Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

d LACNIC. Best Regards, Carlos (sorry for the duplicates, if you also receive arin-p...@arin.net) -- Forwarded message -- Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2019 17:13:12 From: ARIN To: arin-p...@arin.net Subject: [arin-ppml] Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Poli

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

On 27/04/2019 06:44, William Herrin wrote: On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 7:48 PM Owen DeLong > wrote: > Do you honestly believe that hijackings are being committed by ARIN members or even ARIN resource holders that have signed RSAs with ARIN? Wasn't Softlayer (an ARIN resource

Regarding the ARIN Advisory Council and ARIN PDP (was: Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation)

On 26 Apr 2019, at 5:49 PM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via NANOG wrote: > ... > Not only that. I really think they have not invested enough time to read the > proposal, check with the authors and then take a decision. We have got some > email exchange, but clearly not sufficient. I also must state th

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

Hi, El 27/4/19 1:35, "Jared Mauch" escribió: > On Apr 26, 2019, at 5:49 PM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: > > "AP stated that at the LACNIC meeting has discussed it and they dismissed it as out of scope." > > LACNIC will have the first meeting where this topic

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

The policy specifically states that it’s not intended towards honest mistakes, but repeated deliberate persistent behavior. Do you know of any such case involving resource holders that have signed RSAs with ARIN or any other RIR for that matter? Owen > On Apr 26, 2019, at 20:44 , William Herr

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 7:48 PM Owen DeLong wrote: > Do you honestly believe that hijackings are being committed by ARIN members or even ARIN resource holders that have signed RSAs with ARIN? Wasn't Softlayer (an ARIN resource holder) called out on this list about 14 hours ago for hijacking a cou

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

> The proposal is “guarantor”, or at least that’s our intent. Is not ARIN > taking the decision, is the community by means of experts. We have improved > it in the v2 that will be posted in a matter of days in RIPE, but we can’t > improve it in ARIN because simply discussing it is not allowed by

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

t the internet police" --srs From: NANOG on behalf of JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via NANOG Sent: Saturday, April 27, 2019 3:58 AM To: Jon Lewis Cc: North American Network Operators' Group Subject: Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Po

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

> I personally support the petition. I think the out of scope reasoning is > flawed. By enforcing minimum assignment sizes, ARIN has long acted as a > gatekeeper to the routing system, controlling who can and can not > participate. For better or worse, that puts the proposal in scope. Speaking

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

> On Apr 26, 2019, at 5:49 PM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ > wrote: > > "AP stated that at the LACNIC meeting has discussed it and they dismissed it > as out of scope." > > LACNIC will have the first meeting where this topic will be discussed in two > weeks from now. How come an AC member can lie

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

RSA (https://www.arin.net/about/corporate/agreements/rsa.pdf) clearly state that the services are subject to the terms and conditions stated in the policy manual. There is explicit text in case of lack of payment. Not so clear what to do if there is a policy violation, but it looks like at a

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 2:36 PM Jon Lewis wrote: > Maybe I missed it in the proposal, but I don't see that it actually says > what ARIN will do other than produce a report "Yep, our expert panel says > this is hijacked.". What's the expected result (other than the report)? > i.e. What action is

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

A policy proposal typically is not perfect when submitted. However, not having the discussion, doesn't allow to improve it and maybe then, reach consensus. It may happen that the end of the discussion is, instead of a group of experts, we need something different, or may be a compensation for t

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

On Fri, 26 Apr 2019, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: The intent is to clearly state that this is a violation of the policies. The membership documents/bylaws or the RSA, your account may be closed. I looked at it when adapting the policy from RIPE to ARIN, don't have this information right in my

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

By the way, even if ARIN (or the community) decides to do *nothing* in case of a policy violation, clearly the victim will have a better situation to defend the case in courts, and not rely in the judgement of inexperienced folks that will know nothing about what is an Internet Resource, BGP, et

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

The intent is to clearly state that this is a violation of the policies. The membership documents/bylaws or the RSA, your account may be closed. I looked at it when adapting the policy from RIPE to ARIN, don't have this information right in my mind, but I'm sure it was there. Otherwise, if need

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

Not only that. I really think they have not invested enough time to read the proposal, check with the authors and then take a decision. We have got some email exchange, but clearly not sufficient. I also must state that the staff has been very helpful and diligent to clarify and support the peti

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 4:37 PM Jon Lewis wrote: > > Anecdotally, ARIN has, in the past, gotten involved in this sort of thing. > Many years ago, during an acquisition that went sour at the last minute, > the renegging seller went to ARIN complaining that we were hijacking his > IP space. ARIN c

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, 26 Apr 2019, William Herrin wrote: On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 9:41 AM Matt Harris wrote: Can you (or someone else on the list, perhaps even someone who was involved in voting this down) provide some more details as to why it was rejected? Hi Matt, As I understand it (someone wit

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

There are factual errors in the ARIN meeting minutes. It really is a disservice that people on the AC don’t have facts about ARIN and the function of their routing registry (for example). It would be good if the ARIN AC had people that were more aware of the functions ARIN provides. If you co

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

El 26/4/19 20:25, "NANOG en nombre de Matt Harris" escribió: On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 12:49 PM William Herrin wrote: I personally support the petition. I think the out of scope reasoning is flawed. By enforcing minimum assignment sizes, ARIN has long acted as a gatekeeper to the routing sys

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

Hi, (please see inline) On Fri, 26 Apr 2019, Matt Harris wrote: (...) As far as expanding roles goes... Over the past few decades, we've all watched as the internet became less and less "wild wild west" and more and more controlled (sometimes centrally, sometimes in a more or less decentr

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 12:49 PM William Herrin wrote: > I personally support the petition. I think the out of scope reasoning is > flawed. By enforcing minimum assignment sizes, ARIN has long acted as a > gatekeeper to the routing system, controlling who can and can not > participate. For better

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 9:41 AM Matt Harris wrote: > Can you (or someone else on the list, perhaps even someone who was > involved in voting this down) provide some more details as to why it was > rejected? > Hi Matt, As I understand it (someone with better knowledge feel free to correct me) th

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, 26 Apr 2019, Matt Harris wrote: On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 11:28 AM Carlos Friaças via NANOG wrote: Hi, Just to let everybody know that a petition was started in order to try to enable a policy discussion about "BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation".

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 11:41:18AM -0500, Matt Harris wrote: [snip] > Can you (or someone else on the list, perhaps even someone who was involved > in voting this down) provide some more details as to why it was rejected? > What were the arguments in favor of rejecting the proposal? This seems > l

Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 11:28 AM Carlos Friaças via NANOG wrote: > > Hi, > > Just to let everybody know that a petition was started in order to try > to enable a policy discussion about "BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy > Violation". > > If you would like to read the proposal, it is available at:

Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation (fwd)

ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation A petition has been initiated for the following: ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation This proposal was rejected due to scope at the 10 April meeting of the Advisory Council. Anyone may take part in this petitio