[biofuels-biz] switchgrass to electricity (PR)
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/030529/atth008_1.html Press Release Source: Southern Company Southern Company Testing Grass Cubes to Make Electricity Thursday May 29, 10:01 am ET ATLANTA, May 29 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Southern Company today announced that it is now using switchgrass and other local grasses formed into small cubes to generate electricity. The grass cubes are being mixed with coal at Southern Company's Plant Mitchell, near Albany, Ga. Mitchell is owned and operated by the company's Georgia Power subsidiary. (LOGO: http://www.newscom.com/cgi-bin/prnh/20020207/SOCOLOGO ) Switchgrass is a native prairie grass grown easily in the South, and when blended with coal as a fuel can reduce power plant emissions. Initial testing of switchgrass was conducted at Southern Company's Alabama Power Gadsden Steam Plant in the spring of 2001. Results showed switchgrass not only to be a potential energy source but also emissions of carbon dioxide, sulfur dioxide and mercury were reduced. Based on the successful results achieved earlier from the switchgrass co- firing at Plant Gadsden, Southern Company has committed to a three-year demonstration of biomass co-firing at that plant, located in Gadsden, Ala. Switchgrass, along with other biomass fuels, will be tested in order to improve on initial test results, as well as to gain more knowledge of biomass co-firing. We've seen favorable results testing switchgrass as a potential energy source, said Dr. Charles Goodman, Southern Company senior vice president of research and environmental affairs. As Southern Company diversifies its fuel portfolio to meet future energy demands, biomass, such as switchgrass, is just one of several options we are currently testing that may be beneficial in a low-cost, environmental-friendly way. The testing at Plant Mitchell uses two kinds of pelletized grass; coastal Bermuda grass from Sunbelt Ag Expo in Moultrie, Ga., and switchgrass from Alabama that was grown on 300 acres of farmland near Lincoln and Winterboro. If used as an energy crop, switchgrass could provide farmers with maximum yields and returns at minimal costs. Plant Mitchell received 170 tons of the switchgrass cubes to be pulverized and blended with varying amounts of coal to determine the most efficient mixture. Southern Company is hoping that the compressed switchgrass co-firing at Plant Mitchell can be done without having to inject the grass separately as required in the initial testing at Plant Gadsden. Last year, Plant Gadsden's switchgrass pilot project won environmental awards from the Electric Power Research Institute and the Southeastern Electric Exchange. With 4 million customers and nearly 37,000 megawatts of generating capacity, Atlanta-based Southern Company (NYSE: SO - News) is the premier super- regional energy company in the Southeast and a leading U.S. producer of electricity. Southern Company owns electric utilities in four states, a growing competitive generation company, an energy services business and a competitive retail natural gas business, as well as fiber optics and wireless communications. Southern Company brands are known for excellent customer service, high reliability and retail electric prices that are 15 percent below the national average. Southern Company has been named two consecutive years No. 1 on Fortune magazine's America's Most Admired Companies list in the Electric and Gas Utility industry. Southern Company has more than 500,000 shareholders, making its common stock one of the most widely held in the United States. Visit the Southern Company Web site at www.southerncompany.com . Source: Southern Company Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuels-biz] switchgrass to electricity (PR)
Until the numbers get bigger, this possibly qualifuies as greenwash? Good idea in principle, though not exactly new. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] blender batch
Dan: I also did a first test batch of 3 liters wvo, adding 600ml methanol and got only 350ml of glycerine. I didn't really know what to expect, but 10% relative to the original stock seemed kind of low to me as well. Where did you get the notion (expectation) that you should get at least 200ml (20% of feedstock)? I think both Dan and I would appreciate feed back on what kinds of glycerine vs biodiesel yields we should expect. I have not come across much about this on any of the web-based material out there. Does yield vary greatly with oil type and condition? When you have never done this before, its kind of difficult to interpret your results. Cliff At 08:31 AM 5/28/2003 -0700, you wrote: Hi, I did a blender test batch of biodiesel last night. I titrated to 2ml, so I used 5.5g of lye and mixed it in with 200ml of methanol. I then heated the oil up(1 litre), and put it in the blender, and mixed for 15-20 minutes. It quickly began to separate and the biodiesel at the very top inch of the blender after the first 15 minutes or so was quite clear. I woke up in the morning and only 125 ml or glycerin settled out and the biodiesel is cloudy. It dropped to only 50 degrees last night. Shouldn't there by at least 200 ml of glycerin settled at the bottom? There are only 2 layers, the top, light and slightly cloudy, and the dark glycerin. Where is the extra 75 ml of glycerin, and at what temp does the biodiesel clear up? Thanks, Dan __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). http://calendar.yahoo.comhttp://calendar.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor http://rd.yahoo.com/M=251812.3170658.4537139.1512248/D=egroupweb/S=1705083269:HM/A=1564415/R=0/*http://www.netflix.com/Default?mqso=60164784partid=317065853e9b5bf.jpg 53e9b5cf.jpg Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlhttp://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] etanol + metanol
hai keith thanks fo reply my email i have already seen website you gave me, that;'s my reason why i interested to try it.what do you think?do you have any suggestion? thanks Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail! http://login.mail.lycos.com/r/referral?aid=27005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Two-stage Process - jelly?
Hello Paul, Mark See below... - Original Message - From: mark schofield [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi So after playing with the single stage for a while, I have produced a good clear final product. I have bought a hot plate magnetic stirrer for $360 USD that has helped for titrations etc. I have played with the two stage process and the final product has turned to jelly. I have followed the 2-stage instructions exactly - timer, burettes, +/- 1mg weighing scale, 97% H2SO4, hot plate stirrer with closed loop temperature control and digit speed and temp output. The chemicals are all analytical grade and the oil requires only 0.1cc of 0.1M NaOH solution to pH 8.5. I heat 1000cc of oil up to 35'C. I add 80cc of 99.5% Methanol and stir for 5 minutes. I then add 1cc of 97% H2SO4 and stir for 1 hour. I then cut the heat and stir for a further hour. The mixture does not separate but is left for minimum 8hrs usually 12. I re-heat the still liquid mixture to 55'C and add 3.5g NaOH and 120cc Methanol. I stir for 1 hr and leave to settle. The final product doesn't settle and congeals over time. Keith - I am lost. Some where along the line soap is formed. I will re-run the experiment and comment tomorrow. On a larger scale - could a 1um filter / coalescer unit be used to pre-process heated oil? Regards Mark Hello Mark, With oil of 0.1ml 0.1M (0.4%) NaOH titration use of the two stage acid base method is not waranted. The aim of the acid stage is to esterify any FFA present. From your titration we can see that the oil has very little FFA in it to start with. It would be a better candidate for single base method. Very little would be happening in the acid stage, there is almost no FFA to esterify and acid catalysed transesterification is very slow. In this case all that is happening is that you are acidifying (with sulphuric acid) the oil/methanol mix prior to performing a base catalysed transesterification and not taking that acidity into account when choosing the ammount of NaOH to use. When you rerun the experiment try using a larger quatity of NaOH in the second stage. If you don't drain off the small ammount of acid/aqueous layer after the first stage some of the NaOH will be consumed neutralising it. Also current thinking is that more than 3.5g/l gives a better conversion. Both good reasons for using more than 3.5g/l in the second stage. Would suggest using this oil for single base method and finding some oil higher in FFA to trial the acid/base method. Regards Paul Gobert. Paul, if this is the case then how/why does it work so well with virgin oil? Which it does. Also, why have so many people (more and more, despite a concerted disinformation campaign) now use it as their standard process, regardless of what kind of oil they use? - as Aleks recommended in the first place. Mark, why not try it with virgin oil first? That's the common (and sound) advice when starting out with the single-stage process, and it applies equally well to any new process you're trying. Then you have some kind of benchmark to work from. Follow the instructions exactly so you start off with nice variable-free results, one way or the other. Use a standard sort of oil - canola, soy, sunflower, corn. If it doesn't work with virgin oil, then you're getting something wrong - maybe losing too much methanol vapour, as Girl Mark suggested. If it does work with virgin oil, but not with the WVO, then that narrows down your possible causes - perhaps there's water in the oil, or somewhere in the process. Also current thinking is that more than 3.5g/l gives a better conversion. Both good reasons for using more than 3.5g/l in the second stage. Some current thinking is saying that, yes - sweeping statements across the board that no matter what, regardless of anything else, just use 5gm/litre. Fairly typical. And, no, not too impressed that GCs are said to be involved in proving it: say the magic words GC and nobody thinks any further. It all depends, as always. The following is a bit more sensible, IMO: How much lye to use? http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#lyeamount It requires 3.5 gm of NaOH lye per liter of oil as catalyst to transesterify new oil (virgin, uncooked). Used oil (WVO) needs more lye than new oil, to neutralize the Free Fatty Acids (FFAs) formed in cooking the oil, which can slow or stop the transesterification process. You have to titrate the oil to determine the FFA content and how much lye will be required. Titration measures the pH of the oil, ie the acid-alkaline level (pH7 is neutral, lower values are increasingly acidic, higher than 7 is alkaline, or base). From this you can calculate how much extra alkali (lye) will be needed to neutralize the FFAs. The extra lye converts the FFAs to soap, which drops out with the glycerine layer. Too much lye will make extra soap, very alkaline biodiesel that's
Re: [biofuel] acid stage question
Hello to all. Question: If wvo is dried by boiling off water, can the acid stage be undertaken once oil temp. falls below boiling point of methanol? Does higher temp. affect esterification in any positive or negative way? Bill C. Hello Bill Should be no problem. It's quite adaptable, but it's recommended that you get familiar with the standardized process first, according to Aleks's instructions. Then you have a solid baseline to work from in adapting it. One step at a time. I said this in an earlier message: One point on energy use in comparing the two main dewatering methods is that heating to 60-70 deg C and settling loses the heat, whereas with boiling it off, while using lots of energy, you can at least catch it on the way down and start processing the oil once it's cooled to 55 deg C, saving some of the extra energy. But more heat carries the danger of creating more FFAs, which adds to boiling being the less preferred method. It depends on the oil - will you always be working with the same oil? Three possibilities: nice oil, no need for dewatering; heat to 60¡C and settle for 24 hours, draw from the top; boil the water off. We do all three of those at various times. From another previous message: It seems heating to 60¡C and settling to separate water either works or it doesn't. Some people swear by it, others have no success. It may be due to the presence of animal fats in heavily used oils, which can be very difficult to remove the water content from. We've had mixed results. With oil from a new source we heat a sample to 100¡C to dewater (if any) and then process, then try the same with 60¡C and settling. (Or not if boiling shows there wasn't any water.) Best wishes Keith Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] etanol + metanol
Hi Arie hai keith thanks fo reply my email You're welcome! i have already seen website you gave me, that;'s my reason why i interested to try it.what do you think?do you have any suggestion? Go ahead and try it. Tell us what happens. Whatever happens, you'll get useful results for your project, no? There are people here who'll help you, I'm sure. But such general questions are difficult. Start your work, give us some more detail, then you'll get better responses. Where are you, by the way? Regards Keith thanks Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Two-stage Process - jelly?
Dear Keith and All Unlike some other e-mails I'll descibe exactly what I have done. 500cc virgin vegetable oil (non-specific type) Heated to 35'C 80cc 99.5% Methanol added Stirred for 5 minutes Add 0.5cc (10 drops) of 97% H2SO4 Stir at 35'C for 1 hour - 600 rpm Stir without heat for 1 hr - 600 rpm Settle for 8 hrs [ At all time the vessel has been covered with tightly fitting cling film with only a very small hole for the thermo-couple to go in (maybe 1.5 to 2mm diameter). Methanol loss is negligable. ] No glycerine at all. The product has not settled but is still liquid. This is virgin oil never used fresh from the super market ASDA here, now owned by WoolMart. This morning - heated the oil to 55'C. Will add 3.1g NaOH plus 120cc of Methanol. If this turns to jelly then I will repeat again and see what happens. The single stage process works a treat every time, producing good clean ME. Keith, so the extra NaOH on top of that required to drive the reaction neutralises the FFA's (in used oil) and extracts them as soap in the final wash? Regards Mark :-( __ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Diesel Boats
I have a question for any mechanic-types out there - particularly marine-diesel familiars. I am thinking about purchasing a 40 foot diesel work boat for a combined aquculture and dive operation and I am wondering if any knows about: 1 - this engine in particular: General Motors 8V71 twin turbo rated at 450 HP? I know that GM has had some trouble with diesel engines in the past just wondering if anyone has experience or knowledge pertaining to this model in particular. 2 - Special considerations for using biodiesel in marine applications? Thanks for the help. Best, Jack Jack Kenworthy Sustainable Systems Director The Cape Eleuthera Island School 242-359-7625 ph. 954-252-2224 fax www.islandschool.org [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] switchgrass to electricity (PR)
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/030529/atth008_1.html Press Release Source: Southern Company Southern Company Testing Grass Cubes to Make Electricity Thursday May 29, 10:01 am ET ATLANTA, May 29 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Southern Company today announced that it is now using switchgrass and other local grasses formed into small cubes to generate electricity. The grass cubes are being mixed with coal at Southern Company's Plant Mitchell, near Albany, Ga. Mitchell is owned and operated by the company's Georgia Power subsidiary. (LOGO: http://www.newscom.com/cgi-bin/prnh/20020207/SOCOLOGO ) Switchgrass is a native prairie grass grown easily in the South, and when blended with coal as a fuel can reduce power plant emissions. Initial testing of switchgrass was conducted at Southern Company's Alabama Power Gadsden Steam Plant in the spring of 2001. Results showed switchgrass not only to be a potential energy source but also emissions of carbon dioxide, sulfur dioxide and mercury were reduced. Based on the successful results achieved earlier from the switchgrass co- firing at Plant Gadsden, Southern Company has committed to a three-year demonstration of biomass co-firing at that plant, located in Gadsden, Ala. Switchgrass, along with other biomass fuels, will be tested in order to improve on initial test results, as well as to gain more knowledge of biomass co-firing. We've seen favorable results testing switchgrass as a potential energy source, said Dr. Charles Goodman, Southern Company senior vice president of research and environmental affairs. As Southern Company diversifies its fuel portfolio to meet future energy demands, biomass, such as switchgrass, is just one of several options we are currently testing that may be beneficial in a low-cost, environmental-friendly way. The testing at Plant Mitchell uses two kinds of pelletized grass; coastal Bermuda grass from Sunbelt Ag Expo in Moultrie, Ga., and switchgrass from Alabama that was grown on 300 acres of farmland near Lincoln and Winterboro. If used as an energy crop, switchgrass could provide farmers with maximum yields and returns at minimal costs. Plant Mitchell received 170 tons of the switchgrass cubes to be pulverized and blended with varying amounts of coal to determine the most efficient mixture. Southern Company is hoping that the compressed switchgrass co-firing at Plant Mitchell can be done without having to inject the grass separately as required in the initial testing at Plant Gadsden. Last year, Plant Gadsden's switchgrass pilot project won environmental awards from the Electric Power Research Institute and the Southeastern Electric Exchange. With 4 million customers and nearly 37,000 megawatts of generating capacity, Atlanta-based Southern Company (NYSE: SO - News) is the premier super- regional energy company in the Southeast and a leading U.S. producer of electricity. Southern Company owns electric utilities in four states, a growing competitive generation company, an energy services business and a competitive retail natural gas business, as well as fiber optics and wireless communications. Southern Company brands are known for excellent customer service, high reliability and retail electric prices that are 15 percent below the national average. Southern Company has been named two consecutive years No. 1 on Fortune magazine's America's Most Admired Companies list in the Electric and Gas Utility industry. Southern Company has more than 500,000 shareholders, making its common stock one of the most widely held in the United States. Visit the Southern Company Web site at www.southerncompany.com . Source: Southern Company Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] OT: ad hoc comment on Astropower situation
Over the last few months Astropower stock has collapsed. Although I have allowed my indexes to be neglected, it is worth noting that at one time it was clearly the obvious quality amongst many alternative energy stocks of dubious quality, and it was a part of the capitalization of my ae index. It had revenues, consistent revenue growth, profits, consistent profit growth, etc. They made product, they were among the world's top 15 producers, with many oil company subsidiaries and large company subsidiaries competing against them, and they weren't going away. Now they have gone away, from a stock market perspective. Their CFO and CEO, who was respected by others, have resigned in disgrace. Well intended green-mutual-funds who invested in them have been damaged. More than one source seems to indicate that the many hundreds of lower workers throughout the company are not to blame, that they could continue to do their thing and make solar product going forward. But what the heck has top management been doing to turn profits into losses, retroactively? Who the hell knows. I think it's fair to entertain the hypothesis that, quite simply, it is a case of fraud, until there's some clarification. The company, over many months, has not bothered to clarify a goddamn thing. What I want to say is that, in a way, this is only too logical. A couple of years ago I tried to sit down and make a list of enough publicly traded nearly-pure-play PV companies so that I could make a solar index, but it just didn't work out. APWR was in the list of course, and there were a few other sort-of plays, such as SPIR, ENER, SWVG.F or something. Anyway, I have been thinking that some of the criticism of the Bush administration is shallow, and that a primary weapon of their is the neglect of discussion of important topics, and the neglect of the importance of ordering massive quantities of alternative energy products, rather than paying lip service to alternative energies, funding some research with a pittance, and then continuing the massive river of money to traditional energy technologies. I see the collapse of one of the only decent non-oil-company-owned alternative energy companies as something that the fossil fuel lobbyists and others probably find hysterical. Doubtless they will sit around and smirk as to the corruption of those environmentalist jokers. One of APWRE's competitors, ENER (a subsidiary of theirs is United Solar, although that's only a percentage of ENER) is now part-owned by Chevron Texaco and I think has three or four decades of history of slow growth which has benefited the founder and hurt long-term investors irreparably. Somehow they've always stayed afloat, perhaps due to those government contracts which always seem to come in. We wouldn't want to perpetuate the idea that private sector demand could keep a PV company in business. So, APWRE is now in disgrace from a stock-market point of view, SPIR's solar subsidiary plods along (recent quarter was at a loss), SWVG is sort of a joke as far as I can see, stock-price-wise, etc. I doubt Chevron-TExaco, Royal Dutch Shell, etc. are crying in their milk. Doubtless they will try to make the case that it helps vindicate the idea that the market for PV is not strong enough to stand on its own. They will probably leave out that they helped, in my view, arrange for that condition. I haven't seen much mention or discussion of all this, so I am mentioning it. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Diesel Boats
Common, reliable, used in all sorts of marine applications, buses, etc. Known as Screaming Green Leakers I believe, for their noteworthy tendency to run and run, but leak lube oil from various places. Just keep a rag handy. Pretty heavy on fuel use...my 40' tug had a Perkins 354-6, under 100HP, yet could tow a small barge well, and was very economical. Do you really need all that horsepower?? Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca On Thursday, May 29, 2003, at 06:09 AM, Jack Kenworthy wrote: I have a question for any mechanic-types out there - particularly marine-diesel familiars. I am thinking about purchasing a 40 foot diesel work boat for a combined aquculture and dive operation and I am wondering if any knows about: 1 - this engine in particular: General Motors 8V71 twin turbo rated at 450 HP? I know that GM has had some trouble with diesel engines in the past just wondering if anyone has experience or knowledge pertaining to this model in particular. 2 - Special considerations for using biodiesel in marine applications? Thanks for the help. Best, Jack Jack Kenworthy Sustainable Systems Director The Cape Eleuthera Island School 242-359-7625 ph. 954-252-2224 fax www.islandschool.org [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM - ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] acid stage question
Thanks Keith, I got 35 deg. C and 55 deg. C mixed up. Your earlier post makes more sense to me now. Another question is, would raising the pressure in the processor also raise the temp. at which I could begin stage one processing? Thanks for your help. Bill C. - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 3:20 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] acid stage question Hello to all. Question: If wvo is dried by boiling off water, can the acid stage be undertaken once oil temp. falls below boiling point of methanol? Does higher temp. affect esterification in any positive or negative way? Bill C. Hello Bill Should be no problem. It's quite adaptable, but it's recommended that you get familiar with the standardized process first, according to Aleks's instructions. Then you have a solid baseline to work from in adapting it. One step at a time. I said this in an earlier message: One point on energy use in comparing the two main dewatering methods is that heating to 60-70 deg C and settling loses the heat, whereas with boiling it off, while using lots of energy, you can at least catch it on the way down and start processing the oil once it's cooled to 55 deg C, saving some of the extra energy. But more heat carries the danger of creating more FFAs, which adds to boiling being the less preferred method. It depends on the oil - will you always be working with the same oil? Three possibilities: nice oil, no need for dewatering; heat to 60¡C and settle for 24 hours, draw from the top; boil the water off. We do all three of those at various times. From another previous message: It seems heating to 60¡C and settling to separate water either works or it doesn't. Some people swear by it, others have no success. It may be due to the presence of animal fats in heavily used oils, which can be very difficult to remove the water content from. We've had mixed results. With oil from a new source we heat a sample to 100¡C to dewater (if any) and then process, then try the same with 60¡C and settling. (Or not if boiling shows there wasn't any water.) Best wishes Keith Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: acid stage question
Hi girl_mark, Thanks for the help. I will be posting progress reports soon to let other know how we are proceeding. Good luck with your endeavors, Bill C. - Original Message - From: girl_mark_fire [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:22 PM Subject: [biofuel] Re: acid stage question --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, William Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello to all. Question: If wvo is dried by boiling off water, can the acid stage be undertaken once oil temp. falls below boiling point of methanol? thats what a lot of people do Does higher temp. affect esterification in any positive or negative way? Faster reaction. Above 140F you'd want to be using a pressurised vessel so as to keep methanol liquid, or (I think) use a reflux mechanism in your processsor. For homebrew I like using the low temp in Aleks' instructions since it works quite fine (the reaction speed) and I like not having to use extra energy. since I have that extra insulation I keep talking about, it takes very little electricity to heat oil to 35 C and then my processor holds that temperature for several hours with no additional heating. mark Bill C. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Toyota building more low-polluting cars in and for Mexico?
The picture in the paper has Mexico City with all its smog, but the clean-air aspect of this supposed for-Mexico car is not as emphasized in the article itself. Of course, Toyota and other carmakers could export EVs to Mexico City and help them that way, but that won't happen. Probably they'd complain about cost, and the difficulty of generating electricity, as though every solution doesn't have associated challenges. Years ago I heard about the lack of Japanese car sales in Mexico, and recently the story of Mexico losing jobs to Asia has surfaced, but I have yet to read a story which addresses how and why the auto companies have decided that EVs are not a decent solution to Mexico City's notorious smog problem, nor have I seen any decent coverage of Mexico's pretty good-sized (I think) production of ethanol, nor has there been decent coverage of the high cost of gasoline there, despite their status as a major producer of Oil. http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/business/20030529-_1b29toyota.html Company plans car made specifically for Mexico market By Dean Calbreath UNION-TRIBUNE STAFF WRITER May 29, 2003 JOHN GIBBINS / Union-Tribune Although it now does little business in Mexico, Toyota is building a $140 million truck factory in Tijuana. The company is considering a new car geared specificlaly for the Mexican market. TOYOTA CITY, Japan ö In the factory town that gave rise to one of the world's most successful automakers, executives at Toyota are in the planning stages for a new car aimed at the Mexican marketplace ö a move that could turn Tijuana into more of an automotive hub. Officials from Toyota told a trade delegation from San Diego and Tijuana last week that they are trying to design a car specifically for Mexico. The planning stage, they say, could be finished by 2005. Toyota already is building a $140 million truck factory in Tijuana that eventually will employ at least 460 workers. One motivation for opening in Tijuana, Toyota officials say, is to boost the profile of the company in Mexico, where it does little business. Right now, virtually no Toyota cars are selling in Mexico, said Satoshi Tachihara, project general manager of the Americas project division at Toyota. But there is a real need for small, low-cost, low-polluting cars, especially in a place like Mexico City. Toyota officials gave no indication whether they would use the Tijuana site as the launching pad for a Mexican car. But the news of Toyota's plans was encouraging for the Tijuana executives among the delegation, which was coordinated by San Diego's World Trade Center. I see a real future for Tijuana in the auto industry, said Jaime Gonzalez Luna, a board member of the Tijuana Economic Development Corp. There should be many opportunities for suppliers on both sides of the border. James Roberts, who is developing a 180-acre industrial park close to Toyota's 700-acre factory site, is banking on the idea that Toyota will create a cluster of suppliers, parts makers, distributors and shippers. Local suppliers will make Toyota more competitive in the whole scheme of things, he said. Japanese auto suppliers, however, caution that Toyota's current operation in Tijuana is too small to draw a lot of suppliers to the region. And the lure of low-cost manufacturing in China ö coupled with lingering concerns over the quality of Mexican auto supplies ö could blunt the dream of an automotive boom in Tijuana. If Toyota's operation grows successfully, we'll have to consider locating in Tijuana, said Tatsuya Toyoda, who heads the America team of the international business planning group at Denso, Toyota's biggest supplier. But we also have to consider the possibility of China. Labor in China is less than half of that in Mexico. With a slew of high-tech manufacturers shutting their Mexican production lines and shifting operations to China or other bases in Asia, Tijuana's beleaguered maquiladora industry has been increasingly hoping that Toyota's truck plant would lead to a new influx of Japanese companies. There's good reason for their optimism. Unlike some of the electronics firms that have been forced to pull out of Mexico because of declining sales and profits, Toyota is a genuine moneymaker. It is the most profitable company in Japan, with $8 billion in profits during its recently concluded fiscal year ö a 54 percent jump over the previous year. Roughly a third of its worldwide sales, which totaled 6.3 million vehicles last year, take place in North America. Toyota is currently building a plant that will start making chassis for its Tacoma trucks next summer. By 2005, it will be assembling entire trucks in Tijuana. Its goal is to produce 170,000 truck chassis and 20,000 pickups a year. Teams of potential managers at the Tijuana plant are now being trained in Toyota's headquarters in Toyota City. At the same time, the company ö which was beaten to the Mexican market by such Japanese
Re: [biofuel] Two-stage Process - jelly?
Mark, why are you using total 40% methanol - are those figures right? Should be half those amounts for 500cc of oil. Dear Keith and All Unlike some other e-mails I'll descibe exactly what I have done. 500cc virgin vegetable oil (non-specific type) Heated to 35'C 80cc 99.5% Methanol added Stirred for 5 minutes Add 0.5cc (10 drops) of 97% H2SO4 Stir at 35'C for 1 hour - 600 rpm Stir without heat for 1 hr - 600 rpm Settle for 8 hrs [ At all time the vessel has been covered with tightly fitting cling film with only a very small hole for the thermo-couple to go in (maybe 1.5 to 2mm diameter). Methanol loss is negligable. ] No glycerine at all. The product has not settled but is still liquid. This is virgin oil never used fresh from the super market ASDA here, now owned by WoolMart. This morning - heated the oil to 55'C. Will add 3.1g NaOH plus 120cc of Methanol. If this turns to jelly then I will repeat again and see what happens. The single stage process works a treat every time, producing good clean ME. Keith, so the extra NaOH on top of that required to drive the reaction neutralises the FFA's (in used oil) and extracts them as soap in the final wash? In single-stage transesterification the extra NaOH on top of the base amount as indicated by titration neutralizes the FFAs, converting them to soap, which drops out as a by-product with the so-called glycerine layer - more like a soap layer, as Todd says. It's removed when you separate the biodiesel from all the gunk at the bottom, shouldn't be in the wash if you've done it right. Final wash? All washes are the same, it's not that the first wash removes this and the second wash removes that. Each wash removes whatever's soluble until it gets saturated; the next wash removes more of the same until it too gets saturated, and so on. Well, it's not quite saturation, but anyway, that batch of water won't absorb any more junk from that batch of biodiesel. The water can be re-used though - see Bubblewashing 101 by Girl Mark: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash2.html#counter Best Keith Regards Mark :-( Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Two-stage Process - jelly?
Dear Keith Sorry yes I used 40cc and 60cc respectively for the process for 500cc oil not as I had previously written. I was having a senior moment. On the pork lard front, the single stage has produced an extremely clean product almost the same colour as mineral diesel here ie clear white, if that makes sense. So, the FFA's are neutralised and are removed with the glycerine. The wash water then removes the soaps that do not settle out? Thanks Keith. I appreciate your help. Regards Mark __ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Two-stage Process - jelly?
Mark, Earlier I was curious if you were using oil or an oil/fat blend (WVO). Should it be presumed that the feedstock at the beginning of the second stage and prior to reheating is still liquid? If so, should it be presumed that there was a layer of extra alcohol above the oil, perhaps slightly darkened? If so, and were it me, I'd separate the feedstock from such a layer and then conduct the second stage, just to isolate variables. Second, if you're getting jelly out of a SVO, you might wish to back off the caustic some. Jelly, or glop soap is a condition that results from too much caustic in the presence of water. It doesn't take much to push what is primarily a transesterification reaction into one that is directed towards saponification (soap making, aka jelly). You might (or perhaps might not) care to take a look here. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Biodiesel/message/2504 It's a step by step how to that runs the base side of an acid base experiment in three separate stages, rather than all at once. That's not to declare that it should be done in such a manner. But it does indicate that glycerin drop in the second stage can occur with less than a requisite amount of caustic. Take your time and take no short cuts. It works and works well. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: mark schofield [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 7:51 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Two-stage Process - jelly? Dear Keith and All Unlike some other e-mails I'll descibe exactly what I have done. 500cc virgin vegetable oil (non-specific type) Heated to 35'C 80cc 99.5% Methanol added Stirred for 5 minutes Add 0.5cc (10 drops) of 97% H2SO4 Stir at 35'C for 1 hour - 600 rpm Stir without heat for 1 hr - 600 rpm Settle for 8 hrs [ At all time the vessel has been covered with tightly fitting cling film with only a very small hole for the thermo-couple to go in (maybe 1.5 to 2mm diameter). Methanol loss is negligable. ] No glycerine at all. The product has not settled but is still liquid. This is virgin oil never used fresh from the super market ASDA here, now owned by WoolMart. This morning - heated the oil to 55'C. Will add 3.1g NaOH plus 120cc of Methanol. If this turns to jelly then I will repeat again and see what happens. The single stage process works a treat every time, producing good clean ME. Keith, so the extra NaOH on top of that required to drive the reaction neutralises the FFA's (in used oil) and extracts them as soap in the final wash? Regards Mark :-( __ Yahoo! Plus - For a better Internet experience http://uk.promotions.yahoo.com/yplus/yoffer.html Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Diesel Boats
thanks for the input on the engine - much appreciated. and it is not
necessarily that I need that much power, but it is what's in the boat that is
for sale. It may also prove useful in hauling 1,500 lbs and ice from Eleuthera
to the market in Nassau.
thanks again.
jack
Jack Kenworthy
Sustainable Systems Director
The Cape Eleuthera Island School
242-359-7625 ph. 954-252-2224 fax
www.islandschool.org
- Original Message -
From: Neoteric Biofuels Inc
To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 11:55 AM
Subject: Re: [biofuel] Diesel Boats
Common, reliable, used in all sorts of marine applications, buses, etc.
Known as Screaming Green Leakers I believe, for their noteworthy
tendency to run and run, but leak lube oil from various places.
Just keep a rag handy.
Pretty heavy on fuel use...my 40' tug had a Perkins 354-6, under 100HP,
yet could tow a small barge well, and was very economical. Do you
really need all that horsepower??
Edward Beggs
http://www.biofuels.ca
On Thursday, May 29, 2003, at 06:09 AM, Jack Kenworthy wrote:
I have a question for any mechanic-types out there - particularly
marine-diesel familiars. I am thinking about purchasing a 40 foot
diesel work boat for a combined aquculture and dive operation and I am
wondering if any knows about:
1 - this engine in particular: General Motors 8V71 twin turbo rated
at 450 HP? I know that GM has had some trouble with diesel engines in
the past just wondering if anyone has experience or knowledge
pertaining to this model in particular.
2 - Special considerations for using biodiesel in marine applications?
Thanks for the help.
Best,
Jack
Jack Kenworthy
Sustainable Systems Director
The Cape Eleuthera Island School
242-359-7625 ph. 954-252-2224 fax
www.islandschool.org
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[biofuel] Re: Two-stage Process - jelly?
mark, I;'m not surprised that you don't have a 'glycerine' layer after the first stage. First of all, the more I think about it, the more I doubt that it's glycerine you sometimes see in the bottom of the container at the end of the first stage- someone correct me again if I'mn wrong- but if it's an esterification of free fatty acids, rather than a transesterification of an intact triglyceride, it seems to me that there wouldn't be much glycerine breaking off other than the very small amount of trans-e that's (very slowly) occurring. Jon Van Gerpen's research on this process considers this layer to be excess methanol, combined with some water that is formed in the reaction. Presumably there'd also be a little bit of glycerine if any transesterification is happening as well, all in the same layer as the water/methanol. I believe that Todd also calls it first stage methanol rather than first stage glycerine, and if you look at how 'runny' it is, it looks like methanol more than like glycerine (at least the few times Ive seen it). Van Gerpen's method (that's the exceedingly-high-methanol industrial process, somewhat different than Aleks' process and hard to do if you don't have methanol recovery and cheap energy) finds that depending on the amounts of methanol used and the amounts of water produced, the excess methanol/.water sometimes coalesces on top of the esters/oil, and sometimes ends up below the oil phase. The stuff I saw/made using his method created a layer that looked exactly like the watery 'glycerine' that I've seen using A;leks' method. However I have not always produced this aqueous layer in Aleks;' method, and I frequently used that method with nice oil, just like you. So my guess is that it's somehow connected to the amount of water produced, and that the condition of the nice oil might have something to do with it. I would also guess that how dry the oil is in the first place would be a contributing factor. Anyway, I don't worry when I don't see first stage glycerine in ALeks method, as that seems quite normal to me in my experience. On the other hand I usually don't look for it, so it may appear more often than I am aware of. Todd in the post below suggests removing any first stage alcohol (the dark layer, sometimes below and sometimes above the oils).I would add that if you do this change, be prepared to add a similar amount of fresh, anhydrous methanol, to replace any that is removed, to make sure there is enough for the second stage reaction. mark --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark, Earlier I was curious if you were using oil or an oil/fat blend (WVO). Should it be presumed that the feedstock at the beginning of the second stage and prior to reheating is still liquid? If so, should it be presumed that there was a layer of extra alcohol above the oil, perhaps slightly darkened? If so, and were it me, I'd separate the feedstock from such a layer and then conduct the second stage, just to isolate variables. Second, if you're getting jelly out of a SVO, you might wish to back off the caustic some. Jelly, or glop soap is a condition that results from too much caustic in the presence of water. It doesn't take much to push what is primarily a transesterification reaction into one that is directed towards saponification (soap making, aka jelly). You might (or perhaps might not) care to take a look here. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Biodiesel/message/2504 It's a step by step how to that runs the base side of an acid base experiment in three separate stages, rather than all at once. That's not to declare that it should be done in such a manner. But it does indicate that glycerin drop in the second stage can occur with less than a requisite amount of caustic. Take your time and take no short cuts. It works and works well. Todd Swearingen Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: [renewable-energy] OT: ad hoc comment on Astropower situation
I don't have what you want, handy. An initial attempt to search at energy.gov yields this only slightly-helpful document and tables: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/solar.renewables/page/rea_data/chapter2.html The problem is in part that it has not company-specific data. The NREL.gov website is down, which is where I'd prefer to look. This site starts to give a manufacturer-specific and country-specific idea: http://www.oja-services.nl/iea-pvps/isr/31.htm These guys want $6000 for a report containing some of the info: http://www.kmicorp.com/photovoltaic_market_studies/pv_manufacturer.htm I've just always liked this page: http://www.eco-web.com/cgi-local/sfc?a=index/index.htmlb=index/category/9.1.html Ok, so none of this helps. I have this from a couple of years ago that I copied down because it was a pain to get. Not everything you wanted, but a start on getting an idea as to the biggest: In 1999 the six largest solar companies produced 71% of worldwide solar panel shipments. These six are BP Solarex, Kyocera Corp., Siemens Solar Group, Sharp Corp., AstroPower Inc., and Photowatt Int'l S.A. The top seven manufacturers accounted for about 82% of the world's PV shipments for 2001. They were (in approximate order) Sharp, BP Solar, Kyocera, Siemens Solar (recently purchased by Shell), AstroPower, RWE Solar, and Isofoton. On Thu, 29 May 2003 15:02:29 -0700, you wrote: Does anyone have an article or other summary of the state of the PV industry at the moment? I am not looking for one-word epithets, but a more analytical assessment. Like product sold worldwide, companies showing a profit, etc. A few years of history, with maybe one year of projections would seem appropriate. If you know of such a summary or summary article, and can at least remark that it is not total B.S., I would appreciate a link or a citation. Thanks! Robert Wichert == murdoch wrote: Over the last few months Astropower stock has collapsed. Although I have allowed my indexes to be neglected, it is worth noting that at one time it was clearly the obvious quality amongst many alternative energy stocks of dubious quality, and it was a part of the capitalization of my ae index. It had revenues, consistent revenue growth, profits, consistent profit growth, etc. They made product, they were among the world's top 15 producers, with many oil company subsidiaries and large company subsidiaries competing against them, and they weren't going away. Now they have gone away, from a stock market perspective. Their CFO and CEO, who was respected by others, have resigned in disgrace. Well intended green-mutual-funds who invested in them have been damaged. More than one source seems to indicate that the many hundreds of lower workers throughout the company are not to blame, that they could continue to do their thing and make solar product going forward. But what the heck has top management been doing to turn profits into losses, retroactively? Who the hell knows. I think it's fair to entertain the hypothesis that, quite simply, it is a case of fraud, until there's some clarification. The company, over many months, has not bothered to clarify a goddamn thing. What I want to say is that, in a way, this is only too logical. A couple of years ago I tried to sit down and make a list of enough publicly traded nearly-pure-play PV companies so that I could make a solar index, but it just didn't work out. APWR was in the list of course, and there were a few other sort-of plays, such as SPIR, ENER, SWVG.F or something. Anyway, I have been thinking that some of the criticism of the Bush administration is shallow, and that a primary weapon of their is the neglect of discussion of important topics, and the neglect of the importance of ordering massive quantities of alternative energy products, rather than paying lip service to alternative energies, funding some research with a pittance, and then continuing the massive river of money to traditional energy technologies. I see the collapse of one of the only decent non-oil-company-owned alternative energy companies as something that the fossil fuel lobbyists and others probably find hysterical. Doubtless they will sit around and smirk as to the corruption of those environmentalist jokers. One of APWRE's competitors, ENER (a subsidiary of theirs is United Solar, although that's only a percentage of ENER) is now part-owned by Chevron Texaco and I think has three or four decades of history of slow growth which has benefited the founder and hurt long-term investors irreparably. Somehow they've always stayed afloat, perhaps due to those government contracts which always seem to come in. We wouldn't want to perpetuate the idea that private sector demand could keep a PV company in business. So, APWRE is now in disgrace from a stock-market point of view, SPIR's solar subsidiary plods
[biofuel] Biogas from chicken manure
Does anyone have pointers re producing biogas / methane from chicken manure, and its subsequent use in firing heaters for nurseries ? Tony Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/CNxFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
