Greets,
I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
Python.
If my work environment really hasn't taken advantage of a scripting language
On Nov 8, 2010, at 9:23 AM, Victor Villa wrote:
> PERL or Python?
How long will your scripts live. Are these things that will be write once run
once, or are these going to live for years.
If it is years python has a more structured syntax and is more providable for
clean code.
Perl is beautif
Let the holy war commence :p
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 09:23, Victor Villa wrote:
> Greets,
>
> I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
>
> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some
Why not use PHP, the language you're already fluent in?
On Nov 08, 2010, at 08:23 AM, Victor Villa wrote:
Greets,
I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk
On 11/08/2010 09:23 AM, Victor Villa wrote:
> I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
>
> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
> Python.
>
> If my work environment real
On 11/08/2010 09:40 AM, Wade Preston Shearer wrote:
> Why not use PHP, the language you're already fluent in?
I've been down that road, and while this certainly is tempting, I would
recommend he avoid this path.
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While I don't do a lot of CLI scripting, I've written a few in PHP and it
worked just fine. Would you share some details of your experience and why you
would recommend against it?
On Nov 08, 2010, at 08:45 AM, Michael Torrie wrote:
On 11/08/2010 09:40 AM, Wade Preston Shearer wrote:
> Why not
>
> Why not use PHP, the language you're already fluent in?
>
>
I thought about that, but then though, "When in Rome, do as the Romans do."
If PHP is a common scripting language for the sys admin world (and
truthfully speaking, I don't know), then i'd be lucky as I'm already there.
But if it isn't
On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 09:45 -0700, Michael Torrie wrote:
> On 11/08/2010 09:40 AM, Wade Preston Shearer wrote:
> > Why not use PHP, the language you're already fluent in?
>
> I've been down that road, and while this certainly is tempting, I would
> recommend he avoid this path.
While I personally
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 09:23, Victor Villa wrote:
> Greets,
>
> I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
>
> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
> Python.
>
> If my work
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 09:31:48 -0700
Jeff Jibson wrote:
> Let the holy war commence :p
On programming languages or on top posting?
Or both?
Heretic! Heretic!
--
Charles Curley /"\ASCII Ribbon Campaign
Looking for fine software \ /Respect for open standards
and/or
On 11/08/2010 09:23 AM, Victor Villa wrote:
> Greets,
>
> I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
>
> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
> Python.
I love Bash, espec
Quoting Michael Torrie :
> On 11/08/2010 09:23 AM, Victor Villa wrote:
>> I recently shifted career focus from web dev to sys admin.
>>
>> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
>> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
>> Python.
php was originally written in perl and then recompiled in c in
subsequent versions so you will probably find the most familiarity with
perl . That being said the real issue here is your skill as a programmer
vs how readable you want to force your self to be. If you feel that
others can read you
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 09:23:24 -0700
Victor Villa wrote:
> If my work environment really hasn't taken advantage of a scripting
> language (nothing predefined), which should I choose? PERL or Python?
Pick the one most suitable for the job at hand. This may be a matter of
which has the most suitable
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 09:55:24 -0700
Victor Villa wrote:
> I thought about that, but then though, "When in Rome, do as the
> Romans do." If PHP is a common scripting language for the sys admin
> world (and truthfully speaking, I don't know), then i'd be lucky as
> I'm already there. But if it isn't,
Alex Esplin wrote:
> While it's true that you can write clean, easy-to-understand and
> maintain code in Perl, it takes more effort to do so than in Python.
> While it's also true that you can script anything in Python that you
> can in Perl, sometimes Perl's backtick (``) operator and built-in
> r
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 10:21 AM, Kenneth Burgener
wrote:
> Alex Esplin wrote:
>> While it's true that you can write clean, easy-to-understand and
>> maintain code in Perl, it takes more effort to do so than in Python.
>> While it's also true that you can script anything in Python that you
>> can i
>
> I once had to script something that would run based on the sunrise and
> sunset times of where the machine was located. Since we live on a
> spherical planet that is tilted 23 1/2 degrees, sunrise and sunset
> times don't stay the same. Of course since I knew math and astronomy,
> I was given
> On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 10:21 AM, Kenneth Burgener
> wrote:
> > I like to think of the transition like this: (depending on the size
> > of script I need)
> > Bash - Perl - Python
>
> What happened to the Ruby love on the list?
I still love ruby plenty! :) However, I would never recommend it
On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 11:32 -0700, Von Fugal wrote:
> As for the rails dilemma, I fully agree. Rails is awesome, don't get me
> wrong, but the fanboi hordes that have loitered the community are
> much like those pertaining to the Tea Party. Both are extremely
> unfortunate and are to be avoided.
Y
On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 09:23 -0700, Victor Villa wrote:
> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
> Python.
In my opinion, all experienced systems administrators should know four
languages. Ba
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 11:56 AM, Stuart Jansen wrote:
> Perl should never be a first language.
I thought it was established that the original poster at least knows
PHP already, so he has already been "mentally mutilated beyond hope of
regeneration," as Dijkstra put it. Perl should definitely be
On 11/08/2010 10:21 AM, Kenneth Burgener wrote:
> stringing several external commands is more
> complicated (very simple in bash an Perl), but Python does have good
> readability and vast libraries, and is becoming the popular choice.
I used to think this as well. Then I realized I was using Py
Quoting Stuart Jansen :
> On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 11:32 -0700, Von Fugal wrote:
>> As for the rails dilemma, I fully agree. Rails is awesome, don't get me
>> wrong, but the fanboi hordes that have loitered the community are
>> much like those pertaining to the Tea Party. Both are extremely
>> unfort
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 1:19 PM, Michael Torrie wrote:
> On 11/08/2010 10:21 AM, Kenneth Burgener wrote:
> > stringing several external commands is more
> > complicated (very simple in bash an Perl), but Python does have good
> > readability and vast libraries, and is becoming the popular choice.
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Michael Torrie wrote:
> On 11/08/2010 10:21 AM, Kenneth Burgener wrote:
>> stringing several external commands is more
>> complicated (very simple in bash an Perl), but Python does have good
>> readability and vast libraries, and is becoming the popular choice.
>
>
Kenneth Burgener wrote:
> Alex Esplin wrote:
>> While it's true that you can write clean, easy-to-understand and
>> maintain code in Perl, it takes more effort to do so than in Python.
>> While it's also true that you can script anything in Python that you
>> can in Perl, sometimes Perl's backtick
On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 12:29 -0700, Eric Wald wrote:
> Speaking of which, does anyone here really expect to use Perl 6?
Yes! I can't wait to be able to use Perl 6. A cleaner version of Perl,
with regex so powerful they had to rename it. The Ruby community is
famous for loving DSLs, but with Perl 6
On Mon, 08 Nov 2010 12:22:03 -0700
Jacob Albretsen wrote:
> > Yay! Now we get to debate politics!
> >
> > Let's see...
> >
> > Ruby is to the Tea Party as Bash is to...
>
> GET OFF MY PHONE!
Typical American. Shouting != debating.
--
Charles Curley /"\ASCII Ribbon Camp
Von Fugal wrote:
>
>> Ruby is sort of Perl-like in cleverness, but with object-orientedness
>> baked into everything as with Python. It also borrows liberally from
>> Scheme and Smalltalk, which are a couple of my favorite programming
>> languages. Unfortunately, someone went and wrote Rails wit
Stuart Jansen wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 12:29 -0700, Eric Wald wrote:
>> Speaking of which, does anyone here really expect to use Perl 6?
>
> Yes! I can't wait to be able to use Perl 6. A cleaner version of Perl,
> with regex so powerful they had to rename it. The Ruby community is
> famous fo
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 12:29:16 -0700
Levi Pearson wrote:
> This reminds me of a clever scripting language I ran across a while
> ago. It's scsh, the Scheme Shell.
Which reminds me of a project I started on many years ago, on the Atari
ST. The Forth Shell. A shell written in Forth. Or Forth with sh
On 11/8/10 2:29 PM, Eric Wald wrote:
> I second this. If Bash is sufficient, then let it do the job. It's
> particularly well-suited to string commands together, farming the real
> work to find, xargs, grep, cut, sort, and sed. I occasionally use make
Bash is my *FAVORITE* chainsaw. That being
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 12:17:13 -0700
Levi Pearson wrote:
> so he has already been "mentally mutilated beyond hope of
> regeneration," as Dijkstra put it.
I believe Dijkstra was talking about BASIC when he said
that. I don't think anyone has so far recommended that abomination to
Mr. Villa.
--
C
On 11/08/2010 09:53 AM, Wade Preston Shearer wrote:
> While I don't do a lot of CLI scripting, I've written a few in PHP
> and it worked just fine. Would you share some details of your
> experience and why you would recommend against it?
I have several things against PHP for system programming
- P
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 12:44 PM, Charles Curley
wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 12:29:16 -0700
> Levi Pearson wrote:
>
>> This reminds me of a clever scripting language I ran across a while
>> ago. It's scsh, the Scheme Shell.
>
> Which reminds me of a project I started on many years ago, on the Ata
On 11/08/2010 12:50 PM, Charles Curley wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 12:17:13 -0700
> Levi Pearson wrote:
>
>> so he has already been "mentally mutilated beyond hope of
>> regeneration," as Dijkstra put it.
>
> I believe Dijkstra was talking about BASIC when he said
> that. I don't think anyone h
> > As for the rails dilemma, I fully agree. Rails is awesome, don't get me
> > wrong, but the fanboi hordes that have loitered the community are
> > much like those pertaining to the Tea Party. Both are extremely
> > unfortunate and are to be avoided.
>
> Interesting. You imply that there is a
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 12:50 PM, Charles Curley
wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 12:17:13 -0700
> Levi Pearson wrote:
>
>> so he has already been "mentally mutilated beyond hope of
>> regeneration," as Dijkstra put it.
>
> I believe Dijkstra was talking about BASIC when he said
> that. I don't think
On 11/08/2010 11:32 AM, Von Fugal wrote:
> I still love ruby plenty! :) However, I would never recommend it as a
> scripting language. I've tried that numerous times myself when I was
> still in ruby honeymoon. It's more trouble than it's worth. Use
> something scritpy like perl or bash. I'm not su
On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 12:42 -0700, Eric Wald wrote:
> Interesting. You imply that there is a fundamentally good idea hidden
> somewhere deep inside the Tea Party that could be usefully ported to a
> more productive platform. I would love to know what it is; my fanboi
> cousin has led me to believ
On 11/08/2010 01:25 PM, Stuart Jansen wrote:
> If nothing else, it would be wonderful to a mainstream party (either
> one!) return to fiscal responsibility without resorting to "throw
> everyone to wolves, screw the rest of the nation 'cause my life is
> pretty okay right now".
Sadly I don't know
On 11/08/2010 01:00 PM, Michael Torrie wrote:
>
> Of course it's not for shell scripting, but modern BASIC isn't that bad.
>
>
Since we've gone this route, my company need to pick a new scripting
language. We are currently using qbasic. We are switching to perl.
There was some thought of
On 11/08/2010 02:02 PM, Kyle Waters wrote:
> Since we've gone this route, my company need to pick a new scripting
> language. We are currently using qbasic. We are switching to perl.
> There was some thought of python but we settled on perl, just felt it
> worked better for our purposes(btw w
On 11/08/2010 02:07 PM, Michael Torrie wrote:
>
> On what platform were you running? I thought qbasic as 16-bit DOS.
>
>
My company purchased a version that is compatible with windows xp. It
seems to be having trouble with windows 7 especially when ran across a
netware mapped drive...
On Mon, 08 Nov 2010 13:00:46 -0700
Michael Torrie wrote:
> I definitely would have no qualms about teaching a child to program in
> FreeBASIC or even FreePascal, and later have them learn C or Java.
> Then again, Python would be an even better choice for teaching.
Nah, start them out right. PDP
On 11/08/2010 02:47 PM, Charles Curley wrote:
> On Mon, 08 Nov 2010 13:00:46 -0700
> Michael Torrie wrote:
>
>> I definitely would have no qualms about teaching a child to program in
>> FreeBASIC or even FreePascal, and later have them learn C or Java.
>> Then again, Python would be an even bette
On Mon, 2010-11-08 at 14:09 -0700, Kyle Waters wrote:
> My company purchased a version that is compatible with windows xp. It
> seems to be having trouble with windows 7 especially when ran across a
> netware mapped drive...
If you're doing Perl on Windows, just want to make sure you're awa
PLUG,
I'm currently configuring sendmail servers to some specs I've been
given (RHEL).
I was always taught that the RIGHT way to configure sendmail was to
install sendmail-cf and configure it via the sendmail.mc / submit.mc
files and then generate the .cf files. A lot of what I'm reading
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010, Jacob Albretsen wrote:
> I was always taught that the RIGHT way to configure sendmail was to
> install sendmail-cf and configure it via the sendmail.mc / submit.mc
> files and then generate the .cf files. A lot of what I'm reading online
> tells me to edit sendmail.cf / sub
On 11/08/2010 04:13 PM, Jon Jensen wrote:
> On Mon, 8 Nov 2010, Jacob Albretsen wrote:
>
>> I was always taught that the RIGHT way to configure sendmail was to
>> install sendmail-cf and configure it via the sendmail.mc / submit.mc
>> files and then generate the .cf files. A lot of what I'm rea
Learning to Program
I got a query from a new Linux user who wants to learn computer
programming. Linux is an excellent choice for this, because there are a
huge number of programming languages available for itand all free.
The risk is in becoming overwhelmed by the choices available.
There's
On Mon, Nov 08, 2010 at 09:23:24AM -0700, Victor Villa wrote:
> As I learn Bash i'm finding more and more that knowledge of a scripting
> language is needed, though i'm seeing some talk about PERL and some talk
> Python.
>
> If my work environment really hasn't taken advantage of a scripting langu
On 08 Nov 2010, at 16:27, Charles Curley wrote:
> Learning to Program
>
> I got a query from a new Linux user who wants to learn computer
> programming. Linux is an excellent choice for this, because there are a
> huge number of programming languages available for itand all free.
> The risk
On Mon, Nov 08, 2010 at 02:02:28PM -0700, Kyle Waters wrote:
> Since we've gone this route, my company need to pick a new scripting
> language. We are currently using qbasic. We are switching to perl.
> There was some thought of python but we settled on perl, just felt it
> worked better for
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 6:22 PM, Aaron Toponce wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 08, 2010 at 02:02:28PM -0700, Kyle Waters wrote:
> > Since we've gone this route, my company need to pick a new scripting
> > language. We are currently using qbasic. We are switching to perl.
> > There was some thought of python
On 11/08/2010 05:18 PM, Jonathan Duncan wrote:
>
> That is a good list, which also reminds me that I was going to pick
> one to put my eight year old on. Probably one that I also have not
> learned yet so that we can learn it together. Lisp could be fun to
> look at again, I have always wanted t
On 08 Nov 2010, at 17:36, Michael Torrie wrote:
> On 11/08/2010 05:18 PM, Jonathan Duncan wrote:
>>
>> That is a good list, which also reminds me that I was going to pick
>> one to put my eight year old on. Probably one that I also have not
>> learned yet so that we can learn it together. Lisp
On Mon, 8 Nov 2010 18:31:17 -0600
Scott Edwards wrote:
> >
> > Are they waiting for "use qbasic;" ? :)
>
> Scott.
Hmmm, maybe you could write it for them.
--
Charles Curley /"\ASCII Ribbon Campaign
Looking for fine software \ /Respect for open standards
and/o
At one time, I was going to mention JavaScript, and then I showed this
thread to a good friend of mine. Yes, that's right, consider if you will,
JavaScript.
(09:50:00 PM) Eric Hamilton: I don't want to subscribe to the list just to
respond to some random thread about which scripting language to u
On 08 Nov 2010, at 17:36, Michael Torrie wrote:
> When I was very young (single digits) I learned Logo. It was fun
> because it was so interactive. Logo may yet still be useful for a
> learning language. Python even has a turtle you can import that brings
> some logo-like functionality to pyth
On 08 Nov 2010, at 22:05, Jonathan Duncan wrote:
> http://armorgames.com/play/2205/light-bot
>
I found that link on this page which seems have a bit of good info.
http://www.marshallbrain.com/kids-programming.htm
/*
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