My apologies if I'm resurrecting something that was discussed extensively.
It has been pointed out to me that:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-57
The actual votes are held on the private lists. I'm not sure I
understand that. I would have thought that - after having the pre-vote
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My apologies if I'm resurrecting something that was discussed extensively.
It has been pointed out to me that:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-57
The actual votes are held on the private lists. I'm not sure I
understand that.
Ant
+1
Mike.
ant elder wrote:
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My apologies if I'm resurrecting something that was discussed
extensively.
It has been pointed out to me that:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-57
The actual votes are held on the private
On Thursday 07 June 2007 17:35, Paul Fremantle wrote:
The actual votes are held on the private lists. I'm not sure I
understand that. I would have thought that - after having the pre-vote
discussion on the private lists, the main vote would happen on the
podling-dev and [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Thanks! I should have asked both ways :-) Its useful to know I'm not alone!
Paul
On 6/7/07, Niclas Hedhman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Thursday 07 June 2007 17:35, Paul Fremantle wrote:
The actual votes are held on the private lists. I'm not sure I
understand that. I would have thought that
On 6/7/07, Hiram Chirino [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I ceased use of and destroyed my copy of the Specification years ago =)
But seriously, what kind of IP is it that is being violated?
copyright? patent? or some other kind that I'm not aware of?
what is NMS?
what is the NMS API?
who
On 6/7/07, robert burrell donkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
it's not a policy change
everything outside
http://incubator.apache.org/incubation/Incubation_Policy.html is
guidance not policy. the document in question is CTR not RTC.
Good point
so, anyone feeling sufficiently strongly about
what is NMS?
NMS is a .NET version of JMS. In other words an API that allows .NET
clients to interact with a messaging server, especially one that
follows the same semantics as JMS (i.e. a JMS server like Apache
ActiveMQ)
what is the NMS API?
Same as above.
who specficies it?
NMS has been
Hiram
I'm not sure about whether Sun has relevant patents on the JMS APIs.
Howver, there are two things that may have been violated. Firstly, the
license agreement that was clicked-through whenever someone looked
at the JMS specification. Secondly the JMS copyright. Since, as far as
I can see,
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hiram
I'm not sure about whether Sun has relevant patents on the JMS APIs.
Howver, there are two things that may have been violated. Firstly, the
license agreement that was clicked-through whenever someone looked
I guess you are referring to
Hiram
I guess you are referring to the license to that allows a person to
hold a copy of the JMS spec. I wonder if violating/terminating the
that license IP taints any work created using Ideas obtain from it.
Since this seems to be in the Idea category... I would have thought
that there would
All very good suggestions.
ant elder wrote:
How about changing it so;
(1) incubator-private is notified that discussion of a new committer is
starting on the poddling's private list so IPMCers can participate in that
discussion;
(2) when the actual vote happens the incubator is
Interesting proposition, however the concept of derived work in a strict
copyright sense (i.e., derivative work) may not apply to implementation
of a specification. Copyright protects against copying ultimately. A
derivative work is a work that is based on and actually includes part of
the
Bingo. Nicely explained.
I'm glad someone else sees the problem.
We need to keep our software 100% clean; its amazing how much IP law you
need to know to write code and give it away.
Which is why the generic form API for AMQP should be derived from AMQP, not
JMS.
AMQP itself was designed
Maybe we should create a set of APIs that offer genuinely open access
to messaging systems on .NET, Java, C, C# etc. Of course if Sun wished
to offer us the JMS API under an unencumbered license we could do
that, otherwise we could start from scratch.
This Apache Messaging API could then be
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
--
Paul Fremantle
Co-Founder and VP of Technical Sales, WSO2
OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair
blog: http://pzf.fremantle.org
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Oxygenating the Web Service Platform, www.wso2.com
-
+1
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
--
Paul Fremantle
Co-Founder and VP of Technical Sales, WSO2
OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair
blog: http://pzf.fremantle.org
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Oxygenating the Web Service Platform, www.wso2.com
+1 (non binding)
On 6/7/07, Davanum Srinivas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
+1
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
--
Paul Fremantle
Co-Founder and VP of Technical Sales, WSO2
OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair
blog: http://pzf.fremantle.org
[EMAIL
On Jun 7, 2007, at 2:35 AM, Paul Fremantle wrote:
My apologies if I'm resurrecting something that was discussed
extensively.
Well, yes, there have been three threads on this subject in the past
month, having about 50 emails on the subject.
Please see the incubator-general archives with
On Thursday 07 June 2007 21:34, Paul Fremantle wrote:
Since this seems to be in the Idea category... I would have thought
that there would need some patents in place to enforce it.
Not really. Once you agree to a contract (like that license) its
simply contract law, AFAIK.
Nitpicking,
+1
Craig
On Jun 7, 2007, at 8:54 AM, Paul Fremantle wrote:
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
--
Paul Fremantle
Co-Founder and VP of Technical Sales, WSO2
OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair
blog: http://pzf.fremantle.org
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Oxygenating the Web Service Platform, www.wso2.com
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
what is NMS?
NMS is a .NET version of JMS.
Not quite. Its a .Net Messaging API to the various MOMs available on
the .Net platform such as MSMQ, TibCo, MQSeries together with new
implementations such as for ActiveMQ and Stomp. Its just as
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hiram
I guess you are referring to the license to that allows a person to
hold a copy of the JMS spec. I wonder if violating/terminating the
that license IP taints any work created using Ideas obtain from it.
Since this seems to be in the
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Maybe we should create a set of APIs that offer genuinely open access
to messaging systems on .NET, Java, C, C# etc. Of course if Sun wished
to offer us the JMS API under an unencumbered license we could do
that, otherwise we could start from
+1
-jean
Paul Fremantle wrote:
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
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On 6/7/07, John O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Bingo. Nicely explained.
I'm glad someone else sees the problem.
We need to keep our software 100% clean; its amazing how much IP law you
need to know to write code and give it away.
Which is why the generic form API for AMQP should be derived
FWIW, the process outlined below fully addresses my concerns
I had with the original change.
Martin
ant elder wrote:
[...]
How about changing it so;
(1) incubator-private is notified that discussion of a new committer is
starting on the poddling's private list so IPMCers can participate in
On 6/7/07, John O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
AMQP itself was designed mostly based on IETF concepts which are
unencumbered (like smtp, nntp, nfs).
This is not true going forward as the IETF specifically permits (and,
some may say, encourages) encumbered standards now. So, even
implementing
Justin Erenkrantz wrote:
On 6/7/07, John O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
AMQP itself was designed mostly based on IETF concepts which are
unencumbered (like smtp, nntp, nfs).
This is not true going forward as the IETF specifically permits (and,
some may say, encourages) encumbered standards
AIUI, the legality of Sun's specification licenses is considered dubious.
Not that dubious defines a stance or action, just a note.
--- Noel
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Justin Erenkrantz wrote:
the IETF specifically permits (and, some may say, encourages)
encumbered standards now. So, even implementing IETF standards
is now dangerous.
The IETF has lost a lot of credibility as an independent standards body, and
really ought to be ashamed. But they are
On 6/7/07, James Strachan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Maybe we should create a set of APIs that offer genuinely open access
to messaging systems on .NET, Java, C, C# etc. Of course if Sun wished
to offer us the JMS API under an unencumbered
On 6/7/07, Paul Fremantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
+1
- robert
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+1..
Mvgr,
Martin
Paul Fremantle wrote:
$subject says it all.
Here is my +1
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+1
-Bertrand
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As we're discussing elsewhere, I don't believe that this vote is necessary
as a PMC matter, but I do concur with the Niclas participating as a Mentor
on ODE.
--- Noel
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For
Matthieu Riou wrote:
+1 (non binding)
:-) Actually, Mattieu, yours ought to matter the most (OK, along with Dims
and Paul as existing members of the podling), since the real question ought
to be whether or not you folks accept him as a Mentor.
--- Noel
Cool :) So should we have a vote on ode-dev then?
Thanks,
Matthieu
On 6/7/07, Noel J. Bergman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Matthieu Riou wrote:
+1 (non binding)
:-) Actually, Mattieu, yours ought to matter the most (OK, along with
Dims
and Paul as existing members of the podling), since the
Cool :) So should we have a vote on ode-dev then?
shrug
Sometimes I think that we get a bit vote happy. Is this really something
that is in need of a vote? E.g., is this a policy decision, karma grant or
code release? Does being a Mentor grant any special powers/rights? Is it
really just a
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