We aren't trying to make The Perfect Editor here. We are trying to replace an aging editor with something more current. Let us not make perfection the enemy of progress. Of course there are still improvements to be made but iD is definitely a fantastic bit of code. We can keep bikeshedding it until the cows come home but at some point a switch needs to be thrown.
Some specific responses: On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 4:27 PM, NopMap <ekkeh...@gmx.de> wrote: > > I agree with the previous posts that ID is not a suitable editor for > beginners/as default as long as it presents destructive operations in such > a > prominent manner. I'm referring to the delete button but also to the > make-square, make-round and rotate options. You do not need these to draw > streets on top of tracks or aerial imagery, which is the basic start of > mapping. I have never used them at all. But they can be very destructive > for > existing geometry. An expert mode where you can add those operations later > might be a good solution. > > So basically, you don't like the radial context menu. That is mostly a UI design decision. These operations are not all that much less prominent in P2. They were just in a box down in the corner of the map instead of at-the-ready under your mouse cursor. Initially I wasn't sold on the radial menus but I think they work reasonably well here. Every once in a while they get in the way of something I want to select but most of the time they are pretty handy. > I tried deleting a few things and there was no warning that I was acting > destructively. The warning before saving is too general and the list of > change objects also does not indicate whether I did something dangerous. I > believe that immediate warnings when you do something dangerous (and an > expert switch to disable them later) would be very helpful to prevent > damage > and teach the user how to proceed. > This is identical behavior to P2. I just tried deleting ways that were members of turn restriction and bus route relations in P2. No warning, just silent deletion. This is not a reason that would prevent iD from replacing P2. > > The wording on the delete button is also misleading. It says: "remove this > from the map". But that is not what it does. It deletes it from the > database, not from any particular map. This encourages the common > misunderstanding that "OSM is a map" and of course unnecessary deletions. > > So what is your suggestion for new text on this button? You can't explain the difference between a map rendering and a geodatabase in a tooltip. > On the other hand, some very useful functions seem to be missing. Or at > least they are not offered as icons and I couldn't figure out how to do it. > One is "click on end node of line and continue drawing it" (click on node > in > P2). Another is "copy tags from similar way" (r in P2). > You just select the line tool and click on the end of a way. It automatically continues the existing way. I will concede that this isn't exactly obvious. Do you have a suggestion to make it better? I think the P2 behavior would be inconsistent with the rest of the UI in iD. Maybe just make the tooltip say "Add or extend..." instead of just "Add"? > > There is some relation handling, but the visibility of relations is still > insufficient. They are shown in the sidebar, but with all instances I > tried, > the normal tags took up all the visible space in the bar and you had do > scroll down to read anything about relations. As they are not marked on the > map in any way, they are still invisible to the unsuspecting user. If you > don't know that there must be a relation there and directly look for it, > they remain totally invisible. > Again, this is pretty similar to current P2 behavior and not something that should block iD from replacing P2 as the default. I think P2 does display some relation types slightly more prominently. But for example turning restrictions are rendered on the map as a somewhat meaningless icon on the via node. Other than that you have to switch to "Advanced" mode to see most relation information. This is even further removed from visibility than at the bottom of the side panel in iD. > > I agree with the previous posts that OSM should not create a connection to > Facebook, Twitter or any other social service without conscious choice by > the user or in a way that suggests that it is an integral part of OSM or > that membership there is required in any way. A good solution might be a > plain "share" link on the save page that leads you to a setting where you > can opt-in to your favorite services if you like to. Or maybe you could > detect the Facebook session and tracking cookies and show it the button > only > if you have an active session. But currently it looks like OSM is simply > advertising for Facebook. > I view having to click on the buttons as sufficient opt-in. I mean seriously... who in their right mind would think that a "share on Facebook" button is some kind of official endorsement of Facebook by OSMF? There are share, like, +1 and tweet buttons on a majority of pages that most people view on the internet. They do not imply endorsement. They imply more eyeballs on OSM which in my book is a good thing. If this is seriously considered a show stopper for making iD the default editor then we need to stop pretending this is the internet of 2005. Toby
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