Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 8 Jan 2014 10:36, "Larry Hastings" wrote: > > On 01/07/2014 06:06 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote: >> >> Addressing the key remaining barriers to migration for existing Python 2 users would be an excellent objective to attain before we end upstream support for Python 2.7, but it's one that would be bett

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Terry Reedy
On 1/7/2014 9:35 PM, Larry Hastings wrote: On 01/07/2014 06:06 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote: Addressing the key remaining barriers to migration for existing Python 2 users would be an excellent objective to attain before we end upstream support for Python 2.7, but it's one that would be better addres

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Larry Hastings
On 01/07/2014 06:06 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote: Addressing the key remaining barriers to migration for existing Python 2 users would be an excellent objective to attain before we end upstream support for Python 2.7, but it's one that would be better addressed by a slightly shorter dev cycle than

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Benjamin Peterson
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014, at 06:06 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote: > On 8 Jan 2014 08:44, "Eric V. Smith" wrote: > > > > On 1/7/2014 7:33 PM, Benjamin Peterson wrote: > > > A PyPI module is not so great because you'll have to change every > > > formatting operation to use a function from a module rather than t

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 8 Jan 2014 08:44, "Eric V. Smith" wrote: > > On 1/7/2014 7:33 PM, Benjamin Peterson wrote: > > A PyPI module is not so great because you'll have to change every > > formatting operation to use a function from a module rather than the % > > operator or the format method. > > I think this is the

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Gregory P. Smith
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 4:58 PM, Larry Hastings wrote: > On 01/07/2014 03:10 PM, A.M. Kuchling wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 07, 2014 at 02:37:22PM -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: > > Just to be clear, this is exactly what I mean. I'm not saying AC is not > worth it; I'm questioning the timing. > > Agreed

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Larry Hastings
On 01/07/2014 03:10 PM, A.M. Kuchling wrote: On Tue, Jan 07, 2014 at 02:37:22PM -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: Just to be clear, this is exactly what I mean. I'm not saying AC is not worth it; I'm questioning the timing. Agreed; let's try to avoid far-ranging sets of changes so late in the beta cy

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Eric V. Smith
On 1/7/2014 7:33 PM, Benjamin Peterson wrote: > A PyPI module is not so great because you'll have to change every > formatting operation to use a function from a module rather than the % > operator or the format method. I think this is the crux of the issue. Are we trying to say "porting your exis

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Benjamin Peterson
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014, at 04:29 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote: > On 8 Jan 2014 07:11, "A.M. Kuchling" wrote: > > > > On Tue, Jan 07, 2014 at 02:37:22PM -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: > > > Just to be clear, this is exactly what I mean. I'm not saying AC is not > > > worth it; I'm questioning the timing. > > >

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 8 Jan 2014 07:11, "A.M. Kuchling" wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 07, 2014 at 02:37:22PM -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: > > Just to be clear, this is exactly what I mean. I'm not saying AC is not > > worth it; I'm questioning the timing. > > Agreed; let's try to avoid far-ranging sets of changes so late in

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread A.M. Kuchling
On Tue, Jan 07, 2014 at 02:37:22PM -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: > Just to be clear, this is exactly what I mean. I'm not saying AC is not > worth it; I'm questioning the timing. Agreed; let's try to avoid far-ranging sets of changes so late in the beta cycle. If we want to send 3.4 back to alpha a

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Eli Bendersky
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 1:33 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > On mar., 2014-01-07 at 13:18 -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: > > Hello, > > > > Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn > > after the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now > > it seems that the wh

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
вівторок, 07-січ-2014 13:42:29 Łukasz Langa написано: > Let me play the devil’s advocate here: how much do we risk in future > maintainability costs if we move to Argument Clinic in Python 3.5 and > leave large parts of Python 3.4 uncovered by it? > > I mean that we can get some ugly diffs between

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Brett Cannon
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 4:31 PM, Gregory P. Smith wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 1:18 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn after >> the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now it seems >> that the whol

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Ethan Furman
On 01/07/2014 01:18 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote: Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn after the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now it seems that the whole implementation is being reconsidered (Antoine's email to pydev). This doesn't look like

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Łukasz Langa
On Jan 7, 2014, at 1:33 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote: > On mar., 2014-01-07 at 13:18 -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: >> Hello, >> >> Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn >> after the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now >> it seems that the whole impl

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On mar., 2014-01-07 at 13:18 -0800, Eli Bendersky wrote: > Hello, > > Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn > after the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now > it seems that the whole implementation is being reconsidered > (Antoine's email to pyde

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Gregory P. Smith
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 1:18 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote: > Hello, > > Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn after > the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now it seems > that the whole implementation is being reconsidered (Antoine's email to > pydev).

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Eli Bendersky
On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 1:26 PM, Victor Stinner wrote: > 2014/1/7 Eli Bendersky : > > Are we really that much in need of convert-to-clinic *now*? > > Why not creating the 3.4 branch after the beta1 and develop Python 3.5 > in default during the stabilisation process of Python 3.4? It's like > many

Re: [python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Victor Stinner
2014/1/7 Eli Bendersky : > Are we really that much in need of convert-to-clinic *now*? Why not creating the 3.4 branch after the beta1 and develop Python 3.5 in default during the stabilisation process of Python 3.4? It's like many other softwares are developed. Only bugfixes would be accepted in

[python-committers] clinic churn after beta2

2014-01-07 Thread Eli Bendersky
Hello, Does it really make sense to introduce large amounts of code churn after the release of 3.4 beta2? It started innocently enough, but now it seems that the whole implementation is being reconsidered (Antoine's email to pydev). This doesn't look like something we should be doing so late in th