My current comments in red below.
- Original Message -
From:
Dave Hansen
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 2:41
AM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Question
Regarding Covenants & Salvation
The fact that they had
not even hear
ry 27, 2006 9:48 AM
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] Question Regarding Covenants & Salvation
Note that law allows for contracts to be enforceable even without a signature if
it is clear that an agreement was made orally as per the things stated in
the contract.
DAVEH: Th
The fact that they had
not even heard of the Holy Ghost told Paul that something was wrong here.
He knew already that they had been baptized, and apparently he had assumed
that they had been baptized in the name of Jesus.
DAVEH: Yes indeed.Paul knew that something was extremely wrong
DaveH wrote:
> It seems obvious (to me) that whoever baptized them
> did not have the proper authority. If faith were the
> pivotal factor, why would they need to be rebaptized?
Because their faith was not in Jesus Christ when they were baptized. The
problem was not authority. The problem was
9:48
AM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Question
Regarding Covenants & Salvation
Note that law allows for contracts to be enforceable even without a signature if
it is clear that an agreement was made orally as per the things stated in
the contract.DAVEH: That is not necessarily
Note that law allows for contracts to be enforceable even without a signature if
it is clear that an agreement was made orally as per the things stated in
the contract.
DAVEH: That is not necessarily true, DavidM. Real estate contracts
are a real world exception. And I suspect that wil
With the Father in heaven.
DAVEH: Hmm...I did not expect that to be your answer.
it seems to me that you perceive the authority of the
one who does the baptizing as being very important.
DAVEH: Yes. From our previous discussions, you may remember that I
view the rebaptism by Pau
DaveH wrote:
> Do you feel that the OT sacrificial rites were
> similarly relatedthat is, were signs of a
> covenant? If so, why do you think they needed
> to be replicated?
No, I view the sacrificial rites of the Sinai covenant were not signs of the
covenant, but rather elements of the cove
DAVEH:
> With who do you think was Jesus making a covenant?
With the Father in heaven. John the Baptist was a forerunner of the new
convenant that would come through Jesus. His baptism prepared the way by
helping people understand the elements of entering into this new covenant.
Therefore, hi
I believe that a covenant sign is
one reason that Jesus was himself baptized by John.
DAVEH: With who do you think was Jesus making a covenant?
baptism has
other purposes as well,
DAVEH: With Jesus' baptism, was the reason not the primary reason to
fulfill righteousness?
David Miller w
DAVEH: Again, thanx for the explanation. Do you feel that the OT
sacrificial rites were similarly relatedthat is, were signs of a
covenant? If so, why do you think they needed to be replicated?
David Miller wrote:
DaveH wrote:
Do you view circumcision in a similar light
as
DaveH wrote:
> Do you view circumcision in a similar light
> as baptism...it being a covenant?
Yes, I view it in a similar light, but I would not use the words you used,
"it being a covenant." Circumcision is a sign of the convenant, actually
used for more than one covenant in history (both Abr
DAVEH: Once again, I thank you for your thoughtful answer, DavidM. Do
you view circumcision in a similar light as baptism...it being a
covenant? (A short answer is acceptableno need to elaborate.)
David Miller wrote:
DaveH wrote:
What other (other than baptism) ways do
you
DaveH wrote:
> What other (other than baptism) ways do
> you see as ratifying the covenant?
Well, in the case of Abraham, there was a blood covenant. So that would be
one other way there. With Jacob, there was wrestling with God. In terms of
coming into a relationship with Jesus, the waters o
DAVEH: Thanx for explaining this, DavidM. It does bring up another
question though. What other (other than baptism) ways do you see as
ratifying the covenant?
David Miller wrote:
DAVEH:
As you probably know, I associate baptism with
such a covenant. How do you perceive it?
DAVEH:
> As you probably know, I associate baptism with
> such a covenant. How do you perceive it?
Yes, I view it the same way. However, I view baptism as the standard
expression of faith for ratifying the covenant, not as the only way of
ratifying the covenant. In fact, baptism without faith
DAVEH: As you probably know, I associate baptism with such a
covenant. How do you perceive it? (The covenant, that is.) And, do
you know if many Protestants believe in personal covenants relating to
salvation as well? (My guess is that they don't, and that you may be
the odd duck on this o
No
- Original Message -
From:
Dave Hansen
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: January 23, 2006 10:18
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Question
Regarding Covenants & Salvation
DAVEH: You are losing me with that comment, Lance.
Do you not believe the Lord m
ssage -
From:
Dave
Hansen
To:
TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent:
January 23, 2006 09:47
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] Question Regarding Covenants & Salvation
DAVEH: The Lord made personal covenants with Abraham.
Lance Muir wrote:
Sent:
January 23, 2006 01:25
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] Question Regarding Covenants & Salvation
DAVEH: The Lord made covenants with groups of people
(Israelites, for instance). I was trying to distinguish that kind of
(group) covenant with that of a pers
DAVEH: My comment about Abraham in a parallel post is an example of
personal covenants. Is this concept foreign to Protestants?
Lance Muir wrote:
Please expand on 'personal covenant' DH.
Subject: [TruthTalk] Question Regarding Covenants & Salvation
DAVEH: I would appreciate hearing fro
DAVEH: The Lord made personal covenants with Abraham.
Lance Muir wrote:
Who other than Israelites?
-
Original Message -
From:
Dave
Hansen
To:
TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent:
January 23, 2006 01:25
Subject:
Re: [TruthTalk] Question
DaveH wrote:
> Do you feel that there is a personal covenant
> associated with salvation?
Yes.
David Miller
--
"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know
how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org
If you do not want t
Please expand on 'personal covenant' DH.
- Original Message -
From: "Dave Hansen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "TruthTalk"
Sent: January 23, 2006 00:16
Subject: [TruthTalk] Question Regarding Covenants & Salvation
DAVEH: I would appreciate hearing from any TTers who would like to share
Who other than Israelites?
- Original Message -
From:
Dave Hansen
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: January 23, 2006 01:25
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Question
Regarding Covenants & Salvation
DAVEH: The Lord made covenants with groups of pe
DAVEH: The Lord made covenants with groups of people (Israelites, for
instance). I was trying to distinguish that kind of (group) covenant
with that of a personal covenant that the Lord would make with an
individual. Does that make sense, John?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Maybe. Exactly wh
Maybe. Exactly what is a personal covenant, DH?
jd
-- Original message -- From: Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > DAVEH: I would appreciate hearing from any TTers who would like to > share their thoughts with me about the relationship between personal > covenants and sal
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