Re: [Talk-us] NYC Name Vandalism
Other criteria for ranking a object for "change protection" could be 1) How long has it been since the last change to it. 2) How big is it. ( a long road would rank higher than a short one) 3) How many things are "attached to it" 4) How important is it. (Motorways are more important than tracks) (tourism objects are more important than objects of local interest only) ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] The take - away
I think that the "take-away" from all this is... Since OSM is a community project, no one (or group) can work in isolation. At some stage the community will have questions/criticisms of your work. You must be able to receive and respond to these promptly. Failure to do so will inevitably result is eventual escalation, maybe in a saintly way (ala Andy) or maybe in a lesser way, as in Frederik and most of the rest of us ( I suspect). The niceness of the escalation will probably depend on how long it takes to get the response. Cheers Nick H ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Rural US: Correcting Original TIGER Imported Ways
Paul wrote "Or maybe the unedited original TIGER that's still around dropped to highway=road. " Given that the *vast* majority of these (with no name) are completely fictional, and even those that aren't, are so out of position and so wrongly connected as to render them worse than useless, I believe that deletion is the only sensible option. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Rural US: Correcting Original TIGER Imported Ways
I've always been of the opinion that any of the original TIGER data import that has not yet been edited and does not have a name tag, should just be deleted. Then, and only then can the rural areas begin to be mapped correctly. In the early days there were a lot of people who thought that "any data is better than no data" whereas I believe that "no data" is better than bad data. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Texas - redacted roads.
AAAH - all my questions are answered. The City of Austin's use of google base map has "fooled" me into thinking that the map data was theirs rather than googles. If I click on the "blue line" then I see the actual City of Austin data and indeed it is "REED WILL DRIVE". Damm - So I have actually just gone and put in a google mistake into OSM. Easily fixed tonight and I will check any other roads that I have "fixed" in the last two days. Ok - so after all this, the only error was in the google data, which is no great surprise. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Texas - redacted roads.
Clifford wrote "Looking at the data from Austin, the road should be name Reed Will Drive." Hi Clifford. Which site did you find the authoritive data for Austin from? (Tiger has nothing and is not authorative anyway, as far as I can tell) The Cit of Austin site https://data.austintexas.gov/Locations-and-Maps/Street-Segment/t4fe-kr8c has "Redwill Drive" CAPCOG http://regional-open-data-capcog.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/roads-2015 has "Reed Will Drive" There is annecdotal evidence that the street signs have (or maybe had) "Reed Will Drive" So, firstly I think we need to find out what the street signs say currently. Then we need to contact all authoritive holders of this data to clarify what name is correct and to ensure all occurrences are fixed as necessary. In the meantime what would you suggest is the best action to take? Lets say the street sign is wrong (REED WILL) and the correct data is City of Austin's Redwil. Should we (in OSM) put what the user will probably search for, the correect (hypothetically) Redwil or should we put the "ground truth" (REED WILL) which is what the user will see if he acually ever makes it to that location. PS - I have just noticed that the City of Austin website has an attribution of "Map data @2017 Google" Does this mean that the displayed names are from google rather than City of Austin and therefore not usable by us. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Texas - redacted roads.
Nathan wrote "Best to stay well on the correct side of the line " Ok - point taken. Did I mention that at the location I posted (using OSM) the CAPCOG website (roads dataset) http://regional-open-data-capcog.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/roads-2015 has the road listed as REED WILL and with a type of DR. I've been told that this is an acceptable source or road names, Maybe somebody could drive past this road and report back what the actual street signs do say. If they do say "Reed Will" then I will try to contact the Austin authorities to clarify the situation. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Texas - redacted roads.
richlv wrote "just a quick reminder that we should try not to use google maps or streetview, the legal status of "just looking" is also fuzzy :)" Ok, so I if want to find out what a road is called, I'm not allowed to use a street directory to do this? This would be extremely weird. If I am allowed to use a street directory for this, then I'm not allowed to tell anybody else what I think the name of the road is. Also extremely weird. I don't believe that writing what someone else thinks is the name of the roads constitutes republishing their proprietary work and I'm certainly not putting this information into any other work or database. (Mind you IANAL). A few years ago this topic came up and IIRC Google said that it was ok to look at "some" amount of their published data but not systematically trawl through a LOT of it. All very subjective, I know. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Texas - redacted roads.
Andrew wrote "I would check out the City of Austin's OpenData portal: https://data.austintexas.gov/Locations-and-Maps/Street-Segment/t4fe-kr8c The license is the same (PD) as when the initial building import was completed, so you are good to go." Thanks Andrew, I'm now replacing some names adding new roads and neighbourhoods etc. One interesting road is Redwil Drive. https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/30.23189/-97.59361 Tiger has no name, Google maps and Austin-gov have Redwill Drive but google street view shows both street signs as Reed Will Drive. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Texas - redacted roads.
at http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/30.23990/-97.57717 Openstreetmap has three missing roads, that Bing and Google have as, Joe Lane, Cleto Street and Fifnella way. Tiger 2017 does not have these. Is there any usable source for these Texas roads or, if not, does anyone have local knowledge of them or the ability to survey them? ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr
I wrote "NSW and Queensland don't have any sources of names that we can use, so they will have to be surveyed." Actually , I meant Victoria and Queensland. NSW does have a good source but there are no redacted roads in NSW. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr
Tod wrote "Not sure this is a big enough job to bother putting up a OSM task for it. Just grab the way IDs in your state, and maybe in your neighboring state(s), and do it." Unfortunately , my neighboring states are in Australia :-) NSW and Queensland don't have any sources of names that we can use, so they will have to be surveyed. I'm working on Texas now and have cleaned up one area just right of Austin. I did add some new roundabouts an recreated some deleted roads. Even though Tiger 2017 did not have names for some of the new roads, there were houses there that had addr:name tags , so I used that name. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Redacting 75, 000 street names contributed by user chdr
Can someone put up an OSM task so that we can replace these names , from Tiger 2017? ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] wtsp.com using OSM for detour maps
Some while back, at the Denver SOTM, a bloke gave a presentation about depiction. This software is all about dynamic changes to the map due to natural hazards like flood, fire, etc and has the ability to incorporate immediate changes to routability by marking roads closed or marking certain areas as flooded. I think that OSM is not a good place for rapidly changing data but when used as a basemap for a layer like depiction, it would be a godsend, in emergency situations. http://blog.depiction.com/w/about/ ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] New roads in Houston
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/29.86540/-95.66553 Can someone who has access to TIGER 2017 or who has local knowledge, add the names of these two new roads. Bing imagery shows that these new roads already have residents. They were not in OSM, till today, and are in the flood affected area of Hurricane Harvey. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Emergency Shelters
Are the emergency shelters currently mapped in OSM? I think that it would be really useful, in an emergency to have these locations available on your phone or watch as offline routable maps (including whether they are pet friendly). Maybe in the next few months we could convince/help all states to import their data into OSM. PS - I've just bought a waterproof Garmin Epix watch and loaded routable OSM maps to it. Turn by turn navigation works really well on it. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER fixup for Hurricane Harvey potential impact areas
Thanks Mike, Looks good. I've already found a serious routability issue with an unedited TIGER road in the Houston area. -I'm fixing it now. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER fixup for Hurricane Harvey potential impact areas
Is there anything we can do, OSMwise, for communities in the path of Hurricane Irma. Anything that may be useful for search and recovery would be a priority. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER fixup for Hurricane Harvey potential impact areas
Hi Brian, >From the TxDOT website I see that the road data is updated yearly, but unfortunately the data was last published at the end of 2015. One think I would like to make sure of, is that Texas roads are up-to-date so that any new subdivisions that may be water affected are actually on the OSM map. A couple of years ago there was a "Tiger missing and misaligned 2015" layer that I found really usefull for bringing many US cities and towns up-to-date. Do you know if there is (or plans for) a more recent version of this, maybe Tiger 2017??? Also if there was a layer like this that only had missing/misaligned roads where the Tiger data had a name tag, then new sub-divisions and any missing streets could be easily added, all over the US (once Texas is updated). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Open survey on participation biases in OSM
This is how it's done http://www.dw.com/en/online-map-shows-wheelchair-accessible-locations-worldwide/a-15381244 I met this bloke at SOTM Japan some years ago. He didn't put out a questionaire about whether non-disabled persons tended to tag less accessability tags than disabled persons, because he already knew the answer. He just went out and mapped them, created a website to support his interest and got thousands of people interested in his project. Truly an inspirational mapper. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Open survey on participation biases in OSM
We are ,mostly, volunteers. Therefore I think we should map whatever takes our fancy and should not feel obliged to spend our time/money on mapping that we do not want to do willingly. If the location based service providers find that certain info is missing that they would like to have then maybe they could pay someone to collect the data, or even better, do it themselves. If you can convince mappers to alter their mapping habits, well and good, but trying to shame or threaten them into doing so will just destroy whatever community there is. Your statement (highly paraphrased) of "If you don't map what I want you to map, then nobody is going to want to use your data" may not be the best way to win people over to your cause. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER tracing layer updated to 2015 release
Yes, many thanks Eric, This facility will result in significant improvements to the US OSM data. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Am I doing this right? Houses w/ addresses
Excellent job Steve, I believe that house addresses is the only thing missing from OSM that is stopping it from becoming the mainstream mapping data of choice! I’ve always been interested in how to collect addresses, which can be a time consuming and difficult task. Walking around a neighborhood with paper and pencil peering into people’s letter boxes and at their front doors may upset some people, so I’ve though up a (possibly) better way. Two people, in a car. Two GPS units, probably both smartphones, one recording the track log and the other recording the passengers voice. As you drive down the road, the passenger calls out something like….. 12 left 15right 14 left 16 right….. turning left on main street, 67 left etc, etc.. Then later in an editor you can match times from the two sources and compare against Bing imagery to correctly place the house numbers. Cheers ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER 2014 update
Richard Welty wrote "the question is how much work are you willing to do to use it." The answer is simple - verry little. I've been doing quite a lot of armchair mapping recently. 1) Pushing crazy TIGER roads around in residential and rural areas. 2) Adding missing roads in Las Vegas (and adding new ones from actual surevy last month). 3) Unabbreviating roads in Las Vegas and in the Denver Area. 4) Readding roads and road names (deleted during the redaction) in Victoria Australia, from the VICMap tms layer 5) Doing manyy of the tasks from the maproulette "crossing ways" challenge. This means that I spend all of my "Osm" time on mapping using tools created by others (or from driving around my state) but have no time or inclination to develop these tools. There are about 150 roads in Las Vegas that do not have suffixes and I'm hoping that the 2014 data will addreess this problem. Also there were a lot of new gated communities in Las Vegas that are as yet unnamed in TIGER 2013, and I was not able to drive into these. I'm hoping that some (maybe even most) of these will appear in the new 2014 Tiger data. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER 2014 update
Mike wrote "Since the new roads were flagged, I was able to bring them into OSM. (All manually checked for connectivity, smoothing, etc)." Is ther a way to use TIGER 2014 in JOSM yet. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Dirt Roads (formerly: Abandoned railway)
While people work out how to remove the multitude of tiger ways that don't actually exist, downgrade others from the incorrect "residential" to "unclassified" or "track" depending on imagery or ground survey, and fix the geometry of all unedited TIGER data, I beleive that it's absolutely essential (from safety and useability perspectives) to immediately mark all these uncertain ways as unroutable. Whether to make them driveways or use access=no , I've no idea. I think thrse ways can easily be identified by... 1) They are original TIGER data import 2) They have not been edited since import 3) They are "higway=residential" 4) They are unnamed A bot could do this easily and then it really doesn't matter how long it takes to find the best solution. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Road abbreviations
Keith wrote "Sounds like you fixed this quickly. Would you mind explaining the steps in detail you took to achieve this? Thanks" I decided to use a set of common abbreviations of Ct St Ave Dr Ln Pl Pkwy Cl Cir Rd In Australia I'd propably add "Cct" (Circuit) to the list. Then for the first "Ct" which is "Court" I went to overpass-turbo.eu and ran the query of This shows all the ways whose name ends in a space followed by ct (in any capitalization). With this map in one window and JOSM in another window, I then located the first "Ct" in the Josm window and edited it manually to be "Court" Often there was a *nest* of abbreviations (St Ln Pl etc...) in the same neighbourhood, so having fixed one way I would hav a quick look around that area. and fix any other abbreviations I found. Then on to the next "Ct". I generally worked my way west to east and north to south. Once I had cleared up all the "Ct" (rerunning the operpass query verifies this) I then started on the "St" (Streets). About30 or 40 hours later Las Vegas was fixed. What I will now do I export to CSV all the Las Vegas Road names, then grep out all the good ones (I.E Court, Street, Road) and see what's left. Any typos I've made while editing (E.G Ctourt) and any ways without suffixes will be left and I can investigate if they can be improved or not (from TIGER 2013). You'll notice that no bots were run in the making of these fixes. This is for two reasons. Firstly I'm not a fan of bots since they make assumptions which may not always be true. Secondly, manual editing in JOSM with the TIGER 2013 and OSM data showing, means that I found quite a few missing road names in OSM. Also I found quite a few missing roads and If both TIGER and Bing imagery agreed about the road then I added in the road. I also found a few typos along the way which I could fix as well. Ie always found that desk checking against another source (like TIGER) and entire city results in massive improvements. Any city I've mapped I always desk check against another source and inevitably find lots of typos to fix. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Road abbreviations
stevea wrote, "though there are problems in the west, like Las Vegas" Ok - I think I've fixed all of these in Las Vegas (there were a few thousand). It's amazing how simple they are to find using the overpass api (and overpass turbo). Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Road abbreviations
Stecea wrote "though there are problems in the west, like Las Vegas" Hi, I've just come back from a holiday to Las Vegas where I surveyed as many "unamed" streets and new neighbourhoods (that are not named in TIGER 2013) as I could find. Hopefully this means that OSM now has the best road data of Las Vegas on the planet, although some gated communities still have unnamed streets. Now that I am reduced back to armchair mapping, I may as well get started on expanding all the abbreviated street names in Las Vegas from Paul's excellent overlay. Should keep me busy for a couple on months!! Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Turn restriction dispute
It may be that what is happening is that NE2 is deliberately trying to start an edit war so that he will be allowed back onto this list to discuss it. If, as seems to be the case, the bulk of his edits are destructive and need to be reverted, then the sensible thing to do may be to put an auto revert bot in for him. This would protect the OSM database and allow people to just ignore him. Or, the more sensible thing would be just to ban him from editing. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remap-a-tron level 2 complete! Suggestions for level 3?
oldtopos wrote "I will also point out that the connectivity errors I mentioned earlier are, in fact, largely a result of unedited TIGER data" I'd be happy to go along with a flavour of a "connect-a-tron". It's very hard not to clean up an entire neighbourhood/s when "crazy TIGER roads" are spotted so this would target a lot of those as well. Also if we all always activate TIGER 2012 imagery then it's also very hard to ignore new TIGER 2012 roads that need adding. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remap-a-tron level 2 complete! Suggestions for level 3?
I think the most necessary cleanup to the USA OSM data is to clean up all the crazy unedited original Tiger roads. These can easily be identified simply as those ways that have a name but are still the original Tiger data and have not been edited. (except for the balrog-kun bot). You could just identify spots not closer together than (say) 1 mile and that would allow the editor to have a nice piece of real estate to clean up each time. It is quite fun doing this since (with the help of TIGER 2012) overlay and Bing imagery, it is usually possible to determine which road goes where and you see an enormous improvement in the map for relatively small efforts. If the remap-a-tron identifies an area where all the original; TIGER data was correct, then no problems, we just flag it as good and move on, but at least that area has now been eyeballed by a real person who probably will be able to add in a few new TIGER 2012 roads if they have the overlay active. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remap-a-tron level 2 complete! Suggestions for level 3?
Level 3 Tiger 2012 roads, that are named, that don't have a corresponding OSM way with similar naming and similar geometry. This would pick up new 2012 Tiger roads, and unedited original Tiger named roads which were of poor quality. Level 4 Tiger unedited roads that are "highway residential" and have no name. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Schedule for State Of The Map US is live
Hi all, I've just oredered a ticket for this. I live in Australia but I hope it's ok if I attend a local chapter event like this. I do have some US credentials. I've driven and mapped extensively in California, and Colarado and Nevada and armchairmapped in a few other states as well. I believe that SOTM Tokyo was the most important SOTM ever and likewise I am sure this SOTM-US will be the most important one ever since we do stand at so many crossroads right now and I don't want to miss out on any of it. PS - I have a mapping party planned in Australia in two years time, and I would really like to talk to someone from NASA about their cool remote controlled vehicle that we saw in Tokyo!!! PPS - I Haven't applied for leave yet but I hope that won't be a problem! Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remapping tips
Mike wrote "Each area will need to be evaluated as to when a feed will be resumed." Mike, I think it is unreasonable to expect the average sat-nav user to selectively update just bits of their data based on the progress with data replacement. They don't want to know about the licence change or inner workings of the OSM community, they just want accurate up to date routable data that can be downloaded easily into their GPS. They are not going to be able to build their own maps from slices of OSM data. Therefore if remapping isn't done (urgently) then the users will have to freeze the updates and miss out on all the new roads that are built after the licence changeover. This is a real shame since being right up to date is one of OSM's greatest strengths. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remapping tips
andrzej wrote "my personal appeal is that you spend the time between now and April 1 mapping one of the so many blank spots in OSM" I totally disagree, There are real people out there actually using OSM Data for car navigation, cycle navigation etc.. For the OSM data to become unroutable when that is so easily avoided would be unthinkable. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Remapping tips
Firstly - don't listen to those who see blobs of red on OSMI and say "we're all doomed" - This is a very overly pessimistic view. Instead, have a look at the Cleanmap of, for example, L.A. http://cleanmap.poole.ch/?zoom=11&=&lat=34.04097&lon=-118.05841&layers=B00 It seems that L.A. is almost complete. However this is a slightly optimistic view. Now check out the Badmap http://cleanmap.poole.ch/?zoom=11&=&lat=34.04097&lon=-118.05841&layers=00B Now you see that while L.A. is in pretty good shape, there is, in fact, quite a bit of work to do, especially in the Glendale, Burbank areas. You are very lucky that in the USA you have a clean source of street names (TIGER 2011) so the effort to remap a road is minimal. The simple ones take about a minute, to remove the way plus any intersection dirty nodes, trace in a new one from BING and the TIGER centerline, paste in some source tags and highway=residential tag from a copy buffer and copy in the TIGER 2011 name from the TMS overlay (remembering to un-abreviate as you go). Some roads are (unfortunately) glued to landuse polygons. For these you need to unglue first to make room for the road replacement. These take a lot more time but, hopefully, there are not too many of these. Only retreive clean tags for the way or any nodes. If a traffic signal tag on a node is dirty, just blow it away. Then If you can identify the signals by pavement markings on the BIng imagery, put them in. I'll be doing bits of L.A but will be spending most of my time trying to salvage Australia, so when you've finished the US come help me down here!! ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remapping is good
Ok I've found a few more close typos Gassen not Glassen Tropico not Tropica Parrish not Parish Lavell not lavel Pleasant View not Pleasent View Seymour not Seymore Arroyo Seco not Aroyo Seco Shilburn not Shelburn I've have not fixed the Parrish/Lavell ones since there is something really wrong with either or both of OSM and TIGER. I believe that this area really needs another survey. It would be great if TIGER2011 could be in one half of Frederik's compare tool and OSM in the other, however putting Google in the other half allows you to easily spot where there are potential spelling mistakes in the OSM data. I think there will be many hundreds of errors in LA alone and finding them all would increase the accuracy of the OSM data by a LOT. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remapping is good
Nathan wrote >On 1/31/2012 4:07 PM, Nick Hocking wrote: >>* Blimey - two streets up from Arvia, Asbury Street was incorrectly *>>* named in OSM as Ashbury. *>>* Just how many typos are there in L.A. *>>* Hey - now there's a good idead for a competition!!! * >What you mean is that imports are better than surveying (since mappers >make typos). The correctness of this is left to the reader No, What I mean is that any info in OSM should be desk checked at least once by another mapper. When I mapped Canberra, I desk checked everything at least twice against about four independent sources. Where there were any discrepencies, I resurveyed the road/s in question to get the correct data, and yes, some of the typos were mine. In about a dozen cases I could prove that the street sign was wrong and the government fixed these in less than two months. Now, the real question is, is there a programatic way to check OSM against TIGER2011 and report and naming differences? Being able to do this would be of enormous benifit to OSM in the USA. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Remapping is good
Blimey - two streets up from Arvia, Asbury Street was incorrectly named in OSM as Ashbury. Just how many typos are there in L.A. Hey - now there's a good idead for a competition!!! ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Remapping is good
This morning I decided to remap another street off Cypress Avenue L.A. I randomly choose "Ariva Street" and lo and behold the TIGER2011 overlay said that it was Arvia Street. TIGER is usually spot on with names and since a Bing search and Google maps/street view also agree about "Arvia" this street is now correctly named (courtesy of TIGER). Luckily I also checked around the neighbourhood and found that, last night I had messed up Pepper Av (now fixed). If people are going to spend an entire night armchair mapping, wouldn't it be great if they all remapped L.A. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] LA and other license changeover challenged areas.
martjin wrote "I'd say knowing what they look like + Bing is sufficient if the road markings are actually there (not only the lane separator linear markings - that's too ambiguous). " Ok - I have remapped Cypress Avenue and the intersection at Verdugo Road using only Bing and TIGER. I have added a few traffic signals and one crossing and have inferred two turn restrictions from Bing imagery of pavement markings. However I have one problem. Just North of the San Fernando - Verdugo intersection is a small oneway connection road from Cypress Avenue/Eagle Rock Boulevard. Previously in OSM it was tagged as Part of Eagle Rock Boulevard and Google Street View seems to confirm this. However The TIGER 2011 Josm layer does not have this named or maybe it is not rendering. Using MARPLOT with TIGER 2010 data I see it named as part of San Fernando Road which is what I have had to put into OSM. Can anyone tell me if TIGER 2011 has this named or does any one have personal knowledge of the correct name. If not then I will try to organise someone in L.A. to take a run past that intersection. Please feel free to tell me if I've messed up anything here or if you think that I've infringed anyones Copyright. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] LA and other license changeover challenged areas.
Nathan wrote >On 1/30/2012 7:05 AM, Nick Hocking wrote: >> Be carefull with intersecting road Cypress Avenue, we can't recover the >> cycleway tag unless you yourself have personal knowledge of this. >The bike lane markings can (barely) be seen on Bing aerials. Thanks for that Nathan, Google street view clearly shows these markings as "Bike Lane" with an arrow pointing ahead. In all honesty I can't absolutely read this with Bing aerials but knowing what these markings look like and their position at the intersection, the Bing marking couldn't really be anything else, (or could they?) Corner of Alice Street is about the clearest one I can find. So what is the consensus, is the Bing imagery adequete for an armchair mapper to claim the cycle lane or could Google claim that I cheated. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] LA and other license changeover challenged areas.
I have just "saved" one street in L.A. (Loosmore Street) and hereby award myself one SLAP (Save L.A. Point). I mapped the geometry from Bing and the tags from TIGER 2011 and set the source tag to reflect this. I didn't reuse any nodes. Anyone can earn themselves a SLAP by remapping any road close to (I.E intersecting or " next to") a previously SLAPped road. Be carefull with intersecting road Cypress Avenue, we can't recover the cycleway tag unless you yourself have personal knowledge of this. SLAP points can be redeemed for beer next time I'm in L.A, this could be a year or two. The redemption rate wil be determined by me as will be the type of beer (I'm leaning toward Fat Tyre or Moose Drool or maybe an Australian beer). ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Shootout in Vegas
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=35.996927&lon=-114.925865&zoom=18&layers=M TIGER 2011, google maps, and some other sources show the intersection as Shootout Place and Cattle Ranch Place. However TIGER 2010 and Google Streetview indicate the inersection is between Gold Camp Street and Cattle Ranch Place. I have put TIGER 2011 into OSM. If someone is driving past, could they clarify this for me please? Also just South of this, it appears that Pistol Perry Parkway is gated. Bing imagery is not conclusive so if a real mapper could verify this, that would be great. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Finding new roads
Toby wrote
"Alternatively, we could grow the community and not have to rely on
TIGER. This also seems hard though :("
Yes that has always been the issue with TIGER imports,
even the original one.
At some stage we need to decide to be the best there is rather than
"just as good as the last TIGER"
We probably need two local mappers per million people just to
keep the roads up to date.
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[Talk-us] Finding new roads
I believe that OSm's most usefull attribute is to be up to date. The only real way to do this is with a local mapper but bringing the USA up to Tiger 2011 up-to-datedness would be a great start. Are there tools to 1. Compare named OSM roads with Tiger 2011 roads and highlight just the new ones. 2.Compare Bing imagery with Tiger 2011 and highlight any apparent sealed roads that do not have Tiger 2011 ways. Roads currently traced but not named can already be targeted well using OSMI highways facility and could be fixed first. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER 2011 Road Tiles
Thanks Ian, This in conjunctin with Bing imagery makes finding new neighbourhoods really easy. Of course at the same time I always clean up a few nearby decliner edits as well. And where a decliner has "taken over " a Tiger road it is now very easy to just blow it away and remap it from the new Tiger stuff. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER 2011 Release
Ok thanks all - I've got it now and that little cancerous bit in Parachute should disappear soon :-) BTW, it is interesting (to say the least) that hte TIGER 2011 data appears to have address info in it for all roads. Once the licence change is complete and our dat is stable then this must be of considerable interest Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] TIGER 2011 Release
Is this available, somewhere, in OSM format. There's a neighborhood in Parachute, Colorado, that wasn't in the original Tiger but has been added by a decliner, that I'd like to remap. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Grand Jnction Update - TIGER 2010
OK I've moved all the old TIGER roads into line with the imagery and added in all the newer TIGER 2010 roads (a hundred at least). I've got a big cleanup to do and then moving hundreds of drains underground, relocating canals and train lines to fit the imagery and adding bridges level crossings, traffic lights etc etc... There are some new roads that are not in TIGER 2010. For example near K and 18 roads in Fruita Where the Colorado website has Richwood Avenue and Woodland Avenue. Does anyone know who I could e-mail from the Grand JUnction Council to find out which roads (and their rough location) have been built in the last year? I'm about to start comparing OSM coverage with the Bing imagery, street by street to try to find new roads that I need to survey when I'm there in September. Also there are unresolved issues of whether it is Scarlet Drive or Scarlet Street (near 23rd and I 70) and whether step-aside drive is partly Glen Caro drive or not (near G and 23 1/2) I also now need to get all the roads the correct type (motorway, primary etc) and then fix the relations I broke by duplicating the I 70 Business loop. If anyone can let me know of any other roads/neighbourhoods etc that I need to survey properly, it would be greatly appreciated. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Grand Junction + TIGER2010
Richard wrote some parts of TIGER 2010 are no doubt excellent and worth the effort to use to improve OSM. but TIGER is erratic enough that i don't think we should hold it up as a "standard". Absolutely agree. I was troubled using the word standard because of the exact reason youi give. I was looking for a word that gave the impression that TIGER 2010 has many more "newer" roads than the old TIGER, even if they are in the wrong geometry. I was thinking of saying "up to TIGER 2010 quantity" but that doesn't sound right either. I can only come up with "up to TIGER 2010 updatedness" which sound a bit wimpy to me. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Grand Junction + TIGER 2010
Thanks Mike, I've just had a bit of a play with this and have it pretty much under control. I've added four or five new roads. The method works well. I guess that I've now got about twenty hours of hard work to bring Grand Junction up to TIGER 2010 standard. My sequence to add a new "neighbourhood is" Set inactive layer to bright colour Hide Bing Activate old layer Look for bright "new" TIGER 2010 road with no old road coexisting Activate new layer Select new road/s Edit->Merge selection (into old layer) Activate old layer and hide new layer show bing Attach new roads to existing roads and each other if necessary Combine same named segments. Tools->Simplify-way for each new road. Manual realign-cleanup-add turning circle etc. Upload Show new layer ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Grand Junction + TIGER 2010
On Mon, Jun 27, 2011 at 12:10 AM, Ian Dees wrote: > > Can I suggest that instead you open the TIGER data file as a separate layer > in JOSM so you can copy new data from the TIGER layer to the OSM layer. > There's no point in tracing from rasters if the data already exists as > vectors. > > >> >> What would be really usefull is to have OSM in one of the geofabrik >> compare windows and TIGER 2010 in the other. Is there an easy way to achieve >> this? >> >> > > I'm working on this. I should have something useful pretty quickly after > the new OSM US server gets set up at the new data center some time next > week. > > OK, thanks Ian, Yes I'll do it that way. Though it's after Mignight I couldn't resist doing just a couple ot roads. And I find that where the old TIGER had B 1/2 Road, the TIGER 2010 has B 50/100 Road. Does anyone know if this is correct and are they renaming roads in this manner in order to have more possibilities in between? ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Grand Junction + TIGER 2010
Mike N wrote " I converted a copy of Mesa County for your use:" Thanks MIke, that's great!! I just opened it in Josm and looked at one "new" estate. All the roads are there and named. Even Riverside Parkway is there complete!. I think I've got about 50 hours work to bring Grand Junction up to TIGER 2010. What I'll do is have the current OSM data in one JOSM window with Bing Imagery and your TIGER 2010 data in another. Then I'll just use the imagery to trace the road and type the name and other tags from the other window. Painfull I know but it'll kill off quite a few winter nights. What would be really usefull is to have OSM in one of the geofabrik compare windows and TIGER 2010 in the other. Is there an easy way to achieve this? Then maybe a couple of days real mapping in Grand Junction will bring the place (roadwise anyway) up to date. When I get there the very first thing I'm going to do is see if the road "22 75/100" really exists. TIGER and Google say yes, but other maps say no. Once again, many thanks Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Grand Junction + TIGER 2010
I'm coming along reasonably well with turning the original TIGER data green for Grand Junction (Colorado). Along the way I see that there is an enormous number of missing roads (new roads). Most of these, hopefully, are in the TIGEDR 2010 data. Is there a place that I can view the TIGER 2010 data so that I can edit in, road by road (with their names), the new roads into OSM? Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Road Trip to SotM
Hi Kate, The trip from Grand Junction over to Pueblo looks (on the map) really interesting. I'll plan (tentatively) to get to Pueblo about lunch time on the 7th Does anyone know of any "unmissable" things to see/do on the US 50? Cheers Nick Hi All,I know there was some talk about the GeoBus for State of the Map. Well, on a much smaller scale myself and Iván Sánchez are going to drive from Washington D.C. to Denver. This is a one way trip and I plan to sell my car at the end. Anyway if anyone is interested in meeting up along the way here is now currently tentative schedule including dates.DC Sept 1Knoxville Sept 2 Memphis Sept 3Dallas Sept 4Dallas Sept 5Amarillo Sept 6Pueblo CO Sept 7 Denver Sept 8See you at SotM!-Kate ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Proposed mapping party
Hi all, I am proposing the worlds first PIMP (Proxy Individual Mapping Party). How it goes would be like this. Once I have finished turning Grand Junction from red to green (in about 1 week), then lots of you (from all over the world) could check what OSM has against all possible mapping sources (both maps and imagery). Where there are any differences or omissions or just confusions then we could make a list of these locations. I would then plan a route (on my latest favourite sat-nav device) to visit all these locations. Then I would (either by myself in a car or with another passenger/geo-photographer) map all the differences that I/we can in two days. Once entered into OSm then OSM/Grand junction would be pretty much usable for tourists etc. I'd leave POI's for others to do, I'm only interested in roads their names and any turn restrictions. Maybe keen eyed people could spot one way roads than I/we could check on. Since I'd be in a rental car. I'd best restrict myself to just paved roads. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] It's taken awhile but....
It's taken a couple or years but finally a top mapper has really improved on some basic mapping I did in Las Vagas. I think they used personnel notes plus Bing imagery and have really fleshed out Bellagio and quite a lot of other Casinos. (although Encore is still woefully bad). That has just decided me to holiday this year, again in Las Vegas (rather than my planned Queensland trip). I'll stay first at Mandalay Bay (since they have a wave pool, and their mapping could use a bit of TLC) then Encore, so that I can improve that a bit. Then since Vegas is so close to Denver, I'll register for the SOTM. Are there any mapping parties near Denver planned just before or just after the SOTM? In order to repay Colorado for hosting the SOTM, maybe all registrants could spend (say) 10 hours pushing Colorado Tiger data around to fit Bing imagery. I'll finish off Grand Juction over the next few weeks and on my way to Denver (from Vegas) I'll map for a couple of days in Grand Junction to try to map all the new roads. I've just done a bit more Tiger pushing and unfortunately it seems that Grand Junction REALLY needs a few months work from a keen local mapper. OK - this should be fun! Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] TIGER Edited viewer refresh
Does anyone know how often this map will be updated? ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger Data 2007
"I don't see it as "corrupting". It's not mangling the mapper's work in any way. If they don't like the new overlapping road, then just delete the TIGER one." Ok - We've hit an impass then. You can't "just hit delete" You have to merge all the duplicated data in order to make the way/area sane It takes much more effort than to originally edit in the new road. So you have not just mangled the mappers works you've actually turned it into negative value content for the OSM dataset. I'll leave you with one more comment that I can assure you I don't mean to be inflamatory, but I would understand if you take it so. There can only be two winners from a bulk upload of Tiger data Tele Atlas and Navteq. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
"Well, #2 would be nice but it would be tricky to detect a collision with an existing way. Frankly, because the first TIGER import was done, the number of completely new ways that would be added in a new import would be small, and the number of those ways that conflict with ways added manually by editors would be even smaller. So, I think it's a small sacrifice to have to remove a few duplicated roads in exchange for county-wide improved accuracy." Karl, I agree #2 could be tricky but I believe it is essential. I don't think you can corrupt someones edits and then say to them "sorry, we decided to sacrifice your hard work because we determined that it was for the greater good." It hope that is not the OSM way. Also I despute your statement of "a few" but notwithstanding that, this is not a numbers game.. "gee officer - I only killed a few people - there are hundreds left" is not going to get you very far. Still, I will say that if the numbers of duplicated way are so few then I think that the person who creates the duplicated ways should also fix them up. Then I'd have no problem with the uploads so long as rules 1 and 3 are also kept. I would repeat that unless the new data has most of the non existant roads gone and has dual carriageway interstates, then I'd give it a miss anyway. I.E roads down by at least 40%. Motorways up by 100%. Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
I consider that your bulk upload script is in exactly the same boat as an automaitc edit script. As such I think that it should adhere to the code of conduct for automatic editors, one point of which is to respect others' edits. To me, this means, don't revert or corrupt others' edits. To achieve this your script only needs to follow three rules. 1)Do not modify or delete any data unless you are upgrading unmodified tiger data 2) Do not place a way if it already exists, unless you are replacing an unmodified tiger way. 3) Do not add a way or part thereof if it has been deleted by a user. Breaking rules 1 or 3 would be, in essence, reverting a user's edit. Breaking rule 2 would be corrupting it If you can manage to make your script follow all three rules then I can't see anyone having any problems. On a more infalmatory note, I checked with yahoo and google and it seems that in a LOT or areas more than half of the tiger roads don't actually exist. The mappers must have been paid by the road :-) Is tiger 2007 any better in this regard and does it yet have dual carriageways for all the interstates? Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
If by "not disturbing existing edits" you include the overlaying of other data on top of existing ones, then I completely agree. Also there are countless non-existant roads crossing the interstates. These have had to be deleted and I agree, must never come back. And yes I agree that any altered tiger data should be left just as is and no ways added. I don't agree that new tiger data should ever be overlaid. It should replace old unmodified tiger data and should not be added near any other data. This would just repeat the cycle where good data is degraded by the overlay of older info and must then be re-edited. My observation is that OSM mappers produce more accurate and uptodate data than any one else. Therefore if the bulk uploading interferes with OSM data then the quality of the OSM data will be degraded. PS - if you see this line then this post hasn't been truncated ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
Dale, I don't think it's reasonable to expect mappers to continually go over the areas they have contributed to in order to remove obosolete ways bulk-loaded over their own. I think it best to hold off more editing untill the last tiger import is complete. Heck - the 2015 bulk upload may even have dual carriageways for the interstates. I kid you not the Tiger interstates are woefull from a routing perspective. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
Steve What would constitute "significant edits? Let's say I fix up the interstate for the entire length of its run through a county but make no other improvements. Are these "significant edits or would I find Tiger's version of an interstate reapplied over my own. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
Please see Golden Canyon Road in Death Valley. It shows the problems with auto uploads. I've put my original response in a diary entry. Not sure why it kept getting truncated. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
I'll keep trying one paragraph at at time if necessary - sorry 'bout this. If it fails then I'll write a diary entry. >From my own experience I noticed some problems as well. My travels took me through my second most favourite place on earth - Death Valley. When I went to edit in the tracks I noticed that on Badwater road there were two roads (and still are). One edited in by 80n and another uploaded Tiger one and both intertwined. Since then another mapper has made some improvements to the Tiger one although he has not yet removed the reviewed tag. I've also been slack in this respect but am in the process of fixing this. More serious is the situation of Golden Canyon Road. I walked up this washway a small way (as you can see from my gps tracks) but didn't want to repeat the fatal decision of a German Tourist so I quickly went back to the car. This was in mid summer. Google Earth readily shows the correct nature of the car park area and washway status. 80n has this tagged correctly as "footway" but Tiger declares it highway, residential, a most incorrect tagging, and dangerous as well. Needless to say these two ways are intertwined as well. I haven't looked up the edit dates but I'll take a bet that 80n didn't edit in this footway and not realise that there was an incorrect residential way already mapped. I had already fixed up the other end of this track (at Zabriski Point) but had put the whole area in the too hard basket and decided that when I finally get my tracks all edited in, I would attempt to fix up Death Valley. I had also noticed problems in San Francisco, where there were two Lombard Streets on top of each other, one with the squiggly bit straight. Fortunately someone has corrected this. On a side note, I believe that the correct thing to do is to just delete the "Tiger reviewed" tag rather than turn it to "yes". Is this correct? I'm firmly convinced that automatic uploads should only go into areas where there are NO user edited nodes or ways. Other updates need to be done manully to avoid data corruption. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
3rd try - last two posts apprear to have been truncated. "Again, let's calm down a little bit. Were you around for the last import? Did you see how I handled data conflicts in that one? Was there a problem there that needs fixing this time around?" Yes I think there were problems. There have been some diary entries bemoaning the fact that their edits had been blown away by the Tiger data upload. >From my own experience I noticed some problems as well. My travels took me through my second most favourite place on earth - Death Valley. When I went to edit in the tracks I noticed that on Badwater road there were two roads (and still are). One edited in by 80n and another uploaded Tiger one and both intertwined. Since then another mapper has made some improvements to the Tiger one although he has not yet removed the reviewed tag. I've also been slack in this respect but am in the process of fixing this. More serious is the situation of Golden Canyon Road. I walked up this washway a small way (as you can see from my gps tracks) but didn't want to repeat the fatal decision of a German Tourist so I quickly went back to the car. This was in mid summer. Google Earth readily shows the correct nature of the car park area and washway status. 80n has this tagged correctly as "footway" but Tiger declares it highway, residential, a most incorrect tagging, and dangerous as well. Needless to say these two ways are intertwined as well. I haven't looked up the edit dates but I'll take a bet that 80n didn't edit in this footway and not realise that there was an incorrect residential way already mapped. I had already fixed up the other end of this track (at Zabriski Point) but had put the whole area in the too hard basket and decided that when I finally get my tracks all edited in, I would attempt to fix up Death Valley. I had also noticed problems in San Francisco, where there were two Lombard Streets on top of each other, one with the squiggly bit straight. Fortunately someone has corrected this. On a side note, I believe that the correct thing to do is to just delete the "Tiger reviewed" tag rather than turn it to "yes". Is this correct? I'm firmly convinced that automatic uploads should only go into areas where there are NO user edited nodes or ways. Other updates need to be done manully to avoid data corruption. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
I'll try again - last post appreas to have been truncated. "Again, let's calm down a little bit. Were you around for the last import? Did you see how I handled data conflicts in that one? Was there a problem there that needs fixing this time around?" Yes I think there were problems. There have been some diary entries bemoaning the fact that their edits had been blown away by the Tiger data upload. >From my own experience I noticed some problems as well. My travels took me through my second most favourite place on earth - Death Valley. When I went to edit in the tracks I noticed that on Badwater road there were two roads (and still are). One edited in by 80n and another uploaded Tiger one and both intertwined. Since then another mapper has made some improvements to the Tiger one although he has not yet removed the reviewed tag. I've also been slack in this respect but am in the process of fixing this. More serious is the situation of Golden Canyon Road. I walked up this washway a small way (as you can see from my gps tracks) but didn't want to repeat the fatal decision of a German Tourist so I quickly went back to the car. This was in mid summer. Google Earth readily shows the correct nature of the car park area and washway status. 80n has this tagged correctly as "footway" but Tiger declares it highway, residential, a most incorrect tagging, and dangerous as well. Needless to say these two ways are intertwined as well. I haven't looked up the edit dates but I'll take a bet that 80n didn't edit in this footway and not realise that there was an incorrect residential way already mapped. I had already fixed up the other end of this track (at Zabriski Point) but had put the whole area in the too hard basket and decided that when I finally get my tracks all edited in, I would attempt to fix up Death Valley. I had also noticed problems in San Francisco, where there were two Lombard Streets on top of each other, one with the squiggly bit straight. Fortunately someone has corrected this. On a side note, I believe that the correct thing to do is to just delete the "Tiger reviewed" tag rather than turn it to "yes". Is this correct? I'm firmly convinced that automatic uploads should only go into areas where there are NO user edited nodes or ways. Other updates need to be done manully to avoid data corruption. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tiger 2007 data
"Again, let's calm down a little bit. Were you around for the last import? Did you see how I handled data conflicts in that one? Was there a problem there that needs fixing this time around?" Yes I think there were problems. There have been some diary entries bemoaning the fact that their edits had been blown away by the Tiger data upload. >From my own experience I noticed some problems as well. My travels took me through my second most favourite place on earth - Death Valley. When I went to edit in the tracks I noticed that on Badwater road there were two roads (and still are). One edited in by 80n and another uploaded Tiger one and both intertwined. Since then another mapper has made some improvements to the Tiger one although he has not yet removed the reviewed tag. I've also been slack in this respect but am in the process of fixing this. More serious is the situation of Golden Canyon Road. I walked up this washway a small way (as you can see from my gps tracks) but didn't want to repeat the fatal decision of a German Tourist so I quickly went back to the car. This was in mid summer. Google Earth readily shows the correct nature of the car park area and washway status. 80n has this tagged correctly as "footway" but Tiger declares it highway, residential, a most incorrect tagging, and dangerous as well. Needless to say these two ways are intertwined as well. I haven't looked up the edit dates but I'll take a bet that 80n didn't edit in this footway and not realise that there was an incorrect residential way already mapped. I had already fixed up the other end of this track (at Zabriski Point) but had put the whole area in the too hard basket and decided that when I finally get my tracks all edited in, I would attempt to fix up Death Valley. I had also noticed problems in San Francisco, where there were two Lombard Streets on top of each other, one with the squiggly bit straight. Fortunately someone has corrected this. On a side note, I believe that the correct thing to do is to just delete the "Tiger reviewed" tag rather than turn it to "yes". Is this correct? I'm firmly convinced that automatic uploads should only go into areas where there are NO user edited nodes or ways. Other updates need to be done manully to avoid data corruption. Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
[Talk-us] Tiger 2007 Data
Hi Dave, Can you confirm that any bulk upload of Tiger 2007 date will not erase or be overlaid over/under/alongside any existing user edits. On my last US trip I've got about 6000 miles of gps tracks. I've only edited in a few hundred miles of them so far but am reluctant to do any more work if the Tiger 2007 data will destroy what I've done so far. Destroying (or corrupting) existing edits would nullify the current efforts by Cloudmade to enhance a US community (IMHO). Cheers Nick ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
