Re: [Talk-hr] OSM vs AdriaTOPO 1.00 LITE

2010-05-19 Thread nixa
On 05/19/2010 01:23 PM, hbogner wrote:
 On 05/15/2010 02:12 PM, hbogner wrote:
 Taman sam sinoc pricao sa kokom o kreiranju osm karte za RH, BiH, SLO te
 sam mislio ubaciti i Crnu Goru, te u to sve pokusati ubaciti i slojnice
 tako da bude korisno i planinarima, biciklistima, i ostalim korisnicima
 koji zele podatke o visinama.
 Sad su izdali AdriaTOPO Lite tj besplatnu verziju sa smanjenom kolicinom
 podataka. Moram ovo kreirtati te kasnije usporediti sa ATL.
 Kaj vi kazete na popis drzava koji planiram ubaciti, imate li koji drugi
 prijedlog, ideju, kritiku, komentar ...

 http://www.navigo-sistem.hr/proizvod/539/1

 sinoc je aktivirana skripta koja ce svakodnevno generirati novu kartu
 navedenih drzava te ju sprema ovdje: http://student.geof.hr/osm/
 ima jedan sitan problem, nema neko lako pamtljivo ime, za sad su to samo
 ip domene drzava koje su u karti hr, si, ba, me
 svaki prijedlog oko imena je dobrodosao.
 za sad slojnice nisu ukljucene

jel bi ja te karte mogao koristiti s garminom ili koja je poanta? :)


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Re: [Talk-hr] OSM vs AdriaTOPO 1.00 LITE

2010-05-19 Thread hbogner
On 05/19/2010 01:26 PM, nixa wrote:

 jel bi ja te karte mogao koristiti s garminom ili koja je poanta? :)

poanta je bas u tome da gmapsupp.img mozes koristiti sa garmin 
uredjajima i garmin softverom na mobitelima, samo *-gmapsupp.img moras 
preimenovati samo u gmapsupp-img i spremiti ga u uredjaj preko postojece 
karte, nadam se da nemoram dodatno napominjati da si postojecu kartu sa 
uredjaja kopiras na komp kao backup :D


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Re: [talk-ph] Micro Mapping Party in Ortigas-Mandaluyong on May 22

2010-05-19 Thread Eugene Alvin Villar
Hi Marloue,

Let's set it at Starbucks Metrowalk at 9 am. It would be nice to finally get
to meet you! :-)

Eugene


On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Marloue Pidor mur...@mail2engineer.comwrote:

  Eugene, I will be joining the micro mapping party this saturday, where is
 the meeting point?


 murlwe

 -Original Message-
 From: Eugene Alvin Villar [sea...@gmail.com]
 Sent: 5/18/2010 11:57:31 AM
 To: talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
 Subject: Re: [talk-ph] Micro Mapping Party in Ortigas-Mandaluyong on May
 22
 
 The link to Facebook is obviously wrong. It should be:
 http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=121402554549978
 
 If you have a Facebook account, please RSVP if you can (even a decline
 would be
 useful). :-)
 
 
 The cake slices are also set:
 
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Ortigas-Mandaluyong_Mapping_Party#Cake_slices
 
 
 
 On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:08 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
 Here are two pages:
 
 1. The Facebook event page (RSVP there if you have an account):
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Ortigas-Mandaluyong_Mapping_Party
 
 2. The OSM Wiki announcement page (still under construction):
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Ortigas-Mandaluyong_Mapping_Party
 
 
 
 
 On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 9:34 PM, ianlopez ian_lopez_1...@yahoo.com
 wrote:
 
 
 I've suggested other areas that are close enough but not too far from
 the
 Ortigas area
 
 1. EDSA-Pioneer-Boni Avenue intersection:
 
 http://sautter.com/map/?zoom=17lat=14.57255lon=121.0472layers=0BTF
 There are new developments in the area, specifically in the Pioneer side
 (Robinsons Cybergate, Light Residences, Pioneer Woodlands)
 2. Area between Boni-Pionner intersection and Kapitolyo:
 
 http://sautter.com/map/?zoom=17lat=14.57297lon=121.05339layers=0BTF
 The streets are complete, but it lacks POI's, buildings and landuse.
 
 Maybe one of us should hand out OSM fliers to passers-by [if they're
 interested]
 ( http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:OSM-PH_Flyer_2010-03-19.pdf )
 
 
 Tony Montana: Me, I want what's coming to me.
 Manny Ribera: Oh, well what's coming to you?
 Tony Montana: The world, chico, and everything in it.
 -
 http://ianlopez1115.wordpress.com/
 
 
 --- On Sat, 5/15/10, Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
 From: Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.com
 Subject: [talk-ph] Micro Mapping Party in Ortigas-Mandaluyong on May 22
 To: OSM talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
 Date: Saturday, May 15, 2010, 10:22 AM
 
 
 Hi guys,
 
 I really don't think we could push through with the Corregidor Mapping
 Party.
 Planning was mostly nonexistent and I don't think many people are willing
 to
 spend a large amount of money for the ferry trip and the possible
 overnight stay
 in the hotel on Corregidor. Let's postpone that island for a while.
 
 In the meantime, I suggest we tackle parts of Metro Manila that are still
 incomplete:
 
 
 1. Mandaluyong-Shaw area:
 
 http://sautter.com/map/?zoom=17lat=14.58246lon=121.04721layers=B0TF
 This area of Mandaluyong is still missing a lot of streets because they
 are
 covered by clouds in the Yahoo satellite imagery.
 
 
 2. Ortigas CBD:
 
 http://sautter.com/map/?zoom=17lat=14.58448lon=121.05964layers=B0TF
 In contrast to the Makati CBD, Ortigas is still pretty blank in its
 building
 coverage.
 
 3. Metrowalk-Ortigas Home Depot:
 
 http://sautter.com/map/?zoom=17lat=14.58647lon=121.06578layers=B0TF
 Yahoo's satellite imagery in this area predates the large retail
 construction
 here so it would be nice if we can map this new development.
 
 
 One nice thing about this is that these three areas are near each other
 and
 since this is Ortigas, meeting up would be easier.
 
 And after the on-the-field surveying, let's meet up after and have that
 newbies
 tutorial session that Carlos suggested.
 
 What do you guys think? :-)
 
 Eugene
 
 
 
 -Inline Attachment Follows-
 
 
 
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[talk-ph] Corregidor Mapping Party

2010-05-19 Thread Andre Marcelo-Tanner
Maybe for future planning this, we could solicit donations from inns on 
the island or from Sun Cruises. I think this is the list of places:
(1) Corregidor Inn - by far the best accomodation but the most expensive.
(2) MacArthur's Cafe - near the Lorcha dock on the north side of 
Bottomside. (Bottomside is the area where you landed on the island). 
They have a few cottage style rooms, basic accommodation.
(3) Corregidor Cove Cafe - they have a few cottages on the ocean front 
on the south side of Bottomside. Again basic accommodation.
(4) Sea Calm Inn - located up the hill between Bottomside and 
Middleside. Also known as the 'hostel'. The sign there says P650night. 
(09189442884 or 09185241503)

Maybe offer them to map the place for free, just free stay or stipend, 
and we can show them how to print a new and updated map or how they can 
get the map image and add their own graphics to it to make their own 
'Tourist' Map of the Island that they can sell or make use of

Free mapping, what better value than free mapping? :)

Andre

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Re: [OSM-talk-be] CORINE Land Cover 2000

2010-05-19 Thread Nicolas Pettiaux
2010/5/19 Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org:
 Hi Nicolas and others,

 I spoke to Guido d'Hoker (g...@ngi.be) in IGN/NGI yesterday and all I
 can say is that he was not quite sure about the status of CORINE 2006
 - as far as I can see it is included in
 http://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/data/corine-land-cover-2006-clc2006-100-m-version-12-2009
 but I might not be quite sure what is being meant here.

I'll let you investigate further.

Anyway, with
 regard to licensing issues feel free to contact him directly, he can
 put you in touch with the right people.

have you got a direct telephone number that you could send me
privately ? (otherwise I'll go to the IGN website)

I would like to discuss the availability of some (all ?) of the datas
of IGN under free licences (aka compatible with osm).

Thanks,

Nicolas
 Martijn


 martijn van exel +++ m...@rtijn.org
 laziness - impatience - hubris
 http://schaaltreinen.nl/
 twitter / skype: mvexel
 flickr: rhodes



 On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 10:58 PM, Nicolas Pettiaux nico...@pettiaux.be 
 wrote:
 2010/5/16 Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org:
 BTW, nice work on the overlay. I think it looks super sweet especially on 
 lower zoom levels.
 I will be at IGN this week and try and talk to some people there.

 let us know what comes out : could you ask who we should contact, what
 are the blocking points for ING to release its data as the French and
 British did ?

 THanks,

 Nicolas

 --
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Abppc - « promouvoir les échanges entre professeurs de physique et de
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Re: [OSM-talk-be] CORINE Land Cover 2000

2010-05-19 Thread Lennard
On 19-5-2010 7:01, Martijn van Exel wrote:

 can say is that he was not quite sure about the status of CORINE 2006
 - as far as I can see it is included in
 http://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/data/corine-land-cover-2006-clc2006-100-m-version-12-2009
 but I might not be quite sure what is being meant here.

What you see there is a bitmapped version of CLC 2006, with 100 m 
resolution. There is also a 250 m version there, and bitmapped images of 
the changes going from 2000 to 2006.

The seamless vector data, however, is not available, and that is the 
version we would need.

-- 
Lennard

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Re: [OSM-talk-be] CORINE Land Cover 2000

2010-05-19 Thread Martijn van Exel
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 9:33 AM, Lennard l...@xs4all.nl wrote:
 On 19-5-2010 7:01, Martijn van Exel wrote:

 can say is that he was not quite sure about the status of CORINE 2006
 - as far as I can see it is included in

 http://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-maps/data/corine-land-cover-2006-clc2006-100-m-version-12-2009
 but I might not be quite sure what is being meant here.

 What you see there is a bitmapped version of CLC 2006, with 100 m
 resolution. There is also a 250 m version there, and bitmapped images of the
 changes going from 2000 to 2006.

 The seamless vector data, however, is not available, and that is the version
 we would need.

Oh of course. I did not notice that this was only the raster dataset
provided here.
Martijn

martijn van exel +++ m...@rtijn.org
laziness - impatience - hubris
http://schaaltreinen.nl/
twitter / skype: mvexel
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Re: [OSM-talk] place=isolated_dwelling approved - adding to mapfeatures

2010-05-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi,

M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote:
 Some isolated farms (called stations) are as large as a hamlet. They are
 isolated in terms of tens of kms from their neighbours. Some appear on 
 regular
 maps as if they were towns
 I'm sure that the Argentinians and the Americans have similar farms.
 
 then they should be tagged as place=hamlet, shouldn't they?

Is anything as large as a hamlet really a hamlet?

Bye
Frederik

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Re: [OSM-talk] lazyweb: what linux-based wifi gps phone would you recommend

2010-05-19 Thread Jean-Marc Liotier
jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote:
 
 here is a question from one of my friends,
 *what linux-based wifi gps phone would you recommend?*
 any suggestions?

Most free : Openmoko.
Best market potential : Android
Best compromise : Maemo... Except that Nokia has orphaned Maemo.
Best hope from my point of view is Meego... But there won't be anything 
on the market running it for at least a year.

I would be most happy with a N900 running Maemo if there was not the 
nagging knowledge that it is a dead end. So for now I stick with the 
Android I bought long before the N900 came out - but I'm not quite 
satisfied with it, in part because it does not feel open at all.


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Re: [OSM-talk] place=isolated_dwelling approved - adding to mapfeatures

2010-05-19 Thread Elizabeth Dodd
On Wed, 19 May 2010, you wrote:
  But all isolated farms are isolated_dwellings, no ?
 
  No.
  Some isolated farms (called stations) are as large as a hamlet. They are
  isolated in terms of tens of kms from their neighbours. Some appear on
  regular maps as if they were towns
  I'm sure that the Argentinians and the Americans have similar farms.
 
 then they should be tagged as place=hamlet, shouldn't they?
 
no, they aren't hamlets, or villages. 
places which have a place= in Au have official place names on government 
registers (eg NSW Geographical Names Board)


-- 
Man is the only animal that blushes -- or needs to.
-- Mark Twain

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Re: [OSM-talk] lazyweb: what linux-based wifi gps phone would you recommend

2010-05-19 Thread Markus Lindholm
On 19 May 2010 10:34, Jean-Marc Liotier j...@liotier.org wrote:
 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote:

 here is a question from one of my friends,
 *what linux-based wifi gps phone would you recommend?*
 any suggestions?

 Most free : Openmoko.
 Best market potential : Android
 Best compromise : Maemo... Except that Nokia has orphaned Maemo.
 Best hope from my point of view is Meego... But there won't be anything
 on the market running it for at least a year.

 I would be most happy with a N900 running Maemo if there was not the
 nagging knowledge that it is a dead end. So for now I stick with the
 Android I bought long before the N900 came out - but I'm not quite
 satisfied with it, in part because it does not feel open at all.

As far as I've understood N900 will be able to run MeeGo when it comes.

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[OSM-talk] Historical Mapping Examples?

2010-05-19 Thread Kate Chapman
Hi All,

I'm attending THATCamp this weekend and would like to talk about
OpenStreetMap.  THATCamp is an unconference specifically related to
technology applied to the digital humanities.  One area I thought
would be of interest would be historical related areas in
OpenStreetMap.  I was thinking areas with historic value, rather than
areas that are mapped and no longer exist.

An example near me would be Arlington National Cemetery:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=38.87964lon=-77.06507zoom=16layers=B000FTFT

Anyway if you have an examples along that vein that you think are
particularly good please send them along.

Thanks,

Kate
user:wonderchook

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Re: [OSM-talk] place=isolated_dwelling approved - adding to mapfeatures

2010-05-19 Thread M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org:
 Hi,

 M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote:

 Some isolated farms (called stations) are as large as a hamlet. They are
 isolated in terms of tens of kms from their neighbours. Some appear on
 regular
 maps as if they were towns
 I'm sure that the Argentinians and the Americans have similar farms.

 then they should be tagged as place=hamlet, shouldn't they?

 Is anything as large as a hamlet really a hamlet?


in Germany that would be the definition, given that we're talking
about human settlements and not industrial installations. Large is
about the number of people living there, isn't it?

cheers,
Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-legal-talk] Proposed human readable contributor terms

2010-05-19 Thread andrzej zaborowski
On 19 May 2010 19:14, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason ava...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 16:42, Mike Collinson m...@ayeltd.biz wrote:
 - Don't put in copyrighted data. It should either be your own work or
 something that there is clear permission to use.

 Perhaps just talk about data you don't have permission to submit or
 something like that. Let's not propagate the copyrighted != non-free
 misunderstanding.

(I'm clueless about copyright and law so maybe the following is
completely crazy, but these things have bothered me)

I think this point needs to be decided, it sounds like it's a grey
area now.  Can you submit copyrighted data if you agreed to the new
Contributor Terms, even if it's under a free license?  Since you have
to grant copyright to OSMF, it may be that you can't.

This raises the question if we think that factual data can be
copyrighted or not, and if we want to be consistent in that thinking,
or should we always assume the pessimistic interpretation to be on the
safe side.

If it can be copyrighted, can this have the following consequences?

 * it may be that you can't submit data traced from non-public domain
imagery (such as OS) if you're a new user.
 * it may be that you can't edit existing data in OSM because it's
licensed CC-By-SA, and edits are usually derived from it (there can be
modifications that are not derived, but they don't make much sense).
So maybe the relicensing of existing data should have happened before
new contributors can edit.  (apart from the point that it may be
useless for them to make edits if the whole element later gets removed
if the original contributor doesn't/can't agree to relicense... maybe
there should be a big fat warning)

If data can't be copyrighted, then:

 * asking contributors to relicense is just a courtesy? (they may
still need to grant their database rights but not the copyright, so
then there's no problem with Australian administrative boundaries and
other CC-By-SA sources we used?)

Cheers

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Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-legal-talk] Proposed human readable contributor terms

2010-05-19 Thread Anthony
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 2:14 PM, andrzej zaborowski balr...@gmail.comwrote:

 Can you submit copyrighted data if you agreed to the new
 Contributor Terms, even if it's under a free license?


Obviously only if it's a free license which is compatible with DbCL.  That
probably includes CC0 and not much else.
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Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-legal-talk] Proposed human readable contributor terms

2010-05-19 Thread Mike Collinson
Comments in-line.

At 06:14 PM 19/05/2010, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:

On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 16:42, Mike Collinson m...@ayeltd.biz wrote:
 Great idea, thanks for taking the initiative on this.  I had a go with your
 text and the underlying ideas we used to construct the terms below.

Great, any idea about what timeframe we might be looking at for
rollout of it on the signup form?

I will dodge that question until we have had legal review on a draft that 
everyone is reasonably happy with but I promise to push it forward.


 Summary of OpenStreetMap Contributor Terms:
 -

There's a lot I like about it, including that it's using bullet
points. Those are easier to wade through. And easier to translate.

 - Don't put in copyrighted data. It should either be your own work or
 something that there is clear permission to use.

Perhaps just talk about data you don't have permission to submit or
something like that. Let's not propagate the copyrighted != non-free
misunderstanding.

Good point. I've changed 
http://www.osmfoundation.org/wiki/License/Contributor_Terms_Summary


 - You still own the bits of data you put in, i.e. you can still use them in
 other places.

 - You allow the OpenStreetMap Foundation to publish your bits of data as
 part of the OpenStreetMap geodata database for others to use.

 - The OpenStreetMap Foundation can only publish the data under a free and
 open license. If it fails in that, it has broken a contract with you.

Actually, aside from these terms is free and open license defined
anywhere as the OSMF is using it? Some define it as licenses approved
be the OSI + FSF, but that's obviously not true in our case.

It is deliberately not defined. The reasoning is that it is clear when a 
license is NOT free and open (which is what we really, really want to avoid), 
but we will all have ideas about what IS a free and open license. That will 
promote healthy debate and will change over time. It is up to future 
generations of mappers, not us here and now ... and certainly not by that 
dd License Working Group.


 - Until the proposed change-over, that license is the CC BY SA 2.0.  When
 enough existing contributors agree to re-license their data, that license
 will change to Open Database License 1.0.

 - The OpenStreetMap Foundation can only pick a new free license if it's
 approved by the OSMF membership (a foundation of paid-up members) and a 2/3
 majority vote of active contributors. You'll be considered an active
 contributor if you've edited in at least 3 out of the last 12 months and
 don't take longer than 3 weeks to reply to E-Mail.

 - If you want attribution you should add your name to the Contributors page.

 - To the maximum extent possible, neither you nor the OpenStreetMap
 Foundation are responsible for anything that might happen to folks using
 your data.

FWIW I left this bit out, I don't see whe warranty footnotes need to
be in the summary, but perhaps the legally inclined disagree.

Not critical, but I think it is worth reassuring new contributors that the 
language protects them rather than the reverse.


 This is only a summary and is not legally binding. The full text can be
 found at http://www.osmfoundation.org/wiki/License/Contributor_Terms


Mike
License Working Group



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Re: [OSM-talk] place=isolated_dwelling approved - adding to mapfeatures

2010-05-19 Thread Aun Johnsen
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 9:11 AM, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote:
 2010/5/19 Elizabeth Dodd ed...@billiau.net:
 On Wed, 19 May 2010, you wrote:
  But all isolated farms are isolated_dwellings, no ?
 
  No.
  Some isolated farms (called stations) are as large as a hamlet. They are
  isolated in terms of tens of kms from their neighbours. Some appear on
  regular maps as if they were towns
  I'm sure that the Argentinians and the Americans have similar farms.

 then they should be tagged as place=hamlet, shouldn't they?

 no, they aren't hamlets, or villages.
 places which have a place= in Au have official place names on government
 registers (eg NSW Geographical Names Board)


 And the smaller ones don't? In Germany all human settlements
 (excluding the ones that are not official i.e. illegal) are in some
 government register, be it hamlets or smaller.

 I guess you would generally have to adopt the criteria for places in
 AU, we did this in Germany and Italy as well. e.g. 999 inhabitants is
 far too big for a hamlet in Europe. Towns we are not classifying by
 population (on the lower end) but by their status. I guess in AU
 with it's scarse settlement structure it is necessary to display
 hamlets also on lower zoom levels in the rendering than we can do in
 Europe, ...

How to tag Norwegian named farms making part of a grend which I
would have tagged as hamlet? They are not isolated dwellings as they
are not isolated, just parts of the larger unit.

How to tag Brazillian Fazendas, they are farms that can consits of as
many as 20 buildings, with living barracks for season workers and
factory like buildings for pre-processing of their harvests.

How to tag Brazillian Sitios, they are small farms or groups of
houses, usually very isolated.

For the first I would use place=farm on the named farms, making them
part of place=hamlet

The second I would call place=farm, they are not hamlets as often only
one familly live there permanently, though there can be more than 100
workers in the harvest seasons

The third I could call place=isolated_dwelling, though place=locality
have fallen for me as completely natural.

A[]

 cheers,
 Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

2010-05-19 Thread pavithran
On 15 May 2010 13:59, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote:
 Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:
 Adobe has explicitly said in the past that they can't open source it
 because they've used a lot of parts in in that they've licensed from
 somewhere else.

 http://www.adobe.com/de/products/eula/third_party/flashplayer/

 Pretty much all the all rights reserved stuff is codecs. Like I say,
 video is moving to HTML5 anyway and shouldn't distract from the wider
 Flash Player.

On a related note Google,Mozilla and Opera have joined to announce[1]
a new open video format called webm [2].
It’s licensed using a BSD-style license. “WebM and the codecs it
supports (VP8 video and Vorbis audio) require no royalty payments of
any kind.

Chromium, Firefox, and Opera builds are available today[3]. Chrome
builds will shortly follow. No statement yet from Microsoft or Apple
regarding support in their platforms.
1.http://webmproject.blogspot.com/2010/05/introducing-webm-open-web-media-project.html
2. http://www.webmproject.org/about/
3. http://www.webmproject.org/users/

Regards,
Pavithran
-- 
pavithran sakamuri
http://look-pavi.blogspot.com

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Re: [OSM-talk] place=isolated_dwelling approved - adding to mapfeatures

2010-05-19 Thread John Smith
On 19 May 2010 22:11, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote:
 I guess you would generally have to adopt the criteria for places in
 AU, we did this in Germany and Italy as well. e.g. 999 inhabitants is
 far too big for a hamlet in Europe. Towns we are not classifying by
 population (on the lower end) but by their status. I guess in AU

We do something similar, some remote towns have been classified as
cities to make them render sooner not due to populations, but due to
importance to the regional importance to areas, although some of these
places call themselves cities, but that's more ego than anything. I
was at one point going to suggest place=regional_centre instead of
using place=city but that was more or less when I started and never
got back to it.

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[OSM-talk] SotM 2010 schedule published - looks great.

2010-05-19 Thread Richard Weait
I know that you have been waiting to see the schedule for State of the
Map 2010. And now I know that you will love it.  The SotM team has
done a spectacular job of soliciting and acquiring a great line-up of
speakers and topics.  You will want to buy your ticket and book your
trip now.  http://stateofthemap.org/register-now/

Day One: Business and Workshop Day
Friday http://stateofthemap.org/schedules/friday/

Day Two: Community, Tech, Quality and Scholarship Tracks
Saturday http://stateofthemap.org/schedules/saturday/

Day Three: Tools, Imports, Humanitarian and Cartography Tracks
Sunday http://stateofthemap.org/schedules/sunday

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Re: [OSM-talk] Historical Mapping Examples?

2010-05-19 Thread Rob Warren

Hi Kate.

I run the Muninn Project (http://blog.muninn-project.org/) which extracts 
data from First World War scanned archives. I've been lurking on the 
mailing list for a while now to get some background before asking 
about this very topic, but you beat me to it.

Would anyone be interested in creating Open Trench Map - 1918 Edition?

Historical mapping has some problems that are a bit different from 
conventional mapping in that 1) everything is a timestamp and 2) research 
people care very much about the data being 'wrong'.

So, besides the fact that trenches keep getting moved, bombed, renamed 
and worked on as the front moves back and forth, the maps also reflect what 
people *think* is happening on the other side.

So we get a German map of British trenches, a Canadian map of German 
trenches and the differences between what is happening and what people 
think is happening are of great historical value.

Unsuprisingly, sometimes different maps from the same army at the same 
time don't match up.

We have a lot of geo data that can be used to track individual soldiers on 
the map over the course of the war too, down to which trenches they were 
in.

I spend most of my time on data extraction, but I think historical mapping 
is something that needs to be worked on. I'd be interested in setting up 
an informal working group or exchange, please feel free to write me off or 
on-list.

best,
rhw

 Message: 5
 Date: Wed, 19 May 2010 07:41:06 -0400
 From: Kate Chapman k...@maploser.com
 Subject: [OSM-talk] Historical Mapping Examples?
 To: osm talk@openstreetmap.org
 Message-ID:
   aanlktimhbq1xypqkrwe8gb1cr6g1poo4a7aksvprf...@mail.gmail.com
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

 Hi All,

 I'm attending THATCamp this weekend and would like to talk about
 OpenStreetMap.  THATCamp is an unconference specifically related to
 technology applied to the digital humanities.  One area I thought
 would be of interest would be historical related areas in
 OpenStreetMap.  I was thinking areas with historic value, rather than
 areas that are mapped and no longer exist.

 An example near me would be Arlington National Cemetery:
 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=38.87964lon=-77.06507zoom=16layers=B000FTFT

 Anyway if you have an examples along that vein that you think are
 particularly good please send them along.

 Thanks,

 Kate
 user:wonderchook

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Re: [OSM-talk] Historical Mapping Examples?

2010-05-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 May 2010 08:02, Rob Warren war...@muninn-project.org wrote:
 Historical mapping has some problems that are a bit different from
 conventional mapping in that 1) everything is a timestamp and 2) research
 people care very much about the data being 'wrong'.

While it would be nice for the OSM APIs to natively support
downloading data based on time frames, you could do something similar
with JOSM by slightly extending it's current filtering options to
include the ability to filter based on a time frame, in the mean time
the tags you are looking for is:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:start_date
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:end_date

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Re: [OSM-talk] Historical Mapping Examples?

2010-05-19 Thread Richard Welty
i have mapped some trails through the antietam national battlefield,

http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=39.47959lon=-77.73945zoom=15layers=B000FTF

the upper trail is the Cornfield Trail, and the bottom edge is the 
Bloody Lane Trail.

and here, further south, is the Union Advance Trail:

http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=39.45295lon=-77.73383zoom=16layers=B000FTF

the work isn't complete, but i wasn't there long enough to cover them 
all, plus
the 13 year old and her mother were somewhat intolerant of my goal to 
hike and
map all the trails.

i've also experimented with mapping defunct race tracks, for example
the old Pine Bowl Speedway south of Troy, NY was located here:

http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=42.66732lon=-73.60079zoom=16layers=0B00FTF

mapnik doesn't render it by default, but osmarender does. someday i'll 
do something
with mapping the various courses that served the Watkins Glen Grand Prix 
starting
in 1948

richard


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[OSM-talk] closedstreetmap.org

2010-05-19 Thread SteveC
If anyone wants the above domain name, let me know as it expires in a month.

Yours c.

Steve


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Re: [OSM-talk] closedstreetmap.org

2010-05-19 Thread Stefan de Konink
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Op 20-05-10 02:04, SteveC schreef:
 If anyone wants the above domain name, let me know as it expires in a month.

I'll forward it to my accountmanager at TeleAtlas.


Stefan
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Version: GnuPG v2.0.15 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

iEYEAREKAAYFAkv0iCcACgkQYH1+F2Rqwn0ILQCfQ85da363rVx6Lc3sNSlFhIXM
LZEAoITLjgiRVdHg9YxXgsuHt24Kdinx
=TBWQ
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[OSM-talk] volcano craters in auckland - possibly out of copyright map

2010-05-19 Thread Robin Paulson
i found a map on wikipedia from 1859, which i would assume makes it
out of copyright and thus far game for copying data into osm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:AucklandMapHochstetter1859.JPG

if so, what would be the best way to view it as an underlay, for
adding volcanoes to the map database?

cheers

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[OSM-talk-nl] Correctiewerk gerelateerd aan 3dshapes

2010-05-19 Thread steggink
Hoi,

Ik zag zojuist dat user ijsb diverse correctiewerkzaamheden uitvoert  
[1], door o.a. paden e.d. van landuse vlakken (3dshapes import) los te  
trekken. Deze werden door anderen incorrect ingebracht. Zie bijv. [2].

Natuurlijk is het goed werk wat ijsb levert (voor zover ik heb  
gezien), maar het baart me wel zorgen dat de import van 3dshapes deze  
inspanning veroorzaakt. Het is blijkbaar te makkelijk om data fout  
in te brengen. Vooral nieuwere / onervaren gebruikers zijn hieraan  
debet, wat natuurlijk wel te begrijpen is.

Een oplossing hiervoor is niet 1-2-3 te geven. Ik zou het in ieder  
geval niet weten. Zou het niet een idee zijn om met RichardF te  
babbelen om een soort lagenstructuur aan Potlatch toe te voegen, zodat  
bijv. wegen en landuse data onafhankelijk van elkaar bewerkt kunnen  
worden? Als beide lagen aangevinkt worden, kunnen ze tegelijk  
bewerkt worden, en kunnen ook nodes, e.d. hergebruikt worden.

Ik zal ijsb zelf eens vragen hoe hij hierover denkt. Ook kan een  
bedankje er zeker wel van af :)

Groeten,

Frank

[1] http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/ijsb/edits
[2] http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/58924255/history

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Re: [OSM-talk-nl] Correctiewerk gerelateerd aan 3dshapes

2010-05-19 Thread Ben Laenen
stegg...@steggink.org wrote:
 Ik zag zojuist dat user ijsb diverse correctiewerkzaamheden uitvoert
 [1], door o.a. paden e.d. van landuse vlakken (3dshapes import) los te
 trekken. Deze werden door anderen incorrect ingebracht. Zie bijv. [2].
 
 [...]

 Een oplossing hiervoor is niet 1-2-3 te geven. Ik zou het in ieder
 geval niet weten. Zou het niet een idee zijn om met RichardF te
 babbelen om een soort lagenstructuur aan Potlatch toe te voegen, zodat
 bijv. wegen en landuse data onafhankelijk van elkaar bewerkt kunnen
 worden? Als beide lagen aangevinkt worden, kunnen ze tegelijk
 bewerkt worden, en kunnen ook nodes, e.d. hergebruikt worden.

Iets wat ik mis in Potlatch is zoiets als wat de ctrl toets doet in JOSM: 
ervoor zorgen dat punten die je toevoegt nergens aan worden vastgehangen. Voor 
zover ik weet bestaat dit niet in Potlatch en is vaak de enige manier om dat 
op te lossen om de weg eerst ergens anders te leggen en dan te verplaatsen 
naar waar ze moet komen...

Ben

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Re: [OSM-talk-nl] auteursrechten op wegenkaarten - gerechtelijke uitspraak

2010-05-19 Thread Co Drost | GISwerk
Beste,

  Leuke discussie maar ik begrijp eigenlijk niet zo goed waar het over gaat,
anders dan excuses zoeken voor het al dan niet overnemen van gegevens uit
auteursrechtelijk beschermde bronnen. 

  Als ik een engels boek vertaal in het nederlands en afdruk in een ander
lettertype mag dat?

  Als ik een fiets van een ander pak (of die wel of niet op slot staat) en
deze blauw met geel en roze verf mag iedereen er dan mee fietsen? Een fiets
is een fiets en niet als zodanig beschermd. En blauw met geel en roze vindt
ik beste creatief.

  Producten zoals de Top10NL worden uitsluiten onder gebruiksrecht ter
beschikking gesteld met duidelijke restricties ten aanzien van het gebruik.
Het vervormen, in een andere kleur weergeven en verspreiden, past niet
tenzij je daar nadrukkelijk toestemming voor hebt, zoals ook voor de onroute
Fiets en wandelkaarten daar ook netjes afspraken over heeft gemaakt met het
Kadaster. Daarnaast vindt ik het ook niet ethisch hoe je de tekst ook leest.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Co 


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Re: [OSM-talk-nl] auteursrechten op wegenkaarten - gerechtelijke uitspraak

2010-05-19 Thread Andre Engels
2010/5/19 Co Drost | GISwerk cdr...@giswerk.nl:

  Leuke discussie maar ik begrijp eigenlijk niet zo goed waar het over gaat,
 anders dan excuses zoeken voor het al dan niet overnemen van gegevens uit
 auteursrechtelijk beschermde bronnen.

  Als ik een engels boek vertaal in het nederlands en afdruk in een ander
 lettertype mag dat?

Nee. Maar als het bewuste boek een biografie is, mag je gerust een
fiks aantal feiten uit het boek nemen om zelf een ingekorte
beschrijving van het leven van dezelfde persoon te geven.


-- 
André Engels, andreeng...@gmail.com

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Re: [OSM-talk-nl] auteursrechten op wegenkaarten - gerechtelijke uitspraak

2010-05-19 Thread Stefan de Konink
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA512

Op 19-05-10 13:15, Co Drost | GISwerk schreef:
   Leuke discussie maar ik begrijp eigenlijk niet zo goed waar het over gaat,
 anders dan excuses zoeken voor het al dan niet overnemen van gegevens uit
 auteursrechtelijk beschermde bronnen. 

Leuk dat je, je eigen branche wilt beschermen. Gezien dat de rechter een
uitspraak doet over de niet auteursrechtelijke staat van feitelijke
data, (tegen over een creatief werk), is er geen recht op exclusieve
publicatie.


   Als ik een engels boek vertaal in het nederlands en afdruk in een ander
 lettertype mag dat?

Je maakt een afgeleid werk van een creatief werk. Daar zitten
auteursrechten op. Lees de uitspraak en je zult zien dat de rechter geen
creativiteit toeschrijft aan feitelijke data. Wel aan cartografie.


   Als ik een fiets van een ander pak (of die wel of niet op slot staat) en
 deze blauw met geel en roze verf mag iedereen er dan mee fietsen? Een fiets
 is een fiets en niet als zodanig beschermd. En blauw met geel en roze vindt
 ik beste creatief.

http://www.shirtshop.nl/stock/shop/large/832.png


   Producten zoals de Top10NL worden uitsluiten onder gebruiksrecht ter
 beschikking gesteld met duidelijke restricties ten aanzien van het gebruik.
 Het vervormen, in een andere kleur weergeven en verspreiden, past niet
 tenzij je daar nadrukkelijk toestemming voor hebt, zoals ook voor de onroute
 Fiets en wandelkaarten daar ook netjes afspraken over heeft gemaakt met het
 Kadaster. Daarnaast vindt ik het ook niet ethisch hoe je de tekst ook leest.

Grappig, laatst heb ik het daar dus over gehad met het Kadaster. En die
doen helemaal niet zo moeilijk over hergebruik. Waarschijnlijk omdat zij
ook wel begrijpen dat als een tweede LIDAR vliegtuigje over Nederland
heen gaat dat er dan dezelfde data uitkomt.


Stefan
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Re: [talk-au] General Observations.

2010-05-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 May 2010 11:01, Brendan Morley morb@beagle.com.au wrote:
 Brisbane regularly have the street type abbreviated (ST, RD, MWY, ART) and I
 think it is better to record the in the field name as such. Even with
 accurate capitalisation.

 Think tourists who aren't familiar with the way we do things around here.

You are confusing use with recording, if you record the actual street
type, software can then convert both the searches and the output to
show what people expect, some street types have multiple abbreviations
and would be even more difficult to search.

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Re: [talk-au] General Observations.

2010-05-19 Thread Ross Scanlon
On Thu, 20 May 2010 11:01:43 +1000
Brendan Morley morb@beagle.com.au wrote:

 On Sun, 9 May 2010 18:59:25 +1000, Ross Scanlon wrote:
 
 7.  Abbreviations
 
 -  Abbreviations in street names are a no no.  Read the wiki page at 
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:name,  DONT do it.  At the moment in 
 the Bunbury 
 area alone there are 380+ abreviated street names (according to josm 
 validator).
 
 I actually would like to discuss this a bit further.  Street signs in 
 Brisbane regularly have the street type abbreviated (ST, RD, MWY, ART) and I 
 think it is better to 
 record the in the field name as such.  Even with accurate capitalisation.

Not just in Brisbane most of Australia has street signs this way.
 
 Think tourists who aren't familiar with the way we do things around here.

I has nothing to do with usage it has everything to do with storage in the 
database.

If we tell a tourist to go to Alpha Street they can then enter into a search 
engine Aplha Street or Alpha St or Alpha Str and the search engine can then 
search appropriately.

If the info in the database is Alpha St then what's to say the it is not Alpha 
Saint or Alpha Strip or Alpha Street and so you end up with lot's of extraneous 
results.

By entering the full type of street, road, etc it's then just a matter of 
having an appropriate abbreviation look up table to convert from before 
searching going the other way is more difficult.  So entering Alpha Street will 
return the correct info but likewise so will Alpha St.




-- 
Cheers
Ross

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Re: [talk-au] General Observations.

2010-05-19 Thread Andrew Gregory
On Thu, 20 May 2010 09:59:21 +0800, Ben Last ben.l...@nearmap.com wrote:

 Street types are covered by AS4590, Interchange of client information,
 Australia Post Address Presentation Standard.

 See also:
 http://meteor.aihw.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/270020/meteorItemView/long

I've added all the street name abbreviations I know to the list at:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Name_finder:Abbreviations#English

I think it's important that what is stored in the database must be as  
unambiguous as possible. That means I totally agree with the no  
abbreviations policy. It also means there's a couple of St . that I  
need to go back and fix to Saint ..

-- 
Andrew Gregory mailto:and...@scss.com.au
http://www.scss.com.au/family/andrew/

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Re: [talk-au] General Observations.

2010-05-19 Thread Roy Wallace
On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 11:46 AM, Brendan Morley morb@beagle.com.au wrote:

 Yes, I would be *recording* what I *saw* in the field.

FWIW, I think Brendan's got a good point. It comes down to what's
verifiable. I disagree with Ross that an abbreviation mapping can only
work one way. It is possible to search for a Street and find a St just
as it is possible to search for a St and find a Street.

However, I don't think it's worth trying to change the convention at
this point. Spell Street in full, even if you only see St - only
because it's a convention that would be hard to change.

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Re: [talk-au] General Observations.

2010-05-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 May 2010 12:12, Andrew Gregory and...@scss.com.au wrote:
 abbreviations policy. It also means there's a couple of St . that I
 need to go back and fix to Saint ..

Saint can be either St or Saint, eg St George shouldn't be expanded.

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Invalid_Abbreviation_Expansion

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Re: [Talk-de] mehrere Relationen gleichzeitig darstellen

2010-05-19 Thread Andre Joost
Am 18.05.10 23:20, schrieb Lothar Emmerich:
 Eine Frage:

 Ist es möglich, mehrere Wanderwege (Relatioenen) einer Region gleichzeitig 
 darzustellen?
 Mit der Syntax  http://www.openstreetmap.org/?relation=xxx  können Relationen 
 wunderbar
 gezeigt werden. Möchte aber in einer Region versch. Wanderwege aufzeigen.


Mit openlayers sollte das wohl möglich sein.

Wenn es auch offline sein darf:
gpx-file der Relationen mit josm oder dem Relation Analyzer erzeugen 
(wenn letzterer denn wieder laufen sollte), und in
QLandkarteGT, viking oder Quantum GIS darstellen.

Gruß,
André Joost



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Re: [Talk-de] source:maxspeed=DE:urban

2010-05-19 Thread Karl Eichwalder
Rainer Kluge rklug...@web.de writes:

 Der Vorteil liegt darin, dass man nichts ändern muss, wenn der Gesetztgeber 
 mal
 auf die Idee kommt die Höchstgeschwindigkeit in geschlossenen Ortschaften zu
 verändern oder für verschiedene Fahrzeugkategorien unterschiedlich
 festzulegen.

Theoretisch vielleicht, praktisch wirst du alle stellen kontrollieren
müssen, da in einzelfällen bestimmt eine abweichende geschwindigkeit
angeordnet werden wird (wie es ja auch jetzt bereits innerorts straßen
gibt, auf denen 60, 70 oder mehr erlaubt ist).

 Dass das nicht ganz abwegig ist, zeigt ein Blick auf andere Länder, wo die
 Höchstgeschwindigkeit innerorts in der Vergangenheit von 60 auf 50 herunter
 gesetzt wurde.

Ja, aber das hat nichts mit unserem tagging zu tun.

 Bei maxspeed=50 müssten in diesem Fall alle Elemente mit diesem Tag überprüft
 und ggf. angepasst werden. Nur dort, wo das Straßenstück in einer geschlossen
 Ortschaft liegt, dürfte geändert werden. Solange es nicht möglich ist, Straßen
 als in geschlossener Ortschaft zu taggen, halte ich das DE:urban für die
 sinnvollere, weil zukunftsträchtigere Lösung.

Das ist keinen deut besser, nur kryptischer.  Halt eins dieser typischen
indirection layers, die immer möglich sind, aber einem letztlich nur das
leben schwer machen.

-- 
Karl Eichwalder

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Re: [Talk-de] OSM städtisch ausgelegt. Land braucht den cyclefootway

2010-05-19 Thread Karl Eichwalder
Florian Lohoff f...@zz.de writes:

 Ich wohne auch auf dem Land - bei mir ist das alles cycleway - Ein
 cycleway=track ist straßenbegleitend und wird auf dem way der straße
 angelegt. Ein highway=cycleway ist ja immer ein eigenstaendiges objekt
 von daher ist der terminus des Straßenbegleitend da sicherlich
 uebertrieben und/oder falsch.

 Ein path ist wirklich ein Pfad - d.h. nichts befestigtes in meinen
 augen. D.h. wenn jden tag 30 Schulkinder auf dem selben weg durch
 den Wald stapfen dann ist das nach 3 Monate ein Path. Zum foot oder
 cycleway wirds erst dann wenn jemand das ggfs ausschildert oder
 befestigt.

+1, so isses.

-- 
Karl Eichwalder

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Re: [Talk-de] JOSM: Trackname in der Zeichenfläch e ermitteln

2010-05-19 Thread dieter jasper
Am 19.05.2010 07:12, schrieb Jan Tappenbeck:
 Moin !

 weiß einer von Euch ob man irgendwie den Namen einer GPX-Datei in der
 Zeichenfläche abfragen kann ?

 Gruß Jan :-)

zumindest gibt es die Möglichkeit, einer GPX-Datei eine Farbe zuzuordnen.
Im Fenster Layers Rechtsklick auf die GPX-Datei und dann  Rechtsklick 
auf 'Customize Color'. Farbe aus Farbpalette auswählen.

Gruß
Dieter Jasper


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Re: [Talk-de] Segelfluggellände

2010-05-19 Thread Friedhelm Schmidt
Am 19.05.2010 02:00, schrieb Ulf Möller:
 access=glider wäre denkbar, aber ein eigenes Tag für Segelfluggelände
 wäre wohl besser...


+1

-fri-

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Re: [Talk-de] Häuser einzeichnen?

2010-05-19 Thread hike39
Am 13.05.2010 13:33, schrieb Lothar Beck:

 Am 13.05.2010 00:43, schrieb Daniela Duerbeck:
 Ich hab mich nun auch ein wenig daran versucht, allerdings mit
 bescheidenem Erfolg. Wenn ich in Josm eine Area importiere
 und mir das
 Satellitenbild dazu herunterlade, ist alles total verzerrt.
 Wenn ich
 jetzt die Häuser so schief nachzeichne, wie ich sie sehe, sind sie
 hinterher immer noch schief, wenn auch weniger. Was mache
 ich falsch
 und wie kriegen andere Leute 90°-Winkel hin?

 Viele Grüße von Dani


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 Satelliten-/Luftbilder darfst Du nicht als senkrechte
 Draufsicht über dem jeweiligen Objekt ansehen. Da besteht
 fast immer eine mehr oder weniger große Verzerrung in einer
 oder mehrere Richtungen. Ohne ein wenig über den Daumen zu
 peilen, geht es nicht.

 Grüße

 René

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 Hallo Alle,

 Ich war der Meinung wenn ich DOP Fotos habe, siehe auch:
 http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthofoto so sind diese verzerrungsfrei. Solche
 stellt z.Bsp.das http://www.geodatenzentrum.de bereit, mit dem ich schon
 gute Erfahrungen gemacht habe. Auch der Deutschland/Bayernviewer
 http://deutschlandviewer.bayern.de enthält u.A. DOP Fotos.

 Leider kann man diese meines Wissens nach nicht speichern, aber zumindest
 kann man sich eine Kopie des Bildchirmes machen und sich dann mit dem JOSM
 Plugin Piclayer zur Kontrolle die Unterschiede zur OSM Karte ansehen.

 Ob man die zum Abzeichnen verwenden darf ist eine andere Frage, die hier in
 der List auch schon diskutiert wurde.

 Gruss Loth

Hallo
auch ich bin gerade dabei Häuserumrisse zu erfassen. Dazu habe ich als 
Quelle selbstgemachte Luftbilder, die ich per Piclayer als eigene Ebene 
in JOSM einbringe. Nur beim Drehen der Bilder verzerrt auch Piclayer. 
Das heisst überall schlägt McMurphy zu. Im Prinzip kann man nur mit 
TryError oder auch der transparenten Karte von
http://sauter.com/map/
sich der Realität nähern.
Was toll wäre, wäre eine Möglichkeit ein Gebäude von zwei, drei 
verschiedenen Seiten zu fotografieren und dann über eine Anwendung den 
wahrscheinlichsten Grundriß errechnen zu lassen. Aber da habe ich noch 
nichts gefunden.

Gruß Horst


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Re: [Talk-de] Häuser einzeichnen?

2010-05-19 Thread André Riedel
Am 19. Mai 2010 09:29 schrieb hike39 ho...@hike.de:
 Hallo
 auch ich bin gerade dabei Häuserumrisse zu erfassen. Dazu habe ich als
 Quelle selbstgemachte Luftbilder, die ich per Piclayer als eigene Ebene
 in JOSM einbringe. Nur beim Drehen der Bilder verzerrt auch Piclayer.
 Das heisst überall schlägt McMurphy zu. Im Prinzip kann man nur mit
 TryError oder auch der transparenten Karte von
 http://sauter.com/map/
 sich der Realität nähern.
 Was toll wäre, wäre eine Möglichkeit ein Gebäude von zwei, drei
 verschiedenen Seiten zu fotografieren und dann über eine Anwendung den
 wahrscheinlichsten Grundriß errechnen zu lassen. Aber da habe ich noch
 nichts gefunden.

Hallo Horst,

für dein Problem eignet sich die Webseite:
http://warper.geothings.net/

Dort kannst du die Luftbilder entzerren und als WMS in JOSM einbinden.

Ciao André

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[Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellplätze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread Martin Mainzer
Hallo,

ich habe mich in den letzten Wochen mit den Wohnmobil-Stellplätzen in
OSM (tourism=caravan_site) beschäftigt. Um diese Daten für Leute die mit
Wohnmobilien unterwegs sind, nutzbar zu machen habe ich POI-Dateien für
Navis und eine OpenLayer Karte für Europa mit den Stellplätzen erstellt
(beides auf meiner User-Site:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Marmai).
Bei der Arbeit mit den Daten ist mir aufgefallen, dass zwar schon eine
Menge an Wohnmobilstellplätzen in Deutschland verzeichnet ist (560,
Europa 1447), aber kaum weitergehende Informationen eingetragen sind.
Ich denke, dass es insbesondere interessant wäre zu wissen, ob die
Stellplätze kostenlos oder kostenpflichtig sind (fee=*) und ob
Stromanschlüsse vorhanden sind (power_supply=*). Vielleicht können diese
Informationen noch an der einen oder anderen Stelle ergänzt werden, und
dadurch der Wert von OSM-Daten für Wohnmobil-Reisende deutlich erhöht
werden.

Viele Grüße,
Martin

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Re: [Talk-de] Segelfluggellände

2010-05-19 Thread Friedhelm Schmidt
Am 19.05.2010 09:19, schrieb Friedhelm Schmidt:
 Am 19.05.2010 02:00, schrieb Ulf Möller:
   access=glider wäre denkbar, aber ein eigenes Tag für Segelfluggelände
   wäre wohl besser...
 
 +1

Als Tag würde ich

aeroway = glider_airfield

für das Gelände und

aeroway = airstrip

für das Start/Landefeld vorschlagen.

Dann kann man sich noch Gedanken über die Startarten (Windenstart, F-Schlepp, 
...) machen.


-fri-

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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellplätze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread Jan Tappenbeck
Am 19.05.2010 09:50, schrieb Martin Mainzer:
 Hallo,

 ich habe mich in den letzten Wochen mit den Wohnmobil-Stellplätzen in
 OSM (tourism=caravan_site) beschäftigt. Um diese Daten für Leute die mit
 Wohnmobilien unterwegs sind, nutzbar zu machen habe ich POI-Dateien für
 Navis und eine OpenLayer Karte für Europa mit den Stellplätzen erstellt
 (beides auf meiner User-Site:
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Marmai).
 Bei der Arbeit mit den Daten ist mir aufgefallen, dass zwar schon eine
 Menge an Wohnmobilstellplätzen in Deutschland verzeichnet ist (560,
 Europa 1447), aber kaum weitergehende Informationen eingetragen sind.
 Ich denke, dass es insbesondere interessant wäre zu wissen, ob die
 Stellplätze kostenlos oder kostenpflichtig sind (fee=*) und ob
 Stromanschlüsse vorhanden sind (power_supply=*). Vielleicht können diese
 Informationen noch an der einen oder anderen Stelle ergänzt werden, und
 dadurch der Wert von OSM-Daten für Wohnmobil-Reisende deutlich erhöht
 werden.

 Viele Grüße,
 Martin

Hi !

am besten Du erstellt ein Ticket [1] dafür und legst gleich ein Present 
[2] bei.

Gruß Jan :-)



[1] http://josm.openstreetmap.de/newticket

[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Anpassen_der_Vorlagen_von_JOSM


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Re: [Talk-de] OSM städtisch ausgelegt. Land brauch t den cyclefootway

2010-05-19 Thread Martin Simon
Am 19. Mai 2010 08:35 schrieb Karl Eichwalder k...@gnu.franken.de:
 +1, so isses.

-1, das ist falsch und das weißt auch du.

Noch einmal: wenn du es nicht magst, benutze es nicht, sondern das
alternative foot/cycle/bridleway-Schema - aber hör auf, hier das tag
zu verbiegen.

Danke.

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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellplätze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread Stefan Dettenhofer (StefanDausR)
Hallo Martin,

Martin Mainzer schrieb:
 Bei der Arbeit mit den Daten ist mir aufgefallen, dass zwar schon eine
 Menge an Wohnmobilstellplätzen in Deutschland verzeichnet ist (560,
 Europa 1447), aber kaum weitergehende Informationen eingetragen sind.
 Ich denke, dass es insbesondere interessant wäre zu wissen, ob die
 Stellplätze kostenlos oder kostenpflichtig sind (fee=*) und ob
 Stromanschlüsse vorhanden sind (power_supply=*). 
Hier
http://www.womo-sp.org/
gibt es ausführliche Listen von WoMo-Stellplätzen. Vielleicht könnte man 
ja mal nachfragen, ob man diese Infos in OSM integrieren dürfte.

Gruß,
Stefan


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[Talk-de] Datenspende Haltestellen Osnabrück

2010-05-19 Thread Lulu-Ann
Hallo Osnabrücker,

mir wurde eine Datenspende in Aussicht gestellt, es geht um die Haltestellen 
des ÖPNV in Osnabrück.

Kann mich da jemand unterstützen?

Bitte möglichst mit Telefonnummer an mich mailen.
Danke!

Gruß
Lulu-Ann

-- 
GRATIS für alle GMX-Mitglieder: Die maxdome Movie-FLAT!
Jetzt freischalten unter http://portal.gmx.net/de/go/maxdome01

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Re: [Talk-de] power=substation;tower

2010-05-19 Thread Schorschi

 hat jemand eine idee wie man diese kombinierten power=tower + 
 sub_station + masttrenner tagged?

das ist wohl ein Mittelspannungsmast - oft 20 kV, manchmal auch 10 kV 
(kommt ein bißchen auf die Gegend an), außerdem geht wohl eine dreiphasige 
Niederspannungleitung zum Verbraucher (oder auch Einspeiser, heutzutage 
gibt's die ja glücklicherweise auch dezentral).

Wie wäre es mit einer Art

(englische Übersetzung ist noch notwendig)

power=tower
trafo=yes
trenner=yes
voltage=2; 400
...

voltage gehört dann eher zur Leitung - obwohl, das weißt du :-)

On Mon, 17 May 2010, Florian Lohoff wrote:

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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellplätze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
Am 19. Mai 2010 09:50 schrieb Martin Mainzer mart...@gmx.de:
 Hallo,

 ich habe mich in den letzten Wochen mit den Wohnmobil-Stellplätzen in
 OSM (tourism=caravan_site) beschäftigt. Um diese Daten für Leute die mit
 Wohnmobilien unterwegs sind, nutzbar zu machen habe ich POI-Dateien für
 Navis und eine OpenLayer Karte für Europa mit den Stellplätzen erstellt
 (beides auf meiner User-Site:
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Marmai).
 Bei der Arbeit mit den Daten ist mir aufgefallen, dass zwar schon eine
 Menge an Wohnmobilstellplätzen in Deutschland verzeichnet ist (560,
 Europa 1447), aber kaum weitergehende Informationen eingetragen sind.


mir ist aufgefallen, dass Dein Kartenoverlay noch relativ wenige
Informationen anzeigt (ich habe z.B. bei der Wohnmobilstation in
Berlin Mitte auch die Adresse und Telefonnr. drin, angezeigt wird aber
nur der Name), und bei langen Namen zu Scrollbalken im Overlay führt.

Gruß Martin

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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellplätze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread aighes

Hallo,
schau dich da mal um:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Extend_camp_site

Viele Grüße,
aighes
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Wohnmobil-Stellplatze-bei-OSM-tp5073874p5074608.html
Sent from the Germany mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[Talk-de] Beschriftung an power:sub_station?

2010-05-19 Thread Manuel Reimer
Hallo,

ich habe ein kleines Trafohäuschen als power:sub_station mit 
operator:EON eingetragen. Auf diesem Häuschen gibt es eine Aufschrift, 
die wohl der Name dieses Standorts ist. Wie kann man die sinnvoll 
eintragen? Als name möchte ich das ungerne eingeben, denn dann wird 
für das doch recht kleine Häuschen ein riesiger Beschreibungstext in die 
Karte gerendert.

Irgendwer eine Idee?

Gruß

Manuel


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Re: [Talk-de] Beschriftung an power:sub_station?

2010-05-19 Thread Alexander Matheisen
Hallo,

ich hab auch schon ein paar solcher Häuschen eingetragen, und ich habe
diese Angabe (in meinem Fall immer Straße mit/ohne Hausnummer) als ref
angegeben.

http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/node/732248335


Alex


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[Talk-de] news.gmane.org (was: Re: OSM in Sachsen verbessern)

2010-05-19 Thread Manuel Reimer
Matthias Meißer wrote:
 Das stimmt Manuel aber ML sind ebend Push Medien, während ich ein Forum
 nachschaue wenn ich ebend Lust habe. Aber auch MLs haben ihre
 Berechtigung keine Frage. Um aber auch für Außenstehende möglichst
 einfach erreichbar zu sein und die Diskussion leicht verfolgbar zu
 machen, würde ich das Forum bevorzugen.

Worauf ich hinweisen wollte ist der NNTP-Zugang von gmane unter 
news.gmane.org (Subjektwechsel, für den Fall, dass es noch andere 
interessiert).

Die Mailingliste hier wird dort als Gruppe 
gmane.comp.gis.openstreetmap.region.de geführt.

Alles, was du tun musst, ist z.B. in Thunderbird ein neues 
Newsgroup-Konto anzulegen. Server ist news.gmane.org. Mailadresse muss 
stimmen, da diese von gmane verifiziert wird.

Dann auf den neu angelegten Account rechtsklicken (in der 
Ordnerübersicht) und Abonnieren wählen. Hier nun die oben genannte 
Gruppe abonnieren und siehe da -- Alle Beiträge da und übersichtlich in 
Threadform gegliedert. Auch Antworten ist hier möglich. Beim ersten 
Posting wird dich gmane aber nach Bestätigung fragen (via Mail), um die 
Mailadresse einmalig für das Posten freizuschalten.

Damit hätte sich auch das mit dem Push-Medium erledigt, denn in dieser 
Usenet-Ähnlichen Form empfinde zumindest ich das ganze als viel 
komfortabler als jedes Forum. Ich lese und antworte wann ich es für 
richtig halte und mein Postfach wird auch nicht zugeballert.

Die anderen wichtigen OSM-Listen werden von gmane auch geführt. Einfach 
zusammenabonnieren, was man benötigt.

BTW: Vielleicht für den einen oder anderen auch interessant:
http://einklich.net/usenet/usenet1.htm

Gruß

Manuel


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Re: [Talk-de] Beschriftung an power:sub_station?

2010-05-19 Thread Fabian
ref=*




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[Talk-de] OSM - GPX konvertierung Darstellungsform

2010-05-19 Thread Jan Tappenbeck

Hi !

ich habe mit dem Ausdruck

gpsbabel -i osm -f input.osm -o gpx -F output.gpx

aus den Daten einer Relation einen Track erzeugt um diesen später in 
OpenLayers darstellen zu können.

Das hat auch soweit geklappt wie folgender Link zeigt:

http://www.tappenbeck.net/osm/maps/deu/maps4osm.php?id=16zoom=15lat=54.14503lon=9.28834layers=B00T

Nun ist es nur so das die einzelnen Segmente autom. ohne Codeänderungen 
farblich unterschiedlich angezeigt werden und Symbole auf den 
Stützpunkten darstellt werden.

Weiß einer von Euch wie man aus den OSM-Daten wieder eine richtige 
GPX-Datei erstellen kann ??

Gruß Jan .-)

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Re: [Talk-de] mehrere Relationen gleichzeitig darstellen

2010-05-19 Thread malenki
Lothar Emmerich schrieb:

Eine Frage:

Ist es möglich, mehrere Wanderwege (Relatioenen) einer Region
gleichzeitig darzustellen? 

Ja.

Beispiel:
http://www.malenki.ch/OSM/html/BED/wanderwege_bed_III_bilder.html

Darfst dich gern bedienen. Falls du html, css  co kannst, benutze
bitte Joo Janta 200 Super-Chromatic Peril Sensitive Sunglasses, danke
:)

hth
malenki



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Re: [Talk-de] OSM - GPX konvertierung Darstellungsform

2010-05-19 Thread Andre Joost
Am 19.05.10 15:06, schrieb Jan Tappenbeck:

 Hi !

 ich habe mit dem Ausdruck

 gpsbabel -i osm -f input.osm -o gpx -F output.gpx

 aus den Daten einer Relation einen Track erzeugt um diesen später in
 OpenLayers darstellen zu können.

 Das hat auch soweit geklappt wie folgender Link zeigt:

 http://www.tappenbeck.net/osm/maps/deu/maps4osm.php?id=16zoom=15lat=54.14503lon=9.28834layers=B00T

 Nun ist es nur so das die einzelnen Segmente autom. ohne Codeänderungen
 farblich unterschiedlich angezeigt werden und Symbole auf den
 Stützpunkten darstellt werden.

 Weiß einer von Euch wie man aus den OSM-Daten wieder eine richtige
 GPX-Datei erstellen kann ??


Da ist wohl ein wenig preprocessing notwendig. Wenn die Wegstücke im gpx 
verbunden sind, gibts auch keine Marker mehr.

emaitie tuts aber grade wieder, vielleicht bist du damit das Problem los.

Gruß,
André Joost

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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellpl?tze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread Jacob Hampel

Hallo Stefan,

Stefan Dettenhofer

 Hier
 http://www.womo-sp.org/
 gibt es ausf?hrliche Listen von WoMo-Stellpl?tzen. Vielleicht k?nnte man
 ja mal nachfragen, ob man diese Infos in OSM integrieren d?rfte.

 Gru?,
 Stefan


bist du dir sicher, dass die Qualität der Daten auch gut ist. Es gibt in der 
Liste viele Wohnwagenstellplätze, die mit einem Fragezeichen versehen sind.
Wenn ja, soll ich mal ne Mail schicken

Jacob

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Re: [Talk-de] http://betaplace.emaitie.de - offline ?

2010-05-19 Thread malenki
Jan Tappenbeck schrieb:

ich ziehe mir für die Wegekarten  immer die GPX-Dateien von 
http://betaplace.emaitie.de über die betreffende ID.

works for me

Gruß
malenki



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Re: [Talk-de] Falsche(?) hamlets

2010-05-19 Thread Andreas Braunmiller
Bei dieser Thematik bräuchte ich auch ein wenig Hilfe. Lindau (Bodensee)
hat mehrere Stadtteile, welche wiederum in Ortsteile aufgeteilt sind
[1]. Die Stadt wird wohl als town getagged und die Stadtteile als
suburb, aber welche place-Eigenschaften wären für die Ortsteile
passend - etwa hamlet?
Die Gemeinde Bodolz daneben hat ebenfalls mehrere Ortsteile [2], doch
sind manche nicht größer als ein Weiler. Wäre hier hamlet für alle
Ortsteile die richtige Lösung?

Gruß,
Andreas

[1] http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lindau_%28Bodensee%29#Stadtteile
[2] http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodolz



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Re: [Talk-de] Beschriftung an power:sub_station?

2010-05-19 Thread Sebastian Klemm
Hallo,

Am 19.05.2010 14:42, schrieb Alexander Matheisen:
 ich hab auch schon ein paar solcher Häuschen eingetragen, und ich habe
 diese Angabe (in meinem Fall immer Straße mit/ohne Hausnummer) als ref
 angegeben.
   

Bei Trafostationen ist ref=* für die Liniennummer vorgesehen (sorry,
finde die Quelle gerade nicht), die Adresse passt da meiner Meinung nach
nicht rein.
Falls die Häuschen in Deiner Gegend tatsächlich eine Adresse haben,
könntest Du diese mit dem addr:* Tag eintragen.

Grüße,
Sebastian

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Re: [Talk-de] http://betaplace.emaitie.de - offline ?

2010-05-19 Thread Jan Tappenbeck
Am 19.05.2010 15:31, schrieb malenki:
 Jan Tappenbeck schrieb:

 ich ziehe mir für die Wegekarten  immer die GPX-Dateien von
 http://betaplace.emaitie.de über die betreffende ID.

 works for me

 Gruß
 malenki



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aber erst heute wieder !


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Re: [Talk-de] OSM - GPX konvertierung Darstellungsform

2010-05-19 Thread Jan Tappenbeck
Am 19.05.2010 15:21, schrieb Andre Joost:
 Am 19.05.10 15:06, schrieb Jan Tappenbeck:

 Hi !

 ich habe mit dem Ausdruck

 gpsbabel -i osm -f input.osm -o gpx -F output.gpx

 aus den Daten einer Relation einen Track erzeugt um diesen später in
 OpenLayers darstellen zu können.

 Das hat auch soweit geklappt wie folgender Link zeigt:

 http://www.tappenbeck.net/osm/maps/deu/maps4osm.php?id=16zoom=15lat=54.14503lon=9.28834layers=B00T

 Nun ist es nur so das die einzelnen Segmente autom. ohne Codeänderungen
 farblich unterschiedlich angezeigt werden und Symbole auf den
 Stützpunkten darstellt werden.

 Weiß einer von Euch wie man aus den OSM-Daten wieder eine richtige
 GPX-Datei erstellen kann ??


 Da ist wohl ein wenig preprocessing notwendig. Wenn die Wegstücke im gpx
 verbunden sind, gibts auch keine Marker mehr.

 emaitie tuts aber grade wieder, vielleicht bist du damit das Problem los.

 Gruß,
 André Joost

habe ich aber auch gerade erst wieder gelesen nachdem gepostet !

gruß Jan :-)


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Re: [Talk-de] Falsche(?) hamlets

2010-05-19 Thread André Riedel
Am 19. Mai 2010 15:42 schrieb Andreas Braunmiller andreas.braunmil...@web.de:
 Bei dieser Thematik bräuchte ich auch ein wenig Hilfe. Lindau (Bodensee)
 hat mehrere Stadtteile, welche wiederum in Ortsteile aufgeteilt sind
 [1]. Die Stadt wird wohl als town getagged und die Stadtteile als
 suburb, aber welche place-Eigenschaften wären für die Ortsteile
 passend - etwa hamlet?
 Die Gemeinde Bodolz daneben hat ebenfalls mehrere Ortsteile [2], doch
 sind manche nicht größer als ein Weiler. Wäre hier hamlet für alle
 Ortsteile die richtige Lösung?

 Gruß,
 Andreas

 [1] http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lindau_%28Bodensee%29#Stadtteile
 [2] http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodolz

Am besten lässt sich dieses Problem mit grob eingezeichneten Grenzen
und dem admin_level-Tag lösen.

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Key:boundary#Use_of_border_types_in_Germany_2

admin_level=8 - Lindau
admin_level=10 - Stadtteile
admin_level=11 - Ortsteil

Ciao André

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Re: [Talk-de] Falsche(?) hamlets

2010-05-19 Thread René Falk
Am 19.05.2010 15:42, schrieb Andreas Braunmiller:
 Bei dieser Thematik bräuchte ich auch ein wenig Hilfe. Lindau (Bodensee)
 hat mehrere Stadtteile, welche wiederum in Ortsteile aufgeteilt sind
 [1]. Die Stadt wird wohl als town getagged und die Stadtteile als
 suburb, aber welche place-Eigenschaften wären für die Ortsteile
 passend - etwa hamlet?
 Die Gemeinde Bodolz daneben hat ebenfalls mehrere Ortsteile [2], doch
 sind manche nicht größer als ein Weiler. Wäre hier hamlet für alle
 Ortsteile die richtige Lösung?

Hängt davon ab, wie es vor Ort ausschaut. Ist ein Ortsteil eher ein Dorf
als ein Weiler, würde ich ihn auch als village taggen. Wenn der Ortsteil
eher wie ein Weiler ausschaut, dann hamlet.

Grüße

René

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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellpl?tze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread Stefan Dettenhofer (StefanDausR)
Jacob Hampel schrieb:
 bist du dir sicher, dass die Qualität der Daten auch gut ist.

Ich weiß es nicht, habe die Liste mehr durch Zufall gefunden.
Du kannst ja mal die in OSM vorhandenen Stellplätze stichprobenartig 
vergleichen.

 Es gibt in der Liste viele Wohnwagenstellplätze, die mit einem Fragezeichen 
 versehen sind.
   

Das wird seinen Grund haben...

 Wenn ja, soll ich mal ne Mail schicken

   
Dann kannst du ja auch gleich nach der Qualität fragen.

Gruß,
Stefan


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Re: [Talk-de] Wohnmobil-Stellplätze bei OSM

2010-05-19 Thread RalfGesellensetter
Am Mittwoch, 19. Mai 2010 schrieb Martin Mainzer:
 Um diese Daten für Leute die mit
 Wohnmobilien unterwegs sind, nutzbar zu machen habe ich POI-Dateien für
 Navis ...


Hallo Martin, das finde ich interessant.

Könntest du kurz erläutern, wie du bei der POI-Erstellung vorgegangen bist?
Das ist sicher auch für andere Bereiche interessant (Spielplätze etc.).

Danke
Ralf

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Re: [Talk-de] Beschriftung an power:sub_station?

2010-05-19 Thread Manuel Reimer
Sebastian Klemm wrote:
 Bei Trafostationen ist ref=* für die Liniennummer vorgesehen (sorry,
 finde die Quelle gerade nicht), die Adresse passt da meiner Meinung nach
 nicht rein.
 Falls die Häuschen in Deiner Gegend tatsächlich eine Adresse haben,
 könntest Du diese mit dem addr:* Tag eintragen.

Es ist in dem Sinn keine Adresse sondern es steht am Häuschen der Name 
des nächstgrößeren Dorfes und eine Nummer.

Gruß

Manuel


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Re: [Talk-de] Beschriftung an power:sub_station?

2010-05-19 Thread Alexander Matheisen

 Bei Trafostationen ist ref=* für die Liniennummer vorgesehen (sorry,
 finde die Quelle gerade nicht), die Adresse passt da meiner Meinung nach
 nicht rein.
 Falls die Häuschen in Deiner Gegend tatsächlich eine Adresse haben,
 könntest Du diese mit dem addr:* Tag eintragen.


Nein,es ist ja keine Adresse , sondern oft nur die Straße, sonst noch die 
Hausnummer des nächsten Hauses. Das ist dann die interne Bezeichnung für den 
Standort, die auf einem kleinen Schildchen unter dem Vorsicht 
Hochspannung-Schild steht, daher passt ref ziemlich gut.


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[Talk-de] osm auf .de vs. .org

2010-05-19 Thread Peter Loos
Vor mehreren Tagenvon mir mit JOSM  eingegebene Änderungen sind schon lange
auf www.openstreetmap.org zu sehen, aber nicht auf www.openstreetmap.de.
Woher kommt das?

 

Grüße

pl

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Re: [Talk-de] osm auf .de vs. .org

2010-05-19 Thread Jochen Topf
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:49:06PM +0200, Peter Loos wrote:
 Vor mehreren Tagenvon mir mit JOSM  eingegebene Änderungen sind schon lange
 auf www.openstreetmap.org zu sehen, aber nicht auf www.openstreetmap.de.
 Woher kommt das?

Standardmäßig benutzt openstreetmap.de einen eigenen Tileserver. Der benutzt
zwar den selben Style, braucht aber länger zum Aktualisieren der Tiles, weil
er viel weniger RAM und langsamere Platten hat. Er kommt einfach nicht nach.

Du kannst aber auch auf openstreetmap.de auf den Tileserver umstellen, den
openstreetmap.org benutzt:von OSM Standard (dt. Server) auf OSM Standard
(engl. Server).

Jochen
-- 
Jochen Topf  joc...@remote.org  http://www.remote.org/jochen/  +49-721-388298


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[Talk-de] AKÜFI(was: AIO keine Adressen mehr )

2010-05-19 Thread Johann H. Addicks
Am 19.05.2010 07:52, schrieb Christian Knorr:
 NKIN
 Nein zu der Absicht oder ob Du es bestätigen kannst ?
 das sollte durch das K eigentlich eindeutig sein.
 Das andere wäre ja NIEN gewesen
 -v
 Beschreib' mir doch mal bitte jemand wovon hier die Rede ist.

Keine Ahnung, darum bat ich mit meiner Anforderung --verbose bereits.

Fakt ist, dass es ein Address-Layer gab, welches zumindest mit einigen 
Garmin-Geräten (leider nicht mit Garmin XT) nutzbar war.
Derzeit gibt's es leider nicht in der AllInOne.

-jha-


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Re: [Talk-de] AKÜFI (was: AIO keine Adressen meh r)

2010-05-19 Thread Christian Knorr
Am Donnerstag 20 Mai 2010 02:22:04 schrieb Johann H. Addicks:

 Am 19.05.2010 07:52, schrieb Christian Knorr:
  NKIN
 
  Nein zu der Absicht oder ob Du es bestätigen kannst ?
 
  das sollte durch das K eigentlich eindeutig sein.
  Das andere wäre ja NIEN gewesen
 
  -v
 
  Beschreib' mir doch mal bitte jemand wovon hier die Rede ist.

 Keine Ahnung, darum bat ich mit meiner Anforderung --verbose bereits.
Vielen Dank für Dein Statememt. Dein AKÜFI [1] war amüsant, hättest Du aber 
auch einen Link mit angeben können.
Nun zur Sache: mir fehlt absolut die Phantasie, was mit NKIN wambacher 
oder -v ausgedrückt werden soll.
Wenn Alle die Nachrichten so schreiben würden, dass auch ein Newbie, der das 
aus dem Archiv holt, das auch noch versteht, wäre Allen geholfen. Unter 
Umständen können Fragen so beantwortet und nicht zum x-ten Mal gestellt 
werden.

Nein, ich will kein selbsternannter Dorfsheriff sein, ich freue mich nur immer 
über Dokus die auch verständlich sind. Und auch verständlich bleiben. Denn, 
um die Archivierung der ML brauchen wir uns ja zum Glück :) nicht zu kümmern.

 Fakt ist, dass es ein Address-Layer gab, welches zumindest mit einigen
 Garmin-Geräten (leider nicht mit Garmin XT) nutzbar war.
 Derzeit gibt's es leider nicht in der AllInOne.
Das hatte ich verstanden, nur ab NKIN nicht mehr, deshalb hatte nur das 
zitiert.

 -jha-
MfG, Chris...

[1] http://www.stupidedia.org/stupi/Ak%C3%BCfi

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Re: [Talk-in] Mapping Miriyalguda and other places in AP

2010-05-19 Thread Uma Ramana Rao
Arun,
   2 more gps tracks.
http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/CDPO_AP_IN/traces
Regards
Uma

On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 10:05 PM, Arun Ganesh arun.plane...@gmail.comwrote:

 On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 4:11 AM, Uma Ramana Rao uma.ramana...@gmail.comwrote:

 Arun,
Can you send me walking papers, I will see what I can do with them.
 Regards
 Uma


 Uma, see if this is ok http://walking-papers.org/print.php?id=h4k4tvtv
 otherwise you can create one yourself from http://walking-papers.org/#make

 Once you take the print out, you can fill in missing details, like road
 names, public utilities like police station, post boxes, banks/atms or
 anything else that you would like to be added on the map.

 After that you can scan the print and upload it to this
 http://walking-papers.org/upload.php
 we will be able to superimpose your scan on the osm map and transfer all
 the data that you marked.

 Here is an example of a scan from another uploader
 http://paperwalking-uploads.s3.amazonaws.com/scans/z6b8mc4b/large.jpg



 --
 http://j.mp/ArunGanesh

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[Talk-in] GPSMid -- J2ME Application

2010-05-19 Thread Srikanth Lakshmanan
All,

Came across this awesome java mobile app GPSMid [1] after planemad tweeted
about it. This app can take OSM data and hold it in the form of midlet and
provide routing. It can position using Cell ID. So positioning / navigation
on any phone which has j2me support / some memory without GPS / GPRS.

For folks with GPRS, it can also live edit OSM which i think will be of
immense use to us to quickly add a POI / name an unnamed street. One needs
to create the midlet for the area they are interested from planet.osm file /
XAPI requests using osm2gpsmid [2] (fairly simple) and install them on the
mobile to start mapping on their mobiles. (I thought it was only possible by
the folks with iPhone and mapzen, but now poorer folks too can :) )

[1] http://gpsmid.sourceforge.net
[2] http://gpsmid.sourceforge.net/osmtogpsmid.html
-- 
Regards
Srikanth.L
http://j.mp/SrikanthL
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Re: [Talk-in] GPSMid -- J2ME Application

2010-05-19 Thread Arunmozhi
Thank you so much . . .  This is like a holy grail for people like me
who cannot get their hands on gps devices

On 5/20/10, Srikanth Lakshmanan srik@gmail.com wrote:
 All,

 Came across this awesome java mobile app GPSMid [1] after planemad tweeted
 about it. This app can take OSM data and hold it in the form of midlet and
 provide routing. It can position using Cell ID. So positioning / navigation
 on any phone which has j2me support / some memory without GPS / GPRS.

 For folks with GPRS, it can also live edit OSM which i think will be of
 immense use to us to quickly add a POI / name an unnamed street. One needs
 to create the midlet for the area they are interested from planet.osm file /
 XAPI requests using osm2gpsmid [2] (fairly simple) and install them on the
 mobile to start mapping on their mobiles. (I thought it was only possible by
 the folks with iPhone and mapzen, but now poorer folks too can :) )

 [1] http://gpsmid.sourceforge.net
 [2] http://gpsmid.sourceforge.net/osmtogpsmid.html
 --
 Regards
 Srikanth.L
 http://j.mp/SrikanthL


-- 
Sent from my mobile device

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Re: [Talk-in] GPSMid -- J2ME Application

2010-05-19 Thread Srikanth Lakshmanan
Well you cannot still add ways. It can just add POIs, edit the properties of
existing ways. GPS compliments this app well too.

On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 8:17 AM, Arunmozhi arunthe...@gmail.com wrote:

 Thank you so much . . .  This is like a holy grail for people like me
 who cannot get their hands on gps devices

 On 5/20/10, Srikanth Lakshmanan srik@gmail.com wrote:
  All,
 
  Came across this awesome java mobile app GPSMid [1] after planemad
 tweeted
  about it. This app can take OSM data and hold it in the form of midlet
 and
  provide routing. It can position using Cell ID. So positioning /
 navigation
  on any phone which has j2me support / some memory without GPS / GPRS.
 
  For folks with GPRS, it can also live edit OSM which i think will be of
  immense use to us to quickly add a POI / name an unnamed street. One
 needs
  to create the midlet for the area they are interested from planet.osm
 file /
  XAPI requests using osm2gpsmid [2] (fairly simple) and install them on
 the
  mobile to start mapping on their mobiles. (I thought it was only possible
 by
  the folks with iPhone and mapzen, but now poorer folks too can :) )
 
  [1] http://gpsmid.sourceforge.net
  [2] http://gpsmid.sourceforge.net/osmtogpsmid.html
  --
  Regards
  Srikanth.L
  http://j.mp/SrikanthL
 

 --
 Sent from my mobile device

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-- 
Regards
Srikanth.L
http://j.mp/SrikanthL
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Re: [Talk-it] Why Your Data Sucks

2010-05-19 Thread ale_z...@libero.it
Fortunatamente l'approccio wiki di OSM può mitigare la catena di errori, la 
regola è: non ti fidare troppo dei dati che trovi, non ti fidare troppo dei 
tuoi dati.
Purtroppo sono in tanti che si affidano ciecamente alla tecnologia, ma i 
creduloni sono sempre esistiti e sempre esisteranno :-)

Ale_Zena_IT

Messaggio originale
Da: lucadel...@gmail.com
Data: 19/05/2010 0.15
A: GFOSS.itgf...@faunalia.it, openstreetmap list - italianotalk-
i...@openstreetmap.org
Ogg: [Talk-it] Why Your Data Sucks

magari qualcuno se lo è perso

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX8iQN04tOo

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Re: [Talk-it] Ways come aree

2010-05-19 Thread albertobonati
Il 18/05/2010 0.52, Simone Saviolo ha scritto:
 ..

 Ora, da ciò che ho letto in più posti la mappatura delle strade
 andrebbe fatta con le aree per mille motivi, ma le way lineari sono
 comunque la soluzione migliore per il routing. In altre parole,
 l'ideale sarebbe avere entrambe, e va bene. Il mio semplice
 esperimento, tuttavia, ha già evidenziato un paio di problemi.


Nei centri urbani, se gli edifici sono disegnati, lo spazio che rimane è 
la strada. Basterebbe dire al render di non disegnare le due linee che 
la definiscono graficamente e la strada, con tutte le sue irregolarità 
di slarghi e cambi di larghezza tipici dei centri storici, verrebbe 
riprodotta automaticamente.
Il nome della via potrebbe rimanere come ora mentre per il routing non 
cambierebbe nulla perchè il vettore sarebbe comunque presente.
Il controllo di questo si potrebbe ottenere con un semplice tag da 
mettere a discrezione.

Ciao

Alberto

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Re: [Talk-it] Ways come aree

2010-05-19 Thread G Zamboni

Il 19/05/2010 8.40, albertobonati ha scritto:
 Il 18/05/2010 0.52, Simone Saviolo ha scritto:

 ..

 Ora, da ciò che ho letto in più posti la mappatura delle strade
 andrebbe fatta con le aree per mille motivi, ma le way lineari sono
 comunque la soluzione migliore per il routing. In altre parole,
 l'ideale sarebbe avere entrambe, e va bene. Il mio semplice
 esperimento, tuttavia, ha già evidenziato un paio di problemi.


  
 Nei centri urbani, se gli edifici sono disegnati, lo spazio che rimane è
 la strada. Basterebbe dire al render di non disegnare le due linee che
 la definiscono graficamente e la strada, con tutte le sue irregolarità
 di slarghi e cambi di larghezza tipici dei centri storici, verrebbe
 riprodotta automaticamente.

Non è affatto automatico. Nonostante il fatto che siamo una nazione di 
auto e automobilisti ci sono sempre le piste ciclabili e i marciapiedi, 
oltre alle aiuole, ecc...
In alcuni vecchi centri storici è vero quello che dici, ma non puoi 
considerarla una regola generale, neanche se prendi in considerazione 
solo i centri città.

Sarebbe troppo facile :-)

 Ciao

 Alberto



Ciao
Giuliano
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Re: [Talk-it] Ways come aree

2010-05-19 Thread albertobonati
Il 19/05/2010 9.35, G Zamboni ha scritto:

 Non è affatto automatico. Nonostante il fatto che siamo una nazione di
 auto e automobilisti ci sono sempre le piste ciclabili e i marciapiedi,
 oltre alle aiuole, ecc...
 In alcuni vecchi centri storici è vero quello che dici, ma non puoi
 considerarla una regola generale, neanche se prendi in considerazione
 solo i centri città.

 Sarebbe troppo facile :-)


Non la vedo come regola generale ma come una possibilità di riprodurre 
in modo abbastanza fedele l' andamento delle strade nei centri storici 
delle città.
E' il sistema adottato, ad esempio, nella rappresentazione cartografica 
del Comune di Bologna (1) e mi sembra funzioni bene.
Non risolve il problema dei marciapiedi, ma la loro definizione potrebbe 
comunque rimanere come attributo della strada.
Altre elementi, come le aiuole, possono essere comunque mappati.

Ciao
Alberto

(1) http://sit.comune.bologna.it/sit/ctwloader9.html

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Re: [Talk-it] Ways come aree

2010-05-19 Thread Simone Saviolo
Il 18 maggio 2010 19.06, Federico Cozzi f.co...@gmail.com ha scritto:
 2010/5/18 Simone Saviolo simone.savi...@gmail.com:
 D'accordo, capisco il tuo punto di vista. Non mi viene in mente nessun
 esempio che io conosca di piazza pedonale senza alcuna indicazione su
 dove debba andare una macchina (anche solo una corsia disegnata per
 terra), però non posso escludere che esista.

 Piazza dell'Anfiteatro, Lucca:
 http://maps.google.it/maps?f=qsource=s_qhl=itgeocode=q=luccasll=43.71897,10.401274sspn=0.004769,0.013733ie=UTF8hq=hnear=Lucca,+Toscanall=43.845347,10.506085spn=0.000595,0.001717t=kz=20
 Se accendi la sovrapposizione delle strade vedi che anche Google ha
 tracciato la way perimetrale, ma OSM è meglio perché ha indicato
 area=yes ;-)
 http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=43.845417lon=10.506345zoom=18layers=B000FTF

Sono d'accordo sulla proposta, ma così, sempre per discutere di lana
caprina, rifiuto l'esempio. Piazza Anfiteatro è un vero e proprio
anfiteatro, circondato dagli edifici, che ha (se non ricordo male) due
soli accessi, uno di fronte all'altro. Chi voglia attraversare la
piazza ha effettivamente un percorso obbligato. In pratica la way non
esiste, ma di fatto c'è.

Piccolo OT: le ortofoto sono preziosissime a Lucca e in casi simili!
Il GPS non avrebbe mai potuto essere all'altezza...

 Ciao,
 Federico

Ciao,

Simone

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Re: [Talk-it] Ways come aree

2010-05-19 Thread Federico Cozzi
2010/5/19 Simone Saviolo simone.savi...@gmail.com:
 Piazza dell'Anfiteatro, Lucca:
 Sono d'accordo sulla proposta, ma così, sempre per discutere di lana
 caprina, rifiuto l'esempio. Piazza Anfiteatro è un vero e proprio
 anfiteatro, circondato dagli edifici, che ha (se non ricordo male) due
 soli accessi, uno di fronte all'altro. Chi voglia attraversare la
 piazza ha effettivamente un percorso obbligato. In pratica la way non
 esiste, ma di fatto c'è.

No, di accessi ce ne sono quattro. Tracciare le 6 way che congiungono
tutti i 4 accessi mi sembrerebbe arbitrario: neppure Google Maps lo fa
e si limita a tracciare il perimetro.

Ecco il routing suggerito da GMaps per andare da E a O: è stupido,
cioè ti fa costeggiare la piazza.
http://maps.google.it/maps?f=dsource=s_dsaddr=Piazza+dell'Anfiteatrodaddr=Piazza+dell'Anfiteatrohl=itgeocode=FW4GnQIdME2gAA%3BFSwHnQIdRFKgAAmra=dmemrcr=0mrsp=1sz=19dirflg=wsll=43.84519,10.505915sspn=0.00119,0.002411ie=UTF8ll=43.845347,10.506231spn=0.00119,0.002411t=hz=19

Il routing suggerito da www.yournavigation.org (purtroppo non riesco a
trovare un link al risultato) è analogo. E' un peccato, perché OSM ha
il concetto di area=yes.

 Piccolo OT: le ortofoto sono preziosissime a Lucca e in casi simili!
 Il GPS non avrebbe mai potuto essere all'altezza...

Indubbiamente! Meglio ancora sono le CTR o simili. Ho mappato parte di
Lucca basandomi sul WMS della Toscana.
Inoltre le città storiche italiane hanno una pianta invariata da
decenni, se non da secoli, e si possono anche usare mappe su cui il
copyright è scaduto.

Ciao,
Federico

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[Talk-it] FYI: Pigmei con il GPS

2010-05-19 Thread f.pelu...@libero.it
Ciao a tutti,

non so che fine faranno i dati raccolti, ma sarebbe bello avere dentro OSM 
anche le piste dei pigmei:

http://www.repubblica.it/tecnologia/2010/05/19/news/pigmei_gps-4171896/

Simone, secondo te OSM ha qualche rapporto con queste ONG?

Ciao
/niubii/



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[Talk-it] Fiumi che attraversano un lago

2010-05-19 Thread Alberto Nogaro
Come dobbiamo tracciare i fiumi che attraversano un lago? Il problema è
simile a quello delle vie che attraversano le piazze. E' meglio interrompere
il fiume sulla riva del lago, o tracciare un vettore arbitrario che lo
attraversa? Il secondo approccio sarebbe in parte analogo al caso del
riverbank, che non sostituisce il vettore del fiume. Le CTR usano questo
approccio, per avere un grafo dei fiumi connesso, e fino ad ora lo ho
mantenuto negli import, ma non sono sicuro che sia corretto.

Ciao,
Alberto




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Re: [Talk-it] Fiumi che attraversano un lago

2010-05-19 Thread Luca Delucchi
Il 19 maggio 2010 11.08, Alberto Nogaro bartosom...@yahoo.it ha scritto:
 Come dobbiamo tracciare i fiumi che attraversano un lago? Il problema è
 simile a quello delle vie che attraversano le piazze. E' meglio interrompere
 il fiume sulla riva del lago, o tracciare un vettore arbitrario che lo
 attraversa? Il secondo approccio sarebbe in parte analogo al caso del
 riverbank, che non sostituisce il vettore del fiume. Le CTR usano questo
 approccio, per avere un grafo dei fiumi connesso, e fino ad ora lo ho
 mantenuto negli import, ma non sono sicuro che sia corretto.

geograficamente penso (sono quasi sicuro) che sia completamente errato!
controllando i dati provinciali però seguono il metodo della
continuità lineare.
A questo punto incomincio a pensare che sia meglio avere più dati e
poi chi li vuole utilizzare sceglie quali delle due tipologie
utilizzare


 Ciao,
 Alberto


ciao
Luca

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Re: [Talk-it] Fiumi che attraversano un lago

2010-05-19 Thread M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
2010/5/19 Alberto Nogaro bartosom...@yahoo.it:
 Come dobbiamo tracciare i fiumi che attraversano un lago? Il problema è
 simile a quello delle vie che attraversano le piazze. E' meglio interrompere
 il fiume sulla riva del lago, o tracciare un vettore arbitrario che lo
 attraversa?

secondome facciamo meglio lasciando/mettendo i fiumi in continuità,
cioè farli attraversare esplicitamente il lago.

ciao,
Martin

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Re: [Talk-it] Nomi di collezioni di oggetti

2010-05-19 Thread Carlo Stemberger
Il 18/05/2010 16:58, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer ha scritto:
 Per i laghi
 sono invece d'accordo: se il nome vale per le due insieme e ogniuno
 non ha un nome lo mettrei alla relazione.

+1

@Martin: ti fa piacere se ti segnalo i tuoi (sempre più rari) errorini 
di italiano?

-- 
  .'  `.   | Registered Linux User #443882
  |a_a  |  | http://counter.li.org/  .''`.
  \_)__/  +--- : :'  :
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Re: [Talk-it] Parcheggi quando e come

2010-05-19 Thread Alberto Nogaro
-Original Message-
From: talk-it-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-it-
boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Simone Cortesi
Sent: giovedì 13 maggio 2010 11.41
To: gd.zamb...@tiscali.it; openstreetmap list - italiano
Subject: Re: [Talk-it] Parcheggi quando e come

Fratelli di parcheggio! uniamoci! Anche io appena posso agigungo un
parcheggio, comprensivo di stradine di accesso e service=parking_aisle

Qualche esperto di posteggi mi sa spiegare che differenza c'è in questo
rendering tra posteggi in verde scuro e in verde chiaro?

http://toolserver.org/~osm/styles/?zoom=17lat=45.19853lon=9.17355layers=0
000F0FF000BFF

Ciao,
Alberto


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[Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Federico Cozzi
Ciao,
sulla base delle regole che avevo inventato qualche settimana fa (è
city se ha almeno 100.000 abitanti o è capoluogo di provincia)
l'Italia ha ora un aspetto leggermente diverso:
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=42.19lon=13.26zoom=6layers=B000FTF
Mi sembra abbastanza in linea con gli altri paesi ma è difficile da valutare.

Vi sembra che ci sia qualche grande assente che dovremmo reintrodurre?

Potremmo agire in due modi:
1. rivalutare la soglia di 100.000 abitanti (peraltro elastica) se
scoprissimo ad es. che alla realtà italiana è più adeguata la soglia
degli 80.000 (un numero a caso!)
2. promuovere a city alcune specifiche città inferiori alla soglia
sulla base di considerazioni di contesto

Ciao,
Federico

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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Federico Cozzi
2010/5/19 Federico Cozzi f.co...@gmail.com:
 1. rivalutare la soglia di 100.000 abitanti (peraltro elastica) se
 scoprissimo ad es. che alla realtà italiana è più adeguata la soglia
 degli 80.000 (un numero a caso!)

Per il punto 1, ho trovato questo elenco delle città italiane ordinate
per popolazione:
http://www.tuttitalia.it/citta/popolazione/

La soglia a 100.000 abitanti include 45 città.
Abbassando a 90.000: 55 città.
Abbassando a 80.000: 69 città
Abbassando a 70.000: 82 città
Abbassando a 60.000: poco più di 100.

A titolo di confronto ecco quante città ci sono negli altri paesi:
UK: 69
Francia: 42
Spagna: 84
Germania: 111

Dal che emerge che la Francia è forse sottorappresentata e la Spagna
sovra-rappresentata. Se volessimo confrontarci con UK dovremmo
abbassare la soglia a 80.000 abitanti.
Personalmente mi sembra ragionevole abbassare la soglia a 80.000 se
non addirittura a 70.000, ma non più bassa.

Obiezioni? Altre statistiche?

Ciao,
Federico

PS: questo ragionamento statistico non elimina la possibilità di
promuovere una town a city sulla base di altre considerazioni!

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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Simone Saviolo
Il 19 maggio 2010 15.55, Federico Cozzi f.co...@gmail.com ha scritto:
 Vi sembra che ci sia qualche grande assente che dovremmo reintrodurre?

Manca Roma!!! Probabilmente è solo un problema di labelling, però...

Simone

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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Federico Cozzi
2010/5/19 Federico Cozzi f.co...@gmail.com:
 sulla base delle regole che avevo inventato qualche settimana fa (è
 city se ha almeno 100.000 abitanti o è capoluogo di provincia)

Mi correggo: capoluogo di regione !

Ciao

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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Federico Cozzi
2010/5/19 Simone Saviolo simone.savi...@gmail.com:
 Vi sembra che ci sia qualche grande assente che dovremmo reintrodurre?
 Manca Roma!!! Probabilmente è solo un problema di labelling, però...

Sì purtroppo viene nascosta dallo Stato del Vaticano, che vince su
Roma perché è uno stato e Roma è solo capitale.
Il posizionamento delle etichette è un'arte e Mapnik non è il massimo
da questo punto di vista...

Ciao,
Federico

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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Fabio Alessandro Locati
 Manca Roma!!! Probabilmente è solo un problema di labelling, però...
Purtroppo è coperta da città del vaticano...
-- 
Fabio Alessandro Locati

Home: Segrate, Milan, Italy (GMT +1)
Phone: +39-328-3799681
MSN/Jabber/E-Mail: fabioloc...@gmail.com

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Involved in: KDE, OpenStreetMap, Ubuntu, Wikimedia

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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Gianfranco Gliozzo

Carissimi

Ma ci sono geografi o urbanisti che partecipano al progetto?
Se esistessero già dei criteri sarebbe il caso di non reinventare l'acqua calda.

Mi sembra che una classificazione basata semplicemente sulla popolazione possa 
essere riduttiva ma al tempo stesso non penso che un'analisi multicriteriale 
più complessa sia fattibile ed opportuna. La soglia di 50.000 per città penso 
possa bastare. Ricordo che in Italia la normativa individua le aree 
metropolitane dove la conurbazione fitta ed altri criteri legati alla 
popolazione, stabiliti per legge, facevano si che anche centri urbani di 
popolazione limitata potessero considerarsi parte di un sistema con 
caratteristiche metropolitane.
Sarebbe il caso di un tag e di una classificazione Italiana per aggiungere le 
municipalità coinvolte nelle diverse aree metropolitane?

Inoltre il confronto statistico con gli altri paesi non deve trarre in inganno, 
si tratta di contesti insediativi e storici ben diversi.
Francia ed Austria ad esempio sono Macrocefale con una capitale che 
giganteggia su tutti gli altri insediamenti sia in termini di popolazione che 
di servizi, questo sminuisce di molto il ruolo degli altri insediamenti.

Grazie a tutti per la passione con cui mandate avanti il progetto.
Un mapper in quiescenza,

Gianfranco



 Date: Wed, 19 May 2010 16:21:00 +0200
 From: f.co...@gmail.com
 To: talk-it@openstreetmap.org
 Subject: Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town
 
 2010/5/19 Federico Cozzi f.co...@gmail.com:
  1. rivalutare la soglia di 100.000 abitanti (peraltro elastica) se
  scoprissimo ad es. che alla realtà italiana è più adeguata la soglia
  degli 80.000 (un numero a caso!)
 
 Per il punto 1, ho trovato questo elenco delle città italiane ordinate
 per popolazione:
 http://www.tuttitalia.it/citta/popolazione/
 
 La soglia a 100.000 abitanti include 45 città.
 Abbassando a 90.000: 55 città.
 Abbassando a 80.000: 69 città
 Abbassando a 70.000: 82 città
 Abbassando a 60.000: poco più di 100.
 
 A titolo di confronto ecco quante città ci sono negli altri paesi:
 UK: 69
 Francia: 42
 Spagna: 84
 Germania: 111
 
 Dal che emerge che la Francia è forse sottorappresentata e la Spagna
 sovra-rappresentata. Se volessimo confrontarci con UK dovremmo
 abbassare la soglia a 80.000 abitanti.
 Personalmente mi sembra ragionevole abbassare la soglia a 80.000 se
 non addirittura a 70.000, ma non più bassa.
 
 Obiezioni? Altre statistiche?
 
 Ciao,
 Federico
 
 PS: questo ragionamento statistico non elimina la possibilità di
 promuovere una town a city sulla base di altre considerazioni!
 
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Re: [Talk-it] Risultati della retrocessione di molte city a town

2010-05-19 Thread Federico Cozzi
2010/5/19 Gianfranco Gliozzo gianfrancoglio...@hotmail.com:
 Se esistessero già dei criteri sarebbe il caso di non reinventare l'acqua
 calda.

Non c'è che l'imbarazzo della scelta :-)
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citt%C3%A0#Possibili_definizioni

Anche avessimo il criterio perfetto, ci sarebbe comunque il problema
dell'omogeneità su OSM: se questo criterio portasse a individuare solo
10 città in Italia, oppure 300, sarebbe comunque discutibile se
applicarlo come discrimine tra place=city o place=town.

Secondo me ci vuole un criterio che selezioni un numero di città
italiane compreso circa tra 50 e 100.
Il taglio sulla popolazione, combinato con l'eccezione capoluogo di
regione (che quindi combina considerazioni di importanza) più
eventuali altre eccezioni è arbitrario ma non troppo e si avvicina
all'obiettivo. L'unico problema è che attualmente seleziona a malapena
50 città, ma se volessimo includere più città potremmo abbassare la
soglia fino a 80.000 se non 70.000.

La soglia a 50.000 invece mi sembra un po' bassa perché selezionerebbe
149 comuni:
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comuni_italiani_con_pi%C3%B9_di_50.000_abitanti
Neanche la Germania ha 149 place=city, ed è affine all'Italia come
distribuzione della popolazione (anche se quantitativamente ha un
numero più elevato di abitanti).

Ciao,
Federico

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Re: [Talk-it] programma osmit2010

2010-05-19 Thread gvf
Il giorno mar, 18/05/2010 alle 21.46 +0200, Luca Delucchi ha scritto:
 È online il programma ufficiale di OSMit2010 [0], ricordo nuovamente
 agli interessati di registrarsi il prima possibile per far si di avere
 un evento meglio organizzato
 
 saluti
 
 per il Comitato
 Luca Delucchi
 
 [0] http://www.dicat.unige.it/osmit2010/informazioni-sul-meeting/programma

L'url mi risulta essere leggermente diverso:

http://www.dicat.unige.it/osmit2010/informazioni-sul-meeting/programma-2

la pagina è comunque poco leggibile a meno di non avere un monitor 22
pollici (e una buona vista)

-- 
Ciao Gio.


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