Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
Howdy, My suggestion is that you move from skaapstad up to jozi. I have encountered many developers here who have struts projects going, and the local industry seems to be keen on it too. We have just completed moving a banking legacy system to struts/EJBs and our client (Tebabank) insisted on java. Everyone is real impressed with the results and I am certain that this site will be used as a reference for similar projects in the future. :-) Scott. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 06/26/03 01:28pm Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] # The information contained in this message and or attachments is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any system and destroy and copies. # - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
Hi Scott, You know how the majority here in Cape Town take things easy. Well, not me!! :) I'm always looking for better ways in doing things / dealing with problems. I might get a chance to go to Johannesburg soon to work on a legacy system architecture conversion to J2EE architecture. (EJB, JTA, etc..) This will definitely be a good move for me. :) As far as Struts, I've worked with it affectively for only about 2 months so far. It's brilliant I can say! :) I'm doing quite an involved B2C system at the moment using Struts, OJB, and many other interesting goodies. The reality is that I'm currently employed in a very MS environment, so I thought I'll get them to gradually convert to a more Java architectural approach hence hinting towards Struts framework. So far I haven't really succeeded. :) This is why I'm looking for help on the mailing list aspecialy from anyone who had simillar experience. --Alen - Original Message - From: SCOTT VENTER [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 1:46 PM Subject: Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!! Howdy, My suggestion is that you move from skaapstad up to jozi. I have encountered many developers here who have struts projects going, and the local industry seems to be keen on it too. We have just completed moving a banking legacy system to struts/EJBs and our client (Tebabank) insisted on java. Everyone is real impressed with the results and I am certain that this site will be used as a reference for similar projects in the future. :-) Scott. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 06/26/03 01:28pm Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] # The information contained in this message and or attachments is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any system and destroy and copies. # - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
You might take a look at Maverick. http://mavnet.sourceforge.net/ It's very much like Struts, and uses a site-map, but is simpler. It is also available for .NET (as well as .PHP). Perhaps the Maverick.NET framework might provide a way that you could combine the best of both worlds. IMHO, the major benefit of MVC frameworks, including Struts, is the XML site map. -Ted. Alen Ribic wrote: Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Ted Husted, Struts in Action http://husted.com/struts/book.html - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
thx Ted. Could you perhaps give me some really strong points as to why they would benefit from switching over to Struts or do you believe that switching over to Struts would only merely be debatable? I really wanna use Struts in our dev. env. :-) --Alen - Original Message - From: Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Struts Users Mailing List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 4:33 PM Subject: Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!! You might take a look at Maverick. http://mavnet.sourceforge.net/ It's very much like Struts, and uses a site-map, but is simpler. It is also available for .NET (as well as .PHP). Perhaps the Maverick.NET framework might provide a way that you could combine the best of both worlds. IMHO, the major benefit of MVC frameworks, including Struts, is the XML site map. -Ted. Alen Ribic wrote: Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Ted Husted, Struts in Action http://husted.com/struts/book.html - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
Alen, Take a look at this ... http://www.strutskickstart.com/ There's a link in the sidebar, Powerpoint: Selling Struts to Management, to download a presentation that might be helpful for you. I haven't read it myself (thankfully haven't needed to), but others on this list have been grateful for it. Hope that helps, Susan Bradeen On 06/26/2003 11:00:09 AM Alen Ribic wrote: thx Ted. Could you perhaps give me some really strong points as to why they would benefit from switching over to Struts or do you believe that switching over to Struts would only merely be debatable? I really wanna use Struts in our dev. env. :-) --Alen - Original Message - From: Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Struts Users Mailing List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 4:33 PM Subject: Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!! You might take a look at Maverick. http://mavnet.sourceforge.net/ It's very much like Struts, and uses a site-map, but is simpler. It is also available for .NET (as well as .PHP). Perhaps the Maverick.NET framework might provide a way that you could combine the best of both worlds. IMHO, the major benefit of MVC frameworks, including Struts, is the XML site map. -Ted. Alen Ribic wrote: Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Ted Husted, Struts in Action http://husted.com/struts/book.html - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!!
Great! Thanks Susan. This is definitely something I'll be able to use. Regards, --Alen - Original Message - From: Susan Bradeen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Struts Users Mailing List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 6:13 PM Subject: Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!! Alen, Take a look at this ... http://www.strutskickstart.com/ There's a link in the sidebar, Powerpoint: Selling Struts to Management, to download a presentation that might be helpful for you. I haven't read it myself (thankfully haven't needed to), but others on this list have been grateful for it. Hope that helps, Susan Bradeen On 06/26/2003 11:00:09 AM Alen Ribic wrote: thx Ted. Could you perhaps give me some really strong points as to why they would benefit from switching over to Struts or do you believe that switching over to Struts would only merely be debatable? I really wanna use Struts in our dev. env. :-) --Alen - Original Message - From: Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Struts Users Mailing List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 4:33 PM Subject: Re: Help me to convince my boss to use Struts!!! You might take a look at Maverick. http://mavnet.sourceforge.net/ It's very much like Struts, and uses a site-map, but is simpler. It is also available for .NET (as well as .PHP). Perhaps the Maverick.NET framework might provide a way that you could combine the best of both worlds. IMHO, the major benefit of MVC frameworks, including Struts, is the XML site map. -Ted. Alen Ribic wrote: Hi Everyone I just have had a discussion with my boss with regards to why he prefers the way of using a push mechanism microsoft.xmlhttp to return data to client. (Client's browser doesn't reload when response is returned :) ) We are based in a very MS environment as you can see but he has been going the push mechanism way for some time now. (ASP functions are called up via send() request function of JavaScript MS xmlhttp comp.) I'm trying to convince him that framework such as Struts is the answer to many of our problems. The main issue to him is the extra overhead constraint on bandwidth. We are based in South Africa, Cape Town and the bandwidth here is quite poor hence he would like to lower the roundtrip cost. Example: We have a system that has a tree view of data. Now as a tree, he would like to keep the previously opened branches open while the new one is pushed into the clients browser by the server hence only the newly expanded branch will be returned as a response from the server. Also note that he as a MS slave doesn't give a dam about platform independency, not even multiple browser support. (Sad I know!) Also with regards to security, he implies that we run our applications in a very friendly environment, so people won't try to disable clientside JavaScript validation as an example. It doesn't seem like a major issue either. Development time-frame seems to be a big issue too. I just can seem to convince him of the actual benefits of using Struts even damn ASP.NET compared to his method of using a 2 tiered system with push mechanism. So anyone PLEASE help me get the benefit across to him!!! I would like to put it into a table format or something for him to be able to scan through. From some experience in Struts I have got the real feel for the benefit of using Struts / MVC based framework but I still can't seem to explain well to him the main reason why he should convert!!! :( Hope to hear from you guys soon. Best Regards --Alen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Ted Husted, Struts in Action http://husted.com/struts/book.html - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
