[vUDS Blueprint 13.10] Server support for 12.04.3/3.8 kernel
Hi List During the last 6 months, we shipped 12.04.2, the most recent point release for Ubuntu 12.04 LTS. This included the new hardware enablement kernel from quantal (3.5) which is great; however this update (which was opt-in) broke quite a few DKMS packages which are popular with server users; I specifically worked on openvswitch and iscsitarget but I'm aware of other impacts. I think that we should try to deal with this more pro-actively for 12.04.3 which will include the hardware enablement kernel from raring (3.8). This has some nice features including native VXLAN support which will be interesting to OpenStack Havana Quantum users. So for 12.04.3 I propose we undertake the following server team activities: 1) As soon as the HWE 3.8 kernel is available (which I think should be soon/already), we regression test all server related DKMS packages; we need a list of these - I'll start with: iscsitarget openvswitch Bugs should be raise for any failures introduced by the new kernel version. 2) Fix bugs; this might actually mean introducing a new upstream version of a DKMS based package. Specifically I'd like to see if we could introduce a new openvswitch stable release; 1.4.x is going to get extremely distro patch heavy to fully support the 3.8 kernel (which makes me very uncomfortable), whereas 1.9.0 (the next stable release) already supports up to 3.8. This might mean introducing a parallel 1.9.0 package alongside the 1.4.x package we already have. The objective of this work is to ensure that server users have a well documented and smooth upgrade path to using the 3.8 hardware enablement kernel on Ubuntu 12.04. Anyone want to add more packages to that list to test/fix? Cheers James -- James Page Ubuntu Core Developer Debian Maintainer james.p...@ubuntu.com -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
On 06/02/2010 03:14 AM, Thierry Carrez wrote: How about: Ubuntu Server development, discussion and support | For general (not server specific) questions visit #ubuntu | Get involved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/GettingInvolved | Be patient. Don't ask to ask, just ask. | Docs and resources: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/ +1 -- Peter Matulis | GPG 34F740E8 Ubuntu Support Team | Canonical Ltd. (canonical.com) -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
[Bug 520309] Re: [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support
** Changed in: intel Status: New = Fix Released -- [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/520309 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Server Team, which is subscribed to multipath-tools in ubuntu. -- Ubuntu-server-bugs mailing list Ubuntu-server-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server-bugs
Re: Server Support
Mathias Gug wrote: In my case, actually having those unanswered questions kind of prevent me from using the channel for random development chat. I don't feel like appearing as an insensitive developer that continues his work and jokes with co-workers while people beg for help on the channel. And most of the time I could help them, if only I had the free time[tm] to do so. I understand that feeling. One perspective could be to set the expectations right: answers given in the channel are done on a best effort basis. And one should not be offended if their questions aren't answered even if people are chatting in the channel. If I'm the only one bothered by this, I have no issue keeping the status quo. The current help factoids states: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) How about splitting out the help factoid to include a statement about setting the expectations right: Thanks for stopping by and ask for help. We'll try to help you out on a best effort basis. If anyone knows the answer they will probably reply. If you have a serious problem you may wanna opt for another support option available at http://www.ubuntu.com/support/. When someone asks a question one could always use the help factoid to set their expectations right. Maybe the channel topic should be updated to reflect that development is the main thing we discuss on this channel ? Currently it shows: Ubuntu Server discussion and support | For general (not server specific) support visit #ubuntu | IRC Guidelines: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines | Get involved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/GettingInvolved | Be patient. Don't ask to ask, just ask. | Docs and resources: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/ How about: Ubuntu Server development, discussion and support | For general (not server specific) questions visit #ubuntu | Get involved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/GettingInvolved | Be patient. Don't ask to ask, just ask. | Docs and resources: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/ Then it wouldn't feel so awkward to ignore support questions to discuss development issues. -- Thierry Carrez Ubuntu server team -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
Thierry Carrez thierry.car...@ubuntu.com wrote: Mathias Gug wrote: In my case, actually having those unanswered questions kind of prevent me from using the channel for random development chat. I don't feel like appearing as an insensitive developer that continues his work and jokes with co-workers while people beg for help on the channel. And most of the time I could help them, if only I had the free time[tm] to do so. I understand that feeling. One perspective could be to set the expectations right: answers given in the channel are done on a best effort basis. And one should not be offended if their questions aren't answered even if people are chatting in the channel. If I'm the only one bothered by this, I have no issue keeping the status quo. The current help factoids states: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) How about splitting out the help factoid to include a statement about setting the expectations right: Thanks for stopping by and ask for help. We'll try to help you out on a best effort basis. If anyone knows the answer they will probably reply. If you have a serious problem you may wanna opt for another support option available at http://www.ubuntu.com/support/. When someone asks a question one could always use the help factoid to set their expectations right. Maybe the channel topic should be updated to reflect that development is the main thing we discuss on this channel ? Currently it shows: Ubuntu Server discussion and support | For general (not server specific) support visit #ubuntu | IRC Guidelines: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines | Get involved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/GettingInvolved | Be patient. Don't ask to ask, just ask. | Docs and resources: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/ How about: Ubuntu Server development, discussion and support | For general (not server specific) questions visit #ubuntu | Get involved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/GettingInvolved | Be patient. Don't ask to ask, just ask. | Docs and resources: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/ Then it wouldn't feel so awkward to ignore support questions to discuss development issues. I'm fine with that. Scott K -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
Hi, On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 12:16:20PM +0200, Thierry Carrez wrote: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. Jorge Castro was present and said he noticed the Ubuntu Server team didn't really chat in #ubuntu-server at all, and the channel was quite dead from a team discussion perspective. It was just made of unanswered support questions that echoed in a big void, which looked bad. In my case, actually having those unanswered questions kind of prevent me from using the channel for random development chat. I don't feel like appearing as an insensitive developer that continues his work and jokes with co-workers while people beg for help on the channel. And most of the time I could help them, if only I had the free time[tm] to do so. I understand that feeling. One perspective could be to set the expectations right: answers given in the channel are done on a best effort basis. And one should not be offended if their questions aren't answered even if people are chatting in the channel. The current help factoids states: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) How about splitting out the help factoid to include a statement about setting the expectations right: Thanks for stopping by and ask for help. We'll try to help you out on a best effort basis. If anyone knows the answer they will probably reply. If you have a serious problem you may wanna opt for another support option available at http://www.ubuntu.com/support/. When someone asks a question one could always use the help factoid to set their expectations right. So I support the idea that having a separate support channel for -server would result in a more lively server development channel, where you could chat about development without (directly) appearing like a careless bastard^H^H overworked person. When/if I have time to do server support, I move to the other channel and answer questions. There is value in having separated topics. IMO the traffic in #ubuntu-server doesn't warrant the creation of another channel for now. We can revisit the idea of a channel split (ie #ubuntu-server-devel) if the traffic in #ubuntu-server increases to the point where it's becomes counter-productive. -- Mathias Gug Ubuntu Developer http://www.ubuntu.com -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
Soren Hansen wrote: On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 10:54:17PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: One of the work items listed in: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-community is now: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. Oh, wow. I completely missed this. Thanks for pointing this out. I hope this is just a suggestion someone put into the Gobby doc at UDS, rather than an actual work item. Mathias, you're set as the drafter. Can you chime in, please? I can chime in, I was there. Jorge Castro was present and said he noticed the Ubuntu Server team didn't really chat in #ubuntu-server at all, and the channel was quite dead from a team discussion perspective. It was just made of unanswered support questions that echoed in a big void, which looked bad. In my case, actually having those unanswered questions kind of prevent me from using the channel for random development chat. I don't feel like appearing as an insensitive developer that continues his work and jokes with co-workers while people beg for help on the channel. And most of the time I could help them, if only I had the free time[tm] to do so. So I support the idea that having a separate support channel for -server would result in a more lively server development channel, where you could chat about development without (directly) appearing like a careless bastard^H^H overworked person. When/if I have time to do server support, I move to the other channel and answer questions. There is value in having separated topics. That said, I agree that support should go somewhere well defined, rather than just being removed from topic. I've no opinion on how best to separate them: * #ubuntu-server = dev // #??? = support * #ubuntu-server = support // #ubuntu-server-dev = dev * ... The second option might actually be more discoverable, since developers will know where development talk occurs, while it's difficult to change the habits of the unwashed masses. -- Thierry Carrez Ubuntu server team -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
Thierry Carrez thierry.car...@ubuntu.com wrote: Soren Hansen wrote: On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 10:54:17PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: One of the work items listed in: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-community is now: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. Oh, wow. I completely missed this. Thanks for pointing this out. I hope this is just a suggestion someone put into the Gobby doc at UDS, rather than an actual work item. Mathias, you're set as the drafter. Can you chime in, please? I can chime in, I was there. Jorge Castro was present and said he noticed the Ubuntu Server team didn't really chat in #ubuntu-server at all, and the channel was quite dead from a team discussion perspective. It was just made of unanswered support questions that echoed in a big void, which looked bad. In my case, actually having those unanswered questions kind of prevent me from using the channel for random development chat. I don't feel like appearing as an insensitive developer that continues his work and jokes with co-workers while people beg for help on the channel. And most of the time I could help them, if only I had the free time[tm] to do so. So I support the idea that having a separate support channel for -server would result in a more lively server development channel, where you could chat about development without (directly) appearing like a careless bastard^H^H overworked person. When/if I have time to do server support, I move to the other channel and answer questions. There is value in having separated topics. That said, I agree that support should go somewhere well defined, rather than just being removed from topic. I've no opinion on how best to separate them: * #ubuntu-server = dev // #??? = support * #ubuntu-server = support // #ubuntu-server-dev = dev * ... The second option might actually be more discoverable, since developers will know where development talk occurs, while it's difficult to change the habits of the unwashed masses. And yet I regularly hear Canonical wishing for more engagement from the server community in development activities. I think if you would invest some time in engaging this community instead of avoiding it you would get more engagement in return. I mix development discussion with other support related chat and don't sense any negativity from it. The most I have to do is occasionally tell someone I either don't have time to help them or don't know the answer to their question. Generally people understand this. I think only once or twice in years was this a problem. I think your reticence to use the channel is the thing that needs changing here, not the channel. Scott K -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 06:40:23AM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: Thierry Carrez thierry.car...@ubuntu.com wrote: I can chime in, I was there. Jorge Castro was present and said he noticed the Ubuntu Server team didn't really chat in #ubuntu-server at all, and the channel was quite dead from a team discussion perspective. It was just made of unanswered support questions that echoed in a big void, which looked bad. In my case, actually having those unanswered questions kind of prevent me from using the channel for random development chat. I don't feel like appearing as an insensitive developer that continues his work and jokes with co-workers while people beg for help on the channel. And most of the time I could help them, if only I had the free time[tm] to do so. So I support the idea that having a separate support channel for -server would result in a more lively server development channel, where you could chat about development without (directly) appearing like a careless bastard^H^H overworked person. When/if I have time to do server support, I move to the other channel and answer questions. There is value in having separated topics. That said, I agree that support should go somewhere well defined, rather than just being removed from topic. I've no opinion on how best to separate them: * #ubuntu-server = dev // #??? = support * #ubuntu-server = support // #ubuntu-server-dev = dev * ... The second option might actually be more discoverable, since developers will know where development talk occurs, while it's difficult to change the habits of the unwashed masses. And yet I regularly hear Canonical wishing for more engagement from the server community in development activities. I think if you would invest some time in engaging this community instead of avoiding it you would get more engagement in return. I mix development discussion with other support related chat and don't sense any negativity from it. The most I have to do is occasionally tell someone I either don't have time to help them or don't know the answer to their question. Generally people understand this. I think only once or twice in years was this a problem. I think your reticence to use the channel is the thing that needs changing here, not the channel. Scott K Thanks for the background, Thierry, and to Soren and Scott for helping flesh it out. It sounds like the biggest issue is that we need better support for server users, and that should be reflected in the blueprint. If we can successfully encourage better support, it sounds like the existing channel will work fine. If not, then splitting the channel might help the devel side, but may hurt efforts to build community, which is the purpose of the blueprint. Are any other IRC channels active in terms of support, e.g. for virtualization or UEC? #ubuntu-virt? #ubuntu-ec2? I'll try to get more active helping with support in u-s. Always a good way to learn how to improve the distro. Cheers, Neal McBurnett http://neal.mcburnett.org/ -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
Soren Hansen wrote: On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 10:54:17PM -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote: One of the work items listed in: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-community is now: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. Oh, wow. I completely missed this. Thanks for pointing this out. I hope this is just a suggestion someone put into the Gobby doc at UDS, rather than an actual work item. Mathias, you're set as the drafter. Can you chime in, please? I was the one who added the support bit to /TOPIC to begin with years ago and I stand by that decision. If I have spare cycles at all, I want to help people with problems with Ubuntu Server, but there's no way I'm joining #ubuntu to do that. I'd like for #ubuntu-server to be an appropriate forum for all things related to Ubuntu Server. IME it's not anywhere near too busy with support stuff to prevent the developers from having conversations about development stuff. If other people feel differently, I don't believe the solution is to remove the support option from #ubuntu-server, but probably rather to move the developmenty sort of stuff to #ubuntu-devel or maybe, just maybe, to #ubuntu-server-devel, but I don't think we're at a volume where a separate dev channel is warranted. I agree, even that I have not been on the channel latelly I really like to help otheres to solve their problems with ubuntu server, my vote for #ubuntu-server-devel. Best regards -- Jorge Armando Medina Computación Gráfica de México Web: http://www.e-compugraf.com Tel: 55 51 40 72, Ext: 124 Email: jmed...@e-compugraf.com GPG Key: 1024D/28E40632 2007-07-26 GPG Fingerprint: 59E2 0C7C F128 B550 B3A6 D3AF C574 8422 28E4 0632 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Server Support
One of the work items listed in: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-community is now: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. If we are going to drop support from the topic of #ubuntu-server, what is the plan to support the server community on IRC? In my experience server people require a different kind of support than desktop users and so I don't think tossing server support into #ubuntu is the right answer. Scott K -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
I second to that --Mensaje original-- De: Scott Kitterman Remitente:ubuntu-server-boun...@lists.ubuntu.com Para:ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com Asunto: Server Support Enviado: 25 May, 2010 20:54 One of the work items listed in: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-community is now: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. If we are going to drop support from the topic of #ubuntu-server, what is the plan to support the server community on IRC? In my experience server people require a different kind of support than desktop users and so I don't think tossing server support into #ubuntu is the right answer. Scott K -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam Enviado desde un dispositivo inalámbrico BlackBerry® -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
Re: Server Support
Some disaggregation of the IRC channels is in order. #ubuntu is bad for your mental health. As one with the Gerald Ford syndrome (I can't walk and chew gum at the same time), I simply can't keep the threads sorted out. #ubuntu-server at 1/6th the size of #ubuntu is more intelligible but even then, some threads are beyond my cognitive ability. I presume the authors have some purpose in posting but the posts themselves defy comprehension. How about #ubuntu-server-panic for those times when a formerly working server is broken; #ubuntu-server-support for help in adding new features; #ubuntu-server-lounge for general bs. I read https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-communitythree times before it started to make some sense. Maybe I am getting old and the bloom is off the rose. The most fun I have had lately is playing with the Google App Engine (python). Development of neo-plastic embolisms is not healthy for an organism. Jim On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 10:54 PM, Scott Kitterman ubu...@kitterman.comwrote: One of the work items listed in: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/server-maverick-community is now: + ubuntu-server IRC channel: both support and devel. Change the topic to + remove Support. If we are going to drop support from the topic of #ubuntu-server, what is the plan to support the server community on IRC? In my experience server people require a different kind of support than desktop users and so I don't think tossing server support into #ubuntu is the right answer. Scott K -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam -- Rev. Jim Tarvid, PCA Galax, Virginia http://ls.net http://drupal.ls.net http://crossleft.org -- ubuntu-server mailing list ubuntu-server@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
[Bug 520309] Re: [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support
** Also affects: multipath-tools (Ubuntu) Importance: Undecided Status: New -- [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/520309 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Server Team, which is subscribed to multipath-tools in ubuntu. -- Ubuntu-server-bugs mailing list Ubuntu-server-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server-bugs
[Bug 520309] Re: [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support
** Branch linked: lp:ubuntu/multipath-tools -- [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/520309 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Server Team, which is subscribed to multipath-tools in ubuntu. -- Ubuntu-server-bugs mailing list Ubuntu-server-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server-bugs
[Bug 520309] Re: [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support
This bug was fixed in the package multipath-tools - 0.4.8-14ubuntu3 --- multipath-tools (0.4.8-14ubuntu3) lucid; urgency=low * Support failback for Intel Modular Server (LP: #520309). -- Colin Watson cjwat...@ubuntu.com Fri, 12 Feb 2010 12:21:42 + ** Changed in: multipath-tools (Ubuntu) Status: New = Fix Released -- [Patch] Multipath Tools: modify the path priority tool for Intel Modular Server support https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/520309 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Server Team, which is subscribed to multipath-tools in ubuntu. -- Ubuntu-server-bugs mailing list Ubuntu-server-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server-bugs
