Michael, he is looking for legitimate topics, not bogus ones. I don't know when
the last time you danced in NYC was, but I have never seen or experienced the
women you describe. Women have no problem dancing with whomever they want, and
turning men down, especially since men outnumber women at
I cant believe people are dredging up these old nuevo debates, must be trying
intentionally to revive list thru antangonistic postings. There is no such
thing as Nuevo, there is only good or bad dancing, given the circumstances
(performance or social) and partner, spacing, music, etc. I doubt
lol, yes, i was more than a wee bit over the top, cant help it, that's
how i roll :) obsessive/compulsive about everything, especially tango.
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Lois, i agree with you about what makes a tango scene special. I would
add to that really friendly dancers and welcoming hosts who make you
feel at home. I found both of those in Boulder, as well as places to
dance, such as the Avalon Ballroom and the Cochabamba Norte Practica.
Even though the
Not expecting to convince anyone, so this is my last post on this topic,
and I am preaching to the choir for the several who have agreed with me
in private, unsure why they don't post to the list.May I propose an
experiment to those who consider music a distraction to learning dance.
In the
I understand your position, Michael, but I respectfully disagree with
your conclusion. The music helps one understand the figure. The human
brain is a marvelous mechanism that has the evolved the ability to use
multiple references to anchor a memory, including the visual details of
where the
I am really shocked when I read comments like Michael's who said he
doesnt understand why music is played in class, for the alleged reason
that it intereferes with his ability to learn the figure. This suggests
that he believes executing the figure itself is more important than
placing it in the
Hard to believe there are still people propogating this old canard
again. The best dancers in the world, many of whom I've taken classes
with and spoken to, use both, depending on the size and speed of the
step, the direction, the dynamic effect sought, and they will tell you
it's a matter of
Totally disagree with all those who want to isolate tango instruction
from the music. The only reason to dance IS the music. If not, just
take up tai chi, or contact improv, or partner yoga, why bother with
tango. The student should learn the feel of the steps, the technique,
and the
Michael, we shall continue the conversation in NY when you get here. To
put it simply, If there is no music, there is no dance. If there is no
music, there is no tango. You can also learn how to dance by studying
ballet. But we are reading this list because we dance tango, not ballet.
Nothing in
This is a response to the clip mario posted and the question he asked.
The lead and follow are being executed through the variation in the
compression from the floor through the frame to the partner. When the
leader wants the partner to move her axis, from point a to point b, he
indicates that
Eero, you stole my copyrighted tango karma phrase and gave it to charles
!
-Martin
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There is another problem with elitism that hasnt been discussed yet, and
that is typecasting. I have had the following experience in NYC, but it
may be universal. Lets say some nights I'm feeling in a better mood than
others, feeling genenrous, I want to spread good tango karma, give back
, they would dance with you, even after
your newbie dance?
Gordon
- Original Message -
From: Nussbaum, Martin mnuss...@law.nyc.gov
Date: Thursday, February 3, 2011 2:04 pm
Subject: [Tango-L] Elitism
To: tango-l@mit.edu
There is another problem with elitism that hasnt been discussed yet
Sandhill, i've had that disconcerting experience. i learned that i can
avoid the unintended volcada of those followers so inclined to do it
(pun intended) if i remember to relax the embrace just a bit right
before her forward step, to remove any implication that i might be
supporting her weight
Youtube, and the internet in general, is and will be the single biggest
thing to happen to Tango, and all performing arts, in history. Way
bigger than radio and TV as a game changer. Based on my personal
experience of 13 years in tango, I completely disagree with Charles.
There is a lot to be
Jack Dyland wrote: I've never been rejected since
because, if the girl doesn't want to dance with me, she won't make
eye-contact. That's the beauty of the cabeceo for the man?- no more
rejections.
What do you call it when you cababceo the woman, she meets your eyes and
painfully slowly
Ah Niki, come to nyc, where the gender imbalance is in your favor!
Entonces, most leaders here are very aggressive in trying to get tandas.
Not only will they use verbal invites, but some, pretending to be
gallant but really coming off as boorish, will even interrupt your
conversations,
Here is a NYC dancer who loves vocals in his tango. Never noticed
anything whiny, so if i heard it im sure it doesnt bother me. Vocals
give me more emotion, nuance to express, even though i dont understand
a word of it, I feel it. In fact, not understanding the Spanish is
actually a plus for
Trini wrote, Really, I don't get this convolution of Sergio's simple
statement about stepping on the beat.
I orifginally objected because that is misleading to beginners and
retards their musicality.
come now, Trini, i am sure you dont step only on the beat. Have you
ever watched a roomful of
Sergio wrote: What you cannot do is to step off the beat.
If he meant this literally, I respectfully disagree, and I wonder which
part of the beat he is talking about. I also have observed many great
tango dancers and teachers over the years, and most of them will play
with the rhythm of a
Sharukh writes that colgadas are new. I believe they were done forever,
in a smaller scale, anytime you have a stop (parada) and a passing over
step (posada), there is a moment, however brief, where the follower is
off axis. Particularly if you were in close embrace when you did this,
as the
Milonga/Practica Review: Tuesday night at Cochabamba Milonga/Practica
with Gustavo Naveira was an incredible night, and possibly a
game-changing event, for tango in NYC. Due to the high number of
excellent dancers in the room, the energy and vibe were electrified.
There was a feeling of
Don't take it back, Jack! You partner is not a statistically valid
sample. Most sensitive followers will synchronize breathing with you
during pauses, suspension and release, and its wonderful.
Of course, I am assuming you do not breathe as loud as a horse. But she
cant help but sense your
Bettina seems to regard copying as bad; Im not so sure. One must have
the tools before one can create. jazz musicians transcribe solos of the
giants before they create their own, same with art students I see at the
met sketching a winslow homer.
most great artists in every field are very aware
Trini wrote - Nuevo tango looks fine when done to Piazzolla. It doesn't
look very good with D'Arienzo or DiSarli ...
Trini, surely you jest. I am sure you have seen Chicho dance to
Darienzo ( the famous youtube clip at la viruta with Lucia, I believe),
and Gustavo dance to Disarl. IMHO, the
I disagree with these guys, especially for social dance. Guys who stick
out their left arm greater than 90 degrees, or 135 as huck suggests,
yikes! , or even wider as I've seen in fashion lately, are an accident
waiting to happen for some unlucky person, like an illegal clothesline
tackle in
side step is simply one type of open step. However clearly not all
open steps are side steps, so IMO it's valuable to discuss the
properties and use of side steps as a special case of open steps.
Sidesteps are a sub-species of open steps, but not a special case ,
treating it as such needlessly
forgot to mention that in the first line of last post i was quoting jay
rabe, who was critiquing my post of the other day,
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Sorry I did not reply to Damian and jack last Thursday post sooner, I
was in Montreal for the fest.
Jack Dylan quoted Damian, and said,
Another thing - everyone seems to agree on the mantra ...there are
3 possible steps and there are only 3. Forward, backward and sideward.
Damian asked should
Sergey says a friend of his came up with 1000 sacadas? Please show
them to me.
From a pure sturcutral anlaysis, by my calculation there are only 48.
Here is my analysis:
Lets start with leader doing sac to follower. There are only 3 steps
involving full weight shift for follower in tango.
You are double counting some of these. For example, on her right open
step, if you do right front sac to her departing left foot, it is open,
if you use your left foot, you are crossed.
Yikes, I had not considered using both feet at the same time. I
actually have seen Chicho do that on
I have that shirt in lots of colors. The style is a bit old fashioned,
conservative boxy american cut. And i wish it were made in a thinner
fabric. Great for travel, it does not wrinkle even when jammed intoa
backpack. If you wear it unbuttoned, untucked, with a contrasting
color T, it
Klaus, I think you should aim higher than the leader in the clips you
chose.
Musical? Yes.
Smooth? Absolutely.
Connected? ... maybe, but he might as well have been dancing foxtrot.
His right palm was on the followers left rib in most of the sequences I
viewed, keeping a four-square ballroom
Mario, I agree that appears to be a minimalist style; although he does
get a little more animated toward the end. First, lets me say
something nice about them- This is fine social dancing, esp for a
crowded floor, and the posture is superb. But, is this an interesting
performance? If
Megan wrote, I had the feeling that he walked away thinking, Cecilia
gave me such a warm smile!
Trust me, that is not what he was thinking. He was feeling rejected.
And it was not such a warm rejection. A warm rejection is when the woman
says, thank you for asking, I am resting, ask me another
Jack Dylan asked about the reason for the 30 seconds that seems idle
chit chat after the music starts. Here's is one possible explanation
that comes to my mind, I am sure there are others.
It goes along with the BA tradition of clearing the floor during the
cortina, which has other obvious
Astrid wrote: The man to who this happens probably also does not know
how to lead ochos with his chest instead of his hand, otherwise he could
easily stop her movement.
Not so simple. The followers who go on auto pilot ochos are invariably
beginners who do not wish to dance in close embrace,
Sometimes you engage the embrace in the frame and it is felt in the
followers right hand, sometimes less. What others call muscle tone.
For example, in a rebote, you would engage not tense up, the frame so
she knows it will be a rebote vs a boleo. In a counterclockwise giro,
my left hand creates
I agree with all of Michaels tips except this one:
5) Maintain good posture by keeping the hips back so the chest comes
forward. (This is NOT the same thing as bending forward from the
waist.)
Rather than emphasize the hips back, which might lead to a sway back and
bad curvature of the spine, I
Bibi wrote: not aware of a tango community that tangueros out-number
tangueras. Educate me if I am wrong.
I am beginning to suspect this oft repeated refrain is a female ruse to
keep other women out of tango.
Well, since you asked, Bibi... In NYC, at most of the milongas by about
11pm, you
Look at :27-:50 in the clip you attached. He does walk directly in
front of her feet, ie his right in front of her left, when he walks
straight ahead in parallel system. Of course, when he switches to cross
system, its different.
flame wrote:
The point of referring to the length of
Bruno, the embrace used in the Chicho Poema clip is known as a V
embrace. It is actually used quite a lot by traditional salon dancers,
as well as more modern masters, such as Gustavo. It is much more
versatile than the flat-on, chest on chest embrace, in that transitions
and turns that might
Victor, I am not sure what you mean by calling chicho and gustavo too
polished, unless that means they dance very well. The example you
showed from practica x was, in comparison, like robotic stick figures
without any soul. Before you go calling Chicho too old for nuevo, I
think you should
Okay Krasimir, the second piece in this improv by Gustavo/Giselle is
done to the same music you selected in your clip. I think the G/G clip
is so much more interesting, so much more musical, and so much more
emotional than the Peralta clip you selected, it blows it out of the
water.
. But that leader certainly does not do her skills justice, nor
does he compare to her usual partner, Ney.
-Original Message-
From: Astrid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 12:16 PM
To: Nussbaum, Martin; tango-l@mit.edu
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Victor, chicho, the real tango
:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 12:16 PM
To: Nussbaum, Martin; tango-l@mit.edu
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] Victor, chicho, the real tango, practica X
Victor, I am not sure what you mean by calling chicho and gustavo too
polished, unless that means they dance very well. The example
Janis writes that Gustavo is missing the essence the music. I have to
believe something in the interview she refers to was taken out of
context or lost in translation, or perhaps a statement he made lamenting
a state of affairs was misconstrued as an approval. Janis, have you
ever taken a week
I disagree with Lois, Trini and Buffis, at least with regards to
milonga in NYC. Luckily I have a fantastic regular partner / follower
who loves milonga traspie as much as I do, and mirrors my fascination
with Javier/Geraldine youtubes, or I would be one very repressed dancer.
Most women here do
maybe not ... seem to remember either Jack lemmon or his partner with
the rose in mouth in Some Like It Hot, which being within the viewing
lifetimes of more dancers today than Four Forsemen, probably reinforced
the image. what im curious about is the genesis of the silly head snap
the public
Tip one: come to NYC. Unlike other cities I travel to, here most
milongas have more male leaders than female followers. There are also
more female leaders than there are male followers, which makes the
gender imbalance even worse, as it takes two eligible women out of
circulation. Through
Igor asked about the difference. I am sure he knows boleos, so I am
posting at the risk of a retort claiming they are both technically
boleos, but here goes:
I think of leading boleos in two ways:
1.by moving my torso and frame with the womans pivot, in the
same direction either
or a follow. Not sure which festivals Ceverett attends, but I
have never seen a festival class which was skewed the way he says.
-Original Message-
From: Deby Novitz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 9:24 PM
To: Nussbaum, Martin
Cc: tango-l@mit.edu
Subject: buenos
With many more women than men, he can dance with who he wants.
Ahh, let's raise a toast to the good life. This makes me think of taking
early retirement and moving to BA. :). Sounds like tango heaven for
this mid-life male dancer in NYC, where the number of skilled leaders
outnumbers the
Nina wrote:
If someone had offered me to do a few milongas, I am not sure I would
have answered it any differently than this woman. :)Language holds
power. Never underestimate the power of seduction (salesmanship,
persuasion). This is an example of a failed sales attempt. The man had
2
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