from Mark Felder:
> Yes, however the Sendmail in base on FreeBSD 8 and 9 is compiled against
> OpenSSL < 1.0 which means it's missing support for TLS 1.2, SNI, and
> other modern best practice features.
That suggests putting sendmail to ports rather than base system, so that
updates would not de
Bryan Drewery wrote this message on Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 09:40 -0600:
> The RC script also leads to much confusion in this configuration:
>
> > # service sendmail stop
> > Stopping sendmail.
> > Waiting for PIDS: 80956.
> > sendmail_submit not running? (check /var/run/sendmail.pid).
> > Stopping s
On 2014-02-25 16:31, RW wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Feb 2014 19:24:02 -0500 (EST)
> Benjamin Kaduk wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 24 Feb 2014, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> What would really help is if the ports fetch-recursive-list target
>>> could extend to reliably include the distfiles for the runtime
>>> d
On Tue, Feb 25, 2014, at 10:07, Michel Talon wrote:
> Thomas Mueller wrote
>
> > There needs to be better documentation of sendmail if it is to be kept, and
> > the option to compile sendmail for fuller function including
> >SSL and TLS
>
> Apparently sendmail is compiled with ssl/tls support
On 2/24/2014 6:56 AM, Daniel Kalchev wrote:
On 24.02.14 13:47, Thomas Mueller wrote:
I don't believe BSD users use base system of itself to send and receive email.
They use ports (FreeBSD) or equivalent in other BSDs.
One of the beauties of the BSD 'base system' is that upon installation
yo
On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 11:30:56AM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:50:10PM +0100, Jilles Tjoelker wrote:
> > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 07:01:54PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> > > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 03:30:14PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> > > > On Mon, F
On 2/24/2014 6:56 AM, Daniel Kalchev wrote:
One of the many problems with removing functionality is very well
illustrated by what happens now, when you upgrade an pre-10 system
running nameserver: you end up without it and eventually without your
nameserver database as well. Imagine, one day a us
Thomas Mueller wrote
> There needs to be better documentation of sendmail if it is to be kept, and
> the option to compile sendmail for fuller function including
>SSL and TLS
Apparently sendmail is compiled with ssl/tls support in FreeBSD, standard. This
is what i get by sending mail from my
f
On Mon, 24 Feb 2014 19:24:02 -0500 (EST)
Benjamin Kaduk wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Feb 2014, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>
> >
> > What would really help is if the ports fetch-recursive-list target
> > could extend to reliably include the distfiles for the runtime
> > dependencies as well. But I'm not even
Am 24.02.2014 15:56, schrieb Daniel Kalchev:
On 24.02.14 13:47, Thomas Mueller wrote:
I don't believe BSD users use base system of itself to send and receive
email. They use ports (FreeBSD) or equivalent in other BSDs.
One of the beauties of the BSD 'base system' is that upon installation yo
from Julio Merino:
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 6:47 AM, Thomas Mueller
> wrote:
> > To Julio Merino: How long did NetBSD include both sendmail and postfix in
> > base? What NetBSD releases? What was the first release that included both
> > sendmail and postfix, and the first release where sendma
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:50:10PM +0100, Jilles Tjoelker wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 07:01:54PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 03:30:14PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
>
> > > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 06:17:37PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> > > > On Sun,
On 25 Feb 2014, at 08:09, Daniel Kalchev wrote:
> What we risk with "everything is a port" concept is that we live in a world
> that there is a lot of software to chose from, but from time to time, the
> software happens to be incompatible with FreeBSD in one way, or another.
> Another risk is
On 24.02.14 19:49, Mark Felder wrote:
We can strip pieces of FreeBSD off and end up with an kernel. Or we
could keep the system very much usable out of the box.
Imagine a world where everything in FreeBSD is a package and we have a
working "PROVIDES" framework. Upon installation you can choose
On 25 Feb, Peter Jeremy wrote:
> On 2014-Feb-24 10:44:30 -0600, Bryan Drewery wrote:
>>
>>I have the Oreilly sendmail book here and it's thicker than The Design
>>and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System. That's quite an
>>application!
>
> More impressively, ISTR it's thicker than "The
On 2014-Feb-24 10:44:30 -0600, Bryan Drewery wrote:
>
>I have the Oreilly sendmail book here and it's thicker than The Design
>and Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System. That's quite an
>application!
More impressively, ISTR it's thicker than "The Magic Garden Explained"
- which is the SV
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 09:40:26AM -0600, Bryan Drewery wrote:
> IMHO base should be the very minimalistic needs to get a server online,
> and should be secure and simple by default. ...
> Anything not meeting the bare-bones criteria can be installed with 'pkg
> install' or ports.
+1 (OTOH I am no
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 6:47 AM, Thomas Mueller
wrote:
> To Julio Merino: How long did NetBSD include both sendmail and postfix in
> base? What NetBSD releases? What was the first release that included both
> sendmail and postfix, and the first release where sendmail was dropped?
>
As far as I
On 2/24/14, 7:47 PM, Thomas Mueller wrote:
I never got far enough with DragonFlyBSD or OpenBSD on live USB to see osmpd or
opensmtpd (OpenBSD or dma (DragonFly).
I couldn't read hard drive from either OpenBSD or DragonFly, could read OpenBSD
but not DragonFly live USB stick from FreeBSD and Ne
On 2/24/14, 10:45 PM, Mark Felder wrote:
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 3:41, Joe Holden wrote:
On 24/02/2014 04:26, Julio Merino wrote:
On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
Hi,
As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
(DragonFly Mail Agent) in
On Mon, 24 Feb 2014, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
What would really help is if the ports fetch-recursive-list target could
extend to reliably include the distfiles for the runtime dependencies as
well. But I'm not even sure that's possible. We tried a few different
things, but in the end we had
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 07:01:54PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 03:30:14PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 06:17:37PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> > > On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 10:11:56PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> > > > As so
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 12:46, Bryan Drewery wrote:
> On 2/23/2014 3:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> > (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation
> > so
> > here they are
On 02/24/14 17:16, Lucius Rizzo wrote:
> * Bryan Drewery [2014-02-24 09:40]:
>
>> Remembering the time I spent trying to configure sendmail to not accept
>> inbound mail, and trying to get it to behave how I want, I fully support
>> this. Of all the years I've messed with sendmail, I still have
On 2/23/2014 3:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> Hi,
>
> As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation so
> here they are.
>
Does this support a /usr/sbin/sendmail wrapper for sending mail th
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 1:07 PM, Joe Nosay wrote:
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Mark Felder wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 9:50, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>> >
>> > On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:40 AM, Bryan Drewery
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Anything not meeting the bare-bones criteri
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 12:53 PM, Mark Felder wrote:
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 9:50, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
> >
> > On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:40 AM, Bryan Drewery wrote:
> >
> > > Anything not meeting the bare-bones criteria can be installed with 'pkg
> > > install' or ports.
> >
> > Try this
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 9:50, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
>
> On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:40 AM, Bryan Drewery wrote:
>
> > Anything not meeting the bare-bones criteria can be installed with 'pkg
> > install' or ports.
>
> Try this in a shop where all your machines are completely air-gapped from
> the
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 8:56, Daniel Kalchev wrote:
>
> On 24.02.14 13:47, Thomas Mueller wrote:
> > I don't believe BSD users use base system of itself to send and receive
> > email. They use ports (FreeBSD) or equivalent in other BSDs.
>
> One of the beauties of the BSD 'base system' is that
On Feb 24, 2014, at 8:50 AM, David Chisnall wrote:
> Or, purely hypothetically, if your goal was to make it work, you could just
> use Poudriere which will take a list of packages that you need and build a
> package set for you, which you can stick on a DVD / USB stick / whatever and
> take i
In message , Lyndon Nerenberg
writes:
>On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:56 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp =
>wrote:
>
>> Bullshit.
>
>Sounds like your week didn't get off to a good start.
No, I'm simply calling your argument bullshit, because it is.
>> You got FreeBSD in there in the first place, there clearly
>>
On 24 Feb 2014, at 16:39, Lyndon Nerenberg wrote:
> If the above doesn't work, you have to fall back to ports. And this is where
> things get really hairy. Just generating the list of required distfiles is
> problematic. 'make fetch-recursive-list' will give you a script to run to
> pull dow
On 2/24/2014 10:16 AM, Lucius Rizzo wrote:
> * Bryan Drewery [2014-02-24 09:40]:
>
>> Remembering the time I spent trying to configure sendmail to not accept
>> inbound mail, and trying to get it to behave how I want, I fully support
>> this. Of all the years I've messed with sendmail, I still h
On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:56 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
> Bullshit.
Sounds like your week didn't get off to a good start.
> You got FreeBSD in there in the first place, there clearly
> is some kind of aperture through which software can migrate.
Yes, we walk in a DVD-ROM with a FreeBSD installat
On 2/24/2014 9:56 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
> In message , Lyndon
> Nerenberg
> writes:
>
>> Try this in a shop where all your machines are completely air-gapped
>>from the internet.
>
> Bullshit.
>
> You got FreeBSD in there in the first place, there clearly
> is some kind of aperture thro
On Feb 24, 2014 7:50 AM, "Lyndon Nerenberg" wrote:
>
>
> On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:40 AM, Bryan Drewery wrote:
>
> > Anything not meeting the bare-bones criteria can be installed with 'pkg
> > install' or ports.
>
> Try this in a shop where all your machines are completely air-gapped from
the interne
* Bryan Drewery [2014-02-24 09:40]:
> Remembering the time I spent trying to configure sendmail to not accept
> inbound mail, and trying to get it to behave how I want, I fully support
> this. Of all the years I've messed with sendmail, I still have little
> understanding of how to configure it
On 24/02/2014 15:40, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
In message <530b666a.1000...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
Please check how NTP is authenticated before giving bad advice,
it's all in the RFC.
v3 or v4? It is an optional part of the spec in both cases and again
isn't required for 99% of peopl
In message , Lyndon Nerenberg
writes:
>Try this in a shop where all your machines are completely air-gapped
>from the internet.
Bullshit.
You got FreeBSD in there in the first place, there clearly
is some kind of aperture through which software can migrate.
--
Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX s
On Feb 24, 2014, at 7:40 AM, Bryan Drewery wrote:
> Anything not meeting the bare-bones criteria can be installed with 'pkg
> install' or ports.
Try this in a shop where all your machines are completely air-gapped from the
internet.
signature.asc
Description: Message signed with OpenPGP usin
In message <530b666a.1000...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
>> Please check how NTP is authenticated before giving bad advice,
>> it's all in the RFC.
>>
>v3 or v4? It is an optional part of the spec in both cases and again
>isn't required for 99% of people using ntpd as a client, which was the
On 2/23/2014 3:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> Hi,
>
> As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation so
> here they are.
>
> DragonFly Mail Agent is a minimalistic mailer that is able to rel
On 24/02/2014 13:52, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
In message <530b2dee.3030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
The other point I should make here is that if you care that much about
time security you shouldn't be contacting ntp servers over 3rd party
networks anyway, at least not without some IP-l
On 24.02.14 13:47, Thomas Mueller wrote:
I don't believe BSD users use base system of itself to send and receive email.
They use ports (FreeBSD) or equivalent in other BSDs.
One of the beauties of the BSD 'base system' is that upon installation
you have an usable workstation/server environm
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 03:30:14PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 06:17:37PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> > On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 10:11:56PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> >
> > > As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> >
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014, at 3:41, Joe Holden wrote:
> On 24/02/2014 04:26, Julio Merino wrote:
> > On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> >
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> >> (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 06:17:37PM +0400, Slawa Olhovchenkov wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 10:11:56PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
>
> > As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> > (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation
>
On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 10:11:56PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation so
> here they are.
What's about suid, security separations & etc?
__
In message <530b2dee.3030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
>The other point I should make here is that if you care that much about
>time security you shouldn't be contacting ntp servers over 3rd party
>networks anyway, at least not without some IP-level
>encryption/authentication, or use a s
I never got far enough with DragonFlyBSD or OpenBSD on live USB to see osmpd or
opensmtpd (OpenBSD or dma (DragonFly).
I couldn't read hard drive from either OpenBSD or DragonFly, could read OpenBSD
but not DragonFly live USB stick from FreeBSD and NetBSD, meaning poor
interoperability on my sy
On 24/02/2014 11:26, Joe Holden wrote:
On 24/02/2014 11:18, Ollivier Robert wrote:
According to Joe Holden on Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:13:23AM +:
hm, I can't say I have noticed this as being a problem where I've
used it, are there any scenarios where this is a showstopper?
Non-support for
On 24/02/2014 11:18, Ollivier Robert wrote:
According to Joe Holden on Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:13:23AM +:
hm, I can't say I have noticed this as being a problem where I've
used it, are there any scenarios where this is a showstopper?
Non-support for auth is a concern, lack of NTPv4 protoco
According to Joe Holden on Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:13:23AM +:
> hm, I can't say I have noticed this as being a problem where I've
> used it, are there any scenarios where this is a showstopper?
Non-support for auth is a concern, lack of NTPv4 protocol support is another.
Base ntpd also inclu
In message <530b2953.3030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
>> openntpd not able to authenticate the sources it is using and thus lack a big
>> ntp feature as a client.
Last I looked its clock-discipline algorithm were non-existent, it just
slammed the clock around.
>hm, I can't say I have not
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:13:23AM +, Joe Holden wrote:
> On 24/02/2014 11:08, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> > On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:04:48AM +, Joe Holden wrote:
> >> On 24/02/2014 10:56, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
> >>> In message <530b2500.5030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
> >>>
>
On 24/02/2014 11:08, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:04:48AM +, Joe Holden wrote:
On 24/02/2014 10:56, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
In message <530b2500.5030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
Can I also suggest that ntp.org shouldn't be in the base either? :P
I absolu
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 11:04:48AM +, Joe Holden wrote:
> On 24/02/2014 10:56, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
> > In message <530b2500.5030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
> >
> >> Can I also suggest that ntp.org shouldn't be in the base either? :P
> >
> > I absolutely agree, but the replacement
On 24/02/2014 10:56, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
In message <530b2500.5030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
Can I also suggest that ntp.org shouldn't be in the base either? :P
I absolutely agree, but the replacement is less clear in that case.
I'd suggest openntpd as a candidate as it would
In message <530b2500.5030...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
>Can I also suggest that ntp.org shouldn't be in the base either? :P
I absolutely agree, but the replacement is less clear in that case.
--
Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20
p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since
On 24/02/2014 10:00, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 09:56:05AM +, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
In message <530b13ca.6000...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
On 24/02/2014 04:26, Julio Merino wrote:
On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
As some of you
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 09:56:05AM +, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
> In message <530b13ca.6000...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
> >On 24/02/2014 04:26, Julio Merino wrote:
> >> On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin
> >> wrote:
>
> >>> As some of you may have noticed, I have imort
In message <530b13ca.6000...@rewt.org.uk>, Joe Holden writes:
>On 24/02/2014 04:26, Julio Merino wrote:
>> On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
>>> As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
>>> (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked t
On 24/02/2014 04:26, Julio Merino wrote:
On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
Hi,
As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
(DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation
so
here they are.
DragonFly Mail Agent is
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 12:38:14PM +0400, Lev Serebryakov wrote:
> Hello, Baptiste.
> You wrote 24 февраля 2014 г., 1:11:56:
>
> BD> DragonFly Mail Agent is a minimalistic mailer that is able to relay mails
> to
> BD> some smtp servers (with TLS, authentication and so on)
> One question: why not
On 24 Feb 2014, at 08:35, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> dma can exactly do that :) while being smaller than opensmtpd (which is very
> very nice as well, this is the one I use when I need a full smtp setup :))
Sounds excellent then. We definitely should be moving to a world where all of
the base
Hello, Baptiste.
You wrote 24 февраля 2014 г., 1:11:56:
BD> DragonFly Mail Agent is a minimalistic mailer that is able to relay mails to
BD> some smtp servers (with TLS, authentication and so on)
One question: why not OpenSMTPD from OpenBSD?
--
// Black Lion AKA Lev Serebryakov
__
On Mon, Feb 24, 2014 at 08:32:13AM +, David Chisnall wrote:
> On 24 Feb 2014, at 07:34, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
>
> > Usual complains about sendmail in base until now has been:
> > - complex configuration
> > - long history of security concerns
> > - no need for a full mta in base
>
> The
On 24 Feb 2014, at 07:34, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> Usual complains about sendmail in base until now has been:
> - complex configuration
> - long history of security concerns
> - no need for a full mta in base
The other complaint is that sendmail is only half of a useable MTA in base. If
you
On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 11:26:20PM -0500, Julio Merino wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> > (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation
> > s
On Sun, Feb 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Baptiste Daroussin wrote:
> Hi,
>
> As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
> (DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation
> so
> here they are.
>
> DragonFly Mail Agent is a minimalistic mailer that is
Hi,
As some of you may have noticed, I have imorted a couple of days ago dma
(DragonFly Mail Agent) in base. I have been asked to explain my motivation so
here they are.
DragonFly Mail Agent is a minimalistic mailer that is able to relay mails to
some smtp servers (with TLS, authentication and so
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