Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rod Dorman wrote: > >> In article , >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> >>> ... >>> Kludging local timezone conversions into the NTP protocol somehow would >>> be a nightmare if you could persuade anyone to do it! 24 or more >>> timezones ... >>> >> Don'

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: >> John Hasler wrote: >>> Jim Pennino writes: If you limit the problem to Olson, the problem was solved years ago at: ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/ >>> Until they have a budget cut, a server reorganization, decide the traffic >>> is excessive

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > Rob writes: >> The offset from UTC is not the kind of timezone information that is being >> discussed here. > > Sure it is. > >> It cannot be distributed via NTP anyway, as the server does not know >> where the client is and thus cannot give it the offset info. > > True. >

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Unruh wrote: >> Joe writes: >> >>> Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >>> network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >>> have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >>> or reasons why there should no

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Todd Glassey CISM CIFI wrote: > Joe wrote: >> Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >> network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >> have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >> or reasons why there should not be on

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

On Sat, 20 Jun 2009 22:00:06 +, jimp wrote: > David Woolley wrote: >> j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: >> >> >>> What about all the systems that don't use Olson? >>> >>> >> I'm only aware of one that doesn't require the system administrator to >> manually configure for any zone that that

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

On Sat, Jun 20, 2009 at 5:45 PM, wrote: > Yeah, for the entire planet. > > How many changes have effected YOU since 1976? Most of them have affected me or my organization. If you use any form of calendaring-enabled appliaction (Exchange, Notes, Google calendar, WebEx, SAP, whatever), time zone ch

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: >> John Hasler wrote: >>> Jim Pennino writes: If you limit the problem to Olson, the problem was solved years ago at: ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/ >>> >>> Until they have a budget cut, a server reorganization, decide the traffic >>> is exc

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David Woolley wrote: > j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: >> David Woolley wrote: >>> j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: >>> What about all the systems that don't use Olson? >>> I'm only aware of one that doesn't require the system administrator to >>> manually configure for any zone that

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > And you keep ingnoring the fact that timezone info is not just about > OS vendors. NTP is a protcol that can be used by anything that wants > to keep correct time, not only by a computer system running a commercial > OS. This is "localisation" and the TZ* element is only one small

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: > John Hasler wrote: >> Jim Pennino writes: >>> If you limit the problem to Olson, the problem was solved years ago at: >>> ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/ >> >> Until they have a budget cut, a server reorganization, decide the traffic >> is excessive, or just get b

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: > David Woolley wrote: >> j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: >> >>> What about all the systems that don't use Olson? >>> >> I'm only aware of one that doesn't require the system administrator to >> manually configure for any zone that that doesn't match the (histori

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > Jim Pennino writes: >> If you limit the problem to Olson, the problem was solved years ago at: >> ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/ > > Until they have a budget cut, a server reorganization, decide the traffic > is excessive, or just get bored. You are still ignoring the fact tha

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David Woolley wrote: > j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: > >> >> What about all the systems that don't use Olson? >> > > I'm only aware of one that doesn't require the system administrator to > manually configure for any zone that that doesn't match the (historic) > US rules, and that is the

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Jim Pennino writes: > If you limit the problem to Olson, the problem was solved years ago at: > ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/ Until they have a budget cut, a server reorganization, decide the traffic is excessive, or just get bored. > Since 1976 there have been 2 changes to the timezone rules in t

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

j...@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote: > > What about all the systems that don't use Olson? > I'm only aware of one that doesn't require the system administrator to manually configure for any zone that that doesn't match the (historic) US rules, and that is the Windows NT family. _

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > I wrote: >> I'm just proposing that the file be made available at a standard location >> on a well-known set of distributed servers. > > Jim Pennino writes: >> For what kind of system? > > Any. > >> While the zoneinfo database, also known as the Olson database, is >> probab

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

I wrote: > I'm just proposing that the file be made available at a standard location > on a well-known set of distributed servers. Jim Pennino writes: > For what kind of system? Any. > While the zoneinfo database, also known as the Olson database, is > probably the most common, it is hardly the

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > I wrote: >> I don't know of any distribution that provides an easy way >> arrange for automatic updates of a single file. > > Null writes: >> Why would rsync not work? > > It would work fine but it seems like overkill and is not universally > available. > >> ...or a cron t

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > Jim Pennino writes: >> Newer stuff tends to run a version of Linux or FreeBSD and you get >> updates as patches from the maker. > > Downloaded automatically as needed? What happens when the maker goes bust, > shuts down their server, or decides the product is obsolete? The

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

I wrote: > I don't know of any distribution that provides an easy way > arrange for automatic updates of a single file. Null writes: > Why would rsync not work? It would work fine but it seems like overkill and is not universally available. > ...or a cron task for wget crontab /tasks.crontab @m

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Jim Pennino writes: > Newer stuff tends to run a version of Linux or FreeBSD and you get > updates as patches from the maker. Downloaded automatically as needed? What happens when the maker goes bust, shuts down their server, or decides the product is obsolete? -- John Hasler j...@dhh.gt.org Da

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > E-Mail Sent to this address will be added to the BlackLists > wrote: >> ... and, what do all those millions of embedded systems >> do now to get time zone data? > > They don't. DST support is usually hardwired, manually configured > or nonexistent. > The user has to set the clock

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

E-Mail Sent to this address will be added to the BlackLists wrote: > ... and, what do all those millions of embedded systems > do now to get time zone data? They don't. DST support is usually hardwired, manually configured or nonexistent. The user has to set the clock himself twice a year or a

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > I don't know of any distribution that provides an easy way > arrange for automatic updates of a single file. Why would rsync not work? rsync rsync://ftp.eu.openbsd.org/OpenBSD/distfiles/DateTime-TimeZone-0.49.tar.gz . or a cron task for wget crontab /tasks.crontab @mont

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Steve Kostecke writes: > Then you have to get the OS aggregators / distributors / vendors to agree > to switch over to utilizing this new TZ data distribution system instead > of their existing package management systems. Not instead. The client would be a packaged program which would update the

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

On 2009-06-19, John Hasler wrote: > We have a standard file. Ftp will do fine as a protocol. We just need to > agree on a standard location for the current tzdata file and its timestamp > and recruit a distributed set of servers. The NTP pool servers would do > nicely. The client to periodica

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob writes: > The offset from UTC is not the kind of timezone information that is being > discussed here. Sure it is. > It cannot be distributed via NTP anyway, as the server does not know > where the client is and thus cannot give it the offset info. True. > The interesting information is the

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rod Dorman wrote: >> In article , >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> ... >>> Kludging local timezone conversions into the NTP protocol somehow would >>> be a nightmare if you could persuade anyone to do it! 24 or more >>> timezones ... >> >> Don't forget that there

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rod Dorman wrote: > In article , > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> ... >> Kludging local timezone conversions into the NTP protocol somehow would >> be a nightmare if you could persuade anyone to do it! 24 or more >> timezones ... > > Don't forget that there are places like Newfoundland that do

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

In article , Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > ... >Kludging local timezone conversions into the NTP protocol somehow would >be a nightmare if you could persuade anyone to do it! 24 or more >timezones ... Don't forget that there are places like Newfoundland that don't have a nice round number of h

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Unruh wrote: >> "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >> >>> Rob wrote: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If >>> you >>> have support, you can eve

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > A compiled timezone info file is about 2-3 KB in size. > However, it might be that it is not the best option to send it in compiled > form, because this is dependent on issues like wordlength and byteorder. > A similar format but sent as XML could be better. But it would of course > b

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 3:38 PM, David Woolley wrote: >> A similar format but sent as XML could be better.  But it would of course >> be several times bigger. > > Generally one only uses XML if one wants a bloated file or to be > fashionable.  What's wrong with the current Olson source format? Wha

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Hal Murray wrote: >>> In article , >>> Rob writes: >>> So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do such localization should be on their own, providing their own update mechanism, and there should not be a universal upd

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Hal Murray wrote: >> In article , >> Rob writes: >> >>> So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do >>> such localization should be on their own, providing their own update >>> mechanism, and there should not be a universal update mechanism for >>> timezone updat

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Hal Murray wrote: > In article , > "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >> Rob wrote: >>> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> Rob wrote: >>> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If >>>

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Hal Murray wrote: > In article , > Rob writes: > >>So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do >>such localization should be on their own, providing their own update >>mechanism, and there should not be a universal update mechanism for >>timezone updates that is neutral to op

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

In article , "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> Rob wrote: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If >>> you >>> have support, yo

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Hal Murray wrote: > In article , > Rob writes: > >> So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do >> such localization should be on their own, providing their own update >> mechanism, and there should not be a universal update mechanism for >> timezone updates that is neutral t

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

In article , Rob writes: >So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do >such localization should be on their own, providing their own update >mechanism, and there should not be a universal update mechanism for >timezone updates that is neutral to operating system? Why have a

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David Woolley wrote: > Rob wrote: > >> A similar format but sent as XML could be better. But it would of course >> be several times bigger. > > Generally one only uses XML if one wants a bloated file or to be > fashionable. What's wrong with the current Olson source format? I'm not sure I und

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > A similar format but sent as XML could be better. But it would of course > be several times bigger. Generally one only uses XML if one wants a bloated file or to be fashionable. What's wrong with the current Olson source format? ___ que

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David J Taylor wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> David J Taylor wrote: > [] >>> Only for one country out of hundreds. >>> >>> David >> >> Only ONE is important to me these days! > > I cannot take that view, Richard, as I write software which is used in > dozens of countries and time zones. M

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Uwe Klein wrote: > >>Timezone stuff is "Localisation" and handled forex by libc and/or >>other programming frameworks. >> >>And the package manager for "managed" linux distributions ( same for the bsds >>) >>usually present timely updates. > > > So your standpoint is that every sy

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob writes: >Uwe Klein wrote: >> Timezone stuff is "Localisation" and handled forex by libc and/or >> other programming frameworks. >> >> And the package manager for "managed" linux distributions ( same for the >> bsds ) >> usually present timely updates. >So your standpoint is that every syst

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

"Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >Unruh wrote: >> "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >> >>> Rob wrote: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If >>> you >>> have support, you ca

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > David J Taylor wrote: [] >> Only for one country out of hundreds. >> >> David > > Only ONE is important to me these days! I cannot take that view, Richard, as I write software which is used in dozens of countries and time zones. My software works purely in UTC, and a

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Bill Unruh writes: > But there are at least 10 different timezone/DST rules for the USA. How > does [WWVB] broadcast them all? They merely provide an indications as to the current DST status. The entire US goes on and off DST at the same time. Here is the format:

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Unruh wrote: > "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > >> Rob wrote: >>> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you >> have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can'

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David J Taylor wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> Rob wrote: >>> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. >> If you have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. >> Sinc

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David J Taylor wrote: > Rob wrote: > [] >> So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do >> such localization should be on their own, providing their own update >> mechanism, and there should not be a universal update mechanism for >> timezone updates that is neutral to operatin

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: [] > So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants to do > such localization should be on their own, providing their own update > mechanism, and there should not be a universal update mechanism for > timezone updates that is neutral to operating system? Initially, using some

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Uwe Klein wrote: > Timezone stuff is "Localisation" and handled forex by libc and/or > other programming frameworks. > > And the package manager for "managed" linux distributions ( same for the bsds > ) > usually present timely updates. So your standpoint is that every system builder who wants t

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Unruh wrote: > Joe writes: > > >>Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >>network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >>have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >>or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> There you go. It works for you, but it does not work in the general case. > > I think it works for most people and places. Most of the US switches > to/from DST on the same day. I don't know about the rest of the western > hemisphere but since I seldom leave the

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Unruh wrote: > Joe writes: > >>Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >>network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >>have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >>or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> Rob wrote: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. > If you have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. > Since I can't afford support (I'm r

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > Rob writes: >> I would think that a more distributed approach is better. > > Put the file at a standard location on a known set of servers (maybe a > subset of the pool servers?). Provide the md5sum at the same location so > that software can know when there has been a change

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe writes: >Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, >ma

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

"Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> Rob wrote: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you > have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't > afford support

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe wrote: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of > network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there > have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, > or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, >

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > I have a couple of "radio controlled" digital clocks and a > wrist watch that do it automagically. The VLF broadcast from > WWVB provides the necessary info. Yes, but all the WWVB broadcast says about DST is whether it is in effect or not, or about to start or end, ac

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Null writes: > Yea States never ignore federal laws, and do as they wish instead. They are free to ignore this law. They just lose all their Federal subsidies if they do. Which means, of course, that they never ignore it. However, almost every other country in the world has "DST" arrangements a

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > David Woolley wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> You don't need to extend NTP to do this. >>> Just put the file with the timezone data on an FTP >>> server and tell us where it is. Maybe a few >> >> Already done. > > Please tell me where to get it.

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Chris Adams wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert said: >> I think it works for most people and places. >> Most of the US switches to/from DST on the same day. > > By law, all of the US has to switch DST on the same day > at the same local time. IIRC now, states have to switch > or not switch state-wide

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Once upon a time, Richard B. Gilbert said: >I think it works for most people and places. Most of the US switches >to/from DST on the same day. By law, all of the US has to switch DST on the same day at the same local time. IIRC now, states have to switch or not switch state-wide as well (even

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> Rob wrote: >>> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you >> have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't >

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David Woolley wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > >> You don't need to extend NTP to do this. Just put the file with the >> timezone data on an FTP server and tell us where it is. Maybe a few > > Already done. Please tell me where to get it. ___

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

John Hasler wrote: > IMHO a standardized, automated and decentralized way of distributing > changes to timezone files might be useful, though. It just should > not be part of NTP. I'm not sure it is as automated and decentralized as you might want, but there is a mechanism in place to update the

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > > Is that FTP server robust enough to allow for e.g. all installations > of a popular operating system to download it automatically from there? Probably not, especially if the designers were lazy and didn't randomise the polling. > > I would think that a more distributed approach

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob writes: > I would think that a more distributed approach is better. Put the file at a standard location on a known set of servers (maybe a subset of the pool servers?). Provide the md5sum at the same location so that software can know when there has been a change. Seems like the traffic woul

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David Woolley wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > >> You don't need to extend NTP to do this. Just put the file with the >> timezone data on an FTP server and tell us where it is. Maybe a few > > Already done. Is that FTP server robust enough to allow for e.g. all installations of a popular

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Jan writes: > If local time were used only on equipment that has a presentation layer > (OSS and BSS), then this would reduce the size of the problem by at least > one if not two orders of magnitude. Better to use UTC everywhere and convert to local time only for presentation. -- John Hasler j..

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > You don't need to extend NTP to do this. Just put the file with the > timezone data on an FTP server and tell us where it is. Maybe a few Already done. > dozen servers would be better. I think there is even a "standard" way > of expressing when ST/DST changes o

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert writes: > I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you > have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't > afford support (I'm retired and a hobbyist) I have to do it by hand. Most Linux distributions provide this support for fr

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > How can it not be true? The time broadcast encodes both the time > (standard time) and whether or not DST is in effect. Of course it WWV may encode UTC, but European VLF transmitters transmit wall clock time. > doesn't work for those jurisdictions that have chosen

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> Rob wrote: Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you > have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't > afford support (I'

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> Rob wrote: >>> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't afford support (I'm retired and a hobbyist) I have to

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Rob wrote: >> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >>> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you >>> have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't >>> afford support (I'm retired and a hobbyist) I have to do it by hand. >>

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

David Woolley wrote: > Microsoft store it the the registry, so need to > provide incremental updates. Microsoft cannot provide complex future rules. This was true in the past, but it has been fixed. ___ questions mailing list questions@lists.ntp.org

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Nero Imhard wrote: > Making all this telco equipment understand a new ntp protocol > extension won't be easier than implementing Olsen's TZ stuff or > switching to UTC Is there some distributed server system available where those Olsen TZ files could be downloaded? It would of course be no probl

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you >> have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't >> afford support (I'm retired and a hobbyist) I have to do it by hand. > > As Jan Ceuleers also pointed o

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 3:01 PM, Rob wrote: > Now you are just iterating the reasons why it would be useful to > distribute this info via some network.  The question being asked is > if it could be useful to use an NTP server to distribute it.  An > alternative could be do use some HTTP server, a n

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you > have support, you can even get updates from the vendor. Since I can't > afford support (I'm retired and a hobbyist) I have to do it by hand. As Jan Ceuleers also pointed out, the problem is n

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > I believe that the O/S vendors supply a file with timezone data. If you Not in general true. Not all Unix system use the Olson package, e.g. SCO OpenServer doesn't. Microsoft store it the the registry, so need to provide incremental updates. Microsoft cannot provi

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Jan Ceuleers wrote: > So the challenge is to keep tens of thousands of network elements > (routers, ATM switches, telephone exchanges etc) aware of when to > switch to/from DST during their lifetime of multiple years. Wouldn't > it be great if we could do this without manual interventions, or > sc

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> Joe wrote: >>> Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >>> network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >>> have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >>> or reasons why there s

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe wrote: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of > network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there > have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, > or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, >

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Rob wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> Joe wrote: >>> Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >>> network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >>> have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >>> or reasons why there s

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > Joe wrote: >> Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >> network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >> have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >> or reasons why there should not be one?

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe wrote: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of > network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there > have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, > or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, >

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe wrote: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of > network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there > have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, > or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, >

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe wrote: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have > some form of network service to update timezone data. > Does anyone know if there have been any proposals about > a standardized timezone update protocol, or reasons > why there should not be one? Since NTP is well establishe

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 12:44 PM, Danny Mayer wrote: > Joe wrote: >> Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of >> network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there >> have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, >> or reasons why

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe writes: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of > network service to update timezone data. Maybe, but is it really that dynamic? > Since NTP is well established, maybe it could be expanded to include > timezone data? I'd rather not. -- John Hasler j...@dhh.gt

Re: [ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Joe wrote: > Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of > network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there > have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, > or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, >

[ntp:questions] Can or should the NTP protocol eventually serve timezone data?

Timezone data is fairly dynamic. It makes sense to have some form of network service to update timezone data. Does anyone know if there have been any proposals about a standardized timezone update protocol, or reasons why there should not be one? Since NTP is well established, maybe it could be exp