Ray Horton wrote:
I agree 100% that the score and parts should be written in original
notation, substituting mainly treble clef, BUT:
I am confused. The two PDFs Kim posted, (if they are score and part for
the same measures), are obviously written for horn in A. Are we
discussing two
I made a mistake, the horn parts were written for G horns.
I apologize about that error and adding confusion to the discussion.
Is there any sure proof way to figure what horns were used in the
music of this period?
e.g. for example in the samples I provided, the first note of the horn
part
Assuming we're talking about 18th century, orchestral horn parts most
commonly used only about 10 pitches: written c (or C in old bass
clef), g, c', e', g', c'', d'', e'', f'', g''. (It is of course the
harmonic series.) If you are looking at a score written in concert
pitch, find the horn key
But in the Graupner example I posted-- he has the sinfonia in D major,
but the horn parts are in G.
So I guess the first note you see in the horn part is a help (which was a g).
Graupner wrote an ouverture for 2 horns and 2 trumpets and timpani,
one horn is in F and the other G.
This don't seem
Silly me. G horn in Kim's example, of course. I really should not
post so late at night.
The alto clef is a neat way of writing D horn in concert pitch - could
help the composer keep the part playable while helping the copyist.
Trombone players think alto clef whenever we have to read
On Aug 21, 2009, at 12:14 PM, Ray Horton wrote:
But how many composers wrote concert pitch horn parts in the score?
I haven't seen it any where else, but then, I don't deal with the
MSS too often.
RBH
I have a modern edition (published by Hinshaw Music) of Credo in D a
8 by
At 11:19 AM -0400 8/21/09, Kim Patrick Clow wrote:
Is there any sure proof way to figure what horns were used in the
music of this period?
Sure. You compare the written notes with the notes that were
available on the natural horns. Although it can get pretty hairy for
Mozart, because he
At 11:36 AM -0400 8/21/09, Kim Patrick Clow wrote:
Graupner wrote an ouverture for 2 horns and 2 trumpets and timpani,
one horn is in F and the other G.
This don't seem to be very obvious choices.
Rather, not very simple choices. We would think
nothing of this in the music of von Weber,
The practice is varied, but I believe pre-20th-century composers thought in
clefs, not transpositions. Most were keyboard players with considerable clef
skills.
What you're dealing with is a matter of philology. Depending on the level and
philosophy of creating an edition, I suggest the
Rental parts are nothing but a means to make life difficult for any
conductor who wishes to use them.
This is exactly why I don't publish my works; dealing with publishers and
editors and even rentals is something I do not want to be a part of...ever.
If people want to buy my works, they simply
All this talk about concert pitches and brass parts brings to mind
that from what I understand now, many HIP performance groups would
rather use the 18th century parts when available and make any
editorial changes on those-- really taking out the step of making a
performing edition. But that still
At 12:14 PM -0500 8/21/09, Howey, Henry wrote:
The practice is varied, but I believe pre-20th-century composers
thought in clefs, not transpositions. Most were keyboard players
with considerable clef skills.
Absolutely true. Movable clefs were standard from Guido's 11th
century notation on,
At 12:19 PM -0500 8/21/09, Patrick Sheehan wrote:
You should contact Music Theatre International (MTI.com) (a musical rental
company) and find out what they charge for a school or professional company.
Or Rodgers Hammerstein Theatricals www.rnhtheatricals.com or
Tams-Witmark
Hmm. What sort of reputation does Hinshaw have in this area?
Interesting, though.
Martin Banner wrote:
I have a modern edition (published by Hinshaw Music) of Credo in D a
8 by Giacomo Puccini senior, the great great grandfather of the
famous opera composer of the same name (1712-1781),
At 1:19 PM -0400 8/21/09, Kim Patrick Clow wrote:
All this talk about concert pitches and brass parts brings to mind
that from what I understand now, many HIP performance groups would
rather use the 18th century parts when available and make any
editorial changes on those-- really taking out the
Hinshaw has published well over twenty of my modern performing
editions of 18th and early 19th Century concerted choral works,
complete with vocal score, orchestral score and instrumental parts. If
you click on the second link down below, you can go directly to a
listing of my editions in
i seem to remember having come across catalogues online with rental
prices but all the catalogues i saved back when looking at this same
sort of thing are without rental prices listed... but maybe i am
remembering having access to prices through a job i had in an arts
library.
i remember
also, i have never heard of clean up charges actually being
applied, although i'm sure sometimes they are. i think the pricing
is used to encourage the body renting the parts to return them free
of markings under the threat of exorbitant clean up fees if the
publisher has to do it.
Looks good Martin, and such a nice picture of you! I did not mean to
cast aspersions on Hinshaw!
I buy church anthems from Hinshaw. I was making associations I should
not make. (Well, you know what I meant - I wouldn't expect to get an
authoritative 18th century score from Word Publishers
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, Patrick Sheehan patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com wrote:
Call them up and ask for their librarian or musicologist;
the receptionist
people don't like long explanations; they WILL hang up on
you (part of the
rude population of NYC).
They have musicologists - tell me more.
On 21 Aug 2009 at 14:09, John Howell wrote:
a lot of hard-core specialists DO prefer facsimiles rather
than modern editions, feeling that they convey information that
modern editions strip out, but those are few and far between, and
would be useless for the performers Kim is
On 21 Aug 2009 at 16:22, John Howell wrote:
Don Moses was the chorus master,
but I got drafted to assist him because I was the only one who could
read David's chicken scratchings! Just another indication that early
full scores were for composers, not conductors, and were never
intended
2009/8/21 John Howell john.how...@vt.edu
At 11:19 AM -0400 8/21/09, Kim Patrick Clow wrote:
Is there any sure proof way to figure what horns were used in the
music of this period?
Sure. You compare the written notes with the notes that were available on
the natural horns. Although it
On Aug 21, 2009, at 2:00 PM, shirling neueweise wrote:
i remember not seeing any example of parts costing more than 1000
(eur/usd) to rent. this price ceiling is what large-scale opera and
some major orchestral works will cost. there can be 2nd performance
(75%) and even 3rd performance
In his orchestral music Mozart wrote very few notes that were not not
available naturally without much hand work, it was onlly in the concerti
that he included stopped notes. in his orchestral music these were limited
mainly to the top line F and Eb
Cheers,
Lawrence
2009/8/21 John Howell
Does anyone know of a way to notate the use of a wah-wah pedal for an
electric guitar ---and is there a Garritan sound that I can load to play
back the effect? I'm looking for the Three's Company kind of sound; real
70's -ish.
Patrick J. M. Sheehan
patricksheehanmu...@gmail.com
i remember not seeing any example of parts costing more than 1000
(eur/usd) to rent. this price ceiling is what large-scale opera and
some major orchestral works will cost. there can be 2nd performance
(75%) and even 3rd performance (50%) discounts within a certain
timeframe (a
We performed and recorded a couple of David Baker pieces in the LO back
in 1974.Great guy.
John Howell wrote:
At 2:54 PM -0400 8/21/09, David W. Fenton wrote:
Certainly, French music printing in the early 18th century (for
example) is very elegant and easy to read from, but a lot of MSS
On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 5:10 PM, David W.
Fentonlists.fin...@dfenton.com wrote:
In an earlier period, they were prepared for the copyist to prepare
the parts. And that's one of the reasons that Kim's situation is so
interesting to me, in that the scores he's working with would likely
have
Hi Patrick,
I don't think there is a Garritan sound for that, but I only have the
Garritan sounds for Finale. I played the guitar part in the pit for Joseph
and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat last year, and the guitar book says
wah wah at the start of the section with a for
At 10:16 PM +0100 8/21/09, Lawrence Yates wrote:
In his orchestral music Mozart wrote very few notes that were not not
available naturally without much hand work, it was onlly in the concerti
that he included stopped notes. in his orchestral music these were limited
mainly to the top line F and
Fin Mac 2K7
My Mass Mover tool will not allow me to move measures from one system
to another. I highlight the measure in question (while in the MM
tool) and hit the DOWN ARROWbut Finale does not respond.
I think that I might have to re-install Finale to fix the problem.
If I do
Hi Patrick,
The Garritan sounds sets only come with clean, unprocessed electric
guitar sounds. If you want to apply a wah-wah effect (or any other
guitar effect) you will need to do that via a Digital Audio
Workstation, using any number of common plugins.
As far as notation goes, you can
I'm not sure anyone is going to get any useful information about
CONCERT music rates from a company specialising in GRAND RIGHTS,
which typically run 2 to 4 times as much as concert rights, or even
more. Rodgers and Ham charge way more than other companies, because
they can. I would call
On Aug 21, 2009, at 5:43 PM, Patrick Sheehan wrote:
Does anyone know of a way to notate the use of a wah-wah pedal for an
electric guitar ---and is there a Garritan sound that I can load to
play
back the effect? I'm looking for the Three's Company kind of
sound; real
70's -ish.
I wished U would have helped David with his Arranging book...it was (is) in
really poor hand
Terry
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, David W. Fenton lists.fin...@dfenton.com wrote:
From: David W. Fenton lists.fin...@dfenton.com
Subject: Re: [Finale] Concert pitch scores
To: Finale@shsu.edu
Date:
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