Le 18/09/2012 23:31, Frederik Ramm a écrit :
Marc,
On 18.09.2012 21:53, Marc Sibert wrote:
I thing the point is not why my account was blocked, but why someone
have the right to block an account and whatfor ?
I think that we need import guidelines, and we need people who can
block those who don't follow the guidelines, otherwise having
guidelines doesn't make sense.
On that particuliar point you are right : rules have to be followed to
maintain the community, or else "man will loose his head / on lui
coupera la tête".
Many reasons have been given in support of the "separate account" rule
in the guidelines already. But let me add one more thing:
None of these reasons apply to Cadastre uploads (previously
discussed)... that only my point of view (not only mine in fact).
Others have said that you are a respected and well known mapper in
France. If that's true, then I think that you should lead by example.
Even if you feel that in your particular case you don't need a
separate account - create one anyway, because others will follow your
example, and if the message you send to new mappers in France is
"don't bother about those silly policies" then we'll have people
violating *other* aspects of the policy - even those you would agree
with! - in no time.
Just like a professional pilot with thousands of flying hours'
experience will still execute all procedures "by the book" instead of
taking shortcuts that his experience would allow him to, a long-time
respected mapper should also play by the book and be a good example to
others.
Some time rules have to be breaked and changed because "the field" shows
there limits. I would not lead to the wrong direction (to my mind). I do
not simply "bother", but I think the policies *are* stupid in the
Cadastre case. Now, we are arguing, discussing... I win :-) Next step,
we will change the rule. I am french (latin ?), I used to discuss orders !
In fact DWG people just don't like imports and are jalous of the
"opendata" wind in France. Your anoying !
The amount of open geodata in the world is several orders of magnitude
more than what we have in OSM. Decisions need to be made about which
parts of that are worth importing; import everything and OSM comes to
a grinding halt.
Again, I follow you on that point.
And in all that data, I choose French Cadastre (only buildings layer)
DWG does not have an "imports are bad" policy but if it were for me,
personally, I would require from every importer an analysis about how
the import does not only make the *map* better, but also makes the
*community* better. Imports to help the community would be acceptable;
imports "instead of" community would not.
I have the opposite point of view : The object of OSM is to be complete
and usefull (full of "good" data), not to contribute endless. So first,
import automaticaly and then correct with humain brain. Of course I
learned that this extrem PoV is not available... also in french
community. Still, data are for computers, not for humans !
Today, France has 50% more data in OSM than Germany. I am not jealous
of that. I would be jealous if France had 50% more mappers and I
sincerely hope that the French community can find ways to engage more
people to help. But for all its data glory, the number of people who
have made more than 100 edits this year in France is about 3000, and
the same number in Germany is about 6000. This means - very roughly of
course - that the average French OSMer must keep three times as much
data current as the average German mapper. And you can't do that with
imports forever - there comes a time when you'll have to switch to
"maintenance mode".
Bye
Frederik
Humm you seem to like numbers. Personal contributions are too slow. Demo :
In France we have about 36000 municipalities. Has you wrote, there is
about 1000 (up to 3000) active contributors in the country. I needed 3
months to cover my (small - 7000 inhabitants) village (without
buildings). So we need about 36 * 3 = 108 months = 9 years.
That's why we need of help of the machines... asta la vista, baby !
My pleasure to read you.
--
Marc Sibert
mailto:m...@sibert.fr
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