Nice paper - I think the reason people prefer loudspeakers to headphone sin this case is to do with the HRTFs - over speakers people get to use their own personal HRTFs (discounting phanotm sources) whereas this isnt quite figured out yet for headphones,
On 30 June 2017 at 10:56, Richard Foss <r.f...@ru.ac.za> wrote: > Completely blown away by the video! This is truly wonderful and an > exemplary use of immersive sound. > > The leap motion/Unity project was a post grad project. I will send a paper > on it to you by email. Just need to check with conference organizers > whether I can make it more publicly available. > > > > On 30 Jun 2017, at 11:29 AM, Augustine Leudar <augustineleu...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > Hi Richard - Ive also being using the leap a lot - its great but a bit > > buggy sometimes when you get outside the infrared area , you can see it > > used in a big neolithic site here : > > > > https://vimeo.com/217058501 > > > > I had a friend who used the connect which was also fine but a bit buggy. > > Do you have a link to the stuff you did with the leap ? > > anyway yes Ill message you near the time , > > best, > > Gus > > > > On 30 June 2017 at 10:23, Richard Foss <r.f...@ru.ac.za> wrote: > > > >> That’s an inspiring video, thanks! > >> > >> And many points of contact. A few years back we used the Microsoft > Kinect > >> to allow for hand control over sound localization, much like you appear > to > >> be using the wii in the video. This worked well, except for the fact > that > >> the user had to be positioned in a fairly confined area. The mobile > device > >> control removes this restriction. > >> > >> Last year we used Unity and the Oculus with the LeapMotion controller to > >> create a virtual room and move ‘grabable’ sound sources around it. We > tried > >> providing the audio over headphones using Unity’s capabilities, and also > >> Immergo (DBAP) over speakers. Interestingly the test subjects preferred > the > >> external speakers. > >> > >> Yes, I have used the phone’s orientation capabilities to indicate a > >> sound’s localization, but don’t have a video of it. You can see the > layout > >> on the phone here: > >> > >> https://www.immersivedsp.com/ <https://www.immersivedsp.com/> > >> > >> Checkboxes at the bottom select the various axes. The purple circle can > be > >> touch-moved for two dimensions, and the white rectangle indicates > >> height.The blue circles indicate already recorded tracks that move with > the > >> playback of the sound. > >> > >> Would love to make the London demo and if possible will contact you, > >> thanks! > >> > >> > >>> On 30 Jun 2017, at 10:39 AM, Augustine Leudar < > augustineleu...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> by the way have you already done this thing pointing the phone and > >>> indicating a sound in 3d space - if so do you have a link to it ? > >>> This is a pretty crappy video of very early prototype I did a few years > >> ago > >>> - but things have moved on a lot since this : > >>> > >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cmodvSM5jE > >>> > >>> On 30 June 2017 at 09:33, Richard Foss <r.f...@ru.ac.za> wrote: > >>> > >>>> That sounds great Augustine, and fun! Certainly highlights the > >> flexibility > >>>> and capability of Max/MSP. > >>>> > >>>> Immergo uses the gyroscope of the smartphone/tablet for orientation > >>>> determination. > >>>> > >>>> The typical mode of working is to touch-move a sound source (circle) > >>>> around a representation of the sound space on the screen, for two > >>>> dimensional movement, and to tilt the device at the same time for the > >> third > >>>> dimension. You can request that all three axes are provided by phone > >>>> orientation though. So then it would be like pointing the device to > >>>> indicate the location of the sound. > >>>> > >>>> The rendering algorithm is selectable - DBAP is used for unusual > speaker > >>>> arrangements, like an art installation ’tunnel’ that we are currently > >>>> setting up. But you can select VBAP if the speakers are arranged on a > >>>> sphere. Big thank you’s to Trond Lossius and Ville Pulkki who made > their > >>>> algorithms freely available!! > >>>> > >>>> A long overdue and pleasurable task is to use Max with Immergo. > >> Currently > >>>> using the Reaper DAW. I will keep you updated. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 11:38 PM, Augustine Leudar < > >> augustineleu...@gmail.com> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Thats pretty impressive Richard - I would definately consider this > >> system > >>>>> in future for indoor stuff. In terms of interactive and automation - > I > >> do > >>>>> that in MaxMSP mostly - so we have things like an accelerometer on > your > >>>>> hand and wherever you point there is a sound etc etc - you also have > a > >>>> map > >>>>> of the speakers and pan around that map (using Dbap basically) - Ive > >>>> seen a > >>>>> lot of third party systems that do automation etc - but I am already > >>>> pretty > >>>>> happy with max for interactive 3D audio - theres nothing Ive found I > >>>>> couldnt do yet ! But I guess I could integrate max easily enough with > >> the > >>>>> AVB system. > >>>>> > >>>>> On 29 June 2017 at 22:28, Richard Foss <r.f...@ru.ac.za> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> One other thing - you mentioned wanting to move audio channels in > real > >>>>>> time - you can move up to 32 channels around in the speaker space, > >>>> using a > >>>>>> client-server program called Immergo. The server runs on the Mac and > >> the > >>>>>> client on the Mac or a remote tablet - its web browser based, so you > >>>> type > >>>>>> in a URL. You successively select tracks and move them around a > >>>>>> representation of your speaker space. You can record and play back > the > >>>>>> movements. The movements are realized via mixer matrices in the > >>>> speakers. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> So its two different approaches you can use - pre-prepared channels > >> with > >>>>>> movement incorporated (guess you would use the terminology ‘bed > >>>> channels’) > >>>>>> or channels that can be moved via the mixer matrices (object audio > >>>> style), > >>>>>> where metadata containing time stamped 3D coords is recorded. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Richard. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 10:52 PM, Richard Foss <r.f...@ru.ac.za> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> That’s correct Augustine - just the Ethernet out the Mac. That will > >> go > >>>>>> into an Ethernet AVB compliant PoE+ switch (extreme, netgear etc). > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> The SPK-4Ps will be connected to other ports of the switch. You can > >>>> link > >>>>>> together switches for larger port numbers. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 10:25 PM, Augustine Leudar < > >>>>>> augustineleu...@gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Hi Richard - > >>>>>>>> So if I have this right no interface is required - just the > ethernet > >>>>>> out of > >>>>>>>> the mac ? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On 29 June 2017 at 20:49, Richard Foss <r.f...@ru.ac.za <mailto: > >>>>>> r.f...@ru.ac.za>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Hi Augustine, to answer this question about the SPK-4Ps: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> can you daisy chain them (as discrete channels) or would you > have > >> to > >>>>>> run > >>>>>>>>> a seperate ethernet cable to each one? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> You would run a separate Ethernet cable from a switch to each > one. > >> So > >>>>>> for > >>>>>>>>> example, running a DAW on a Mac, you would output your tracks to > >> the > >>>>>>>>> outputs made available by the Mac AVB virtual audio entity, and > >> each > >>>>>>>>> speaker would listen to one of the outputs. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> You would use PoE+, not PoE, and each speaker is powered by a > Merus > >>>>>> audio > >>>>>>>>> Eximo amplifier, providing 30W. With the Mac you could connect up > >> to > >>>>>> 120 > >>>>>>>>> speakers. You also have the possibility of connecting a separate > >>>>>> passive > >>>>>>>>> speaker to the powered one, providing 2 x 15W. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Here is a bit more info: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> http://www.technologyintegrator.net/article/immersivedsp- > >>>>>>>>> integrates-merus-audio-eximo-amp-minidsp-spk-4p-speaker/ < > >> http://www > >>>> < > >>>>>> http://www/>. > >>>>>>>>> technologyintegrator.net/article/immersivedsp- < > >>>>>> http://technologyintegrator.net/article/immersivedsp-> > >>>>>>>>> integrates-merus-audio-eximo-amp-minidsp-spk-4p-speaker/> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Richard. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> On 29 Jun 2017, at 6:38 PM, Augustine Leudar < > >>>>>> augustineleu...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> aye - and that would kind of defeat the advantage of it - Ill > >> stick > >>>> to > >>>>>>>>>> passive for now - Ive always found active speakers a bit of a > pain > >>>> for > >>>>>>>>>> larger site specific stuff because you have to run power to > them > >> as > >>>>>> well > >>>>>>>>>> as audio. > >>>>>>>>>> These look like they might be OK for some stuff : > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> https://www.immersivedsp.com/products/spk-4p > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> but Im a bit unsure as to what exactly they can do - can you > daisy > >>>>>> chain > >>>>>>>>>> them (as discrete channels) or would you have to run a seperate > >>>>>> ethernet > >>>>>>>>>> cable to each one ? > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> On 29 June 2017 at 17:04, Dave Hunt < > davehuntau...@btinternet.com > >>> > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> I think that you'll find that an active speaker with an AVB > input > >>>>>> will > >>>>>>>>>>> require more current than can be supplied over an ethernet > cable. > >>>>>>>>> Perhaps > >>>>>>>>>>> for very small speakers with a low power digital amplifier, but > >>>>>> anything > >>>>>>>>>>> decent would require mains (or DC batteries) to the speaker. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> The available current may power the DAC though. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Ciao, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> Dave > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> From: Augustine Leudar <augustineleu...@gmail.com> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Date: 28 June 2017 22:06:52 BDT > >>>>>>>>>>>> To: Surround Sound discussion group <sursound@music.vt.edu> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Sursound] Multichannel players for permanent > >>>>>>>>> installations > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Richard - > >>>>>>>>>>>> There is lots of things that pan all around the room but the > >>>>>>>>> soundscape is > >>>>>>>>>>>> designed in pre production for this installation and then its > >>>> just a > >>>>>>>>>>>> multichannel file (or seperate mono ones). Other > installations I > >>>> do > >>>>>> are > >>>>>>>>>>>> interactive and so sounds are processed and panned in realtime > >>>>>> around > >>>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>>>> space depending on the sensors used etc. Certainly the AVB > thing > >>>>>> might > >>>>>>>>> be > >>>>>>>>>>>> good for some less inhospitable environments- I especially > like > >>>> the > >>>>>> way > >>>>>>>>>>>> power can be taken to the the speakers via the ethernet > >> cable..... > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ > >> attachme > >>>>>>>>>>> nts/20170629/0e011d85/attachment.html> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>>>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>>>>>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu > >>>>>>>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - > >> unsubscribe > >>>>>> here, > >>>>>>>>>>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>>> Augustine Leudar > >>>>>>>>>> Artistic Director Magik Door LTD > >>>>>>>>>> Company Number : NI635217 > >>>>>>>>>> Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, > >>>>>>>>>> Belfast BT88LL > >>>>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ > >>>>>>>>> attachments/20170629/5b094292/attachment.html> > >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>>>>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu > >>>>>>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - > unsubscribe > >>>>>> here, > >>>>>>>>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ < > >>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/> > >>>>>>>>> attachments/20170629/a3a9354f/attachment.html> > >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>>>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu <mailto:Sursound@music.vt.edu> > >>>>>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound < > >>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound> - unsubscribe > >>>> here, > >>>>>>>>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>> Augustine Leudar > >>>>>>>> Artistic Director Magik Door LTD > >>>>>>>> Company Number : NI635217 > >>>>>>>> Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, > >>>>>>>> Belfast BT88LL > >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ > >>>>>> attachments/20170629/e501836d/attachment.html < > >>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/ > >>>>>> mailman/private/sursound/attachments/20170629/e501836d/ > >>>> attachment.html>> > >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu <mailto:Sursound@music.vt.edu> > >>>>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound < > >>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound> - unsubscribe > >>>> here, > >>>>>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ > >>>>>> attachments/20170629/73cc7217/attachment.html> > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu > >>>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe > >>>> here, > >>>>>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu > >>>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe > >> here, > >>>>>> edit account or options, view archives and so on. > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> -- > >>>>> Augustine Leudar > >>>>> Artistic Director Magik Door LTD > >>>>> Company Number : NI635217 > >>>>> Registered 63 Ballycoan rd, > >>>>> Belfast BT88LL > >>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>> URL: <https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/private/sursound/ > >>>> attachments/20170629/0f8cecf3/attachment.html> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Sursound mailing list > >>>>> Sursound@music.vt.edu > >>>>> https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - 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