Re: [ietf-dkim] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6376 (4926)

2017-02-14 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 14/02/17 01:32, Barry Leiba wrote: > Verified as Editorial is my preference. Done. Cheers, S. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ NOTE WELL: This list operates according to http://mipassoc.org/dkim/ietf-list-rules.html

Re: [ietf-dkim] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6376 (4926)

2017-02-08 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 08/02/17 03:04, Barry Leiba wrote: > When I was on the IESG, we had been talking with Heather and Sandy about > what to do about fixing up the whole errata system. Not sure where that > is now. It wasn't anyone's top priority at the time. The RFC editor folks were too busy with the RFC for

Re: [ietf-dkim] Fwd: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6376 (4926)

2017-02-07 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 07/02/17 15:33, Dave Crocker wrote: > G'day. > > Looking for a community determination, here: The DKIM spec's examples > in A.2 and A.3 do not explicitly claim to be related to each other. > However they do contain the same message, so that assuming a > relationship seems pretty reasonable.

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM Key Sizes

2016-10-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi Jon, On 27/10/16 23:29, Jon Callas wrote: > >> On Oct 27, 2016, at 1:29 AM, Peter Goldstein >> wrote: > >> Those guidelines ... specify that receivers MUST validate >> signatures of 512 to 2048 bits, but are not required to validate >> signatures with longer keys - may be worth revisiting g

Re: [ietf-dkim] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6376 (4810)

2016-09-26 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks folks. I plan to accept this as-is later today unless someone proposes better text that gets a better reaction. S On 27/09/16 03:30, John R Levine wrote: > tl;dr the proposed correction does the right thing > > >>> Section: 3.5 >>> >>> Original Text >>> - >>> x-sig-q-tag-arg

Re: [ietf-dkim] [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6376 (4810)

2016-09-26 Thread Stephen Farrell
If someone familiar with the dkim abnf could comment I'd be happy to approve/reject this as appropriate. S On 26/09/16 20:15, RFC Errata System wrote: > The following errata report has been submitted for RFC6376, > "DomainKeys Identified Mail (DKIM) Signatures". > >

[ietf-dkim] Fwd: [Lurk] Another outside the "box" use case: DKIM

2016-03-02 Thread Stephen Farrell
case that'll be tackled, or if there are other relevant use-cases people are also willing to work on. If interested in this, please discuss it on l...@ietf.org Ta, S. Forwarded Message Subject: [Lurk] Another outside the "box" use case: DKIM Date: Mon, 29 Feb 201

Re: [ietf-dkim] IPR Disclosure: ENTERKHAN CO., LTD's Statement about IPR related to RFC 6376, draft-allman-dkim-base-01, and Creative Commons

2013-08-15 Thread Stephen Farrell
That looks weird. Do we know its not spam? S On 08/15/2013 04:44 PM, IETF Secretariat wrote: > > Dear Murray Kucherawy, Dave Crocker, Tony Hansen: > > An IPR disclosure that pertains to your RFC entitled "DomainKeys Identified > Mail (DKIM) Signatures" (RFC6376) was submitted to the IETF Secre

[ietf-dkim] Stephen Farrell's Yes on status-change-dkim-to-internetstandard-03: (with COMMENT)

2013-05-12 Thread Stephen Farrell
Stephen Farrell has entered the following ballot position for status-change-dkim-to-internetstandard-03: Yes When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however

Re: [ietf-dkim] WG Action: Conclusion of Domain Keys Identified Mail (dkim)

2011-10-04 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 09/26/2011 07:23 PM, Barry Leiba wrote: >> The Domain Key Identified Mail (dkim) working group in the Security Area >> has concluded. > > And with that, ends an era. I want to thank everyone who worked hard > on getting the DKIM documents decided, written, and published. I've > been pleased

Re: [ietf-dkim] ECC (was RE: DKIM using old RSA padding?)

2011-02-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 28 Feb 2011, at 19:47, Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > On 2/28/2011 1:34 PM, Stephen Farrell wrote: >> The time to switch for DKIM is likely to be when ... > > > Just to be entirely pedantic: > > 1. This topic is out of scope for the wg at this time. Asking i

Re: [ietf-dkim] ECC (was RE: DKIM using old RSA padding?)

2011-02-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 28/02/11 17:48, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > But while we're on the topic... > > Elliptic curve cryptography has been getting more and more attention lately. > Does anyone have a good feel for adoption rates? Should we (or maybe another > group, or an individual submission) look into regi

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM using old RSA padding?

2011-02-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 28/02/11 09:53, Hanno Böck wrote: > Hi, > > I'm currently researching about the usage of RSA-PSS, an improved > padding method for RSA signatures (specified in PKCS #1 2.1/RFC 3447). > > I saw that domainkeys in RFC 4871 is hard-bound to the old PKCS #1 1.5 > method. RFC 4871 was developed y

Re: [ietf-dkim] Do we need to meet in Prague?

2011-01-26 Thread Stephen Farrell
So I've just requested a 1.5 hour slot for Prague. If we figure we don't need it we can cancel out later. Stephen. On 21/01/11 18:50, Eliot Lear wrote: > Barry, > > I'd suggest that the group is in one of two states: > > * We are sufficiently agreed on 4871bis that it can advance, at >

Re: [ietf-dkim] Re-thinking the organization of the DKIM spec

2011-01-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 11/01/11 12:12, Eliot Lear wrote: > 1. I recognize that sometimes good ideas have their own schedules, but > I consider it unfortunate that the WG had to spend time to go through > WGLC, resolve open issues, and then for the authors and chairs to > reorganize the work. Just one quick clari

Re: [ietf-dkim] ADSP and SPF

2010-11-24 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 24/11/10 16:02, Alessandro Vesely wrote: > +1. For different reasons, both ADSP and SPF seem to need a revision. > Is there an opportunity to be taken here? Not in this WG with this charter. Let's get done with out work items. S. ___ NOTE WELL:

Re: [ietf-dkim] one more round of the inane mailing list argument, was DKIM Japan has been set up

2010-11-24 Thread Stephen Farrell
Let's not do this on this list. On 24/11/10 15:42, John R. Levine wrote: > This really does need to be a FAQ. > >>> DKIM works just dandy, when lists sign their mail like this one does. > >> Unless the intermediary co-operates by re-signing, mailing lists can break >> DKIM signatures. > > Qui

Re: [ietf-dkim] Last call comment: Changing the g= definition

2010-10-15 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 15/10/10 19:48, Michael Thomas wrote: > On 10/15/2010 10:45 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote: >> In this case, I don't recollect an objection, so thus far, it seems >> to me that Dave's correct on this one. I think its perfectly fine >> for an editor to try to close

Re: [ietf-dkim] Last call comment: Changing the g= definition

2010-10-15 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 15/10/10 18:32, Barry Leiba wrote: >> I'd like to ask a procedural question of the chairs: Dave killfile's >> many participants, therefore any consensus he sees will merely reflect >> the echo chamber of his own making. >> >> So I strongly object on procedural grounds for authors who kill file

Re: [ietf-dkim] I-D Action:draft-ietf-dkim-implementation-report-03.txt

2010-10-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 11/10/10 22:35, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: >> The same question on Working Group Last Call applies here as well. >> >> Abort, retry or ignore? :-) > > I guess it's up to the chairs. It hadn't occurred to me that this could > upset a WGLC. At this point I'd say that the changes are (I ho

Re: [ietf-dkim] THIS IS A MULTIPLE 5322.FROM MESSAGE

2010-10-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 05/10/10 23:54, Julian Mehnle wrote: > Recommending that one more "From" be added to h= (and hashed) > than From headers are initially placed in the message should be enough. > There is no need to change the semantics of the spec. Assuming that "recommending" above maps to a (putative) "MU

Re: [ietf-dkim] Comments on draft-ietf-dkim-implementation-report-01

2010-10-02 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 02/10/10 16:22, Dave CROCKER wrote: > > On 10/2/2010 5:58 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote: >> On 01/10/10 18:28, Dave CROCKER wrote: >>> I think the text should therefore be revised from: >>> >>>> 1.1. Signing Identity >>> ... >>>>

Re: [ietf-dkim] Comments on draft-ietf-dkim-implementation-report-01

2010-10-02 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 01/10/10 18:28, Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > On 10/1/2010 10:15 AM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: >> The spec simply states that DKIM doesn't require any binding at all. >> (Section 1.1) > > > It occurs to me that this language permits a misinterpretation and that > stronger > and more direc

Re: [ietf-dkim] Authorizing List Domains

2010-09-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 28/09/10 23:02, Douglas Otis wrote: > On 9/27/10 9:47 PM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: >>> On Monday, September 27, 2010 4:19 PM, Douglas Otis wrote: > > TPA-Label involves ADSP being discussed on the dkim list. I've no idea precisely what Doug means here, but to avoid doubt: the DKIM WG has

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM+ADSP = FAIL, and it's our fault

2010-09-15 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 15/09/10 15:43, McDowell, Brett wrote: > On Sep 15, 2010, at 12:11 AM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > >> Based on that (rather precise) description, aren't ADSP's requirements a >> proper subset of the DKIM requirements? If so, I'm not sure I agree with >> "badly conflicting", but it does fr

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM+ADSP = FAIL, and it's our fault

2010-09-15 Thread Stephen Farrell
I totally agree that this pointless repetition is...pointless. Barry and I have asked folks to stop that kind of thing a number of times with no real success. (As demonstrated by the last few days messages.) Perhaps this time people will be more responsible, we'll see. I also think that the few

Re: [ietf-dkim] marketing dkim

2010-08-19 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, Please. Let's get back to the work at hand and not spend time on this, Stephen. ___ NOTE WELL: This list operates according to http://mipassoc.org/dkim/ietf-list-rules.html

Re: [ietf-dkim] marketing dkim

2010-08-19 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 19/08/10 18:06, Michael Thomas wrote: > On 08/19/2010 09:20 AM, John Levine wrote: >> Be sure to tell them that ADSP is not useful, according to one of the >> authors of the ADSP RFC. > > Chairs -- > > Can I ask for a revision of ADSP where John is stripped out of the document? You can ask.

Re: [ietf-dkim] Splitting the mailing list document?

2010-08-10 Thread Stephen Farrell
So it seems reasonable for folks to discuss this for a few days and if a consensus is clear we can go from there. Otherwise maybe we can poll about in next week or so. (Other suggestions welcome, particularly from Murray as editor.) S. On 10/08/10 15:06, Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > On 8/9/2010 1

Re: [ietf-dkim] Straw poll results

2010-08-09 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks. I suspect we're not longer involved in a straw poll of any kind in this thread. If there are points arising, please start new threads. Otherwise, it'd be great if folks could spend their time commenting on Murray's draft, as some have already done. Thanks, Stephen. __

Re: [ietf-dkim] Straw poll results

2010-08-09 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi John, I think I generally agree with the overall conclusion that expecting signatures to verify after list processing isn't worth the effort, but I'm not sure your logic below is sound... On 09/08/10 18:45, John Levine wrote: > In article <548b10a3a5fcf3025a4b5...@lewes.staff.uscs.susx.ac.uk>

[ietf-dkim] Chair affiliation

2010-07-08 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi, There was a discussion on the IETF wg chairs list last year that concluded it'd be good for chairs to be transparent about their affiliation. So: Until recently (April) I was working 50:50 for Trinity College Dublin (TCD) and NewBay Software. Since then I've got some more research money and

[ietf-dkim] Maastricht meeting

2010-05-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, I guess we do have work to do in Maastricht so Barry and I will request a meeting slot unless we hear that lots of people we'd want there will be missing. (Last time I asked I only got a very few folks who said they'd be there. If you will be there, I'd be interested in knowing that off li

Re: [ietf-dkim] Charter update

2010-05-22 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 05/21/2010 03:45 PM, Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > On 5/20/2010 3:36 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote: >> Separately, some IESG folks have asked whether we really have >> the cycles available for some of our new charter items, in >> particular: > > I don't under

Re: [ietf-dkim] Charter update

2010-05-20 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 05/19/2010 11:25 PM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > Attending a Maastricht meeting is highly likely for me, but Beijing is less > certain. You may not be alone there. > Could we plan a regular meeting in Maastricht? Seems appropriate given the > big interest in a "DKIM And MLMs" document.

Re: [ietf-dkim] Lists "BCP" draft available

2010-05-18 Thread Stephen Farrell
That doesn't seem to be about mailing lists. I don't see that we're re-opening ADSP now and we're not chartered for that, so I don't really see much point in this discussion. So perhaps take that discussion offlist? Stephen. On 05/19/2010 01:18 AM, Michael Deutschmann wrote: > On Tue, 18 May 2

[ietf-dkim] Charter update

2010-05-12 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi all, The attached is the updated charter Barry and I will send to Sean on Monday. The text is the same as last time we sent this to the list, we just modified the milestones a bit to reflect what we think is doable starting from now. This charter and milestones imply that we should probably r

Re: [ietf-dkim] Lists "BCP" draft available

2010-05-12 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 05/11/2010 06:10 PM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: >> From what I see on the list, there is clear consensus that this >> document should be produced as a WG document (which I support as well). >> So can we consider that question closed? > > That's up to the chairs, but I suspect we have enough

[ietf-dkim] Recent discussions

2010-05-07 Thread Stephen Farrell
Just a question/comment about these recent discussions. Is there anything here that's not already noted in our draft charter update that might be actionable and could garner WG consensus? I didn't see anything myself, but then there's been a lot of mail so I may have missed something. If I've go

Re: [ietf-dkim] An alternative way forward for dkim-deployment...

2010-03-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks Pasi, FWIW, I think Pasi's suggestion moves us forward nicely so I'd be happy to see us agree to do that. Stephen. On 03/11/2010 10:30 AM, pasi.ero...@nokia.com wrote: > I'm getting the impression that this debate is starting to be about > proving points rather than making progress. In t

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM errata 1532 (v= and DomainKeys)

2010-03-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 03/11/2010 10:50 AM, pasi.ero...@nokia.com wrote: > Just two unprocessed errata left! Tackling the easier one first: > > http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?eid=1532 > > Appendix A of draft-ietf-dkim-deployment has detailed text about > this topic (differences in DNS key records bet

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM charter update proposal

2009-10-18 Thread Stephen Farrell
SM wrote: >>> The working group is now ready to switch its focus to refining and >>> advancing the DKIM protocols. The current deliverables for the >>> DKIM working group are these: >>> >>> * Advance the base DKIM protocol (RFC 4871) to Draft Standard. > > The base DKIM protocol is updated

[ietf-dkim] HOWTO discuss things on this list...

2009-10-17 Thread Stephen Farrell
DKIM colleagues, You all know that the DKIM discussions have sometimes been contentious, and some participants have gotten hot under the collar. We note that that's been particularly true recently, and we'd like everyone to take a step back and remind themselves of a few things: 1. The purpose o

Re: [ietf-dkim] Is anyone using ADSP? - bit more data from the receiving side

2009-10-13 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi Hector, We need to keep the tone here under control and in particular the text below is inappropriate. Please desist from making assertions like this on this list. hector wrote: > Well, maybe if the WG can get a true champion of POLICY and not one > that selfishly took over SSP with the sole

Re: [ietf-dkim] gathering data

2009-10-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
, so for now, I'm just trying to understand if you're proposing something for that, (and if so, if you're volunteering to do work:-) If your question is unrelated to the charter discussion, that's fine too. Cheers, S. > > - Original Message - > From: "

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM charter update proposal

2009-10-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, To make life a little easier for us all, (well, mainly Barry and I:-), could you please keep this thread to discussion of the proposed charter update. And where you've thoughts on that, specific alternate text would be appreciated. Thanks, Stephen. PS: I see John L. has done the right t

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM charter update proposal

2009-10-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks Dave, Let's give it a day or two more to see if anyone else has suggested changes then Barry & I will think about folding in your suggestions. Cheers, S. Dave CROCKER wrote: > > Barry Leiba wrote: >> Description of Working Group: >> >> The Internet mail protocols and infrastructure al

[ietf-dkim] gathering data (was: Re: DKIM charter update proposal)

2009-10-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
Franck, Franck Martin wrote: > Seems to me something is missing: gather data to establish if DKIM > specifications have in any way alleviated any misuse of the email system, in > particular but not limited to spam, phishing attacks and fraud. > If you want to propose some specific work items

Re: [ietf-dkim] DKIM charter update proposal

2009-10-05 Thread Stephen Farrell
Scott Kitterman wrote: > If advancing DKIM/ADSP along the standards heirarchy is all that's on the > table, I think it should wait. > > Effective rollout of DKIM in large hetrgenous organizations is complex and > takes time. I think it's better to pause for a while and give broad > operati

[ietf-dkim] [Fwd: FW: Nomcom 2009-10: Important Reminder: Call for Nominations, Local Office hours, Nominee Questionnaires available]

2009-09-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
FYI. Stephen. --- Begin Message --- Hi all, Thanks to the ADs and chairs that forwarded the previous reminder to their mailing lists. I would appreciate it if other chairs and ADs could do so, since we are really in need of more nominations. Thanks, Mary. -Original Message- From: ietf

Re: [ietf-dkim] RFC4871bis - whether to drop -- k: Key type

2009-06-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > Stephen Farrell wrote: >> The putative attack would be to sign with foo-sha256 where foo is some >> algorithm that a verifier supports and such that the foo key encoding >> could >> accept an rsa p= value as input and such that that c

Re: [ietf-dkim] RFC4871bis - whether to drop -- k: Key type

2009-06-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: >> Here's what I remember from the original discussion of h= and k= in >> the key record. >> >> First, part of the idea was to have them both there, to make things >> parallel: "This key is used for this crypto suite." >> [...] > > I'm neutral on either keeping or remo

Re: [ietf-dkim] RFC4871bis - whether to drop -- k: Key type

2009-06-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
Dave CROCKER wrote: > > Barry Leiba wrote: >> 1. Crypto suite X had been seriously cracked, such that an attacker >> could, at least in some cases, create a valid suite-X signature on his > > Is there any experiential basis to motivate our having to worry about this > attack vector? In other

Re: [ietf-dkim] chained signatures, was l= summary

2009-06-09 Thread Stephen Farrell
I think Murray's point is a fair one. This thread isn't really progressing in terms of what to in/exclude from 4871bis as far as I can see so let's leave it there. Stephen. Doug Otis wrote: > On Jun 8, 2009, at 3:37 PM, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > >>> The use of the DKIM l=, z= and x= feature

[ietf-dkim] 4871bis/4871 interop

2009-06-02 Thread Stephen Farrell
It'd be useful for us, as chairs, to know if we have consensus around requirements for interop between implementations of 4871 and 4871bis. Some of the discussions about things to deprecate may affect that, so if we have a clear understanding in advance it might short-cut some discussions of spec

Re: [ietf-dkim] Whither 4871bis?

2009-05-08 Thread Stephen Farrell
So let me try summarise and ask a question. I don't think I've seen anyone who wants to do more than just roll up the existing errata into a bis document, possibly with some editorial changes I guess. I've not seen anyone suggest that we add features or remove a raft of features or make other sub

Re: [ietf-dkim] Update of RFC4871 Appendix D. MUA Considerations (resent)

2009-04-10 Thread Stephen Farrell
Dave CROCKER wrote: > I'd like to strongly encourage the working group to defer this change until > the > -bis work. Yep. With my chair hat on, I think such a change would be very like starting in on the bis work (which we've yet to scope) and we didn't include it in the consensus call. So I b

Re: [ietf-dkim] what is a standard, was errata revision: Assessor

2009-03-26 Thread Stephen Farrell
Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > Perhaps some other vendors would like to weigh in. I'm not at all sure we really need to have that discussion on here. The logic being that it doesn't affect what we do or don't say in the errata I-D. Stephen. ___ NOTE WE

[ietf-dkim] DKIM SAAG writeup...

2009-03-25 Thread Stephen Farrell
DKIM met on Wednesday at 9am. About 40 people attended. Discussion centred on the content of, and how to process, an I-D describing mostly terminology changes to RFC 4871. The consensus in the room was to quickly finish up that I-D (we had three areas where some tweaking might be needed), and the

Re: [ietf-dkim] Moving on to ADSP - was RE: Handling the errata after the consensus call

2009-03-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
Siegel, Ellen wrote: > >> -Original Message- >> On Behalf Of John Levine >> >> Seems like a reasonable way to avoid the i= fight. If there's interest, >> I can whip up a new ADSP draft with an r= tag. >> > > Sounds like a good approach to me. Just in case: Please don't prepare a new A

Re: [ietf-dkim] Moving to consensus on draft-ietf-dkim-rfc4871-errata

2009-03-11 Thread Stephen Farrell
Jim Fenton wrote: > Dave CROCKER wrote: >> Are there other changes to draft-ietf-dkim-rfc4871-errata being proposed? >> > > I believe the Chairs requested that the other, non-controversial, errata > be incorporated into this draft. I think we suggested it as an option rather than requested

Re: [ietf-dkim] ADSP -> Experimental

2009-03-10 Thread Stephen Farrell
You have suggested that many times. The WG and the BoFs before it always disagreed. End of story as far as I'm concerned unless *many* of those that want it as standards-track now indicate a change of mind. Again, please stop. This is unproductive and totally distracting the WG from progressing w

Re: [ietf-dkim] ADSP -> Experimental

2009-03-10 Thread Stephen Farrell
Please stop all this ADSP "good"/ADSP "bad" repetition. ADSP is finished WGLC and the only thing on our agenda for it now is pushing it further along the process. The might, or might not, require some minor change as a result of the resolution one of the 16 errata for 4871, however, forgetting A

Re: [ietf-dkim] Handling the errata after the consensus call

2009-03-10 Thread Stephen Farrell
SM wrote: > Hi Stephen, > At 17:00 09-03-2009, Stephen Farrell wrote: >> Firstly, we're not authors in the sense of being personally >> responsible for each word - the ability and willingness to write >> something with which you disagree is laudable in many cases and

Re: [ietf-dkim] Nitpicking about ADSP

2009-03-09 Thread Stephen Farrell
Does the subject line and the endless rehashing of old arguments imply that there is, in fact, no recession and that we all have plenty of time to do all this for the n-th time? *Please* re-read and opine on Barry's message, and not on this aged topic. S. On 9 Mar 2009, at 23:48, Douglas Ot

Re: [ietf-dkim] Handling the errata after the consensus call

2009-03-09 Thread Stephen Farrell
On 9 Mar 2009, at 22:47, SM wrote: > At 14:17 09-03-2009, John Levine wrote: >> I sign all my mail, but there's no way I can say that with ADSP. In >> its current form, ADSP is broken and useless. > > Given that one of the authors of draft-ietf-dkim-ssp-09 states that > ADSP is broken and usel

Re: [ietf-dkim] Handling the errata after the consensus call

2009-03-09 Thread Stephen Farrell
MH Michael Hammer (5304) wrote: > Please offer a better way of indicating that mail is always signed. Actually, please don't. We were chartered to do ADSP and we've (almost) done that. Unless someone's looking to recharter I don't see how this list is relevant for other ways to do what ADSP doe

Re: [ietf-dkim] Errata

2009-02-23 Thread Stephen Farrell
Michael Thomas wrote: > In any case, I'd like to understand the process by which a substantial > change in semantics is allowed under the rubric of "errata". I also believe "substantial change" is not allowed and wouldn't get the ok from our AD to use the RFC editor's errata process. However, a

Re: [ietf-dkim] Errata

2009-02-23 Thread Stephen Farrell
So I think this thread seems to have descended into the fairly pointless and unproductive category. Maybe let's leave it there while Barry and I tot up the responses to the concensus call and see what we (as chairs) make of that. In particular: Michael Thomas wrote: > Dave CROCKER wrote: >> A nu

[ietf-dkim] Consensus call on d=/i= clarification

2009-02-16 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi All, We've had some recent discussion about d=/i= on the list and a couple of concrete proposals for clarifications to make to RFC 4871. - The first is Dave's erratum I-D. [1] - The second is a proposal from Eliot.[2] Barry and I would like to see if there's rough consensus on one of th

Re: [ietf-dkim] Requesting working group LastCall on: draft-ietf-dkim-rfc4871-errata-02

2009-02-13 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, Please hold off on +1's etc until Barry & I respond to Dave's request for a WGLC. If and when we do WGLC then you'll need to resend anyway, so there's no need now. S. ___ NOTE WELL: This list operates according to http://mipassoc.org/dkim/ietf

Re: [ietf-dkim] Requesting working group Last Call on: draft-ietf-dkim-rfc4871-errata-02

2009-02-12 Thread Stephen Farrell
Dave CROCKER wrote: > Consequently, I'd like to ask that we go through a working group Last Call > for > rfc4871-errata-02. Barry and I are just pinging about with Pasi on some process stuff but will be back to get this started/sorted in a day or two. S. __

Re: [ietf-dkim] draft Errata on RFC 4871

2009-01-26 Thread Stephen Farrell
John Levine wrote: > Except that the UAID might or might not be an e-mail address. The one > on this messgage isn't. So, for clarity, can you (or someone) call out what you think is the impact, if any, for ADSP, caused by this proposed change to 4871. Thanks, Stephen.

Re: [ietf-dkim] draft Errata on RFC 4871

2009-01-26 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks Dave (and the other's acked) for taking this on and making a firm proposal. I guess we've a couple of questions related to this: Firstly, do we have rough consensus on the substance of the erratum? Separately, is the best route from here to do a 4871bis (assuming the 5378 mess gets sorte

[ietf-dkim] Copyright issues affecting current Internet-Drafts

2009-01-15 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, There are some issues with the new IPR policies outlined in RFC 5378 that I would like to bring to your attention. Please read through the writeups that other folks have provided and make your own judgement. Discussion of this should take place on the IETF list and not here. Stephen. >---

[ietf-dkim] Clarifying i=/d= in 4871 (was: Re: Next steps for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp)

2009-01-13 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi Dave, I think you're making a reasonable point below about 4871. Dave CROCKER wrote: > > > Stephen Farrell wrote: >> I don't believe this discussion is necessary in order to progress the >> ADSP draft, which, for better or worse, is where the W

Re: [ietf-dkim] Next steps for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp

2009-01-07 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, Can we restrict ourselves to the subject on the subject line or start a separate thread? I don't believe this discussion is necessary in order to progress the ADSP draft, which, for better or worse, is where the WG's rough consensus ended up. Thanks, Stephen.

Re: [ietf-dkim] Next steps for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp

2008-12-31 Thread Stephen Farrell
John L wrote: > That would be fine with me, but what it says now is that the i= MUST match > the From: address. As I've said a few times, that's clearly wrong, but I > got shouted down in the past when I tried to change it. Without getting into the merits of the argument (and I don't think we

[ietf-dkim] DKIM msp meeting minutes

2008-11-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi, I don't think we posted these to the list yet, so here they are. [1] Regards, Stephen. [1] http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/08nov/minutes/dkim.txt ___ NOTE WELL: This list operates according to http://mipassoc.org/dkim/ietf-list-rules.html

Re: [ietf-dkim] AD evaluation comments for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp

2008-11-24 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi Pasi, The authors have pushed out a new version of ADSP. [1] I've just had a look at the diffs [2] between that and the previous one, and they seem to have covered your AD comments fairly well, so hopefully you'll be ok with starting IETF LC after you've had a chance to check their changes.

Re: [ietf-dkim] errata conclusions

2008-11-22 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks Tony, If there are no objections, we'll forward these to Pasi to take action (i.e. update the errata pages) in one week from now, Stephen. Tony Hansen wrote: > Here's a description of the errata conclusions that were made at today's > meeting. If anyone disagrees, speak now. > > T

[ietf-dkim] Draft agenda for MSP

2008-11-07 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi All, A bit late (sorry;-) but I've now posted a draft agenda. [1] Let Barry & I know if there are any changes/additions needed - we do have time if necessary. Regards, Stephen. [1] http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/08nov/agenda/dkim.txt ___ NOTE WE

Re: [ietf-dkim] [dkim-ops] Q: "dkim=discardable"

2008-10-30 Thread Stephen Farrell
Doug, That was discussed at length in the WG and we ended up where we ended up. I'm sure you'll make the point again in IETF LC, (which is entirely fine), but we don't need to revisit the topic on this list, so please stop raising it here. If you think you have some compelling reason that we sh

Re: [ietf-dkim] Re-send: Considerations for rechartering

2008-10-29 Thread Stephen Farrell
Oops - probably just by me, sorry. (Found it in a wrong folder.) S. Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > Apparently this got missed. Re-sending... > > -- Forwarded message -- > Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2008 11:31:39 -0700 (PDT) > From: Murray S. Kucherawy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: ietf-dkim@m

Re: [ietf-dkim] Potential DKIM re-chartering...

2008-10-29 Thread Stephen Farrell
em, as it > provides approximately that capability in what would be a standardized > way. I realize there will be some disagreement whether this is a good > idea, but that's what a chartering discussion is all about. Ok. Looks like a good agenda item for MSP. But of course, folks shou

Re: [ietf-dkim] Potential DKIM re-chartering...

2008-10-28 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, we've had no response so far to this request for new work items. If that remains the case, Barry and I plan to let our AD know that its time to declare victory for DKIM and that we'll be heading into dormant mode after the next meeting (which should be very short). Stephen

Re: [ietf-dkim] AD evaluation comments for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp

2008-10-20 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks Pasi, I'll work with the authors to get their reactions back to the list and we can go from there, Cheers, S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Hi, > > I've done my AD review for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp-06, and I was happy > to see that the document is in good shape. > > I do have couple of sugge

[ietf-dkim] Potential DKIM re-chartering...

2008-10-13 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi All, In Dublin [1] we had a few proposals for new work items and presentation of some related work (Murray's stuff). We agreed with the AD that we would not start a discussion about potentially re-chartering until after ADSP and the overview were out of the WG. Well, we're there now, ADSP is w

Re: [ietf-dkim] RFC 4871 errata

2008-09-30 Thread Stephen Farrell
e that silence > means everyone's OK with them.) > > Best regards, > Pasi > >> -Original Message- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of ext >> Stephen Farrell >> Sent: 29 September, 2008 12:44 >> To: ietf

[ietf-dkim] RFC 4871 errata

2008-09-29 Thread Stephen Farrell
Hi all, We need to give Pasi guidance on the WG's opinion of the various errata [1] that've been posted for RFC 4871. Most of these were generated as a result of the good interop work done earlier, so this should hopefully be easy. We need to tell Pasi if we think the errata as posted should be

[ietf-dkim] ADSP publication requested

2008-09-29 Thread Stephen Farrell
h the process. Personnel Stephen Farrell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) is the shepherd for this document. PROTO write-up: (1.a) Who is the Document Shepherd for this document? Has the Document Shepherd personally reviewed this version of the document and, in particular, does he or she believe

Re: [ietf-dkim] Progressing ADSP (Was: Re: New Version Notification for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp-06 (fwd))

2008-09-20 Thread Stephen Farrell
Sorry, let me clarify. WGLC is done. I was only interested in getting "+1 to publish" or "I agree with Doug" responses. We're done with this document. Thanks, Stephen. ___ NOTE WELL: This list operates according to http://mipassoc.org/dkim/ietf-list-ru

[ietf-dkim] Progressing ADSP (Was: Re: New Version Notification for draft-ietf-dkim-ssp-06 (fwd))

2008-09-20 Thread Stephen Farrell
Thanks John, So this means that we're not taking on board the various suggestions in Doug's draft since they didn't garner any real support. I think that's correct, but just in case - if there's a whole bunch of folks out there who agree with Doug's draft so much that they think we should not pro

Re: [ietf-dkim] Overview WGLC

2008-09-18 Thread Stephen Farrell
Douglas Otis wrote: > > On Sep 18, 2008, at 8:53 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote: > >> >> >> Stephen Farrell wrote: >>> This note is to start WGLC for the overview document. [1] >>> >>> Given its vacation time, WGLC will run for 4 weeks from

Re: [ietf-dkim] ADSP WGLC

2008-09-18 Thread Stephen Farrell
Stephen Farrell wrote: > This note is to start WGLC for the ADSP document. [1] > > Given its vacation time, WGLC will run for 4 weeks from > now, ending on September 3rd. And this closes WGLC for ADSP. I think we got the following comments:- http://mipassoc.org/pipermail/ietf

Re: [ietf-dkim] Overview WGLC

2008-09-18 Thread Stephen Farrell
Stephen Farrell wrote: > This note is to start WGLC for the overview document. [1] > > Given its vacation time, WGLC will run for 4 weeks from > now, ending on September 3rd. And this note closes WGLC. I believe we got the following comment:- http://mipassoc.org/pipermail/ietf

[ietf-dkim] Meeting next time

2008-09-12 Thread Stephen Farrell
Folks, FYI - I've submitted a meeting request for a 1 hour session and asked that it not be Monday or Friday. We can start agendising later, but feel free to let Barry and I know if you'd like a slot now (and for what and for how long). If we're looking like 1 hour is too short I can modify the

[ietf-dkim] Closing issues

2008-08-06 Thread Stephen Farrell
Eliot, I believe we can now close all of the issues mentioned in the minutes just sent out. (Almost all of those were previously flagged for closure a few weeks ago.) Can you do that on Friday, just to give people a last chance to check if I messed up? Thanks, Stephen.

[ietf-dkim] Fuller minutes for last week's meeting.

2008-08-06 Thread Stephen Farrell
I've expanded on the summary posted earlier at [1]. Please send any comments by the end of this week (I'll be on vacation thereafter). Stephen. [1] http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/08jul/minutes/dkim.txt ___ NOTE WELL: This list operates according to

[ietf-dkim] Overview WGLC

2008-08-06 Thread Stephen Farrell
This note is to start WGLC for the overview document. [1] Given its vacation time, WGLC will run for 4 weeks from now, ending on September 3rd. Thanks, Stephen. [1] http://tools.ietf.org/wg/dkim/draft-ietf-dkim-overview/ ___ NOTE WELL: This list oper

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