--- Ranko Bijelonic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > >You could certainly code each Action as a Servlet but it would take > more > >work. > > I'm not sure exactely how it would take more work (provided there were > Struts like utils writen one time).
But there aren't so it would take more work. > > >You've mentioned changing the Servlet spec several times and seem to be > >under the impression that it's easy to do. Open source software has > >certain advantages over standards because it is easier to try new > things. > >It's *much* easier to change Struts than to change any Java > specification > >including Servlets. But you should notice the huge influence OSS and > >Struts in particular has had over the standard technologies. Struts > >directly contributed to JSF and JSTL with ideas and pressure to make > the > >standards better than the Struts version. IMO, that's a much more > >effective way of changing things for the better. > > Yes, that is true. We definitely benefited from Struts in many ways. > But > it just seems to be getting too encompasing. Now we have declarative > exception handling that is configured in struts-config.xml, and we have > it > ( a weaker version maybe) in web.xml. > Struts is becoming kind of self > sufficient where everything is done through it even if it already can be > done through something else. Its like a little container itself. But > maybe > i'm just temporarily mad :). Struts relies on many standard Java technologies as well as Jakarta Commons code. David > > ranko > > > > > > ranko > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Adam Levine [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Monday, July 21, 2003 12:49 PM > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Subject: RE: Struts MVC framework similar to that of a servlet > > > container? > > > > > > > > > for my $0.02. > > > > > > Using just pure servlet and base JSP, dealing with forms is not > > > intuitive > > > or clean. You either rely on too much code in a JSP, or too much > > > reading > > > and parsing at the start of your servlets. And, the development > cycle > > > increases as your changes increase. I find the Struts mode to be > > clean > > > and > > > simple. Need to change a field, add a field. Change one class (the > > > ActionForm, or not at all with a dynaform), modify the .jsp > > > presentation. > > > And then account for the field change in the business logic. > Combine > > it > > > with XDoclet, and you've got immediate Data/Value Objects that can > be > > > generated from the ActionForm itself, ready to be passed back to > your > > > EJB > > > level code (using CMP, you never have to account for the field in > the > > > logic, > > > unless you're doing business level decisions). > > > The mechanisms in place for detailing messages back to the user > > (ie, > > > ActionErrors) are very clean, easly integrated with field-specific > > > messages. > > > Seamless integration with Java's i18n functionality. > > > > > > >> I'm looking for the reasons why this would not be the case. > > > > > > Are you looking for where using the base Sevlet layer is more > > > advantageous > > > over using Struts? Or, are you looking for areas that Struts just > > > doesn't > > > handle, leaving a gaping hole? Are you being persnickity, or is > > there > > > a > > > serious question/concern ? > > > > > > From: "Ranko Bijelonic" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Reply-To: "Struts Users Mailing List" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Subject: RE: Struts MVC framework similar to that of a servlet > > > container? > > > Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 12:38:22 -0400 > > > > > > > > > Yes Struts does definitely solve many problems and make it easier. > > But > > > is > > > seems that it solves a lot of problems that are already solved. I'm > > > looking > > > for the reasons why this would not be the case. Thanks for the > help, > > > > > > ranko > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Sandeep Takhar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Monday, July 21, 2003 11:21 AM > > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > > Subject: RE: Struts MVC framework similar to that of a servlet > > > container? > > > > > > > > > I guess the main difference between what you mention > > > and struts is that you can use this stuff right away > > > for the app you want to build without modification. > > > > > > As long as you understand the concepts you can apply > > > them. Similar to how you understand a servlet/filter > > > spec. Now you have common problems solved. > > > > > > You don't have to code them or copy and paste from > > > somewhere. > > > > > > You also have the ability to auto-populate to lists > > > which is pretty neat. > > > > > > sandeep > > > --- Ranko Bijelonic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > there's a lot of stuff it gives you out of the > > > > box. > > > > > > > > > 1. solid code > > > > so does the container i guess. > > > > > > > > >2. validation framework > > > > This is one of those changes that could be added by > > > > way of utility classes. > > > > Have that Filter that autopopulates, check for > > > > correct types like Struts. > > > > > > > > >3. tile framework > > > > You can use it without Struts > > > > > > > > > 4. auto-population framework > > > > It should be easy to add a Filter that autopopulates > > > > a configured form (not > > > > every time but as a standard). > > > > > > > > > 5. role based actions > > > > I'm not sure what this is. > > > > > > > > >6. xml configuration of all the links or actions of > > > > your application > > > > So does web.xml i guess. > > > > > > > > >7. best practices framework bundling (scaffolding) > > > > complete with examples (many years of experience > > > > went > > > > into this one). > > > > Same thing as above. There are tutorials, examples, > > > > etc... > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8. ease of use > > > > If you think of a Servlet as an Action its kind of > > > > as easy. Except for some > > > > repetative tasks that I would include to complete > > > > the servlet spec (rather > > > > than rewrite some of the container functionality to > > > > add those utils). > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Sent: Monday, July 21, 2003 8:42 AM > > > > To: Struts Users Mailing List > > > > Subject: Re: Struts MVC framework similar to that of > > > > a servlet > > > > container? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sandeep, > > > > You mentioned role based actions in your list... > > > > which has caught my eye. > > > > Can you please elaborate on this ? Or point me to > > > > some documentation ? > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > -raj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Sandeep Takhar" > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
