Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Bas A.Schulte wrote: Hi, I've been meaning to write an article about how I used Apache/mod_perl to implement a mobile SMS application platform as it demonstrates use of Apache/mod_perl outside the Web realm, something I hadn't seen so far. Time constraints (as always) have prevented me from doing this properly, however, I'll try to give a short description of the system. The goal kinda is to see if others are using Apache/mod_perl in a similar way to share experiences, discuss issues that arise or discuss alternatives (I'd love someone to tell me I'm an idiot for handling all this lowlevel stuff myself and move to J2EE/java at once, if he can convince me I could have implemented this with the same budget and time frame). Very nice, Bas. Thanks for sharing with us. For J2EE in Perl see http://p5ee.perl.org/. Very early alpha though. For protocol server httpd-2.0/modperl-2.0 is exactly what you want, since it supports protocol servers and other useful things you will most likely benefit from (e.g. filtering), but don't hold your breath yet, since httpd-2.0 is not out yet. Though if you plan doing a next generation some time in the future, you probably better off start looking at modperl-2.0. We already have Eliza protocol example running as one of the tests: t/TEST -v protocol/eliza protocol/eliza1..6 ok 1 # send: Hello Eliza # recv: Hi. What seems to be your problem? ok 2 # send: How are you # recv: You're not really talking about me -- are you? ok 3 # send: Why do I have core dumped? # recv: That's quite interesting. ok 4 # send: I feel like writing some tests today, you? # recv: That is interesting. Please continue. ok 5 # send: good bye # recv: That is interesting. Please continue. ok 6 ok All tests successful. This is the client: http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/~checkout~/modperl-2.0/t/protocol/eliza.t This is the server: http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs.cgi/~checkout~/modperl-2.0/t/protocol/TestProtocol/eliza.pm Also, can we adapt your story for our success stories collection? http://perl.apache.org/stories/ If so, can you please send me an adapted version, or I can simply throw it in as is :) _ Stas Bekman JAm_pH -- Just Another mod_perl Hacker http://stason.org/ mod_perl Guide http://perl.apache.org/guide mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://ticketmaster.com http://apacheweek.com http://singlesheaven.com http://perl.apache.org http://perlmonth.com/
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Bas A.Schulte wrote: Hi, I've been meaning to write an article about how I used Apache/mod_perl to implement a mobile SMS application platform as it demonstrates use of Apache/mod_perl outside the Web realm, something I hadn't seen so far. Time constraints (as always) have prevented me from doing this properly, however, I'll try to give a short description of the system. The goal kinda is to see if others are using Apache/mod_perl in a similar way to share experiences, discuss issues that arise or discuss alternatives (I'd love someone to tell me I'm an idiot for handling all this lowlevel stuff myself and move to J2EE/java at once, if he can convince me I could have implemented this with the same budget and time frame). [snip] I actually implemented a similar system, although it's not SMS specific. Basically, I have a central system in Apache/mod_perl. The eventual design is for full I/O in many protocols, including HTTP, SMTP, FTP and a handful of other protocols. So far the output is pretty much ready, and I think I'm going to wait for Apache 2 before I do the inputs. I _could_ write mod_perl handlers to understand other protocols, but Apache 2 is being designed around this, as far as I understand, so I'm going to do that around Apache 2 (as soon as I get off my ass and learn the new API :-)) Issac
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Issac, On Thursday, March 21, 2002, at 11:01 AM, Issac Goldstand wrote: Bas A.Schulte wrote: Hi, I've been meaning to write an article about how I used Apache/mod_perl to implement a mobile SMS application platform as it demonstrates use of Apache/mod_perl outside the Web realm, something I hadn't seen so far. Time constraints (as always) have prevented me from doing this properly, however, I'll try to give a short description of the system. The goal kinda is to see if others are using Apache/mod_perl in a similar way to share experiences, discuss issues that arise or discuss alternatives (I'd love someone to tell me I'm an idiot for handling all this lowlevel stuff myself and move to J2EE/java at once, if he can convince me I could have implemented this with the same budget and time frame). [snip] I actually implemented a similar system, although it's not SMS specific. Basically, I have a central system in Apache/mod_perl. The eventual design is for full I/O in many protocols, including HTTP, SMTP, FTP and a handful of other protocols. Well, this proves again that everything we software developers do has been done umteen times before ;) The system I described actually isn't tied to SMS as well; it has been designed with other devices in mind as well. The virtual SMSC component as I described it really should have a better name as it really is a protocal handler and serializing/deserializing component that is capable of handling other protocol and formats. In fact, I am considering enhancing it to be able to use it in a WAP or i-Mode context (if we can only find a way to get paid by the mobile subscriber using WAP which is easy with SMS). So far the output is pretty much ready, and I think I'm going to wait for Apache 2 before I do the inputs. I _could_ write mod_perl handlers to understand other protocols, but Apache 2 is being designed around this, as far as I understand, so I'm going to do that around Apache 2 (as soon as I get off my ass and learn the new API :-)) Yep; Apache 2 combined with mod_perl sure sounds interesting, now if it only had the stability that 1.x has ;) Regards, Bas.
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
On Thu, 21 Mar 2002 00:40:24 +0100, Bas A.Schulte [EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
BAS To handle a large number of concurrent transactions in a
BAS transaction-safe environment without me having to worry too much about
BAS concurrency issues and referential integrity I will slowly move to
BAS Oracle. $dbh-do('LOCK TABLE USER, INSTANCE, APP_DATA') just plain
BAS sucks unless you want to create a very large distributed *single-user*
BAS system running on multiple machines.
Without changing SQL backend you can have transactions with
MySQL. Just use InnoDB table type. It is faster than default table
type for read/write intensive applications because it doesn't lock
whole tables but provides Oracle style row-level locking.
--
oIlya Martynov = http://martynov.org/o
oTIV.net = http://tiv.net/ o
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Hi,
On Thursday, March 21, 2002, at 11:39 AM, Ilya Martynov wrote:
On Thu, 21 Mar 2002 00:40:24 +0100, Bas A.Schulte
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
BAS To handle a large number of concurrent transactions in a
BAS transaction-safe environment without me having to worry too much
about
BAS concurrency issues and referential integrity I will slowly move to
BAS Oracle. $dbh-do('LOCK TABLE USER, INSTANCE, APP_DATA') just plain
BAS sucks unless you want to create a very large distributed
*single-user*
BAS system running on multiple machines.
Without changing SQL backend you can have transactions with
MySQL. Just use InnoDB table type. It is faster than default table
type for read/write intensive applications because it doesn't lock
whole tables but provides Oracle style row-level locking.
I knew I shouldn't have mentioned MySQL and it's, possibly perceived,
shortcomings ;)
I know about InnoDB, I know about Postgresql too, it's just that I
really like Oracle for lots of reasons. I have no personal experience
with running MySQL or Postgresql in a high-volume concurrent read/write
transaction situation. It seems most MySQL success stories are about
websites with 98% read-only transactions on the database which just
isn't similar to my needs. I used MySQL myself for that type of problem
and it sure worked.
If someone really wants to do another DB discussion, let's move that to
a different discussion ;)
Bas.
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Over the last year I've been slowly working on a similar system in my spare time (of which I have none). To do systems monitoring and reporting I'm using mod_perl on the front end and communicating with remote systems via XML::RPC. The XML::RPC server on the remote system runs local command via perl wrappers. These wrappers are now returning raw command output, but my next step is to have them convert it first to XML and then return it, where it can be stored in a DB (I use DB2) and/or processed by AxKit. I decided to go this way so I could delegate the customization of the local wrappers to other admins, because our site uses so many different platforms (AIX, Sun, linux, BSD, all stripes of Windows, OS/2, AS/400, OS/390, MacOS 9, MacOS X, etc etc). So far I've only been monitoring and reporting disk usage, just to get up and running. Bill
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Have you tried Postgresql? It's a free, fast, ACID compliant database. I
have it compiled running within a few hours, not knowing much of anything
about it before hand. From what I've read the speed is comparable w/ mysql
for most applications.
Drew
At 12:40 AM 3/21/2002 +0100, Bas A.Schulte wrote:
To handle a large number of concurrent transactions in a transaction-safe
environment without me having to worry too much about concurrency issues
and referential integrity I will slowly move to Oracle. $dbh-do('LOCK
TABLE USER, INSTANCE, APP_DATA') just plain sucks unless you want to
create a very large distributed *single-user* system running on multiple
machines.
==
Drew Taylor JA[P|m_p]H
http://www.drewtaylor.com/ Just Another Perl|mod_perl Hacker
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *** God bless America! ***
--
Speakeasy.net: A DSL provider with a clue. Sign up today.
http://www.speakeasy.net/refer/29655
==
Re: Non-web use for Apache/mod_perl
Hi,
On Thursday, March 21, 2002, at 12:57 AM, Drew Taylor wrote:
Have you tried Postgresql? It's a free, fast, ACID compliant database.
I have it compiled running within a few hours, not knowing much of
anything about it before hand. From what I've read the speed is
comparable w/ mysql for most applications.
Drew
At 12:40 AM 3/21/2002 +0100, Bas A.Schulte wrote:
To handle a large number of concurrent transactions in a
transaction-safe environment without me having to worry too much about
concurrency issues and referential integrity I will slowly move to
Oracle. $dbh-do('LOCK TABLE USER, INSTANCE, APP_DATA') just plain
sucks unless you want to create a very large distributed *single-user*
system running on multiple machines.
I kinda was afraid about people getting excited about my RDBMS remarks
which really is a subject in itself ;)
I have zero personal experience with Postgresql even though I've read
good things about it so that ruled it out for a project with a very
tight time frame. And I just happen to really, really like Oracle so
unless the application generates some real money, I will probably always
go far Oracle.
Regards,
Bas.
