> However, the idea that Muslims should somehow be "cleaning their own house" > and taking care of these guys is stupid.
Hmm...maybe..but the pressure on some of them who do think differently to conform is quite great. I felt that from one of the friends I mentioned in my post. Somewhere during the third year, one of them lost his mother. There was so much guilt drilled into him that after he came back a few weeks later, he completely quit drinking and smoking. Started doing namaz religiosly and going to the prayer every Friday (we usually were sleeping after a heavy lunch or used the long lunch break to take the rest of the day off and the weekend started early). And he avoided hanging out with us, and moved with the other Muslims more. I realize these are isolated incidents, and exceptions aren't the rule, but then exceptions are a clue. The alternative to some of the more progressive Muslims leading the change is that we wait till the free market economy and capitalism hits them hard enough that they are more concerned with making money and living the good life that religion takes a back seat in their overall psyche (simplistic, but there has to be some motivators?). That madrassa reformed kid I mentioned was a normal, school going kid. The family itself was not very well off, but they were doing OK. And they were very nice people. Their daughters (or at least one of them) were doing professional degrees in engineering (which are the most competitive to get admissions to) which is quite rare in Kerala Muslims in similar economic strata. So, basically I don't get it. I don't think we can compare them to the Vikings. And I don't think this is just history repeating itself. And forcing change (through military or other means) from the outside might only result in making matters worse (as evidenced in recent efforts) and maybe if nurtured from within, it might have better results? Kiran