Would have to be approved by local AHJ and not really designed for an area with 
a finished ceiling.  Interesting product but stills has limited listing.

Craig L. Prahl, CET   
Fire Protection 
CH2MHILL
Lockwood Greene
1500 International Drive
Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
Direct - 864.599.4102
Fax - 864.599.8439
CH2MHILL Extension  74102
[email protected]



-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Matt Grise
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 2:08 PM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Design solution needed

As long as they are not too worried about cost you could try a vortex system 
from Victaulic. They don't need much water, electricity, or space. They are 
expensive though! I am also not sure what the lead time is on one.

On the plus side: they are very cool.

Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP 
Sales Engineer 
Alliance Fire Protection 
130 w 9th Ave.
North Kansas City, MO 64116

*Licensed in KS & MO 

913.888.0647 ph 
913.888.0618 f 
913.927.0222 cell 
www. AFPsprink.com 

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] 
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ron Greenman
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 1:02 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Design solution needed

Craig,

It's not. I just confused myself. I was trying to do something that
works really well in a different situation. I was just going down the
bigger pipe size in the system line when the whole problem is the
restricted pipe at the beginning. Have you figured the loss at a very
short run (since we have no idea about 10, 50, or 1000 feet)? I'm
having a bad math day.

On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 10:49 AM,  <[email protected]> wrote:
> How is making bigger holes on the discharge end going to change the velocity 
> in the 1.25" service pipe if the flow is a constant?
>
> Craig L. Prahl, CET
> Fire Protection
> CH2MHILL
> Lockwood Greene
> 1500 International Drive
> Spartanburg, SC  29304-0491
> Direct - 864.599.4102
> Fax - 864.599.8439
> CH2MHILL Extension  74102
> [email protected]
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] 
> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ron Greenman
> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2011 1:38 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Design solution needed
>
> With this little pipe velocity is the problem. I'm using the bigger
> holes to require less pressure at the end head and so slow the water
> down that's passing through the narrow pipe. Given the restriction of
> the pipe and the constant calculated demand of 0.15/X (900 or 1500)
> this may do nothing but my in head estimator isn't well calibrated
> either.
>
> On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 10:09 AM, Morey, Mike <[email protected]> wrote:
>> K8 heads could actually penalize his design in the OH-I area couldn't they?  
>> 7 psi minimum end head dictates 14ish GPM out of a k5.6, even at 130 sq ft 
>> going to a K8 head would actually cause him to discharge more GPM than the 
>> density requires (at least using my not particularly well calibrated 
>> internal calculator), and GPM as we know is what creates friction loss.  In 
>> the LH area if he spaced the heads out near the limits a K8 will save him 
>> some pressure, but given his water supply that doesn't look to be his 
>> biggest concern.  The big question is how long the 1 1/4" run is in my mind, 
>> if it's short enough you can jump up at the connection, if it isn't then you 
>> don't have a lot of options unless maybe you can squeeze out some area 
>> reductions (QR/Ceiling height reductions if they haven't been considered) 
>> with careful code reading and head selection.
>>
>> Mike Morey, SET
>> Sprinkler Designer
>> BMW Constructors, Inc.
>> O: 317.651.0596 | C: 317.439.2695
>> www.bmwc.com 
>> <https://owa.bmwc.com/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.bmwc.com>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: [email protected] on behalf of Ron Greenman
>> Sent: Mon 4/4/2011 12:49 PM
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: Re: Design solution needed
>>
>>
>>
>> What K heads are you using. Bigger holes help more than bigger pipes
>> in good pressure/bad water situations. If you're using K5.6 see the
>> huge gain K8.0 will give you. And your moister recent post asked most
>> of the questions I asked just as that left and yours arrived.
>>
>>
>>
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>>
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> Ron Greenman
> Instructor
> Fire Protection Engineering Technology
> Bates Technical College
> 1101 So. Yakima Ave.
> Tacoma, WA 98405
>
> [email protected]
>
> http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/
>
> 253.680.7346
> 253.576.9700 (cell)
>
> Member:
> ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC
>
> They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis
> Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626)
> _______________________________________________
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-- 
Ron Greenman
Instructor
Fire Protection Engineering Technology
Bates Technical College
1101 So. Yakima Ave.
Tacoma, WA 98405

[email protected]

http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/

253.680.7346
253.576.9700 (cell)

Member:
ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC

They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis
Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626)
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