"Wm. Taylor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
No, I am not suggest that. A dichotomy is by definition a separation. I'm saying you can not do this without killing the person. We are integrated souls. The dualisms and dichotomies and trichotomies of your framework is Classical Gr. philosophy penetrating and imprisoning your thoughts.Bill----- Original Message -----From: Kevin DeeganSent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 9:01 PMSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Soul searching.But you are suggesting that we are a dichotomyThe verses I posted are clearWilliam said But as to whether we are trichotomous beings, with spirit, body, and soul, I would have to disagree.1 thes 5 tells us we are body soul & spirit some suggest soul and spirit are the same. I simply posted Heb 4:12 to show that since soul & spirit can be separated they are not one & the same.
"Wm. Taylor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:Kevin,I suggest you do the same thing I suggested to Perry. I'll consider your thoughts from my end. Will you consider mine from yours? Oh, and I'm not suggesting that spirit and soul are the same thing. Maybe take a deep breath and reread what I did say [:>(Bill----- Original Message -----From: Kevin DeeganSent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 8:12 PMSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Soul searching.Well what do you do with this verse then?
1 Thes 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Soul & spirit can not be the same thing since they can be separated: Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Body spirit soul: Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Zech 12:1 formeth the spirit of man within him.
Terry Clifton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:Wm. Taylor wrote:
======================================================I was rebuked a while back because I was "dichotomizing" the idea of personhood, when I should have been "trichotomizing" like the Bible does. Well, actually I was doing neither; rather I was arguing toward the idea of integration and away from all forms of spirit/body dualisms, as if we can so dissect a person as to separate the spirit from the body, and the body from the spirit.And so the question I would like to address is about personal continuity, personal ontology, dualism, etc. There is no end to thorny problems we can get into when discussing this. And so I won't say a lot about it. But to me, it seems we need to be very careful about reifying the words that we use from our tradition, making them so concrete in our thinking that we impose back on Scripture meaning that simply doesn't exist; for instance, when we read "soul," what are we to make of this language? Is "soul" a third part of a tripartite structure, spirit-body-soul, called a human being? I think not.I regard the Scriptural use of the word "soul" heuristically, as simply a way of saying, me being me in the presence of God, without implying that there is a thing inside of me called the soul, which if I could do enough surgery inside myself and dissect myself and identify all my parts, I might actually be able to discover that soul part of me.I'm perfectly happy to use "soul" as a word -- don't get me wrong. But let's use it like the Bible does. It's a way of describing personhood in the presence of God. But as to whether we are trichotomous beings, with spirit, body, and soul, I would have to disagree. We are spirit and body integrated in such a way that to speak of one to the exclusion of the other, is to dehumanize and depersonalize, and to dichotomize who we are as living persons. Soul speaks to the whole of me, spirit and body, integrated before our Lord.Let's get to the crux of the issue: if we insist on making "soul" an actual substantive thing, as some of you are insisting, then it seems to me we need to go looking for the rest of Jesus. He's hanging there on a tree, you see, nails through his body, looks to heaven and says, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." Well, what happened to his soul? Where did it go? Did he forget who he was, a human being? Come on people [:>) Jesus was a living soul, an integrated whole, a complete person. The body part dies on the cross. That leaves a disembodied spirit, which he commits to his Father -- No soul searching. No parts missing!Bill Taylor
Makes sense to me Bill. Maybe we could use the word "Soul" in place of person?
Terry
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spamDo you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam
