Re: [OSM-talk] [Osmf-talk] OPENSTREETMAP FOUNDATION - NOTICE OF ANNUAL GENERAL MEETING

[Stefan Baebler]

It can easily happen that there are several very active OSM
contributors employed by the same (larger) company. Company's primary
business might not be OSM (or even GIS) related, it might just be
large enough to gather enough geo geeks. Those people might work in
various branches, possibly not even knowing each other trough other
channels than OSM.

Introducing "strict" rules for specific situations is no good. CM
could easily set up a new daughter company to employ Nick or Steve to
bypass that rule if they wanted. Or a completely new, "unrelated"
company entity and outsource the CM management position...

What it would work is:
- full disclosure of candidates' affiliations (done?)
- any OSMF member can propose _anything_ to be voted upon at GM. This
might be a general rule that Richard Weait suggested or a special
voting round to eliminate one of the candidates in worst case (if
voters determine that both candidates are individually good, but
having both on board might be bad for the future of OSMF and none of
them steps down, AND if voters first agree to vote about that in the
first place)

At the same time substantial part of OSMF membership (=voting body)
can easily be bought by anyone with enough money and people to act as
members, allowing them to change rules, statues or to dissolve OSMF
(quickly & visibly or subtly and slowly, taking OSM down with it). :)

The bottom line: let's use common sense and try not to too quickly
come up with "general" rules to cover specific issues.

Stefan
PS: i wonder if trust points could solve these issues as well :)

On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:32 PM, SteveC wrote:
>
> On 15 Aug 2009, at 18:20, Richard Weait wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 5:43 AM, Frederik Ramm
>> wrote:
>>> Nick,
>>>
>>> Nick Black wrote:
 I'm going to be standing for election to the OSM Foundation Board
 again
 this year.
>>>
>>> Do you and Steve have any comment on Richard Weait's suggestion that
>>> from every commercial organisation, at most one person should be a
>>> member of the OSMF board (http://weait.com/cloudmade-layoffs)? I'm
>>> very
>>> supportive of that, although not exactly out of fear that you might
>>> both
>>> be looking for a new job at the same time, but more along the lines
>>> of
>>> what RichardF said in the comments section on that page.
>>
>>> This would mean that *either* your *or* SteveC should be on the board
>>> but not both of you. It is of course everyone's right to stand for
>>> election and let the voters decide if they support Richard's
>>> suggestion
>>> or not - but I would be interested in hearing your opinion.
>>
>> Nick followed up several times, but I can't see any answer to
>> Frederik's direct question.  I'd like to hear replies from each of the
>> candidates on this.
>>
>> Should any single company be able to hold an unlimited number of seats
>> on the Foundation board?  A majority?  All?
>
> I agree with others that the members should be the ones to decide. I
> don't think arbitrary rules will help much at this stage and I don't
> think it would ever get to the stage of being a majority or more
> anyway from any one organisation.
>
>> There are eleven excellent candidates on the wiki,
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Foundation/AGM09/Election_to_Board
>> each qualified and suitable to hold a seat on the board.  Each worthy
>> of my vote.  How does more than a single candidate from any company
>> benefit the Foundation and the project?
>
> I'm not standing on a platform of 'I'm at CloudMade therefore vote for
> me' so really the company issue is a tertiary one. I think you should
> judge Nick and I on what we've done with our time helping OSM, which
> is very substantial, and not get hung up on this. The protections in
> OSM are very strong against anyone taking it over and I'm happy to
> make them stronger still.
>
> And as for the issue of Nick or I being let go from CloudMade... I can
> assure you I would still work just as hard on OSM.
>
> Yours &c.
>
> Steve
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Local Chapters Meeting Minutes WAS Re: Status of the Local Chapter working group

[Liz]

On Tue, 18 Aug 2009, John Smith wrote:
> > One of the goals of the meeting next week will
> > be to set a timetable for getting local chapters set up,
> > which will be largely dependent on how much we all agree /
> > disagree in the call.  Until then, please read over the
> > Local Chapters wiki page and add as many comments or ideas
> > as possible, so we can discuss next week.
>
> It's a bit exclusionary to state that and then already acknowledge that
> people can't make it due to time of day.

And we do need to get input and output from the meetings
as we have to make clear decisions which will fit into our legal frameworks in 
each case




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[OSM-talk] server not rendering fully

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

hi,

I am setting up an India specific server with mod_tile and mapnik. I finally 
got 
the beast to work, but at higher zoom levels it is not rendering completely. 
Apparently it is giving up instead of generating the tiles fully. Obviously 
there is some setting I have to make in apache config to force it to produce 
the full tiles regardless of how long it takes. I have disable cache and also 
lengthened the timeouts. Any one has a clue as what can be done to force it to 
render the tiles properly? The server is here:

http://xlquest.net/
-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

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Re: [OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Rahkonen Jukka]

Cartinus wrote:

>On Monday 17 August 2009 16:17:36 Tobias Knerr wrote:
>> >> OR highway is not null AND cycleway is not null
>>
>> You might want check for cycleway=no here, there are a few hundreds
of
>> them.

> You'd want to exclude cycleway=opposite as well, because that is just
removing 
> the oneway restriction for bicycles.

But isn't it still kind of a cycleway and thus worth making it visible
on a cyclemap?

> -- 
> m.v.g.,
> Cartinus

-Jukka-

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Re: [OSM-talk] Local Chapters Meeting Minutes WAS Re: Status of the Local Chapter working group

[John Smith]

--- On Tue, 18/8/09, Nick Black  wrote:

> Chapters meetings.  You can find minutes here [1] along
> with information about the next meeting.  

There seems to be more questions posed than answers in the minutes...

> The next meeting is proposed for the 24th August
> at 18.00 - 19:30 BST.  I know this is not great for a lot
> of people who are in non-BST friendly time zones, so if you
> can't make it but would like to, please add your name to
> the wiki so we can have a second call at a better
> time.

I did, but it didn't seem to make a difference, also there is at least one 
other person that would like to have been in the conference but wasn't an 
insomniac last night either.

> One of the goals of the meeting next week will
> be to set a timetable for getting local chapters set up,
> which will be largely dependent on how much we all agree /
> disagree in the call.  Until then, please read over the
> Local Chapters wiki page and add as many comments or ideas
> as possible, so we can discuss next week.

It's a bit exclusionary to state that and then already acknowledge that people 
can't make it due to time of day.


  

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Re: [OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Cartinus]

On Monday 17 August 2009 16:17:36 Tobias Knerr wrote:
> >> OR highway is not null AND cycleway is not null
>
> You might want check for cycleway=no here, there are a few hundreds of
> them.

You'd want to exclude cycleway=opposite as well, because that is just removing 
the oneway restriction for bicycles.

-- 
m.v.g.,
Cartinus

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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Nop]

Hi!

Hatto von Hatzfeld schrieb:
>  
>> Official is new and has only one meaning.
> 
>>From Map features: "official is used for ways dedicated to a certain mode of
> travel by law. Usually indicated by a traffic sign."
> 
> I really do not see where the use of "designated" has differed from this
> definition.

Which of the 5 definitions of designated do you mean? :-)

Just read this topic from the beginning and you should understand.

bye
Nop


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Re: [OSM-talk] Golf course rendering for OpenStreetMap (mapnik)

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Tuesday 18 Aug 2009 6:27:10 am you wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:03 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote:
> > On Monday 17 Aug 2009 11:46:20 pm Richard Weait wrote:
> >> I've started a mapnik style sheet that renders golf holes with
> >> fairways, greens and other goodies.  Have a look and help out if you
> >> are inclined.
> >>
> >> http://weait.com/content/golf-course-style-openstreetmap
> >
> > some of us have done considerable work in this area - it is on the wiki.
> > You could incorporate that instead of completely reinventing the wheel
> > regards
> > Kenneth Gonsalves
>
> Dear Kenneth,
>
> I'm sorry that you have found offense where none was intended.  I am
> aware of the work on the wiki[1] and mentioned and linked the wiki in
> my article as I took much of my guidance from the wiki.
>
> Your suggestion that I've reinvented the wheel is baffling.
>
> I've used golf=fairway/green/bunker/tee as suggested on the wiki and
> discussion page[2].  I added golf=tee to the wiki as it was only on
> the discussion page.
>
> None of these are reinventing the wheel.
>
> I marked water areas as natural=water and trees as landuse=forest as
> seen in every country on OpenStreetMap, so surely you are not
> suggesting that is reinventing the wheel.
>
> I've put together an example in mapnik, the discussion page has
> samples in Kosmos and osmarender.  No duplication there.
>
> So what has put your nose out of joint?  Help me understand you.

I know it sounded a bit abrupt - but actually I am not annoyed with you, I am 
pleased that you have taken interest in this - actually what made me a bit 
abrupt is that I have been struggling to get up a local server for India, 
mainly to properly display golf courses and was frustrated at getting nowhere 
- so maybe I took it out on you. Apologies. Keep up the good work.
-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

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Re: [OSM-talk] Golf course rendering for OpenStreetMap (mapnik)

[Richard Weait]

On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:03 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote:
> On Monday 17 Aug 2009 11:46:20 pm Richard Weait wrote:
>> I've started a mapnik style sheet that renders golf holes with
>> fairways, greens and other goodies.  Have a look and help out if you
>> are inclined.
>>
>> http://weait.com/content/golf-course-style-openstreetmap
>
> some of us have done considerable work in this area - it is on the wiki. You
> could incorporate that instead of completely reinventing the wheel
> regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves

Dear Kenneth,

I'm sorry that you have found offense where none was intended.  I am
aware of the work on the wiki[1] and mentioned and linked the wiki in
my article as I took much of my guidance from the wiki.

Your suggestion that I've reinvented the wheel is baffling.

I've used golf=fairway/green/bunker/tee as suggested on the wiki and
discussion page[2].  I added golf=tee to the wiki as it was only on
the discussion page.

None of these are reinventing the wheel.

I marked water areas as natural=water and trees as landuse=forest as
seen in every country on OpenStreetMap, so surely you are not
suggesting that is reinventing the wheel.

I've put together an example in mapnik, the discussion page has
samples in Kosmos and osmarender.  No duplication there.

So what has put your nose out of joint?  Help me understand you.

Best regards,
Richard

[1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Golf_course
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/Golf_course

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Re: [OSM-talk] Golf course rendering for OpenStreetMap (mapnik)

[Kenneth Gonsalves]

On Monday 17 Aug 2009 11:46:20 pm Richard Weait wrote:
> I've started a mapnik style sheet that renders golf holes with
> fairways, greens and other goodies.  Have a look and help out if you
> are inclined.
>
> http://weait.com/content/golf-course-style-openstreetmap

some of us have done considerable work in this area - it is on the wiki. You 
could incorporate that instead of completely reinventing the wheel
-- 
regards
Kenneth Gonsalves
Associate
NRC-FOSS
http://nrcfosshelpline.in/web/

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Re: [OSM-talk] Announcemen: Multilingual Country-List

[Lennard]

Peter Körner wrote:

>> It reaches 100% when /Tromelin Island /is set to not-ok.

I got Bahasa Indonesia at 229/230 with 2 countries (Tromelin, Turkey) as 
not ok.

-- 
Lennard


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Re: [OSM-talk] Historic Mapping needs help Now!

[Nic Roets]

On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 11:00 PM, Mikel Maron  wrote:

>
> Look forward to some good ideas.
>

Here is my plan :
* Create a separate server that starts with a very old planet file and then
processes the diffs.
* Use Mercator projection, divide the map into tiles of fixed size of
approximately 2km x 2km. Enumerate the tiles according to the Hilbert curve.
This scheme works well for rendering cities areas at high zoom most queries
(which are the vast majority of queries). The lack of performance on other
queries will be more than compensated for (as gosmore proves).
* To prevent wasting disk space on ocean, desert and tiles, choose a
function that "maps" the many tiles unto few buckets (hash function).
* For each bucket allocate a few kilobytes of disk space. We need to mark it
as empty, but there is a nice Linux trick of marking parts of a file as zero
and delaying the actual writing until that part of the file is actually
modified.
* Now add all the data to the file i.e. write the info into the buckets. If
a bucket K gets full, use K+1. The structure(s) used for nodes have space to
point to the ways that use them. The ways are store in the buckets,
preferably next to one of the nodes used in it. Ways point to the nodes that
they depend on. Use a similar scheme for relations.
* Every node, way and relation must have a start time, end time (initially
infinite) and a pointer to its successor.
* Now process the diff files. Old nodes, ways & relations aren't removed.
Instead their end times and successors are updated.
* To find old nodes, ways and relations we need an index that maps their id
numbers to where they currently are in the file. These indices are not
stored in the file (RAM?). Note that I'm only interested in serving bounding
box queries for any given time T. I'm not interested in serving queries like
"Where was node N at time T ?" So old versions of this index is not
necessary.
* To serve a query, iterate over all the tiles and look in the buckets. If a
bucket K is full, look in K+1, until you found one with unused space.
* Over time many buckets will get full and this will mean that the server
will need to linearly search larger and larger parts of the file. When this
performance degradation happens (say after several months), we just create a
new file. The server then looks at the T values of the queries to choose the
correct file.

Then the T parameter will appear in the permalink, it will get passed to
mod_tile etc. and you will get a map of burning man 2008.

And the possibility of differential rendering also exist.


> Thanks
> Mikel
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Postal an idea to extend Walking-Papers to "not connected" people

[Michal Migurski]

> I made the mistake of ignoring my OSM-talk mail for a few days, I'm
> really happy to see that people are thinking of ways to work with
> Walking Papers. I've been building up some steam to work on another
> set of change requests, now's the time to ask if you have a pet
> feature you'd like to see added. =)


Thanks everyone for the suggestions, I've added these and others to  
the issues page on Github:
http://github.com/migurski/paperwalking/issues

I've ordered them very roughly from top to bottom, based on ease of  
implementation and likelihood. Github seems to have an issue voting  
system I've never used, maybe this would be useful. If you have some  
thoughts on importance / details of any issue, try leaving a comment.

-mike.


michal migurski- m...@stamen.com
  415.558.1610




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Re: [OSM-talk] Announcemen: Multilingual Country-List

[Peter Körner]

Thank you for the bug-report, i'll check both bugs soon.

Peter

> I think there was a bug introduced during resorting of the list or 
> during the transition from
> zh-classic -> zh-classical. The list behaves strange. Once I noticed 
> that when i changed a
> country name in one language, the status of the same country name in 
> another language
> changed also. I cannot verify or nail down any bug from remote.
> 
> Please see also the image attached which shows a 100.43% progress for 
> translation of the
> Arabic country names.
> http://cassini.toolserver.org/~mazder/multilingual-country-list/?lang=ar
> 
> It reaches 100% when /Tromelin Island /is set to not-ok.
> 


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Re: [OSM-talk] Announcemen: Multilingual Country-List

[Micha Ruh]

Hi

I think there was a bug introduced during resorting of the list or during
the transition from
zh-classic -> zh-classical. The list behaves strange. Once I noticed that
when i changed a
country name in one language, the status of the same country name in another
language
changed also. I cannot verify or nail down any bug from remote.

Please see also the image attached which shows a 100.43% progress for
translation of the
Arabic country names.
http://cassini.toolserver.org/~mazder/multilingual-country-list/?lang=ar

It reaches 100% when *Tromelin Island *is set to not-ok.

Gruess, Micha
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Re: [OSM-talk] [Osmf-talk] OPENSTREETMAP FOUNDATION - NOTICE OF ANNUAL GENERAL MEETING

[SteveC]

On 15 Aug 2009, at 18:20, Richard Weait wrote:

> On Wed, Jul 29, 2009 at 5:43 AM, Frederik Ramm  
> wrote:
>> Nick,
>>
>> Nick Black wrote:
>>> I'm going to be standing for election to the OSM Foundation Board  
>>> again
>>> this year.
>>
>> Do you and Steve have any comment on Richard Weait's suggestion that
>> from every commercial organisation, at most one person should be a
>> member of the OSMF board (http://weait.com/cloudmade-layoffs)? I'm  
>> very
>> supportive of that, although not exactly out of fear that you might  
>> both
>> be looking for a new job at the same time, but more along the lines  
>> of
>> what RichardF said in the comments section on that page.
>
>> This would mean that *either* your *or* SteveC should be on the board
>> but not both of you. It is of course everyone's right to stand for
>> election and let the voters decide if they support Richard's  
>> suggestion
>> or not - but I would be interested in hearing your opinion.
>
> Nick followed up several times, but I can't see any answer to
> Frederik's direct question.  I'd like to hear replies from each of the
> candidates on this.
>
> Should any single company be able to hold an unlimited number of seats
> on the Foundation board?  A majority?  All?

I agree with others that the members should be the ones to decide. I  
don't think arbitrary rules will help much at this stage and I don't  
think it would ever get to the stage of being a majority or more  
anyway from any one organisation.

> There are eleven excellent candidates on the wiki,
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Foundation/AGM09/Election_to_Board
> each qualified and suitable to hold a seat on the board.  Each worthy
> of my vote.  How does more than a single candidate from any company
> benefit the Foundation and the project?

I'm not standing on a platform of 'I'm at CloudMade therefore vote for  
me' so really the company issue is a tertiary one. I think you should  
judge Nick and I on what we've done with our time helping OSM, which  
is very substantial, and not get hung up on this. The protections in  
OSM are very strong against anyone taking it over and I'm happy to  
make them stronger still.

And as for the issue of Nick or I being let go from CloudMade... I can  
assure you I would still work just as hard on OSM.

Yours &c.

Steve

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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM status POIs?

[Apollinaris Schoell]

http://openstreetbugs.schokokeks.org/dumps/ offers downloads of the raw
data. shouldn't be difficult to grep the info and format it into a csv
files.
Garmin utilities can convert csv files to POI
I think only Garmin with memory cards support loading these POI files. This
way you don't need to recompile the map




On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 6:42 AM, Someoneelse wrote:

> Apollinaris Schoell wrote:
>
>> there is something better already
>> http://openstreetbugs.schokokeks.org/
>>
>
> Is there a way of getting data out of that easily?  If there is it would
> make sense to be able to convert bugs within an area to e.g. Garmin
> waypoints.
>
> I tend to use those for "stuff I need to come back to".  They don't get
> added to the main map, obviously, but you can get an idea by looking at a
> recent public trace of mine such as
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/SomeoneElse/traces/454421 .  I tend to
> use blue for "stuff to come back to", green for "done" and other symbols
>  for particular features.  Before going somewhere I create a GPX of all
> waypoints within the area and send it to my GPS and then edit e.g. blue to
> green when something is completed.
>
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[OSM-talk] Historic Mapping needs help Now!

[Mikel Maron]

Hi

I'm again working this year on mapping for the Burning Man arts festival, 
coming up in two weeks.
This makes urgent a growing theme in OSM, with several presentations at this 
year's SOTM .. how to handle historic data.

Here's the current map of Burning Man for 2009. I haven't added Camp locations 
yet, will come soon.
http://playaevents.burningman.com/brc/2009/map/

That map data hasn't been added to OSM.org yet, because the prior year's map is 
still there, and still being used. For example, Flickr...
http://radar.oreilly.com/2008/08/flickr-burning-man-open-street-map.html

Why is 2008 historic map data now? Well each year, the location of the festival 
moves, to minimize impact on the area. Everything is rebuilt, created again 
over several weeks, existing as a place for one week, and then deconstructed 
over several weeks. However, the impact of Burning Man is year round, and for 
years to come; the amount of media generated and geotagged during the event is 
enormous. Take a look at the photos in the Flickr map to understand why.


So I'd like to import 2009 BM into OSM now. But there's a need to retain the 
2008 data. I'm opening the question up... what is the best way to mark this 
data as historic, keep it available as needed, but make sure it doesn't show up 
in core renderings?

Look forward to some good ideas.

Thanks
Mikel
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Re: [OSM-talk] Golf course rendering for OpenStreetMap (mapnik)

[Richard Weait]

On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Colin McGregor wrote:
> Time for me to play devils advocate here for a moment. I have on rare
> occasions played golf on a par 3 course (I'm not very good...). But
> one of the things I do know is that some course maintainers shift the
> holes from time to time. So while say water hazards stay fairly fixed,
> a hole may shift by several meters  each month...

Hello Barrister to the Devil. ;-)

> So, how does one track hole movement from month to month?

Short answer
One does not.  That is the responsibility of the golfer.

Long answer
Pin placement, that is the location of the flag and hole on the green,
can move every day for tournaments and every day or two depending on
how busy the golf course is.  I've traced the outline of the greens as
best I can.  It would be out of the ordinary for a pin to be placed
outside of the green, though sometimes temporary greens are created
due to weather damage.

I have not, yet addressed pin placement.  I am unlikely to address
exact, daily pin placement at all, as that would likely fail the "map
it if it is nailed down" test for inclusion in OpenStreetMap.

This exact daily pin placement issue is faced by the golf courses as
well.  They have a scorecard with the distance from each tee printed
on it.  When the pin moves, that distance changes, but printing these
things on-demand does not seem to be the way they work.  (At least not
at the courses I've seen.)  There are also yardage markers on or
beside the fairway, usually at 150 yards, and sometimes at 100 and 200
as well.  Some courses print yardage to the green on each sprinkler
head as well.

Each tee box will have a distance marker.  The tee blocks indicate
from where the golfer must hit, and those may be removed a substantial
distance from the nominal marker.  You may see golfers pacing in the
tee box; they are counting the difference from the nominal distance.

Golfers expect the printed pin distance on the scorecard, fairway
marker or sprinkler head, to be to the distance to center of the
green.  Often the flag will give the golfer a clue if the pin is at
the front, middle or back of the green by the colour of the flag, or
by the height of a smaller flag below the main flag.  Other courses
have pin zones on the score cards that tell the golfer where on the
green the pin will be.  Armed with the knowledge of the distance to
the center of the green, and the relative position of the pin on the
green, the golfer can consider wind, temperature, elevation above sea
level, depth of rough, ball lie, and then select the right club.  Then
I shank it into the woods.

Some courses go further than maps and scorecards and supply a guide
book.  These include for each hole, an idealized shot plan, that shows
where a good golfer would land each shot.  Even then, given the
expense of compiling and printing such a guide, the pins and tees are
put in the center of the tee box and green.  The golfer calculates the
difference.

There is a proposal for these ideal shot planners on the wiki but I
have not included those yet.  I would want to do a site survey to
include shot planning for this course.  I've also omitted hole number,
distance, par and rating as they are not apparent from the aerial
imagery.  Well we could make safe guesses for par if pressed.

Best regards,
Richard.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Hatto von Hatzfeld]

Nop wrote:

> Hatto von Hatzfeld schrieb:
>> 
>> I appreciate Nop's proposal - but why replace "designated" by "official"?
>> I do not see that "designated" has been used in the past with a meaning
>> differing from what "official" would be used for in future.
 
> Designated is linked to footway/cycleway and there are about 5 different
> interpretations on what it means, all of them documented somewhere in
> the Wiki.

You are exaggerating. They all say something like "specially designated
(typically by a government) for use by a particular mode (or modes) of
transport."
 
> Official is new and has only one meaning.

>From Map features: "official is used for ways dedicated to a certain mode of
travel by law. Usually indicated by a traffic sign."

I really do not see where the use of "designated" has differed from this
definition.

Hatto




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Re: [OSM-talk] copyright problem with data copied from a map

[Renaud MICHEL]

Le lundi 17 août 2009 à 20:37, Andy Allan a écrit :
> Hi Renaud,

Hello, thank you for your answer.

> I think the best thing for you to do in this case is to contact the
> Foundation, as explained in the FAQ.
>
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Faq#I_think_someone.27s_been_entering_
>copyrighted_data_-_how_do_we_deal_with_that.3F

I had missed that question in the FAQ, should have read more carefully.

> Provide all the details you have gathered so far, and it will be
> passed on. Copyright violation is something we need to take seriously,
> and the relevant working group can take further actions such as
> banning the user and removing data from the history should such things
> prove necessary. You have certainly done the right thing so far by
> contacting the user directly to make initial investigations.

OK, I'll mail them all the informations.

thanks
-- 
Renaud Michel


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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Mitja Kleider]

Alexander Menk wrote:
> can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?

Just use the JOSM remote bookmarklet, it works fine.



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Re: [OSM-talk] Golf course rendering for OpenStreetMap (mapnik)

[Colin McGregor]

On 8/17/09, Richard Weait  wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> I've started a mapnik style sheet that renders golf holes with
> fairways, greens and other goodies.  Have a look and help out if you
> are inclined.
>
> http://weait.com/content/golf-course-style-openstreetmap
>
> Best regards,
> Richard

Time for me to play devils advocate here for a moment. I have on rare
occasions played golf on a par 3 course (I'm not very good...). But
one of the things I do know is that some course maintainers shift the
holes from time to time. So while say water hazards stay fairly fixed,
a hole may shift by several meters  each month...

So, how does one track hole movement from month to month?


Colin.

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Re: [OSM-talk] copyright problem with data copied from a map

[Andy Allan]

On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 9:18 AM, Renaud MICHEL wrote:

> Any advice?

Hi Renaud,

I think the best thing for you to do in this case is to contact the
Foundation, as explained in the FAQ.

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Faq#I_think_someone.27s_been_entering_copyrighted_data_-_how_do_we_deal_with_that.3F

Provide all the details you have gathered so far, and it will be
passed on. Copyright violation is something we need to take seriously,
and the relevant working group can take further actions such as
banning the user and removing data from the history should such things
prove necessary. You have certainly done the right thing so far by
contacting the user directly to make initial investigations.

Cheers,
Andy

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[OSM-talk] Golf course rendering for OpenStreetMap (mapnik)

[Richard Weait]

Dear all,

I've started a mapnik style sheet that renders golf holes with
fairways, greens and other goodies.  Have a look and help out if you
are inclined.

http://weait.com/content/golf-course-style-openstreetmap

Best regards,
Richard

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[OSM-talk] Local Chapters Meeting Minutes WAS Re: Status of the Local Chapter working group

[Nick Black]

Hello,
We just held the first of a new program of Local Chapters meetings.  You can
find minutes here [1] along with information about the next meeting.

The next meeting is proposed for the 24th August at 18.00 - 19:30 BST.  I
know this is not great for a lot of people who are in non-BST friendly time
zones, so if you can't make it but would like to, please add your name to
the wiki so we can have a second call at a better time.

For the next meeting, it would be good to go through all of the comments
from the Local Chapters wiki page - so if you have added a comment and would
like to discuss it further, please come and join in the call.

I know its hard for non native English speakers to follow long meetings on
phone calls and that text based meetings are better for some.  A good
compromise could be for someone from each of the local communities to
volunteer to transcribe onto a local IRC channel and to push any questions
to the main IRC, where we can try to answer questions as they come up.  This
is my best idea for making the process as inclusive as possible - if you
have a better idea, please let me know :-)

One of the goals of the meeting next week will be to set a timetable for
getting local chapters set up, which will be largely dependent on how much
we all agree / disagree in the call.  Until then, please read over the Local
Chapters wiki page and add as many comments or ideas as possible, so we can
discuss next week.

Best,

--
Nick

[1] -
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Foundation/Local_Chapters#Past_Meeting_Minutes


On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 1:11 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:

> 2009/8/14 Jochen Topf :
> > Hi!
> >
> > I don't mind if anybody wants to have a phone conversation on things.
> Just keep
> > in mind that most interested people will not be on that phone call and
> that all
> > the discussions have to be repeated on this list or on the wiki for the
> benefit
> > of those of us not on the call.
>
> yes. I think to discuss in a written form has a lot of advantage
> respect to a phone-conference. (searchable, re-readable, not dependant
> on specific temporal availability of contributors and time-zones, less
> ad-hoc and therefore (sometimes) more reflected, less
> band-width-dependant, less dependant on language-skills, ...), so in a
> global project I'd prefer a written discussion.
>
> cheers,
> Martin
>



-- 
-- 
Nick Black
twitter.com/nick_b
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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Nop]

Hi!

Hatto von Hatzfeld schrieb:
> 
> I appreciate Nop's proposal - but why replace "designated" by "official"? I
> do not see that "designated" has been used in the past with a meaning
> differing from what "official" would be used for in future.
> 
> Or did I miss anything in this discussion?

Yes. :-)

Designated is linked to footway/cycleway and there are about 5 different 
interpretations on what it means, all of them documented somewhere in 
the Wiki.

Official is new and has only one meaning.

bye
Nop


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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2009/8/17 Mike Harris :
> ... but, rightly or wrongly, I do not think I am alone in using
> highway=footway for all paths intended primarily for pedestrians whether
> urban or rural, designated or not, designation=anything

+1

>  - the only real
> exception I make is (mostly) in rural areas where the path is clearly
> informal and of undefined status, where I would use highway=path.

not to forget, that those paths are IMHO the most important, as they
are usually not covered in other maps, but indicate the need (and
solution) for a connection ;-)

cheers,
Martin

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[OSM-talk] Multipolygon issue

[Emilie Laffray]

Hello,

I have just noticed that some inner polygons disappeared recently since the
last import by osm2pgsql. The forest/wood had inner polygons but it seems
the forest decided to take over the city that was within its borders.
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=47.9598&lon=1.9778&zoom=14&layers=B000FTF

Has anything changed regarding multipolygons? I am keen to know whether it
is a "bug" or whether I should upgrade the forest.

Emilie Laffray
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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Peter Körner]

This is true if you use Greasemonkey to *remove* existing josm-links, 
but (in my eyes) not if you're proposing a Greasemonkey-script to add them.

Peter

>> These kinds of things can easily be fixed using a tool like
>> Greasemonkey. I've made a few scripts myself, but none that is
>> suitable for general consumption. But it's really easy to make them
>>   
> Greasemonkey sounds more like a workaround to me in this case :)

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Re: [OSM-talk] How to tag this barrier?

[Shaun McDonald]

On 17 Aug 2009, at 16:42, Iván Sánchez Ortega wrote:


To the left of those, you'll see a couple of yellow foldable  
thingamajig. They
are supposed to stay folded at ground level to allow traffic, and  
they can
be "deployed" up and locked up (with a key) in order to prevent any  
vehicles
from passing through (sometimes the thingamajigs are used to prevent  
people

from parking somewhere instead).

So, how to tag the barrier=retractable_bollard and the
barrier=foldable_thingamajig?


I'd say a barrier=rising_bollard, which I though had been already used.

Shaun



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Re: [OSM-talk] How to tag this barrier?

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2009/8/17 Iván Sánchez Ortega :

> So, how to tag the barrier=retractable_bollard and the
> barrier=foldable_thingamajig?

I'd tag barrier=bollard, bollard=foldable
or barrier:type=foldable

cheers,
Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] How to tag this barrier?

[Richard Weait]

2009/8/17 Iván Sánchez Ortega :
> Hi,
>
> In this chapter of "How the f*** do I tag this piece of s***?", I ask everyone
> to have a look at these images:
>
> http://ivan.sanchezortega.es/30072009_006.jpg
> http://ivan.sanchezortega.es/30072009_007.jpg
>
> At the right of the image, you'll see some retractable bollards. You know, a
> bollard that mechanically dissapears into the ground with a remote control or
> something. A standard bollard is barrier=bollard, but how to tag a
> retractable one?

> So, how to tag the barrier=retractable_bollard and the
> barrier=foldable_thingamajig?

Functionally aren't these gates that allow bikes and pedestrians even
while "closed"?

barrier=gate; bicycle=yes pedestrian=yes access=keymaster ?

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[OSM-talk] How to tag this barrier?

[Iván Sánchez Ortega]

Hi,

In this chapter of "How the f*** do I tag this piece of s***?", I ask everyone 
to have a look at these images:

http://ivan.sanchezortega.es/30072009_006.jpg
http://ivan.sanchezortega.es/30072009_007.jpg

At the right of the image, you'll see some retractable bollards. You know, a 
bollard that mechanically dissapears into the ground with a remote control or 
something. A standard bollard is barrier=bollard, but how to tag a 
retractable one?

To the left of those, you'll see a couple of yellow foldable thingamajig. They 
are supposed to stay folded at ground level to allow traffic, and they can 
be "deployed" up and locked up (with a key) in order to prevent any vehicles 
from passing through (sometimes the thingamajigs are used to prevent people 
from parking somewhere instead).

So, how to tag the barrier=retractable_bollard and the 
barrier=foldable_thingamajig?


Cheers,
-- 
--
Iván Sánchez Ortega 

http://ivan.sanchezortega.es
Proudly running Debian Linux with 2.6.30-1-amd64 kernel, KDE 3.5.10, and PHP 
5.2.10-2 generating this signature.
Uptime: 17:32:47 up 27 min,  4 users,  load average: 0.89, 1.04, 1.18


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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Nick Whitelegg]

>... but, rightly or wrongly, I do not think I am alone in using
>highway=footway for all paths intended primarily for pedestrians whether
>urban or rural, designated or not, designation=anything - the only real
>exception I make is (mostly) in rural areas where the path is clearly
>informal and of undefined status, where I would use highway=path.

>I arrive at this after a very long recycle of messages earlier on in this
>same discussion group and it is also consistent with
>http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/UK_public_rights_of_way .

This was originally my page, I have to admit, but is old, and came about 
before the widespread use of "path". I could change it to my own feelings 
on the matter but given the sensitivity to changing wiki pages on tagging, 
I'm not sure whether I should ;-)

>Please understand that I am not arguing a case here - merely recording 
what
>I currently do and why I do it. Once again it would appear that there are
>inconsistencies both in practice and within the different pages of the 
wiki.
>This is not surprising but it does, understandably, give rise to 
confusion
>and to lengthy discussions (witness the length of this thread).

>How to resolve?

>Mike Harris

Each country (or at least, each country with significant off-road mapping 
being done) could have a group of people with significant experience in 
countryside mapping (thinking walkers and off road cyclists) who could sit 
down (figuratively speaking, more likely communicate over the net) and 
thrash out the requirements of their own country, and come up with a 
catch-all proposal. Then, representatives of each country group could 
compare notes and thrash out an internationally-acceptable proposal.

My own feeling is we need agreement otherwise the renderer rules have to 
get more and more (and more) complex! The recommendation should be just 
that, not a "thou shalt follow or else" rule, but the renderers would then 
follow the recommendation.

Nick





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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Alexander Menk]

Martin Norbäck wrote:
>> Date: Mon, 17 Aug 2009 10:56:43 +0100
>> From: Tom Hughes 
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via
>>JOSM-remote-control-plugin
>> To: talk@openstreetmap.org
>> Message-ID: <4a89295b.9040...@compton.nu>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>
>> On 17/08/09 10:52, Alexander Menk wrote:
>>
>> 
>>> can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to
>>>
>>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?
>>>   
>> We've been over this many times - it is not appropriate to
>> unconditionally add a a link that will not work for most people.
>> 
>
> These kinds of things can easily be fixed using a tool like
> Greasemonkey. I've made a few scripts myself, but none that is
> suitable for general consumption. But it's really easy to make them
>   
Greasemonkey sounds more like a workaround to me in this case :)

Alex

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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Martin Norbäck]

> Date: Mon, 17 Aug 2009 10:56:43 +0100
> From: Tom Hughes 
> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via
>        JOSM-remote-control-plugin
> To: talk@openstreetmap.org
> Message-ID: <4a89295b.9040...@compton.nu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> On 17/08/09 10:52, Alexander Menk wrote:
>
>> can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to
>>
>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?
>
> We've been over this many times - it is not appropriate to
> unconditionally add a a link that will not work for most people.

These kinds of things can easily be fixed using a tool like
Greasemonkey. I've made a few scripts myself, but none that is
suitable for general consumption. But it's really easy to make them.

/Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Mike Harris]

... but, rightly or wrongly, I do not think I am alone in using
highway=footway for all paths intended primarily for pedestrians whether
urban or rural, designated or not, designation=anything - the only real
exception I make is (mostly) in rural areas where the path is clearly
informal and of undefined status, where I would use highway=path.

I arrive at this after a very long recycle of messages earlier on in this
same discussion group and it is also consistent with
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/UK_public_rights_of_way .

Please understand that I am not arguing a case here - merely recording what
I currently do and why I do it. Once again it would appear that there are
inconsistencies both in practice and within the different pages of the wiki.
This is not surprising but it does, understandably, give rise to confusion
and to lengthy discussions (witness the length of this thread).

How to resolve?

Mike Harris

-Original Message-
From: Nick Whitelegg [mailto:nick.whitel...@solent.ac.uk] 
Sent: 17 August 2009 09:14
To: Roy Wallace
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

>>> Whitelegg wrote:
 In the UK I would tag such a path as
foot=designated;bicycle=permissive;
 and pragmatically highway=footway for the moment, using the 
 generally-accepted definition of "footway" as "urban surfaced path"
 (though would prefer highway=path; surface=paved)
>>>
>>> That is not the definition of footway. highway=footway is "For 
>>> designated footpaths, i.e. mainly/exclusively for pedestrians."
>>
>> that's the recent wiki recommendation, but I guess footway is far 
>> older than this definition from Jan 08. Don't know how many footways 
>> have been in the  db till then and how many were added afterwards not 
>> corresponding to this definition, but might be lots ;-)


>Sure, but perpetuating deprecated definitions via the mailing list 
>without specifically indicating them as such (deprecated) is IMHO 
>damaging.

My comment on "footway" meaning "urban surfaced path" was based on many
recent mailing list discussions which seem to indicate that there was a
tendency to use "footway" for urban paths and "path" for mud/dirt/rock paths
in the countryside. Based on that perceived tendency, plus my own
preferences, that's what I've been doing recently.

Nick





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Re: [OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2009/8/17 Tobias Knerr :
> Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

>> I'd also have a look at tagwatch searching for "cycle" to see all the
>> possible variations.
>
> I wouldn't do this. Just correct those "variations" (aka errors) in the
> data if you care about them.

I wasn't referring to typos but to some "strange" tags like byway and
maybe others, that might be interesting for bicycles as well. If you
find some typos it's good to correct them obviously, not to put them
in the query.

cheers,
Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Rahkonen Jukka]

 Tobias Knerr wrote:
> 
> Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> Rahkonen Jukka wrote:
> >> OR highway=briddleway AND
> 
> "bridleway", but I guess that's just a typo.
> 
> >>   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive) OR 
> >> highway is not null AND cycleway is not null
> 
> You might want check for cycleway=no here, there are a few 
> hundreds of them.
> 
> > I'd also have a look at tagwatch searching for "cycle" to 
> see all the 
> > possible variations.
> 
> I wouldn't do this. Just correct those "variations" (aka 
> errors) in the data if you care about them.
> 
> > I'm not a programmer but it seems to me that you're missing same 
> > parenthesis
> 
> Assuming AND binds more strongly than OR, the query seems correct.
> 
> Tobias Knerr

Thanks to both of you. I did not even try to write totally correct SQL,
I can handle it if I understand what variations I must search for. I
believe I have to simplify the final rendering step by creating an own
column to the database to collect the cycleways or otherwise the
on-demand queries are getting too complicated for my WMS server.

-Jukka-


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Re: [OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Tobias Knerr]

Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> 2009/8/17 Rahkonen Jukka :
>> OR highway=briddleway AND

"bridleway", but I guess that's just a typo.

>>   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
>> OR highway is not null AND cycleway is not null

You might want check for cycleway=no here, there are a few hundreds of them.

> I'd also have a look at tagwatch searching for "cycle" to see all the
> possible variations.

I wouldn't do this. Just correct those "variations" (aka errors) in the
data if you care about them.

> I'm not a programmer but it seems to me that you're missing same
> parenthesis

Assuming AND binds more strongly than OR, the query seems correct.

Tobias Knerr

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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[Mike N.]

From: "Elena of Valhalla" 

>> On Mon, 17 Aug 2009, John Smith wrote:
>>> Is 640x480 good enough?
>> ;) ofcourse we want 1080p ;)
>
> is 640x480 good enough e.g to read street names and other signs?

http://home.att.net/~niceman/VidCap1.jpg

   I took that yesterday from a helmet cam 1280 X 720.   Generally I cannot 
read street signs across the street.   This one is partially blurred by 
motion.

  The actual results for a an OpenStreetView session would depend on the 
camera's field of view and speed of movement.   In practice, if there were 4 
videos with smaller fields of view, street signs would be more readable. 
OpenStreetView might prefer a larger field of view for a better feel for the 
location rather than being able to read small print street signs.

   Mike 


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Re: [OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2009/8/17 Rahkonen Jukka :
> I would like to render a map that highlights all the cycleways. Could
> the tagging
> specialists on the list check if this query would give me what I want
> and correct if there is something wrong or missing?
>
> WHERE highway=cycleway
> OR highway=footway AND
>   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
> OR highway=path AND
>   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
> OR highway=briddleway AND
>   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
> OR highway is not null AND cycleway is not null
> #I cannot handle cycleway=opposite_lane or left/right thing in
> #rendering yet so I do not care
>
> Should I add also 'OR bicycle=official'?

yes, if you want all of them I'd recommend to (maybe depends on the
area in which you're mapping).
I'd also have a look at tagwatch searching for "cycle" to see all the
possible variations.

I'm not a programmer but it seems to me that you're missing same
parenthesis, e.g.
where highway=cycleway
or (highway=footway and (x1 or x2 or x3))
or (path and cycleway)
or ...

cheers,
Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM status POIs?

[Someoneelse]

Apollinaris Schoell wrote:
> there is something better already
> http://openstreetbugs.schokokeks.org/

Is there a way of getting data out of that easily?  If there is it would 
make sense to be able to convert bugs within an area to e.g. Garmin 
waypoints.

I tend to use those for "stuff I need to come back to".  They don't get 
added to the main map, obviously, but you can get an idea by looking at 
a recent public trace of mine such as 
http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/SomeoneElse/traces/454421 .  I tend to 
use blue for "stuff to come back to", green for "done" and other symbols 
  for particular features.  Before going somewhere I create a GPX of all 
waypoints within the area and send it to my GPS and then edit e.g. blue 
to green when something is completed.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[Stefan de Konink]

On Mon, 17 Aug 2009, Elena of Valhalla wrote:

> On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:12 PM, Stefan de Konink wrote:
> > On Mon, 17 Aug 2009, John Smith wrote:
> >> Is 640x480 good enough?
> > ;) ofcourse we want 1080p ;)
>
> is 640x480 good enough e.g to read street names and other signs?

Signs yes, names... I have doubts. But this will also depend on the
shutterspeed (motion blur prevention). For now Tijs does only work on
photos with the name as subject on the photo.


Stefan


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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[Elena of Valhalla]

On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:12 PM, Stefan de Konink wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Aug 2009, John Smith wrote:
>> Is 640x480 good enough?
> ;) ofcourse we want 1080p ;)

is 640x480 good enough e.g to read street names and other signs?

-- 
Elena ``of Valhalla''

homepage: http://www.trueelena.org
email: elena.valha...@gmail.com

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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[Stefan de Konink]

On Mon, 17 Aug 2009, Erik Johansson wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 8:35 PM, OJ W wrote:
> > I'm just looking at ways of getting video-camera data into openstreetview
> >
> > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Georeference_video
> >
> > http://dev.openstreetmap.org/~ojw/StreetPhotos/test3/output.kml
> >
> > is anyone else working with georeferenced videos for mapping?
>
> I tried but my point and shoot overheated, and the time
> stamps/framerate was 10s off in the end.. :-)

The Elphel geocamera gives direction GPS etc. embedded in the video
stream. That would probably the killer cam ;)


Stefan


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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[Stefan de Konink]

On Mon, 17 Aug 2009, John Smith wrote:

> --- On Mon, 17/8/09, Erik Johansson  wrote:
> > Anyways I was pointed to a camera that records your
> > journey.
> > http://technabob.com/blog/2009/08/12/selfic-cube-7100-car-black-box-recorder/
>
> Is 640x480 good enough?

;) ofcourse we want 1080p ;)


But to be honest, having seen progressing 480p out of a canon in MJPEG,
I'm very happy to watch that ;)


Stefan


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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Postal an idea to extend Walking-Papers to "not connected" people

[David Earl]

On 17/08/2009 13:30, Emilie Laffray wrote:
> 
> 
> 2009/8/17 Iván Sánchez Ortega  >
> 
> Some of us have only black-and-white printers. Is there any
> possibility of
> developing a new B/W map style?? (Less use of colors, more use of dashed
> lines, pattern fills and such)
> 
> 
> +1
> 
> Emilie Laffray

and +1 from me too.

David


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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Postal an idea to extend Walking-Papers to "not connected" people

[Emilie Laffray]

2009/8/17 Iván Sánchez Ortega 

> Some of us have only black-and-white printers. Is there any possibility of
> developing a new B/W map style?? (Less use of colors, more use of dashed
> lines, pattern fills and such)
>

+1

Emilie Laffray
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Postal an idea to extend Walking-Papers to "not connected" people

[Iván Sánchez Ortega]

El Domingo, 16 de Agosto de 2009, Shaun McDonald escribió:
> I'd like the option to be able to use the nonames style, as there is
> often people looking for unnamed streets and POIs.

+1

Some of us have only black-and-white printers. Is there any possibility of 
developing a new B/W map style?? (Less use of colors, more use of dashed 
lines, pattern fills and such)

> An easier way to print off several adjacent maps for a mapping party
> would be useful.

+1

Though, if A3 size or larger maps could be printed, there is client-side 
software capable of splitting that into A4 sheets (KDE has that festure 
built-in since ages ago).

Cheers,
-- 
--
Iván Sánchez Ortega 

Q:  How many Zen masters does it take to screw in a light bulb?
A:  None.  The Universe spins the bulb, and the Zen master stays out
of the way.


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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[John Smith]

--- On Mon, 17/8/09, Erik Johansson  wrote:
> Anyways I was pointed to a camera that records your
> journey.
> http://technabob.com/blog/2009/08/12/selfic-cube-7100-car-black-box-recorder/

Is 640x480 good enough?


  

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Re: [OSM-talk] Video inputs to OpenStreetView

[Erik Johansson]

On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 8:35 PM, OJ W wrote:
> I'm just looking at ways of getting video-camera data into openstreetview
>
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Georeference_video
>
> http://dev.openstreetmap.org/~ojw/StreetPhotos/test3/output.kml
>
> is anyone else working with georeferenced videos for mapping?

I tried but my point and shoot overheated, and the time
stamps/framerate was 10s off in the end.. :-)


Anyways I was pointed to a camera that records your journey.
http://technabob.com/blog/2009/08/12/selfic-cube-7100-car-black-box-recorder/

Available for ~150 euro with shipping.
http://english.gmarket.co.kr/challenge/neo_goods/goods.asp?goodscode=167668112

-- 
/Erik

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Re: [OSM-talk] Using OSM on a handheld GPS

[Morten Kjeldgaard]

> All Garmin etrex, gpsmap, colorado, oregon, etc which are able to
> display normal garmin maps.
> See http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Garmin

... but get a model with a colour display.

-- Morten

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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Alexander Menk]

Hi!

I think that is what Tom hat in mind as well.
Looks like there are some small modifications needed in:

http://svn.openstreetmap.org/sites/rails_port/app/views/user/account.html.erb
http://svn.openstreetmap.org/sites/rails_port/app/views/browse/node.html.erb

and may be in

http://svn.openstreetmap.org/sites/rails_port/app/models/user_preference.rb

Unfortunately I do not have any idea how to set up a test system and so 
on. Anybody who has experience with this?

Alex

Aleksejs Mjaliks wrote:
> Maybe it is possible to show JOSM links for logged in users? And add  
> possibility turn on/off this links in user settings?
>
> I agree with Alexander, JOSM links will be very useful.
>
>
> Aleksejs
>
>
> On 2009.08.17, at 12:56, Tom Hughes wrote:
>
>   
>> On 17/08/09 10:52, Alexander Menk wrote:
>>
>> 
>>> can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to
>>>
>>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?
>>>   
>> We've been over this many times - it is not appropriate to
>> unconditionally add a a link that will not work for most people.
>>
>> 


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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Aleksejs Mjaliks]

Maybe it is possible to show JOSM links for logged in users? And add  
possibility turn on/off this links in user settings?

I agree with Alexander, JOSM links will be very useful.


Aleksejs


On 2009.08.17, at 12:56, Tom Hughes wrote:

> On 17/08/09 10:52, Alexander Menk wrote:
>
>> can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to
>>
>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?
>
> We've been over this many times - it is not appropriate to
> unconditionally add a a link that will not work for most people.
>


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[OSM-talk] Why I love Tagwatch

[Ed Loach]

I wouldn't have found these two ways otherwise:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/35039425
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/35107068
I particularly like the airplane tag on the second way, though it was the boat 
tags ("yes, if you can :D") that helped me locate these two ways.

Ed



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Re: [OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Tom Hughes]

On 17/08/09 10:52, Alexander Menk wrote:

> can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to
>
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?

We've been over this many times - it is not appropriate to 
unconditionally add a a link that will not work for most people.

Tom

-- 
Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu)
http://www.compton.nu/

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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Tobias Knerr]

Hatto von Hatzfeld wrote:
> On http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Approved_features/Path you may count
> how many people approved the proposal but explicitly opposed the
> deprecation of existing tags.

Yes, many participants opposed the deprecation, as did I. However, I
wanted to keep those tags as clearly defined shortcuts for common key
combinations (that is, highway=footway e.g. should be exactly the same
as highway=path + foot=designated), simply to ease transition and save
some typing effort.

Right now, however, people are trying to interpret some additional
meaning into the path vs. *way distinction that originally wasn't there
at all. (Things like paved surface, urban vs. rural, intentionally
maintained etc.) This is definitely *not* what I voted for.

Tobias Knerr


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[OSM-talk] Link for editing via JOSM-remote-control-plugin

[Alexander Menk]

Hi!

can somebody add a link to open JOSM (localhost:8111) to

http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/ ?

Regards,
   Alexander



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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Hatto von Hatzfeld]

Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:

> 2009/8/13 Nop :
>> Proposal #2: Introduce offical dedication
>> Leave old tags as they are and accept that foot/cycleway and designated
>> are as fuzzy as described above. Clarify that these tags only give
>> information on possible use, but not about the legal situation.
>> Introduce a new tag biclyce/foot=official to tag the strict use case of
>> road-signed ways or corresponding legal dedication.
>>
>> This way, nothing needs to be changed in existing fuzzy tagging, but
>> real foot/cycleways are simply tagged by adding an "official" or
>> changing designated to official if appropriate.
> 
> IMHO if this solution is chosen we should also deprecate "designated",
> as it is of no more use, and would just lead to possible problems when
> contradictory to official.

I appreciate Nop's proposal - but why replace "designated" by "official"? I
do not see that "designated" has been used in the past with a meaning
differing from what "official" would be used for in future.

Or did I miss anything in this discussion?

Hatto



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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Hatto von Hatzfeld]

Roy Wallace wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 9:49 PM, Richard
> Mann wrote:
>>
>> The deprecation of footway/cycleway was
>> voted on (by not many people, but nevertheless), and the deprecation was
>> rejected, but some people don't seem to be able to take no for an answer.
> 
> It was? Maybe that was before my time.

On http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Approved_features/Path you may count
how many people approved the proposal but explicitly opposed the
deprecation of existing tags.

Hatto



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[OSM-talk] Selecting cycleways

[Rahkonen Jukka]

I would like to render a map that highlights all the cycleways. Could
the tagging 
specialists on the list check if this query would give me what I want 
and correct if there is something wrong or missing?

WHERE highway=cycleway
OR highway=footway AND 
   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
OR highway=path AND 
   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
OR highway=briddleway AND 
   (bicycle=yes OR bicycle=designated OR bicycle=permissive)
OR highway is not null AND cycleway is not null
#I cannot handle cycleway=opposite_lane or left/right thing in 
#rendering yet so I do not care

Should I add also 'OR bicycle=official'?
(With 'cycleway' I mean something like 'A way that can legally be used
for cycling and that 95% of urban people riding 300-3000 km per year
with a bicycle would say well suitable for riding a 5 km distance to
work wearing jeans and having a briefcase on a rack'). 

-Jukka Rahkonen-

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Re: [OSM-talk] Proliferation of path vs. footway

[Nick Whitelegg]

>>> Whitelegg wrote:
 In the UK I would tag such a path as 
foot=designated;bicycle=permissive;
 and pragmatically highway=footway for the moment, using the
 generally-accepted definition of "footway" as "urban surfaced path"
 (though would prefer highway=path; surface=paved)
>>>
>>> That is not the definition of footway. highway=footway is "For
>>> designated footpaths, i.e. mainly/exclusively for pedestrians."
>>
>> that's the recent wiki recommendation, but I guess footway is far
>> older than this definition from Jan 08. Don't know how many footways
>> have been in the  db till then and how many were added afterwards not
>> corresponding to this definition, but might be lots ;-)


>Sure, but perpetuating deprecated definitions via the mailing list
>without specifically indicating them as such (deprecated) is IMHO
>damaging.

My comment on "footway" meaning "urban surfaced path" was based on many 
recent mailing list discussions which seem to indicate that there was a 
tendency to use "footway" for urban paths and "path" for mud/dirt/rock 
paths in the countryside. Based on that perceived tendency, plus my own 
preferences, that's what I've been doing recently.

Nick


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[OSM-talk] reusing OSM POI information

[Frank O'Dwyer]

Hi,

I've developed an iPhone app / web app for annotating/rating/tagging
locations.

I haven't formalised this yet but the intention is for the data the app
is collecting to be open data - I'm currently intending to use the
opendatacommons database license for the data collection and cc-by-sa
for the entries themselves. I'm not sure exactly which version of
cc-by-sa to use but since 3.0 is the latest I'm thinking of that.

I'm interested in reusing the OSM POI information and incorporating it
into the database. Conversely I'd like to be able to share back with
OSM the data that the app collects, as there is probably a lot of
overlap and perhaps new information for you (e.g. additional GPS fixes
per POI, etc). Other information like rating and tags and unstructured
descriptions you may or may not be interested in but of course that
would be available also.

I know that OSM has had a lot of discussion about switching licenses so
my question is if there is any problem with doing this and if my
proposed license choice would be compatible with yours? Also, if I do
this who should I attribute - the individual OSM contributors (how?) or
OSM or both? I have read the wiki FAQs on this but I thought it would be
better to check.

On the technical side I have got fields in my database per entry for
contributing user, data source (string), and data source identifier
(also a string). The first field references the record for a normal user
of the app and the other fields are intended to reference the original
source of an external POI (normally null as I don't use any external
sources yet). I was thinking of something like creating a user called
'osm' and then using the source and source id fields to reference the
osm username and node id. In this case the entries would be attributed
to OSM. Alternatively I could create dummy user records for external
contributors, which would attribute the entries to individuals. Having
the node ID should also make it easier to match up entries across the
two DBs. Also if necessary, adding to the schema is not too much of a
problem.

Cheers,
Frank



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