Cited the wrong JSR. Integrating JSR-303 (bean validations) is beyond a hack.
arma...@uwm.edu wrote: > As a developer that has been using Stripes for over 4 years (since 1.3), > I truly have nothing but positive things to say about the framework. > And I agree with many of the sentiments being expressed (needs better > marketing, mostly feature-complete). > > Additionally, my organization is exactly the organization that Ross > described in his e-mail. We are a 3 person development team that has > been using Stripes because it allows us to get things done mostly > without getting in the way. > > I would also like to add that I love the marketing ideas being thrown > around. Currently, it seems very difficult for the average developer to > contribute to the site in any meaningful way. Any improvements would be > welcome. And I would be happy to help with some documentation or articles. > > That all being said, I have some thoughts on features and releases. > > While the project is mostly feature-complete, it feels difficult to > write extensions that are not hackish. For example, the URL writing has > never met my needs for my projects. The default implementation is > probably fine for most people but it incredibly difficult to swap it out > for something else. I mean, I certainly could use a urlrewrite (and > have) but this is ridiculously tedious. I would like to write my own > implementation (act a little more like Rails routes) but don't want to > recreate the wheel (many methods and classes are private or otherwise). > My point is, it is difficult to extend this part of the project. This > is also true for tag renderers and validation (integrating JSR-311 is > beyond a hack). I think ensuring extension points should be one the > major development focuses of the project. It would certainly encourage > more extension development. > > And while I know there hasn't been a releasable version of 1.6 at this > point, I believe that Stripes should be releasing regular previews or > betas. I feel disinclined to checkout and build the latest version of > Stripes and integrate it into one of my projects. However, if > previews/betas that were mostly stable were released, I would certainly > be inclined to download them. Using Rails terminology, I don't want the > edge version but would like the near-edge version. This also has the > benefit of showing development activity. > > Finally, it would be nice to see a true roadmap for the project. I > suppose I can go into JIRA and see what is coming. And while I know the > project feels feature-complete, there should still be some sort of plan. > For me, roadmaps are one of things that help me evaluate a project's > liveliness. > > I know that was a lot but I hope I was not off-base. > > Regards, > Andy > > > Ross Sargant wrote: >> I agree with the sentiment that the framework is basically feature >> complete. I've been a happy user for 2+ years and for the size and scale >> of projects I work on, I'd have to say I have no serious complaints at all. >> >> I've actually appreciated the fact that stripes is such a limited & >> focussed framework and sticks to that. That saves me all the time I'd >> normally have to spend learning the latest bells & whistles myself and >> passing knowledge on to others on my team. It doesn't make any sense for >> stripes to give that virtue up in the hope that the developer activity & >> feature bloat associated with that will somehow attract more users. >> >> My experience with stripes has been that it makes the really tedious >> stuff easy but it doesn't lay down so much that you can't freely apply >> your own creativity where you want. I think that is ideal and if it >> ain't broke, don't fix it. >> >> So,it would seem to me that its the marketing side that needs more >> urgent attention. If the level of activity on the mailing list is at all >> indicative of the number of users then clearly there is an issue but for >> every 1 person who decides not to use stripes due to its slow release >> cycle, there could be 10 people who just don't know about it at all. >> >> I also agree that this is a very high quality mailing list. I *suspect* >> that many on this mailing list hold more senior technical positions in >> smaller organizations and used that position to introduce stripes >> without having to justify it to a commission. That "demographic" is >> probably the best chance for growth and the philosophy behind stripes >> really works in that setting. A simple, reliable thing that is easy to >> learn and helps you get things done. It might not get you full buzzword >> points on your product brochure but you'll definitely sleep well! >> >> Unfortunately, I'm no marketer but I don't mind lending a hand where I >> can :) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Freddy Daoud <xf2...@fastmail.fm >> <mailto:xf2...@fastmail.fm>> wrote: >> >> Hi all, >> >> I have been thinking about this topic for quite some time now and, >> admittedly, have been "avoiding" it.. but now that the discussion has >> been sparked, I can't hide my head in the sand anymore. >> >> I am happy to see the responses to Nikolaos's post. Some very good >> points are made. >> >> Most of these concerns are known to the community, but the problems >> remain: >> >> * the web site is dry and lacks visual appeal. this has been discussed >> time and again and we can't find anyone with the artistic talent, the >> time, and the will to redesign the site. >> >> * development is not as active as it used to be. i think the framework >> has somewhat peaked because it is, for the most part, >> feature-complete. >> >> * my own involvement in the framework has been reduced to answering >> questions on the mailing list. don't get me wrong--i am not claiming >> that i was ever one of the main developers. clearly, Tim and Ben are. >> But, when I was working on the book, I was also developing >> professionally with Stripes, and the two combined made me very >> interested in Stripes' features. A few of the tweaks that made it into >> the 1.5 release were directly related to writing the book. >> >> * more on the previous point: I still develop professionally with >> Stripes, but have not much interest in any major new features. The >> current trunk suits me fine. Any "nice-to-haves" I consider not part >> of the core framework, and I put them in Rayures. >> >> * I fully agree with the full-stack idea. This is what Rayures does. >> In one minute, you can set up a Stripes project that is ready to run >> with Maven, Tomcat plugin, Spring, Hibernate, JPA, Log4J, and TestNG. >> >> * about the lack of developer activity: I think we need some new >> blood. I can't speak for Ben, but I think it is too much to ask of him >> being almost the sole developer. Personally, I gave my all to write >> the book, improve the documentation, contribute to the framework when >> I could, write articles (e.g. The Server Side), write blog posts, post >> links on DZone, get book reviews, promote Stripes on forums.. But now >> I am *burnt out*. As I mentioned earlier, I still answer questions on >> the mailing list when I can, but other than that, I need to just be a >> happy Stripes *user*. >> >> * more on the previous point: I think there are several people who are >> quite skillful, sharp, and competent who would make great developers >> for Stripes. I think we need a group of those people to step up and >> keep the framework alive. Several names come to mind, but I won't name >> them because I don't want to offend anyone by omission, nor do I want >> to put anyone on the spot. >> >> * yes I know it is lame when someone says "I'd like feature X" and the >> reply is "ok then why don't you implement it?" but sometimes the >> person actually says "I did implement it! can you add my code?" But >> the problem remains that someone needs to validate the code, decide if >> it belongs in the core (lest we bloat the framework, something we've >> been trying to avoid and shoud continue to resist), and so on. This is >> the job of a "core" group of developers who have the Stripes >> philosophy at heart. Unfortunately, since the departure of Tim, this >> core seems to have disintegrated. No disrespect at all to Tim by the >> way, he created a truly awesome framework and gave me an awesome topic >> to write about. I certainly don't blame him for having moved on. >> >> Before this post gets too long (too late!) I guess in conclusion, we >> all agree that Stripes needs more steam in terms of development, >> marketing, spreading the good word, blogging, revamping the site, >> developing bells and whistles--extensions that make you go "wow" but >> keeping them outside the core. >> >> Stripes needs more activity. The question is, who is willing to invest >> themselves into this goal? Who is willing to take over, for the future >> of Stripes? >> >> If there is enough response, how do we "hand over the reigns"? >> >> Cheers, >> Freddy >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by: >> >> Show off your parallel programming skills. >> Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010. >> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd >> _______________________________________________ >> Stripes-users mailing list >> Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net >> <mailto:Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Ross Sargant >> Software Engineer >> p: 954-623-6015 x2108 >> email: rsarg...@tvrc.com <mailto:rsarg...@tvrc.com> >> >> TVR Communications LLC >> 541 S. State Road 7,Suite 5,Margate, Florida,33068 >> >> http://www.tvrc.com >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by: >> >> Show off your parallel programming skills. >> Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010. >> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Stripes-users mailing list >> Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by: > > Show off your parallel programming skills. > Enter the Intel(R) Threading Challenge 2010. > http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-thread-sfd > _______________________________________________ > Stripes-users mailing list > Stripes-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/stripes-users ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ This SF.net Dev2Dev email is sponsored by: Show off your parallel programming skills. 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