that the Flight log didn't show one Hold...lots of fades but no holds but I was sure that I was not in control of the model a lot of the time. (never suspecting a dead spot on my elevator motor commutator). I sent a note to the Horizon guys, asking if they could figure out what was wrong with my 'radio'? Of course there as nothing wrong with my radio and that was confirmed by the Flight Log's numbers. I switched to a Pike Giant (F3B/Slope Racer) that I love for Thermal Comps because its so challenging, and the next three rounds where all with in 2 seconds of perfect..one 75 and two 100 landingsversus almost cutting me and my timer in half with two of the previous 4 flights. The Barker install puts the two RXs on top of my elevator and rudder servos which lay on their sides in my fuse. After that I flew the Supra a lot and didn't seem to have that kind of lack of control again but was suddenly seeing numbers every flight of 999! and HOLDs too. I'd contacted Don he confirmed it was crazy that the numbers had changed that much. Something was weird...and it wasn't like the RX's...or their antenna. Yesterday when I my elevator stopped moving, and found that it would stop at a specific point as if it were unplugged..intermittently...and after the third crash, I switched the rudder servo with the elevator servo...I was determined to get a 30...figuring I could get away with a locked rudder (it would stop only about 1/4" off center, but would move if I cycled the stick). Of course I didn't factor in that it might also be upping the current drain on the systemand that's the point where all this is leading to... The 999 readings I was getting were only on the main RX antennas! The remote stayed consistent...and the main was perched on top that injured servo! When I switched servos, the main now perched on a healthy servo..the numbers from those flights were back to normal with no holds! So I am thinking that the servo amp/motor was likely radiating, causing interference to the RX perched on top of it...or if not that the current spikes possibly. A lot to learn about this 2.4 stuff. Gordy -- Gordysoar Gordysoar's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=12801 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856574 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: 72 MHz, 2.4GHz, latency and you...
Gordysoar Wrote: > If you'd all just start using your Talking Timers wheny you 'practice' > and have a landing task set up like the zone that will be at your next > contest. > > Its interesting when an RES wooden RES ship like the Big Birdy, > Marauder, Grand Esprit or the like, whips up on the entire field of > super moldies > > Keep in mind that houses fly just fine in Kansas without digital > servos, computer radios and 2.4 gigglehurts stuff. > > Launch, find a thermal, stay in it for 10mins and land on the 100 > spot. > > While you guys are looking at scopes the top guys are looking at their > model's tails, and using their left thumbs MORE than their rights. > > Here's a question, can the Flash move his thumb faster than the pulses > of a 2.4 module system can reach the surfaces? > > Gordy Did you enjoy that post Gordy :) While I agree that taking your contest tasks seriously will always make you a better pilot the post was originally started on the topic of latency. The same well practiced pilot may actually find that a lower latency system will actually give him a overall "better" connection to his model in subtle yet discernable ways that a 72 MHz and or a "modulized" 2.4 GHz system may not. The argument that humans are not able to perceive the difference between 30 MS and 70 MS in a single event does not account for the fact that an average flight consists of hundreds of control inputs. String these together and you may be able to glean the difference. In fact this is what pilots are already reporting. This argument is a lot like the past FPS argument in the videogame industry. It was thought that the human eye can't really benefit from a video image produced of frames per second higher than 32 FPS. We know now that a video processor capable of 250 FPS can throw in more detail and visual data and give this useful data to the player. Today you will not find a single video card capped at anything close to 32 fps. What is the connection here? Just like a video game player taking in all of the small details on his 250 FPS video experience the new breed of 2.4 GHz TX may be able to give a new slightly better connection and feedback to the user. If you doubt this then try flying a house at the next contest .I think you might appreciate the connection I am speaking to. In short this sport has advanced with small incraments over the years that adds up to amazing performance. Few would go back now. 30MS as compared to 70 MS is a small incrament and one day we will look back at this latency issue and wonder how we ever flew on anything more than 10 MS latency. -- webbsolution webbsolution's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=164801 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856574 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] For Sale: 5.33m EMS Duo Discus 1/3 Scale Glider
I have a large medical bill to pay and have no choice but to sell my beautiful EMS 1/3 scale 5.33 meter Duo Discus. It's in my garage and has never flown. Has 2 blemishes on a wing from shipping which are easily repaired with some monokote. This is the version with the sheeted wings. Retract installed. Scale canopy and cockpit prepared for scale finish. Get a great glider at a great price regardless of the Euro exchange rate, and the plane is already in SoCal. I am asking $2750 obo. I can possibly deliver to the Visalia Spring Aerotow or the JR Aerotow (need to know by Monday). Picture from the former EMS website: http://tinyurl.com/5onp3x I can send pictures of the actual plane this weekend upon request. Please contact me at fdeichsel at hotmail dot com. _ Stay in touch when you're away with Windows Live Messenger. http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_messenger_052008
[RCSE] Re: GORDY POETRY
Little bit more of a commute than I wanna make... enjoy yourselves... JW -- schrederman schrederman's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=13218 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856759 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: 72 MHz, 2.4GHz, latency and you...
If you'd all just start using your Talking Timers wheny you 'practice' and have a landing task set up like the zone that will be at your next contest. Its interesting when an RES wooden RES ship like the Big Birdy, Marauder, Grand Esprit or the like, whips up on the entire field of super moldies Keep in mind that houses fly just fine in Kansas without digital servos, computer radios and 2.4 gigglehurts stuff. Launch, find a thermal, stay in it for 10mins and land on the 100 spot. While you guys are looking at scopes the top guys are looking at their model's tails, and using their left thumbs MORE than their rights. Here's a question, can the Flash move his thumb faster than the pulses of a 2.4 module system can reach the surfaces? Gordy -- Gordysoar Gordysoar's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=12801 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856574 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: GORDY POETRY
Contest at the Sysosett field, MOM too ;-). Gordy NJ tonite -- Gordysoar Gordysoar's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=12801 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=856759 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] F3J In The Rockies - Hotels
Hey guys, My flying buddy Jerry Gross and I (wives to) are heading west for the contest and are running into a little trouble on a hotel. We'd like to stay out on Tower Road somewhere near the sod farm but don't want to pay "Airport" prices. $150.00 a night is a bit much for no more time than we're going to be in the room. Girls will head to the mountains and we will be FLYING!! If anyone can give me the actual name and rough address of a good place to stay on Tower I would really appreciate it. Thanks in advance to anyone that can help - hey Doc, you out there? Sure look forward to seeing all of you. I'll try to leave this flippin' wind at home when I come out. Randy (when's this weather going to break) McCleave in not so mountainous Kansas
[RCSE] 9303 w/2.4 module question
You can switch between the two Tx antenna systems in less than a minute, so I'm not sure mounting the 2.4 antenna on top of the 72 MHz collapsed Tx antenna will save you much time. The actual 2.4 antenna can be mounted nearly anyway you want, but you need to have the ability to keep it perpendicular to the aircraft for max range. Yeah, you could slip it over the stub of the 72MHz antenna and secure it with tape, but why? It only takes a few seconds to unscrew the regular 72MHz antenna and screw in the plastic 2.4 GHz antenna mount (it is only a mount and not part of the antenna system). Slipping it over the other antenna will probably not affect range, but a ground range check should reveal any problems. I can't make any guarantees since I have't tried it. Ben Clerx I have a 9303 with a 2.4 module. The 2.4 antenna mount uses a plastic adap= ter which screws in to replace the 72 mhz antenna. =20 Is there any reason I cannot simply mount the 2.4 antenna on top of the col= lapsed 72 mhz antenna? In other words, do I have to remove the 72 mhz ante= nna? Robert Samuels ... St. Louis ** Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family favorites at AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod000301)
[RCSE] 11 Days to TMSS/ESL M-O-M!
Good afternoon, Our event down here in Southeast Virginia is really shaping up. Our president, Lenny Strickland, has been pulling-out all the stops acquiring equipment and getting the field in great shape for the contest. Just got the awards in the mail last night, and they look fantastic. I hope you all can come on out enjoy the fun with us. Thanks, Josh. http://www.soartmss.com/id19.html Office phone: (757)864-1159 Home phone: (757)850-3971 Cell phone: (757)771-1073 Fax: (757)864-8675 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] For Sale: 5.33m EMS Duo Discus 1/3 Scale Glider
I have a large medical bill to pay and have no choice but to sell my beautiful EMS 1/3 scale 5.33 meter Duo Discus. It's in my garage and has never flown. Has 2 blemishes on a wing from shipping which are easily repaired with some monokote. This is the version with the sheeted wings. Retract installed. Scale canopy and cockpit prepared for scale finish. Get a great glider at a great price regardless of the Euro exchange rate, and the plane is already in SoCal. I am asking $2750 obo. Open to offers! I can possibly deliver to the Visalia Spring Aerotow or the JR Aerotow (need to know by Thursday at the latest). Picture from the former EMS website: http://tinyurl.com/5onp3x I can send pictures of the actual plane upon request. Please contact me at fdeichsel at hotmail dot com. -- 249 Spiele für nur 1 Preis. Die GMX Spieleflatrate schon ab 9,90 Euro. Neu: Asterix bei den Olympischen Spielen: http://flat.games.gmx.de RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] midsouth registration
Midsouth,s registration still won,t download, and there are no contacts listed. Paul Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Man on Man this weekend
For those of you that believe "Man on Man" is the only way to fly, get yur butts to the SVSS May club contest this Saturday. Pilots meeting 9:30 AM. First round 10 AM. Pre-registration is mandatory in order to set up the flight groups. e-mail to; [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] F3J Fundraiser
OK guys lets keep it going. Just ordered a jacket and 2 hats. Who is next? On my way to England to fly Raven + Wasp UAVs, Mike Reagan
[RCSE] 9303 w/2.4 module question
I have a 9303 with a 2.4 module. The 2.4 antenna mount uses a plastic adapter which screws in to replace the 72 mhz antenna. Is there any reason I cannot simply mount the 2.4 antenna on top of the collapsed 72 mhz antenna? In other words, do I have to remove the 72 mhz antenna? Robert Samuels ... St. Louis _ Get Free (PRODUCT) RED™ Emoticons, Winks and Display Pics. http://joinred.spaces.live.com?ocid=TXT_HMTG_prodredemoticons_052008
