Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-14 Thread Mnyb
I was thinking about the topic. Why there is no more thorough deconstruction of specific products/claims. 1. The level of disinformation is close to 100% almost the whole audio press are into to the scam or fooled by it, you cant get through. so it is futile to even try 2. The claims by voodoo

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-14 Thread Phil Leigh
Archimago;690548 Wrote: LOL, hilarious interview. This part is interesting: PQ: It's not a question of digital or analog, because in CD's the music is still stored as a continuous, if some what squared, sine wave, in the form of ones and zeros. The CD does not break up the signal at all.

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-13 Thread DaveWr
TheOctavist;690402 Wrote: bad design principles sound like this. http://www.audionote.co.jp/en/legend.html i dont know that ive ever seen so much bullshit on a designers page. well, machina dynamica, but thats , I think a DaDa-ist ruse. If you had heard the stuff then your comments

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-13 Thread TheOctavist
DaveWr;690435 Wrote: The real key is that common sense applies, there are routes to good design, but in the end the final arbiter is the listening experience. the problem is.. I don't really *care* what the designer prefers, listening wise..so designing by his ear solely is useless to

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-13 Thread TheOctavist
Mnyb;690418 Wrote: The AN-E sogon speaker for $125,000 for example (but there even more expensive versions ). Or the probably even more expensive CDT-5 cd transport with tube rectifiers tube spdiff out and of course silver wire for the digital signals ? DAC's have a transformers as

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-13 Thread andy_c
There's an 'interview with Audio Note's Peter Qvortrup' (http://hifi-unlimited.blogspot.com/2010/05/10-qs-for-peter-qvortrup-of-audio-note.html) by a Malaysian blogger that I found quite funny :-). -- andy_c andy_c's

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-13 Thread TheOctavist
im glad that guy kept asking him about price. hilarious. nothing justifies those prices. criminal, imo -- TheOctavist VortexboxSBT(stock)Forssell MDAC-2Klein and Hummell 0300D Sota Sapphire/Lyra KleosBespoke Valve Phono StageMastersound Due VentiLink Audio K100

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-13 Thread Archimago
andy_c;690539 Wrote: There's an 'interview with Audio Note's Peter Qvortrup' (http://hifi-unlimited.blogspot.com/2010/05/10-qs-for-peter-qvortrup-of-audio-note.html) by a Malaysian blogger that I found quite funny :-). LOL, hilarious interview. This part is interesting: PQ: It's not a

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread Mnyb
konut;690254 Wrote: You are assuming the same people that design the DACs are also the same people that design the amps. That would be an incorrect assumption. Good to hear that :), but it is the same company ? Then one can probably use their amps with some confidence ? I'm suspicious of

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread TheOctavist
mashley;690253 Wrote: Actually some engineers design their audio equipment to produce great specs on paper and they don't even bother to listen to their designs because the figures tell them what they believe to be correct. Certain people at Audio Note find this highly amusing especially

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread mlsstl
RE: Audio Note - they have a rather small but cultish following that strongly believes in the brand. However, there are a lot of people out there they haven't impressed. I've not heard a lot of their gear, but what I have didn't move me to pursue the question any further. However, as far as

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread Mnyb
mlsstl;690338 Wrote: don't even bother to listen to their designs, I'd be interested in hearing what brands are involved and where he got his evidence of this. This is a bit of circular reasoning what to listen to if it is transparent ? You can set up an an abx to a known ref to make sure

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread mlsstl
To be fair to all parties, it is also important to define what constitutes listening. If it means hooking the final design up to a system and seeing if it sounds good and exhibits no aberrant behavior under load, then I'm positive that every piece of audio equipment qualifies to one extent or

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread totoro
mlsstl;690362 Wrote: To be fair to all parties, it is also important to define what constitutes listening. If it means hooking the final design up to a system and seeing if it sounds good and exhibits no aberrant behavior under load, then I'm positive that every piece of audio equipment

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread TheOctavist
bad design principles sound like this. http://www.audionote.co.jp/en/legend.html i dont know that ive ever seen so much bullshit on a designers page. well, machina dynamica, but thats , I think a DaDa-ist ruse. -- TheOctavist VortexboxSBT(stock)Forssell MDAC-2Klein and Hummell 0300D

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-12 Thread Mnyb
TheOctavist;690402 Wrote: bad design principles sound like this. http://www.audionote.co.jp/en/legend.html i dont know that ive ever seen so much bullshit on a designers page. well, machina dynamica, but thats , I think a DaDa-ist ruse. They are actually 2 or 3 companies (complicated

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-11 Thread TheOctavist
Mnyb;690070 Wrote: Then add all kind of euphonics as software filters that could be turned on or off or mixed . And also variable output impedance of the power amp and adaptable current limits that could be applied in some arbitrary impedance points to emulate inability to drive complex

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-11 Thread TheOctavist
eeyep'An Interview with Andrew Jones of Pioneer/TAD' (http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue30/andrew_jones.htm) Positive Feedback What about audiophile type parts? Any advantage? Wire, caps, etc. Andrew Jones We have high quality parts certainly, mostly manufactured by ourselves or to our

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-11 Thread Mnyb
Trying to find one of my old favs in the genre , but searching for anti-riaa gets to many hits . There once was an idiotic device that reduced the output of a CD player and applied anti-riaa filter so that you could use your phono preamp with your CD to get better sound :) God old mr Walker

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-11 Thread Soulkeeper
Mnyb;690070 Wrote: Then add all kind of euphonics as software filters that could be turned on or off or mixed . Or hardware. If there had been a reasonably priced hardware unit on the market in 1999, that could color the sound to make my CD player sound more like my turntable, I would

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-11 Thread mashley
Actually some engineers design their audio equipment to produce great specs on paper and they don't even bother to listen to their designs because the figures tell them what they believe to be correct. Certain people at Audio Note find this highly amusing especially considering those engineers

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-11 Thread konut
Mnyb;690070 Wrote: Their amps get rave reviews everywhere :( such is the state engineering in high end audio . You are assuming the same people that design the DACs are also the same people that design the amps. That would be an incorrect assumption. -- konut

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-10 Thread Soulkeeper
Maybe obvious (to some?), but an interesting read anyways. -- Soulkeeper 'Bug 17797: Updating wiki.slimdevices.com' (http://bugs.slimdevices.com/show_bug.cgi?id=17797) Soulkeeper's Profile:

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-10 Thread SuperQ
Yea, I had no idea. Shows how good my ears are. I bought a uDac-2 and thought it was OK, nothing fancy. A step above the DAC in my phone (wow, the noise). Now I regret the purchase slightly. A blatant disregard for design is offensive to me, mostly because I spend my day taking software

Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-10 Thread Mnyb
Their amps get rave reviews everywhere :( such is the state engineering in high end audio . This is very common practice, but it was nice of someone to deconstruct the thing, there is really no way for nuforce to turn they can admit that they are incompetent or dishonest or both . As

[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Designing by listening= failure.

2012-02-09 Thread TheOctavist
http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/02/nuforce-udac-2-drama.html of course it doesn't work. Obvious man is obvious. -- TheOctavist VortexboxSBT(stock(TT failed dbt)Forssell MDAC-2Klein and Hummell 0300D Sota Sapphire/Lyra KleosBespoke Valve Phono StageMastersound Due VentiLink Audio K100