Re: Firewire 800 HDD
Phillipe, I didn't mean to sound too negative about the future of Firewire. I would have no qualms buying a new Firewire 400 drive tomorrow. Like Shay I have many that I use every day - I also have a Firewire 800 drive which I love and use with relish. In fact I wish my other drives were Firewire 800 as well as it is significantly faster than Firewire 400 particularly when multiple drives are daisy-chained together. And even FW 400 is faster than USB 2.0 in most real-life situations despite the apparent 80Kbps difference. It is only the future versions of Firewire - 1600 and 3200 that sound in doubt at this point. The fact is, SATA II and standard external connectors are not here yet to my knowledge and Macs obviously don't have them built-in yet - in fact, Apple is still including FW 800 on their very latest PowerMac G5s and PowerBooks. A FW 800 drive and definitely a FW 400 drive bought today will give you great mileage far ages yet. Most Firewire drives have USB 2.0 on them as well, so you'll have that added flexibility as well. My advice is if you need external storage now, a Firewire 400 or 800 drive is the thing to go for. -Mart From: J Philippe Chaperon [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 06 May 2005 17:54:45 +0800 To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au Subject: Re: Firewire 800 HDD on 5/5/05 7:58 PM, Martin Hill at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Rob Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] Actually that brings up a point why the camera manufacturers with the advent of large files and bandwidth size have not adapted Firewire 800. Would rectify a few problems especially with the VTR's for HD coming online and the troubles Panasonic and Apple are having with the AJ-HD1200A. Sadly if the CEO of Weibetech (a Firewire hard disk manufacturer) is correct (see link and excerpt below), Apple may be deprecating it's commitment to Firewire 800 and possibly heading in the direction of SATA bus technologies for external as well as internal connections. It is hard to imagine that Firewire 400 won't stick around with so much video gear using it - but at least for future external hard drives, it sounds like Firewire 1600 and 3200 may just be pipe-dreams. Perhaps that is why Firewire 800 still hasn't made it down to the iMac or into video gear and perhaps why Apple hasn't fixed the performance problems with Firewire 800: http://www.barefeats.com/fire47.html Who knows which way it will go? :-( -Mart Thanks for this info Mart, and to Rob and Shay for their comments. That is now making it difficult for me as I was just about to place an order with Daniel for a Firewire external drive, admitedly a FW400. The question now is: Do I want to back a moribund horse? I thoroughly love Apple and its product, but at times, as a small user of its products, I cannot help but feel I am spending the hard-earned cabbages on something which may not be there tomorrow. FireWire seems to be going the way of the wonderful Newton. Wonder how those who bought these pricey, although brilliant, PDAs feel about the abondonment of this platform by Apple? I think that Apple should think more than twice before trumpeting some new technologies which they are not sure to back all the way. Boy, did they ever flaunt the superiority of Firewire! Maybe they are right, but commercially a real black hole I guess that with the new iPods coming with only the USB cable, the writing was already on the walls for FW? Yes? I'd feel sorry to see FW go though .. Regards, Philippe -- To him who is in fear everything rustles. - Sophocles (BC 495-406, Greek Tragic Poet) -- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List -- Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml Unsubscribe - mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] WAMUG is powered by Stalker CommuniGatePro
Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me?
Hi All I just took an Apple-Shift-4 screen shot of something, and instead of getting the nice normal pdf file I'm so used to getting on my desktop I now get a png file. So I open it up in preview and save it as a pdf, and notice I get a quality loss. OK, so I've had a long day, so this could be me,...but has anyone else noticed this and find it a bit of an annoyance? I'm used to just taking a quick screen shot, getting it as a pdf then firing it off to clients and suppliers etc. Does this mean that if I now send these file to a PC person I might run into some issues? A quick google search tells me it should be alright,.. http://www.filext.com/detaillist.php?extdetail=png And even worse,..a further search gives me an answer to my own question... :o) ---quote--- PNG is better for screenshots, because it's lossless; this makes sure that every pixel in the graphic is exactly what it was onscreen, rather than the approximations JPEG does (besides which, I've noticed that many JPEG compressor implementations seem to have this undying hatred for shades of red). Gamma correction is nice when people view PNGs with tools that support them, because it further ensures accuracy. However, you pay for this accuracy in terms of file size. In earlier OSX versions, when you could directly save screenshots as PNG, OSX was actually quite good at making sure you got the smallest files you possibly could. Now that's not possible, though there are command-line tools like pngcrush that you can use to crunch them down better. ---end quote--- ,..but I just thought I would get a few opinions. :o) Which leads me to my next question,.why did Apple change this??? :o) Hope everyone's weekend is going well! Enjoy! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Phone: 0414 795 960 Email: danielATmacwizardryDOTcomDOTau Web: http://www.macwizardry.com.au **For everything Macintosh**
Re: Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me?
PNG is more widely supported now. Internet Explorer and Firefox can open PNG files (but IE can't display transparency for PNG). It should generate smaller file sizes than PDF. And also you don't need Acrobat Reader, which probably will load faster in your client's machine. Apple chose PNG over JPG or PDF, probably because it is a better graphics format, smaller than PDF (file size) and is compatible with any graphics viewer (including browsers). Steven On 06/05/2005, at 11:36 PM, Daniel Kerr wrote: Hi All I just took an Apple-Shift-4 screen shot of something, and instead of getting the nice normal pdf file I'm so used to getting on my desktop I now get a png file. So I open it up in preview and save it as a pdf, and notice I get a quality loss. OK, so I've had a long day, so this could be me,...but has anyone else noticed this and find it a bit of an annoyance? I'm used to just taking a quick screen shot, getting it as a pdf then firing it off to clients and suppliers etc. Does this mean that if I now send these file to a PC person I might run into some issues? A quick google search tells me it should be alright,.. http://www.filext.com/detaillist.php?extdetail=png And even worse,..a further search gives me an answer to my own question... :o) ---quote--- PNG is better for screenshots, because it's lossless; this makes sure that every pixel in the graphic is exactly what it was onscreen, rather than the approximations JPEG does (besides which, I've noticed that many JPEG compressor implementations seem to have this undying hatred for shades of red). Gamma correction is nice when people view PNGs with tools that support them, because it further ensures accuracy. However, you pay for this accuracy in terms of file size. In earlier OSX versions, when you could directly save screenshots as PNG, OSX was actually quite good at making sure you got the smallest files you possibly could. Now that's not possible, though there are command-line tools like pngcrush that you can use to crunch them down better. ---end quote--- ,..but I just thought I would get a few opinions. :o) Which leads me to my next question,.why did Apple change this??? :o) Hope everyone's weekend is going well! Enjoy! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Phone: 0414 795 960 Email: danielATmacwizardryDOTcomDOTau Web: http://www.macwizardry.com.au **For everything Macintosh** -- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List -- Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml Unsubscribe - mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] WAMUG is powered by Stalker CommuniGatePro
Re: Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me?
On 6/05/2005 11:53 PM, Steven Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PNG is more widely supported now. Internet Explorer and Firefox can open PNG files (but IE can't display transparency for PNG). It should generate smaller file sizes than PDF. And also you don't need Acrobat Reader, which probably will load faster in your client's machine. Apple chose PNG over JPG or PDF, probably because it is a better graphics format, smaller than PDF (file size) and is compatible with any graphics viewer (including browsers). Steven On 06/05/2005, at 11:36 PM, Daniel Kerr wrote: Hi All I just took an Apple-Shift-4 screen shot of something, and instead of getting the nice normal pdf file I'm so used to getting on my desktop I now get a png file. So I open it up in preview and save it as a pdf, and notice I get a quality loss. OK, so I've had a long day, so this could be me,...but has anyone else noticed this and find it a bit of an annoyance? I'm used to just taking a quick screen shot, getting it as a pdf then firing it off to clients and suppliers etc. Does this mean that if I now send these file to a PC person I might run into some issues? A quick google search tells me it should be alright,.. http://www.filext.com/detaillist.php?extdetail=png And even worse,..a further search gives me an answer to my own question... :o) ---quote--- PNG is better for screenshots, because it's lossless; this makes sure that every pixel in the graphic is exactly what it was onscreen, rather than the approximations JPEG does (besides which, I've noticed that many JPEG compressor implementations seem to have this undying hatred for shades of red). Gamma correction is nice when people view PNGs with tools that support them, because it further ensures accuracy. However, you pay for this accuracy in terms of file size. In earlier OSX versions, when you could directly save screenshots as PNG, OSX was actually quite good at making sure you got the smallest files you possibly could. Now that's not possible, though there are command-line tools like pngcrush that you can use to crunch them down better. ---end quote--- ,..but I just thought I would get a few opinions. :o) Which leads me to my next question,.why did Apple change this??? :o) Hope everyone's weekend is going well! Enjoy! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Phone: 0414 795 960 Email: danielATmacwizardryDOTcomDOTau Web: http://www.macwizardry.com.au **For everything Macintosh** Thanks Steven That is good to know. :o) I knew there had to be a good reason for it. It would still be nice if it was a preference pane you could set somewhere. :o) Oh well,..it works, so I suppose that's the main thing :o) Thanks again! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Phone: 0414 795 960 Email: danielATmacwizardryDOTcomDOTau Web: http://www.macwizardry.com.au **For everything Macintosh**
Re: Part II streaming video now up
As someone from the other side of the country (Sydney) it was great to see the WAMUG meeting this way. I personally would love to see all Mac User Groups do something similar. Is there some way to find out more about the iLecture System and the steps taken to get the meeting online? It would be great if Macquarie Uni (which also has an iLecture system) could be convinced to host local Mac User Group meetings also. I currently run a number of online Mac User Groups but would love to hold live meetings and post them online as WAMUG has done. A number of other MUG's already hold meetings at Universities, colleges etc and once more people get onto broadband, technologies like this are sure to take off. I've recently brought my first Xserve along with some drive modules to take it to just over a Terabyte of storage. I've also purchased a Xserve Raid with around 1.2 Terabytes, a number of empty hard disk modules (which I'll be adding disks to), PCI Fibre Card and a 25RU Rack. Unfortunately everything is still packed up, until I can finish pouring a slab (it is formed up) to set it up on under the house. Currently I just use a couple of G4 Desktops as servers out of my bedroom. I realise I could never compete with the resources of a university but at least the new system should be a great start. Perhaps I may be able to do something similar to the iLecture system using QuickTime Streaming Server. I even run Lasso so perhaps I could create a front end system like iLecture as well. Any thoughts on considerations involved with such a project would be appreciated. Somehow though I think it may require at least another Xserve if I want to also serve sites, databases and possibly set up Netbooting (for a dozen or so local machines) for my home network. Anyway I digress, all I really need to say is, congratulations to all involved you've done a great job, been a huge inspiration to me and if you don't mind I'd like to write a story about what you've done on the Australian Mac Users Group site as an example of what a Mac User Group is capable of when they truly embrace technology. -- All the best Greg Sharp President/Webmaster [EMAIL PROTECTED] Australian Mac Users Group (AUSMUG) http://australian.macusersgroup.org
Re: Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me?
Dan, There is a useful Tiger widget called Capture that allows you to change the format of screengrabs between jpeg, tiff, jpz, pict, bmp, qtif and psd as well as controlling a few other options: http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/dashboard/capture.html Should give you more of the flexibility you desire. -Mart From: Daniel Kerr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 06 May 2005 23:36:50 +0800 To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au Subject: Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me? Hi All I just took an Apple-Shift-4 screen shot of something, and instead of getting the nice normal pdf file I'm so used to getting on my desktop I now get a png file. So I open it up in preview and save it as a pdf, and notice I get a quality loss. OK, so I've had a long day, so this could be me,...but has anyone else noticed this and find it a bit of an annoyance? I'm used to just taking a quick screen shot, getting it as a pdf then firing it off to clients and suppliers etc. Does this mean that if I now send these file to a PC person I might run into some issues? A quick google search tells me it should be alright,.. http://www.filext.com/detaillist.php?extdetail=png And even worse,..a further search gives me an answer to my own question... :o) ---quote--- PNG is better for screenshots, because it's lossless; this makes sure that every pixel in the graphic is exactly what it was onscreen, rather than the approximations JPEG does (besides which, I've noticed that many JPEG compressor implementations seem to have this undying hatred for shades of red). Gamma correction is nice when people view PNGs with tools that support them, because it further ensures accuracy. However, you pay for this accuracy in terms of file size. In earlier OSX versions, when you could directly save screenshots as PNG, OSX was actually quite good at making sure you got the smallest files you possibly could. Now that's not possible, though there are command-line tools like pngcrush that you can use to crunch them down better. ---end quote--- ,..but I just thought I would get a few opinions. :o) Which leads me to my next question,.why did Apple change this??? :o) Hope everyone's weekend is going well! Enjoy! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Phone: 0414 795 960 Email: danielATmacwizardryDOTcomDOTau Web: http://www.macwizardry.com.au **For everything Macintosh** -- The WA Macintosh User Group Mailing List -- Archives - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/archives.shtml Guidelines - http://www.wamug.org.au/mailinglist/guidelines.shtml Unsubscribe - mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] WAMUG is powered by Stalker CommuniGatePro
Re: Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me?
On 7/05/2005 1:12 AM, Martin Hill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dan, There is a useful Tiger widget called Capture that allows you to change the format of screengrabs between jpeg, tiff, jpz, pict, bmp, qtif and psd as well as controlling a few other options: http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/dashboard/capture.html Should give you more of the flexibility you desire. -Mart From: Daniel Kerr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 06 May 2005 23:36:50 +0800 To: WAMUG Mailing List wamug@wamug.org.au Subject: Tiger screenshot annoyance,..or is it just me? Hi All I just took an Apple-Shift-4 screen shot of something, and instead of getting the nice normal pdf file I'm so used to getting on my desktop I now get a png file. So I open it up in preview and save it as a pdf, and notice I get a quality loss. OK, so I've had a long day, so this could be me,...but has anyone else noticed this and find it a bit of an annoyance? I'm used to just taking a quick screen shot, getting it as a pdf then firing it off to clients and suppliers etc. Does this mean that if I now send these file to a PC person I might run into some issues? A quick google search tells me it should be alright,.. http://www.filext.com/detaillist.php?extdetail=png And even worse,..a further search gives me an answer to my own question... :o) ---quote--- PNG is better for screenshots, because it's lossless; this makes sure that every pixel in the graphic is exactly what it was onscreen, rather than the approximations JPEG does (besides which, I've noticed that many JPEG compressor implementations seem to have this undying hatred for shades of red). Gamma correction is nice when people view PNGs with tools that support them, because it further ensures accuracy. However, you pay for this accuracy in terms of file size. In earlier OSX versions, when you could directly save screenshots as PNG, OSX was actually quite good at making sure you got the smallest files you possibly could. Now that's not possible, though there are command-line tools like pngcrush that you can use to crunch them down better. ---end quote--- ,..but I just thought I would get a few opinions. :o) Which leads me to my next question,.why did Apple change this??? :o) Hope everyone's weekend is going well! Enjoy! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Thanks Martin! Appreciate that little widget. Will download it now and add it to the list of useful things! :o) Thanks again! Enjoy! Kind Regards Daniel --- Daniel Kerr MacWizardry Phone: 0414 795 960 Email: danielATmacwizardryDOTcomDOTau Web: http://www.macwizardry.com.au **For everything Macintosh**
services:summarise
This is the best thing in OS X that I've seen for ages: http://www.macworld.com/2005/05/secrets/juneosxhints/index.php *Clean up text using services:summarise* Have you ever come across a selection of text you’d like to keep—for example, a how-to on a Web page or an article on your local paper’s site? You may have tried copying it and pasting it into TextEdit or Stickies, only to end up with the text and all its distracting formatting, links, and spacing. Here’s a quick and easy workaround. If the program you’re using supports OS X’s Services feature (as is the case for most Apple apps, as well as The Omni Group’s products and Bare Bones’ BBEdit), you can use the Summarize service to clean up the text for easy saving. Start by selecting the text within the source application, and then choose application name: Services: Summarize. Using Font Book by itself to preview many fonts simultaneously is difficult. So press F10 to access Exposé’s Application Windows mode and clearly preview each font in its own window. A new window will open, and you’ll see a cleaned-up version of your text. Next, move the Summary Size slider to the 100% mark; this will force the service to show every word in your original selection. Then press Command-C to copy the text to the Clipboard (it’s already all selected by default), switch to your final destination (a Stickies note, a Word document, or whatever), and press Command-V to paste. If the text isn’t in a Services-aware application, drop it into TextEdit as your first step. If you have TextEdit in Plain Text mode (go to TextEdit: Preferences), doing so will get rid of almost all the formatting. Using the Summarize service will then remove any remaining excess line breaks and other oddities.
Tiger and Stuffit .. does it work ?
From Macfixit : Important StuffIt-related questions answered MacFixIt reader Scott Rose had an enlightening question and answer session with Allume Systems regarding issues with StuffIt Expander and StuffIt Deluxe in Mac OS X 10.4. Q. Can you please explain why Stuffit Expander is no longer included with Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger? A. That's a question for Apple, not us. Here's what they say on the Apple website: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=301016 We would certainly like to see it included in the standard install of the OS again. I know several developers have submitted its absence as a bug in Tiger! Q. Also, why does Apple no longer migrate over the Stuffit Framework when using the Migration Assistant to migrate from one computer to the next? A. The Migration Assistant copied the StuffIt.framework successfully in my tests. However, the Archive Install option does not copy the StuffIt.framework, leaving a crippled StuffIt Expander. We have a post on our forum suggesting users reinstall to correct this issue In addition, try this: in Safari's preferences, turn off the Open 'safe' files automatically option, then download a MacBinary encoded file (.bin) and see if you can do anything with it. You can't! There are no tools that come included in Tiger to deal with MacBinary, BinHex, StuffIt, StuffIt X, and other formats. We just released a stand-alone StuffIt Expander installer for Tiger users to deal with that issue.
Re: OT Dreamweaver and css
Onno Benschop wrote: Other than that, get rid of Dreamweaver, all it does is weave pipe-dreams, use a text editor. Taco HTML Edit is nice. Cheers Paul
Streaming Video of WAMUG
Hi WAMUGgers I haven't really had time yet to look at the streaming videos, but may find time this weekend. We have a GMUG meeting at 1pm this afternoon at Goldings Paving Centre in Glenfield, up here in sunny Gero (it's a beautiful day altogether) and if Carol and Richard have their broadband up and running we may venture a look then. Many thanks to all the WAMUGgers who produced this epic adventure so more distant list members can view you all in glorious action! It's almost as exciting as Dr Who returning to the screen. I've been looking at http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/video/index.shtml and that looks fantastic too. So to all you Daleks, Roses and Time Lords at WAMUG, thanks and have a great day. Regards Reg (PS Sent to you by a Geraldton Tiger powered PowerBook - remember the little tiger tails Esso used to give away to tie on your fuel caps - Put a Tiger in your Tank! My brother had a 1956 VW beetle and his tail hung out the front of the boot lid as if the beetle had eaten it!)
Re: Streaming Video of WAMUG
Correction: On 7 May 2005, at 9:20am, Reg Whitely wrote: I haven't really had time yet to look at the streaming videos, but may find time this weekend. We have a GMUG meeting at 1pm this afternoon at Goldings Paving Centre in Glenfield, up here in sunny Gero (it's a beautiful day altogether) and if Carol and Richard have their broadband up and running we may venture a look then. I've just been reminded that the meeting is NEXT Saturday, so I can get on with the loungeroom renovations today. Time warp conflict in etherspace continuum! Reg
Re: Firewire 800 HDD
I wish iPods where firewire 800 compliant. That would certainly give me a big transfer speed advantage hmmm or would it. I've always wondered why it had taken so long to provide this feature. Maybe the speed of the iPod hard drive would be a limiting factor making firewire 800 pointless? Ruben
Tiger Mail Warning
There may be an issues with mail when updating to Tiger (10.4) where your mail will not import old emails properly or at all. It seems people have been experiencing a variety of problems related to this. For more information you can go to this site http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?t=253160 however I'd advise you to refrain from taking the solutions on that site as gospel. You certainly should not rename your mail folder before upgrading. Instead make sure you back up your mail folder (found in ~users/library) along with anything else important. I experienced a problem with importing old emails from the mail program after performing a clean install. I attempted to use the mail program to import old mails by directing it to my backed up folder. It wouldn't import anything that way. Now this is the useful part... I fixed the problem by quitting mail then moving the mail folder (in the ~users/library folder) to the hard drive and replacing it with a copy of my backed up mail folder. I then ran the mail program and it imported all of my old emails. They were all marked as unread but that's a problem easy fixed. Perhaps this will be useful to someone else Ruben A. Franke
Safari 1.3 and no more save to clipboard?
Hi, In previous versions of Safari before this 1.3 I used to be able place the pointer over a link press my right mouse button and choose 'save link to clipboard' but it's not an option now. Also it also used to be possible to save a picture using the right mouse button and get a requester to choose which directory to put it in which gave the opportunity to rename it - handy for renaming a pic that's called 'i290' or what ever. Now there is only an option to save it directly to your download directory and no chance to rename it. Plus it's now showing 'localized string not found' whatever that means. I don't recall that showing up in past versions. Is there some setting in Safari's Preferences to fix this? Thanks Brian
Re: Firewire 800 HDD
on 6/5/05 11:12 PM, Martin Hill at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Phillipe, I didn't mean to sound too negative about the future of Firewire. I would have no qualms buying a new Firewire 400 drive tomorrow. Like Shay I have many that I use every day - I also have a Firewire 800 drive which I love and use with relish. In fact I wish my other drives were Firewire 800 as well as it is significantly faster than Firewire 400 particularly when multiple drives are daisy-chained together. And even FW 400 is faster than USB 2.0 in most real-life situations despite the apparent 80Kbps difference. It is only the future versions of Firewire - 1600 and 3200 that sound in doubt at this point. The fact is, SATA II and standard external connectors are not here yet to my knowledge and Macs obviously don't have them built-in yet - in fact, Apple is still including FW 800 on their very latest PowerMac G5s and PowerBooks. A FW 800 drive and definitely a FW 400 drive bought today will give you great mileage far ages yet. Most Firewire drives have USB 2.0 on them as well, so you'll have that added flexibility as well. My advice is if you need external storage now, a Firewire 400 or 800 drive is the thing to go for. To all who commented, Mart, Greg, Shay, Craig and others many thanks. I guess that sometimes I tend to be a bit narrow minded and panicky too !! Having said this I am so glad to be in the Apple camp seeing the many problems my relatives and friends who are on the 'dark side' are experiencing. My old Performa 5400 using OS 8.1 (yes, I know its from the dark ages ) is still working beautifully with all the applications I bought so many years ago. It needed only one re-install in all its working life. And the current G5 is just 'sensationel', overkill for my usage but hey, one has only one go at life! Well I will be picking up my Firewire 400 drive this coming week. Yiiip! Many thanks guys. Regards, Philippe (Call me 'old yellow' I worked hard for this title ;) -- It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change. Charles Darwin (1809-1882, British Naturalist)
Tiger upgrade
Inspite of two back ups I lost iTunes,iPhoto, and Entourage emails.After the fifth attempt and two hours and forty minutes install I now have a mangled copy of Tiger. As a cynical old veteran I know I have no comeback from Apple( yes I did read the fine print carefully) but it seems that you need an independent back up (not Disk Copy) removed from the machine. Has anyone any knowledge of dud install disks from Apple? Regards Mike Armson
