Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Winkler
On Fri, Jun 11, 2004 at 01:07:46AM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > > Currently I use a Fellowes (nee Cirque) touchpad as my primary mouse. > > It's a bit bigger than a laptop touchpad, but not by much. > > Like this one: > > http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?RestartFlow=t&Section_Id=1795&Produ

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Fri, 2004-06-11 at 00:54, Paul Winkler wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 08:42:42PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > > Speaking of touchpads, does anyone know of a (usb) touchpad that works > > with your finger, not just a pen? (The only ones I've seen just work > > with the stylus, which is no go

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Winkler
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 08:42:42PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > Speaking of touchpads, does anyone know of a (usb) touchpad that works > with your finger, not just a pen? (The only ones I've seen just work > with the stylus, which is no good) I'm guessing you mean a big one, like 15 or 20 cm on

[linux-audio-dev] Buffer size settings - Mac/Windows

2004-06-10 Thread Michael Ost
Hi. Does anyone out there know what the audio buffer size settings in Windows and MacOS really mean? If you say "128 samples" does that translate to 2 buffers of 128 samples --- one buffer playing, one buffer filling --- or 2 buffers of 64 samples? Is it 256 samples of latency or 128? I realize t

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Florian Schmidt
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 13:23:52 -0400 Dave Robillard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I think that's a really good idea.. the 'base' slider could be really > small (ie the size of a knob), but the movement would be linear, and > with variable precision.. and it seems like it would be immediately > obviou

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 20:21, Paul Winkler wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:55:32PM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:28:01 -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > > > I think that your frontal lobe is saying "knobs are round, move the mouse > > > around them" but I still believe that

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Winkler
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:55:32PM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:28:01 -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > > I think that your frontal lobe is saying "knobs are round, move the mouse > > around them" but I still believe that your hand will find it more > > intuitive and correct to

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread Florian Schmidt
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 15:57:14 -0500 Jan Depner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I like this idea, however, in JAMin, we were trying to save real > estate. The status bar is used for JACK status. It would be very easy > to implement this since I've already built focus change detection in for > context

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Davis
>Hallo, >Thorsten Wilms hat gesagt: // Thorsten Wilms wrote: > >> The discussion about linear or radial mouse movement for >> knobs finaly got me to mockup an idea i had in my mind >> for sometime already. >> >> For now I call it fan sliders: >> http://wrstud.urz.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/0

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Davis
>Hallo, >Steve Harris hat gesagt: // Steve Harris wrote: > >> On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 09:26:54 +0200, Frank Barknecht wrote: >> > Better use Mutt, it sucks less. >> >> In all seriousness, all the non elm/mutt apps I've used dont let me go >> though my mail quickly enough. The ability to switch inb

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 19:10, Tim Hockin wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:56:30PM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > > I was speaking of knobs. A horizontal slider is obviously visually > > > different from a vertical one. A horizontally-linear knob is not > > > obviously different from a verticall

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:56:30PM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > I was speaking of knobs. A horizontal slider is obviously visually > > different from a vertical one. A horizontally-linear knob is not > > obviously different from a vertically-linear knob :) > > I dont think theres any reason to

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 01:37:12 -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > > Not if the pan sliders are laid out horizontally :-) > > I was speaking of knobs. A horizontal slider is obviously visually > different from a vertical one. A horizontally-linear knob is not > obviously different from a vertically-lin

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:28:01 -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > I think that your frontal lobe is saying "knobs are round, move the mouse > around them" but I still believe that your hand will find it more > intuitive and correct to move the mouse in one direction - up and down. Hmm... I've just reali

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Frank Barknecht
Hallo, Steve Harris hat gesagt: // Steve Harris wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 09:26:54 +0200, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > Better use Mutt, it sucks less. > > In all seriousness, all the non elm/mutt apps I've used dont let me go > though my mail quickly enough. The ability to switch inboxes, de

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Jan Depner
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 17:00, Steve Harris wrote: > Yup, but I dont think we got consensus on the metadata format, which is > kinda fundamnetal. For the record, I (still) think we should use a > restricted subset of RDF/N3. > As long as you never, ever have to look at it. I could actually

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 04:01:25 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:49:57AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > > > Its out of process. Sounds like torben wants to swallow the plugin UI, > > thats kinda neat, didn't think anyone would bother, but we should take > > that into a

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:25:46 -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > That reminds me of something I've been meaning to ask (after actually > reading the DSSI RFC) > > Is there anything really soft synth specific about DSSI? Should it be > DAPI (disposable audio plugin interface). You have to care abo

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:28:17 -0400, Paul Davis wrote: > >> There is chasm both broad and deep between > >> > >> "plugin, show your GUI now" > >> > >> and an actual implementation of such functionality. > > > >Yeah osc.udp://localhost:2134/ui/show ;) I'm very much in favour of > >simple

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:57:06 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Automation in VST is pretty much broken AFAICT. It relys on explicit > > support from the plugins to work. > > i am tempted to say "not true" but i may miss something. > > - there is a setParameter() call on the plugin (so i can

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:22:55 -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > That said, the existance of the list should be more well-known. There's > far too much audio stuff going on that isn't even aware of LAD, which > can't be good. Er, actually thats not neccesarily true. Some people prefer to actually

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Frank Barknecht
Hallo, Thorsten Wilms hat gesagt: // Thorsten Wilms wrote: > The discussion about linear or radial mouse movement for > knobs finaly got me to mockup an idea i had in my mind > for sometime already. > > For now I call it fan sliders: > http://wrstud.urz.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/04-06-10_f

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 09:26:54 +0200, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Marek Peteraj hat gesagt: // Marek Peteraj wrote: > > > In case anybody here is using evolution to post on lad. > > > > Since 1.2 it was the most stable and perfect application i've ever seen. > > Evolution seems to have o

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Steve Harris
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:15:56 +0200, Tim Orford wrote: > > And no, linux audio is definitely not perfectly unusable for me. > > Quite the contrary; pd, supercollider, snd, ladspa, alsa, jack and the > > very low-latish kernel make it to be a very usable platform for creative > > work you can't

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread Jan Depner
I like this idea, however, in JAMin, we were trying to save real estate. The status bar is used for JACK status. It would be very easy to implement this since I've already built focus change detection in for context sensitive help (shift-F1 over any widget). I don't think I have enough room to g

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 02:53:56PM -0400, Paul Winkler wrote: > > > No, I did not mean 2 axes for one widget. Only that a linear widget has > > > to indicate it's direction even before interaction happens, and that it > > > makes sense to use vertical for volume and horizonal for pan in the > >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] TiMidity as a CPU hog

2004-06-10 Thread Greg Lee
Dave Phillips wrote: Greetings: Can someone explain why TiMidity eventually hogs the CPU at 95% or more after running for a while (like 12 hours or more) ? I'm talking about hogging the chip while TiMidity is idling, not playing. I'd guess that it is actually playing -- busy running through all

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Frank Barknecht
Hallo, Marek Peteraj hat gesagt: // Marek Peteraj wrote: > In case anybody here is using evolution to post on lad. > > Since 1.2 it was the most stable and perfect application i've ever seen. Evolution seems to have one big problem: It seems to make it hard to edit and shorten replies, or what's

[linux-audio-dev] TiMidity as a CPU hog

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Phillips
Greetings: Can someone explain why TiMidity eventually hogs the CPU at 95% or more after running for a while (like 12 hours or more) ? I'm talking about hogging the chip while TiMidity is idling, not playing. I'm using it as a softsynth, it works well, but even in the latest version its CPU u

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Mike Rawes
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 20:02:48 +0200 Thorsten Wilms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 10:19:10AM -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > > > Oh, and about linear needing 2 directions, up/down for gain > > > and right left for pan (Uwe): Sure. And the widget has > > > to be clear about that i

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Winkler
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 11:28:01AM -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 08:02:48PM +0200, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > > No, I did not mean 2 axes for one widget. Only that a linear widget has > > to indicate it's direction even before interaction happens, and that it > > makes sense to

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 02:26:44PM -0400, Paul Davis wrote: > >I'm happy to have the freedom to know what my OS is *really* doing. I'd > >buy Cubase for Linux. > > you don't care as much about the freedom to know what your DAW is > *really* doing? if you're a musician or an audio engineer, you wi

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 08:02:48PM +0200, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > > When you move the mouse slowly, you get very fine control. When you move > > it faster, the control gets coarser. So you can move a knob from 0.0 to > > 1.0 quickly with a fast mouse gesture, or you can move it from 0.5 to 0.6 >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Davis
>On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:40:33PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: >> Not that I wasn't being truthful though - I really don't want >> proprietary software anywhere around here (freedom's pretty much all we >> have), but that's just one man's opinion, take it or leave it. > >I'm happy to have the fre

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Davis
>> The discussion about linear or radial mouse movement for >> knobs finaly got me to mockup an idea i had in my mind >> for sometime already. >> >> For now I call it fan sliders: >> http://wrstud.urz.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/04-06-10_fan_slider_01.png [ ... ] >I think that's a really g

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Mike Rawes
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 19:03:35 +0200 Thorsten Wilms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello again! > > The discussion about linear or radial mouse movement for > knobs finaly got me to mockup an idea i had in my mind > for sometime already. > > For now I call it fan sliders: > http://wrstud.urz.uni-w

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Thorsten Wilms
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 10:19:10AM -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > > When you move the mouse slowly, you get very fine control. When you move > it faster, the control gets coarser. So you can move a knob from 0.0 to > 1.0 quickly with a fast mouse gesture, or you can move it from 0.5 to 0.6 > very s

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:50:19PM +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > why dont we specify behaviour and a gfx format for control animations > and then implement the widgets for gtk and qt ? Brilliant, but get every aspect of the behavior down. For example, something that no one has discussed yet:

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 13:03, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > Hello again! > > The discussion about linear or radial mouse movement for > knobs finaly got me to mockup an idea i had in my mind > for sometime already. > > For now I call it fan sliders: > http://wrstud.urz.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/0

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Kjetil Svalastog Matheussen
Tim Hockin: > > I know Linux people love to claim how choice is our strength, but I think > it's bunk. Linux needs a single GUI environment that has a lot of deep > flexibility Yes! I completely agree with this. > (and I don't mean Scheme config files :) Oh... :) --

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Orford
> And no, linux audio is definitely not perfectly unusable for me. > Quite the contrary; pd, supercollider, snd, ladspa, alsa, jack and the > very low-latish kernel make it to be a very usable platform for creative > work you can't do in other OS's. i would seriously be interested to know what th

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:40:33PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > Not that I wasn't being truthful though - I really don't want > proprietary software anywhere around here (freedom's pretty much all we > have), but that's just one man's opinion, take it or leave it. I'm happy to have the freedom t

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Hockin
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 02:09:08PM +0200, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > Tim Hockin: please elaborate about velocity sensitve knobs like > used by OhmForce. When you move the mouse slowly, you get very fine control. When you move it faster, the control gets coarser. So you can move a knob from 0.0 to

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Kjetil Svalastog Matheussen
Marek Peteraj: > > > > Personally speaking, as a free software developer I don't care if my > > programs are deemed as sucessful, they work for me, and handful of other > > people - this makes me happy :) > I'd like to see what other developers of the most popular linux audio > projects think. Bec

[linux-audio-dev] Sliders

2004-06-10 Thread Thorsten Wilms
Hello again! The discussion about linear or radial mouse movement for knobs finaly got me to mockup an idea i had in my mind for sometime already. For now I call it fan sliders: http://wrstud.urz.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/04-06-10_fan_slider_01.png It's all about concept, not style. The

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Tim Orford
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:22:55PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > > That was exactly Dave's point. Marek wants some kind of "we" thing going on. > > He wants us all to march off in solidarity in the direction he chooses and it > > just doesn't work that way. You want to make money, I don't c

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 10:54, Michael Ost wrote: > On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 06:39, Dave Robillard wrote: > > That nice you think I should want proprietary software to get developed > > for linux. Well, I don't. IMHO that amounts to throwing away the > > single advantage "we" have, which sounds pretty

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Pete Bessman
At Thu, 10 Jun 2004 12:50:19 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > i dont see a problem. there is knob code for every toolkit on > sourceforge. lets unify the gfx data have a widget for every toolkit. votes++ [pb]

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 10:22, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 04:25:15PM -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 11:56:59PM +0200, Arnold Krille wrote: > > > Still the question is: What toolkit to use for a > > > standard-LAD-Gui-elements-set? Or just define the grap

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 10:01, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:49:57AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > > > Its out of process. Sounds like torben wants to swallow the plugin UI, > > thats kinda neat, didn't think anyone would bother, but we should take > > that into account. >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 07:28, Paul Davis wrote: > >> There is chasm both broad and deep between > >> > >> "plugin, show your GUI now" > >> > >> and an actual implementation of such functionality. > > > >Yeah osc.udp://localhost:2134/ui/show ;) I'm very much in favour of > >simple, UNDERcomp

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 07:09, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On 09 Jun 2004 21:10 , Michael Ost <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> sent: > > >On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 15:56, Dave Robillard wrote: > >> I don't think I could possibly care less who uses 'linux audio'. I > >> don't really think anyone else here should eith

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 06:07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 11:35:38PM +0200, Marek Peteraj wrote: > > On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 11:04, Pelle Nilsson wrote: > > > Marek Peteraj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > > > > > ... > > > > Second thing is that the way you percieve them shou

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 06:22, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:27:03AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 08:41:10 -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > > > Heck, I write programs I don't even release because I'm too lazy (ie > > > this: http://chat.carleton.ca/~dro

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 05:33, Alfons Adriaensen wrote: > On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 10:57:09AM +0200, Uwe Koloska wrote: > > > But there comes another handling problem: > > some people have opted for linear movement (I too think radial > > movement is intuitive but mostly unusable -- normal mouse mov

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Michael Ost
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 06:39, Dave Robillard wrote: > On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 00:10, Michael Ost wrote: > > On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 15:56, Dave Robillard wrote: > > > I don't think I could possibly care less who uses 'linux audio'. I > > > don't really think anyone else here should either - we should b

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Re: UI stuff

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 03:19:44PM +0100, Mike Rawes wrote: > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 07:02:30PM +0100, Mike Rawes wrote: > > > On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 14:20:41 +0200 > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > galan has: > > > > left click -> up down movement > > > > right

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread Florian Schmidt
On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 20:22:24 +0100 Chris Cannam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Tuesday 08 Jun 2004 7:46 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Right click on any slider in JAMin and it immediately goes to > > the default position, whether center or zero. > > Ah, now I looked for that feature but di

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Griffiths
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 09:39:42 -0400, Dave Robillard wrote > On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 00:10, Michael Ost wrote: > > > > Should I drop off the list? I ain't the same 'we' you are, I guess. > > > > While it's true that the proprietary world has made lots of bad s/w, we > > in the biz have also made lot

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 04:25:15PM -0700, Tim Hockin wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 11:56:59PM +0200, Arnold Krille wrote: > > Still the question is: What toolkit to use for a > > standard-LAD-Gui-elements-set? Or just define the graphics and the handling > > and then let everyone implement it

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Ben
At Harrison we decided to avoid knobs altogether. Instead we use short, fat faders (OK there are a few knob things just to look different) That worked out pretty well. My preferences are: left-click for linear (up & down) adjustment right-click for fine adjust middle-click to return to defaul

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Re: UI stuff

2004-06-10 Thread Mike Rawes
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 07:02:30PM +0100, Mike Rawes wrote: > > On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 14:20:41 +0200 > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > galan has: > > > left click -> up down movement > > > right click -> knob points to mouse > > > > > > middle click is still undefine

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:49:57AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > Its out of process. Sounds like torben wants to swallow the plugin UI, > thats kinda neat, didn't think anyone would bother, but we should take > that into account. why do you think no one would bother ? there is XEMBED and if if t

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Ultramaster Juno6, anyone?

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 02:00, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > That's cool and all, but what about the RS-101? > > What happened to Ultramaster? They had some cool looking stuff that I > never got a chance to use. > > On Fri, May 28, 2004 at 10:59:29AM +0200, Frank NEUMANN wrote: > > > > Hi all, > >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 02:27, Steve Harris wrote: > > If John Q. Hacker cared about PR, he wouldn't be that much of a hacker > > would he? :) > > Heh. Lazyness, Imapatience and Hubris. Guilty as charged. More like "riled up by Marek and spouting his mouth off" though. :) > > Heck, I write progr

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Dave Robillard
On Thu, 2004-06-10 at 00:10, Michael Ost wrote: > On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 15:56, Dave Robillard wrote: > > I don't think I could possibly care less who uses 'linux audio'. I > > don't really think anyone else here should either - we should be aiming > > to build the best system possible, period. No

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread RTaylor
{Sgi... digital performer} Maybe } you could use both color and space. I guess that's OpenGL Performer now. -- If I had saxophones / Big baritone, cleanin' up the muddy breaks If I had Saxophones / I could get some recognition from that Mobile Alabama DJ{J.Buffet}

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread RTaylor
On Wednesday 09 June 2004 16:12, Jan Depner wrote: } } I think you're only considering red/green colorblindness. I've been } doing GUIs for 26 years and boy do I get bitches about color. It's } their favorite whine. I've been doing color since '77.. If you ever need assistance... -- If I

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread RTaylor
On Wednesday 09 June 2004 21:54, Dave Robillard wrote: } On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 22:25, Dan Harper wrote: } > Also, it's just not natural for me to move my mouse in a circle, the } > natural movement of my hand is not a circle, try to draw a perfect } > circle in the Gimp sometime by mouse! This mea

[linux-audio-dev] Knobs, the reply

2004-06-10 Thread Thorsten Wilms
Oh well, just read through the more than 30 mails ... Thanks to Arnold, Marek, Tim Hockin, Benno, Uwe, Tim Orford for the nice words. Thanks to everyone for the interest. About a standard toolkit: The general desktop toolkits do not adress some special needs of audio apps, that's clear. While

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Martin Habets
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 07:18:57PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 17:56, Arnold Krille wrote: > > Still the question is: What toolkit to use for a > > standard-LAD-Gui-elements-set? Or just define the graphics and the handling > > and then let everyone implement it in his/he

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Paul Davis
>> There is chasm both broad and deep between >> >> "plugin, show your GUI now" >> >> and an actual implementation of such functionality. > >Yeah osc.udp://localhost:2134/ui/show ;) I'm very much in favour of >simple, UNDERcomplicated solutions. If you make its easy to do almost >everythin

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread eviltwin69
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 02:06 , Lee Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> sent: >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >>Aarggg - knobs. One of my pet peeves. Knobs make absolutely no >>sense in a GUI. There is no easy (or standard) way to control them. Note that >>there are no knobs in JAMin. The pa

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread eviltwin69
On 09 Jun 2004 21:10 , Michael Ost <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> sent: >On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 15:56, Dave Robillard wrote: >> I don't think I could possibly care less who uses 'linux audio'. I >> don't really think anyone else here should either - we should be aiming >> to build the best system possible,

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 08:41:47PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 20:22, Paul Davis wrote: > > >On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 07:18:57PM -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > > I see what you're saying, and don't get me wrong - I didn't mean to > imply it's an easy thing to do. But it is

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Re: UI stuff

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 07:02:30PM +0100, Mike Rawes wrote: > On Wed, 9 Jun 2004 14:20:41 +0200 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 11:21:25AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > > > On Tue, Jun 08, 2004 at 05:06:16 -0500, Jan Depner wrote: > > > > This is exactly the point I

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Ladspa Gui's (Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a?)

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 01:56:13PM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 02:06:05PM +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > Maybe. I have no particular objections, but the UI should be free to > > > ignore it I think. The old-school X11 -geometry seems like a good starting > > > place.

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 07:27:03AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 08:41:10 -0400, Dave Robillard wrote: > > Heck, I write programs I don't even release because I'm too lazy (ie > > this: http://chat.carleton.ca/~drobilla/patchbay.png).. PR isn't even on > > the radar screen. >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 11:35:38PM +0200, Marek Peteraj wrote: > On Wed, 2004-06-09 at 11:04, Pelle Nilsson wrote: > > Marek Peteraj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > > > > ... > > > Second thing is that the way you percieve them shouldn't change as you > > > switch applications. Which is what VST p

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Ultramaster Juno6, anyone?

2004-06-10 Thread will
That's cool and all, but what about the RS-101? What happened to Ultramaster? They had some cool looking stuff that I never got a chance to use. On Fri, May 28, 2004 at 10:59:29AM +0200, Frank NEUMANN wrote: > > Hi all, > > some might remember that two years ago (or so) there was a nice (thoug

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread torbenh
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 10:16:00AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 09:44:49 +0200, Robert Jonsson wrote: > > > > > > if i try out a new VST plug i open its GUI. with the GUI i get a nice > > > and compact look of all its controls. > > > If i want to use the plugin i resort to r

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Alfons Adriaensen
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 10:57:09AM +0200, Uwe Koloska wrote: > But there comes another handling problem: > some people have opted for linear movement (I too think radial > movement is intuitive but mostly unusable -- normal mouse movement > is linear) but then I think we need both directions: >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] [OT] marketing hype [was: Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?}

2004-06-10 Thread Alfons Adriaensen
On Wed, Jun 09, 2004 at 10:11:33PM +0200, Marek Peteraj wrote: > Just as if i said: "There something magical about the sound of pipe > organs. No wonder they're called the kings of all musical instruments. > We have tried to model one such pipe organ as close as possible so that > you can enjoy pl

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Uwe Koloska
Thorsten Wilms wrote: SVG vector graphics (prefered by Peter and me) http://wrstud.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/04-05-02_knobs_02.png 3d rendering variatios http://wrstud.uni-wuppertal.de/~ka0394/forum/04-05-02_knob_3d_1-2-3.jpg very nice! I most like the svg ones for the cleaner look. But there

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Uwe Koloska
Dave Robillard wrote: I think we've (perhaps?) finally figured out that we can't really have a "standard-LAD-GUI-elements-set". It will just turn into another LADSPA-GUI war, nothing will get decided, and nothing will get done. But as far as I understand, it's not about GUI-elemt toolkits but abo

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Project ideas?

2004-06-10 Thread michael tewner
I like this idea; Adding an OpenGL spectrogram to Meterbridge... ...By the way, are there any 31-band EQ's for JACK... That also sounds like a cool idea... -tewner On Wed, 9 Jun 2004, Steve Harris wrote: > On Tue, Jun 08, 2004 at 02:29:08 -0400, Dave Phillips wrote: > > Jussi Laako wrote: > > >

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Is ladspa actually la-dsp-a? Is JACK the ultimate solution?

2004-06-10 Thread Lee Revell
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Aarggg - knobs. One of my pet peeves. Knobs make absolutely no sense in a GUI. There is no easy (or standard) way to control them. Note that there are no knobs in JAMin. The parametric controls aren't even knobs. I think this was the point he was making

Re: [linux-audio-dev] Knobs / widget design

2004-06-10 Thread Claudio Mettler
On Thu, Jun 10, 2004 at 12:33:19AM +0100, Steve Harris wrote: > It seems like there are as many preferences as users. How about > ~/.knobrc ;) Or how about libknob? I know, this sounds silly, but if we extend that Idea, we have libladstandards. Things like dB-level<->color mappings, logarithmic/ex