]] On Behalf Of Forstater, Mathew
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 5:51 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:[PEN-L:8062] RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Barkley- All very interesting. I know of Bordieu, but I admit I tried to
start
reading some of his stuff a few times and just
e presumably the justification for seniority pay scales.
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Nicole Seibert [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:03 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:8282] RE: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Mat,
I have res
i hope everyone understood, as I thought it would be obvious from my other
comments, that I was not proposing that Marx was using the term in the same way,
it was just further evidence supporting my own objection to the term "social
capital" as it is used by the "lonely bowler" school.
:8175] Re: Social Capital
Barkley Rosser says to Mat:
But, if my recommending you to be published
occurs in response to your having previously recommended
that I be published, then this may be the payoff of a social
reciprocity relation, certainly a cashing in of social capital in
the Bourdieu
n compared to mainstream science
today.
--- Ken Hanly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
- Original Message -
From: ALI KADRI [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 3:46 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8058] Re: Social Capital
Everything is social to begin with? What is that
rance when compared to mainstream science
today.
--- Ken Hanly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
- Original Message -
From: ALI KADRI [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 3:46 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8058] Re: Social Capital
Everything is social to begin
n Hanly
- Original Message -
From: ALI KADRI [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 5:48 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:8185] Re: Re: Re: Social Capital
That is ok, the "in the begenning" clause was meant
anecdotaly in reference to a sid. hook understandi
:[PEN-L:8052] Re: Re: Social Capital
jbr wrote:
But, how does one commidify "trust" or
"community"?
Corporate "goodwill" is close to this, no? It is frequently understood to be
the "good name" of a company above and beyond the book value of its co
At 03:12 PM 2/16/01 -0500, you wrote:
I thank Mat for noting Marx's use of the
term "social capital" in Volume II of Capital.
Of course, this was one of the volumes not
published in his lifetime, much less translated
into English by him, in contrast with Volume I.
Thus, presumably the term
o: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 5:48 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:8185] Re: Re: Re: Social Capital
That is ok, the "in the begenning" clause was
meant
anecdotaly in reference to a sid. hook
understanding
of the matter. of course you know this is a matter
of
defin
is the usefulness of the term here?
-Original Message-
From: J. Barkley Rosser, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 4:55 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:8116] Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Speaking of the evolution of terms, the word
capital
PROTECTED]
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2001 11:18 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:8131] RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Formalist anthropologists like Schneider often note this derivation in
arguing that cattle are 'wealth' in pastoralist communities like the
Maasai.
However, the only term in Maasai langu
At 01:30 PM 2/15/01 -0500, you wrote:
With regard to Putnam, who likes bowling leagues,
bridge clubs, choral societies, and the like, I once heard him
give a talk in which he declared that there is a better than 90%
correlation between the level of memberships in choral societies
in the 1870s in
Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2001 1:54 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8139] Re: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
At 01:30 PM 2/15/01 -0500, you wrote:
With regard to Putnam, who likes bowling leagues,
bridge clubs, choral societies, an
.c." and
maybe correlated with broader social problems if they have
conflicts with other groups, e.g. African Americans in Brooklyn.
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thursday, February 15, 2001 2:07 PM
Subject:
although i participate in pen-l, i am also on another email list of which i am
the only member. at first i didn't feel that comfortable with it, but the
conversation is generally congenial and flaming has been kept to a minimum
(although i can get snippy at times). at one time i considered
Hmmm and peccatum in Latin means sinIs there a connection :)
Cheers, Ken Hanly
- Original Message -
From: J. Barkley Rosser, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 4:55 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8116] Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Speaking
Barkley Rosser says to Mat:
But, if my recommending you to be published
occurs in response to your having previously recommended
that I be published, then this may be the payoff of a social
reciprocity relation, certainly a cashing in of social capital in
the Bourdieu sense, if not in the
This is part of the reason why I think *more* uses, and especially more sloppy
uses (e.g. "social capital"), of the word capital is not what we need. It is
already tough enough, with finance capital vs. industrial capital, and capital
goods vs. money captial. These two pairs are not the same
Jim,
So, you prefer "salience" to "social capital"?
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 10:05 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8073] Re: Re: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Socia
sense.
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Forstater, Mathew [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 6:35 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8064] RE: Re: Re: Social Capital
couldn't this all lead to some reductio absurdisms. food is necessary to
live
Let me see if I can think this through. (Maggie, it is just like Ross Thomson's
class our first semester at the New School. Tell me if I have remembered right).
Let's think about the circuits of capital. M-C-M' can be broken down to be:
-LP
M - C -MP (machines, tools,...P...C' - M'
PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 4:26 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8105] RE: Social Capital
Let me see if I can think this through. (Maggie, it is just like Ross
Thomson's
class our first semester at the New School. Tell me if I have remembered
right).
Let's
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:8110] Re: RE: Social Capital
Of course there is yet another annoying idea
floating around that indeed all factors of production
are just sub-species of capital, at least those that
are not just immediately used up in production.
The point is that their fut
Message-
From: Forstater, Mathew [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 5:31 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8111] RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
It reminds me of the evolution of the word "rent" in the 'discipline'. Now
everything is "capital
I have a problem with the term "social capital." First, in economics they are
already using the term "human capital" for labor power, with rational
individuals "investing" to seek maximum return over time, etc. Lester Thurow
actually pointed out some of the problems with this years ago, but in
I have a problem with the term "social capital." First, in economics they are
already using the term "human capital" for labor power, with rational
individuals "investing" to seek maximum return over time, etc. Lester Thurow
actually pointed out some of the problems with this years ago, but
At 10:20 AM 2/13/01 -0600, you wrote:
have a problem with the term "social capital." First, in economics they are
already using the term "human capital" for labor power, with rational
individuals "investing" to seek maximum return over time, etc. Lester Thurow
actually pointed out some of the
Jim Devine mentioned the wierdness of human capital. Here is a short section from
Class Warfare in the Information Age.
In order to come to grips with this expanded vision of the labor force,
economists devised a new concept. Specifically, they invented a new resource,
which they called,
Social capital is going through all kinds
of changes and wiggles. I don't think it is inherently
socialist, although it certainly emphasizes the
collective in the sense of "community" over the
individual.
When I picked up a copy of the volume put out
by the World Bank on Social
m. Durlauf notes that it
may be impossible to separate the two. Is nationalism a
form of bridging or bonding social capital?
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Forstater, Mathew [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 11:21 AM
S
Actually, one of the conceptual problems with
social capital as compared with human capital
is that there is no commodification of it. One can
borrow money to go to college, thus "investing"
(in both time and money) in one's human capital
(potential). And in slavery, there is outright
isn't this what Clinton called "triangulation," using the other major
party's rhetoric and programs to justify one's own programs? And should the
Dem/GOP overlap be surprising, given how similar the two parties are?
At 01:43 PM 2/13/01 -0500, you wrote:
Anyway, apparently the
Jim Devine wrote:
isn't this what Clinton called "triangulation," using the other
major party's rhetoric and programs to justify one's own programs?
And should the Dem/GOP overlap be surprising, given how similar the
two parties are?
At 01:43 PM 2/13/01 -0500, you wrote:
Anyway,
At 03:05 PM 2/13/01 -0500, Doug wrote:
Jim Devine wrote:
isn't this what Clinton called "triangulation," using the other major
party's rhetoric and programs to justify one's own programs? And should
the Dem/GOP overlap be surprising, given how similar the two parties are?
At 01:43 PM 2/13/01
Mat wrote:
On Jim's comment about Marxian terminology, money capital is required to
purchase labor-power. So that portion of capital is variable capital, but
labor
power itself is not capital. Yes?
for Marx, the meaning of words depends on context (as Ollman makes very
clear in his
:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 2:25 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:8042] Re: Social Capital
Mat wrote:
On Jim's comment about Marxian terminology, money capital is required to
purchase labor-power. So that portion of capital is variable capital, but
labor
power itself
capital goods are commodities but not all commodities are capital.
also, all capital goods are reproducible means of production, but not all
reproducible means of production are capital goods. a reproducible means of
production only becomes capital when it is used to produce commodities, that
Charles,
Point well taken. But, is belonging to the Elks
club a commodity? Of course it is true that one must
pay dues to belong to many such social organizations...
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Charles Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
t: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 2:25 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:8042] Re: Social Capital
Mat wrote:
On Jim's comment about Marxian terminology, money capital is required to
purchase labor-power. So that portion of capital is variable capital, but
labor
power itself is not capital. Yes?
certainly look like social
capital in the Bourdieu reciprocity sense.
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: ALI KADRI [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 4:47 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8058] Re: Social Capital
Isn't everything social to begin wi
in an organization per se.
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 4:13 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8052] Re: Re: Social Capital
jbr wrote:
But, how does one commidify "trust" or
Isn't everything social to begin with, so may be
social represents the category of totality. hence, in
the beginning there was social being and social
consciousness where the former reflects man's material
relation with nature etc.. and the latter how one
expresses those relations. My immediate
Once you leave the realm of Adam Smith's beaver and deer, everything gets
fuzzy. I mentioned goodwill as another example. While a piece of
software used as capital may resemble a machine more than Mickey Mouse, on
the accountant's books such distinctions can disappear.
On Tue, Feb 13, 2001 at
Michael Perelman wrote:
With the increasing importance of intellectual property, economics is
rapidly rethinking what is and what is not capital. The inclusion of
software as a capital expense is indicative of the reconceptualization of
capital.
Don't you agree that there's something
With the increasing importance of intellectual property, economics is
rapidly rethinking what is and what is not capital. The inclusion of
software as a capital expense is indicative of the reconceptualization of
capital. Chris already mentioned goodwill has another form of intangible
capital.
001 3:08 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8040] RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
I should make clear, if my earlier post did not, that my problem is with
the
word "capital." Capital is very important to the study of capitalism (duh)
and
we can't just go throwing it around all over. It also is repuls
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 02/13/01 04:02PM
capital goods are commodities but not all commodities are capital.
((
CB: However, aren't all commodities that the capitalist owns in the capital
relationship , capital , ?
((
also, all capital goods are reproducible means of production,
jbr wrote:
But, how does one commidify "trust" or
"community"?
Corporate "goodwill" is close to this, no? It is frequently understood to be the "good
name" of a company above and beyond the book value of its combined assets. It is
frequently recorded on balance sheets (and even depreciated),
Mat wrote:
labor power is a commodity. that is different than labor power being
capital. a commodity is anything bought and sold in a market. the money
used to purchase labor power is part of the total capital. but labor power
is not capital. right?
labor-power _becomes_ part of capital
some 'new'
institutionalist stuff)?
Let's start there.
Mat
-Original Message-
From: J. Barkley Rosser, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 3:08 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:8053] Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Mat,
Actually among the very f
]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 5:52 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8062] RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Barkley- All very interesting. I know of Bordieu, but I admit I tried to
start
reading some of his stuff a few times and just couldn't get into it. Either
I
--
From: J. Barkley Rosser, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 4:04 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [PEN-L:8060] Re: Re: Social Capital
Well, of course in a very crude sense, what
yuppies call "networking" may well be simply a
matter of accumulating social
Republicans away from believing that
individuals are "lone atoms" apart from community, Olasky said. "He is a
civil society guy."
Michael Pugliese
-Original Message-
From: J. Barkley Rosser, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday,
. Barkley Rosser, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 6:25 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8063] Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Social Capital
Mat,
On the grounds of the questions you ask, I
think you would not be unhappy with (most) of
the social capital
Well, of course in a very crude sense, what
yuppies call "networking" may well be simply a
matter of accumulating social capital. Certainly
to the extent that such networking leads not only
to "contacts," but to mutual backscratching and
quid pro quos. The latter certainly look
Has anybody noticed that "faith-based initiatives"
have the initials FBI?
Barkley Rosser
-Original Message-
From: Michael Pugliese [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 8:13 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8068] Re: Re: Social Capi
At 08:45 PM 02/13/2001 -0500, you wrote:
Mat,
Actually we may be about to see a bunch
of economists trying to pigeonhole this idea
into more standard contexts. Expect game
theory (evolution of cooperation). Expect
minimizing transactions costs in new institutional
contexts. I have no
Michael Perelman wrote:
Once you leave the realm of Adam Smith's beaver and deer, everything gets
fuzzy. I mentioned goodwill as another example. While a piece of
software used as capital may resemble a machine more than Mickey Mouse, on
the accountant's books such distinctions can
- Original Message -
From: ALI KADRI [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 3:46 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8058] Re: Social Capital
Everything is social to begin with? What is that supposed to mean.?
In the beginning God made the social and saw
- Original Message -
From: ALI KADRI [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 3:46 PM
Subject: [PEN-L:8058] Re: Social Capital
Everything is social to begin with? What is that supposed to mean.?
In the beginning God made the social and saw
At 02:07 PM 2/13/01 -0600, you wrote:
I should make clear, if my earlier post did not, that my problem is with the
word "capital." Capital is very important to the study of capitalism (duh) and
we can't just go throwing it around all over.
Assassinating Bourdieu would be the quickest end. I
62 matches
Mail list logo
