In
cajtoo5_ge2a6kxkcbnsqgxm8ve2e_gmocw4kdggxpdr6ngv...@mail.gmail.com,
on 07/11/2014
at 05:05 PM, Mike Schwab mike.a.sch...@gmail.com said:
ISPF is more like DOSSHELL on DOS 4.0.
In the sense that the QE2 is like a rowboat. I've used ISPF and I've
used DOSSHELL; DOSSHELL isn't in the same
In 2104291439117353.wa.paulgboulderaim@listserv.ua.edu, on
07/09/2014
at 05:07 PM, Paul Gilmartin
000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu said:
But I think it's fair in a sense to call ISPF the GUI enhancement
above the TSO READY prompt.
IMHO that would be the TSO Session Manager;
ISPF is more like DOSSHELL on DOS 4.0.
On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 8:50 PM, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)
shmuel+ibm-m...@patriot.net wrote:
In 2104291439117353.wa.paulgboulderaim@listserv.ua.edu, on
07/09/2014
at 05:07 PM, Paul Gilmartin
000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu said:
In 21c7a156-000c-4c46-94b1-2d0127f14...@comcast.net, on 07/08/2014
at 05:50 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net said:
Maybe the problem is you got into this position by your own
permissive behavior
The problem is not putting unsupported software into production; the
problem is putting code
On 8/07/2014 11:17 PM, Kirk Wolf wrote:
I'm not sure that I understand all of the arguments in this thread. Welcome
to IBM-MAIN :-)
That was my fault and I apologize to the list for the digression. It was
a misjudged attempt at humor and I shall refrain
from doing so in future.
It seems as
That works both ways Ed.
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
On Behalf Of Ed Gould
Sent: Monday, July 7, 2014 9:15 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Freebie software; was Feebie software
Shane
On 9/07/2014 5:18 AM, John McKown wrote:
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 3:48 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net wrote:
snip
You are in a difficult situation (much like all of Texas).
Personally I hope you don't get awakened at 0030 with an issue and
production is now broken.
Ah. I was unclear. My
On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 6:39 AM, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote:
On 9/07/2014 5:18 AM, John McKown wrote:
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 3:48 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net wrote:
snip
You are in a difficult situation (much like all of Texas).
Personally I hope you don't get
On 9 Jul 2014, at 8:47 pm, John McKown john.archie.mck...@gmail.com wrote:
On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 6:39 AM, David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com wrote:
On 9/07/2014 5:18 AM, John McKown wrote:
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 3:48 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net wrote:
snip
You are in a
On Tue, 8 Jul 2014 06:59:38 -0500, John McKown wrote:
Productivity is the responsibility of the
individual programmer. Or, a poor workman blames his tools! (or lack
thereof).
LOL! How about A poor manager blames his employees.
--
Tom Marchant
From: et...@tulsagrammer.com
Dave, while I might agree with you in the abstract, I think reality
isn't as cooperative as you suggest. The cost of licensing that
productivity improvement is a hard, easily-quantifiable expense that
must be paid with REAL money. On the other hand, the
On Jul 9, 2014, at 10:28 AM, Dave Salt wrote:
SNIP-
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
Dave,
I tried it and didn't get it.
http://www.mackinney.com/products/program-development/simplist.html
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
On Behalf Of Dave Salt
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2014 8:28 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Freebie software
cheap shot bait
If the situation was reversed and a new tool
From: gib...@wsu.edu
cheap shot bait
If the situation was reversed and a new tool was introduced that took 5
minutes longer to do something than the old tool, would anyone complain?
/cheap shot bait
They did, it's called GUI
LOL!
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
From: edgould1...@comcast.net
Dave,
I tried it and didn't get it.
http://www.mackinney.com/products/program-development/simplist.html
Thanks anyway for giving it a try it's really appreciated.
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
On Wed, 9 Jul 2014 14:19:09 -0400, Dave Salt wrote:
From: gibney
cheap shot bait
If the situation was reversed and a new tool was introduced that took 5
minutes longer to do something than the old tool, would anyone complain?
/cheap shot bait
They did, it's called GUI
LOL!
But
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 11:48 AM, Dave Salt ds...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 9:35 AM, DASDBILL2 dasdbi...@comcast.net wrote:
The loss of time is never free.
I couldn't agree more. If it costs $100,000 a year to employ a mainframe
developer (salary, benefits, premises, etc.),
Shane is entitled to explicate his own references or indeed not to do
so, and local connotations may anyway vary: (Here in the Boston,
Massachusetts, area where French food of any sort is usually mediocre
we have a bistrot, Mistral, that serves high-quality provençal food.)
More usually Le
On 8/07/2014 9:13 PM, John Gilmore wrote:
Shane is entitled to explicate his own references or indeed not to do
so, and local connotations may anyway vary: (Here in the Boston,
Massachusetts, area where French food of any sort is usually mediocre
we have a bistrot, Mistral, that serves
DANGER! OFF-TOPIC POST! Read on at your own risk!...
David Crayford wrote:
Having said that, a true aussie favorite is a meat pie with tomato sauce
dolloped on top!
Tomato sauce? Yuck, for me at least, to pour tomato sauce on food is a ghastly
insult to the poor chef or anyone who kindly
On 8/07/2014 9:43 PM, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote:
DANGER! OFF-TOPIC POST! Read on at your own risk!...
David Crayford wrote:
Having said that, a true aussie favorite is a meat pie with tomato sauce
dolloped on top!
Tomato sauce? Yuck, for me at least, to pour tomato sauce on food is a
David Crayford wrote:
Food snob!
Of course. ;-)
But you mob don't mind chewing on biltong or dolloping monkey gland on your
sausages! :)
As long it is Kudu biltong, not some lame cattle or ostrich biltong. ;-D
Now, I can't post anymore because you made me hungry ...
;-D
Groete /
.
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
http://www.mackinney.com/products/program-development/simplist.html
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 06:59:38 -0500
From: john.archie.mck...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Freebie software
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 11:48 AM, Dave
I'm not sure that I understand all of the arguments in this thread. Welcome
to IBM-MAIN :-)
Outside of the z/OS realm, people mostly understand that various aspects of
software can be decoupled:
- license to use - (free or paid). Commercial licenses often include
warranties, indemnities, etc.
information for you on the back of that napkin over there, unless it's wet.
Bill Fairchild
- Original Message -
From: Dave Salt ds...@hotmail.com
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Sent: Monday, July 7, 2014 11:48:05 AM
Subject: Re: Freebie software
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 9:35 AM
On Mon, 7 Jul 2014 12:48:05 -0400, Dave Salt ds...@hotmail.com wrote:
But many companies would rather waste millions than spend a few thousand on
tools that improve productivity.
Dave Salt
Shops such as John's and others that I am familiar with, that have either a
stated, or un-stated
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 10:58 AM, Dana Mitchell mitchd...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jul 2014 12:48:05 -0400, Dave Salt ds...@hotmail.com wrote:
But many companies would rather waste millions than spend a few thousand on
tools that improve productivity.
Dave Salt
Shops such as John's and
: Re: Freebie software; was Feebie software
On 8/07/2014 9:43 PM, Elardus Engelbrecht wrote:
DANGER! OFF-TOPIC POST! Read on at your own risk!...
David Crayford wrote:
Having said that, a true aussie favorite is a meat pie with tomato sauce
dolloped on top!
Tomato sauce? Yuck, for me
or received at this email address.
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf
Of DASDBILL2
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 1:25 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: [IBM-MAIN] international cuisine; was Re: OT: Re: Freebie software
Don't forget chitlin's grits
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf
Of Ken Porowski
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 1:44 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: international cuisine; was Re: OT: Re: Freebie software
: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 10:44 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: international cuisine; was Re: OT: Re: Freebie software; was
Feebie software
I have heard tell of a dish they call haggis.
CIT | Ken Porowski | VP Mainframe Engineering | Information Technology | +1 973
740 5459
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
http://www.mackinney.com/products/program-development/simplist.html
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 06:59:38 -0500
From: john.archie.mck...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Freebie software
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 11:48 AM, Dave Salt ds
On Jul 8, 2014, at 7:15 AM, John McKown wrote:
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 11:15 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net
wrote:
Shane:
That an issue... wondering minstrel... I have been an 4 shops where
wondering minstrels have left their tools and I have to clean up
and
listen to 30 (or so
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 3:48 PM, Ed Gould edgould1...@comcast.net wrote:
snip
You are in a difficult situation (much like all of Texas).
Personally I hope you don't get awakened at 0030 with an issue and
production is now broken.
Ah. I was unclear. My use of Co:Z is only in a non-production
On 7/8/14, 9:57 AM, Dave Salt wrote:
I hear you, and I've heard that same argument many times. But it
makes absolutely no sense to me. If we take the example of a
company that spends 10 million dollars a year to employ 100
mainframe developers, and that company licenses a tool that
improves
In another shop, and all my previous employers, I did as you said. No
unsupported freebies. In this shop, saying no is to be placed at the top
of the RIF list for not being a team player. And not supportive.
Hopefully, if/when I get a new employer, I can do things the proper way.
On Jul 8, 2014
In
CAHm_n2=smc2bh0_5xicbquxc86p8mwrg4zgeeusasgt5wbw...@mail.gmail.com,
on 07/08/2014
at 10:17 AM, Kirk Wolf k...@dovetail.com said:
It seems as if some on this thread assume that there are only two
kinds of software: 1) closed-source; paid license and support 2)
free without support
, July 8, 2014 10:46 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] international cuisine; was Re: OT: Re: Freebie
software; was Feebie software
Don't forget chitlin's grits
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU]
On Behalf
On Jul 8, 2014, at 7:06 PM, John McKown wrote:
In another shop, and all my previous employers, I did as you said. No
unsupported freebies. In this shop, saying no is to be placed at
the top
of the RIF list for not being a team player. And not supportive.
Hopefully, if/when I get a new
I just got in 4 tins of Surströmming from Sweden to try for the first time.
Fish is about 6 inches long, height about 1 inch, quarter inch thick
after gutting.
Put into cans with low salt brine. Looked like smoked salmon, tasted
very salty like anchovies.
Just touching it with a fork and the meat
Let's start correcting our subject typos now.
Bill Fairchild
- Original Message -
From: David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Sent: Friday, July 4, 2014 10:42:02 AM
Subject: Re: Feebie software
On 4/07/2014 11:37 PM, Shane Ginnane wrote:
On Fri, 4
If you substitute 'free' with 'included with the OS' you have software and
tools that you can depend on to be available at any site you find yourself
working at. Debug tool, HLASM toolkit, and all other ISV's may or may not be
available.
Dana
From: David Crayford dcrayf...@gmail.com
To:
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Dave Salt
On Mon, Jul 7, 2014 at 9:35 AM, DASDBILL2 dasdbi...@comcast.net wrote:
The loss of time is never free.
I couldn't agree more. If it costs $100,000 a year to employ a mainframe
developer (salary,
On Mon, 7 Jul 2014 09:44:30 -0500, Dana Mitchell wrote:
If you substitute 'free' with 'included with the OS' you have software and
tools that you can depend on to be available at any site you find yourself
working at. Debug tool, HLASM toolkit, and all other ISV's may or may not be
On Mon, 7 Jul 2014 12:48:05 -0400, Dave Salt wrote:
But many companies would rather waste millions than spend a few thousand on
tools that improve productivity.
Wonder what he might have in mind ... ;)
Shane ...
--
For
But many companies would rather waste millions than spend a few thousand on
tools that improve productivity.
Wonder what he might have in mind ... ;)
I think there's a clue here somewhere... ;-)
Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it!
On 7/7/2014 8:17 PM, Shane Ginnane wrote:
Such is the life of a wandering mistral.
Surely there's a good pun lurking in here, right?
--
Bob Woodside
Woodsway Consulting, Inc.
http://www.woodsway.com
rwoodsi...@woodsway.com
Shane:
That an issue... wondering minstrel... I have been an 4 shops where
wondering minstrels have left their tools and I have to clean up
and listen to 30 (or so people) complain about this used to work.
Sorry BTDTGTS I don't accept that answer.
Ed
On Jul 7, 2014, at 7:17 PM, Shane
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