Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Dave Hanna - I think you miss the point. Oxidation of any carbon-compound releases carbon dioxide. It includes combustion of fuels, weathering of wood -- even exchange of gases from human metabolism. I'm not one to tell you to stop breathing to reduce the carbon dioxide build up in the planet's atmosphere. Certainly not! What does make sense to me is to reduce the amount of fossil fuel that is burned. That means use of plant residues from the current growing season, solar power, wind or tidal, etc. Biodiesel is one version of use of plant residues. Others include fermentation to yield other oxygenated fuels and direct use such as refuse-to-energy plants. A commitment to alternative fuels by our federal government would probably be a good thing. Even in its absence -- or token support by the Department of Energy, for example -- the private sector is doing a pretty good job. Witness the astounding interest in and by members of this group. The problem that I see is the response by the rest of the world. I realize that the United States was castigated by others due to the fact that we declined to agree to the Kyoto accords. But so long as we are actually DOING something, is formal acceptance really necessary? I don't think so, particularly when other nations just seek to increase their fuel use at our expense. This attitude has a name. It is called jealousy. Look at China, as the worst example. Their use of fossil fuels is burgeoning. Who calls on them to find other sources? Besides, anyone who dared would be ignored. And the type of fuel most abundantly burned is called stone coal, named by the fact that it contains so much sulfur that it is hard, like a rock. When it is burned, it releases massive amounts of sulfur dioxide which, in the presence of water vapor, forms sulfuric acid. Further, there are only minimal pollution controls or efficiency standards so, beside releasing sulfuric acid, they belch forth massive amounts of oxides of nitrogen as well as carbon dioxide. Dave, global warming is real. Migration of species from lower to higher latitudes, more severe weather-related disturbances, drought bands, proliferation of economically unimportant grasses (i.e. --weeds) are all components. To say that global warming is ...an attempt by the extreme left to control the activities of society, is dismissive of reality as well as expressing naivety to the extreme. Study the work of the late, great oceanographer Roger Revelle, in the 1950s, from Scripp's institute. He studied global warming by the responses of the ocean. His work was panned by those who feared the upset of the status quo. But he was right then and he remains right now. -- Jay L. Stern In a message dated 08/27/2004 7:21:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Andrew, Global warming is in my opinion an attempt by the extreme left to control the activities of society to the extent that they'll control all of human activities. This is about power and the lefts never ending desire to regulate free people. Trying to control CO2 is an exercise in futility. Hydrocarbons are in constant change. It's a part of nature as surely as the water cycle. These people even come up with ridiculous hypotheses that would enable them to control the amount of cattle allowed to be on farms. Cattle produce methane gas you know. The same microbes present in the digestive system of cattle can be found every where in nature. The grasses the cows eat will eventually be consumed by these microbes in or out of the cow. If you don't believe this, take some grass clippings, put them in a plastic bag with a couple of quarts of water and let it set in a warm area. Tie the bag up and you will soon see the bag swell. The gases,CO2 and methane ,are being produced by the bacteria. After a few days you can dump the contents of the bag and you'll find a product very similiar to cow waste. There may be some real reason for hope in resolving the energy crisis with the new technologies being developed today. The advancements being made by such corporations as Changing World Technologies, certainly is a sign of good things to come. If we can really take virtually any hydrocarbon and expose it to say 600 psi @ 500 degrees F for relatively short periods of time and produce a useable oil, think of the possibilities. Thank you for listening to my rambling note. Sincerely, Dave Hannah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives:
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Hi Keith... DanghI should know this one...you told me before once, a few eons ago, now you've used it twice in the last few days... CAWKI? Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca On Aug 29, 2004, at 11:28 AM, Keith Addison wrote: they're a threat to CAWKI. Can't be us, after all, we wouldn't do a thing like that, must be nature, it's downright unnatural, it should be stopped. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Edward, I searched for it and came up with Civilization As We Know It. Todd On Aug 29, 2004, at 10:17 PM, Neoteric Biofuels Inc wrote: CAWKI Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Hi Ed Hi Keith... DanghI should know this one...you told me before once, a few eons ago, now you've used it twice in the last few days... CAWKI? :-) Twice? Did I? Oh right - sinister extreme leftwing conspiracies on the one hand and sheep farts and termites on the other, CAWKI can't possibly survive. Save the women and children first! We'll all be murdered in our beds! Bullets can't stop it, rockets can't stop it - we might have to use nukular forz! Um, sorry... I didn't want to puzzle anyone, but it is part of Internet usage, I didn't just make it up: CAWKI Civilization As We Know It http://www.acronymfinder.com/ Acronym Finder: Find out what over 361,000 acronyms abbreviations stand for As a writer and editor I really don't like acronyms, but midst the chaos of the global Internet, WTH... Regards Keith Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca On Aug 29, 2004, at 11:28 AM, Keith Addison wrote: they're a threat to CAWKI. Can't be us, after all, we wouldn't do a thing like that, must be nature, it's downright unnatural, it should be stopped. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Thanks, Keith Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca On Aug 29, 2004, at 10:39 PM, Keith Addison wrote: Hi Ed Hi Keith... DanghI should know this one...you told me before once, a few eons ago, now you've used it twice in the last few days... CAWKI? :-) Twice? Did I? Oh right - sinister extreme leftwing conspiracies on the one hand and sheep farts and termites on the other, CAWKI can't possibly survive. Save the women and children first! We'll all be murdered in our beds! Bullets can't stop it, rockets can't stop it - we might have to use nukular forz! Um, sorry... I didn't want to puzzle anyone, but it is part of Internet usage, I didn't just make it up: CAWKI Civilization As We Know It http://www.acronymfinder.com/ Acronym Finder: Find out what over 361,000 acronyms abbreviations stand for As a writer and editor I really don't like acronyms, but midst the chaos of the global Internet, WTH... Regards Keith Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca On Aug 29, 2004, at 11:28 AM, Keith Addison wrote: they're a threat to CAWKI. Can't be us, after all, we wouldn't do a thing like that, must be nature, it's downright unnatural, it should be stopped. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
What is CAWKI? Nickg - Original Message - From: Neoteric Biofuels mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Inc To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com mailto:biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, August 30, 2004 10:19 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment Thanks, Keith Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca http://www.biofuels.ca On Aug 29, 2004, at 10:39 PM, Keith Addison wrote: Hi Ed Hi Keith... DanghI should know this one...you told me before once, a few eons ago, now you've used it twice in the last few days... CAWKI? :-) Twice? Did I? Oh right - sinister extreme leftwing conspiracies on the one hand and sheep farts and termites on the other, CAWKI can't possibly survive. Save the women and children first! We'll all be murdered in our beds! Bullets can't stop it, rockets can't stop it - we might have to use nukular forz! Um, sorry... I didn't want to puzzle anyone, but it is part of Internet usage, I didn't just make it up: CAWKI Civilization As We Know It http://www.acronymfinder.com/ http://www.acronymfinder.com/ Acronym Finder: Find out what over 361,000 acronyms abbreviations stand for As a writer and editor I really don't like acronyms, but midst the chaos of the global Internet, WTH... Regards Keith Edward Beggs http://www.biofuels.ca http://www.biofuels.ca On Aug 29, 2004, at 11:28 AM, Keith Addison wrote: they're a threat to CAWKI. Can't be us, after all, we wouldn't do a thing like that, must be nature, it's downright unnatural, it should be stopped. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129eov5dm/M=295196.4901138.6071305.3001176/ D=groups/S=1705083269:HM/EXP=1093967919/A=2128215/R=0/SIG=10se96mf6/*htt p://companion.yahoo.com click here http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=295196.4901138.6071305.3001176/D=group s/S=:HM/A=2128215/rand=291240489 _ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ . [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Hello Bob, how goes? Dave, I couldn't help but post this completely irrelevent but nevertheless risible piece of information from faroff clean, green New Zealand. It's not so irrelevant. Being one of the countries that signed the Kyoto Protocol (the agreement to limit greenhouse gas emissions) we decided to take it so seriously that our government proposed a law to tax all farmers according to the number of live beasts (cattle, sheep, pigs etc) they kept on the farm. The reason given was that farm animals farted methane gas almost continuously. As we have some 67 million sheep, the output is considerable. :-) Feed them beans! When the farmers did the math they realised they'd be taxed off their land. The Opposition quickly dubbed the proposed law the Fart Tax and it was laughed out of parliament. I kid you not, the above is totally true. I can attest to that, I followed it at the time, in some wonder. No wonder this was the land where they filmed Lord of the Rings. LOL! Snicker... Jolly nice scenery you've got there in Mordor I thought. I suppose if I were a heroin addict and it became a serious matter that too many people were taking drugs and it was doing great harm and simply had to be stopped I might be keen to legislate huge punitive taxes on all those dastardly folks who drink wine with their meals, along with the small measure of gin in the baby's gripewater. Hm, not quite right... kind of hard to find a metaphor for some things these days. I saw a similar solution proposing to clamp right down on termites because of the amount of methane generated by the breakdown of the rotten wood they feed to their fungus farms, or something like that, thought I caught a passing whiff of a researcher who reckoned he'd hit on a grant-magnet. A recent NYT article said this: ... the electorate wants cheap gas, clean air, unspoiled wilderness and world peace - all at the same time. In other words, we want to drive our Ford Explorers to No Nukes concerts without coming across any ugly refineries that spoil the scenery. And, hey, maybe we can even get away with it if we crack down on Muttons of Mass Destruction and the Termite Terrorists instead, they're a threat to CAWKI. Can't be us, after all, we wouldn't do a thing like that, must be nature, it's downright unnatural, it should be stopped. I have this idea from somewhere or other that, yes, methane is indeed a powerful greenhouse gas, but that's not all it is, it's a bit more complicated than that, and reducing natural levels of methane emissions in order to offset highly unnatural levels of Explorer emissions might turn out to have the opposite of the desired effect. I'll have to look it up. Sometime or other. Regards Keith Regards, Bob. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:48 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment Andrew, Global warming is in my opinion an attempt by the extreme left to control the activities of society to the extent that they'll control all of human activities. This is about power and the lefts never ending desire to regulate free people. Trying to control CO2 is an exercise in futility. Hydrocarbons are in constant change. It's a part of nature as surely as the water cycle. These people even come up with ridiculous hypotheses that would enable them to control the amount of cattle allowed to be on farms. Cattle produce methane gas you know. The same microbes present in the digestive system of cattle can be found every where in nature. The grasses the cows eat will eventually be consumed by these microbes in or out of the cow. If you don't believe this, take some grass clippings, put them in a plastic bag with a couple of quarts of water and let it set in a warm area. Tie the bag up and you will soon see the bag swell. The gases,CO2 and methane ,are being produced by the bacteria. After a few days you can dump the contents of the bag and you'll find a product very similiar to cow waste. There may be some real reason for hope in resolving the energy crisis with the new technologies being developed today. The advancements being made by such corporations as Changing World Technologies, certainly is a sign of good things to come. If we can really take virtually any hydrocarbon and expose it to say 600 psi @ 500 degrees F for relatively short periods of time and produce a useable oil, think of the possibilities. Thank you for listening to my rambling note. Sincerely, Dave Hannah Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Hi L. Fascinating post, a little strongly worded, but exactly right. I am always amazed when I read in the papers about the Christians fighting the Muslims, or the Christians fighting whoever. If you pick up a gun, you are not a Christian. Period. Peter G. Thailand --- bioveging [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am Christian, I do not support war, nor does Jesus support wars. I do not support financially or morally any criminal national interests at the cost of the lives and health of the world's innocents. If the flag of country clashes with the banner of love that flies over the kingdom of God, the national flag takes a powder. THAT is true Christian patriotism, dedication to the love of God and each other, not the nationalistic, warmongering, so-called patriotic blindness of enabling serial war upon the poor of the world. Suffer the little children to come unto me, for OF SUCH is the kingdom of God is what Jesus taught, not make the little children suffer. The Apostle Paul taught that we are to become all things to all men, which means to blend in and participate in whatever country or situation we find ourselves in, not to fabricate the situations to what we THINK it should be and make a financial profit from it. It is the so-called christian that makes the worthy name of Jesus to be despised through bad example and America is at the top of that list. From what people have been exposed to, and considering the absolutely UN-christian behaviour of those who profess to be follwers of Christ's teachings (but don't) it is not difficult to understand why Christianity has been so degraded. Had the damn warmongers claimed to be Budists everyone would have not derided Budda, but looked upon the criminals as an aberation, but because these child killers profess and pretend to be christians it falls on Christ to bear the weight. And so it will be, although YOU who profess to follow the teachings of Jesus but do not are going to have a boat load of expalining to do. Why call ye me Lord Lord and DO NOT the things that I ask? Jesus said that. L. --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Jake: You sure nailed me. I'm one of those of fossils who is a Christian, Conservative, and hopefully a Patriot. I am the guy you all despise and ridicule at every opportunity. Flame on people. If you get a chance you might take the opportunity to have a discussion without all the vitriol. I have always had an interest in alternative energy resources and at one time owned virtually every copy of Mother Earth News. I read all those articles about how the world was coming to an end. Is Paul Erlichman still around? Remember how we were all going to starve as a result of the population explosion? You may not believe this but I also consider myself a conservationist. Abusing your resources is not only stupid but its bad business. Being a conservative, I think about such things. :)) The people on this forum have provided a remarkable amount of very valuable information concerning Biofuels. You are to be commended. I have tried many of the systems you have presented and am very impressed. Your council works. Todd Swearingen is without a doubt very knowledgeable and gives simple and precise answers to the questions asked by those on the forum with questions. Now, I would like to make a suggestion that some of you entrepreneurs might consider. I believe there is an opportunity for many people to earn real good money. This might be a thumb nail bus. plan. Assume your able to collect 1000 gals. of WVO per week. Seems like a reasonable task. That amount should yield 1000 gals. of Biofuel. It should also yield 750# of glycerin. Please don't take it to the grass clippings pile. Glycerin as you all know is valuable. Learn how to Purify it and then assign your wife the task of making a very high value soap. Sell it on the Internet @ $1.50 per 3.5 oz. bar. If she can't make that much soap, pour the glycerin in 2# blocks and again sell it for 2-3 bucks a pound. Let's see what you accomplished. Gross Income BioD $2,200.00 Soap 200# at app. $1,000.00 and the balance of glycerin 500# @ 2.50 /#. Let's see now that's about $4,400.00 in gross income. You might have a Grand in expenses and that seems to me to be a pretty good part time business. Both liberals and conservatives may be able to agree on some things. Biod is Good, Glycerin soap is high quality soap, and I hope all of you have a wonderful day and life.Now go out there all you greedy capitalist and do good. :)) Sincerely, Dave Hannah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Dear L, Wow! Judge not that ye be not judged. I don't think this is the appropriate forum for us to debate who is the better Christian. You don't know me and I don't know you. I only pray that you have the peace that passes understanding. Sincerely, Dave Hannah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Dave, Afraid you'll need to recalculate your numbers a bit. First, the stuff that settles out of a transesterification is a soap/alcohol/glycerol/catalyst cocktail, not just glycerol. The only reason it hardens is because a high fraction of its volume is soap and not glycerol. (In its pure state, glycerol is colorless, sweet and weighs out at 10# per gallon.) The higher the soap to glycerol ratio the harder it gets. Unfortunately, a greater soap ratio indicates a higher FFA content in the parent oil and in turn a lower biodiesel yield. The only way to get the input/yield ratio up to 1:1 is to use an acid base process. This reduces the ratio of soap in the cocktail and prevents the cocktail from hardening. The reality is that if you achieve the 1:1 ratio you will get very little soap. When recovering the glycerol from the cocktail, that soap is fractured back to FFAs and the sodium or potassium ion. The metal ion bonds with the acidic ion (usually phosphorous) to form a sodium or potassium precipitate (fertilizer). The methanol is recovered from the glycerol, leaving a straw colored to amber product, perhaps somewhere in the range of 95% purity. If the parent stock was WVO the glycerol will be in great need of deodorization/sterilization. Methanol is also recovered from the FFAs and the FFAs are used as a fuel (appoximately the same viscosity as biodiesel and considerably less viscous than SVO or WVO) or run back through the acid/base process. If the recovered glycerol comes from biodiesel manufactured from SVO, you can add it to various soap and cosmetic products. Glass soap, aka glycerin soap, is nothing more than an average soap recipe with extra glycerin added, along with a prolonged boiling step using ethanol. In short, glass soap is an energy hog. A cold processed soap with extra glycerin that is not boiled to glass clear would save energy, alcohol and time (as if time can be saved) yet still achieve the same utilitarian results. Sorry to say it, but the process of getting from A to Z is a fair bit more involved than you might think. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:26 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment Dear Jake: You sure nailed me. I'm one of those of fossils who is a Christian, Conservative, and hopefully a Patriot. I am the guy you all despise and ridicule at every opportunity. Flame on people. If you get a chance you might take the opportunity to have a discussion without all the vitriol. I have always had an interest in alternative energy resources and at one time owned virtually every copy of Mother Earth News. I read all those articles about how the world was coming to an end. Is Paul Erlichman still around? Remember how we were all going to starve as a result of the population explosion? You may not believe this but I also consider myself a conservationist. Abusing your resources is not only stupid but its bad business. Being a conservative, I think about such things. :)) The people on this forum have provided a remarkable amount of very valuable information concerning Biofuels. You are to be commended. I have tried many of the systems you have presented and am very impressed. Your council works. Todd Swearingen is without a doubt very knowledgeable and gives simple and precise answers to the questions asked by those on the forum with questions. Now, I would like to make a suggestion that some of you entrepreneurs might consider. I believe there is an opportunity for many people to earn real good money. This might be a thumb nail bus. plan. Assume your able to collect 1000 gals. of WVO per week. Seems like a reasonable task. That amount should yield 1000 gals. of Biofuel. It should also yield 750# of glycerin. Please don't take it to the grass clippings pile. Glycerin as you all know is valuable. Learn how to Purify it and then assign your wife the task of making a very high value soap. Sell it on the Internet @ $1.50 per 3.5 oz. bar. If she can't make that much soap, pour the glycerin in 2# blocks and again sell it for 2-3 bucks a pound. Let's see what you accomplished. Gross Income BioD $2,200.00 Soap 200# at app. $1,000.00 and the balance of glycerin 500# @ 2.50 /#. Let's see now that's about $4,400.00 in gross income. You might have a Grand in expenses and that seems to me to be a pretty good part time business. Both liberals and conservatives may be able to agree on some things. Biod is Good, Glycerin soap is high quality soap, and I hope all of you have a wonderful day and life.Now go out there all you greedy capitalist and do good. :)) Sincerely, Dave Hannah Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Todd Thank you for the instruction. I would like to know what the potential yield of pure glycerin is if you did an acid - base transesterification - esterification of the WVO, then seperated the FAA and boiled off the methanol? I realize that the coctail is not pure glycerin. Do you know what that % of 97% glycerin is of the original gal. of WVO. I believe it was you who suggested in an earlier post that a thin film processor would do the job at a cost. I assumed you were referring not only the cost of the equipment but also the expense of the electricity to operate the Processor. I apologize for my inability to explain myself more clearly. Again, thank you for all your help. It's much appreciated. Sincerely, Dave Hannah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Dave, I couldn't help but post this completely irrelevent but nevertheless risible piece of information from faroff clean, green New Zealand. Being one of the countries that signed the Kyoto Protocol (the agreement to limit greenhouse gas emissions) we decided to take it so seriously that our government proposed a law to tax all farmers according to the number of live beasts (cattle, sheep, pigs etc) they kept on the farm. The reason given was that farm animals farted methane gas almost continuously. As we have some 67 million sheep, the output is considerable. When the farmers did the math they realised they'd be taxed off their land. The Opposition quickly dubbed the proposed law the Fart Tax and it was laughed out of parliament. I kid you not, the above is totally true. No wonder this was the land where they filmed Lord of the Rings. Regards, Bob. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:48 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment Andrew, Global warming is in my opinion an attempt by the extreme left to control the activities of society to the extent that they'll control all of human activities. This is about power and the lefts never ending desire to regulate free people. Trying to control CO2 is an exercise in futility. Hydrocarbons are in constant change. It's a part of nature as surely as the water cycle. These people even come up with ridiculous hypotheses that would enable them to control the amount of cattle allowed to be on farms. Cattle produce methane gas you know. The same microbes present in the digestive system of cattle can be found every where in nature. The grasses the cows eat will eventually be consumed by these microbes in or out of the cow. If you don't believe this, take some grass clippings, put them in a plastic bag with a couple of quarts of water and let it set in a warm area. Tie the bag up and you will soon see the bag swell. The gases,CO2 and methane ,are being produced by the bacteria. After a few days you can dump the contents of the bag and you'll find a product very similiar to cow waste. There may be some real reason for hope in resolving the energy crisis with the new technologies being developed today. The advancements being made by such corporations as Changing World Technologies, certainly is a sign of good things to come. If we can really take virtually any hydrocarbon and expose it to say 600 psi @ 500 degrees F for relatively short periods of time and produce a useable oil, think of the possibilities. Thank you for listening to my rambling note. Sincerely, Dave Hannah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
andys280176 wrote: If you look behing the 'veil' of global warming it is plain scaremongering. As a scientist/ environmentalist, I would strongly disagree this latest find is nothing short of an admission of failure by the environmentalists, in that, the one science they conveniently believed in has grossly over-estimated the effect-if any-of global climate change. Quite the contrary, we very well may be underestimating the effect of anthropogenic forcing to the climate via greenhouse gases, due to the masking effect of the aerosols. Climate change? whatis the definition? Quite simply...the continual changing of the climate's atmospherical conditions in relation to time in other words it is never stable always going up or down BUT the question remains are human activities accelerating the rate of change to our and all of life on the planet's detriment? The data at this point strongly suggest yes it is also convenient for scientists to come out and say the environment a nd climate is changing as they wouldn't get funding for saying everything is fine I suspect that you would find the majority of scientists support the hypothesis of anthropogenic forcing of the climate, and hold that position in the absence of any funding , myself among them. and being politically incorrect. As Professor David bellamy-a conservationist- summed it up global warming is poppycock see the link: http://www.sovereignty.org.uk/features/eco/hotair.html David Bellamy appears to be a darling of the kooks, for example he is quoted on a website the looks to fox news and the washington times for sources. He also quotes as a reference a website which produces a CD on how to survive nuclear war. He sounds like a shill for the Council of oil pumpers and coal diggers. One of his principal arguments is that additional CO2 is good for us. It increases plant productivity. The only problem is that it doesn't. Increased plant productivity is not sopping up the excess CO2, because CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere continue to increase. -- Bob Allen,http://ozarker.org/bob -- - The modern conservative is engaged in one of Man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness JKG --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
:-) Dave, most of your very own national treasures of US climate-change denialism have been doing sharp U-turns for quite some time now, don't get left behind. Nothing's more stale than yesterday's spin. Wow, what an embarrassment of riches I have here that you'd have to blind-eye to think that. And I haven't even been looking for it, it just arrives. Let's be really fresh about it - here's one from next month: http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0409/feature1/index.html Global Warning @ National Geographic Magazine There's no question that the Earth is getting hotter - and fast. The real questions are: How much of the warming is our fault, and are we willing to slow the meltdown by curbing our insatiable appetite for fossil fuels? [More...] Human cause? The editor says so. He says scientists all over the world say so, and the 74-page feature pulls it all together with the evidence they're finding. That huge bulging mountain of evidence by comparison with which all else is but a pimple, proving beyond all doubt that it's just an extreme leftwing conspiracy to take over humanity, the world, the universe and all the fish has somehow succeeded so far in escaping their attention. I guess they all must be part of this dreadful conspiracy, eh? All in the pay of... Um, of... Who was it again they're all in the pay of? Socialists (arghhh!) plotting to deprive Americans of their property rights, it says here in the list archives. Hm... perhaps not. Er, how about this one - the cabal of developing countries that are plotting with the UN to take all America's money? No? Andrew, Global warming is in my opinion an attempt by the extreme left to control the activities of society to the extent that they'll control all of human activities. This is about power and the lefts never ending desire to regulate free people. Trying to control CO2 is an exercise in futility. Hydrocarbons are in constant change. It's a part of nature as surely as the water cycle. These people even come up with ridiculous hypotheses that would enable them to control the amount of cattle allowed to be on farms. Cattle produce methane gas you know. The same microbes present in the digestive system of cattle can be found every where in nature. The grasses the cows eat will eventually be consumed by these microbes in or out of the cow. If you don't believe this, take some grass clippings, put them in a plastic bag with a couple of quarts of water and let it set in a warm area. Tie the bag up and you will soon see the bag swell. The gases,CO2 and methane ,are being produced by the bacteria. After a few days you can dump the contents of the bag and you'll find a product very similiar to cow waste. Yes, there are quite a lot of people here who make and use and promote biogas. So what? What's it have to do with sinister extreme leftwing conspiracies to eradicate freedom and all we hold so dear, including CAWKI? There may be some real reason for hope in resolving the energy crisis with the new technologies being developed today. The advancements being made by such corporations as Changing World Technologies, certainly is a sign of good things to come. If we can really take virtually any hydrocarbon and expose it to say 600 psi @ 500 degrees F for relatively short periods of time and produce a useable oil, think of the possibilities. You mean we won't have to go cold turkey after all - we can all go on wasting as much energy as we want, at the rate of 200 times our fair share or something, as if there's no tomorrow? Hooray! LOL! Re Changing World Technologies: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/33476/ http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/36736/ Anyway, Dave, it seems this extreme leftwing conspiracy has spread its filthy tentacles everywhere, nothing remains untainted, not even the Senate: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/32769/ Senate committee backs $60 million abrupt climate change research program Not even the Pentagon: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/32446/ Pentagon Goes Crazy for Massive Climate Change Not even the White House: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/37916/ Climate data mark shift in emphasis Best stick to Rupert Murdoch and FauxTV, it's the last bastion. Just as well we still have REAL science, like this here: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/32435/ http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/32566/ Best Keith Thank you for listening to my rambling note. Sincerely, Dave Hannah Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages
Re: [biofuel] Re: Environment
Dear Jake: You sure nailed me. I'm one of those of fossils who is a Christian, Conservative, and hopefully a Patriot. I am the guy you all despise and ridicule at every opportunity. Flame on people. If you get a chance you might take the opportunity to have a discussion without all the vitriol. I have always had an interest in alternative energy resources and at one time owned virtually every copy of Mother Earth News. I read all those articles about how the world was coming to an end. Is Paul Erlichman still around? Remember how we were all going to starve as a result of the population explosion? You may not believe this but I also consider myself a conservationist. Abusing your resources is not only stupid but its bad business. Being a conservative, I think about such things. :)) The people on this forum have provided a remarkable amount of very valuable information concerning Biofuels. You are to be commended. I have tried many of the systems you have presented and am very impressed. Your council works. Todd Swearingen is without a doubt very knowledgeable and gives simple and precise answers to the questions asked by those on the forum with questions. Now, I would like to make a suggestion that some of you entrepreneurs might consider. I believe there is an opportunity for many people to earn real good money. This might be a thumb nail bus. plan. Assume your able to collect 1000 gals. of WVO per week. Seems like a reasonable task. That amount should yield 1000 gals. of Biofuel. It should also yield 750# of glycerin. Please don't take it to the grass clippings pile. Glycerin as you all know is valuable. Learn how to Purify it and then assign your wife the task of making a very high value soap. Sell it on the Internet @ $1.50 per 3.5 oz. bar. If she can't make that much soap, pour the glycerin in 2# blocks and again sell it for 2-3 bucks a pound. Let's see what you accomplished. Gross Income BioD $2,200.00 Soap 200# at app. $1,000.00 and the balance of glycerin 500# @ 2.50 /#. Let's see now that's about $4,400.00 in gross income. You might have a Grand in expenses and that seems to me to be a pretty good part time business. Both liberals and conservatives may be able to agree on some things. Biod is Good, Glycerin soap is high quality soap, and I hope all of you have a wonderful day and life.Now go out there all you greedy capitalist and do good. :)) Sincerely, Dave Hannah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ~-- Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
