At the bottom of the Royal Mile, Edinborrraaacccggghh? Maybe we'll stay there instead of the mid-mile unsprinklered fiasco, where they didn't learn from the mistakes of others!
glc -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Stewart Kidd Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 8:15 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Reasons to not sprinkler a pharmaceutical plant Franz The mention of the underground parking also rings bells ! Recent tests for the UK government suggest that the likelihood of fire spread from vehicle to vehicle is much greater than previouslyb thought and the fuel load of modern cars is rated at around 7Mw ! Stewart PS Currently installing a mist system in a 16th century former Scottish royal palace - should be complete by July. If you want to have a look let me know On 14 May 2009, at 13:12, George Church wrote: > Being a sprinkler guy, I don't know that many pharmaceuticals that > aren't > sprinklered since we only hang around ones that are! > > However, I can relay that back about 25 years ago we retrofit a > 100,000 sf > existing mfg building on a large pharmaceutical campus that had a > 30,000 SF > clean room area (DIPA) for a rather phenomenal amount of money. > > The largest hazard was the plastic containers, but the decision to > sprinkler > the building came after a small plant renovation project erupted > into a > fireball when some flammables deposited (inadvertently)as a coating > caught > from a welder. I don't recall there being fatalities, but certainly > dirty > underwear for anyone within a 100 feet of it. Management realized > the risk > to life in addition to the experienced (and what could have been > much worse > potentially) BI. Once they decided to do it, there was no pushback > on cost, > suggestions to omit AS in any areas, etc. believe me, retrofitting > operating > sterile mfg operation ain't cheap. 3 levels of gowning, so you lost > almost > an hour for a p. All material washed down with alcohol in an airlock, > washdown the scissors, power machine, pretty much everything but the > blueprints. Pull the tape measure out completely and swab it down as > it > retracts. > > In this same building a few years later, a change in the machinery > had us > installing a head with exposed piping, SS316, maybe 10' with a > couple 90's, > and our NTE price was $5k. Brought it in for $3500 and they were > happy. > > So while this isn't exactly what you asked for, here's a drugmaker > that > originally elected to NOT sprinkler in I think the 1960's, had an > OOPS that > could have been a lot worse, and when they realized the exposure, they > didn't hesitate to do all it took to bring it up to the level of > safety that > should have been in place originally- at a much lower price. > > The cleaning crew that followed our weekend shift in the sterile > area missed > a little bit and they had to dump the first shift following's > production; I > believe it was $250,000 of drugs down the drain. Expensive cleaning > crew QC, > eh? > > They're smart if they learn from the mistakes of others, and save > some money > and do it right the first time. > > George Church > Rowe Sprinkler > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Frans > Stoop > Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 8:27 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Reasons to not sprinkler a pharmaceutical plant > > Dear colleagues, > > Here is a peculiar question: > A pharmaceutical company is planning to build a new plant with > laboratories for production and quality control, offices and an > underground parking level. > The top floor is for HVAC. > The main process is waterbased, although, like any other laboratory, > there small quantities of flammable liquids present. > The flammable liquids will be stored in fire cabinets. > We already convinced the company's management that sprinkler is the > way to go for the obvious reasons: life safety, preservation of > property, continuity of operations, etc. > Maybe we advised them too good: > Now the management wonders why not all pharmaceutical plants are > sprinklered throughout. > > I'm composing a list of unsprinklered pharmaceutical facilities with > the reason why the decision makers in concern have chosen not to > sprinkler. > Can you help me with examples of such sites, (parts of) plants or > rooms and the reasoning? > > By the way, this question from our client is not as peculiar as it > looks like at first sight. > It is just a known method of decision making. > It might lead to the decision to protect some rooms or parts of the > building otherwise (with gas, pre-action sprinkler e.g.). > > Frans Stoop > TOS architecture & fire protection > Netherlands <[email protected]> > Tel. +31-24-324 0112 > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
