Anthony wrote
"Creating new Bus Stop nodes
Is the consensus to remove the plaform tags from new nodes?"
I'm not sure I understand.
If you are creating a new bus stop node, then there won't be any tags to
remove, platform or otherwise.
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Hi Anthony,
One reason I can see for discussing this edit here, before doing it, is in
regard to the cases where the platform tag already exists on an area close
to the bus stop node.
If this edit had not been reverted then the question would be, who will
clean up the mess of the duplicate tags.
Hi Martijn,
In my opinion the biggest improvement to Australian OSM data, to make it
usefull for automotive navigation, would be the addition of offline address
data.
I believe that most states have address datasets available that are OSM
licence compliant and could be used for import. Would
Andrew wrote "According to the Geographical Names Board "Bullenbung Creek"
is the old name and "Bullenbong Creek" is the new name (and by new we are
talking
since July 1972)."
Ok thanks - I'll put Bullenbung in as Alt-name.
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Surveying the area between Wagga and Echuca last week I have noticed the
following.
a) At the turn off from the Sturt Highway to Lockhart the (newish) sign
said "Collingullie Jerildere Road" and there were no sign saying "Lockhart
Road". LPI NSW Base Map has "Lockhart Road".
The lowerr end of
Thanks Nev, Tathra looks good.
Now if we could only get those addressess in!
I'm convinced that for OSM to be really usefull it has to be able to fulfil
the function of Car Navigation and that this requires all data to be
available offline.
So all we need is permission to use the LPI addressess
I'll map all the houses in Tathra tonight unless someone else beats me to
it.
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Address data could also be used to verify street/road names and also add
them where they are missing.
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Hi Jubal
The missing OSM information in Australia that would be, by a large margin,
the most usefull, would be address data (and building footprint, if
available).
If we had address data then OSM maps would be usefull for the genberal
public to use in car navigation etc.
Collecting address data
Ben wrote
"I think that's some kind of location code. I forget what it's called. If
you search for that string in Google Maps it takes you to an address at
the Gold Coast."
Bing maps (and Bing search) does not know of this string. Maybe it's
proprietary Google information.
Nick
If byo=yes, then it would be useful to know if corkage is charged, and if
so, how much.
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Sam wrote
"
https://services.slip.wa.gov.au/public/services/SLIP_Public_Services/Transport/MapServer/WMSServer
"
Thanks Sam,
That WMS works well. I'll start working on this this weekend.
The first area I looked at (Banksia Grove) looks to be a bit of a nightmare
:-(
Takes us back to to days
We have specific permissions to use certain QLD and WA data. Do we have any
such permissions for VIC, or do we have anybody who knows who to ask?
Also are there and tile servers or overlays for the QLD and WA data that we
can use to manually get the redacted road names back easily?
Where Cooks Hill Road crosses the Hume Highway near Yass NSW
http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/-34.80827/148.93106
The are signs, on the sides of the bridge, facing both carriageways, saying
"Yellow Creek Road",
Why this so is a mystery to me and the only references to "Yellow Creek
Road"
In OSM there seem to quite a few incorrectly named "Fazzolari Avenue" ways
around the Mona Vale Warriewood area.
Not sure yet how they happened (may have been a copy/paste type issue) -
not sure.
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When I said that Gosmore (YourNavgation) website had done something stupid,
I was wrong.
It was the data that was incorrect. I have fixed the data to make the acute
angle , where the two carriageways meet up, far more acute (which agrees
with the imagery.
Once the Yournavigation site updates
"My suggestion is that the map data is the best place to store that
information."
Actually - the wiki page is very specific on this.
"When a particular turn restriction is *the default* for a given
jurisdiction *and* is *not signed* *don't map them*. It is much better to
ensure that routing
"I'm assuming you mean the Intersection with Lane Cove Rd.
If so it's not permitted to make a u-turn here anyway, as there is no
sign permitting u-turns at the traffic signals.
So I'd not add it as a restriction as anyone driving there should know
that they can not make a u-turn there."
Ok -
"I'm assuming you mean the Intersection with Lane Cove Rd."
No - the intersection with Chiltern Street although it looks as though
someone has just added it.
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What do people think about the intersection at
-33.6793339 151.264475
The road geometry clearly indicates that there is no way you can do a turn
from Moan Vale Road Eastbound back down Mona Vale Road Westbound, yet there
are no signs saying so and I believe that most routers would suggest
Actually. primary roads are of equal need for fixing. Maybe only trunk and
motorways are reasonably accurate routing wise.
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Secondary roads often have high speed limits and are connected to low speed
residential roads. This can cause issues with cars slowing in front of fast
moving cars and cars crossing in front of traffic.
For this reason there are many intersections on secondary roads that have
no-u-turn or
Maybe you could get some students at UNSW to fire up a quad-copter with a
go pro on it and get some up-to-date rectified imagery
to check against their maps, then edit in any changes/improvement.
Nick
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I just tried to add some more Victoria missing road names but can't get the
Vicmap imagery working in either JOSM or Potlatch.
Does it still work for anyone else
Nick
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Thanks all,
Got it working in JOSM now. (Just had a little error in the URL).
Nick
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Regarding the Address data potential import.
The Vic Map data is already available for import and it contains the
address info for all of Victoria. (as well as tons of roads missing from
OSM)
I think this would be the best source of address data to import.
Am I correct in saying that it is permissable to copy street names from the
VicMap into OSM?
Also - what about the house numbers, is that ok as well?
I have neither the time, talent or inclination to do an import of house
numbers, but would help out in any manual effort to add all house numbers
Steve wrote
IMHO some small scale imports may be useful, but from my comparisons, the
VicMap data is not necessarily better than OSM. It often has stuff OSM
doesn't, but sometimes that includes spurious stuff like roads that no
longer exist, never did, etc.
Thanks Steve,
As far as importing
Hi Mark,
The B58 (according to the signs) continues right down to the Hume Weir
(including Murray Street).
C542 continues over the bridge and right up to the intersection with B58. I
have amended these on OSM and added in a few road names in the area.
Unfortunately my car broke down three time
Hi Mark,
Holbrook looks great, thanks. I'll check on B58 and while in Albury I'll
grab a few more street signs for some of the unnamed streets.
I won't bother with Wodonga since once the Vicmap data is available for
JOSM I can add them all then.
Nick
Hi Arthur, mark,
About four weeks ago I went down to Melbourne, for a bike ride and did have
my GPS on through Holbrook. I saw someone had put the bypass in so I didn't
think to check it. I've just uploaded my GPS and it matches the other one
very well and is substantially different to the
http://www.gazette.vic.gov.au/gazette/Gazettes2013/GG2013S204.pdf
Not sure what all this is about but may be of interest (it does mention
Diggers Way).
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Hi Neil,
I think the way to get this fixed permanently could be...
Fix it one more time, re-add the note saying that the imagery is out of
date and that this intersection has been surveyed.
Change the source tag from nearmap to survey.
Now even though one of the mnappers has a fairly colourful
Hi Li
I'm convinced that you will find that it is practically impossible to mass
import (or even mass merge) a new road dataset into existing data when
there is a large amount of existing data. The only practical way would be
to delete all of the Victorian data and start again with the mass
and Bing
imagery in helping to fix up the horrible original TIGER data but would
love to be helping in fixing up Australia.
Nick Hocking
Canberra
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Hi
The other day I was riding the push bike along some trails and got talking
to some horse riders.
It turns out the Lady (Jenny) is the ACT coordinator for (and also the
secretary of) the Bicentennial National Trail Ltd. Naturally I dropped the
term Openstreetmap and it appears that they are
Richard wrote
So if it interests you, have a go at it.
It does interest me and I will have a go at it (eventually). However I
have a few more pressing issues (OSMwise). We urgently need to complete
the street name reclamation of Australia.
To this end I will be mapping Hay and Narrandra in the
Hi Alex,
My view on all this is that if a place has officially been designated as a
city then we must tag it as such. If it is offically a town then we must
tag it as a town etc.
If we can't find any official designation then either common sense of maybe
a state specific rule could be applied.
According to
NSW Government Gazette 1885, vol. I. NSW Government. 1885-03-20
Goulburn was officially proclaimed a City on 20 March 1885
This user has changed Goulburn from a city to a town amazing
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Ian Steer wrote
I think this is good because no matter
which way you go through the intersection, you only pass one set of lights
(rather than 2 if they were placed on the actual intersecting nodes).
Couldn't a smart traffic light counter detect dual carrageways and just
add a single signal,
Sorry folks, I was having too much fun in Port Macquarie and only got to
map for a short while.
I did some roads near the racecourse although most of these were never
named in OSM before. On my returm trip I will make a more determined
effort to re-map the rest of Port Macquarie.
I have made a
I see that Port Macquarie and Wauchope need quite a bit of remedial work
done on them. On my way to the Pan-Pac Games this week, I am going to try
to acheive some of this.
I started by realigning those roads that redaction had caused to misalign.
Then I traced in those roads that went missing. I
David wrote
A lot of the locations are towns that only existed for a short time
and many are ones that never existed, or existed just in the mind of a
planner.
Yes - this absolutely epitomises the main problem of most imports.
Here we have 19,000 bits of data that are almost certainly
Hi all,
I'm going to be at the Gold Coast for the week of November 3-10 for the Pan
Pacific Masters Games.
Although I'm registered in 3 different sports, I intend to spend at least
one day (and some bits and pieces) reading as many Gold Coast street signs
as possible.
I'll be starting around the
John wrote I've been giving you a bit of a hand there, but mainly outside
Canberra
Thanks John, all help very much appreciated. Once I finish Canberra I
will start helping out to clear keep right errors in Sydney.
Keep right is the best method, in m,y view, since it gives immediate
feedback
Ben wrote Also, thank you for fixing those track sections at St Marys. Do
you know what happened there?
Given there was a derailment there 2 months ago, I find
this a spooky co-incidence...
Co-incidently I was in Sydney for the day, on that day, for a work meeting
and as I
I wish to transport a long thinnish somewhat fragile wooden object from
Sydney to Canberra behind steam locomotive 1210. Given that there some
tunnels along the way, is the mapping in OSM accurate enough in terms of
bendiness to calculate (given a known width of tunnel) whether the wooden
object
Alex wrote
or a question about loading gauges that the ARTC might better answer?
Yes it would be better for ARTC to answer but before I bother them I would
like to know if it is at all feasable. Specifically, I am concerned that
one of the tunnels between Queanbeyan and Bungendore may well be
Actually, I've just had a go with a 50 metre stick insect in JOSM and it
is REALLY touch and go (or is that touch and stay).
Nick
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Russell wrote you could at least work out a minimum radius of curvature
OK - what I will do is find out the tunnel width.
Then I'll assume that we offload the objecty just before the tunnel and
walk it through with the object rotated 90 degrees through the long axis.
I'll do as you suggest and
Ok - my initial drawings, using JOSM and a tunnel width of 3 metres show
that this could end up being a matter of inches. I really have to find out
exact dimensions of the object and whether there is any flexability in it
so that we could bend it around the tunnel.
Also, if two tunnels are such a
Hi ben
http://tools.geofabrik.de/osmi/debug.html?view=routing_non_eulon=150.82846lat=-33.7503zoom=15opacity=0.98
gets the routing outside europe ( I had the same problem and went looking
for this url)
.
http://keepright.ipax.at/report_map.php?schema=50error=38081608
paints an even gloomier
Ben wrote
'Classic. You know you've got an OSM addiction problem when... '
What!! - I've only got 28 GPS units, at last count :-)
Actually, with so many unit on me when I ride the bike (3 or 4) I thought
I'd try to see if they interfered with each other. I believe this is why
some airlines
Grant wrote Have you noticed faster tiles this week?
Certainly have.Many thanks Kris
Ive just spent 5 hours editing in my mapping travels from today so the
faster tile server really helped out. It is really fast.
Ive also been fixing hundreds of keep right errors in Canberra, so Fast
Stephen wrote
there is now a need for using mini-roundabout in Australia.
I always like to simplify things (maybe too much sometimes).
How about If the approaches to the intersection/junction have
roundabout signs then it is a roundabout, roundabout laws apply and we
should tag it
Stephen wrote
I'd be just a happy to use a normal roundabout way, and mark it as
traversable with traversable=yes
Yes - an excellent suggestion.
Nick
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Great day mapping - tons of new roads (all virgin OSM) and some fixes to
recent mappings as well.
It goes to show that rechecking others' mapping will usually help improve
the quality of the map. I'm pretty sure that I've made a few mistakes in
today's mappings, so hopefully someone can check
Hi Brett,
You've just said a *really controversial phrase (mini roundabouts).
In Australia there is a *LOT* of history surrounding these things.
I do have a definite opinion on them but I reckon it would be best (if not
unbearably tedious) for you to read the many vitiolic posts on this
In honour of my imminent return to frenzy mapping, I thought I'd make a
claim for this record.
A few weeks ago I cul de sac mapped most of Thurgona driving a Mazda RX8
with a stolen push bike sitting on top of it.
(black grey Trek 4300 Disc).
I did have to make sure I didn't go around corners
John wrote Turn off the snap to road feature to avoid copying the
existing map.
Absolutely.
On some of the older Garmin Nuvi's if you had the snap to road option on
then the track log would still be the actual gps readings, but on my newest
one the track log also snaps to the road .
Excellent,
I think I have time to get from the Airport to my hotel then back to the
mapping party by 10 am.
I want to attend the first session so that I can then do some serious
gadget shopping. Unfortunately the gadgets I really want have probably not
been made yet.
1) A GPS navigator wrist
Ok - I have put the VIC/TAS border back to the correct latitude and moved
Boundary Islet down to straddle it.
Since I have no way of knowing where the border is, in relation to
the island, I have given Victoria four times as much of it as Tasmania (in
relation to their relative areas).
I'm hoping
Hi Brett,
Earlier today view was on the blink (error on page) but seems ok now,
though I'm on a different computer.
I don't get any couldn't load errors but maybe I'm not doing the same
things as you,
Nick
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Leon wrote
Was looking at Victoria/Tasmania border and I have a feeling it's not
quite right in OSM.
Hi Leon,
Yes, embarrasingly I've put the border on the wrong Island.
In my defence - the 39.2 latitude passess about 160 metres south of
Boundary Islet according to both Bing and Google
Michael wrote
OK, I have just imported the missing parts of the ACT border (changeset
#12765494).
Looks good Michael,
I have moved some points on the straight bit using information from some of
my GPS traces. One spot where my GPS traces don't indicate the border is on
the extension to Hugh
John wrote
the border follows this fence-line (at least in
the vicinity of the gate):
Thanks John
I've moved the border closer to the gate, keeping the gate in NSW and the
trail in ACT. The border looks a bit crooked to me now, I'll have to do
some more work on it in a couple of weekends time.
Ben wrote
Does anyone else have thoughts about school zones
Hi Ben,
In South Australia, I've seen school zone signs that say Max 20 KPH, when
children are present
Now - that's going to be hard to tag :-)
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OK - I've just completed the arduous task of reinstating the complete
Victoria/Tasmania border!
Also I'll check out the S.A Victoria border to see if it conforms with the
disputed area.
Nick
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Mark wrote Can someone help with a couple of these in the ACT?
Certainly can, I'll drive them tonight and/or tomorrow morning and we'll
get them them sorted out.
From memory the routes diverge near the circles and we have to take ALT 23
into account as well.
Cheers
Nick
Ok - I've just driven 23 and 52 and Alt 23 (well not the entire lengths of
course).
Southbound 23 (the signs never say NR or NH, just 23 in a shield) comes
down Commonwealth Avenue swings left into Capital Circle (not State Circle)
then onto Canberra Avenue. At Monaro Highway it turns right and
The version1 level 10 ABS boundaries have now been removed.
Now when you see a red way you know that it does indeed need
work on it.
If you use a mapnik rendering (whether Bing maps or
openstretmap.org) the remaining level 10 boundaries show up
well in purple.
These will almost always be of two
Mark wrote
Mark wrote
I haven't looked at all the state borders yet, but some of them at
least are based on ABS data - prior to the ABS import, was there other
data for state borders that can be undeleted, or will we need to add
these in again?
Yes - it's still a very good question.
Once I've
Mark wrote
I don't have an OSM extracts, but there might be another way: undeleting
the old ways.
Thanks Mark,
There is one more consideration which applies to state boundaries and
coastlines.
Some CT-agreers have put in a lot of hard work actually surveying and
improving these borders after
Mark wrote
I haven't looked at all the state borders yet, but some of them at
least are based on ABS data - prior to the ABS import, was there other
data for state borders that can be undeleted, or will we need to add
these in again?
That's a very good question.
The coastline in particular has
Mike wrote
I also want to check what happens when
an accepting user has subsequently made changes over the top.
Yes Mike this is the real problem. If we just revert a decliner edit
then all acceptor edits after that will go up in smoke. Whereas I
believe that in the licence change the DWG will
Hi all,
Whilst cleaning up Canberra I have been very careful to remap everything
that I have deleted either from my own survey or Bing or both.
I also reconnect up everything - though I'm sure keep right will prove
me wrong in 10's of cases.
However some areas of Canberra are so well endowed
PS - quite a few declines spent a lot of time just tracing from
nearmap but never bothered to go out and collect the information
on the ground such as street names etc.
Most of this is still untagged and since it will disappear in
April and needs survey anyway, maybe me should delete them
now
If a decliner splits a ,mappers road then he/she becomes the version 1
owner of that mappers copyrightable information for the rest of the way.
I think it's morally (maybe even legally) wrong for the decliner to now
extinguish this copyright by refusing to relicence it.
Since I think it unlikely
David wrote
I can always retag from my records after the split
Hi David,
It does seem that most of your work will survive.
Those maxspeed edits done by bots (under the userid of
JohnSmith or Rosscoe) will disappear without harm in April.
A lot of them are incorrect so the accuracy of the OSM
Ben,
It appears that ABS data that is inland may connect to the coastline
but doesn't continue along it with the same way.
Therefore I'm pretty sure that if you are carefull not to actually click
on the coastline at all, then you will be quite safe.
Happy cleaning
Nick
Ben wrote
I'm particularly worried about large slabs of coastline disappearing.
Ben,
I'm avoiding touching the coastline since it does not get in my way for
remapping roads and since I don't want
to flood all of australia :-).
I'll have a pretend delete session of ABS ways near coastlines
Hi,
Whilst replacing tainted data with good data (in areas that I have
personally surveyed), I'm
sure that I have broken some relations.
So firstly, apologies to the guy/s in Canberra that have done some
magnificant work with
relations here.
I have been attempting to fix any relations that I
Alex wrote
The data.gov.au ODbL re-licencing means we could reimport the ACT bus
route relations from:
Thanks Alex, yes that's a bit of a relief. I'll still try to fix them as
I break then since it's good practice
but I guess we should import them periodically anyway to remain current.
Nick
Ian Wrote Regardless, I'm sure your remapping will be superior.
Absolutely agree - on the ground mapping from someone in the business is
as good as it can get. It will always be spot on accurate and also
up-to-date.
I'd remap Canberra Railway station except that they are going to shove it
out
Hi John,
For towns that I have completely suryeyed, I will be remapping roads, as
necessary to ensure that my survey work is not lost to the project.
These roads will be completely replaced by my original data, maybe with
some help from Bing imagery where it will help
improve the accuracy of my
Ross wrote The originator of the bot made a mistake with this and was
going to fix it
but the pre licence change lockout prevented this
Ross, that's not my understanding of the situation at all.
On 25 August 2010 14:40, Ross Scanlon info at 4x4falcon.com wrote:
John are you going to do
Richard wroteHi Nick,
I see several approaches available here:
- ask the bot owner to accept
- revert the bot work
- ask for help reverting (typically others in the community or DWG)
- argue convincingly on legal talk that the maxspeed bot and bots in
general don't have rights to decline
Ben wrote
The content of these edits is in the public domain (I.e. the default
residential speed limit in Australia) and these edits could be re-edited
by an actual bot. Given that these edits are easy to identify, and the
large number of ways, this might be a useful exercise. It would give us a
Luke Wrote
I've backed you up on that one. All removed! I have no idea what their
logic is behind (wrongly) mapping non-separated turning lanes in the first
place!
Hi Luke,
Do you think that he may be upset at losing the railway station naming edit
war a while back and may be trying to get his
Ben wrote...
Well it's not accepted by me - IMHO you just need some more tags to express
the information you want:
At this years SOTM there was a brilliant talk about OSM Landmarks.
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/SotM_2011_session:_Landmarks_in_OSM
(unfortunately I can't find the online
Ian wrote
-
I started a thread on talk a while ago about how to handle this situation,
but it went nowhere, with the thread (as usual) hijacked to talk about
licencing issues
Someone wrote
Yep. A one-way street mapped as a two-way street is better than nothing.
To me this statement absoluetly defines the difference between people who
just want to see lots of lines on the map and people who want to actually
use the map for navigation.
Many moons ago I was driving on
Steve Bennett wrote
Or maybe the difference between people who think all navigation
takes place on four wheels and the rest of us.
It's interesting that you choose to use the I presume to speak for lots of
other people and imply that there are way more of us than there are or you
approach.
If
Ben wrote
AFAIK there is no PD source of postcode data.
The vibes I was getting, and of course I may have misinterpreted these, are
that if we made any sort of decent case that the current ABS data, as
imported into OSM is of some benifit in respect to disaster preparedness
and/or disaster
Despite the danger of imports turnimg OSM into a dumping ground of
substandard out-of-date data, there is (In Australia's case) some very good
data that could be imported.
Someone told me that currently, due to the recent disasters (fire and
flood), mapping for disaster preparedness and response
Hi Ben,
I'm sure all the avid tracersout there will deny this,but, I believe that
this is the downside to tracing. Once an area looks well mapped, there is
little incentive for anyone to go there to map it properly. I'd really like
it if all roads that don't have names yet (in OSM) were just
Steve, or anyone...
In Bing maps mapnik style when I try to search for a streetname, it does not
seem to search the OSM data at all.
Am I doing something wrong?
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David wrote
Just a quick note that my understanding is those figures are generated
based on v1 history, none of the bot edits would have been v1 unless
they created a new entity, not just a new/modified tag.
David, you may be right although I took Richard's nodes last edited to
mean the latest
Matt,
I hope Nearmap continue to use OSM data. I only wish that they updated it a
bit more often.
That Way (for areas they cover that I don't get to regularly) I can spot new
roads that need a visit to survey properly.
Cheers
Nick
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Hi Steve,
Yes, I've got my tickets to SOTM and I hope you bring all your hats with
you.
In my spare time I develop some specialised applications for various
sports/pastimes and I think OSM can be useful for some of these.
I develop in Basic4PPC but the creators of this product can't make it work
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